**Additional Information** Additional information on Class D & High Ohm speakers provided by @AuroralActivity: Class D amplifiers, which are highly efficient and use pulse-width modulation (PWM) to amplify audio signals, might have trouble with a 12-ohm speaker due to a few reasons: 1. **Output Power**: Class D amplifiers are typically designed to deliver maximum power at lower impedances, such as 4 or 8 ohms. With a 12-ohm speaker, the amplifier will deliver less power because the higher impedance limits the current flow, resulting in reduced overall power output. This means the speaker might not be driven as effectively or reach the desired volume levels. 2. **Impedance Matching**: Class D amplifiers often have output filters designed to match the impedance of commonly used speakers (4 to 8 ohms). When using a 12-ohm speaker, the mismatch in impedance can affect the performance of these filters, potentially leading to less accurate sound reproduction and decreased efficiency. 3. **Current Capability**: While Class D amplifiers are efficient and generate less heat, they are also designed with certain current capabilities in mind. Higher impedance speakers require less current, which might lead to the amplifier operating outside its optimal range, potentially affecting its performance and efficiency. In summary, a Class D amplifier might struggle with a 12-ohm speaker due to reduced power output, potential impedance mismatches affecting filter performance, and operating outside of its designed current capabilities. Comparison to CHoco Amp provided by Nemo: If you don't need any of the features of the billie like the dac, phono, pre-outs, etc... The CHoco being a purist piece will offer up more refinement than most amps around the same price. Depending on what speakers you have it connected to it can be a small or big differences. Using my Platimon for example the CHoco is a notable step up from the Billie, but using something like my S400 MK2 or Dynaudio Evoke 20 I would actually prefer the Billie amp so while technically the CHoco is better it also depends what speakers you plan to use. The billie is going to match well with a wide variety of speakers and I feel the CHoco is strongest with more detail focused speakers like Focal, Mon, B&W, Triangle, etc... Hope that helps.
I'm really trying to keep the comparisons down to 3, and honestly bro 100% truth, I just forgot about the CHoco, someone else asked about that too, refresh the page and there will be a pinned comment with that comparison.
honestly before I saw that on the website I did try it for about 30 minutes, I didn't notice any hiss but quickly disconnected the pair since I wasn't sure why they say not to do it and I didn't want to go against the mfg suggestion. Perhaps it's just a generalization but for that little 30 minutes session the dwx & billie were fine but I'm not going to recommend people do somethign the MFG says not to do incase it damages something :)
Terrific review. I've been interested in this integrated for a while. I don't recall hearing what sources you used. One reviewer said there is reduced sound quality using the DAC versus the other inputs.
internal dac performance is gonna depend on what you're comparing it to, versus a computers sound card or your TV the billies internal dac is gonna be superior, versus an external dac like an Ares 12th-1 the Ares is gonna sound better. The most realistic example I can give you is my friend has a billie MK2 and uses a Cambridge MXN10 streamer and Focal Kanta No1 speakers, he prefers the Billies internal dac over the one inside the MXN10 streamer, hope that helps! Personally I used this amp with a bluesound node and Ares2 dac and all music was tidal hifi.
@@NemoPropaganda so you didn't give the internal dac a spin? Thanks for all the info though. Would probably do fine for me. Could of course upgrade to an external if at some point I felt the need
@@lsaideOK no I didn't personally use the bliies internal dac, I very rarely use the internal dac on a product. I did test the internal on the Pathos Inpol Remix but that was an optional $750 add on so I figured people would want to know if it was worth it or not but outside of rare situations like that it just takes up too much time. I spend about 10-30 hours of listening just assessing the sound of the amp itself, I can't do that with the internal dac also so with me what you get is someone who spends a crazy amount of time with the core product but at the expense of ignoring certain features. Narrowing my focus allows me to be 100% confident in the area I covered. Essentially I'd rather master one thing than be average at a few if that makes sense.
Thanks for the comparisons. The headphone amp is also a nice & impressive driver. 3 months on, connected to my 4 & 8ohm speakers...while listening to the latest "High on Fire" & Black Sabbath's first, this little amp kicks ass with it's class D power (no issue here) and is shining with holographic quality.
Would love to see a review of some Daedalus Speakers with some ModWright amps. Musical bliss with dynamic swings that will make a grown man cry tears of joy. Great Channel brother.
Deadalus doesn't list prices but I think that's outside of my wheelhouse, I'm guessing they're in that $20k category? As far as modright the stuff looks beautiful but also kinda pricey, I do review expensive amps sometimes but its not super common for me, hopefully in the future as I gain more experience :)
I don’t want to deal with the maintenance of tubes . I’m very happy with today’s integrated amplifiers . Integrated amps have come a long way. I don’t even have a desire for separates . I have a Rotel . My first Integrated then got a larger Michi , and a year ago got a Mc integrated . I think I’m happy with the Michi and may sell the Mc before the economy gets worse
This might not be a similar comparison, but how would you compare to something like a Hegel h190? More so in terms of bass performance? Great video as always!!
The H190 is better overall, costing more than double that's no surprise, more refinement in the treble, better low volume dynamics & detail, etc... As far as bass, both amps have plenty of power.
If you don't need any of the features of the billie like the dac, phono, pre-outs, etc... The CHoco being a purist piece will offer up more refinement than most amps around the same price. Depending on what speakers you have it connected to it can be a small or big differences. Using my Platimon for example the CHoco is a notable step up from the Billie, but using something like my S400 MK2 or Dynaudio Evoke 20 I would actually prefer the Billie amp so while technically the CHoco is better it also depends what speakers you plan to use. The billie is going to match well with a wide variety of speakers and I feel the CHoco is strongest with more detail focused speakers like Focal, Mon, B&W, Triangle, etc... Hope that helps.
@@NemoPropaganda it helps immensely! Tbh thanks to your comment I've selected my next upgrade! There's a used choco in my area for a discount! I'm upgrading my amp from a 1978 kenwood ka5700 (completely rebuilt). I'm excited!
@@HaamRadio54 awesome!! You're gonna be shocked by the casework alone, what the CHoco gives you for it's price is pretty darn impressive :) It's one amp I really regret not buying for myself but I can't buy everything I like lol
@@MasterofPlay7 please rethink that my friend.............90% of what i own is vintage..........including my 3 plasma tvs........a lot of my amps are 30 + years old...........nothing sounds like a great hafler amp..........the newest amp i own is a adcom gfa 5006..............yes you might not be into vintage but and that is great.........but you will save a ton of money.....yes you must have a great repair man for some maintenance............ one thing i do trust is nemo propaganda as he makes me want subwoofers..............because of him i now own REL subs..........you can trust used gears if you shop wise......
Breaks my heart that I cant run this with my DWX. Oh well. I bet it would rock my Preac Response 1 SC/Fe. I'd love to tube roll it. Thanks. I'm on the hawk for a used Pathos.
For 2k it is actually OK value, in a nice package, but I would prefer separates. Getting a Musical Paradise Tube Preamp and a good Class D power amp. I guess most of us have a DAC that can rival the internal one.
value is not a universal truth, it is a personal truth, if you do not think it has value that is your truth and you are welcome to it but two people cannot have a vlue based discussion, it will not go anywhere, it's like arguing over food. Personally I hate cheesecake, maybe you like it, each opinion is real and true for the individual.
Oooh maan, been looking for an upgrade in this price category for my DW6, thought “this checks a lot of boxes” until it checked thaat one WRONG box. Oh well, don’t have to watch Billie amp vids anymore, lol. Thx Nemp
Based on my personal experience, if you managed to score a used Unico Primo Tube integrated amp made in Italy, you would be a happy camper. In particular with a little tube rolling with some PSVanes or NOS Mullards. The build quality is outstanding and they go used for about a grand. Plenty of bucks left over for a good DAC. I just recommended this to a friend on a budget and he raved after hearing the amp. Just my opinion. There is also a higher priced Segundo amp of similar but better quality for maybe two grand used.
not all audio components sound good together or are compatible with eachother, I'd love to see more mfg get in front of this topic and help the end consumer not make mistakes.
I appreciate you reviewing the Billie as its something I've had my eye on. However, you took an integrated amp and reviewed it only as an amp. What happened to the integrated part, and how those pieces compare to others in the price range? How is the DAC, how is the BT functionality, how is the phono amp and how well does the Billie compare as a preamp? There's so much missing here. FWIW, Tom
I think this is your first time seeing me review an integrated amp and you may not realize or know this channel is a side project, I am not a full time reviewer, my videos are shot in single takes, are unscripted, and I generally review the product based on how I personally use it. Nobody pays me to do this and I don't use affiliate links, this is all for fun and for free. I never review the preamp section of an integrated amp separately, it is not my area of expertise and we all know how lossy BT sounds, perfectly fine for when you wanna jam out while cleaning the house or something but you wouldn't use it for critical listening. So that only leaves the internal DAC, if its good or not is relative as it depends what you're comparing it to. Most gears internal dac is about on par with an external dac in the $100-$249 range and the differences are more a matter of taste and preference than performance. They are generally considered good enough. Integrated amp refers to the preamp and poweramp section being combined so I did review the integrated amp, I just don't cover every feature. My goal is to give you a general idea of the overall sound of a product.
Thanks for the review. It was on my list but appears to have gone up in price a fair bit. I have the HECO Celan Revolution 3's. Do you happen to remember what amps you liked with those speakers? I'm probably in the $1K-$2.5K range, give or take...I have a sub too. I talked to someone at the distributor, but surprisingly they didn't have personal experience with the speakers. Go figure...
Hi bro, I bought the review sample so I still have the Rev3 :). Honestly I like them no matter what amp I have connected to them so it just depends what you have now and what you're looking for. The Celan Rev3 sound is sparkly/bright up top, do you want to keep that or reduce that? I think Billie with gold tubes is a great match or if you don't need the features the billie has then you can save some cash and go for the CHoco EMEI which is a purist piece and a little more refined sounding overall. If the EMEI is too warm for you then you can just use the +2 tabs on the Celan Rev3 :)
@@NemoPropaganda Hey, thanks for the reply. Yeah, i got them for $950 open box. Not a scratch on them. I thought I'd go for a new amp right away, but i like them with my vintage amps and some slightly less vintage ones. ;) I don't have anything new, so i guess I'm just curious. Thought you might have come across a great pairing. I know it's all subjective, but it was worth a shot. I haven't had an issue with them being too bright on +2 with any amp so far, but it's nice to have the option. I remember seeing a review of that choco amp. I'll keep it in mind for sure. I just realized, the Billie is a lot more than i remember, but it's the second version. I have to admit, it's probably close to what I'd come up with if i was designing something. They seem to know their shit. I know it's not truly audiophile, but i was thinking about the onkyo rz50. I've had them hooked up tp an older onkyo a/v amp for HT and they perform. They also sound great on my marantz 2245. Ah well, choices choices...
sorry my bro, me talking about vinyl would be me just making it all up lol, I don't know anything about the topic. The only thing I do know is it certainly can sound incredible when done right :)
Currently run Billie MK2 with KLH Model 5, sounds pleasing but sometimes craving those concert level volumes. Mono block Schiit Vidar & Freya S combo would get me there... but how would a single Vidar - Freya S sound compared to Billie MK2?
a single vidar has less power than the billie, I don't think power is your problem. The Model 5 are 90dB efficient and KLH claims they can get up to 112dB in room. Is it possible your room is too big for the speaker? Or perhaps you have very high ceilings? Try adding a subwoofer, most people find they don't listen as loud when a sub is connected.
to keep things fair I review all amps the same way, primarily using my node as the source and an ares2 as the dac, this eleminates any differences in sound quality the internal dac may create and allows me to simply focus on the sound quality of each amp in a way that is consistent.
Hey Nemo, great review! Just a quick query. Do you think this integrated amp will pair well with Focal Kanta 1? Will this be able to tame down the brightness and produce a more holographic sound? And lastly, is Heaven 11 a better match than Hegel H190 for the Kanta no. 1? Your views will be highly appreciated. Thank you.
Hi bro, it depends what amp you currently have and how much you want to balance out the Kanta No1, with the gold tubes the billie will help compared to an amp that is neutral or clarity focused. I have a friend that uses the billie/gold tubes with his kanta no1 and likes it very much though his taste leans towards open/airy/bright. Personally I have a feeling the sound you are looking for will be with the CHoco Emei, it doesn't have any features like the Billie so maybe that's a deal breaker but its treble is a little more refined and a little darker and the Kanta can really benifit from that.
Thank you for the prompt reply, Nemo. Appreciate it so much. I have H190. The SQ is ok, but, i like my system to sound holographic. After hearing your Heaven 11 review, it seems like the Billie Heaven 11 can produce a warmer and holographic sound. Am i correct on this assumption?
@@ralphlee4110 if you have the H190 now I do not think the Billie w gold tubes will feel like a big difference, yeah it's a little more holographic but the H190 is already really great and has a smooth & refined top end so if that's still too much with the Kanta No1 you're going to want something even warmer & darker like the CHoco. But ultimately what I really think is perhaps the Kanta No1 are not for you. That is the conclusion I came to for myself and ended up selling my pair. Focal is great for the detail customer, slowly I'm learning I am not the detail customer.
In my mind an amp that can't handle my Zu Audio DW6 speakers is not very versatile. I've used them with my Cayin MT-12N and Willsenton R8 tube amps and Yamaha A-S301 and A-S3200 solid state integrated amps with great results. Of course there are amps on the other end that can't handle low impedance speakers like the Magnepan planars. I just remembered Steve Guttenberg reviewing this amp and I rewatched it. He used Magnepan and the DW6 speakers with results he really enjoyed, so I guess he didn't get the memo about not using Zu speakers. Could it cause possible damage? ua-cam.com/video/a2SnIYt4CRA/v-deo.html
Class D amplifiers, which are highly efficient and use pulse-width modulation (PWM) to amplify audio signals, might have trouble with a 12-ohm speaker due to a few reasons: 1. **Output Power**: Class D amplifiers are typically designed to deliver maximum power at lower impedances, such as 4 or 8 ohms. With a 12-ohm speaker, the amplifier will deliver less power because the higher impedance limits the current flow, resulting in reduced overall power output. This means the speaker might not be driven as effectively or reach the desired volume levels. 2. **Impedance Matching**: Class D amplifiers often have output filters designed to match the impedance of commonly used speakers (4 to 8 ohms). When using a 12-ohm speaker, the mismatch in impedance can affect the performance of these filters, potentially leading to less accurate sound reproduction and decreased efficiency. 3. **Current Capability**: While Class D amplifiers are efficient and generate less heat, they are also designed with certain current capabilities in mind. Higher impedance speakers require less current, which might lead to the amplifier operating outside its optimal range, potentially affecting its performance and efficiency. In summary, a Class D amplifier might struggle with a 12-ohm speaker due to reduced power output, potential impedance mismatches affecting filter performance, and operating outside of its designed current capabilities.
Bro, with all due respect, you have to stop being lazy, you're mentioning a lot of products you used in your review but don't show ANY photos or videos of the other products you used Which made this a very boring content. No disrespect bro but please don't use another reviewer point to make it OK to make your point. Yes, you can agree with Thomas, but it's like if Thomas didn't say it, your point is not valid. Other than that, I enjoyed your video.
brother I need you to understand you're talking to someone that runs a YT channel as a side gig because they got bored one day, you're talking to someone that films, edits, & uploads all their content using an old iPhone 13 mini, you're talking to someone that has a fulltime job yet still manages to crank out a video once a week and produces roughly 50+ videos a year, all as a freaking side project for fun. But most importantly you're talking to someone that does what he wants, this is my style, it's not for everyone, I'm not here to make anyone happy, people like me or they dont. My channel is small so most people don't like me I'd say, it's all good baby, the internet isn't real life. As far as Thomas, he's my friend, I'll quote him if I want, why shouldn't I? If you think that means I need his words to have my own I'd say that's extremely judgemental and you've grossly underestimated me. But that's what people do, they see a stranger and they judge and criticize. I'm gonna keep doing me, you're along for the ride or not, no hard feelings either way.
As someone that tried the Billie MK2 w/ Zu DW6 Supreme before the warning on their website, I found it awful. The sound was very fatiguing. I'm hesitant to call it bright, since that's probably the wrong word and it's difficult to describe, but I simply did not enjoy listening to that pairing at all. The Billie with the Buchardt S400MKII was fine (a huge sound-stage), but I did find it a bit "boring" @tmr_audio guided to a Quicksilver Audio tube integrated amp for the Zu and it's a wonderful pairing and what I enjoy to this day
I’m guessing you had the standard tubes? Gold was really what made the darn thing shine. With the standard tubes it was for the most part another good amp but nothing special. Personally, I think it should ship with the gold tubes and the standard tubes be an option for those who wish for more neutrality.
@@NemoPropaganda I had the gold tubes and even tube rolled with some of Ebay that I enjoyed even more. It was solid, I just prefer the Zu+Quicksilver combo over Billie+S400 combo
@@MichaelAlanNYC oh yeah, I don't blame you. I love the S400 MK2, but the Zu DWX is just something different. The S400 MK2 is like a high power turbocharged 4 cylinder while the Zu is like a big American V8, it's just more effortless.
**Additional Information**
Additional information on Class D & High Ohm speakers provided by @AuroralActivity: Class D amplifiers, which are highly efficient and use pulse-width modulation (PWM) to amplify audio signals, might have trouble with a 12-ohm speaker due to a few reasons:
1. **Output Power**: Class D amplifiers are typically designed to deliver maximum power at lower impedances, such as 4 or 8 ohms. With a 12-ohm speaker, the amplifier will deliver less power because the higher impedance limits the current flow, resulting in reduced overall power output. This means the speaker might not be driven as effectively or reach the desired volume levels.
2. **Impedance Matching**: Class D amplifiers often have output filters designed to match the impedance of commonly used speakers (4 to 8 ohms). When using a 12-ohm speaker, the mismatch in impedance can affect the performance of these filters, potentially leading to less accurate sound reproduction and decreased efficiency.
3. **Current Capability**: While Class D amplifiers are efficient and generate less heat, they are also designed with certain current capabilities in mind. Higher impedance speakers require less current, which might lead to the amplifier operating outside its optimal range, potentially affecting its performance and efficiency.
In summary, a Class D amplifier might struggle with a 12-ohm speaker due to reduced power output, potential impedance mismatches affecting filter performance, and operating outside of its designed current capabilities.
Comparison to CHoco Amp provided by Nemo: If you don't need any of the features of the billie like the dac, phono, pre-outs, etc... The CHoco being a purist piece will offer up more refinement than most amps around the same price. Depending on what speakers you have it connected to it can be a small or big differences. Using my Platimon for example the CHoco is a notable step up from the Billie, but using something like my S400 MK2 or Dynaudio Evoke 20 I would actually prefer the Billie amp so while technically the CHoco is better it also depends what speakers you plan to use. The billie is going to match well with a wide variety of speakers and I feel the CHoco is strongest with more detail focused speakers like Focal, Mon, B&W, Triangle, etc... Hope that helps.
Such great content, all the time. Thank you for all you do!
thank you for the kind words sir!
Appreciate your candid, detailed reviews with comparisons.
Great review as usual Nemo. But I’m very surprised you didn’t compare this to the CHoco Sound EMEI. I can totally see choosing between these two. ✌️
I'm really trying to keep the comparisons down to 3, and honestly bro 100% truth, I just forgot about the CHoco, someone else asked about that too, refresh the page and there will be a pinned comment with that comparison.
@@NemoPropagandaSchiit happens man. 😁
And that comment was good enough for me anyway. Both of these are amazing deals IMO. ✌️
My understanding is that you don’t want to pair this amp with high sensitivity speakers because you will hear the noise floor of this amp….hiss 🐍
snake oil and snake hiss.... snakes are very audiophile animals.
honestly before I saw that on the website I did try it for about 30 minutes, I didn't notice any hiss but quickly disconnected the pair since I wasn't sure why they say not to do it and I didn't want to go against the mfg suggestion. Perhaps it's just a generalization but for that little 30 minutes session the dwx & billie were fine but I'm not going to recommend people do somethign the MFG says not to do incase it damages something :)
Terrific review. I've been interested in this integrated for a while. I don't recall hearing what sources you used. One reviewer said there is reduced sound quality using the DAC versus the other inputs.
internal dac performance is gonna depend on what you're comparing it to, versus a computers sound card or your TV the billies internal dac is gonna be superior, versus an external dac like an Ares 12th-1 the Ares is gonna sound better. The most realistic example I can give you is my friend has a billie MK2 and uses a Cambridge MXN10 streamer and Focal Kanta No1 speakers, he prefers the Billies internal dac over the one inside the MXN10 streamer, hope that helps! Personally I used this amp with a bluesound node and Ares2 dac and all music was tidal hifi.
@@NemoPropaganda so you didn't give the internal dac a spin? Thanks for all the info though. Would probably do fine for me. Could of course upgrade to an external if at some point I felt the need
@@lsaideOK no I didn't personally use the bliies internal dac, I very rarely use the internal dac on a product. I did test the internal on the Pathos Inpol Remix but that was an optional $750 add on so I figured people would want to know if it was worth it or not but outside of rare situations like that it just takes up too much time. I spend about 10-30 hours of listening just assessing the sound of the amp itself, I can't do that with the internal dac also so with me what you get is someone who spends a crazy amount of time with the core product but at the expense of ignoring certain features. Narrowing my focus allows me to be 100% confident in the area I covered. Essentially I'd rather master one thing than be average at a few if that makes sense.
@@NemoPropaganda I can definitely see that! Good to know more about your process. Thanks for responding so thoroughly. Much appreciated!
Thanks for the comparisons. The headphone amp is also a nice & impressive driver. 3 months on, connected to my 4 & 8ohm speakers...while listening to the latest "High on Fire" & Black Sabbath's first, this little amp kicks ass with it's class D power (no issue here) and is shining with holographic quality.
Nooooo zu audioooooooo 😢. Would seem like a perfect pairing but hey if it doesn’t work what can you do. Great review buddy, you’re amazing!
yeah I was bummed, I really wanted to try that combo lol, the website saying I couldn't just made me want to try it even more lol but I didn't.
@@NemoPropaganda audiophiliac said he loved the combination with the Zus lol, guess it worked hahah
Would love to see a review of some Daedalus Speakers with some ModWright amps. Musical bliss with dynamic swings that will make a grown man cry tears of joy. Great Channel brother.
Deadalus doesn't list prices but I think that's outside of my wheelhouse, I'm guessing they're in that $20k category? As far as modright the stuff looks beautiful but also kinda pricey, I do review expensive amps sometimes but its not super common for me, hopefully in the future as I gain more experience :)
Another no beat around the bush review by you Nemo!
I don’t want to deal with the maintenance of tubes . I’m very happy with today’s integrated amplifiers . Integrated amps have come a long way. I don’t even have a desire for separates . I have a Rotel . My first Integrated then got a larger Michi , and a year ago got a Mc integrated . I think I’m happy with the Michi and may sell the Mc before the economy gets worse
Excellent review as always 👍.
Maybe you should listen to unison research unico primo: tubes + class A integrated. It is also an interesting hybrid...
it's been on my radar, I'm sure I'll check one out eventually.
This might not be a similar comparison, but how would you compare to something like a Hegel h190? More so in terms of bass performance? Great video as always!!
The H190 is better overall, costing more than double that's no surprise, more refinement in the treble, better low volume dynamics & detail, etc... As far as bass, both amps have plenty of power.
How does it compare with the choco emei? Ty as always! Fave audio guy! The man knows bass n holography!
If you don't need any of the features of the billie like the dac, phono, pre-outs, etc... The CHoco being a purist piece will offer up more refinement than most amps around the same price. Depending on what speakers you have it connected to it can be a small or big differences. Using my Platimon for example the CHoco is a notable step up from the Billie, but using something like my S400 MK2 or Dynaudio Evoke 20 I would actually prefer the Billie amp so while technically the CHoco is better it also depends what speakers you plan to use. The billie is going to match well with a wide variety of speakers and I feel the CHoco is strongest with more detail focused speakers like Focal, Mon, B&W, Triangle, etc... Hope that helps.
@@NemoPropaganda it helps immensely! Tbh thanks to your comment I've selected my next upgrade! There's a used choco in my area for a discount! I'm upgrading my amp from a 1978 kenwood ka5700 (completely rebuilt). I'm excited!
@@HaamRadio54 awesome!! You're gonna be shocked by the casework alone, what the CHoco gives you for it's price is pretty darn impressive :) It's one amp I really regret not buying for myself but I can't buy everything I like lol
@@HaamRadio54I wouldn't trust used gears
@@MasterofPlay7 please rethink that my friend.............90% of what i own is vintage..........including my 3 plasma tvs........a lot of my amps are 30 + years old...........nothing sounds like a great hafler amp..........the newest amp i own is a adcom gfa 5006..............yes you might not be into vintage but and that is great.........but you will save a ton of money.....yes you must have a great repair man for some maintenance............ one thing i do trust is nemo propaganda as he makes me want subwoofers..............because of him i now own REL subs..........you can trust used gears if you shop wise......
wow 215watts is entering in the Maggie's zone... LRS + Billie could be a killer combo.
Awesome 🎉🎉. Great rundown bro.
thank you sir!
Great as always.
There is also the Dayton Audio - HTA200 Integrated Stereo Hybrid Tube Amplifier
Dayton makes great budget stuff but I don't think even they would claim it's on the same level as the billie amp or any other $2k amp.
Breaks my heart that I cant run this with my DWX. Oh well. I bet it would rock my Preac Response 1 SC/Fe. I'd love to tube roll it. Thanks. I'm on the hawk for a used Pathos.
Heaven 11 Billie Mark two paired with Buchardt s400 mk II and Denafrips dac and your search is over!
that is a great combination for sure!!
Sorry off topic...I like that screensaver.
it comes with music! enjoy! ua-cam.com/users/liveMZhivjxcF-M?si=HE5hPVP8_DSMWXN2
@@NemoPropaganda thanks!
For 2k it is actually OK value, in a nice package, but I would prefer separates. Getting a Musical Paradise Tube Preamp and a good Class D power amp. I guess most of us have a DAC that can rival the internal one.
value is not a universal truth, it is a personal truth, if you do not think it has value that is your truth and you are welcome to it but two people cannot have a vlue based discussion, it will not go anywhere, it's like arguing over food. Personally I hate cheesecake, maybe you like it, each opinion is real and true for the individual.
Oooh maan, been looking for an upgrade in this price category for my DW6, thought “this checks a lot of boxes” until it checked thaat one WRONG box. Oh well, don’t have to watch Billie amp vids anymore, lol. Thx Nemp
Based on my personal experience, if you managed to score a used Unico Primo Tube integrated amp made in Italy, you would be a happy camper. In particular with a little tube rolling with some PSVanes or NOS Mullards. The build quality is outstanding and they go used for about a grand. Plenty of bucks left over for a good DAC. I just recommended this to a friend on a budget and he raved after hearing the amp. Just my opinion. There is also a higher priced Segundo amp of similar but better quality for maybe two grand used.
Thanks, but I hoped this will be MK3, as MK2 is on the market for quite some time.
is there a MK3 coming?
@@NemoPropaganda only Itai Azerad (Heaven 11) will know when it’s ready.
So strange that an owner's manual would literally mention a speaker model to NOT use. What's up with that?
not all audio components sound good together or are compatible with eachother, I'd love to see more mfg get in front of this topic and help the end consumer not make mistakes.
@@NemoPropaganda Thanks for replying. An advertised "Warm vs. Cool" index would be a start.
I appreciate you reviewing the Billie as its something I've had my eye on. However, you took an integrated amp and reviewed it only as an amp. What happened to the integrated part, and how those pieces compare to others in the price range? How is the DAC, how is the BT functionality, how is the phono amp and how well does the Billie compare as a preamp?
There's so much missing here.
FWIW, Tom
I think this is your first time seeing me review an integrated amp and you may not realize or know this channel is a side project, I am not a full time reviewer, my videos are shot in single takes, are unscripted, and I generally review the product based on how I personally use it. Nobody pays me to do this and I don't use affiliate links, this is all for fun and for free. I never review the preamp section of an integrated amp separately, it is not my area of expertise and we all know how lossy BT sounds, perfectly fine for when you wanna jam out while cleaning the house or something but you wouldn't use it for critical listening. So that only leaves the internal DAC, if its good or not is relative as it depends what you're comparing it to. Most gears internal dac is about on par with an external dac in the $100-$249 range and the differences are more a matter of taste and preference than performance. They are generally considered good enough. Integrated amp refers to the preamp and poweramp section being combined so I did review the integrated amp, I just don't cover every feature. My goal is to give you a general idea of the overall sound of a product.
sorry I didn't mention vinyl, I don't own any records or use vinyl personally, I think it's important to only stick to areas where I have experience.
Thanks for the review. It was on my list but appears to have gone up in price a fair bit. I have the HECO Celan Revolution 3's. Do you happen to remember what amps you liked with those speakers? I'm probably in the $1K-$2.5K range, give or take...I have a sub too. I talked to someone at the distributor, but surprisingly they didn't have personal experience with the speakers. Go figure...
Hi bro, I bought the review sample so I still have the Rev3 :). Honestly I like them no matter what amp I have connected to them so it just depends what you have now and what you're looking for. The Celan Rev3 sound is sparkly/bright up top, do you want to keep that or reduce that? I think Billie with gold tubes is a great match or if you don't need the features the billie has then you can save some cash and go for the CHoco EMEI which is a purist piece and a little more refined sounding overall. If the EMEI is too warm for you then you can just use the +2 tabs on the Celan Rev3 :)
@@NemoPropaganda Hey, thanks for the reply. Yeah, i got them for $950 open box. Not a scratch on them. I thought I'd go for a new amp right away, but i like them with my vintage amps and some slightly less vintage ones. ;) I don't have anything new, so i guess I'm just curious. Thought you might have come across a great pairing. I know it's all subjective, but it was worth a shot. I haven't had an issue with them being too bright on +2 with any amp so far, but it's nice to have the option. I remember seeing a review of that choco amp. I'll keep it in mind for sure. I just realized, the Billie is a lot more than i remember, but it's the second version. I have to admit, it's probably close to what I'd come up with if i was designing something. They seem to know their shit. I know it's not truly audiophile, but i was thinking about the onkyo rz50. I've had them hooked up tp an older onkyo a/v amp for HT and they perform. They also sound great on my marantz 2245. Ah well, choices choices...
A great review, Nemo!! I wish you are a vinyl guy, so you could comment on its phono preamp. 😂
sorry my bro, me talking about vinyl would be me just making it all up lol, I don't know anything about the topic. The only thing I do know is it certainly can sound incredible when done right :)
Vinyl preamp is outstanding
@@jackfalco5351 well, it’s ok… not brilliant…
Currently run Billie MK2 with KLH Model 5, sounds pleasing but sometimes craving those concert level volumes. Mono block Schiit Vidar & Freya S combo would get me there... but how would a single Vidar - Freya S sound compared to Billie MK2?
a single vidar has less power than the billie, I don't think power is your problem. The Model 5 are 90dB efficient and KLH claims they can get up to 112dB in room. Is it possible your room is too big for the speaker? Or perhaps you have very high ceilings? Try adding a subwoofer, most people find they don't listen as loud when a sub is connected.
Were your sound observations of the Billy made through the internal Dac or did you use a separate Dac?
to keep things fair I review all amps the same way, primarily using my node as the source and an ares2 as the dac, this eleminates any differences in sound quality the internal dac may create and allows me to simply focus on the sound quality of each amp in a way that is consistent.
cute amp.
It is an interesting design.
Hey Nemo, great review! Just a quick query. Do you think this integrated amp will pair well with Focal Kanta 1? Will this be able to tame down the brightness and produce a more holographic sound? And lastly, is Heaven 11 a better match than Hegel H190 for the Kanta no. 1? Your views will be highly appreciated. Thank you.
Hi bro, it depends what amp you currently have and how much you want to balance out the Kanta No1, with the gold tubes the billie will help compared to an amp that is neutral or clarity focused. I have a friend that uses the billie/gold tubes with his kanta no1 and likes it very much though his taste leans towards open/airy/bright. Personally I have a feeling the sound you are looking for will be with the CHoco Emei, it doesn't have any features like the Billie so maybe that's a deal breaker but its treble is a little more refined and a little darker and the Kanta can really benifit from that.
Thank you for the prompt reply, Nemo. Appreciate it so much. I have H190. The SQ is ok, but, i like my system to sound holographic. After hearing your Heaven 11 review, it seems like the Billie Heaven 11 can produce a warmer and holographic sound. Am i correct on this assumption?
@@ralphlee4110 if you have the H190 now I do not think the Billie w gold tubes will feel like a big difference, yeah it's a little more holographic but the H190 is already really great and has a smooth & refined top end so if that's still too much with the Kanta No1 you're going to want something even warmer & darker like the CHoco. But ultimately what I really think is perhaps the Kanta No1 are not for you. That is the conclusion I came to for myself and ended up selling my pair. Focal is great for the detail customer, slowly I'm learning I am not the detail customer.
In my mind an amp that can't handle my Zu Audio DW6 speakers is not very versatile. I've used them with my Cayin MT-12N and Willsenton R8 tube amps and Yamaha A-S301 and A-S3200 solid state integrated amps with great results. Of course there are amps on the other end that can't handle low impedance speakers like the Magnepan planars.
I just remembered Steve Guttenberg reviewing this amp and I rewatched it. He used Magnepan and the DW6 speakers with results he really enjoyed, so I guess he didn't get the memo about not using Zu speakers. Could it cause possible damage?
ua-cam.com/video/a2SnIYt4CRA/v-deo.html
I'm not sure if it would cause damage, I just took the mfg advice and didn't try it.
@@NemoPropaganda
Yeah, I would play it safe too. Maybe it could just be an audible effect like distortion.
Class D amplifiers, which are highly efficient and use pulse-width modulation (PWM) to amplify audio signals, might have trouble with a 12-ohm speaker due to a few reasons:
1. **Output Power**: Class D amplifiers are typically designed to deliver maximum power at lower impedances, such as 4 or 8 ohms. With a 12-ohm speaker, the amplifier will deliver less power because the higher impedance limits the current flow, resulting in reduced overall power output. This means the speaker might not be driven as effectively or reach the desired volume levels.
2. **Impedance Matching**: Class D amplifiers often have output filters designed to match the impedance of commonly used speakers (4 to 8 ohms). When using a 12-ohm speaker, the mismatch in impedance can affect the performance of these filters, potentially leading to less accurate sound reproduction and decreased efficiency.
3. **Current Capability**: While Class D amplifiers are efficient and generate less heat, they are also designed with certain current capabilities in mind. Higher impedance speakers require less current, which might lead to the amplifier operating outside its optimal range, potentially affecting its performance and efficiency.
In summary, a Class D amplifier might struggle with a 12-ohm speaker due to reduced power output, potential impedance mismatches affecting filter performance, and operating outside of its designed current capabilities.
@@AuroralActivity
Thanks for the info!
@@AuroralActivity thank you for sharing this information. I'm going to repost it in a pinned post so people can see it.
Bro, with all due respect, you have to stop being lazy, you're mentioning a lot of products you used in your review but don't show ANY photos or videos of the other products you used
Which made this a very boring content. No disrespect bro but please don't use another reviewer point to make it OK to make your point. Yes, you can agree with Thomas, but it's like if Thomas didn't say it, your point is not valid. Other than that, I enjoyed your video.
brother I need you to understand you're talking to someone that runs a YT channel as a side gig because they got bored one day, you're talking to someone that films, edits, & uploads all their content using an old iPhone 13 mini, you're talking to someone that has a fulltime job yet still manages to crank out a video once a week and produces roughly 50+ videos a year, all as a freaking side project for fun. But most importantly you're talking to someone that does what he wants, this is my style, it's not for everyone, I'm not here to make anyone happy, people like me or they dont. My channel is small so most people don't like me I'd say, it's all good baby, the internet isn't real life. As far as Thomas, he's my friend, I'll quote him if I want, why shouldn't I? If you think that means I need his words to have my own I'd say that's extremely judgemental and you've grossly underestimated me. But that's what people do, they see a stranger and they judge and criticize. I'm gonna keep doing me, you're along for the ride or not, no hard feelings either way.
As someone that tried the Billie MK2 w/ Zu DW6 Supreme before the warning on their website, I found it awful.
The sound was very fatiguing. I'm hesitant to call it bright, since that's probably the wrong word and it's difficult to describe, but I simply did not enjoy listening to that pairing at all. The Billie with the Buchardt S400MKII was fine (a huge sound-stage), but I did find it a bit "boring"
@tmr_audio guided to a Quicksilver Audio tube integrated amp for the Zu and it's a wonderful pairing and what I enjoy to this day
I’m guessing you had the standard tubes? Gold was really what made the darn thing shine. With the standard tubes it was for the most part another good amp but nothing special. Personally, I think it should ship with the gold tubes and the standard tubes be an option for those who wish for more neutrality.
@@NemoPropaganda I had the gold tubes and even tube rolled with some of Ebay that I enjoyed even more. It was solid, I just prefer the Zu+Quicksilver combo over Billie+S400 combo
@@MichaelAlanNYC oh yeah, I don't blame you. I love the S400 MK2, but the Zu DWX is just something different. The S400 MK2 is like a high power turbocharged 4 cylinder while the Zu is like a big American V8, it's just more effortless.