Thanks for this, I have a 78-esque rebate plane myself (Record 778), and use of the spur was unclear to me. When I bought my plane, all of the three prongs were unsharpened, so I sharpened one of them. But these stick out quite a bit (as does yours). In my case, it prevented the plane from cutting. Up until now, I just made a saw cut on the side of the rebate (cross grain only, with the grain is fine without spur or saw cut), before removing the waste with the plane. I'll give your method a try (but I'll make sure the spur is razor sharp first)!
I too have a 778. The spurs do need a lot of work to get them to cut easily. A crescent knife shape works really well, allowing scoring both forwards and backwards. Backwards is crucial to score completely before the plane takes a shaving. These planes are sharpened and set, and then used multiple times before needing any further attention. Suggesting multiple similar planes set up for different tasks. Speeds up production and allows for apprentices to use tools they haven't yet learnt how to set up properly. Or is that just an excuse to collect more planes 😉
@@mitchwoodwork thanks for the reply. To me, having a plane set to a standard dimension is indeed an unexpected benefit of working with hand tools. I also have a Record 044 plough plane, and it just has the 1/4" iron set to a sensible dimension for drawer bottoms. Take it out of the box, plough a groove right away, no adjustment needed.
I have had a Record 405 for many years, preferring to use it instead of a router. I worked as a Cabinetmaker for 20 odd years, and now only make for myself and immediate family. In industry I would never have been allowed to use one of these, as speed is of the essence, the electric router and spindle moulder being the tool/machine of choice, but where is the fun in that! One thing I have noticed is you take what I consider to be very heavy cuts. I prefer to take more and lighter passes. I find it gives a better finish, and the blades stay sharp longer. I always use a Veritas honing guide to ensure a perfect bevel, diamond stones to start, and always polishing with an Arkansas Translucent, a surgical polished edge on these cutters really helps, that is half the battle. Another thing I have found useful is the use of pure beeswax (solid) rubbed on the skates and side fence. That really helps cut down the amount of effort needed. Please don’t take my critique the wrong way though, it’s just the way I like to work. One thing I have just discovered is the Stanley 55, with its greater range of cutters for producing mouldings. And I have just purchased a few hollow and round special bases for the 405, which enable you to use the tool as a moulding plane, although I have yet to try them out. I intend to try my hand at making some crown mouldings for a wall cabinet I want to make for my Wife so she can display her Murano glass animals. Great video, and it’s good to see someone else using one. There is lots to learn about them, and I am always looking for more info from other Makers on how to use tools like this. Thanks.
Thanks Kevin. Lovely to hear you use records version of this plane, and always good to know other people's experience and tips. Agree on the heavy cuts, which I only use to hog away waste fast before easing back on the cut for a better finish where necessary. Greatest pleasure is always found when the depth of cut is dialed back and one slips into a gentle rhythm. I'd like to pick up the hollows and rounds set for mine some day too, when I could add to this little series. Cheers
@@mitchwoodwork I have managed to locate 4 of these special bases now, 10 hollow and round, and 8 hollow and round. I am now on the hunt for a pair of 6 hollow and round. They’re quite rare. They also did a 12 hollow and round and a nosing tool for stair treads. I will keep collecting. The other thing I have just bought at great expense was a Stanley 55, which has a 3rd adjustable skate and you can also angle the 2 fences, opening up a whole new vista of achievable cuts.....check one out on UA-cam if you are not familiar.....but it’s basically a more complex Stanley 45. There are a range of moulding profile cutters available for them live ovolos and other stuff. I will let you know how I get on.
Well done! Ditto my dado comments, faster strokes starting with short strokes at the far end and progressively lengthening them back toward you will yield great rewards. Again, I don't mess with the depth of cut after I'm getting a decent shaving and I leave the spurs alone(mine are shorter on one leg) Give it a try and let me know what you think.
Thank you for your detailed explanation! I've used my 45 for a dozen or so projects and often had issues not knowing exactly how to set it up and making a mess being too greedy and forgetting to prevent tear out, always having to come back with unnecessary chisel work. Between you and Roy Underhill (And 20 other teachers...) I'll be cranking out boxes with confidence! I do have a clarification, if you can. When you set the spacing of the two metal plates/runners that support the blade, you were about 3/8" 5/16"? Then in use it looked a little closer, then in the final shot they look almost bedded directly against each other. That's been one of my wonderings; should it be right at the edge of the blade, halfway between? 2/3rds of the width of the blade, 7/8ths? Edit:...I listened back again and heard you say, "~Adding that extra support behind the blade in the right position...will help hold the blade firmly and make the cut easier.~" So I'm going to deduce that somewhere past half and somewhere before flush with the edge? Edit: I like Roy's design and jigs, so I've been watching him back after seeing Wood by Wright's box from firewood today. In his Sliding Lid Boxes episode (www.pbs.org/video/woodwrights-shop-sliding-lid-boxes/) at 5 minutes in he is using a 45 to plow a groove, but doesn't have the second one attached, is that typical then for smaller width blades and/or long grain situations? Thanks again, I think I'm getting it now!?
Thank you for your praise. You're spot on with the blade support, and in the case of the smallest width blades no second skate is required or even possible (since the smallest cutters will not plough a groove wide enough for both). Good luck, and go to it!
Just bought the same plane you are using. It is intimidating but I figure I watch enough vids I should be fairly comfy with it. First to build a box. The cardboard box it came in is moldy and breaking up. I am left handed and wonder it this is going to be a problem. If so I will sell it and get a Veritas left handed plane. Takes all the same cutters. Thanks for the helpful info.
I'm not sure how you'll get on with it being left handed. Have you considered trying right handed planing? I only say that because I am trying to plane left handed; practising a little every weekend. I have arthritis, so trying to spread the load and keep woodworking as long as possible.
I'd say the 45 isn't quite as good as the others, but very capable. Because the 45 was designed to do so many different functions, each one is slightly compromised.
Is it possible to remake the notch in a blade that has been retracted without loosening the wingnut (and broken off the top end)? I notice in your other video on blade sharpening that a couple of your blades had no notch.
@@mitchwoodwork Thanks for your reply. It was the thinnest rebate blade in my 55 set (1/8 inch). I just had a go with a fine round file after starting it in the right place with a saw file - being very careful it didn't remove too much from the width. And it worked! (Have a go with yours.) I think the previous owner wasn't too careful in releasing the wing nut before retracting the blades because the next size up was also bent upwards a bit. The blades must be unhardened at the top end at least. I've learnt quite a lot from your series on these planes. Do you have a 55? I'm still not sure about all the features available.
That's good to know. Pleased you had success. I don't have a 55, but the ability to off-set one skate from the other is one advantage. If I get one, I'll be sure and do a series on it.
Good video. The #45 was a complete disaster back in the day. Back then many men could not read or even sign their name. So why even include a manual with the plane? In short, these planes were shelved after such a short use. Hence, why there are so many coming out of dusty garages and put on ebay.
Very informative demo, clearly captured and edited, well done mate, thanks
Cheers
Excellent video with superb photography. Good idea to use the tear out preventing block at the end of the piece.
EMTdrummer Many thanks. I had fun doing it. Happy woodworking, Mitch
Thanks for this, I have a 78-esque rebate plane myself (Record 778), and use of the spur was unclear to me. When I bought my plane, all of the three prongs were unsharpened, so I sharpened one of them. But these stick out quite a bit (as does yours). In my case, it prevented the plane from cutting. Up until now, I just made a saw cut on the side of the rebate (cross grain only, with the grain is fine without spur or saw cut), before removing the waste with the plane. I'll give your method a try (but I'll make sure the spur is razor sharp first)!
I too have a 778. The spurs do need a lot of work to get them to cut easily. A crescent knife shape works really well, allowing scoring both forwards and backwards. Backwards is crucial to score completely before the plane takes a shaving. These planes are sharpened and set, and then used multiple times before needing any further attention. Suggesting multiple similar planes set up for different tasks. Speeds up production and allows for apprentices to use tools they haven't yet learnt how to set up properly. Or is that just an excuse to collect more planes 😉
@@mitchwoodwork thanks for the reply. To me, having a plane set to a standard dimension is indeed an unexpected benefit of working with hand tools. I also have a Record 044 plough plane, and it just has the 1/4" iron set to a sensible dimension for drawer bottoms. Take it out of the box, plough a groove right away, no adjustment needed.
This was a wonderful video. Succinct and to the point.
Thanks
Great instructional on the Stanley No 45. Thank you!
Matt Vredenburg Cheers
I have had a Record 405 for many years, preferring to use it instead of a router. I worked as a Cabinetmaker for 20 odd years, and now only make for myself and immediate family. In industry I would never have been allowed to use one of these, as speed is of the essence, the electric router and spindle moulder being the tool/machine of choice, but where is the fun in that! One thing I have noticed is you take what I consider to be very heavy cuts. I prefer to take more and lighter passes. I find it gives a better finish, and the blades stay sharp longer. I always use a Veritas honing guide to ensure a perfect bevel, diamond stones to start, and always polishing with an Arkansas Translucent, a surgical polished edge on these cutters really helps, that is half the battle. Another thing I have found useful is the use of pure beeswax (solid) rubbed on the skates and side fence. That really helps cut down the amount of effort needed. Please don’t take my critique the wrong way though, it’s just the way I like to work. One thing I have just discovered is the Stanley 55, with its greater range of cutters for producing mouldings. And I have just purchased a few hollow and round special bases for the 405, which enable you to use the tool as a moulding plane, although I have yet to try them out. I intend to try my hand at making some crown mouldings for a wall cabinet I want to make for my Wife so she can display her Murano glass animals. Great video, and it’s good to see someone else using one. There is lots to learn about them, and I am always looking for more info from other Makers on how to use tools like this. Thanks.
Thanks Kevin. Lovely to hear you use records version of this plane, and always good to know other people's experience and tips. Agree on the heavy cuts, which I only use to hog away waste fast before easing back on the cut for a better finish where necessary. Greatest pleasure is always found when the depth of cut is dialed back and one slips into a gentle rhythm. I'd like to pick up the hollows and rounds set for mine some day too, when I could add to this little series.
Cheers
@@mitchwoodwork I have managed to locate 4 of these special bases now, 10 hollow and round, and 8 hollow and round. I am now on the hunt for a pair of 6 hollow and round. They’re quite rare. They also did a 12 hollow and round and a nosing tool for stair treads. I will keep collecting. The other thing I have just bought at great expense was a Stanley 55, which has a 3rd adjustable skate and you can also angle the 2 fences, opening up a whole new vista of achievable cuts.....check one out on UA-cam if you are not familiar.....but it’s basically a more complex Stanley 45. There are a range of moulding profile cutters available for them live ovolos and other stuff. I will let you know how I get on.
Yeah, good video. Look forward to more with the 45.
Allan Reekie Thank you Allan, plenty more to come.
Very useful video. Extremely well presented. Thanks
Robert Millstein Thanks Robert
Thanks for getting me straightened out on that spur.
Great demonstration Mitch, thanks for sharing it.
Cheers Bill
Well done! Ditto my dado comments, faster strokes starting with short strokes at the far end and progressively lengthening them back toward you will yield great rewards. Again, I don't mess with the depth of cut after I'm getting a decent shaving and I leave the spurs alone(mine are shorter on one leg) Give it a try and let me know what you think.
Thank you for your detailed explanation! I've used my 45 for a dozen or so projects and often had issues not knowing exactly how to set it up and making a mess being too greedy and forgetting to prevent tear out, always having to come back with unnecessary chisel work. Between you and Roy Underhill (And 20 other teachers...) I'll be cranking out boxes with confidence!
I do have a clarification, if you can. When you set the spacing of the two metal plates/runners that support the blade, you were about 3/8" 5/16"? Then in use it looked a little closer, then in the final shot they look almost bedded directly against each other. That's been one of my wonderings; should it be right at the edge of the blade, halfway between? 2/3rds of the width of the blade, 7/8ths?
Edit:...I listened back again and heard you say, "~Adding that extra support behind the blade in the right position...will help hold the blade firmly and make the cut easier.~" So I'm going to deduce that somewhere past half and somewhere before flush with the edge?
Edit: I like Roy's design and jigs, so I've been watching him back after seeing Wood by Wright's box from firewood today. In his Sliding Lid Boxes episode (www.pbs.org/video/woodwrights-shop-sliding-lid-boxes/) at 5 minutes in he is using a 45 to plow a groove, but doesn't have the second one attached, is that typical then for smaller width blades and/or long grain situations?
Thanks again, I think I'm getting it now!?
Thank you for your praise. You're spot on with the blade support, and in the case of the smallest width blades no second skate is required or even possible (since the smallest cutters will not plough a groove wide enough for both). Good luck, and go to it!
Just bought the same plane you are using. It is intimidating but I figure I watch enough vids I should be fairly comfy with it. First to build a box. The cardboard box it came in is moldy and breaking up. I am left handed and wonder it this is going to be a problem. If so I will sell it and get a Veritas left handed plane. Takes all the same cutters. Thanks for the helpful info.
I'm not sure how you'll get on with it being left handed. Have you considered trying right handed planing? I only say that because I am trying to plane left handed; practising a little every weekend. I have arthritis, so trying to spread the load and keep woodworking as long as possible.
Fantastic! Thank you. Any comment on whether the Stanley 45 does a better job than the Veritas Skew Rabbet Plane or the Stanley 78?
I'd say the 45 isn't quite as good as the others, but very capable. Because the 45 was designed to do so many different functions, each one is slightly compromised.
Nicely explained..Thank you..
+glass house Cheers!
Good video. I've seen you use a Stanley 78 also. Which do you prefer for rabbets?
Scott Adams Hi Scott, I prefer the #78, a dedicated plane, with a proper mouth!Cheers, Mitch
Thanks!
WOmadeOD - Made in Wood with Mitch Peacock
Agreed, no contest! The 78 and its clones are wonderful tools.
Can a Record 044 be used for cross-grain rebates?
Yes, but I think you would need to score the cut line first, with a cutting gauge, unless it has nickers (spurs) that line up with the cutter edge.
Is it possible to remake the notch in a blade that has been retracted without loosening the wingnut (and broken off the top end)? I notice in your other video on blade sharpening that a couple of your blades had no notch.
I've not tried it, but I don't see why not. Probably the whole iron is hardened so it isn't necessity easy.
@@mitchwoodwork Thanks for your reply. It was the thinnest rebate blade in my 55 set (1/8 inch).
I just had a go with a fine round file after starting it in the right place with a saw file - being very careful it didn't remove too much from the width. And it worked! (Have a go with yours.)
I think the previous owner wasn't too careful in releasing the wing nut before retracting the blades because the next size up was also bent upwards a bit.
The blades must be unhardened at the top end at least.
I've learnt quite a lot from your series on these planes. Do you have a 55? I'm still not sure about all the features available.
That's good to know. Pleased you had success.
I don't have a 55, but the ability to off-set one skate from the other is one advantage. If I get one, I'll be sure and do a series on it.
Is a Stanley 45 worth it if you got a veritas small plow plane and dedicated rebate plane?
Depends what you want to do. Watch the whole series on the #45 and you'll see what it's capable of.
Nice job buddy
Ken Haygarth Cheers Ken
Good video. The #45 was a complete disaster back in the day. Back then many men could not read or even sign their name. So why even include a manual with the plane? In short, these planes were shelved after such a short use. Hence, why there are so many coming out of dusty garages and put on ebay.
+Robert Cornelius Good point. Our luck then really.
This is not rebate plane.. but plough plane
The #45 is a combination plane, capable of and designed for many functions.
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