This title scared me because I’m a woman who loves comics, especially superhero comics. I thought you were gonna tell me why I shouldn’t be reading them, but boy was I wrong. I’m glad I watched it, cause I agree with what you’re saying here. Thanks for this video.
Yeah he kinda had me a bit taken a back at first. But he didn't really seem like the kind of guy who would actually think that so i just assumed it was click bait
“made for A” obviously doesn’t mean “can’t enjoyable for B”. as male myself, i really enjoyed some of shojou manga(kimi ni todoke, love complex, etc) because its made for woman. if these manga awkwardly trying to capture male audience, then i didn’t watch it first place, and many other males or female would think same.
I was worried when I saw the title too. I was about to say “no they are not” but I actually watched the video first. I honestly wish more women got into comics.
Not really for men or women if you go by Stan Lee's rule, which was: "Don't write with any audience in mind, write what you're interested in, dedicate yourself to that and trust that someone else might like it too." The whole reason he even pushed for characters like Spider-Man was because his publisher kept telling him *"PEOPLE DON'T LIKE SPIDERS, STAN!!!"* So if you're writing a comic book, or crafting any entertainment product: Get the audience out of your head, be original, find what makes you passionate.
Wasn't iron man created with a target audience in mind? Tony was a weapon manufacturer. He was what anti Vietnam war youths hated. Maybe LD mentioned it in his racist character video.
@@theblancmange1265 Tony was really created to be an idea of a hero being on the side of politics he didnt agree with. Humanize the other side he was someone knew as an asshole. but he was also human. Which drew people in.
@@mothman4191 what made iron popular was the movies. he wasn't nearly as popular as the hulk or the X-Men or even captain America until his movies. his movies did a great job making him marketable to the audiences that wanted a normal human being a superhero which was proven to exist thanks to the popularity of Nolan's Batman movie
Japan gets this. Shonen Jump is aimed to boys, but girls like it too - since the popular stories are well written and characters never lose their core.
@@LikaLaruku Anywhere that isn't mainstream comics seems to get it. Stories like UnOrdinary and Sweet Home are good because they focus on the characters and the story. Not politics. Hell, even a comedy like Outrage understands it
@@scottsommer9843 Yeah I agree, but all the girls looks extremely sexualized for their age, and other than a a couple they all act the same as the rest of the students. Barely any time is put into their development, instead they just have quirk showcases or highlights.
yea you are right, Im a girl and i like both superherous and shounen jump, it might not be the majority but we exist and Im reading for the ACTION not the romance, romance is nice, i read romance too but when Im picking up... less say "ONE PIECE" i dont want romance! I want explosive non sensical funny action! Im there for the drive not the connection but the high feeling, if i want romance and action I can always take roranowa kenshin (and i did, the show was badddd the manga was pretty suprisingly good) its the target audiance that makes a diffrence, girls like me come FOR the action in comics/manga/superero shows. if you take that away we would stop loving comic too :/
Scott Sommer Jesus... My Hero Academia is great, but please there have been much better Shōnen before that with better characters. It’s nothing new. And there are so much more than Shonen Jump in the world of manga - if reality is your thing then you can find that in several other manga. But if you want a good new female main character in Jump then read The Promised Neverland!
Remember when Khamala used to be cool and well received despite her middle eastern heritage cause they didn't beat you to death with her as a liberal mouthpiece? Or when Squirrel Girl wasn't a primarily comedy driven tumblr pandering chubster with a shit haircut that talked down Galactus because trans people exist? sigh...I miss 2014.
@@TactlessC squirrel girl was always a joke character, she has beaten Dr Doom by swarming his van with squirrels a millennia ago, and she has had really weird romantic encounters with Daredevil and Wolverine She also beat Wolveirne in a fight in the same year Wolverine embarrassed Iron Fist in hand to hand which all happened well before the sjw stuff existed Not to mention she spent alot of her time as a babysitter for Luke Cage and Jessica Jones Another example of good character turned trash is Carol Danvers, and of course Mockingbird was soiled hard as well. Which is why her series flopped, and why she has been the actual worse possible girlfriend in any comic series and to Spiderman of all people, damn you Dan Slott(it also hurt me a bunch more cus it reminded just how good Ultimate Peter Parker and Kitty Pryde was) Ms Marvel was basically a relatable character who acted like a human with superpowers which is what she was, then the transition into Captain Marvel ultimately turned her into...I dont think anyone genuinely likes the character on paper, especially after Civil war 2 when her boyfriend Rhodes (by the way their relationship was made up literally just for Civil war 2, it existed nowhere else and the characters have never even teamed up) died and apparently she fell in love with him in that 1 hour long relationship which gave her more reason to be upset over his death than Tony Stark who had known him his whole life, Tony even basically agreed that she was hurt more than him over it which was disgustingly awful(damn you bendis, for that, making 616 Hawkeye kill, and most especially for crippling Moon Knights story so hard too)
_Having legitimate flaws_ is the reason Miles Morales was more popular than Iron Heart btw People don't mind having superheroes that don't correlate directly to their race or sex, because what makes them relatable is their flaws and struggles, since that's the one universal experience of all people (Sorry. Comment only tangentially related to the video)
To the original comment, iron heart didn’t have time to be given flaws. She was introduced and a little time passed and she was iron heart. There was also no regular tony stark for fans to read either. When miles was introduced you could still read comics about peter in the regular 616 universe but there wasn’t anything like that when they “got rid” of tony, there was only riri. But this is only my opinion.
@Rambonus Ravager Bullshit, he was brought in because the writer of Ultimate Spiderman wanted a black Spiderman. So he killed Ultimate off to introduce Miles. He's a boring, shitty mary sue and the only reason anyone gives a fuck is because he's black. Even after seven fucking years of writing he has no noteworthy villains, allies or stories. Because he only exists to BE the fucking black spiderman.
I like romance, when it's part of a good action, sci-fi, or fantasy story because it adds additional dynamics to the character interactions, but I'm not big on straight romance. And, yes, I'm a woman. So, I get where you're coming from.
Though geared towards men, I believe that a well-written comic should appeal to men and women. For example, I love Watchmen and I gave my copy to my sister to read. She fell in love with it and now both she and I are waiting in anticipation for the HBO miniseries to come out. A well-written story and comic should, though geared towards men, appeal to both men and women like Watchmen did with my sister.
Should appeal or can appeal? By sayint should, it seems like you are saying that nothing should be made to appeal to a single group. Like saying you can never sell a single flavour of ice cream.
@@dimitripapadopoulos5180 I said should because if a comic is well-written then it will transcend gender norms. I am not saying you can only sell one flavor of ice-cream, but a good flavor of ice cream will appeal to all sexes. I understand what you are saying but I believe that comics have the power to transcend dislikes and likes, gender norms, etc. (like any kind of book or media) if they are well done and tell a good story. I am not saying you should seek to appeal to all audiences but a good story will appeal to all audiences.
DclobberandReik Just write a good story. That’s it. Doesn’t matter what type of people like it. Could be mostly men, could be mostly woman or even both. I say don’t aim for any gender. Just hope someone will read it
@@dclobberandreik4376 but a good story doesn't always appeal to all audiences. Something like action comics don't exactly appeal to people who hate action and fighting. Something like a horror novel won't apply to people who don't like being creeped out. Or some great dark comedy might be just too soon for someone who has recently lost someone. Even the Mona Lisa probably looks bland in someone's eyes. If your aspiration, the thing you see as the biggest true accomplishment, is that a work appeals to everyone, then that's instantly discounting literally everything that has even a single person who dislikes it. So... Everything. A good story, is a good story. In the end it shouldn't truly matter who that good story applies to. If only everyone would just realize that.
Do you realize that "the killing joke" that you have pointed out as one of the best comic book has, arguably, zero action? Batman and joker do not fight. That comic is pure drama. Also drama ≠ romance
@Darth Pancake Studios Overlap does not equal the same. Action can also be considered dramatic just like romance. Anything that involves a challenge and/or rise in ACTION is dramatic.
He consistently states that women prefer "drama _and_ romance" as supported by the study. And he also said that drama should be in action based stories, just not be the focus. He even explained about the Killing Joke.
@@munstrumridcully Yeah, that's the distinction. But if human history is anything to go on, Drama in of itself is a human interest, not just a female one, though the genders of course have preferences in the specific kind of drama they enjoy. Therefore, if there's any theme that could be considered universal, it's drama, because you know you'll appeal to both sides of the coin with it.
@@dogman9291 That's true. Men, in general, prefer drama like that in, just for example, shows like The Sopranos and Better Call Saul, imo. If my wife and daughter are any indication, lol, women tend to prefer drama like that in shows like Gilmore Girls and Grey's Anatomy 😃
@@andrewmontague9682 So far there are three major characters with the name Sandman: Sandman from the Spider-Man comics. Sandman, the ruler of dreams. Wesley Dodds, one of the first DC superheroes.
I like your work, but I disagree slightly with this video. Marvel is not putting out books that appeal to women- I am a woman and have read several current yr Marvel comics- there is no drama or romance. Clairemont's 80s X books are more dramatic and romantic than anything that Marvel has put out in yrs. Also, id argue that men actually like romance, some of comics most enduring and endearing heroes, such as Batman, Superman, Spiderman, Wolverine, etc, have active love lives and even get married. Guys like romance, they just don't like it as the focus of a story, and I think that romance is more palpable to male readers if It's presented more as a partnership. Just my thoughts.
I can only speak for my self, but I have actually appreciate romance in stories when it adds or helps drive, but not be the core aspect, of the plot. Fight Club for instance, is considered a great, testosterone movie, but the crux of the movie kicks off with the Narrator's growing infatuation with Marla. It isn't the focus of the movie though. Hints of the Narrator's feelings and relationship-through-Tyler with her are dropped throughout the movie. She's even the final piece of the puzzle for the Narrator to realize him and Tyler are the same person. The end shows them holding hands as financial institutions fall before them. A prospective for the movie is a guy trying to work out his feelings for a girl and then tell her he likes her.
I think his main point is that what they are trying to do is cram two incompatible types of story together. Superhero action stories just cannot contain more than a certain level, or style, of romance, drama, and human interest elements without ceasing to be effective superhero stories. And so they have ended up with a monstrosity that, in trying to please both sexes, ends up pleasing neither.
Also, It's interesting that you mention the Claremont era, because one of the things I remember most about the romantic side-stories of the late 80s and early 90s X-titles was how much I hated them. Ironically, I'd say that what turned me off the most were the sudden, unrealistic, fantastic ways they sprang up and died, like game of romance roulette. Suddenly in one issue two characters just started hooking up, without there being any real rhyme or reason behind their attraction. And a dozen issues later it all fell apart again, often tragically. It was often blatantly obvious that the relationships were just thrown in to create drama and conflict, rather than being a natural extension of the characters themselves. Peter Parker and Mary Jane, on the other hand, had exactly the kind of relationship that I loved. That was a story that had built up naturally over years, with both characters being totally devoted to each other in a way that just felt right. It was stable, strong, pure, and realistic. So yes, male-oriented comics _can_ have romance in them, but it has to be romance done in a way that seems natural and satisfies the male psyche.
The Peter and MJ thing is the core argument for "Men appreciating romance" and it was also the smoking gun to when Marvel started losing it's concept of balance when they had their marriage in-universe-retconned, because of meta ideas by the writers that "Spider-Man sells better and appeals to people more when he's a single guy bumbling around and failing constantly." Cause hoo boy between Civil War and Superior Spider-Man (or arguably until the current Amazing title done by Nick Spencer where haha MJ and him are together again), Main Universe Spidey was in a real downward spiral cause Peter dating so many women you just didn't give a shit about or had terrible build up just really cut into the poorly written villain stories even more than some might think MJ used to.
I can see where you’re coming from but there’s a reason I read Spider-Man and not Batman, Spider-Man has a heavy focus on the drama and romantic aspects of Peter’s life. I personally wouldn’t read Spider-Man if it didn’t have those romantic qualities, and seeing those qualities in other comics is also a factor that draws me into them. I agree that the new progressive line at Marvel is low quality and the action/conflict can be very clumsy, however I don’t feel romance is the problem. The problem is the integration of say something like romance into the action. For instance: in Spider-Man Black Cat provided romance and drama for a while in the comics, but she also contributed to the action and played a part in showing the consequences this action might have on a person without powers. The romance is prevalent but it’s used as a plot device to the further the narrative and action sequences as a whole rather than being treated as two separate entities like with the current line of comics. If romance doesn’t have a point in a comic it becomes an extraneous detail and nobody likes to read that. What the current writers need to do is make sure they actually have a reason for putting romance into a comic rather than making a cluttered mess. In other words romance isn’t bad these writers just don’t know how to integrate it.
I hope creators will learn to use tropes. We've had "damsel in distress" used on every occassion possible. Now "Mary Sue" took its place and arguebly it's overused just as much. I mean, can we have both people that need saving and people who can stand their ground? I'm not asking for that much.
Lois Lane from the DCAU is a perfect example of this. She's a sassy career woman who really doesn't take crap from anybody, her dad is a military general and a black belt so of course she knows basic hand to hand, however there isn't much she can do when a building is collapsing or two demi gods are punching each other through the city, so it makes sense for her to be a damsel at times and not at others. Edit: fixed some spelling errors
I'm sorry, but I refuse to belive that it's as black and white as this presents it. Not everything has to do with SJW influence. Market dynamics in storytelling change, has so for years, like the ghost and romance stories in the era of Romanticism. Stan Lee said that comics, in general, are for everyone, and I think its really unhealthy to focus so much on what a very little, though vocal, minority has or will ruin, because you'll start seeing correlations everywhere, which clouds judgment because it will result in confirmation bias. Just food for thought
I can see where you could think this, but correlations do, sometimes, equal causation. Mass media in general panders, or is otherwise completely controlled, by radical neo-liberalism, or SJWism as we know it. Sometimes the simple answer of radical ideological fascism is the correct one.
No, women just like trendy things. And there's nothing wrong with that. I love my trendy boots. I love my trendy make up. I love trendy as much as any girl. But right now, it's trendy to be a "nerd" and into nerdy things. While comics are for "everyone," as in anyone can find value in them. No one is going to stop a woman from purchasing a comic. I know first hand because I'm a woman and I've bought comics for over 25 years. The reality is, the consumers with the biggest preference towards them is males. So from a practical standpoint, a market campaign is easier for males, because they naturally gravitate towards the product. You can market to females, but you have to do it under the understanding that it is not a natural draw for them. There has to be slight altercations on how the comics are written, drawn, and colored to appeal. Comics only became a natural draw for women when it became trendy and cool to be a "nerd." So I wouldn't even consider it natural. And then some SJW came in there, trying to be a nerd, because that's the trendy thing to be right now. Realized she didn't actually like comics because they're marketed to males. She raises a big stink about them being sexists, which is why she doesn't like them, but since she's talking out of her ass she's saying she does like them and the only thing she hates is everything about them... because she wants to be trendy and it's trendy to be a nerd... Then other girls say, "Yeah! We want to be nerds too! But we don't like nerdy things, but rather than just admit that, we'll call it sexist!" (Anonymous Girl, whoever you are... wherever you are... I hate you.) The truth is, this hasn't worked out for Marvel. Comic sales have declined and continue to do so for decades. Not years, decades. Because women, in general, don't like comics and they never did. This hasn't changed.
@@TheRisky9 I'm sure some women like things because they're trendy but that definitely isn't all women. I personally have liked shounen anime and manga since middle school and it has nothing to do with feeling like it was cool. It was because it's interesting. The story is what matters. Not the pandering. In fact pandering tends to cause self conscious people to turn away typically. Saying that women only like things when they are trendy is really degrading. It's worse than my SJW program coordinator once telling me I only shave my legs for men, not because I like the way they feel, etc. disregarding that I am a person with ideals and only a product of oppression. So. Think before you speak.
Right? I'm sure Marvel is devastated that interest in comics that were barely making them any money has declined...... and that they've managed to change it into a multi-billion dollar mainstream movie market. Anyone who thinks Marvel has made 'mistakes' by not catering to only men is delusional.
Woman here. By now I am quite a bit into my middle age. 😊 I still love superheroes and action! Fav movie genres are phantasy, sci-fi, action, adventure, comedy... but not much of a drama and romance girl. My least fav genres. They're mostly ok to have in small quantities, but if the story is good, I watch. And Sandman is good, because it has good story and relatable characters.
Same. I hate it when my folks come over for the Holidays & subject me to weeks of Hallmark & Lifetime movies. They're all the same goddamn movie with the same goddamn characters. I don;t care if the most annoying girl in town hooks up with her business rival. I'd rather see them stay bitter rivals & compete ferociously with eachother.
To be honest I wasn't able to finish the video because is the same crap that I have been listening since I took my first comic when I was 5. Girls don't "like action, sports, videogames or comics" FALSE, I loved it I have a well amount of female friends who also loved it, you know what I dislike?, forced drama, teenage angst, romantic plot line who dosen't aport to the main plot.
I like how Japan solves this problem, They have Shonen, Shoujo, Seinin, and Shoujo-Ai. These are the primary Genres that every manga is sorted by. They literally stand for, Young Boys, Young Girls, Adult Men, Adult Women. Everyone has a genre for them and nobody has to shoe horn topics cross genre for everyone. Some stories can appeal to multiple genders regardless of genre, usually those end up being Seinin, But there are lots of cross fans, males that read shoujo. I America this wouldn't work. They would ask, where is the genre for trans-men and trans-women. But its nice to see someplace else in the world not being fucked by social justice. Eventually social justice is just gonna cripple our culture and we won't be known as the best place in the world with the most desirable culture. Which probably is the case since I hear more about people following anime characters and stories now over following american heros outside of marvel.
While I see what you're trying to say, you're kind of off base. While Shoujo and Josei is AGGRESSIVELY aimed at females, Shounen and Seinen stories still have character development and humanizing themes in them, with a splash of background commentary. It's not all DBZ and Naruto vs Card Captor Sakura in terms of balance to gender preferences. I mean....consider if you will Shonen Jump has Skip Beat which is a very slice of life and Shoujo-like series, and sports series like Prince of Tennis which is just eye candy for women, and everything in between before hitting the Action/Combat or Intrigue series. There's series like Full Metal Alchemist and Rurouni Kenshin which is the perfect balance of drama and action that appeals to both sides of the gender spectrum and is lauded by them. Hilariously, outside of Japan's casual racism and xenophobia, people are moving towards anime and manga instead of western comics cause it does the job SJWs want to do better by being well written and more open and appealing to a larger demographic with their varied casts and what not. Japan even handles things like sexual inclusiveness better by either not making it a giant focus point to go "look at me" or just referencing how the society actually carries itself in Japan instead of this "androgynous sugar coating that ignores ugliness and side-effects" that America and Europe likes to do.
@@savagetv6460 You know showing racist people that are also bad in a movie doesn't automatically make it SJW. I don't think the purpose of the movie or any of the characters was to say "Black people good, white people bad" so much as to use racism and control as motives for the villains. Assuming that every movie that portrays black people as good and white people as bad is "SJW" is like assuming that every movie that has black-on-black violence being dealt with by white cops is far-right.
Alessia Leone It sounds stupid when you say 'hole' instead of 'whole' but I guess it would sound stupid nonetheless since what you said is objectively wrong.
The thing "some" people overlook is the studies reveal tendencies; something that will happen more times then it does not. "Some" people think more means all.
Oxytocin has the primary purpose of dealing with pains during childbirth, so that one bring labelled as primarily female makes since. If women have more vasopressin than males, then it too is considered a female hormone; just as testosterone and estrogen are considered to be gendered hormones despite their presence in both sexes.
Personally I would like a balance of Drama and Action because...I like Spider Man and Batman? And I grew up in the 90s and early 2000s with those really good cartoons that had a balance of well written character dynamic and super intense action to keep people drawn in. And those cartoons got me into comics! I'm not going to say the science behind those sort of gender studies surveys are wrong, but it's a bit of a blanket statement to go "Men don't care about drama" or "Super heroes series are for men and don't need it" when Marvel's MO since the 70s has been to have characters that are able to be related and looked up to, people with real character flaws and motivations that if you were in their shoes you might make the same choices. Especially with Spider-Man and the X-Men. Modern Marvel may have become the SJW forest fire of a company in the modern era, but I'd argue that's a misguided attempt to follow their design philosophy they've had for decades. And the fact they still make a few good books that aren't inherently soulless pandering to the far left proves they've not entirely lost their minds.
how to write a good superhero story: know that superheroes are characters. not stories. have the hero develop personal beef with the villain. if the story is short or split into many parts, have one or many villains who are simply evil. make the hero's powers say something about the hero. eg; a smart hero shouldn't have the hulk's powers. have the hero/villain beef pay off with a climactic battle. if there's more than one battle make each one unique. people don't wanna see the same thing several times. and finally, if there are several plot threads, have all of them close at the moment the final battle ends. i think that just about covers everything. this template is plain, but allows for tons of drama and some good action. it can also be stretched to near infinity with the minor villains, alternate plots, and multiple encounters. btw parts of this are from one piece.
...I read comics for drama, romance, AND the whole punchy bits... I used to read X-men to follow Gambit and Rogue's story, the whole "will they?" "won't they?" thing... which made me LOVE Rogue & Gambit, and Mr. and Mrs. X... T-T I'm just broke, right now... otherwise I'd totally be buying them. I also read Superman comics for the dynamic between Lois and Clark, especially now that they're parents. Superhero comics can appeal to everyone if they find a healthy balance, and, as you said, tell a good story.
@@anonygent They were kinda bad for each other (especially since they both had a ton of issues they should have worked through, first, in therapy). But, Rogue & Gambit, and Mr. and Mrs. X were the realization of my dreams, and I had been loving marriage, for them. Although, knowing comics, they'll probably end up wanting the drama of breaking them up, or taking them back to an earlier time, so... meh. I'll enjoy what I got.
Most of those men who "are upset that a male character gets replaced by a female character" it's more along the lines of people complaining about one of their favorite characters getting replaced period. But good luck telling that to any SJW.
The thing that pisses me off is WHY the character is replaced. It’s either because of the reasons he presented in the video (because women supposedly can’t relate to male characters which belittles all women’s mental capacities in a way that is deeply insulting in my opinion) or to push an anti-male agenda; pushing the idea that men suffer from “toxic masculinity” and that they need to be replaced by female characters or more feminine male characters that would supposedly be better.
The thing is, you're assuming that there is (or should be?) just one type of popular superhero comic: action-based. Is there any reason we can't have action-packed superhero comics, and thoughtful intellectual superhero comics, and primarily humorous superhero comics, and primarily romantic superhero comics, etc. etc.? It's not like there aren't more than enough comics titles out there to cover all the bases. Superhero ceased to be a genre a while back. Or if it's a genre, it's a *really* broad one like Science Fiction, which can tell tales ranging from Alien to Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind. On TV superheroes can bring us anything from One Punch Man to Runaways to The Flash to Misfits. The same is true of comics.
I recently met your channel, and I love it, but this video's title scared me a bit, but after seeing it, it makes more sense. I remember some time ago, in an anime group, a post of a girl talking about how much she loves that a lot of the new heros in actions series where weak and were used to cry and be sensitive, remarking how good was to make men to not to reinforce their "toxic masculinity" with nonsense violence and including more not sexualized female characters, but then you enter into groups of that kind of series with that kind of characters and you find that a lot of the members are female, a lot, and their main focuses are the shippings, the slice of live episodes, and the comedy, then when they talk about the battles they don't talk about how creative, intense, or amazing was a battle, talk about the character development moments where they were trying to cry or directly crying, talking about how much they love each other, etc. I didn't see the correlation until now, and is funny because that day I though "Well, what is your problem with nonsense fictional violence? Sometimes men just want to see how two assholes starts a fight and maybe kill each other, also, what is your problem with sexualized female character? Can't we have some eye candies? Then why are you sharing soft porn of that young men if you hate sexualized things?" But, you know, I didn't comment that, I knew that the reaction would be some haha reacts and maybe a block.
as a woman i connect more with action and fantasy as well as sci fi more than most romance movie. i grew up with being obsessed with star wars and all through middle school and high school i have been quite obsessed with marvel movies and dc comic books. where as romance has always been so cheesy and annoying to me though i will say that some have been entertaining its not the first thing i would choose to watch if i wanted to go to the movie theater. edit: i guess my point is give me an action movie over a romance movie any day and ill take it. but i actually really love your videos i think you are very well spoken and comical (in a good way like your funny lol)
You can tell he really just wanted people to see a certain narrative. I really want a bigger commentary channel to make a constructive callout video on him because he actually has some good ideas and could make great videos, but everything he says is motivated by him thinking SJW's are solely responsible for all societies problems.
This seems like a guy who is just smart enough to think he already knows everything and is super proud of that fact, when a real critical thinker would figure out pretty quickly how the bias displayed in this video makes them seem way dumber than they are. Does he really think Marvel could care less who buys comic books at this point? They are flat out printing money in movie tickets and merch. Interest in comics has declined because technology has allowed those stories to be told in a more exciting and engaging format now.
Awesome video, I totally agree with your argument. And let me just say, that as a woman I absolutely love war movies (saving private ryan, full metal jacket, the patriot, band of brothers-i know it was a show) and just movies with nicely choreographed fight scenes and a GOOD Plot! However, if I was given this survey to fill out, I wouldn't put that I like "action" movies, because the word "action" can include so much, it mainly makes me think of poorly made big budget movies like Transformers and most of the recent marvel movies. If they had more genres, like "historical war", "martial arts", etc, I would absolutely mark down those. No idea if the survey gave the people taking it these options and/or they were pulled together at the end more generally but if not it would really help with the data for this study and many others ( :
He uses it to do exactly that. He takes two things he is fired up by and combines them. That is his channel. From what ive seen he focuses strongly on characters en their story, so to ask a painter to sculpt would be stretching it, don’t you think?
Didn't realize Marvel needed saving. Also didn't realize the comics don't or shouldn't cater to romance based on another funny study on stereotypes...you know...since romance was part of the comics since forever? It shouldn't be focused on drama and romance - just as much as it shouldn't be all focused purely on action. These things need balance because they go hand in hand with good storytelling. One without the other is just fifty pages of character-less punchmachines beating the crap out of each other or a boring one-dimensional telenovela. Balance is where it's at, young padawans.
You shouldn't cite speculation in your videos. It's perfectly fine to show a study that shows a correlation, but don't read out assumptions even if written by researchers. There's absolutely no way of telling just from correlation what the causal relationship involved is, and taking a hard-line "nature" stance in the "nature vs nurture" question based on so little is questionable at best. Worse yet, some of your viewers may become convinced that this is true, even though it's stated that it's speculation. As a content creator you should watch out for these kinds of things, since they hurt the objectivity and credibility of your videos, and might be misleading.
They can be for anyone despite having males as the target audience, when an individual takes the various storylines that female readers have enjoyed in the past 2 decades.
As a huge X-men fan from the 80s and 90s. Rogue, & Shadow Cat were among my all time favorites. But they were much better written back then. To this day I believe that the best version of carol Danvers was Rogue after she absorbed her powers and life force.
Good points here. My two favorite comics are The Unbelievable Gwenpool and Loki Agent of Asgard, and both are absolutely amazing, in my opinion, because both have flawed, human characters.
As someone who loves action, I find the idea of action without drama appalling. Drama makes those action scenes more intense. The drama helps to enhance a character, and give them more depth. That depth boosts the emotions of the action scenes. That drama enhances action if done properly. And if done properly, romance can bloom from that drama. It doesn't have to, but as a core, romance and drama can very much be tools to enhance action. Just like how action can boost drama, and even romance if done right. How can the action have meaning without some drama to it? Part of developing a character is delving into their love, whether it be for another person, animal, or idea or object. A good action story needs to have some drama to boost the investment of that action. Romance can further enhance it, especially in giving motive and determination for our hero, or the villain, to fight for what they believe in.
when I was a kid I used to sneak into my brother's room and read his comics. Spiderman, Dr. Strange, X-Men, ... because they had good stories. didn't bother me that they were aimed at boys. the comics aimed at girls were fluffy and boring, IMO. when a female character started getting on my nerves for being written fluffy and ditzy, my imagination took off and I wrote my own stories with a slightly different tomboyish shift. what if she didn't stand there and shriek? what if she put up a fight? or what if she actually liked her science class with the frogs and mice and creepy crawlies? some of us did/do. anyway, thanks LD for posting interesting vids.
I recently read Spider-Man vs Wolverine. A fairly heavy focus on drama and a touch of romance. However, there was action throughout (both on and off panel) and ended in a climactic fight between the two titular characters. It was good and I think fits your description of how a comic can infuse drama into an action based story.
This is what people have to understand about averages. Relatively small deviations between averages produces massive differences in the extremes. So, if males prefer action 70/30 or even 60/40 ratio, that means the people who are *most drawn* to action are overwhelmingly male. Same goes for romance. (in favor of women)
I am a gal who is not really a tomboy at all, but has always preferred stuff aimed at boys. He-Man, Gargoyles, Ghostbusters TAS, TMNT, Voltron, Robotech, X-Men, Batman, Devilman, Jojo's Bizarre Adventures, Cherry 2000, The Story of Ricky (1991), Married With Children, Star Trek, Nightmare on Elm Street, Braindead (1992), NCIS, Blacklist. The cutscenes from Mortal Kombat 2011 were the best movie I saw that year. Romantic dramas are sickening & their tropes bingo is too transparent & by the numbers.
I'm sure I heard of a study where they tested the effects of testosterone on people and only people who were TOLD they'd been given it acted aggressive and competitive - those who'd been given it but were told it wasn't testosterone actually acted nicer. So you can't really blame a preference for action tropes in men on their hormones.
Do not confuse drama with melodrama. Drama is a universal genre. If you try to recall examples of genius comics, they are almost always either drama or contain a significant element of it.
I think tropes are more associated to gender because of culture, the study at 3:20 came to its own conclusions but my conclusion is nurture over nature. Dads tell their sons to be manly and moms tell their daughters to play with dolls.
@@joaoalberto9531 sorry, what i said was a bit spineless. what i meant to say was that stereotypes are curated, and if you think genetics has anything to do with it, you're a nazi
Why does everybody think nowadays that you need to identify with the main character. Hell, i don't want to identify with a main character of a story, i want a good story in a world that isn't linke mine, about a well written character that is not like me. i live as myself in my world everyday. i want to read/watch/play something that is different, i want to read about characters that chose path i have not, i want to play characters that i can not be i want to see a world i can't see in my real life.
Oh a study identified the taste preferences of a tiny group of people from one specific location and culture, so IT HAS TO BE FACT ACROSS ALL OF SPACE AND TIME (because it validates my biases)
This video makes you sound more like somebody who would go to any length to fight off SJWs than one who's actually a fan of superhero comics. Only slightly..
He intentionally is against SJWs. They ruin things. They search for an end-all-be-all to whatever problem they have, and will try to give solutions, but even if the solution is implemented, they're still not happy.
@@paulgreen3030 Look, I haven't watched the video in 2 months, so for the following reply, I will direct my complaints against the kind of people I described in the previous comment and not the UA-camr. And, for the record, I agree most SJW writers are shit at their jobs. So, this is mainly devil's advocate. If you're not a fan of superhero comics, you don't get a say in what's ruining them. You don't say they're good, nor if they are bad, nor explain that sentiment. You won't know if you don't read them. And, if you don't read them, then you shouldn't make a video telling people to blame your own enemies for ruining something you don't care about. Just because they're co-opting comics to spread a political message doesn't give you the right to do so.
@@paulgreen3030 And, after watching a minute and a half of the video, he already starts with the premise that Superhero comics usually don't have Drama and that drama doesn't attract men. As if these comics were mindless action and the whole point of the video has nothing to do with actual opinions about comic books
Japanese comic industry: We created over 9000 genres and sub-genres to please anyone of any age. Feel free to try it out yourself, gaijin. American comic industry: No, no. If we take our 3,5 popular superhero titles and add a few Mary Sues, it might actually work...
Ugh, the "romance is for chicks" trope. I don't know many other women who prefer romance heavy stuff unless they are single, younger than 16 and expected by friends/family to be boy crazy, or going through a divorce/break-up. Most everyone worth their salt prefers well written characters, plots that make sense, relateable scenarios with the element of drama, and villains that are both threatening and a shade away from what we already are... that includes women. The Fairly OddParent's genderswap episode had it right. Timmantha: Do girls like comics? Buff dudes in spandex fighting evil? OF COURSE!!!
I grew up on Marvel comics ("super heroes with super problems") and fell in love with Chris Claremont's psychological stories like the Phoenix Saga. That seems pretty main stream, though not exclusively good guy punches bad guy...
My interests must lean a little more yang than many other women, because I really enjoy comics where male characters beat the hell out of each other. I like the old style hero comics, I also read a lot of Archies. What's important in the stories is the dynamic clash of equal but opposite forces/beliefs. What's satisfying about a good story is when those opposites discover the grey areas in themselves that they might never have noticed if there was no conflict. Male hero's are important for men because they can project themselves into the role, and sort out those grey areas. Male heros are also important for women because we can project our Animus, or hero archetype into the character, and develop our inner strength. Watering down or neutering our heros doesn't help anyone.
It's videos like this that make me realize that a lot of people don't really take time to just listen to each other. Because while as I most definitely want more stories with black characters and them because I feel as though they are under represented. At the core of anything I want the stories to be well written and well made. And it's very clear that I don't "Need" stories to include someone to look like me based on a the media I consume that don't have characters that look or have backgrounds similar to me at all. Maybe the best thing for everyone would be to make a new imprint with that in mind and then actually getting writers that have more talent.
I'm a mostly female identifying person and I don't like romance stories. I only like it if its as a sideplot that you could take out and still have a good story without it. And I'm not the only one who feels that way. So perhaps superhero comics aren't for men as much as they are for people who like superhero comics and action etc, regardless of their gender.
They are "for" everyone in the sense the publishers hope everyone will buy them. But they are not "made" for everyone because they are founded on story traits that have very long been known to appeal to some people more than others. Anyone working in marketing understands this entirely.
Tbh I'm more into the comics for the artwork given that I am an artist who wants to get into the comic industry eventually. But I have to say, the other women I know that are into the comics are in it for the storyline, not just the action or romance or whatever else. A comic isn't worth very much if it doesn't do what it's supposed to and that's to tell a story.
I'm a guy and I'm very unimpressed by the superhero genre in general, generally because these stories very predictable, very reliant on tropes, this "pure good vs pure evil" kinda thing has been done to hell and back, doesn't take many risks when it comes to thw writing (ie. characters who die come back to life, stakes are artificially inflated because we know nothing really bad will ever happen to the protagonist, etc) Idk, I think your video should've been titled "Superhero comics are for BOYS" because media for children tends to be pretty straightforward, as these comics tend to be. I appreciate stories with depth, and really GOOD stories are able to incorporate elements of romance, action, etc seamlessly. Good stories are universal, doesn't matter if you're a guy, girl or whatever, a GOOD story is human and resonates regardless of gender.
I love all the Batman clasics like Long Halloween, Batman Returns, Hush and so on and so on but now when you are mentioning it... the action part is actually really something that interests me the least and my favourite parts are the drama, mystery or character conflits... I never realized that till now.
This reminds me of an interesting thing my drama teacher told me in High School (a whole 22 years ago) -- He told us that the reason for the boon in cartoons for boys in the mid-late 1980's and beyond wasn't because of sexism as many thought, but instead because they found that shows aimed at boys will be watched by both boys and girls, whereas shows aimed at girls will only be watched by girls. In a sense, having almost all shows aimed at boys was, essentially, a method of obtaining the largest possible audience.
This is true of books and movies as well. In the vast ocean of books, only two books with female protagonists have ever been popular with boys, The Wizard of Oz and Alice in Wonderland, both adventure stories of a sort. Meanwhile, a thousand books with male protagonists have been popular with boys and girls. Harriet Potter wouldn't have sold.
Im just asking for a good story, regardless of genre. Im girl and i usually prefer action movies, but if it written badly and i have to turn my brain off, i wont like it
I kinda had an idea for my own story. I just dont know how to go about it. I have the ideas saved. I love what you have to say cause it helps inspire me to be more creative in what I want to talk about. So thank you on that part, Literature Devil.
I'm a guy, and I have never really being interested in comics. I almost never watch movies, even when given the chance to for free, and I prefer deep meaningful stories, that have relatable characters who change over the course of the story, and a world that feels interesting and real. While those are all the essentials of "Good stories", I still prefer those stories even without the player involved actions. Persona 4 for example, limits the "Action" to an alternate plain of reality, which is mainly there to explore a character's flaws and inner self better. The action itself is cool, but it's *not what remains in my mind after putting the game down* The idea that certain genders are pre-built to like certain things, and not others, bothers me a lot. It makes me feel like we don't have free will, and a unique sense of self. My sisters love action a lot, and watch movies related to it. They also love playing games full of action with no romance or plot. I argue it's our culture which makes us *think* this is normal for everyone. You raise someone to believe girls should love romance and take interest in certain stuff, and they will likely take interest in that stuff. That isn't *true* gender based evidence, just evidence we are being *conditioned to think and have these likes and dislikes*
Ah yes, the obvious but apparently not obvious solution. Make something worth fricking reading. It's amazing how many stories fall flat and how many things do bad and people question why that is when many people say things like "the story was weak" or "the story was inconsistent"
One of the most important rules for writing is to know your audience. A good story for the romance loving crowd is not necessarily a good story for the action-loving crowd.
HOW ABOUT we just all agree good writing MAKES GOOD WRITING? I’m fucking tired of people saying stuff like “Political correctness is ruining art”. Yes, tokenism is the bane of writing. No, I refuse to call it forced diversity because tokenism is what it is. Representation can only be positive, people who see themselves represented are happy and everyone else is unaffected. The issue arises with tokenism, when a character is inserted solely to be a character of a minority. Kamala Khan is good character is because she’s a character that happens to be a Muslim girl. Riri Williams is a bad character because the writers stopped her characterization after ‘black girl’.
I feel that the new spider man game kind of brought the genre back to its roots i genuinely felt like i was reading an old comic drama was in there romance but action was the main dining force
So. I agree that action is what the target audience for Superhero comics wants. I do feel like I need to point out that there *are* some women who like Action (I am one of them!), though they are a minority. So Superhero comics are not *just* for men-they are for people who like action, which means *predominantly* (but not exclusively) men. I realize you do say this in the video, so why am I pointing it out again in the comments? Mostly for the sake of other commentators who might not have listened closely.
Sam Z I actually liked the Logan movie, but I don’t like it because of it having drama in its story, but I like it because of the fact that Logan is written like an ordinary human being doing ordinary things, and I also like how the setting takes place in current date Canada/the United States.
Superhero comics are fun! I can see why they're for men, but it's nice that I can enjoy them, too, despite being a woman. I think they're good as-is and get most of my enjoyment out of them when they're seriously dude-centered. We should be able to have nice things without everyone getting their panties in a bunch over it.
The Long Halloween is my favorite comic book so far (I just started getting into reading comic books a couple months ago) and it does a good job appealing to both men and women. There’s a bit of action, a bit of drama, but a lot of mystery which I think both men and women both really like.
I must be an anomaly since I prefer action films and comics, despite me being female. o_o Hell, the first comics I collected were Marvel's X-Men, Dark Horse's Alien and Predator series, and the original Tales from the Crypt comics. I was also into He-Man and She-Ra (which, funny enough, the latter was created when it was discovered that 20% of He-Man's audience were female). The 80s were a fun crazy time. XD Older now, I admittedly prefer action with drama since it's that drama aspect that gives me a reason to care if a character dies/succeeds or not. I mean, I still enjoy popping in Commando, Time Cop, and Best of the Best for the cheese and seeing ass get kicked, but these days I'm getting more bang out of my buck outta shows like Cobra Kai and Game of Thrones - character-driven action plots.
That's interesting. I'm male, and I've always liked romance as the driving element, with the action just being for flavour. Unfortunatly, the large majority of romance plots in media is underdeveloped and makes me gag ("we just met five minutes ago, I am now willing to throw away my life for you"). If I may ask, as a female fan of action of action and fighting, do you prefer your female leads to have their femininity on full display (stereotypical bikini armour, etc.) as is commonly portrayed, or a more utilitarian, unisex approach like Brienne of Tarth from GoT or Stormtroopers from Star Wars? I hope to one day write stories, and it would be useful to know how women like their action avatars.
As other people have said in this section, if we are to consider manga a type of comics, which they are considering they're just comics from Japan, comics can have plenty of drama and action. Take for example Jojo's Bizarre Adventure: Steel Ball Run, by Hirohiko Araki. It is driven by the action from the battles in the story arc, yet it's main cast grows and develops with each other as it goes, adding drama and growing comradery (instead of a romance.)
Well, here I am, two years later and say: Hey, this is kinda incorrect. I mean the ideea that Drama and Romance is not for superhero stories. Why? Well, Stan 'THE MAN" Lee himself said this. He said that what should make a superhero great is how he struggles with his weaknesses. Or his reasons to do what he does. Bascially, his 'drama'. And, frankly, I believe this is really a great thing for superhero comics. Why? Because YOU WANT THE HERO TO WIN. When you know he serves that punch for redemption or to protect someone, you wish that punch to hit as hard as possible. What would be the point of a guy punching another guy for fun? I could give an example from the TV series Avatar: The Last Airbender, Book 2, Chaper: Zuko alone. When he's facing the Earth Kingdom soldiers. Even after watching the end of season 2 countless times, even after knowing of his betrayal and how he's nowhere near redemption and that he's essentially a villain in this chapter as well, I WANT HIM TO WIN. Same could be said a few episodes into season 1, when Zuko faces Admiral Zao: I WANT HIM TO WIN. Despite being a villain, in the context, he's the one having the better and more relatable reasons, so, for every blow he delivers, we are happy for them. I remember watching some old cartoons, Popeye the Sailor Man, black and white era, or Early Superman cartoons when the most thrilling thing was Superman throwing away some bank robbers. That works well for extremely young audiences (10 year olds, perhaps a bit older in that 1940's when those cartoons were made), but for teens, young adults and later? Not really. You get a pretty big deja-vu really soon. And here I paraphrase Stan Lee: 'Superman was such a big character that they needed to introduce kryptonite and Lex Luthor', so, to break the 'deja-vu', you needed to give him drama. And that's not the only case. What are the weaknesses of DC Superheroes? The Martian has fire, GreenLantern yellow light and lack of personal control, Krpytonians have kryptonite and so on. They need that 'drama' to seem like they outmatch something and are not completely overpowered individuals. What are the weaknesses of Marvel superheroes? Can anyone point them out? And yet Marvel's heroes are as well known as DC ones. Why? Because they don't need a special gimmick to add drama to the punches, because their characters are built with drama. X-Men are built with them being rejected by society and hating their powers. This splits them in those allied with Magneto and embrace their powers and those that choose to tame their powers and embrace society. Captain America is a regular guy who was given superpowers to use them for his country. Iron Man is a playboy that tries to keep personal things together.
@@oldcat1790 Well, the ideea is different. What I meant is that, for one part, I do not view commercial success as quality approval. Then, Regarding to 'personal stories', we are still talking about action and fights. What I meant is that simply fighting without a plot gets boring quickly. Just think of every Batman vs Superman fight since, Idk, let's say The Dark Knight. Superman obliterates Batman until Batman pulls out cryptonite. How much could you repeat this? How much could you inovate to keep your sales up? Of course fighting is a centerpiece of action-superhero comics, but it should be more of a climax, rather than 100% plot. Meanwhile, if you take away the fighting, you go into a whole new genre and 'personal problems' don't serve as a build-up for the fighting, so they need to be developed much more. At this point, don't even have a comic, but write a book or a short novel.
Juan Manuel Penaloza Comic book readers don’t really care about the person’s sexuality, race, gender, religion, etc etc, and all we care about if the character is written well and if the characters are relatable.
Even something primarily targeting men or women cannot ignore women or men respectively. A story can be enriched by other viewpoints and story elements, but that's very different from compromising genre and story-telling to coerce a political agenda into a medium.
Years ago a comic shop I go to had a ladies night to attract more female readers. The guy who owned the shop put out a bunch of female centered superhero comics like Wonder Woman, Batwoman, Batgirl, Ms. Marvel, etc but he found most women didn't care for the superhero genre and were more interested in image comic books. He said comics like the walking dead and many other image horror books were way more popular with women. Once saga came out I heard that had a very high female readership which makes sense.
Or it just assumes women don't want to get in on the comic action. And is another reasons why there's a modern feminist movement that people like you and this UA-camr constantly Mansplain as a bad thing.
why do women get triggered when someone says "x, y,z is for men" i dont know a single guy who would bother with "make up, romantic novels and dresses are for women". In fact, most women would openly say that some stuff are for women only and try to change legislation to suit them. In my country we have cars on the subway just for women (at specific times) and every women feels entitled to it, Not one women has suggested that this might be discrimination against men. When its a women only space, women fight for it and feel happy to exclude men. When its a men's thing? They feel entitled to ENTER that space and even change it when they can. it is almost as if women have no personality of their own and have to insert themselves into whatever men are doing, to get attention and feel validated....
Not sure I agree with her, but Florence King said, "Women don't get anything until it's not worth having anymore." Example: Only countries that don't really matter have had female prime ministers/presidents. The biggies, the US, Russia, China, have not.
Comic books ARE for EVERYONE, not just men. There are a lot of women out there that like comic book superheroes. It's not as black and white as it's portrayed. It would be nice if it were neither portrayed nor thought of as so.
You forgot Star Trek. Star Trek is mainly drama, though it’s a male perspective. How do we solve this problem without unnecessary death or duress upon our crew? How do we protect the enterprise? How do we accomplish our mission? How do we handle this challenge of our morality, etc.
As a woman who enjoys comics, I completely agree with you. The SJWs who invaded the comics industry claiming that they’re “fixing it” have barged in uninvited. Women who like comics liked them the way they were: full of action and fistfights and interesting, forboding villains who were brought down by valiant heroes in suspenseful battles. Making the comics industry boring and uninspired by removing the element that makes it so great (i.e.: ACTION???) isn’t going to bring in new female comic book fans. It’s going to push them away. I hate what SJWs have done to my favorite heroes and I want nothing more than to see Marvel and DC go back to pumping out quality action-packed content like they did BEFORE the industry was infested with SJWs who spoke on the behalf of women like me who were never complaining about the state of comics in the first place.
Power, battle... The sweet sirens of sorrow sing songs so simple, yet so silken that spider's are disgraced. Death dances and drives men mad to its macabre horrors, that delightful, devil's dance. What more can a man ask for? What need have I for right and wrong, for the worries of tomorrow and yesterday, when the moment presses between life and death? Oh, the joy!
Okay. Let's talk about why creators of fantasy and fiction keep missing the boat when they try to cater to the gender (or other stereotype) of their "target audience". People who like fantasy and sci-fi are per definition *imaginitive*. It's at the core of our being. Imagination per definition needs a certain amount of flexibility. Thinking outside the box is a core component of who we are. It's much more than "what we like", it's an essential part of us. As a Transformers and Doctor Who fan, I found Elita-1 annoying even as a kid in the 80s. For those who don't know: Elita-1 is basically a pink female robot counterpart to Optimus Prime, introduced later to try to get "girls" to watch by giving them a character to "identify" with. I am very much not the only (male and female) fan who quickly fell *away* from the cartoon after this instead of being drawn in more. It should have been a no-brainer. I think that the most imaginitive people tend to be less stereotypical *because* they are highly imaginitive. It is part of what makes people like me tick. Throwing stereotype at people like me only makes us feel less welcome, not more. I don't care if the Doctor in Doctor Who is male or female. I expect the Doctor to take on murderous traffic cones armed with a screw driver and sarcasm. The show isn't doing poorly right now because people don't like the Doctor to be a woman (though some probably do have an issue, *most* of us die-hard fans really don't). We would like a decent script! Your show/story/whatever format stands and falls with your ability to play with our minds. Tickle our imaginations and we *will* come back for more. It is just that simple. We come back to watch Megatron show up with a Purple Griffin (please do Google it, it's an amazing bit of non-sense!!) and a remote control copy of Optimus Prime (fans like me still *love* that episode and work it into stories of our own because it is *fun* and you barely touched what Megatron could have done in that episode.. we'll forgive that the Autobots couldn't tell the difference between Megatron and Optimus because oh wow it was FUN!) ..because we want a smart antagonist giving our hero hell to overcome. Why? Because none of us are heroes. We are just average people up against things in life we aren't sure we can manage but we are willing to give it our best shot anyway. We're dreamers at heart. When faced with the choice we will likely do what we believe to be right over what is socially acceptable. We dare to dream that we can make things *better* with nothing but what life hands us and our wits, and we are willing to go that extra mile *because* we have a highly active inner world, where our minds alone are the limits of what we can accomplish. We don't actually give up easily, even when out numbered, out maneuvered, and out-muscled. That is what it means to be imaginitive in a nutshell. Don't alienate us because we're outside the norm. We already know we're basically freaks, but we're the freaks that watch your shows, buy both paper and Kindle formats of your stories, and probably write fiction of our own, draw things, etc. It's part of who we are. Most people won't ever get what we see in your work when life is tough enough not to spend time, energy, and hard earned cash on fairy tales. Those folks are never *going* to get it, just as we are never *not* going to get it. Basically.. we're your audience. Hi there.
This title scared me because I’m a woman who loves comics, especially superhero comics. I thought you were gonna tell me why I shouldn’t be reading them, but boy was I wrong. I’m glad I watched it, cause I agree with what you’re saying here. Thanks for this video.
Yeah he kinda had me a bit taken a back at first. But he didn't really seem like the kind of guy who would actually think that so i just assumed it was click bait
Female geek here as well, and I thought this video did a great job breaking things down. I agreed with everything stated.
“made for A” obviously doesn’t mean “can’t enjoyable for B”. as male myself, i really enjoyed some of shojou manga(kimi ni todoke, love complex, etc) because its made for woman. if these manga awkwardly trying to capture male audience, then i didn’t watch it first place, and many other males or female would think same.
Dont worry you can like something not made for you. As long as ya don't change it
I was worried when I saw the title too. I was about to say “no they are not” but I actually watched the video first. I honestly wish more women got into comics.
"Telling a good story", that is the most important thing. =)
The current Marvel comics probably thinks telling a good story is white supremacy lol.
...yes...
Smartest thing ive seen all day
@@gokux75 Which is basically "neutrality is hostility," which is a key part of totalitarian logic.
And you probably couldn't define a good story.
Not really for men or women if you go by Stan Lee's rule, which was: "Don't write with any audience in mind, write what you're interested in, dedicate yourself to that and trust that someone else might like it too."
The whole reason he even pushed for characters like Spider-Man was because his publisher kept telling him *"PEOPLE DON'T LIKE SPIDERS, STAN!!!"*
So if you're writing a comic book, or crafting any entertainment product: Get the audience out of your head, be original, find what makes you passionate.
Marketing to a target demographic is how you sell a product
Wasn't iron man created with a target audience in mind? Tony was a weapon manufacturer. He was what anti Vietnam war youths hated. Maybe LD mentioned it in his racist character video.
@@theblancmange1265 Japan has mastered the marketing concept and manga sells way more than comics.
@@theblancmange1265 Tony was really created to be an idea of a hero being on the side of politics he didnt agree with. Humanize the other side he was someone knew as an asshole. but he was also human. Which drew people in.
@@mothman4191 what made iron popular was the movies. he wasn't nearly as popular as the hulk or the X-Men or even captain America until his movies. his movies did a great job making him marketable to the audiences that wanted a normal human being a superhero which was proven to exist thanks to the popularity of Nolan's Batman movie
Japan gets this. Shonen Jump is aimed to boys, but girls like it too - since the popular stories are well written and characters never lose their core.
South Korea seems to get too. Noblesse's readership seems even split.
@@LikaLaruku Anywhere that isn't mainstream comics seems to get it.
Stories like UnOrdinary and Sweet Home are good because they focus on the characters and the story. Not politics. Hell, even a comedy like Outrage understands it
@@scottsommer9843 Yeah I agree, but all the girls looks extremely sexualized for their age, and other than a a couple they all act the same as the rest of the students. Barely any time is put into their development, instead they just have quirk showcases or highlights.
yea you are right, Im a girl and i like both superherous and shounen jump, it might not be the majority but we exist and Im reading for the ACTION not the romance, romance is nice, i read romance too but when Im picking up... less say "ONE PIECE" i dont want romance! I want explosive non sensical funny action! Im there for the drive not the connection but the high feeling, if i want romance and action I can always take roranowa kenshin (and i did, the show was badddd the manga was pretty suprisingly good)
its the target audiance that makes a diffrence, girls like me come FOR the action in comics/manga/superero shows. if you take that away we would stop loving comic too :/
Scott Sommer Jesus... My Hero Academia is great, but please there have been much better Shōnen before that with better characters. It’s nothing new. And there are so much more than Shonen Jump in the world of manga - if reality is your thing then you can find that in several other manga.
But if you want a good new female main character in Jump then read The Promised Neverland!
I love female comic characters. If they are actually relatable, actually strong, actually believable females, with stable working emotions.
Remember when Khamala used to be cool and well received despite her middle eastern heritage cause they didn't beat you to death with her as a liberal mouthpiece? Or when Squirrel Girl wasn't a primarily comedy driven tumblr pandering chubster with a shit haircut that talked down Galactus because trans people exist? sigh...I miss 2014.
Honestly same goes with any hero. That should be the standard for professional writers.
@@TactlessC squirrel girl was always a joke character, she has beaten Dr Doom by swarming his van with squirrels a millennia ago, and she has had really weird romantic encounters with Daredevil and Wolverine
She also beat Wolveirne in a fight in the same year Wolverine embarrassed Iron Fist in hand to hand which all happened well before the sjw stuff existed
Not to mention she spent alot of her time as a babysitter for Luke Cage and Jessica Jones
Another example of good character turned trash is Carol Danvers, and of course Mockingbird was soiled hard as well. Which is why her series flopped, and why she has been the actual worse possible girlfriend in any comic series and to Spiderman of all people, damn you Dan Slott(it also hurt me a bunch more cus it reminded just how good Ultimate Peter Parker and Kitty Pryde was)
Ms Marvel was basically a relatable character who acted like a human with superpowers which is what she was, then the transition into Captain Marvel ultimately turned her into...I dont think anyone genuinely likes the character on paper, especially after Civil war 2 when her boyfriend Rhodes (by the way their relationship was made up literally just for Civil war 2, it existed nowhere else and the characters have never even teamed up) died and apparently she fell in love with him in that 1 hour long relationship which gave her more reason to be upset over his death than Tony Stark who had known him his whole life, Tony even basically agreed that she was hurt more than him over it which was disgustingly awful(damn you bendis, for that, making 616 Hawkeye kill, and most especially for crippling Moon Knights story so hard too)
Gail Simone ruined Dynimo lol.....
Why do you think Manga is getting more popular.
_Having legitimate flaws_ is the reason Miles Morales was more popular than Iron Heart btw
People don't mind having superheroes that don't correlate directly to their race or sex, because what makes them relatable is their flaws and struggles, since that's the one universal experience of all people
(Sorry. Comment only tangentially related to the video)
Miles Morales has the legitimate flaw of being a shit race baiting character.
Into the spider verse might just be the best Spider-Man movie yet.
To the original comment, iron heart didn’t have time to be given flaws. She was introduced and a little time passed and she was iron heart. There was also no regular tony stark for fans to read either. When miles was introduced you could still read comics about peter in the regular 616 universe but there wasn’t anything like that when they “got rid” of tony, there was only riri. But this is only my opinion.
@Rambonus Ravager Bullshit, he was brought in because the writer of Ultimate Spiderman wanted a black Spiderman. So he killed Ultimate off to introduce Miles. He's a boring, shitty mary sue and the only reason anyone gives a fuck is because he's black. Even after seven fucking years of writing he has no noteworthy villains, allies or stories. Because he only exists to BE the fucking black spiderman.
Miles Morales will die off
(I'm black by the way)
I am the smaller percent of females that actually highly dislikes romance tbh. Good video.
Oh heck I'm highlighted now.
Lel
wow look at you, so special! r/notlikeothergirls
I like romance, when it's part of a good action, sci-fi, or fantasy story because it adds additional dynamics to the character interactions, but I'm not big on straight romance. And, yes, I'm a woman. So, I get where you're coming from.
I’m a female and romance movies and books make me extremely uncomfortable and bored. Also, I agree that this was indeed a good video.
Though geared towards men, I believe that a well-written comic should appeal to men and women. For example, I love Watchmen and I gave my copy to my sister to read. She fell in love with it and now both she and I are waiting in anticipation for the HBO miniseries to come out. A well-written story and comic should, though geared towards men, appeal to both men and women like Watchmen did with my sister.
Should appeal or can appeal? By sayint should, it seems like you are saying that nothing should be made to appeal to a single group. Like saying you can never sell a single flavour of ice cream.
@@dimitripapadopoulos5180 I said should because if a comic is well-written then it will transcend gender norms. I am not saying you can only sell one flavor of ice-cream, but a good flavor of ice cream will appeal to all sexes. I understand what you are saying but I believe that comics have the power to transcend dislikes and likes, gender norms, etc. (like any kind of book or media) if they are well done and tell a good story. I am not saying you should seek to appeal to all audiences but a good story will appeal to all audiences.
DclobberandReik Just write a good story. That’s it. Doesn’t matter what type of people like it. Could be mostly men, could be mostly woman or even both. I say don’t aim for any gender. Just hope someone will read it
Rip on that mini series, mate
@@dclobberandreik4376 but a good story doesn't always appeal to all audiences. Something like action comics don't exactly appeal to people who hate action and fighting. Something like a horror novel won't apply to people who don't like being creeped out. Or some great dark comedy might be just too soon for someone who has recently lost someone.
Even the Mona Lisa probably looks bland in someone's eyes.
If your aspiration, the thing you see as the biggest true accomplishment, is that a work appeals to everyone, then that's instantly discounting literally everything that has even a single person who dislikes it. So... Everything.
A good story, is a good story. In the end it shouldn't truly matter who that good story applies to. If only everyone would just realize that.
Do you realize that "the killing joke" that you have pointed out as one of the best comic book has, arguably, zero action? Batman and joker do not fight. That comic is pure drama.
Also drama ≠ romance
8:38 shows how the gender gap in interest may be smaller than we suspect.
@Darth Pancake Studios Overlap does not equal the same. Action can also be considered dramatic just like romance. Anything that involves a challenge and/or rise in ACTION is dramatic.
He consistently states that women prefer "drama _and_ romance" as supported by the study. And he also said that drama should be in action based stories, just not be the focus. He even explained about the Killing Joke.
@@munstrumridcully Yeah, that's the distinction. But if human history is anything to go on, Drama in of itself is a human interest, not just a female one, though the genders of course have preferences in the specific kind of drama they enjoy. Therefore, if there's any theme that could be considered universal, it's drama, because you know you'll appeal to both sides of the coin with it.
@@dogman9291 That's true. Men, in general, prefer drama like that in, just for example, shows like The Sopranos and Better Call Saul, imo. If my wife and daughter are any indication, lol, women tend to prefer drama like that in shows like Gilmore Girls and Grey's Anatomy 😃
Sandman is a great character, but I wish they would change his name to Sandperson, because that would make the story more inclusive.
Totally agree
It would literally make them my hero's
@@andrewmontague9682
So far there are three major characters with the name Sandman:
Sandman from the Spider-Man comics.
Sandman, the ruler of dreams.
Wesley Dodds, one of the first DC superheroes.
i hope thats a joke
@@MrGrimjaw what's a joke?
I like your work, but I disagree slightly with this video. Marvel is not putting out books that appeal to women- I am a woman and have read several current yr Marvel comics- there is no drama or romance. Clairemont's 80s X books are more dramatic and romantic than anything that Marvel has put out in yrs.
Also, id argue that men actually like romance, some of comics most enduring and endearing heroes, such as Batman, Superman, Spiderman, Wolverine, etc, have active love lives and even get married. Guys like romance, they just don't like it as the focus of a story, and I think that romance is more palpable to male readers if It's presented more as a partnership.
Just my thoughts.
I can only speak for my self, but I have actually appreciate romance in stories when it adds or helps drive, but not be the core aspect, of the plot. Fight Club for instance, is considered a great, testosterone movie, but the crux of the movie kicks off with the Narrator's growing infatuation with Marla. It isn't the focus of the movie though.
Hints of the Narrator's feelings and relationship-through-Tyler with her are dropped throughout the movie. She's even the final piece of the puzzle for the Narrator to realize him and Tyler are the same person. The end shows them holding hands as financial institutions fall before them.
A prospective for the movie is a guy trying to work out his feelings for a girl and then tell her he likes her.
I think his main point is that what they are trying to do is cram two incompatible types of story together. Superhero action stories just cannot contain more than a certain level, or style, of romance, drama, and human interest elements without ceasing to be effective superhero stories. And so they have ended up with a monstrosity that, in trying to please both sexes, ends up pleasing neither.
@@davidh.4944 I don't think modern comics are meant to be pleasing to either sex, just to the writers that use these characters as self inserts.
Also, It's interesting that you mention the Claremont era, because one of the things I remember most about the romantic side-stories of the late 80s and early 90s X-titles was how much I hated them.
Ironically, I'd say that what turned me off the most were the sudden, unrealistic, fantastic ways they sprang up and died, like game of romance roulette. Suddenly in one issue two characters just started hooking up, without there being any real rhyme or reason behind their attraction. And a dozen issues later it all fell apart again, often tragically. It was often blatantly obvious that the relationships were just thrown in to create drama and conflict, rather than being a natural extension of the characters themselves.
Peter Parker and Mary Jane, on the other hand, had exactly the kind of relationship that I loved. That was a story that had built up naturally over years, with both characters being totally devoted to each other in a way that just felt right. It was stable, strong, pure, and realistic.
So yes, male-oriented comics _can_ have romance in them, but it has to be romance done in a way that seems natural and satisfies the male psyche.
The Peter and MJ thing is the core argument for "Men appreciating romance" and it was also the smoking gun to when Marvel started losing it's concept of balance when they had their marriage in-universe-retconned, because of meta ideas by the writers that "Spider-Man sells better and appeals to people more when he's a single guy bumbling around and failing constantly." Cause hoo boy between Civil War and Superior Spider-Man (or arguably until the current Amazing title done by Nick Spencer where haha MJ and him are together again), Main Universe Spidey was in a real downward spiral cause Peter dating so many women you just didn't give a shit about or had terrible build up just really cut into the poorly written villain stories even more than some might think MJ used to.
I can see where you’re coming from but there’s a reason I read Spider-Man and not Batman, Spider-Man has a heavy focus on the drama and romantic aspects of Peter’s life. I personally wouldn’t read Spider-Man if it didn’t have those romantic qualities, and seeing those qualities in other comics is also a factor that draws me into them. I agree that the new progressive line at Marvel is low quality and the action/conflict can be very clumsy, however I don’t feel romance is the problem. The problem is the integration of say something like romance into the action. For instance: in Spider-Man Black Cat provided romance and drama for a while in the comics, but she also contributed to the action and played a part in showing the consequences this action might have on a person without powers. The romance is prevalent but it’s used as a plot device to the further the narrative and action sequences as a whole rather than being treated as two separate entities like with the current line of comics. If romance doesn’t have a point in a comic it becomes an extraneous detail and nobody likes to read that. What the current writers need to do is make sure they actually have a reason for putting romance into a comic rather than making a cluttered mess. In other words romance isn’t bad these writers just don’t know how to integrate it.
I hope creators will learn to use tropes. We've had "damsel in distress" used on every occassion possible. Now "Mary Sue" took its place and arguebly it's overused just as much. I mean, can we have both people that need saving and people who can stand their ground? I'm not asking for that much.
Lois Lane from the DCAU is a perfect example of this. She's a sassy career woman who really doesn't take crap from anybody, her dad is a military general and a black belt so of course she knows basic hand to hand, however there isn't much she can do when a building is collapsing or two demi gods are punching each other through the city, so it makes sense for her to be a damsel at times and not at others.
Edit: fixed some spelling errors
Lex stole 40 cakes!?!?!
That's just awful!
I'm sorry, but I refuse to belive that it's as black and white as this presents it. Not everything has to do with SJW influence. Market dynamics in storytelling change, has so for years, like the ghost and romance stories in the era of Romanticism. Stan Lee said that comics, in general, are for everyone, and I think its really unhealthy to focus so much on what a very little, though vocal, minority has or will ruin, because you'll start seeing correlations everywhere, which clouds judgment because it will result in confirmation bias. Just food for thought
I can see where you could think this, but correlations do, sometimes, equal causation. Mass media in general panders, or is otherwise completely controlled, by radical neo-liberalism, or SJWism as we know it. Sometimes the simple answer of radical ideological fascism is the correct one.
No, women just like trendy things. And there's nothing wrong with that. I love my trendy boots. I love my trendy make up. I love trendy as much as any girl. But right now, it's trendy to be a "nerd" and into nerdy things.
While comics are for "everyone," as in anyone can find value in them. No one is going to stop a woman from purchasing a comic. I know first hand because I'm a woman and I've bought comics for over 25 years. The reality is, the consumers with the biggest preference towards them is males. So from a practical standpoint, a market campaign is easier for males, because they naturally gravitate towards the product. You can market to females, but you have to do it under the understanding that it is not a natural draw for them. There has to be slight altercations on how the comics are written, drawn, and colored to appeal.
Comics only became a natural draw for women when it became trendy and cool to be a "nerd." So I wouldn't even consider it natural. And then some SJW came in there, trying to be a nerd, because that's the trendy thing to be right now. Realized she didn't actually like comics because they're marketed to males. She raises a big stink about them being sexists, which is why she doesn't like them, but since she's talking out of her ass she's saying she does like them and the only thing she hates is everything about them... because she wants to be trendy and it's trendy to be a nerd... Then other girls say, "Yeah! We want to be nerds too! But we don't like nerdy things, but rather than just admit that, we'll call it sexist!"
(Anonymous Girl, whoever you are... wherever you are... I hate you.)
The truth is, this hasn't worked out for Marvel. Comic sales have declined and continue to do so for decades. Not years, decades. Because women, in general, don't like comics and they never did. This hasn't changed.
@@TheRisky9 I'm sure some women like things because they're trendy but that definitely isn't all women. I personally have liked shounen anime and manga since middle school and it has nothing to do with feeling like it was cool. It was because it's interesting. The story is what matters. Not the pandering. In fact pandering tends to cause self conscious people to turn away typically. Saying that women only like things when they are trendy is really degrading. It's worse than my SJW program coordinator once telling me I only shave my legs for men, not because I like the way they feel, etc. disregarding that I am a person with ideals and only a product of oppression. So. Think before you speak.
@@TheRisky9 And yes Marvel's pandering probably has turned people away.
Right? I'm sure Marvel is devastated that interest in comics that were barely making them any money has declined...... and that they've managed to change it into a multi-billion dollar mainstream movie market. Anyone who thinks Marvel has made 'mistakes' by not catering to only men is delusional.
Woman here. By now I am quite a bit into my middle age. 😊 I still love superheroes and action!
Fav movie genres are phantasy, sci-fi, action, adventure, comedy... but not much of a drama and romance girl. My least fav genres. They're mostly ok to have in small quantities, but if the story is good, I watch. And Sandman is good, because it has good story and relatable characters.
Same. I hate it when my folks come over for the Holidays & subject me to weeks of Hallmark & Lifetime movies. They're all the same goddamn movie with the same goddamn characters. I don;t care if the most annoying girl in town hooks up with her business rival. I'd rather see them stay bitter rivals & compete ferociously with eachother.
@@LikaLaruku I hope you're not trying to imply that superhero movies are above retelling the same story over and over... and over.
Cool whay kind of comics do you like?
To be honest I wasn't able to finish the video because is the same crap that I have been listening since I took my first comic when I was 5. Girls don't "like action, sports, videogames or comics" FALSE, I loved it I have a well amount of female friends who also loved it, you know what I dislike?, forced drama, teenage angst, romantic plot line who dosen't aport to the main plot.
@@xCoatlicuex Same. The x-men were IMPORTANT to me growing up, they still are. This guy has some issues.
I like how Japan solves this problem, They have Shonen, Shoujo, Seinin, and Shoujo-Ai. These are the primary Genres that every manga is sorted by. They literally stand for, Young Boys, Young Girls, Adult Men, Adult Women. Everyone has a genre for them and nobody has to shoe horn topics cross genre for everyone. Some stories can appeal to multiple genders regardless of genre, usually those end up being Seinin, But there are lots of cross fans, males that read shoujo. I America this wouldn't work. They would ask, where is the genre for trans-men and trans-women. But its nice to see someplace else in the world not being fucked by social justice. Eventually social justice is just gonna cripple our culture and we won't be known as the best place in the world with the most desirable culture. Which probably is the case since I hear more about people following anime characters and stories now over following american heros outside of marvel.
Is Shoujo-Ai the same a Josei?
While I see what you're trying to say, you're kind of off base. While Shoujo and Josei is AGGRESSIVELY aimed at females, Shounen and Seinen stories still have character development and humanizing themes in them, with a splash of background commentary. It's not all DBZ and Naruto vs Card Captor Sakura in terms of balance to gender preferences. I mean....consider if you will Shonen Jump has Skip Beat which is a very slice of life and Shoujo-like series, and sports series like Prince of Tennis which is just eye candy for women, and everything in between before hitting the Action/Combat or Intrigue series.
There's series like Full Metal Alchemist and Rurouni Kenshin which is the perfect balance of drama and action that appeals to both sides of the gender spectrum and is lauded by them.
Hilariously, outside of Japan's casual racism and xenophobia, people are moving towards anime and manga instead of western comics cause it does the job SJWs want to do better by being well written and more open and appealing to a larger demographic with their varied casts and what not. Japan even handles things like sexual inclusiveness better by either not making it a giant focus point to go "look at me" or just referencing how the society actually carries itself in Japan instead of this "androgynous sugar coating that ignores ugliness and side-effects" that America and Europe likes to do.
No they just didn't use the right term. Shoujo-Ai is just softcore Yuri.
The difference is Japan doesn't have feminism and the manga industry isn't filled with SJW's that want demonize each genre's core demographic.
Shoujo-Ai is actually girls love me amigo.
Josei is for adult women
You know, it is possible for a man and/or for a woman to enjoy both violent genres and more sensitive genres.
@Strider Xanthos get out is an sjw movie
@@savagetv6460 You know showing racist people that are also bad in a movie doesn't automatically make it SJW. I don't think the purpose of the movie or any of the characters was to say "Black people good, white people bad" so much as to use racism and control as motives for the villains. Assuming that every movie that portrays black people as good and white people as bad is "SJW" is like assuming that every movie that has black-on-black violence being dealt with by white cops is far-right.
Thank you, this hole video is bullshit
Alessia Leone It sounds stupid when you say 'hole' instead of 'whole' but I guess it would sound stupid nonetheless since what you said is objectively wrong.
Biomechanic Oxidor It's possible but uncommon. That was the point.
The thing "some" people overlook is the studies reveal tendencies; something that will happen more times then it does not. "Some" people think more means all.
I'd question any study that called oxytocin and vasopressin "female hormones."
I too was shocked when I read it. How the heck did a study like this get published ?!
Those are in everyone. He probably meant estrogen. This guy complains about SJWs in comics, he's not doctor or biochemist.
@@gantzisballs Which is why he should stick to his expertise and criticise art.
@Vinicius Raposo ofc, but he did go off on a tangent about science that he doesn't understand.
Oxytocin has the primary purpose of dealing with pains during childbirth, so that one bring labelled as primarily female makes since. If women have more vasopressin than males, then it too is considered a female hormone; just as testosterone and estrogen are considered to be gendered hormones despite their presence in both sexes.
Marvel has been "diverse" for decades before they ever decided to make it forced.
Personally I would like a balance of Drama and Action because...I like Spider Man and Batman? And I grew up in the 90s and early 2000s with those really good cartoons that had a balance of well written character dynamic and super intense action to keep people drawn in. And those cartoons got me into comics! I'm not going to say the science behind those sort of gender studies surveys are wrong, but it's a bit of a blanket statement to go "Men don't care about drama" or "Super heroes series are for men and don't need it" when Marvel's MO since the 70s has been to have characters that are able to be related and looked up to, people with real character flaws and motivations that if you were in their shoes you might make the same choices. Especially with Spider-Man and the X-Men. Modern Marvel may have become the SJW forest fire of a company in the modern era, but I'd argue that's a misguided attempt to follow their design philosophy they've had for decades. And the fact they still make a few good books that aren't inherently soulless pandering to the far left proves they've not entirely lost their minds.
how to write a good superhero story:
know that superheroes are characters. not stories.
have the hero develop personal beef with the villain.
if the story is short or split into many parts, have one or many villains who are simply evil.
make the hero's powers say something about the hero. eg; a smart hero shouldn't have the hulk's powers.
have the hero/villain beef pay off with a climactic battle.
if there's more than one battle make each one unique. people don't wanna see the same thing several times.
and finally, if there are several plot threads, have all of them close at the moment the final battle ends.
i think that just about covers everything. this template is plain, but allows for tons of drama and some good action. it can also be stretched to near infinity with the minor villains, alternate plots, and multiple encounters. btw parts of this are from one piece.
...I read comics for drama, romance, AND the whole punchy bits... I used to read X-men to follow Gambit and Rogue's story, the whole "will they?" "won't they?" thing... which made me LOVE Rogue & Gambit, and Mr. and Mrs. X... T-T I'm just broke, right now... otherwise I'd totally be buying them. I also read Superman comics for the dynamic between Lois and Clark, especially now that they're parents.
Superhero comics can appeal to everyone if they find a healthy balance, and, as you said, tell a good story.
Gambit was a terrible match for Rogue.
@@anonygent They were kinda bad for each other (especially since they both had a ton of issues they should have worked through, first, in therapy).
But, Rogue & Gambit, and Mr. and Mrs. X were the realization of my dreams, and I had been loving marriage, for them. Although, knowing comics, they'll probably end up wanting the drama of breaking them up, or taking them back to an earlier time, so... meh. I'll enjoy what I got.
@@ChaoticButterfly Interesting. My mother's parents were the ideal couple since my parents were terrible to me and to each other.
Most of those men who "are upset that a male character gets replaced by a female character" it's more along the lines of people complaining about one of their favorite characters getting replaced period. But good luck telling that to any SJW.
The thing that pisses me off is WHY the character is replaced. It’s either because of the reasons he presented in the video (because women supposedly can’t relate to male characters which belittles all women’s mental capacities in a way that is deeply insulting in my opinion) or to push an anti-male agenda; pushing the idea that men suffer from “toxic masculinity” and that they need to be replaced by female characters or more feminine male characters that would supposedly be better.
I can't get over how good this guy is. please make more videos.
I'm female. I read Marvel for character drama/ the soap opera aspect. I do enjoy the action but characters are what make or break a comic for me.
The thing is, you're assuming that there is (or should be?) just one type of popular superhero comic: action-based. Is there any reason we can't have action-packed superhero comics, and thoughtful intellectual superhero comics, and primarily humorous superhero comics, and primarily romantic superhero comics, etc. etc.? It's not like there aren't more than enough comics titles out there to cover all the bases.
Superhero ceased to be a genre a while back. Or if it's a genre, it's a *really* broad one like Science Fiction, which can tell tales ranging from Alien to Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind. On TV superheroes can bring us anything from One Punch Man to Runaways to The Flash to Misfits. The same is true of comics.
I recently met your channel, and I love it, but this video's title scared me a bit, but after seeing it, it makes more sense.
I remember some time ago, in an anime group, a post of a girl talking about how much she loves that a lot of the new heros in actions series where weak and were used to cry and be sensitive, remarking how good was to make men to not to reinforce their "toxic masculinity" with nonsense violence and including more not sexualized female characters, but then you enter into groups of that kind of series with that kind of characters and you find that a lot of the members are female, a lot, and their main focuses are the shippings, the slice of live episodes, and the comedy, then when they talk about the battles they don't talk about how creative, intense, or amazing was a battle, talk about the character development moments where they were trying to cry or directly crying, talking about how much they love each other, etc. I didn't see the correlation until now, and is funny because that day I though "Well, what is your problem with nonsense fictional violence? Sometimes men just want to see how two assholes starts a fight and maybe kill each other, also, what is your problem with sexualized female character? Can't we have some eye candies? Then why are you sharing soft porn of that young men if you hate sexualized things?" But, you know, I didn't comment that, I knew that the reaction would be some haha reacts and maybe a block.
If drama has the narrowest gap between men and women than, if you want maximize audience, it makes more sense to center drama rather than action.
as a woman i connect more with action and fantasy as well as sci fi more than most romance movie. i grew up with being obsessed with star wars and all through middle school and high school i have been quite obsessed with marvel movies and dc comic books. where as romance has always been so cheesy and annoying to me though i will say that some have been entertaining its not the first thing i would choose to watch if i wanted to go to the movie theater.
edit: i guess my point is give me an action movie over a romance movie any day and ill take it. but i actually really love your videos i think you are very well spoken and comical (in a good way like your funny lol)
You've presented a lot of faulty science here. Even if your foundation is good, the road to your conclusions is murky and unrefined.
You can tell he really just wanted people to see a certain narrative. I really want a bigger commentary channel to make a constructive callout video on him because he actually has some good ideas and could make great videos, but everything he says is motivated by him thinking SJW's are solely responsible for all societies problems.
You're a channel of your own. If you feel like some info is missing here, make a response video.
yeah pretty much. he does have good points, but not everything is hurr durr sjw is killing everything.
@@jacehackworth6413 exactly. These anti SJWs are doing the exact same thing as the SJWs. Just the other side of the coin.
@@jacehackworth6413 Agreed. He knows about writing, but this insistence with SJW is just annoying.
This seems like a guy who is just smart enough to think he already knows everything and is super proud of that fact, when a real critical thinker would figure out pretty quickly how the bias displayed in this video makes them seem way dumber than they are.
Does he really think Marvel could care less who buys comic books at this point? They are flat out printing money in movie tickets and merch.
Interest in comics has declined because technology has allowed those stories to be told in a more exciting and engaging format now.
Exactly, not everything is fault of the "SJW"
Awesome video, I totally agree with your argument. And let me just say, that as a woman I absolutely love war movies (saving private ryan, full metal jacket, the patriot, band of brothers-i know it was a show) and just movies with nicely choreographed fight scenes and a GOOD Plot!
However, if I was given this survey to fill out, I wouldn't put that I like "action" movies, because the word "action" can include so much, it mainly makes me think of poorly made big budget movies like Transformers and most of the recent marvel movies. If they had more genres, like "historical war", "martial arts", etc, I would absolutely mark down those. No idea if the survey gave the people taking it these options and/or they were pulled together at the end more generally but if not it would really help with the data for this study and many others ( :
No offence, but bow about a video that is less about social justice ruining everything and more about the art of storytelling itself?
"bow" did you mean how?
I mean, it isn't like the name of the channel is LITERATURE Devil or anything.
He uses it to do exactly that. He takes two things he is fired up by and combines them. That is his channel. From what ive seen he focuses strongly on characters en their story, so to ask a painter to sculpt would be stretching it, don’t you think?
Because he actually doesnt know what makes for a good story?
His channel focuses on Marvel comics, not talking about their identity politics is impossible at this point.
Well duh. Most women don’t like super heros. They just want to invade male spaces.
Didn't realize Marvel needed saving. Also didn't realize the comics don't or shouldn't cater to romance based on another funny study on stereotypes...you know...since romance was part of the comics since forever? It shouldn't be focused on drama and romance - just as much as it shouldn't be all focused purely on action. These things need balance because they go hand in hand with good storytelling.
One without the other is just fifty pages of character-less punchmachines beating the crap out of each other or a boring one-dimensional telenovela. Balance is where it's at, young padawans.
You shouldn't cite speculation in your videos. It's perfectly fine to show a study that shows a correlation, but don't read out assumptions even if written by researchers. There's absolutely no way of telling just from correlation what the causal relationship involved is, and taking a hard-line "nature" stance in the "nature vs nurture" question based on so little is questionable at best. Worse yet, some of your viewers may become convinced that this is true, even though it's stated that it's speculation. As a content creator you should watch out for these kinds of things, since they hurt the objectivity and credibility of your videos, and might be misleading.
They can be for anyone despite having males as the target audience, when an individual takes the various storylines that female readers have enjoyed in the past 2 decades.
As a huge X-men fan from the 80s and 90s. Rogue, & Shadow Cat were among my all time favorites. But they were much better written back then. To this day I believe that the best version of carol Danvers was Rogue after she absorbed her powers and life force.
Good points here.
My two favorite comics are The Unbelievable Gwenpool and Loki Agent of Asgard, and both are absolutely amazing, in my opinion, because both have flawed, human characters.
As someone who loves action, I find the idea of action without drama appalling. Drama makes those action scenes more intense. The drama helps to enhance a character, and give them more depth. That depth boosts the emotions of the action scenes. That drama enhances action if done properly. And if done properly, romance can bloom from that drama. It doesn't have to, but as a core, romance and drama can very much be tools to enhance action. Just like how action can boost drama, and even romance if done right. How can the action have meaning without some drama to it? Part of developing a character is delving into their love, whether it be for another person, animal, or idea or object. A good action story needs to have some drama to boost the investment of that action. Romance can further enhance it, especially in giving motive and determination for our hero, or the villain, to fight for what they believe in.
when I was a kid I used to sneak into my brother's room and read his comics. Spiderman, Dr. Strange, X-Men, ... because they had good stories. didn't bother me that they were aimed at boys. the comics aimed at girls were fluffy and boring, IMO. when a female character started getting on my nerves for being written fluffy and ditzy, my imagination took off and I wrote my own stories with a slightly different tomboyish shift. what if she didn't stand there and shriek? what if she put up a fight? or what if she actually liked her science class with the frogs and mice and creepy crawlies? some of us did/do. anyway, thanks LD for posting interesting vids.
I recently read Spider-Man vs Wolverine. A fairly heavy focus on drama and a touch of romance. However, there was action throughout (both on and off panel) and ended in a climactic fight between the two titular characters. It was good and I think fits your description of how a comic can infuse drama into an action based story.
This is what people have to understand about averages. Relatively small deviations between averages produces massive differences in the extremes. So, if males prefer action 70/30 or even 60/40 ratio, that means the people who are *most drawn* to action are overwhelmingly male. Same goes for romance. (in favor of women)
Correct. I learned this from Jordan Peterson.
@@StudM01 Me too
Pareto distribution.
Came looking for this, was not dissapointed
I am a gal who is not really a tomboy at all, but has always preferred stuff aimed at boys. He-Man, Gargoyles, Ghostbusters TAS, TMNT, Voltron, Robotech, X-Men, Batman, Devilman, Jojo's Bizarre Adventures, Cherry 2000, The Story of Ricky (1991), Married With Children, Star Trek, Nightmare on Elm Street, Braindead (1992), NCIS, Blacklist. The cutscenes from Mortal Kombat 2011 were the best movie I saw that year. Romantic dramas are sickening & their tropes bingo is too transparent & by the numbers.
Dude.... I wanted to get mad at you, but your analysis of the situation is SPOT ON!!! I agree with you, 1,000%
I'm sure I heard of a study where they tested the effects of testosterone on people and only people who were TOLD they'd been given it acted aggressive and competitive - those who'd been given it but were told it wasn't testosterone actually acted nicer. So you can't really blame a preference for action tropes in men on their hormones.
They should definitely start injecting more action into those romance novels that I see all over the bookstore. That would be interesting.
I always thought it was very telling only things that appeal to men are trying to be destroyed from within.
Do not confuse drama with melodrama. Drama is a universal genre. If you try to recall examples of genius comics, they are almost always either drama or contain a significant element of it.
I think tropes are more associated to gender because of culture, the study at 3:20 came to its own conclusions but my conclusion is nurture over nature. Dads tell their sons to be manly and moms tell their daughters to play with dolls.
These kinds of stereotypes show up in newly born babies, even tho nurture has a paper in it, there is a biological drive to these kind of behavior
@@joaoalberto9531 sorry, what i said was a bit spineless. what i meant to say was that stereotypes are curated, and if you think genetics has anything to do with it, you're a nazi
Why does everybody think nowadays that you need to identify with the main character.
Hell, i don't want to identify with a main character of a story, i want a good story in a world that isn't linke mine, about a well written character that is not like me.
i live as myself in my world everyday.
i want to read/watch/play something that is different, i want to read about characters that chose path i have not, i want to play characters that i can not be i want to see a world i can't see in my real life.
Now explain to me why a large number of grown men are obsessed with My Little Pony.
Oh a study identified the taste preferences of a tiny group of people from one specific location and culture, so IT HAS TO BE FACT ACROSS ALL OF SPACE AND TIME (because it validates my biases)
This video makes you sound more like somebody who would go to any length to fight off SJWs than one who's actually a fan of superhero comics.
Only slightly..
The two demographics are more or less the same
He intentionally is against SJWs. They ruin things. They search for an end-all-be-all to whatever problem they have, and will try to give solutions, but even if the solution is implemented, they're still not happy.
@@paulgreen3030 Look, I haven't watched the video in 2 months, so for the following reply, I will direct my complaints against the kind of people I described in the previous comment and not the UA-camr.
And, for the record, I agree most SJW writers are shit at their jobs. So, this is mainly devil's advocate.
If you're not a fan of superhero comics, you don't get a say in what's ruining them. You don't say they're good, nor if they are bad, nor explain that sentiment. You won't know if you don't read them.
And, if you don't read them, then you shouldn't make a video telling people to blame your own enemies for ruining something you don't care about.
Just because they're co-opting comics to spread a political message doesn't give you the right to do so.
@@paulgreen3030 And, after watching a minute and a half of the video, he already starts with the premise that Superhero comics usually don't have Drama and that drama doesn't attract men.
As if these comics were mindless action and the whole point of the video has nothing to do with actual opinions about comic books
To be honet I found the ANTISJW the same that the SJW, they are like two faces of the same coin.
I only discovered this channel recently... maybe a week ago... but, damn, these are some great videos.
Japanese comic industry: We created over 9000 genres and sub-genres to please anyone of any age. Feel free to try it out yourself, gaijin.
American comic industry: No, no. If we take our 3,5 popular superhero titles and add a few Mary Sues, it might actually work...
Ugh, the "romance is for chicks" trope. I don't know many other women who prefer romance heavy stuff unless they are single, younger than 16 and expected by friends/family to be boy crazy, or going through a divorce/break-up. Most everyone worth their salt prefers well written characters, plots that make sense, relateable scenarios with the element of drama, and villains that are both threatening and a shade away from what we already are... that includes women.
The Fairly OddParent's genderswap episode had it right. Timmantha: Do girls like comics? Buff dudes in spandex fighting evil? OF COURSE!!!
Women aren't as put off by the action genre as some people think...
Because there are men who go and watch action movies.
@midgetydeath I'd say hot villains are even better
I grew up on Marvel comics ("super heroes with super problems") and fell in love with Chris Claremont's psychological stories like the Phoenix Saga. That seems pretty main stream, though not exclusively good guy punches bad guy...
My interests must lean a little more yang than many other women, because I really enjoy comics where male characters beat the hell out of each other. I like the old style hero comics, I also read a lot of Archies. What's important in the stories is the dynamic clash of equal but opposite forces/beliefs. What's satisfying about a good story is when those opposites discover the grey areas in themselves that they might never have noticed if there was no conflict. Male hero's are important for men because they can project themselves into the role, and sort out those grey areas. Male heros are also important for women because we can project our Animus, or hero archetype into the character, and develop our inner strength. Watering down or neutering our heros doesn't help anyone.
It's videos like this that make me realize that a lot of people don't really take time to just listen to each other.
Because while as I most definitely want more stories with black characters and them because I feel as though they are under represented. At the core of anything I want the stories to be well written and well made.
And it's very clear that I don't "Need" stories to include someone to look like me based on a the media I consume that don't have characters that look or have backgrounds similar to me at all.
Maybe the best thing for everyone would be to make a new imprint with that in mind and then actually getting writers that have more talent.
A perfect blend of drama, action and romance that is also a comic (kinda). Scott Pilgrim
I'm a mostly female identifying person and I don't like romance stories. I only like it if its as a sideplot that you could take out and still have a good story without it. And I'm not the only one who feels that way. So perhaps superhero comics aren't for men as much as they are for people who like superhero comics and action etc, regardless of their gender.
Superhero comics are for everyone. The end. 'nuff said.
They are "for" everyone in the sense the publishers hope everyone will buy them. But they are not "made" for everyone because they are founded on story traits that have very long been known to appeal to some people more than others. Anyone working in marketing understands this entirely.
drama and romance if done right can appeal to both audiences.
Not done right but done in a particular way or style.
2:39 No, girls like action too and there are boys who like romance too
Also true.
Tbh I'm more into the comics for the artwork given that I am an artist who wants to get into the comic industry eventually. But I have to say, the other women I know that are into the comics are in it for the storyline, not just the action or romance or whatever else. A comic isn't worth very much if it doesn't do what it's supposed to and that's to tell a story.
I'm a guy and I'm very unimpressed by the superhero genre in general, generally because these stories very predictable, very reliant on tropes, this "pure good vs pure evil" kinda thing has been done to hell and back, doesn't take many risks when it comes to thw writing (ie. characters who die come back to life, stakes are artificially inflated because we know nothing really bad will ever happen to the protagonist, etc) Idk, I think your video should've been titled "Superhero comics are for BOYS" because media for children tends to be pretty straightforward, as these comics tend to be. I appreciate stories with depth, and really GOOD stories are able to incorporate elements of romance, action, etc seamlessly. Good stories are universal, doesn't matter if you're a guy, girl or whatever, a GOOD story is human and resonates regardless of gender.
There are comics with morally questionable heroes, maybe you aren't looking in the right places
I love all the Batman clasics like Long Halloween, Batman Returns, Hush and so on and so on but now when you are mentioning it... the action part is actually really something that interests me the least and my favourite parts are the drama, mystery or character conflits... I never realized that till now.
This reminds me of an interesting thing my drama teacher told me in High School (a whole 22 years ago) -- He told us that the reason for the boon in cartoons for boys in the mid-late 1980's and beyond wasn't because of sexism as many thought, but instead because they found that shows aimed at boys will be watched by both boys and girls, whereas shows aimed at girls will only be watched by girls. In a sense, having almost all shows aimed at boys was, essentially, a method of obtaining the largest possible audience.
This is true of books and movies as well. In the vast ocean of books, only two books with female protagonists have ever been popular with boys, The Wizard of Oz and Alice in Wonderland, both adventure stories of a sort. Meanwhile, a thousand books with male protagonists have been popular with boys and girls. Harriet Potter wouldn't have sold.
Finally someone has the courage to state the facts.
I'm a man, and I actually really like romance and drama (if It's a good story, of course)
Im just asking for a good story, regardless of genre. Im girl and i usually prefer action movies, but if it written badly and i have to turn my brain off, i wont like it
I kinda had an idea for my own story. I just dont know how to go about it. I have the ideas saved. I love what you have to say cause it helps inspire me to be more creative in what I want to talk about. So thank you on that part, Literature Devil.
I'm a guy, and I have never really being interested in comics. I almost never watch movies, even when given the chance to for free, and I prefer deep meaningful stories, that have relatable characters who change over the course of the story, and a world that feels interesting and real.
While those are all the essentials of "Good stories", I still prefer those stories even without the player involved actions.
Persona 4 for example, limits the "Action" to an alternate plain of reality, which is mainly there to explore a character's flaws and inner self better. The action itself is cool, but it's *not what remains in my mind after putting the game down*
The idea that certain genders are pre-built to like certain things, and not others, bothers me a lot. It makes me feel like we don't have free will, and a unique sense of self. My sisters love action a lot, and watch movies related to it. They also love playing games full of action with no romance or plot.
I argue it's our culture which makes us *think* this is normal for everyone. You raise someone to believe girls should love romance and take interest in certain stuff, and they will likely take interest in that stuff. That isn't *true* gender based evidence, just evidence we are being *conditioned to think and have these likes and dislikes*
Ah yes, the obvious but apparently not obvious solution. Make something worth fricking reading. It's amazing how many stories fall flat and how many things do bad and people question why that is when many people say things like "the story was weak" or "the story was inconsistent"
Wouldn't make more sense to just tell a good story and not really care about who's reading it.
One of the most important rules for writing is to know your audience. A good story for the romance loving crowd is not necessarily a good story for the action-loving crowd.
HOW ABOUT we just all agree good writing MAKES GOOD WRITING? I’m fucking tired of people saying stuff like “Political correctness is ruining art”. Yes, tokenism is the bane of writing. No, I refuse to call it forced diversity because tokenism is what it is. Representation can only be positive, people who see themselves represented are happy and everyone else is unaffected. The issue arises with tokenism, when a character is inserted solely to be a character of a minority. Kamala Khan is good character is because she’s a character that happens to be a Muslim girl. Riri Williams is a bad character because the writers stopped her characterization after ‘black girl’.
"It's said that comic books are for geeks. But they're not, they're for everybody."
- Atop the Fourth Wall
I feel that the new spider man game kind of brought the genre back to its roots i genuinely felt like i was reading an old comic drama was in there romance but action was the main dining force
Your video speaks so many honest volume, preach.
So. I agree that action is what the target audience for Superhero comics wants. I do feel like I need to point out that there *are* some women who like Action (I am one of them!), though they are a minority. So Superhero comics are not *just* for men-they are for people who like action, which means *predominantly* (but not exclusively) men. I realize you do say this in the video, so why am I pointing it out again in the comments? Mostly for the sake of other commentators who might not have listened closely.
I haven't seen this assessment of the data before. Ty for that :)
As a male I prefer drama centered movies rather than action. I much prefer Logan to all the Wolverine films.
Sam Z I actually liked the Logan movie, but I don’t like it because of it having drama in its story, but I like it because of the fact that Logan is written like an ordinary human being doing ordinary things, and I also like how the setting takes place in current date Canada/the United States.
Superhero comics are fun! I can see why they're for men, but it's nice that I can enjoy them, too, despite being a woman. I think they're good as-is and get most of my enjoyment out of them when they're seriously dude-centered. We should be able to have nice things without everyone getting their panties in a bunch over it.
The Long Halloween is my favorite comic book so far (I just started getting into reading comic books a couple months ago) and it does a good job appealing to both men and women. There’s a bit of action, a bit of drama, but a lot of mystery which I think both men and women both really like.
I must be an anomaly since I prefer action films and comics, despite me being female. o_o Hell, the first comics I collected were Marvel's X-Men, Dark Horse's Alien and Predator series, and the original Tales from the Crypt comics. I was also into He-Man and She-Ra (which, funny enough, the latter was created when it was discovered that 20% of He-Man's audience were female). The 80s were a fun crazy time. XD Older now, I admittedly prefer action with drama since it's that drama aspect that gives me a reason to care if a character dies/succeeds or not. I mean, I still enjoy popping in Commando, Time Cop, and Best of the Best for the cheese and seeing ass get kicked, but these days I'm getting more bang out of my buck outta shows like Cobra Kai and Game of Thrones - character-driven action plots.
That's interesting. I'm male, and I've always liked romance as the driving element, with the action just being for flavour. Unfortunatly, the large majority of romance plots in media is underdeveloped and makes me gag ("we just met five minutes ago, I am now willing to throw away my life for you").
If I may ask, as a female fan of action of action and fighting, do you prefer your female leads to have their femininity on full display (stereotypical bikini armour, etc.) as is commonly portrayed, or a more utilitarian, unisex approach like Brienne of Tarth from GoT or Stormtroopers from Star Wars? I hope to one day write stories, and it would be useful to know how women like their action avatars.
@RadiuZero. I have the same. I liked old Supermen and Batman cartoons, love horror movies, thrillers.
Like good food, it can appeal to everyone
Yes you are an anamoly. Anamolies don't make the rules.
9:36 he says right at this moment that yes you exist. Now that you got acknowledged, can you stop being butthurt?
As other people have said in this section, if we are to consider manga a type of comics, which they are considering they're just comics from Japan, comics can have plenty of drama and action. Take for example Jojo's Bizarre Adventure: Steel Ball Run, by Hirohiko Araki. It is driven by the action from the battles in the story arc, yet it's main cast grows and develops with each other as it goes, adding drama and growing comradery (instead of a romance.)
Well, here I am, two years later and say: Hey, this is kinda incorrect. I mean the ideea that Drama and Romance is not for superhero stories.
Why? Well, Stan 'THE MAN" Lee himself said this. He said that what should make a superhero great is how he struggles with his weaknesses. Or his reasons to do what he does. Bascially, his 'drama'. And, frankly, I believe this is really a great thing for superhero comics. Why? Because YOU WANT THE HERO TO WIN. When you know he serves that punch for redemption or to protect someone, you wish that punch to hit as hard as possible. What would be the point of a guy punching another guy for fun? I could give an example from the TV series Avatar: The Last Airbender, Book 2, Chaper: Zuko alone. When he's facing the Earth Kingdom soldiers. Even after watching the end of season 2 countless times, even after knowing of his betrayal and how he's nowhere near redemption and that he's essentially a villain in this chapter as well, I WANT HIM TO WIN. Same could be said a few episodes into season 1, when Zuko faces Admiral Zao: I WANT HIM TO WIN. Despite being a villain, in the context, he's the one having the better and more relatable reasons, so, for every blow he delivers, we are happy for them.
I remember watching some old cartoons, Popeye the Sailor Man, black and white era, or Early Superman cartoons when the most thrilling thing was Superman throwing away some bank robbers. That works well for extremely young audiences (10 year olds, perhaps a bit older in that 1940's when those cartoons were made), but for teens, young adults and later? Not really. You get a pretty big deja-vu really soon. And here I paraphrase Stan Lee: 'Superman was such a big character that they needed to introduce kryptonite and Lex Luthor', so, to break the 'deja-vu', you needed to give him drama. And that's not the only case. What are the weaknesses of DC Superheroes? The Martian has fire, GreenLantern yellow light and lack of personal control, Krpytonians have kryptonite and so on. They need that 'drama' to seem like they outmatch something and are not completely overpowered individuals. What are the weaknesses of Marvel superheroes? Can anyone point them out? And yet Marvel's heroes are as well known as DC ones. Why? Because they don't need a special gimmick to add drama to the punches, because their characters are built with drama. X-Men are built with them being rejected by society and hating their powers. This splits them in those allied with Magneto and embrace their powers and those that choose to tame their powers and embrace society. Captain America is a regular guy who was given superpowers to use them for his country. Iron Man is a playboy that tries to keep personal things together.
@@oldcat1790 Well, the ideea is different. What I meant is that, for one part, I do not view commercial success as quality approval. Then, Regarding to 'personal stories', we are still talking about action and fights. What I meant is that simply fighting without a plot gets boring quickly. Just think of every Batman vs Superman fight since, Idk, let's say The Dark Knight. Superman obliterates Batman until Batman pulls out cryptonite. How much could you repeat this? How much could you inovate to keep your sales up? Of course fighting is a centerpiece of action-superhero comics, but it should be more of a climax, rather than 100% plot. Meanwhile, if you take away the fighting, you go into a whole new genre and 'personal problems' don't serve as a build-up for the fighting, so they need to be developed much more. At this point, don't even have a comic, but write a book or a short novel.
I just figured out why these videos are so intriguing. This channel is the DarkMatter2525 or TheraminTrees of pop literature 🤯 Subbed
Well I don't know about that. I have an idea for a superhero story centered around a Hispanic female amputee...it's more fun than it sounds.
There's no reason diversity can't be interesting, as long as it's well written.
Juan Manuel Penaloza Comic book readers don’t really care about the person’s sexuality, race, gender, religion, etc etc, and all we care about if the character is written well and if the characters are relatable.
Even something primarily targeting men or women cannot ignore women or men respectively. A story can be enriched by other viewpoints and story elements, but that's very different from compromising genre and story-telling to coerce a political agenda into a medium.
This video very neatly spells out something that used to be obvious to everyone.
Yes, "used" to be... These days everything is affected by politics, memes and Social Justice...
Back when common sense actually seemed common
Well, that "loud-minority-which-will-not-be-named" ruined that
Years ago a comic shop I go to had a ladies night to attract more female readers. The guy who owned the shop put out a bunch of female centered superhero comics like Wonder Woman, Batwoman, Batgirl, Ms. Marvel, etc but he found most women didn't care for the superhero genre and were more interested in image comic books. He said comics like the walking dead and many other image horror books were way more popular with women. Once saga came out I heard that had a very high female readership which makes sense.
Or it just assumes women don't want to get in on the comic action.
And is another reasons why there's a modern feminist movement that people like you and this UA-camr
constantly Mansplain as a bad thing.
@@generalhorse493 Are you for real or is this a troll? I honestly can't tell anymore.
why do women get triggered when someone says "x, y,z is for men"
i dont know a single guy who would bother with "make up, romantic novels and dresses are for women". In fact, most women would openly say that some stuff are for women only and try to change legislation to suit them. In my country we have cars on the subway just for women (at specific times) and every women feels entitled to it, Not one women has suggested that this might be discrimination against men. When its a women only space, women fight for it and feel happy to exclude men.
When its a men's thing? They feel entitled to ENTER that space and even change it when they can.
it is almost as if women have no personality of their own and have to insert themselves into whatever men are doing, to get attention and feel validated....
Not sure I agree with her, but Florence King said, "Women don't get anything until it's not worth having anymore." Example: Only countries that don't really matter have had female prime ministers/presidents. The biggies, the US, Russia, China, have not.
Comic books ARE for EVERYONE, not just men. There are a lot of women out there that like comic book superheroes. It's not as black and white as it's portrayed. It would be nice if it were neither portrayed nor thought of as so.
Again, the vid says SUPERHERO comics, not just comics. Funny how so many respondents ignore essential adjectives.
@@spaceknight793 Reread my comment and FACT.
Did you actually watch the video?
You forgot Star Trek. Star Trek is mainly drama, though it’s a male perspective. How do we solve this problem without unnecessary death or duress upon our crew? How do we protect the enterprise? How do we accomplish our mission? How do we handle this challenge of our morality, etc.
As a woman who enjoys comics, I completely agree with you. The SJWs who invaded the comics industry claiming that they’re “fixing it” have barged in uninvited. Women who like comics liked them the way they were: full of action and fistfights and interesting, forboding villains who were brought down by valiant heroes in suspenseful battles. Making the comics industry boring and uninspired by removing the element that makes it so great (i.e.: ACTION???) isn’t going to bring in new female comic book fans. It’s going to push them away. I hate what SJWs have done to my favorite heroes and I want nothing more than to see Marvel and DC go back to pumping out quality action-packed content like they did BEFORE the industry was infested with SJWs who spoke on the behalf of women like me who were never complaining about the state of comics in the first place.
Power, battle...
The sweet sirens of sorrow sing songs so simple, yet so silken that spider's are disgraced.
Death dances and drives men mad to its macabre horrors, that delightful, devil's dance.
What more can a man ask for? What need have I for right and wrong, for the worries of tomorrow and yesterday, when the moment presses between life and death? Oh, the joy!
Comic books have been brightly colored soap operas for decades but okay sure man
Okay. Let's talk about why creators of fantasy and fiction keep missing the boat when they try to cater to the gender (or other stereotype) of their "target audience".
People who like fantasy and sci-fi are per definition *imaginitive*. It's at the core of our being. Imagination per definition needs a certain amount of flexibility. Thinking outside the box is a core component of who we are. It's much more than "what we like", it's an essential part of us.
As a Transformers and Doctor Who fan, I found Elita-1 annoying even as a kid in the 80s.
For those who don't know:
Elita-1 is basically a pink female robot counterpart to Optimus Prime, introduced later to try to get "girls" to watch by giving them a character to "identify" with.
I am very much not the only (male and female) fan who quickly fell *away* from the cartoon after this instead of being drawn in more.
It should have been a no-brainer. I think that the most imaginitive people tend to be less stereotypical *because* they are highly imaginitive. It is part of what makes people like me tick. Throwing stereotype at people like me only makes us feel less welcome, not more.
I don't care if the Doctor in Doctor Who is male or female. I expect the Doctor to take on murderous traffic cones armed with a screw driver and sarcasm.
The show isn't doing poorly right now because people don't like the Doctor to be a woman (though some probably do have an issue, *most* of us die-hard fans really don't).
We would like a decent script! Your show/story/whatever format stands and falls with your ability to play with our minds. Tickle our imaginations and we *will* come back for more. It is just that simple.
We come back to watch Megatron show up with a Purple Griffin (please do Google it, it's an amazing bit of non-sense!!) and a remote control copy of Optimus Prime (fans like me still *love* that episode and work it into stories of our own because it is *fun* and you barely touched what Megatron could have done in that episode.. we'll forgive that the Autobots couldn't tell the difference between Megatron and Optimus because oh wow it was FUN!)
..because we want a smart antagonist giving our hero hell to overcome.
Why?
Because none of us are heroes. We are just average people up against things in life we aren't sure we can manage but we are willing to give it our best shot anyway. We're dreamers at heart. When faced with the choice we will likely do what we believe to be right over what is socially acceptable. We dare to dream that we can make things *better* with nothing but what life hands us and our wits, and we are willing to go that extra mile *because* we have a highly active inner world, where our minds alone are the limits of what we can accomplish. We don't actually give up easily, even when out numbered, out maneuvered, and out-muscled.
That is what it means to be imaginitive in a nutshell.
Don't alienate us because we're outside the norm. We already know we're basically freaks, but we're the freaks that watch your shows, buy both paper and Kindle formats of your stories, and probably write fiction of our own, draw things, etc. It's part of who we are.
Most people won't ever get what we see in your work when life is tough enough not to spend time, energy, and hard earned cash on fairy tales. Those folks are never *going* to get it, just as we are never *not* going to get it.
Basically.. we're your audience.
Hi there.