The Gospel Destroys Christian Nationalism w/ NT Wright
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- Опубліковано 18 бер 2024
- Welcome to another episode of Ring Them Bells.
Once again NT Wright joins us for a powerful interview.
This time going over his new book with co-author Michael Bird "Jesus and the Powers"
This book is designed to help Christians think critically as we proclaim the good news to the nations, speaking truth to corrupt power.
We go over a very important clip from Tim Mackie of the @bibleproject
Tim lets us know that the good news being proclaimed that Jesus is king of the world had political implications. This proclamation often got the apostle Paul and faithful followers of Jesus in trouble With the authorities.
We're going to understand that the human systems we have in place are corrupt and need a prophetic word. God wants to rule this earth and bring his kingdom here as it is in heaven. This teaches us about the provisionality of the human systems we have in place today. Let's explore these concepts together.
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Link to Full Interview with NT Wright and @ringthembells143 • Jesus and the Powers -...
Link to Tim Mackie Politics and The Bible Talk - • Lecture on the Early C...
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Thanks so much for the Tom Wright content on your channel. Very trust-worthy scholar! Brilliant!
amen! Thank you for clearing the air about what The Gospel of Jesus Christ truly is! Keep up the good work of proclaiming Jesus Only! Bless your channel!
I encourage you to read Leo Tolstoy's book about Jesus' anti-war message of non-resistance, "The Kingdom of God is Within You", as it offers convincing arguments against Christians fighting in wars or even taking up arms using Jesus' commandment of loving your enemies and "resist not evil".
Yeah but Tom is not a pacifist and believes in nations having authority to use the sword. As does Paul, who actually says God uses governments to keep order and punish evil via the sword. I think the end hope is pacifism, but Paul uses phrases like “in so far as possible” and his talk of God installing government. I think essentially the entire picture we have from scripture is a deep and not oversimplified one, that points to a goal, while acknowledging the fallen reality. Service in the military was a hard controversial topic for the early church and should be one today as well. I think the blessing of our modern time, a luxury really, is that with our current tech we can and should seek to communicate more and find as many alternatives to the sword before using it, which may be necessary.
Excellent
Love this! The gospel changes lives not government forcing all morality on its subject’s.
Amen!!!
The godless Atheists are forcing their morality and religion on us right now,
are you enjoying the murder of the unborn?
Men get SAVED to put their light under a bushel. What are you going
to do with what you've been given? Christian Nationalism is not about
making people get saved or go to some state church. It's about good men
in office using God's Word to guide their decisions that affect the whole nation
and the world. Dumbest argument I've ever heard come from NT.
The first few minutes summarizes Eastern Orthodoxy probably more concisely than anyone I've ever seen, yet he doesn't know that (with this and practically everything he says in all the interviews) he is teaching the doctrines of the Orthodox Church!
Can't have a Christian world without Christian nations
No. You can't have a world where people worship God without Christians. Your emphasis is skewed and not Gospel-centered.
@@karenallen7064 is to Gospel centered. A country dedicated to Christ is a good thing
Can't have a Christian world without Christians.
exactly - Britain has forced no-nation on others and now they are losing their land and nation to other cultures and religions - its a political-cultural and not a gospel issue. God created nations - we would do well to honour that.
Good job, keep going……
Thank you!!!
Contributing to the Long standing “Christian” tradition of infighting.
Do tell how this is "contributing to ... infighting"?
Sorry, that is stupid and you paint yourself as uneducated.
Define Christian Nationalism.
Any thought process that Unites a professed follower of Jesus to the nation they live in rather than to the Kingdom of God.
God’s solution for the world is not a Christian nation. God’s solution for the corrupt nations is Jesus. We are proclaiming Jesus as king to all corrupt nations ruled by both wicked spiritual and human powers. Hope that helps ✌️❤️🔔
I guess, i would ask...does Tom vote? Do you advocate voting at all?
You should have defined CN at the beginning of the video.
I feel that. I try to get better with every video, so I will think about that. But…
Rest assured there is More to come on this subject
Start Tuned
The Beginning is Near🔔✅❤️
NO,that is the problem, let those who have to bear the label define it. You will see that tens of millions are tarred with that name who do NOT take the name themselves or do in a totally different meaning.
So, who we vote for matter? Or instead Christian nationalist we would go to let’s allow or help anti Christianity government? That’s to go from one extreme to the other
I don't see how any of that "destroyed" Christian nationalism. If we're to, "make disciples of the nations," it would seem unavoidable, unless your view is that heads of state and politicians can't be converted.
I notice you said "Christian nationalism" was the goal, which I assume is your way of marginalization. It's not "the goal" so much as a natural result of the great commission.
Thanks for watching 🔔✅
The Bible eg Isaiah shows NO destruction of nationality even in the end times.
Unfortunately you're still not really explaining what "the problem" is.
The vast majority of those who would be labeled such wouldn't see this as any kind of argument against theor position.
I think you're going to need to take some time to legitimize, or at least clarify, what is being argued against, otherwise theres a massive barrier to edification.
I can see where this is what "groypers" need to hear, but that's about it.
But then groypers are already so far gone that they're barely Christian if at all.
Its not obvious to me that negative talk about "Christian nationalism" (what ever that is)
Will generate clicks.
Perfect. There is NOTHING this channel does that we do for clicks. We are here to spread the Good News that Jesus is King. Most times that message will not be the most popular, but it is the most needed✅❤️🔔
@@ringthembells143
If you don't generate clicks, you aren't able to spread the word of god effectively. You think this straw man you call Christian nationalism is important? Seems more like you're trying to be covertly political.
@@grouchywithoutcoffee seems to me you haven’t had your coffee today🤷🏻♂️ God will get the message out as he sees it. I’m just going to keep creating content that honors what God is teaching me currently in my life. You can think whatever you want to think. You can also keep scrolling if you want to🔔✅
I won't answer Wright that would be to fall into the trap of making him some oracle.
Aquinas says (and NT knows who that is)
“Man is a debtor chiefly to his parents and his country, after God. Wherefore just as it belongs to religion to give worship to God, so it belongs to piety, in the second place, to show reverence to one’s parents and one’s country.” (ST.II-II.101)
So I am a Christian and my debt is to 'One's Country" ---call it CN but that is stupid for 3 reasons
1) nation is NOT on the same levele as following Jesus , so first change is 'I am a Christian how in a christilike manner puts my country first in my allegaiances , over other countries , hoping that Christians in other countries do the same.
2) When you use that word 'destroys' are you saying that by violence you will act against these brothers and sisters of yours?
3) You enable what you hate. You will always have 'nationalists' , if you don't christianize them you have NAZIS. That is how it has always worked.
Tocqueville refers to these intermediary institustions as essential to stop totalitarian control of your entire life
"In Europe, with its complex hierarchical societies, the majority has little or no power. It is rather the aristocracy, the clergy, the legal profession, and the rising merchant class-the independent centers of powers-that will resist and even oppose the sovereign. Some of these groups do exist in democracies, but they have little or no independent legitimacy.
According to Tocqueville, these “intermediary” institutions that exist in aristocracies serve as a “dike” against the force of dominant political power and a vital protection for human dignity and liberty. Because American democracy lacks such intermediary institutions, it has “no lasting obstacles” in the way of the opinions, prejudices, interests, and momentary passions of the majority and tends towards an unthinking despotism over unpopular minorities."
Jesus is waiting to be King. Typical Amil confusion
"Somehow Jesus crucifixion is winning th evictory over the Arch powers that stand behind the actual politions & leader & Govenors & so on ......."
Well Adam was the 1st man So that when he sinned his inherritance became sin & death, so that his whole line of descent inherits sin & death. There was noone to redeem his line to an inheritance that is life. Ther appeared absolutely no hope at all for Adams line.
Except that the Holy Spirit came to Mary and began a new life within her. Through Mary, Jesus is our kinsman (human) but inheritance is in the male line, so that Jesus inheritance is through His Father Divine, a Spiritual inheritance that is life.
So no under the law of the Kinsman redeermer defined in Leviticus and exampled in Ruth, Jesus can stand as our kinsman redeemer (Head provider of the household), so that if we choose to follow Him, we come into his protection & inheritance divine. However, this is not just a trifling thing to be done with a simple declartation alone, it has to be real, it has to be lived with integrity. Jesus is the head from whom we receive instruction and whom we are to obey as best we can. However, we are imperfect & there is forgiveness for our failings as long as we a in genuine relationship with Him. Seaking him, forgiving others & trying to follow the things He taught, then we remain in Him & He in us, being transformed into a new creation. But the body is not transformes & must die, then if the Spirit lives, it will bring the body to life again, a new & resurrected body. Then we shall be complete in Him,
That is basically what Paul wrote in Romans, so it seems to me there is no somehow about it. It is God's act of Love, it is by His grace alone that we are redeemed (saved). For we deserve it not at all.
I see the christian nationalist view as far as advancing the kingdom of Christ in times of violent resistance… i see it all throughout our 2000 year history of christiandom
what does nationalism have anything to do with it?
And just because you see it happening throughout church history doesn’t mean that it’s the right thing to do. If anyone studies church history and is Not absolutely appalled at the murderous tendencies of Church leadership, then you’re not reading church history.
@@chrisplourde1690 Because it is wrong to almost all foks that anyone should forcibly be without a nation to call his own. People bitch about rights NOWHERE IN HISTORY WERE RIGHTS DEFENDED OFFICIALLY EXCEPT BY NATIONS
@@analogia_entis "Because it is wrong to almost all foks(sic) that anyone should forcibly be without a nation to call his own." who is forcibly with out a nation? And wouldn't it be "Our" own? The existence of a nation is not predicated on the existence of nationalism as a political tool or force within politics. It often hasn't historically speaking. As for defending one's rights, is it that cut and dried? I seem to remember a little rebellion in 1776 that took place to establish a separate govt........
So sad at the blatant misunderstanding of "Christian Nationalism" I love and have learned so many things from Tim Mackie and NT Wright, but they are so off the mark on what Christian Nationalism means. Although I may not agree with everything they believe, Douglas Wison and Dennis Prager are 2 examples of people that give AMAZING clarity to the issue. Watch Foug Wilson's interview on the Babylon Bee....SO insightful!
Doug lol
Christian Nationalism and Dominionism is antithetical to everything Jesus taught! Satan offered him authority over all the kingdoms of the world, but He refused. When the people wanted to make him king, he refused. Didn't Jesus say "My kingdom is not of this world"? I don't remember Jesus gathering together a militia of resistors to fight and destroy the pagan Roman government that ruled over the Jews and declare "Let's make Israel great again!!” No, Jesus was definitely NOT a nationalist! Anyone trying to make you believe otherwise is a wolf in sheep's clothing. So many Christians have fallen under strong delusion because "they did not love the truth" and wished to believe the lies. "For the gate is narrow and the road is hard...and there are few who find it." Read the gospels and stop listening to NAR s "prophets" and "apostles" who love and preach old testament war stories far more than the commandments of love, forgiveness and non-resistance that Jesus taught. Please read your New Testament!
Those 2 would have dramatically different concepts of that term though.
I'm so sorry you are so blinded by false teachers!
Ring Them Bells is using/distorting N.T. Wright here. “Christian Nationalism” in the US is federalist - our first/founding Christian Nationalists deposed any monarch that would represent God. The conservative political movement in America is ultimately concerned with the preservation of THIS limited government, for the sake of the liberty and rights of each to live! (and practice our faith).
If Christian Nationalism (aka: CN) means working toward the Kingdom of God on earth, via human institutions, then there is no necessary dichotomy between CN and the gospel, as your vid title implies.
There's nothing wrong with working toward the realization of the Kingdom of God on earth, via human institutions. Indeed, such is inevitable. To wit:
07:25 "The Church has to reclaim the right to talk about the Kingdom of God, and to go to work to enact it."
Clearly, this cannot be accomplished outside of dealing with the legal framework of whatever society a Christian happens to be living in.
You need to refine your definition of Christian nationalism. For this channel Christian nationalism is defined asAny thought process that Unites a professed follower of Jesus to the nation they live in rather than to the Kingdom of God.
God’s solution for the world is not a Christian nation. God’s solution for the corrupt nations is Jesus. We are proclaiming Jesus as king to all corrupt nations ruled by both wicked spiritual and human powers. Hope that helps ✌️❤️🔔
@@ringthembells143 _"Christian nationalism is defined asAny thought process that Unites a professed follower of Jesus to the nation they live in rather than to the Kingdom of God."_
By definition, your conception NECESSARILY links CN to idolatry. As a result, you unnecessarily alienate anyone who is dedicated to Christ, yet supports CN.
This makes no sense to me. I believe you to be well capable to understand this point.
@@ringthembells143 You don't know your Bible !!! Even in the latter days described by Jeremiah, Isaiah, Daniel, Ezekiel. nations still exist. WE have different languages and customs, foods, dress and a hundred other things. You seem a war on what makes us all unique
@@analogia_entis United under one King, not these evil empires that exist today. Sorry I won’t take the bait of your angry responses. Any defense of Christian nationalism is from the enemy✅🔔❤️