Thanks Dema having proved your point through scientific experimentation it leaves little to question, demonstrated proof is the best proof. Now all I have to do is get off the pot and get a POT.
If the wood was completely dry so to avoid the reaction with water, how do you think the pressure would compare with the open air piece? Watching the video a couple of times it looks fairly clear. When I was into casting I would always bake my wood at 170 degrees for around an hour to drive off as much moisture as possible.
Dema, great experiement and I love it! I do a lot of this sort of thing and have experimented a lot with it too, let me tell you what I have found! Pressure pot is definitely the best route but a lot of people are scared of them (pressure is safe if you follow the instructions and deadly if you mess with it!). Sometimes you cant use pressure too (if the piece is very large etc). I have some solutions for casting without pressure pots and I do this successfully myself. Solution 1. Use a longer pot time resin. I use Gedeo Crystal Clear and its got a 4 hour pot time and takes 30 hours to set up. This is waaay longer than Alumilite but it gives all those bubbles a lot of time to surface and it really does help. Its much more watery too so the bubbles have less problem surfacing which brings me to... Solution 2. Warm your alumilite in a basin of hot water. Warm alumilite will flow a lot better and consequently will get the bubbles out easier because its more watery... Solution 3. 1. Vacuum in cactus juice (methlacrylate resin) into the piece to start. This avoids having air come out of the wood and seals it up nicely. Also looks great if you use a dye with it. Make sure to bake the wood to dry it before you do this (or any solution) as resin does not like water. Solution 4. Give you alumilite a helping hand by vaccuming it briefly immediately after stirring. So I mix it up, nice and warm, stick it in the vacuum for maybe a minute possibly 90 seconds and open and close the valve to stop it madly foaming. This helps evacuate the bubbles from the alumilite but you need to be fast, dont do this 5 minutes after mixing!! Also dont do this with the wood in it or you will draw air out of the wood into the resin, defeating the purpose! Its just for quickly helping those bubbles get out of the resin. In all, a pressure pot is still the best way to go but these tricks can also help even WITH a pot ... I'd love to see you redo the experiment with dry wood and some of these too!
Did you leave the cup under vacuum the whole time until the resin set? Didn't quite get if you did that or not. You're supposed to quickly vacuum out the air and then let the resin set at normal atmospheric pressure. This works very well for slow set resins. Perhaps Alumilite sets too quick for the foam to settle down before getting too hard. I don't know. There's a lot of air in the wood, so I think one must pump that out first, then somehow add the resin still under full vacuum, and then suck the bubbles in the resin out, then take the casting out and let it set, open on the bench. I guess not worth the hassle. :p [edit] Never mind. I found this that pretty much answers what I was thinking. Alumilite sets too quick, and with a pressure pot you don't remove the bubbles, you just compress them down to a size you can't see. :) ua-cam.com/video/yUerBWjMajE/v-deo.html
Thanks for the comparison that is very good info. I have seen other guys degas the A and B parts separately and then mix slowly, cast and then pressurize it. The stuff you are doing comes out really clear and with no bubbles so that looks like a wasted step.
The open air and pressure pot I figured out would end like that The thing about vacuum casting, if you Degassed parts a and b first, then mixed, and right in to the vac, it may of ended differently, however 7 min set time is Too fast as you said for the vac operation. I get great results with vacuum casting and using the clear amazing casting resin with 45 min pot life
Thank you for showing the difference. I have been looking for a good explanation. Your examples explained it well and visually. I now understand. Thank you
I've been watching Zac Higgins and your videos, in preparation for my first casting. You both have addressed pretty much all there is to know about casting wit this awesome product. I'm a jewelry designer/maker. This will be a new adventure for me, mixing the wood and resin to make jewelry. I'm so excited to see how it will turn out. Thanks for this and your other videos!
I just got my first blank out of the pressure pot and I just love the color of the resin (I used a darker blue hue from the pearl powders) and a piece of wood I stabilized earlier today. I'm hooked! Thanks again, you truly made this posses much more easier with all your instructional videos.
Nice video! I have used polyurethane resins a lot in my art, and though I know Alumilite is different, there are a few techniques that I think will still apply. One thing I notice is that you stir like crazy, which introduces a ton of bubbles. Going slow, and pouring into a second cup to stir again, slowly!, will make sure you're fully mixed, and going slow will keep out a lot of bubbles. When you pour, you just dump it in. Not totally bad, not all at once, but still a little faster / thicker than you should. The best pour is from high up in as thin a stream as you can manage. This helps remove bubbles as well. For the left out piece, this would eliminate most of the bubbles you had. I understood that the vacuum tube is not a permanent thing - you do it for a short period to pull out bubbles, not constantly. That may be part of the reason for the foam. This could be a difference between alumilite and polyurethane, but I suspect not. I don't use a vacuum tube or pressure pot, and I've had very good results with no bubbles. I do lots of shallow layers, which helps (my art ends up with a 3d effect), but even the thicker casts were pretty clean. And that's with a 24 hour wait, and around 4 hours before it was gelled.
Aidan Grey Thanks Aiden, i speed up the video when i stir lol,, and the 7 minute working window doesnt allow me to stir slower. And i have tryied slowing the pour. only to have the resin set on me as im pouring it...
***** Oh see, it IS a urethane/alumilite issue. I know you speed it up, but even at normal speed, you go fast, but there's a reason for it. And also - there's the adherence issue that the pressure pot helps with too, so... obviously it's the best way. One other thing I noticed - you always mix the two parts first, then add in the colorants. It may not work, depending on how you tell when they're mixed, but adding the colorants / pearlex to one part first, then mixing the two, might give you more time. Anyway, great demo and great channel! I really like everything you've done so far - impressive!
After working for 35 years with all types of resin in a myriad of ways , using a pressure pot is not the answer due to foaming at the beginning of the process. Also foaming is not caused by the releasing CO2, well not all of it. The majority is because of displacing air in the wood while under a vacuum and not having enough time to displace it. The pot life is waaaay too short. There are ways around it but there is a cost, time and materials. Actually you could add denatured alcohol, put it under a vacuum in a sandwich bag shaped close to the size of the part to use less material. Grind off back to the wood then do it again till all of the air is displaced and foaming is minimized. Once the air has been displaced you will have a uniform density in a matrix of wood and resin. This solves more complex issues when dealing with temperature changes such as going from 30F to 120F. After you have built a stable substrate then you customize it, then use the pressure pot to minimize bubbles from mixing.
This applies if you mix your resin&hardner really fast. If you pace yourself and mix slowly you will have no bubbles. But this can be applied if you have one small casting.
Using a vacuum chamber will pull air out of the wood (causing bubbles), pull moisture out of the wood (reacting with and spoiling the resin) and if you get the pressure low enough cause the resin to boil.
The moisture in the wood is probably reacting with one of the Alumilite components and releasing CO2. As you have learned from experience the wood should be as dry as possible. Even in the absence of moisture the bubbles you see without applying pressure are probably due to an Alumilite side reaction that again releases CO2. I don't know if applying pressure suppresses that reaction or whether the pressure just keeps the CO2 from forming bubbles. When you applied vacuum you were probably getting combination of normal degassing and pulling out the CO2 as it forms. All in all and interesting experiment. Thanks for sharing.
So what temp in a toaster oven? I bought a toster ovenbto dry wood and then to cure after pump/cactus juice... what temp to dry surface moisture or whatever moisture from wood. I'm a newbie. I plan to weigh, cook and weigh again until it stays one weight showing it has been dryed.
Take your piece of wood, and put it in your vacuum chamber. This will remove any moisture in your wood. Then put your wood, and resin in your pressure chamber.
After extensive testing with all types of resins, if your workpieces are small then no you do not need a pressure or vacuum pot providing you can apply heat using a heat gun to release the bubbles. However, if you intend to turn the pieces at high speed on a lathe - especially if they are larger than a pen blank, then for safety you need a pressure pot to ensure it bubble free and stop the piece exploding on the lathe (it happens when the gouges catch a large bubble)
Hi...sorry for my english. I am interested in what you say. I am new in this and I want to see what do I have to buy. I want to make pen...so..I can eliminate the bubbles just using a heat gun? Thanks
I like the video. For alumilite, you are probably right. Do you think you would have better results with an epoxy or other material that has a longer working time?
First off great demonstration of the 3 ways. The question I have is. Could you use some kind of vibration device to help draw the air out? Maybe not for a clear cast but a colored one. Thanks
All of that air in the vacuum sample came from the wood, the way I have always done it is to mix the resin, vacuum it (it will foam slightly, then break, thats how you know it is done, it should only take a few seconds), then pour the resin over the wood (slowly to avoid adding air to the mix), then put it in the pressure pot. This method will give you the very best results.
Hmmm, never heard of them. I use Alumilite, and vacuum actually vaporizes some of the resin ingredients which is another reason Alumilite does not work with vacuum, even stabilized wood will fail.
While I've not done it since I don't turn, wouldn't it work to seal (paint) the wood with a thin coat (or 2) of resin, allowing them to dry and making sure there was complete coverage, THEN casting the resin and letting it dry in the open? As long as you mix carefully and avoid creating bubbles in the resin, you would not get any bubbles from the wood. Warming the resin slightly would help with bubbles as well.
Dema, could you make one more try? Mix resin and then degass it in the vacuum, then pour over the wood. I suppose all the foam you have got was from air and moisture from wood. What I propose is to use a degassed resin, and harden it under normal pressure.
In order to avoid adding air back into the resin after degassing separate is to mix slowly, there is a 7 minute working window, so I know this will still not work. I have tried everything in the 3 years I have been doing this, and pressure casting is the only way to go
Dema, if you will not mix degassed resin, there will be no air absorbed. I've seen *many* tries of transparent resin with using void and it was perfect result every time, even for 5 minute resin - degassing take short time. What I'm trying to point is that this comparison is not 100% correct because you got problems caused by degasing resin and wood together.
Lol actually I do like solid critisizm, and I can see where you may think that my video demonstration is flawd, but believe me, I have tried it all, and in the end a pressure pot is required. I don't own stock in pressure pots ;)
Hello I am French and understand a little English, but not enough to follow conversations. also, not having the translation of your videos, it is difficult for me sometimes, so I have questions that I could then translate using an application. I would like to congratulate you for your achievements on your channel that I have just discovered. also, I am interested in creating stabilized wood blocks. From what I understand, you prefer the pressure method, instead of depression (stabilization), because it is more efficient and faster? stabilization in the resin first requires removal by suction, then putting the block of wood in the resin and waiting?, while the pressure technique seems shorter because the block is directly placed in the epoxy mixture and hardener, and put under pressure for some time (I don't know the duration, and if you can tell me?)? in fact, the second method is all in one, so the first is first a stabilization in resin and then use this block of wood to put it in epoxy, and let it dry? thank you for your answers and continue, it's great. cordially Xavier
Great video, well done and very useful information. Thanks. I see some folks saying you don't need pressure pot for Liquid Diamond, any advice on that would be appreciated. Thanks again.
CO2 formation is caused by water in the wood reacting with the prepolymer (part B). With this type of resin system applying pressure surpasses the formation of CO2 and hence the bubbles. Applying vacuum will merely remove the dissolved air. Drying the wood and applying pressure both should lead to better quality castings.
Hi I learn a lot from your UA-cam channel love wood and Mother Nature , anyway my question is can I put my casting piece twice in the pressure pot . I have so many ideas 💡 😁 I want to put a small item in the middle of the resin but I'm scare , I wish I can sent you a picture of what I'm taking about 😟
Vacuum pot is not for casting. V. P. Is for vacuuming before resin and mold sets up. The pressure pot is for resin during it's cure finish. There's a technique must follow
Hi I like your video as I am new to pen making can you please explain how the pressure pot works, like how it works and how much you can put in the pot. Graham in England
+scottfree well a pressure pot does exactly what it sounds like, it put your blanks under pressure. pressure compresses the air bubbles in the resin making in nice and invisible. and you can fit as much as the pressure pot will fit, there are different sizes.
When you lower the pressure you also lower the boiling point of a fluid. So, my guess is that your vacuum experiment is simply making your resin boil. If that's the case then you are introducing even more gas than the amount of air that was present before. Because now also your resin is turning to gas.
With the vacuum though, you are sucking the air out and it is being replaced by the resin, this fully impregnates the wood with resin instead of encasing it. Good if you have a piece of wood the size or larger than you want to use but not if its smaller. This is done with spalted wood for knife handles.
You are referring to stabilizing resin that is under vacuum for hours and is much thinner in viscosity and then heated to cure/harden it. In this video I use a two part resin that cures in 7-10 minutes and former give you enough time to remove the air and replace it with this resin.
Dema, could you pour layers of the alumilite and torch it each time, would that work to remove all of the air bubbles? And would you need to sand between?
Great, thank you :) btw there might be a trick to solve the problem with the vacuum ;) just "laquer" the piece of wood with epoxy, let it cure and then try the process again with the vacuum...might not work with the resin system you are using due to the limited amount of potlife time but should work with a longer potlife time epoxy resin ;) or degass the resin only then pour it in the cup with the wood
To fet rid of the bubbles in the 2nd one couldnt u have used a heat gun? Or is that a differe t type of resin? Thanks for the demo probably saved some people some money and a head ache..
Joe basementwoodworking i have never tried a heat gun, bt it seems a few people think that will work. maybe a follow up experiment. I know heat works well with Polyester resin, not sure about alumilite, i think the heat will just speed up the curing process.
Thank you much! Subscribed for sure. I’m looking to get into casting for small items for turning and other artisan projects. Would you say it is worth using a pressure pot for any resin casting?
Awesome test Dema! I've been meaning to try vacuum with resins for a while. I'm still curious how PR or epoxy will work under vacuum, but it obviously doesn't work with Alumilite! Do you usually bake dry your wood before casting and stabilizing?
Zac Higgins thanks Zac, maybe youcan do the video on PR and epoxy :). this time of the year its pretty humid in my shop and i do normally bake them over night before casting.
Dear Dmitry (I'm from Russia and I ask forgiveness for my English) ... Please tell me: what is necessary power of the vacuum pump? I plan to make the plastic for the handles of the knives of the polyester resin and acrylic resin and stabilize the wood, in particular polyester (for sale). If you can, please provide the necessary engine harrakteristiki
I'm not trying to be a jerk or say the pressure pot isn't the way to go but you did the vacuum wrong. You needed to vacuum the resin without the wood then slowly pour it over the wood. The reason the vac didn't work and you continued to get the air bubbles (not foam) was because the vac was trying to suck the air out of the wood. If you have stabilized wood you know it take a while to get the air out and then the resin gets sucked into the wood. Which is also why to cure that resin you have to bake it, to allow enough time for you to get all the air out. But it only should take less than a minute or two to remove the air from that much Alumilite resin. Try it again without the wood in the vac and you will be surprised how well it works.
Cory, your not being a jerk at all , this a perfectly good observation. But I have discussed this with Alumilite company and they actually say that using vacuum with Alumilite vaporizes some of the engrediants, but it seems people keep thinking that's it's possible, so I just may try it again some day. Thank you :)
I would just stick with the pressure pot. But if someone has a vac and only plans to do it a couple times and don't want to buy a pot then you can make the vac work. Degassing with a vac is really only meant for silicon or stabilizing type resins (cactus juice) anyways.
Great test Dema. I wonder if a centrifuge would work to remove bubbles if you could leave the piece spinning until it set up... Hmmmm. Anybody out there have a centrifuge and some Alumalite?
Thanks, Really answered questions for me. I have done the "stabilization" with Cactus Juice in a Vac and had good results. This shows I really do need the pressure pot to finish resin casting. Thanks
a vacuum is only needed if you want to color stabalize wood. for casting a pressure pot or simpler just a plain simple heatgun! yes a heatgun gets rid of all the bubbles
When you plug the air for the pressure pot, the compressor was turned off...you just fill the pressure pot with the appropriated pressure (40psi) and when reach the number just unplugged it?
Yes, you can. I've done it. I typically "clean" it up a bit with a toothbrush to knock off dirt or loose parts, then go for it (if you've dried the wood).
Ciao ho visto il tuo video e mi sono iscritto purtroppo non conosco L inglese,vorrei sapere se stai dicendo nel video che è meglio la pentola del vuoto o la pentola sotto pressione grazie NJK
Thanks Dema having proved your point through scientific experimentation it leaves little to question, demonstrated proof is the best proof. Now all I have to do is get off the pot and get a POT.
Haha, send me the pot ;)
***** Hope he wasn't talking about a chamber pot... lol ;)
If the wood was completely dry so to avoid the reaction with water, how do you think the pressure would compare with the open air piece? Watching the video a couple of times it looks fairly clear. When I was into casting I would always bake my wood at 170 degrees for around an hour to drive off as much moisture as possible.
Dema, great experiement and I love it!
I do a lot of this sort of thing and have experimented a lot with it too, let me tell you what I have found!
Pressure pot is definitely the best route but a lot of people are scared of them (pressure is safe if you follow the instructions and deadly if you mess with it!). Sometimes you cant use pressure too (if the piece is very large etc).
I have some solutions for casting without pressure pots and I do this successfully myself.
Solution 1.
Use a longer pot time resin. I use Gedeo Crystal Clear and its got a 4 hour pot time and takes 30 hours to set up. This is waaay longer than Alumilite but it gives all those bubbles a lot of time to surface and it really does help. Its much more watery too so the bubbles have less problem surfacing which brings me to...
Solution 2.
Warm your alumilite in a basin of hot water. Warm alumilite will flow a lot better and consequently will get the bubbles out easier because its more watery...
Solution 3.
1. Vacuum in cactus juice (methlacrylate resin) into the piece to start. This avoids having air come out of the wood and seals it up nicely. Also looks great if you use a dye with it. Make sure to bake the wood to dry it before you do this (or any solution) as resin does not like water.
Solution 4.
Give you alumilite a helping hand by vaccuming it briefly immediately after stirring. So I mix it up, nice and warm, stick it in the vacuum for maybe a minute possibly 90 seconds and open and close the valve to stop it madly foaming. This helps evacuate the bubbles from the alumilite but you need to be fast, dont do this 5 minutes after mixing!! Also dont do this with the wood in it or you will draw air out of the wood into the resin, defeating the purpose! Its just for quickly helping those bubbles get out of the resin.
In all, a pressure pot is still the best way to go but these tricks can also help even WITH a pot ... I'd love to see you redo the experiment with dry wood and some of these too!
Did you leave the cup under vacuum the whole time until the resin set? Didn't quite get if you did that or not. You're supposed to quickly vacuum out the air and then let the resin set at normal atmospheric pressure. This works very well for slow set resins. Perhaps Alumilite sets too quick for the foam to settle down before getting too hard. I don't know. There's a lot of air in the wood, so I think one must pump that out first, then somehow add the resin still under full vacuum, and then suck the bubbles in the resin out, then take the casting out and let it set, open on the bench. I guess not worth the hassle. :p
[edit] Never mind. I found this that pretty much answers what I was thinking. Alumilite sets too quick, and with a pressure pot you don't remove the bubbles, you just compress them down to a size you can't see. :)
ua-cam.com/video/yUerBWjMajE/v-deo.html
Lol glad you were able to find the answer to your question
Thanks for showing these examples Dema. You kinda look like a mad scientist doing it!
GuysWoodshop haha thanks Guy
Thanks for the comparison that is very good info. I have seen other guys degas the A and B parts separately and then mix slowly, cast and then pressurize it. The stuff you are doing comes out really clear and with no bubbles so that looks like a wasted step.
Nice demonstration. I've never done any casting but it looks like fun.
Dema - perfect explanation and demo - thanks for taking the time - you answered my questions
The open air and pressure pot I figured out would end like that
The thing about vacuum casting, if you Degassed parts a and b first, then mixed, and right in to the vac, it may of ended differently, however 7 min set time is Too fast as you said for the vac operation.
I get great results with vacuum casting and using the clear amazing casting resin with 45 min pot life
Best explanation and demonstration comparing different processes I have seen👍👏👌. Thanks a million
Great demo, Dema! It's good to see what happens with each one.
Thanks Matt :)
So much foam with the vacuum!
Andrew Klein Vacuum chamber foam drawers! The easiest drawers you will ever make!
Matthew Cremona b
Great test Dema. I was surprised to see the vacuum make all that foam. Thanks for the vid my friend
Thanks for the demo Dema. People should trust the pros when it comes to this.
Haha thanks Larry, we will wait for the pros to chime in ;)
Excellent demo. I think that will answer a lot of peoples questions. Thanks.
It will for sure, I get this question asked atleast a couple times a day
Thank you for showing the difference. I have been looking for a good explanation. Your examples explained it well and visually. I now understand. Thank you
I've been watching Zac Higgins and your videos, in preparation for my first casting. You both have addressed pretty much all there is to know about casting wit this awesome product. I'm a jewelry designer/maker. This will be a new adventure for me, mixing the wood and resin to make jewelry. I'm so excited to see how it will turn out. Thanks for this and your other videos!
Thank you for watching Aide, and good luck in your journey with casting. It's a lot of fun :)
I just got my first blank out of the pressure pot and I just love the color of the resin (I used a darker blue hue from the pearl powders) and a piece of wood I stabilized earlier today. I'm hooked! Thanks again, you truly made this posses much more easier with all your instructional videos.
Awesome :)
Nice video! I have used polyurethane resins a lot in my art, and though I know Alumilite is different, there are a few techniques that I think will still apply.
One thing I notice is that you stir like crazy, which introduces a ton of bubbles. Going slow, and pouring into a second cup to stir again, slowly!, will make sure you're fully mixed, and going slow will keep out a lot of bubbles.
When you pour, you just dump it in. Not totally bad, not all at once, but still a little faster / thicker than you should. The best pour is from high up in as thin a stream as you can manage. This helps remove bubbles as well. For the left out piece, this would eliminate most of the bubbles you had.
I understood that the vacuum tube is not a permanent thing - you do it for a short period to pull out bubbles, not constantly. That may be part of the reason for the foam. This could be a difference between alumilite and polyurethane, but I suspect not.
I don't use a vacuum tube or pressure pot, and I've had very good results with no bubbles. I do lots of shallow layers, which helps (my art ends up with a 3d effect), but even the thicker casts were pretty clean. And that's with a 24 hour wait, and around 4 hours before it was gelled.
Aidan Grey Thanks Aiden, i speed up the video when i stir lol,, and the 7 minute working window doesnt allow me to stir slower. And i have tryied slowing the pour. only to have the resin set on me as im pouring it...
***** Oh see, it IS a urethane/alumilite issue. I know you speed it up, but even at normal speed, you go fast, but there's a reason for it. And also - there's the adherence issue that the pressure pot helps with too, so... obviously it's the best way.
One other thing I noticed - you always mix the two parts first, then add in the colorants. It may not work, depending on how you tell when they're mixed, but adding the colorants / pearlex to one part first, then mixing the two, might give you more time.
Anyway, great demo and great channel! I really like everything you've done so far - impressive!
After working for 35 years with all types of resin in a myriad of ways , using a pressure pot is not the answer due to foaming at the beginning of the process. Also foaming is not caused by the releasing CO2, well not all of it.
The majority is because of displacing air in the wood while under a vacuum and not having enough time to displace it. The pot life is waaaay too short. There are ways around it but there is a cost, time and materials.
Actually you could add denatured alcohol, put it under a vacuum in a sandwich bag shaped close to the size of the part to use less material. Grind off back to the wood then do it again till all of the air is displaced and foaming is minimized. Once the air has been displaced you will have a uniform density in a matrix of wood and resin. This solves more complex issues when dealing with temperature changes such as going from 30F to 120F.
After you have built a stable substrate then you customize it, then use the pressure pot to minimize bubbles from mixing.
thank you for the info :)
Thanks for sharing your findings Dema. I always wondered about the vacuum chamber, now I have the answer.
Glad I helped :)
Super informative! I really really liked the side-by-side examples. Very well done!
:)
This applies if you mix your resin&hardner really fast. If you pace yourself and mix slowly you will have no bubbles. But this can be applied if you have one small casting.
Using a vacuum chamber will pull air out of the wood (causing bubbles), pull moisture out of the wood (reacting with and spoiling the resin) and if you get the pressure low enough cause the resin to boil.
Yes, he should have put the wood under vacuum first to boil off all the moisture.
Great video, you answered my thoughts about what you did. Using caucus juice to treat my dried up wood.
The moisture in the wood is probably reacting with one of the Alumilite components and releasing CO2. As you have learned from experience the wood should be as dry as possible.
Even in the absence of moisture the bubbles you see without applying pressure are probably due to an Alumilite side reaction that again releases CO2. I don't know if applying pressure suppresses that reaction or whether the pressure just keeps the CO2 from forming bubbles.
When you applied vacuum you were probably getting combination of normal degassing and pulling out the CO2 as it forms.
All in all and interesting experiment. Thanks for sharing.
So what temp in a toaster oven? I bought a toster ovenbto dry wood and then to cure after pump/cactus juice... what temp to dry surface moisture or whatever moisture from wood. I'm a newbie. I plan to weigh, cook and weigh again until it stays one weight showing it has been dryed.
Thanks for the video, I'm just starting casting, it helped
This was a much needed video. Glad I saw this! It answered everything!
This was a great demonstration! Good job sir!
Thanks for using our product. :)
Fantastic information, I'll make sure to pass this along to my wife. She is interesting in getting into casting.
Great demo. I really like the red and blue blanks at the end of the video. But that's natural for me, as I am a Jayhawks fan. Thanks for the video.
Yeah they sure are nice, thanks for watching David . How's the mallet?
i want to buy a pressure pot, do u have some links?
That's a cool experiment. Nicely done.
Take your piece of wood, and put it in your vacuum chamber. This will remove any moisture in your wood. Then put your wood, and resin in your pressure chamber.
After extensive testing with all types of resins, if your workpieces are small then no you do not need a pressure or vacuum pot providing you can apply heat using a heat gun to release the bubbles. However, if you intend to turn the pieces at high speed on a lathe - especially if they are larger than a pen blank, then for safety you need a pressure pot to ensure it bubble free and stop the piece exploding on the lathe (it happens when the gouges catch a large bubble)
Hi...sorry for my english. I am interested in what you say. I am new in this and I want to see what do I have to buy. I want to make pen...so..I can eliminate the bubbles just using a heat gun? Thanks
Nice demonstration and new intro, Dema.
Slowvannah Farms Thank you Sarah :)
Raffir is a variety of resin processed materials suited for use in accessories, jewellery, fine handles .....
Nice demonstration. Good to know.
Very informative, thanks for taking the time to make this great tutorial.
No problem Mike, thank you for watching :)
Maybe try again with dry wood?
I like the video. For alumilite, you are probably right. Do you think you would have better results with an epoxy or other material that has a longer working time?
I use Alumilite because it doesn't shrink and sticks to wood like white on rice. But yes I think it may work better with other resins and epoxy
appreciate the fast reply I enjoy all ur videos very informative
:)
First off great demonstration of the 3 ways. The question I have is. Could you use some kind of vibration device to help draw the air out? Maybe not for a clear cast but a colored one. Thanks
I don't see why not
All of that air in the vacuum sample came from the wood, the way I have always done it is to mix the resin, vacuum it (it will foam slightly, then break, thats how you know it is done, it should only take a few seconds), then pour the resin over the wood (slowly to avoid adding air to the mix), then put it in the pressure pot.
This method will give you the very best results.
Cool, what resin are you using.
***** I have always used Smooth-On products, they have a huge product line and an awesome tech line when you have questions.
Hmmm, never heard of them. I use Alumilite, and vacuum actually vaporizes some of the resin ingredients which is another reason Alumilite does not work with vacuum, even stabilized wood will fail.
***** Good to know. Every product is different, thanks for the demonstration!
Dima, try the same 3 options, but use cactus juice to stabilize the wood.
Thank's. I woundered why some used a pressure pot. Thank you so much.
While I've not done it since I don't turn, wouldn't it work to seal (paint) the wood with a thin coat (or 2) of resin, allowing them to dry and making sure there was complete coverage, THEN casting the resin and letting it dry in the open? As long as you mix carefully and avoid creating bubbles in the resin, you would not get any bubbles from the wood. Warming the resin slightly would help with bubbles as well.
Dema, could you make one more try? Mix resin and then degass it in the vacuum, then pour over the wood. I suppose all the foam you have got was from air and moisture from wood. What I propose is to use a degassed resin, and harden it under normal pressure.
In order to avoid adding air back into the resin after degassing separate is to mix slowly, there is a 7 minute working window, so I know this will still not work. I have tried everything in the 3 years I have been doing this, and pressure casting is the only way to go
Dema, if you will not mix degassed resin, there will be no air absorbed. I've seen *many* tries of transparent resin with using void and it was perfect result every time, even for 5 minute resin - degassing take short time. What I'm trying to point is that this comparison is not 100% correct because you got problems caused by degasing resin and wood together.
Ok, the results I showed are spot on for Alumilite, there are different techniques for other resin types like polyester resin.
I'm just pointing a problem with your approach and methodology, I see you do not like solid criticism.
Lol actually I do like solid critisizm, and I can see where you may think that my video demonstration is flawd, but believe me, I have tried it all, and in the end a pressure pot is required. I don't own stock in pressure pots ;)
Hello
I am French and understand a little English, but not enough to follow conversations. also, not having the translation of your videos, it is difficult for me sometimes, so I have questions that I could then translate using an application. I would like to congratulate you for your achievements on your channel that I have just discovered. also, I am interested in creating stabilized wood blocks. From what I understand, you prefer the pressure method, instead of depression (stabilization), because it is more efficient and faster? stabilization in the resin first requires removal by suction, then putting the block of wood in the resin and waiting?, while the pressure technique seems shorter because the block is directly placed in the epoxy mixture and hardener, and put under pressure for some time (I don't know the duration, and if you can tell me?)? in fact, the second method is all in one, so the first is first a stabilization in resin and then use this block of wood to put it in epoxy, and let it dry? thank you for your answers and continue, it's great. cordially
Xavier
Great demo either way it was informative and cool to see.
Would be nice to see a comparison with a vibrating table too.
Great video, well done and very useful information. Thanks. I see some folks saying you don't need pressure pot for Liquid Diamond, any advice on that would be appreciated. Thanks again.
CO2 formation is caused by water in the wood reacting with the prepolymer (part B). With this type of resin system applying pressure surpasses the formation of CO2 and hence the bubbles. Applying vacuum will merely remove the dissolved air. Drying the wood and applying pressure both should lead to better quality castings.
Hi I learn a lot from your UA-cam channel love wood and Mother Nature , anyway my question is can I put my casting piece twice in the pressure pot . I have so many ideas 💡 😁 I want to put a small item in the middle of the resin but I'm scare , I wish I can sent you a picture of what I'm taking about 😟
Nice Q&A Dema...right to the point.
Thanks Sam:)
Vacuum pot is not for casting. V. P. Is for vacuuming before resin and mold sets up. The pressure pot is for resin during it's cure finish. There's a technique must follow
Might be a stupid question but can you use a bicycle pump to pressuriz the pot ?
Hi I like your video as I am new to pen making can you please explain how the pressure pot works, like how it works and how much you can put in the pot. Graham in England
+scottfree well a pressure pot does exactly what it sounds like, it put your blanks under pressure. pressure compresses the air bubbles in the resin making in nice and invisible. and you can fit as much as the pressure pot will fit, there are different sizes.
I feel little smarter now! Great demo! Thanks!
When you lower the pressure you also lower the boiling point of a fluid. So, my guess is that your vacuum experiment is simply making your resin boil. If that's the case then you are introducing even more gas than the amount of air that was present before. Because now also your resin is turning to gas.
With the vacuum though, you are sucking the air out and it is being replaced by the resin, this fully impregnates the wood with resin instead of encasing it. Good if you have a piece of wood the size or larger than you want to use but not if its smaller. This is done with spalted wood for knife handles.
You are referring to stabilizing resin that is under vacuum for hours and is much thinner in viscosity and then heated to cure/harden it. In this video I use a two part resin that cures in 7-10 minutes and former give you enough time to remove the air and replace it with this resin.
Doesnt*
Awesome Demo ***** !! Thanks for sharing and clearing up some of my questions on these.
Dema, could you pour layers of the alumilite and torch it each time, would that work to remove all of the air bubbles? And would you need to sand between?
Hi Dema, great video! one question, how would you solve the problem with moist in the wood? put it for some time in the oven to "dry" it?!
Thank you, and yes, 12 hours in over at 120 degrees
Great, thank you :) btw there might be a trick to solve the problem with the vacuum ;) just "laquer" the piece of wood with epoxy, let it cure and then try the process again with the vacuum...might not work with the resin system you are using due to the limited amount of potlife time but should work with a longer potlife time epoxy resin ;) or degass the resin only then pour it in the cup with the wood
To fet rid of the bubbles in the 2nd one couldnt u have used a heat gun? Or is that a differe t type of resin? Thanks for the demo probably saved some people some money and a head ache..
Joe basementwoodworking i have never tried a heat gun, bt it seems a few people think that will work. maybe a follow up experiment. I know heat works well with Polyester resin, not sure about alumilite, i think the heat will just speed up the curing process.
Very well done. Gotta get a pressure pot.
Next question, what if you are not using alumalite? Alumalite cures super fast so I wonder if thats the issue.
Thank you much! Subscribed for sure. I’m looking to get into casting for small items for turning and other artisan projects. Would you say it is worth using a pressure pot for any resin casting?
resin hardens inside the timber after sawing from the pores of the resin follows
Awesome test Dema! I've been meaning to try vacuum with resins for a while. I'm still curious how PR or epoxy will work under vacuum, but it obviously doesn't work with Alumilite! Do you usually bake dry your wood before casting and stabilizing?
Zac Higgins thanks Zac, maybe youcan do the video on PR and epoxy :). this time of the year its pretty humid in my shop and i do normally bake them over night before casting.
mr dema am one of your fans can you show us how we can engrave the piece of wood before apply the resin thank you
Good demo thanks Dema
Thanks Mike :)
Wonder how a vacuum molded piece in clear then placed in a pressure pot of colored resin would turn out???
Dear Dmitry (I'm from Russia and I ask forgiveness for my English) ... Please tell me: what is necessary power of the vacuum pump? I plan to make the plastic for the handles of the knives of the polyester resin and acrylic resin and stabilize the wood, in particular polyester (for sale). If you can, please provide the necessary engine harrakteristiki
Thank you.
Great demo
Thank you. That was a big help.
I'm not trying to be a jerk or say the pressure pot isn't the way to go but you did the vacuum wrong.
You needed to vacuum the resin without the wood then slowly pour it over the wood. The reason the vac didn't work and you continued to get the air bubbles (not foam) was because the vac was trying to suck the air out of the wood. If you have stabilized wood you know it take a while to get the air out and then the resin gets sucked into the wood. Which is also why to cure that resin you have to bake it, to allow enough time for you to get all the air out. But it only should take less than a minute or two to remove the air from that much Alumilite resin. Try it again without the wood in the vac and you will be surprised how well it works.
Cory, your not being a jerk at all , this a perfectly good observation. But I have discussed this with Alumilite company and they actually say that using vacuum with Alumilite vaporizes some of the engrediants, but it seems people keep thinking that's it's possible, so I just may try it again some day. Thank you :)
I would just stick with the pressure pot. But if someone has a vac and only plans to do it a couple times and don't want to buy a pot then you can make the vac work. Degassing with a vac is really only meant for silicon or stabilizing type resins (cactus juice) anyways.
Yup I totally agree :)
Дим я так понял что сначала стабилизация дерева в вакууме а потом заливаем смолой и выдерживаем под давлением?
Please forgive my possible ignorance but would you get the exact same result if a different make or type of resin was used
Great test Dema. I wonder if a centrifuge would work to remove bubbles if you could leave the piece spinning until it set up... Hmmmm. Anybody out there have a centrifuge and some Alumalite?
That's a whole other expens lol.
Thanks, Really answered questions for me. I have done the "stabilization" with Cactus Juice in a Vac and had good results. This shows I really do need the pressure pot to finish resin casting. Thanks
So there!!!!! Pressure cast!!! For Sure!!! Great video, Dema. Can can you answer "What happens after death".
Well it depends on your denomination, the results vary :)
Good information.
Thanks for sharing.
a vacuum is only needed if you want to color stabalize wood. for casting a pressure pot or simpler just a plain simple heatgun! yes a heatgun gets rid of all the bubbles
When you plug the air for the pressure pot, the compressor was turned off...you just fill the pressure pot with the appropriated pressure (40psi) and when reach the number just unplugged it?
Once you reach the pressure, u have a ball valve that closes the pressure pot off, so when I unplug it, the pressure stays in the pot,
Great stuff--thanks
What if your using the Alumilite White? Since that doesn't require either the pressure pot or vacuum pump, is any problems involved with it?
hmm i learned an ultrasonic bath should be perfekt to get bubbles out of liquids.
Maybe this works for casting with worthless wood too.
Liked and subscribed such a great help.
Thanks for making this video!!!!
Thanks for watching :)
what type of pressure pot is it? and what kind of vacuum chamber?
Thanks for the experiment but what's the rating of the vacuum compressor? It looks and sounds awfully small.
I just saw your video on making a duck call out of the resin and wood, do you or would you sell the blanks?
thanks was wondering this also.
Great video. Can you cast with wood that has bark still on the edges or should it be removed first?
Yes, you can. I've done it. I typically "clean" it up a bit with a toothbrush to knock off dirt or loose parts, then go for it (if you've dried the wood).
Such a great video. Thank you so much. 🤓🙏
Thanks for the info. Appreciate it.
Great video!
Ciao ho visto il tuo video e mi sono iscritto purtroppo non conosco L inglese,vorrei sapere se stai dicendo nel video che è meglio la pentola del vuoto o la pentola sotto pressione grazie NJK
How do you set up your pressure pot? Be good to do a video on that.
I do have a video on that :)