I like that you don’t get any “good” dialogue options for Dora, because Harry is just incapable of thinking of any. There’s no right thing to say in this situation, because it was the wrong thing to do. You’ve talked about reintegration of old memories and personality traits before. This game is very deliberately open-ended about a lot of things, but one thing that’s repeatedly driven home is that Harry is not capable of reintegrating Dora in a healthy way. Full-stop. There is simply too much trauma there. Even after erasing his memory completely, the neural pathways are too well-traveled. The feelings are so deeply ingrained that the thoughts they inspire are second nature to Harry. The explicitly and only healthy way to deal with her is to go out of your way to not remember her at all. I’d love to hear your take on the game’s stance, the next time she comes up.
I like that the curiosity of the player to learn more about Harry's past is making them do things that are bad for Harry. It makes it hard for the player to actually help him get over it because it feels like you would miss something.
@@DudokX The curiosity of the player is a thing that permeates the whole game really. The whole game has a general vibe of "oh you really have to open all doors and get into every buliding and know everything about everyone now do you?". It frequently makes fun of it while also understanding where it comes from and why it's not necessarily bad
I think the way the game handles dialogue is you don't necessarily get to fully control what Harry thinks or says. You can steer him in a certain direction, but all his thoughts are ultimately his own. In some cases, like the conversation over the payphone, there are no good or constructive options because Harry can't think of any. And when an option to say something pops up, even if you don't select it, chances are that thought still crossed his mind. Just because you haven't said to Dora "I want to die", doesn't mean it's not in the back of his head.
I disagree. If you do everything "right", the end of the game is kind of hopeful. Harry did face at least some of his demons and is ready to continue life and continue healing. I think he can and eventually will deal with the Dora stuff in a healthy way, it just doesn't happen within the duration of the game. It's gonna take years but at least now he is ready to work his way through it. At least that's my interpretation based on my playthrough. (And a little bit based on my life).
@@spectral_force5097 That's a great writing choice, too, considering Disco Elysium is more about learning about who this character is (and, in true RPG fashion, who you are) than it is about finding the killer
This part of the game is a bit of a wake-up call, a reminder that as much as you can shape who you think Harry is by your decisions and dialogue, you aren't playing a self-insert in this world. You're playing as Harry, and when he's at his worst like he is in this moment, you have no choice but to bear witness to a man burning himself alive. You will be able to help him. But not here. Not right now.
I love "why can't I just be an earnest person." That's how you know it's an accurate portrayal of mental illness! Sometimes you desperately want to say or think something better and you just *can't*
Honestly, I haven't been looking forward to this like a lot of other comments. It feels like there is a bit of a disconnect with what a lot of the audience wants to see and how Brady wants to approach things. I definitely came because for Disco Elysium but find myself staying for explanations on therapy and people, things I haven't been exposed to in this way before. Being in therapy myself, it's really helped me with some concepts. Some people's focus seems to be more on the validation of having an experience that impacted them recognized by an expert. Trying to make sure that Brady 'gets it' and such. It seems like a bit of a waste to me. There is a lot more pure reaction content out there It's a great game that taken a permanent stay in my mind. I hope to see it challenged, criticised and used as a jumping off point.
Something I love about the wording of this scene is how CLEARLY Dora is reading the things you say as different from what the player or even maybe Harry means. Telling her you’ve got a case to solve and it’s distressing? Telling her you’re gonna solve it, no matter what? She sighs? Some things you can’t solve, some things you just have to let go. Dora just wants you to let go of her, she’s done trying to fix it. She already tried that. You’re not talking about your case, you’re talking about your relationship. Beautiful. I love how heartrending this scene is. Because even if you go in with the intent to say something constructive, Harry gets drowned by the emotional wave and volition can’t reach him anymore. All he can say are mundane or terrible things because he’s overwhelmed. I adore it. You feel so frustrated you call again, and it just does you more damage. UGH I love this game.
I think the phone call illustrates why the "Sorry Cop" mentality and the accompanying "Rigorous Self-Critique" thought are not healthy coping mechanisms after all. Sometimes, seeking to apologize is more about soothing oneself or self-flagellating than actually trying to address the harm that was caused. The kinder thing to do in this instance is to leave Dora be, but Harry isn't self-aware enough at this point to realize that.
5 years ago this scene devastated me, i felt just like harry and barely managed to hold it together. We were hunched over and shaking with a feeling in our chest like all the air had been sucked out of the room. Harry feels he needs some closure but for Dora it's been closed for years already, they've spoken about it at length already, he's called that number many times before already. Your choices are limited because there's literally nothing left to say, it's all been played out hundreds of times in hundreds of ways. He's hoping if he can just find some correct order of words everything will be fixed and he can go back to how things were, maybe he can figure out what he did wrong and make it right. You can't say anything right because the right thing to say doesn't exist no matter how desperately you want it to. The empty chair thing would probably be good for Harry, I'm sure it would have been good for me.
I'm amazed even a professional therapist fell for this illusion. There is no "right" way to handle this conversation, it's doomed and desperate from the get-go. There is no closure but one that Harry makes for himself.
@@ImVeryOriginal It really is amazing that Disco can be such a bleak story in so many ways only to accentuate itself with these gleaming moments of hope and beauty. You are a broken husk of a man, but it's okay. You can always put yourself back together. You can build something new out of the wreckage.
Quick Tip: fast traveling has to be done in specific spots on the map, such as right outside the church, in the fishing village center area, and right outside the Whirling. Also, loved your talking about gestalt therapy, I've been facilitated in empty chair work a couple of times and each time was really transformative and interesting. Good episode!
If you don't know that lady has a missing husband and choose "Who is this man?", Inland Empire says "This is an omen - a sign from above: Don't start drinking again" and Harry has an option to reflect that this could have been him
Disco Elysium is the only video game that's ever gotten me sincerely weepy and teary-eyed, and this payphone scene is one of two parts that does it. It's _horrifically_ real I've been on both sides of the desperate, pleading, I-promise-I-can-change phone call, with someone who never wants to see you again, and whom you know can't be convinced, but you keep telling yourself "maybe there's some perfect combination of words that will make her forgive me and not hate me and not be uncomfortable around me anymore"
After time, I've started to prefer the latter. Having to be the Dora on that phone call is harder and harder. I feel like as I get older, I understand the permanence of broken things and can accept endings more than the dying gasps of something that should not be.
If you have the tie on when you fail the check, it says this “Let’s move on, bratan. We’ve had all the fun there was to have here, and it wasn’t much.”
I feel like he has enough self-awareness to at least infer based on how we feel about the ledger, Acele's comments about pain related to a woman, dozens of Inland Empire warnings that graze the subject, and other details. I know he doesn't remember everything, but I'm surprised the game acts like we are completely unaware either.
Mmmm! Actually the game leaves room for you to question whether he has legitimate amnesia from drinking, from the small (SPOILER GUARD) or if he’s just trying to deny deny deny. Which I like, personally.
@@eurobrady i feel like harry's thoughts always want him to forget his ex and the pain that comes with her, they keeps denying that she exists to protect him from her. maybe it becomes a bit clearer in future dreams but idk
@@eurobradyI mean the man woke up not remembering: the year, his name, his age, the country he’s in, the concept of money, THE PALE, his face, or that of his mother’s, and the scent of his childhood. Harry did irrevocable damage to himself, and there are a lot of interesting theories around it which I shall not say cauuuuse that’d be a spoiler….
I have finally caught up with the most recent video in this playthrough, so I guess this warrants a comment. All I want to say, is that this has been extremely eye opening for me. Brady, you are an excellent therapist and educator. I've learned so much about therapy and myself by going on this journey with you. You're also a hilarious role playing gamer, too. And a wonderful, warm and empathic person. As far as the phone call goes - you've analysed Harry so thoroughly in this playthrough, I think you are way ahead of him in many realizations. I think Harry is still unsure what his pas was and whether there even was an ex- whatever in his life. All he knows is that he feels a sort of resentment towards women and that when he tries to explore that, it hurts. Then he randomly calls a number and a woman answers and he just doesn't recognize her. All he has is a bundle of emotions - longing, resentment, desire, anger... and he doesn't even know it is in any way connected to this particular woman. But she does know his name... That's why there are all these confusing dialogue options available and no concrete apology. At least that's how I interpret "The Phone Call" in the game. Also, there's some cool extra details in the phone call, if your Harry has some other skills developed (i.e. perception). Unfortunately they didn't chime in this time, though.
(In his hypothetical) "As they're saying nothing is wrong, they're tapping their foot" (me irl) *realizes I'm stress tapping my foot and stops* (Back in the hypothetical) "And the moment you point that out they'll immediately stop" (Me irl) "FUCK YOU BRADY YOU DON'T KNOW MY LIFE, YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT I'VE *SEEN*" "Oh... maybe I should bring this up to my therapist"
It is kinda canon that Harry doesnt remember her, at least not entirely. Now, he can regain some of his memories. The White Mourning and the Apricot Chewing Gum Scented One thoughts are probably the most you can get in information about her and it is still very vague.
Strangely, I was composed during the phone call when I first played, but I bawled my damn eyes out at the man on the boardwalk. I knew who he was as soon as I saw his 'name'. Senseless tragedy always kills me.
The reason it only gave you the option to give the moralist response, is because politics is, and was, Harry’s way of coping with his feelings of inadequacy, in regards to his relationship
In order to fast-travel you have to be just outside the Church or just outside the Whirling-In-Rags (possibly the fishing village too but I'm not 100% sure on remembering that).
On the fast travel confusion I don’t think I’ve ever used fast travel playing this game. So I don’t have any hints on that 😕 Also the reason Alice assigns the case to Kim is because Alice is precinct 57, so she knows Kim and probably can only assign the case to him because they’re both in the same precinct. I will add one more thing. I’m really looking forward to the resolution to the working class case. So much to unpack there and I’m glad it wasn’t approached when there wasn’t enough time. Obviously we’re going to be seeing grief but from Harry’s perspective he’s having to be empathetic and understanding, it’s a big responsibility to big that kind of news to a person and has to be handled with care. I know there’s gonna be a lot to talk about when we get there.
Guys, I know we've all been waiting for this episode, but let's not forget that the gameplay has been going on for more than six months now, and It's only natural that we'll forget some things☝️ That said... That damned payphone. It still hurts.
I like your point on expecting the call to be more hostile cause i think thats what harry wants as well. I think if she told him to fuck off and hung up he could be even a little secure theres no point ever trying again. But cause she doesnt really hate him that way he can never let it go
Often the PC in a game is a blank slate with a bunch of generic options. Harry is almost like an npc in his own right - the choices you get in dialogue reflect that you are exerting (limited) control over a pre-existing character.
Sometimes, you can't apologize for things you've done. Its not worth it to insert yourself in someones life again like Harry is trying to do to Dora. Let it go, you're scaring her.
So even knowing well what's about to happen, when she was about to answer my hands were literally sweating and I got so tense. I think that's due to the brilliant writing, they just do it so well that you basically can feel the emotions yourself. And probably like you've said that's the reason why these options were so limited. By the way I'm so grateful for this series, because a couple of months ago I was in a pretty dark place myself, and when I saw your videos I've reconsidered therapy, and I'm now in a process of recovery. Keep up the great work and take all the time that you want to explore the psychology topics cause they're fascinating to learn.
I love this episode so much, the feeling of thinking you're tough enough now to deal with your past trauma, then getting to it and NOT DEALING WELL... its all so gooood, it's like the roleplay is going so perfectly with the game it's crazyyyy! also LETS GOOOO CHURCH TIME
This seems like a good place to comment something I've been thinking about a lot. My interpretation of the options you're given in DE is that they're all true to Harry, they're all things that he would do or would say, and you're choosing elements of him to emphasize or develop. Just like how we all have multiple dimensions to us, so does Harry, but you're limited to the handful of possible words or actions that he might do or say in a given situation. Some people who are frustrated and want it to be more blank slate or more open-ended don't understand this- You're playing a man with a personality and a past. You have some choice what part of him to develop, but you can't go outside of who he is. This phone conversation shows how true this is. Brady is so eager to apologize, heal, say something mature and emotionally intelligent here, but that's just not something Harry is capable of doing here in any regard.
Do we have reason to believe Harry has something to apologize for? When I first encountered the phone conversation my initial takeaway was that it ruled out some terrible or traumatic possibilities. Reading the letter from the ledger you might think this person has since deceased, or Harry did something horrific to her. Perhaps while drunk. But the phone call carries no implication of something so ugly happening between them, no indication she thinks there's unresolved issues that needs to be talked out. She doesn't want anything from him. Nor does it sound like she hates him. It's more like, she feels sad for him but wants to keep her distance Maybe the relationship ended for mundane reasons. Like middle-schoolers who have a boyfriend/girlfriend for a month and they move on without some traumatic cause for the breakup. Maybe Harry was just a phase for her. Or she realized she wanted something else in her relationship or career. But there's a severe asymmetry. She meant a lot more to him than he did to her, apparently. If that were the case, the phone call was a lost cause from the start. There was nothing productive that could come from it. Volition wasn't urging us to get something off our chest, finally. It was urging us to just stop Edit: it occurs to me Dora being an *ex-wife* complicates this interpretation. Hmm
A comment for the algorythm gods - this series deserves more attention than it gets! Also... Calling... Calling... Calling in the night... Still callling...
The phone call in the union office hit me so much harder then this one, but I'm weird. There are so many unexpected emotional moments that just pop up like this. I love this game.
@@ainequesadadiaz3813 he calls to Video Revachol, the video rental at the corner, at the crossing. near harrys old house. harry had a movie that was very painful and he didnt give them the movie back. basicaly that
The same happens to me. I couldn't replay this game. I couldn't play any other way than being an empathetic cop. I also don't want to try to use alcohol in my game and I also don't want to see the results of successful skill checks. I love the idealistic and innocent Harry who has 11 points of Volition, facing failure again and again and moving forward.
The kebab is there to inject a sense of randomness and mundanity into the man’s death, surely if he knew he was going to die his final choice of meal would not be a… kebab? A food that hundreds of thousands of people likely eat everyday? Many of which will drink and perhaps a few of which will experience this unfortunate incident for themselves? The kebab allows us to understand that this event could truely happen to any of us on any day and that our final meal may end up being as mundane as a simple kebab. It also represents how this man was consuming and letting himself be subject to his desires at the time of his death rather than paying attention to the things happening around him. Furthermore the kebab is often a meal that contains many different varieties of foods all forced together by a stick and losing a part of themselves as a result. This, of course, represents how the coalition government forces nations like Revachol to be subsumed into themselves in order to take their resources and their own identity and force them all into the coalition (kebab). As I have demonstrated here, this was not, in fact, “just a kebab”. But heyyy, thatsss just a theoryyyy, A GAMEEE THEORY!!!thanksssssfor watchinggg!
"Why are we talking like we don’t know them" I actually laughed. We don’t. Harry didn’t even get that this was his ex for the most part. That’s why he was being ridiculous. He’s hurting and he doesn’t know why.
There have been so many hints at it, from the ledger to Inland Empire and as recent as Acele's comments about us being upset about a woman, that I feel like it's pretty reasonable to think Harry at least came to the same assumption that I did that he has an ex-wife and that it's a hurtful subject.
He is also probobly activley and passively surpressing all knowledge of her as well. This is the reason he is like thos after all. All the parts of his brain treat this as a threat
I think you are misunderstanding how the trackers work. They don't show you what you have become, they rewrite the lore of the game to imply that is who you have always been. If you have more "sorry cop" points, character (including dora) will talk to you as if you have always been a sorry cop. Same for political ideologies. You currently have more points in moralism, as such in the story of the game Harry has always been a hardcore moralist, that's why you HAD to pick the weir dialog on the phone, that is who you are.
I was reminded of a little animation short called Theratpy (specifically the second one) between a therapist and his client (both anthropomorphised rats) who's extremely uncooperative. When the therapist asks how he's feeling, he responds. "I'm fine. Just peachy." to which he says "Ah, well, if you're fine we can just relax for a while, right?", but his body language is extremely telling - almost turning 180 degrees in the chair to not have to look at him. It's a pretty cool short! Check it out.
Brady kind of missed this because he didn't lean into the political stuff, but I loooooved the way the political thoughts in my head impacted this phone call on my playthrough. I remember playing "ultra-liberal" and the dialogue choice was something like "I'm going to make so much money and be so successful. I'll be able to support you and I can fix this. I'm going to win you back because I'm going to finally be a winner." It was absolutely haunting.
the case of the boardwalk body has my absolute favorite line of dialog in the game, and I'm pretty sure Brady has the stats to see it. I wonder if he'll be as enamored with it as I was.
Rofl emotional support detective... and man that phone call reminds me of the calls I've had with my ex that I'll never really be entirely over - just my foot in my mouth, and inability to say things I think when I'm not speaking to them.
Little gameplay tip: Dialogue options that have "Wait-" or "Hold on" at the start of it can be asked before the conversation moves on, and may sometimes not be an option later. (You of course don't have to use up every dialogue option, but if you want to, choose these ones first. They're usually also at the top)
You said that violent play makes you uncomfortable, so I thought that you might appreciate something like Kentucky Route Zero down the line. Maybe The Red Strings Club, The Cosmic Wheel Sisterhood, Pyre. Also, point & click adventures such as Strangeland and Broken Age almost never ask you to do violence and they tend to have a focus on character and narrative.
My therapist had me do the empty chair technique with what we determined was my shadow self (the Yungian archetype). It gave me so much insight into the two conflicting perspectives within myself
Whenever the ex-something, the Apricot Scented One, Dora comes into play, you will find you have much less control over Harry. Thus is the impact she has on his mind.
At 42:30 the proceeding response reflects on what idea Harry has gathered about the world so far, what is his grand purpose (and how he can impress and win her back by following it.) Unsurprisingly this one leans into the moralist view with a bit of apocalyptic thought behind it as well, but I find it funny Harry has neither internalized the looming end times thought or followed the moralist quest so it's somewhat out of place. Naturally there wasn't much else you could get out of the phone call since right now Harry hasn't internalized crucial thoughts about Dora and his senses were either not activating or actively working against him to keep him in the state of oblivion.
I'm on part 5 where you first start to try and push/confront Kim. In analyzing fiction such as this, where is the line between analyzing the characters and analyzing the author THROUGH the characters? I felt this a lot in Life Is Strange, does "Max the teenager" have these thoughts/feelings/ideas, or does "The Writer" have these thoughts and feelings and is projecting them through the character?
Beautiful analysis. Shockingly, I never got to the phone call with Dora in my first playthrough bc I felt bad calling random people. But I felt the emotions behind this analysis, bc I have been in limerence with someone I knew from high school, who ditched me twice when we planned to go out in college (she even confirmed earlier with me the day of on the second time). It hurt so much, when I meditated on this and concentrated on my "love" for her, my heart vividly imagined a life I had with her: 2 named kids, a dog, my mom. I thought I was in love with her. But I learned that I was in involuntary limerence, and I wonder if Harry is too. I recently remember seeing someone on the street, thinking it was that person, and I was immediately in fight-or-flight and it felt so bad and disorienting, thinking that I let it go when it's still there. Her name still in my thoughts and on the tip of my tongue almost every day. I'll have to try the empty chair exercise for myself. Love Dorothy Tennov's "Love & Limerence", HIGHLY recommend to someone who feels they also struggle in this way. Perhaps I will be at peace when her name no longer comes to my mind, as sad as that seems to be. I feel so sorry that I was attached so much to her approval, so much so that I was fooled twice due to the both of us being conflct avoidant. God, I need a therapist LMAO Btw you can get hypnogamma to heal 3 morale (basically getting 3 magnesium), and drouamine to heal 3 health
Your experience reminds me of my own. I'm still very deep in a limerence state, but I fled the actual contempt-ruled friendship a year ago, which was instigated by me reading Love and Limerence and actually engaging with my feelings for them (instead of pretending I was... I don't know, above being a victim of unwanted fantasies of romantic love, I guess). I knew they were in a relationship and my feelings were irrational and most importantly, one-sided, and I was just so tired of being limerent. It's odd because I know that while I miss them, I mostly miss the illusion of being desired, nor do I really want a romantic relationship with them, we were obviously incompatible, but that limerence still lingers, I wonder if it will ever go away... I mistakenly thought I saw them in a cafe recently and ran to the bathroom to hide. Like you wrote, it was fight-or-flight. I have no idea what I would say to them a year later. I'm doing alright for myself these days, but I hope they're doing even better. I've learned my lesson, I never want to live in a fantasy ever again.
@@DiscoGoesOn5067 VOLITION [Legendary: Success] - Hang in there. We will make it. The road to healing is going to be a long one, but we will make it through this together.
I don't think there is a better/healthier/earnest way to handle this conversation. It's a bad idea in the first place and in no reality would it lead to any closure or healing. The only healthy way for Harry to deal with that loss is to process the grief and let her go - burdening Dora with any of it at this point is absolutely useless.
You’re talking to her like you don’t know her because Harry lost his memory, Harry doesn’t know he had a wife, there’s just a repressed semblance of a memory. Also you think dealing with someone who literally decided to drink their memory out of their head because of the pain would work so easily?
So Brady with the empty chair technique, what are the important differences between that technique and, for example, imagined conversations in a patient's mind. If somebody is constantly imagining and scripting what they would say in a given situation I don't think it necessarily brings catharsis or release. Especially if the same scenarios are repeated by the patient's mind. Obviously guidance from a third party helps.
Not very disco related but the crossover between gestalt therapy and part work and ifs is cool to me because typically learning to speak with yourself and understand different parts would be seen as only beneficial for people with DID, but it really is beneficial for everyone since the core of it is learning self-empathy and acceptance, and since EVERYONE keeps so much buried underneath coping mechanisms that decay and end up harming rather than helping. Although ig it does get more complicated with systems since there’s way more opportunity for secret-keeping in the subconscious rather than like people w/o it just not being aware of stuff they've kept buried, and needing some help to dig through it
about why the dialogue on the phone is so weird, I think it comes from a combination of all the emotions and mental baggage Harry has built up in his mind related to Dora and his amnesia. So it becomes weird because he doesn't remember their history together, but still has all these storred emotions affecting his body and mind in this conversation.
I know a lot of people get very... excited about people playing the game for the first time. But things that would be interesting to see you tackle from a psychologist perspective? There's still a lot, really, but most you should encounter naturally. To be as vague as possible about a few of the things you might miss, The building with the polar bear refrigerator has another door to go through And unfortunately the Everart's contract quest has a strong payoff
for fast travel a lot people seems to be confused(rightly so), since the game isn't very good at explaining it, basically you can only travel from certain key points of the map to other similar specific points - the plaza in front of the "whirling in rags"(where Kim's vehicle is parked), the main street of the fishing village(near the washer woman), and in front of the church. you can only travel between these points... if you're somewhere else on the map outside these zones the fast travel is disabled.
8:23 I imagine that whoever this person owes money to might be a crooked cop. Or has had experiences with the RCM that warrants them being more afraid of them than the gangster they owe money too (maybe they've done crime to get to this point).
She betrayed the Disco. She is NOT allowed to be in the story because she is the traitor. NO reconciliation. She is an exile. Revachor will not accept her ever again. She is the one and only character that gets rejected from entire storyline. Even the actual murderer of the hanged man is still included within story. Every villians, despite of being punished, are accepted in story. She, Dora, is NOT.
20:00 It is one of those weird quotes in psychoanalysis which are constantly misattributed and there are no credible sources as to who said it first. I've heard it attributed to Freud, Lacan and many other analysts who certainly didn't say it, but who actually was the author? No idea.
Yeah, harry is simply not ready to resolve this yet, despite everything (and kinda get over himself). Dora has moved on, he hasn't.. Plus there’s a lot he doesn't remember. He remembers the feelings but not the details..
re: logic chiming in. Way back in ep 1 I think I made a comment about passive checks. Those are the ones where the dice are not rolled but you just see [X succeeded] in chat and that decide over whether I the skill cimes in or not. You got Logic to 4 somehow, which is the passive check threshhold for medium difficulty checks which are by far the most numerous. As I said back then, if you want a skill to talk a lot and feel like a central part of your character get it to 4. I don't want to make it too mechanic for you by giving exact numbers, but the difference between a skill at 3 and at 4 is enormous and will feel extremely different.
Really epitomizes this search for something beyond and a failure to grasp at it Gestalt therapy seems like a really cogent approach to Disco Elysium with how much the game situates the past as this caustic ghost of a thing
I like that you don’t get any “good” dialogue options for Dora, because Harry is just incapable of thinking of any. There’s no right thing to say in this situation, because it was the wrong thing to do.
You’ve talked about reintegration of old memories and personality traits before. This game is very deliberately open-ended about a lot of things, but one thing that’s repeatedly driven home is that Harry is not capable of reintegrating Dora in a healthy way. Full-stop. There is simply too much trauma there. Even after erasing his memory completely, the neural pathways are too well-traveled. The feelings are so deeply ingrained that the thoughts they inspire are second nature to Harry. The explicitly and only healthy way to deal with her is to go out of your way to not remember her at all.
I’d love to hear your take on the game’s stance, the next time she comes up.
I like that the curiosity of the player to learn more about Harry's past is making them do things that are bad for Harry. It makes it hard for the player to actually help him get over it because it feels like you would miss something.
@@DudokX The curiosity of the player is a thing that permeates the whole game really. The whole game has a general vibe of "oh you really have to open all doors and get into every buliding and know everything about everyone now do you?".
It frequently makes fun of it while also understanding where it comes from and why it's not necessarily bad
I think the way the game handles dialogue is you don't necessarily get to fully control what Harry thinks or says. You can steer him in a certain direction, but all his thoughts are ultimately his own. In some cases, like the conversation over the payphone, there are no good or constructive options because Harry can't think of any. And when an option to say something pops up, even if you don't select it, chances are that thought still crossed his mind. Just because you haven't said to Dora "I want to die", doesn't mean it's not in the back of his head.
I disagree. If you do everything "right", the end of the game is kind of hopeful. Harry did face at least some of his demons and is ready to continue life and continue healing. I think he can and eventually will deal with the Dora stuff in a healthy way, it just doesn't happen within the duration of the game. It's gonna take years but at least now he is ready to work his way through it. At least that's my interpretation based on my playthrough. (And a little bit based on my life).
@@spectral_force5097 That's a great writing choice, too, considering Disco Elysium is more about learning about who this character is (and, in true RPG fashion, who you are) than it is about finding the killer
This part of the game is a bit of a wake-up call, a reminder that as much as you can shape who you think Harry is by your decisions and dialogue, you aren't playing a self-insert in this world. You're playing as Harry, and when he's at his worst like he is in this moment, you have no choice but to bear witness to a man burning himself alive.
You will be able to help him. But not here. Not right now.
I love "why can't I just be an earnest person." That's how you know it's an accurate portrayal of mental illness! Sometimes you desperately want to say or think something better and you just *can't*
As someone who's had anger issues, his response felt so familiar to me. "Why can't I stop these mad words, why can't I respond constructively?"
Ah, fuck. Too real. I wish I wasn't such a coward.
I love how the game handles harry in this situation. You can’t say the right thing, because harry can’t.
Honestly, I haven't been looking forward to this like a lot of other comments. It feels like there is a bit of a disconnect with what a lot of the audience wants to see and how Brady wants to approach things.
I definitely came because for Disco Elysium but find myself staying for explanations on therapy and people, things I haven't been exposed to in this way before. Being in therapy myself, it's really helped me with some concepts.
Some people's focus seems to be more on the validation of having an experience that impacted them recognized by an expert. Trying to make sure that Brady 'gets it' and such. It seems like a bit of a waste to me. There is a lot more pure reaction content out there
It's a great game that taken a permanent stay in my mind. I hope to see it challenged, criticised and used as a jumping off point.
Something I love about the wording of this scene is how CLEARLY Dora is reading the things you say as different from what the player or even maybe Harry means. Telling her you’ve got a case to solve and it’s distressing? Telling her you’re gonna solve it, no matter what? She sighs?
Some things you can’t solve, some things you just have to let go. Dora just wants you to let go of her, she’s done trying to fix it. She already tried that. You’re not talking about your case, you’re talking about your relationship. Beautiful. I love how heartrending this scene is. Because even if you go in with the intent to say something constructive, Harry gets drowned by the emotional wave and volition can’t reach him anymore. All he can say are mundane or terrible things because he’s overwhelmed. I adore it. You feel so frustrated you call again, and it just does you more damage. UGH I love this game.
"Calling...
Calling...
STILL calling...
Then, the ocean breaks.
"Hello?"
"The saddest sound in the world."
@@peefmcgoose2908 "Both pitiful and terrifying. You feel your pulse rising with each ring..."
I think the phone call illustrates why the "Sorry Cop" mentality and the accompanying "Rigorous Self-Critique" thought are not healthy coping mechanisms after all. Sometimes, seeking to apologize is more about soothing oneself or self-flagellating than actually trying to address the harm that was caused. The kinder thing to do in this instance is to leave Dora be, but Harry isn't self-aware enough at this point to realize that.
Bingo. There is no good way to handle that conversation. He shouldn't have called, period.
5 years ago this scene devastated me, i felt just like harry and barely managed to hold it together. We were hunched over and shaking with a feeling in our chest like all the air had been sucked out of the room. Harry feels he needs some closure but for Dora it's been closed for years already, they've spoken about it at length already, he's called that number many times before already. Your choices are limited because there's literally nothing left to say, it's all been played out hundreds of times in hundreds of ways. He's hoping if he can just find some correct order of words everything will be fixed and he can go back to how things were, maybe he can figure out what he did wrong and make it right. You can't say anything right because the right thing to say doesn't exist no matter how desperately you want it to.
The empty chair thing would probably be good for Harry, I'm sure it would have been good for me.
I'm amazed even a professional therapist fell for this illusion. There is no "right" way to handle this conversation, it's doomed and desperate from the get-go. There is no closure but one that Harry makes for himself.
@@ImVeryOriginal It really is amazing that Disco can be such a bleak story in so many ways only to accentuate itself with these gleaming moments of hope and beauty. You are a broken husk of a man, but it's okay. You can always put yourself back together. You can build something new out of the wreckage.
Quick Tip: fast traveling has to be done in specific spots on the map, such as right outside the church, in the fishing village center area, and right outside the Whirling.
Also, loved your talking about gestalt therapy, I've been facilitated in empty chair work a couple of times and each time was really transformative and interesting. Good episode!
If you don't know that lady has a missing husband and choose "Who is this man?", Inland Empire says "This is an omen - a sign from above: Don't start drinking again" and Harry has an option to reflect that this could have been him
Disco Elysium is the only video game that's ever gotten me sincerely weepy and teary-eyed, and this payphone scene is one of two parts that does it. It's _horrifically_ real
I've been on both sides of the desperate, pleading, I-promise-I-can-change phone call, with someone who never wants to see you again, and whom you know can't be convinced, but you keep telling yourself "maybe there's some perfect combination of words that will make her forgive me and not hate me and not be uncomfortable around me anymore"
After time, I've started to prefer the latter. Having to be the Dora on that phone call is harder and harder. I feel like as I get older, I understand the permanence of broken things and can accept endings more than the dying gasps of something that should not be.
You know what's even cooler?
I've never had a romantic relationship in my life - and it still got to me.
I bawled my eyes out at the phone call.
If you have the tie on when you fail the check, it says this
“Let’s move on, bratan. We’ve had all the fun there was to have here, and it wasn’t much.”
Ok that line hurt
oh no he took off the tie. the fate of many worlds is in danger.
“Why are we talking to them like we don’t know them?” We don’t. Harry has amnesia as you may have noticed 😅
I feel like he has enough self-awareness to at least infer based on how we feel about the ledger, Acele's comments about pain related to a woman, dozens of Inland Empire warnings that graze the subject, and other details. I know he doesn't remember everything, but I'm surprised the game acts like we are completely unaware either.
@@eurobradyno, his thoughts are literally suppressing those memories, as you might have noticed from the dreams Harry sees
Mmmm! Actually the game leaves room for you to question whether he has legitimate amnesia from drinking, from the small (SPOILER GUARD) or if he’s just trying to deny deny deny. Which I like, personally.
@@eurobrady i feel like harry's thoughts always want him to forget his ex and the pain that comes with her, they keeps denying that she exists to protect him from her. maybe it becomes a bit clearer in future dreams but idk
@@eurobradyI mean the man woke up not remembering: the year, his name, his age, the country he’s in, the concept of money, THE PALE, his face, or that of his mother’s, and the scent of his childhood. Harry did irrevocable damage to himself, and there are a lot of interesting theories around it which I shall not say cauuuuse that’d be a spoiler….
I have finally caught up with the most recent video in this playthrough, so I guess this warrants a comment. All I want to say, is that this has been extremely eye opening for me. Brady, you are an excellent therapist and educator. I've learned so much about therapy and myself by going on this journey with you. You're also a hilarious role playing gamer, too. And a wonderful, warm and empathic person.
As far as the phone call goes - you've analysed Harry so thoroughly in this playthrough, I think you are way ahead of him in many realizations. I think Harry is still unsure what his pas was and whether there even was an ex- whatever in his life. All he knows is that he feels a sort of resentment towards women and that when he tries to explore that, it hurts. Then he randomly calls a number and a woman answers and he just doesn't recognize her. All he has is a bundle of emotions - longing, resentment, desire, anger... and he doesn't even know it is in any way connected to this particular woman. But she does know his name... That's why there are all these confusing dialogue options available and no concrete apology. At least that's how I interpret "The Phone Call" in the game.
Also, there's some cool extra details in the phone call, if your Harry has some other skills developed (i.e. perception). Unfortunately they didn't chime in this time, though.
(In his hypothetical)
"As they're saying nothing is wrong, they're tapping their foot"
(me irl)
*realizes I'm stress tapping my foot and stops*
(Back in the hypothetical)
"And the moment you point that out they'll immediately stop"
(Me irl)
"FUCK YOU BRADY YOU DON'T KNOW MY LIFE, YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT I'VE *SEEN*"
"Oh... maybe I should bring this up to my therapist"
It is kinda canon that Harry doesnt remember her, at least not entirely. Now, he can regain some of his memories. The White Mourning and the Apricot Chewing Gum Scented One thoughts are probably the most you can get in information about her and it is still very vague.
My favorite line is the "C'mon, you know why."
It's often what empathy says when you reeeeaaally don't feel like empathizing. Then you can mumble to yourself, “f@#&, I guess I do.”
Strangely, I was composed during the phone call when I first played, but I bawled my damn eyes out at the man on the boardwalk. I knew who he was as soon as I saw his 'name'. Senseless tragedy always kills me.
The reason it only gave you the option to give the moralist response, is because politics is, and was, Harry’s way of coping with his feelings of inadequacy, in regards to his relationship
Oh, my, God. This video finally came. The first part of seemingly eternal pain...
In order to fast-travel you have to be just outside the Church or just outside the Whirling-In-Rags (possibly the fishing village too but I'm not 100% sure on remembering that).
On the fast travel confusion I don’t think I’ve ever used fast travel playing this game. So I don’t have any hints on that 😕
Also the reason Alice assigns the case to Kim is because Alice is precinct 57, so she knows Kim and probably can only assign the case to him because they’re both in the same precinct.
I will add one more thing. I’m really looking forward to the resolution to the working class case. So much to unpack there and I’m glad it wasn’t approached when there wasn’t enough time. Obviously we’re going to be seeing grief but from Harry’s perspective he’s having to be empathetic and understanding, it’s a big responsibility to big that kind of news to a person and has to be handled with care. I know there’s gonna be a lot to talk about when we get there.
It's weird, but you can only fast travel between fast travel points.
Yeah, like you need to be either in the village, near the church, or by the Whirling for it to work
Guys, I know we've all been waiting for this episode, but let's not forget that the gameplay has been going on for more than six months now, and It's only natural that we'll forget some things☝️
That said... That damned payphone. It still hurts.
The Piss F****t jacket! The day I get kim to wear it will be my proudest
The only way Harry could have demonstrated how far he has come was listening to himself and not dialling the number at all.
I like your point on expecting the call to be more hostile cause i think thats what harry wants as well. I think if she told him to fuck off and hung up he could be even a little secure theres no point ever trying again. But cause she doesnt really hate him that way he can never let it go
Following up with the working class corpse AND the working class woman is a worthy endeavor.
Someone *has* to.
Often the PC in a game is a blank slate with a bunch of generic options. Harry is almost like an npc in his own right - the choices you get in dialogue reflect that you are exerting (limited) control over a pre-existing character.
I was waiting for this episode.
Sometimes, you can't apologize for things you've done. Its not worth it to insert yourself in someones life again like Harry is trying to do to Dora. Let it go, you're scaring her.
So even knowing well what's about to happen, when she was about to answer my hands were literally sweating and I got so tense. I think that's due to the brilliant writing, they just do it so well that you basically can feel the emotions yourself. And probably like you've said that's the reason why these options were so limited. By the way I'm so grateful for this series, because a couple of months ago I was in a pretty dark place myself, and when I saw your videos I've reconsidered therapy, and I'm now in a process of recovery. Keep up the great work and take all the time that you want to explore the psychology topics cause they're fascinating to learn.
I love this episode so much, the feeling of thinking you're tough enough now to deal with your past trauma, then getting to it and NOT DEALING WELL... its all so gooood, it's like the roleplay is going so perfectly with the game it's crazyyyy! also LETS GOOOO CHURCH TIME
I saw this thumbnail and audibly said aloud “ough my god, it’s time.”
This seems like a good place to comment something I've been thinking about a lot. My interpretation of the options you're given in DE is that they're all true to Harry, they're all things that he would do or would say, and you're choosing elements of him to emphasize or develop. Just like how we all have multiple dimensions to us, so does Harry, but you're limited to the handful of possible words or actions that he might do or say in a given situation. Some people who are frustrated and want it to be more blank slate or more open-ended don't understand this- You're playing a man with a personality and a past. You have some choice what part of him to develop, but you can't go outside of who he is.
This phone conversation shows how true this is. Brady is so eager to apologize, heal, say something mature and emotionally intelligent here, but that's just not something Harry is capable of doing here in any regard.
Doubling down on punching things unlocks the idea "Anti object task force" 😬
This is pain. The phone call is nothing but pain.
I relate with harry a ton. I have a ton of regret with a past relationship. I feel like harry is me without any help
the scene gets SOO much better at night, I nearly cried when I went there in my playthrough
Do we have reason to believe Harry has something to apologize for?
When I first encountered the phone conversation my initial takeaway was that it ruled out some terrible or traumatic possibilities. Reading the letter from the ledger you might think this person has since deceased, or Harry did something horrific to her. Perhaps while drunk.
But the phone call carries no implication of something so ugly happening between them, no indication she thinks there's unresolved issues that needs to be talked out. She doesn't want anything from him. Nor does it sound like she hates him. It's more like, she feels sad for him but wants to keep her distance
Maybe the relationship ended for mundane reasons. Like middle-schoolers who have a boyfriend/girlfriend for a month and they move on without some traumatic cause for the breakup. Maybe Harry was just a phase for her. Or she realized she wanted something else in her relationship or career. But there's a severe asymmetry. She meant a lot more to him than he did to her, apparently.
If that were the case, the phone call was a lost cause from the start. There was nothing productive that could come from it. Volition wasn't urging us to get something off our chest, finally. It was urging us to just stop
Edit: it occurs to me Dora being an *ex-wife* complicates this interpretation. Hmm
Two things
1. dora explains everything herself in the final dream really.
2. they werent married, they were just engaged.
A comment for the algorythm gods - this series deserves more attention than it gets!
Also... Calling... Calling... Calling in the night... Still callling...
The phone call made me cry back when I played it.
For me, this is THE best game, nothing come close, I feel bad that za/um went out in the most disco way possible
The phone call in the union office hit me so much harder then this one, but I'm weird. There are so many unexpected emotional moments that just pop up like this. I love this game.
I’ve never done that, what happens?
@@ainequesadadiaz3813 he calls to Video Revachol, the video rental at the corner, at the crossing. near harrys old house. harry had a movie that was very painful and he didnt give them the movie back. basicaly that
The same happens to me. I couldn't replay this game. I couldn't play any other way than being an empathetic cop.
I also don't want to try to use alcohol in my game and I also don't want to see the results of successful skill checks.
I love the idealistic and innocent Harry who has 11 points of Volition, facing failure again and again and moving forward.
Oooh, this part.
The kebab is there to inject a sense of randomness and mundanity into the man’s death, surely if he knew he was going to die his final choice of meal would not be a… kebab? A food that hundreds of thousands of people likely eat everyday? Many of which will drink and perhaps a few of which will experience this unfortunate incident for themselves? The kebab allows us to understand that this event could truely happen to any of us on any day and that our final meal may end up being as mundane as a simple kebab. It also represents how this man was consuming and letting himself be subject to his desires at the time of his death rather than paying attention to the things happening around him. Furthermore the kebab is often a meal that contains many different varieties of foods all forced together by a stick and losing a part of themselves as a result. This, of course, represents how the coalition government forces nations like Revachol to be subsumed into themselves in order to take their resources and their own identity and force them all into the coalition (kebab). As I have demonstrated here, this was not, in fact, “just a kebab”. But heyyy, thatsss just a theoryyyy, A GAMEEE THEORY!!!thanksssssfor watchinggg!
It's also a super common drunk food
PERCEPTION (HEARING) [Medium: Failure]
Doing The Payphone sequence with Kim in tow is a mood.
"Why are we talking like we don’t know them" I actually laughed.
We don’t. Harry didn’t even get that this was his ex for the most part. That’s why he was being ridiculous. He’s hurting and he doesn’t know why.
There have been so many hints at it, from the ledger to Inland Empire and as recent as Acele's comments about us being upset about a woman, that I feel like it's pretty reasonable to think Harry at least came to the same assumption that I did that he has an ex-wife and that it's a hurtful subject.
He is also probobly activley and passively surpressing all knowledge of her as well.
This is the reason he is like thos after all. All the parts of his brain treat this as a threat
@@eurobradyHarry’s mind is very good at suppressing information, even if you the player understand what’s happening.
@@eurobradyDude, your Harry has a Logic of 0.
Cut him some slack.
@@TheR00k that’s another aspect to be sure
Great reaction as someone who went through a divorce this part with the phone really hit home for me
It wasn't said by someone else about Freud, it was Freud himself who said 'sometimes a cigar is just a cigar'. Or, at least it's attributed to him.
It was in fact Freud himself who said the cigar line.
I think you are misunderstanding how the trackers work. They don't show you what you have become, they rewrite the lore of the game to imply that is who you have always been. If you have more "sorry cop" points, character (including dora) will talk to you as if you have always been a sorry cop. Same for political ideologies. You currently have more points in moralism, as such in the story of the game Harry has always been a hardcore moralist, that's why you HAD to pick the weir dialog on the phone, that is who you are.
I was reminded of a little animation short called Theratpy (specifically the second one) between a therapist and his client (both anthropomorphised rats) who's extremely uncooperative. When the therapist asks how he's feeling, he responds. "I'm fine. Just peachy." to which he says "Ah, well, if you're fine we can just relax for a while, right?", but his body language is extremely telling - almost turning 180 degrees in the chair to not have to look at him. It's a pretty cool short! Check it out.
Sometimes payphone is just a payphone… not this time though!
Brady kind of missed this because he didn't lean into the political stuff, but I loooooved the way the political thoughts in my head impacted this phone call on my playthrough.
I remember playing "ultra-liberal" and the dialogue choice was something like "I'm going to make so much money and be so successful. I'll be able to support you and I can fix this. I'm going to win you back because I'm going to finally be a winner."
It was absolutely haunting.
the case of the boardwalk body has my absolute favorite line of dialog in the game, and I'm pretty sure Brady has the stats to see it. I wonder if he'll be as enamored with it as I was.
Rofl emotional support detective... and man that phone call reminds me of the calls I've had with my ex that I'll never really be entirely over - just my foot in my mouth, and inability to say things I think when I'm not speaking to them.
Calling...
Calling . . .
@@otaku2082 still calling . . .
@@Pierre-lj4sq * Still * calling . . .
@@plida27 Cuno doesn’t fucking care
Calling...
Hey Brady, hope you're doing well
you can fast travel if you stand in one of the fast travel locations. the ones that are titled on the map
"Why are we talking to them like we don't know them?"
Because we don't.
Little gameplay tip: Dialogue options that have "Wait-" or "Hold on" at the start of it can be asked before the conversation moves on, and may sometimes not be an option later. (You of course don't have to use up every dialogue option, but if you want to, choose these ones first. They're usually also at the top)
I'm sorry, milk carton 😕
This episode was absolutely worth the wait. Poor Harry.
You said that violent play makes you uncomfortable, so I thought that you might appreciate something like Kentucky Route Zero down the line. Maybe The Red Strings Club, The Cosmic Wheel Sisterhood, Pyre. Also, point & click adventures such as Strangeland and Broken Age almost never ask you to do violence and they tend to have a focus on character and narrative.
My therapist had me do the empty chair technique with what we determined was my shadow self (the Yungian archetype). It gave me so much insight into the two conflicting perspectives within myself
Whenever the ex-something, the Apricot Scented One, Dora comes into play, you will find you have much less control over Harry. Thus is the impact she has on his mind.
Wonder what you would have said if you found the choice where Harry hears the person lying next to her.
At 42:30 the proceeding response reflects on what idea Harry has gathered about the world so far, what is his grand purpose (and how he can impress and win her back by following it.)
Unsurprisingly this one leans into the moralist view with a bit of apocalyptic thought behind it as well, but I find it funny Harry has neither internalized the looming end times thought or followed the moralist quest so it's somewhat out of place.
Naturally there wasn't much else you could get out of the phone call since right now Harry hasn't internalized crucial thoughts about Dora and his senses were either not activating or actively working against him to keep him in the state of oblivion.
I love the way it denies you any intelligent options he's too compromised
I'm on part 5 where you first start to try and push/confront Kim. In analyzing fiction such as this, where is the line between analyzing the characters and analyzing the author THROUGH the characters? I felt this a lot in Life Is Strange, does "Max the teenager" have these thoughts/feelings/ideas, or does "The Writer" have these thoughts and feelings and is projecting them through the character?
Oh no. I am caught up & now I gotta wait (°ロ°)
Beautiful analysis. Shockingly, I never got to the phone call with Dora in my first playthrough bc I felt bad calling random people. But I felt the emotions behind this analysis, bc I have been in limerence with someone I knew from high school, who ditched me twice when we planned to go out in college (she even confirmed earlier with me the day of on the second time). It hurt so much, when I meditated on this and concentrated on my "love" for her, my heart vividly imagined a life I had with her: 2 named kids, a dog, my mom. I thought I was in love with her. But I learned that I was in involuntary limerence, and I wonder if Harry is too. I recently remember seeing someone on the street, thinking it was that person, and I was immediately in fight-or-flight and it felt so bad and disorienting, thinking that I let it go when it's still there. Her name still in my thoughts and on the tip of my tongue almost every day. I'll have to try the empty chair exercise for myself. Love Dorothy Tennov's "Love & Limerence", HIGHLY recommend to someone who feels they also struggle in this way. Perhaps I will be at peace when her name no longer comes to my mind, as sad as that seems to be. I feel so sorry that I was attached so much to her approval, so much so that I was fooled twice due to the both of us being conflct avoidant. God, I need a therapist LMAO
Btw you can get hypnogamma to heal 3 morale (basically getting 3 magnesium), and drouamine to heal 3 health
Your experience reminds me of my own. I'm still very deep in a limerence state, but I fled the actual contempt-ruled friendship a year ago, which was instigated by me reading Love and Limerence and actually engaging with my feelings for them (instead of pretending I was... I don't know, above being a victim of unwanted fantasies of romantic love, I guess).
I knew they were in a relationship and my feelings were irrational and most importantly, one-sided, and I was just so tired of being limerent. It's odd because I know that while I miss them, I mostly miss the illusion of being desired, nor do I really want a romantic relationship with them, we were obviously incompatible, but that limerence still lingers, I wonder if it will ever go away... I mistakenly thought I saw them in a cafe recently and ran to the bathroom to hide. Like you wrote, it was fight-or-flight. I have no idea what I would say to them a year later.
I'm doing alright for myself these days, but I hope they're doing even better. I've learned my lesson, I never want to live in a fantasy ever again.
@@DiscoGoesOn5067 VOLITION [Legendary: Success] - Hang in there. We will make it. The road to healing is going to be a long one, but we will make it through this together.
Oh shit, not the payphone…
Calling....
@@jizburgCalling . .
I don't think there is a better/healthier/earnest way to handle this conversation. It's a bad idea in the first place and in no reality would it lead to any closure or healing. The only healthy way for Harry to deal with that loss is to process the grief and let her go - burdening Dora with any of it at this point is absolutely useless.
Disco Elysium, Life Is Strange and TUNIC are my top experiences ever
You’re talking to her like you don’t know her because Harry lost his memory, Harry doesn’t know he had a wife, there’s just a repressed semblance of a memory.
Also you think dealing with someone who literally decided to drink their memory out of their head because of the pain would work so easily?
Harry never had a wife. "No one is married anymore. This is Revachol."
The moment we were all waiting for.
WOW, I did not have the courage to call twice, much less three times. That is...
Oooh, I'm excited...
So Brady with the empty chair technique, what are the important differences between that technique and, for example, imagined conversations in a patient's mind. If somebody is constantly imagining and scripting what they would say in a given situation I don't think it necessarily brings catharsis or release. Especially if the same scenarios are repeated by the patient's mind. Obviously guidance from a third party helps.
48:48 Brady experiences the frustration and guilt of relapse
Not very disco related but the crossover between gestalt therapy and part work and ifs is cool to me because typically learning to speak with yourself and understand different parts would be seen as only beneficial for people with DID, but it really is beneficial for everyone since the core of it is learning self-empathy and acceptance, and since EVERYONE keeps so much buried underneath coping mechanisms that decay and end up harming rather than helping. Although ig it does get more complicated with systems since there’s way more opportunity for secret-keeping in the subconscious rather than like people w/o it just not being aware of stuff they've kept buried, and needing some help to dig through it
about why the dialogue on the phone is so weird, I think it comes from a combination of all the emotions and mental baggage Harry has built up in his mind related to Dora and his amnesia. So it becomes weird because he doesn't remember their history together, but still has all these storred emotions affecting his body and mind in this conversation.
Just wanna say, there's a building lot south of the canal lock that you don't seem to have noticed can be explored.
I know a lot of people get very... excited about people playing the game for the first time. But things that would be interesting to see you tackle from a psychologist perspective? There's still a lot, really, but most you should encounter naturally. To be as vague as possible about a few of the things you might miss,
The building with the polar bear refrigerator has another door to go through
And unfortunately the Everart's contract quest has a strong payoff
for fast travel a lot people seems to be confused(rightly so), since the game isn't very good at explaining it, basically you can only travel from certain key points of the map to other similar specific points - the plaza in front of the "whirling in rags"(where Kim's vehicle is parked), the main street of the fishing village(near the washer woman), and in front of the church. you can only travel between these points... if you're somewhere else on the map outside these zones the fast travel is disabled.
8:23 I imagine that whoever this person owes money to might be a crooked cop. Or has had experiences with the RCM that warrants them being more afraid of them than the gangster they owe money too (maybe they've done crime to get to this point).
She betrayed the Disco. She is NOT allowed to be in the story because she is the traitor. NO reconciliation. She is an exile. Revachor will not accept her ever again.
She is the one and only character that gets rejected from entire storyline.
Even the actual murderer of the hanged man is still included within story. Every villians, despite of being punished, are accepted in story.
She, Dora, is NOT.
Oh man the phonecall is heavy
Nooooo you called her again! She has to go to work in two hours :'(
20:00 It is one of those weird quotes in psychoanalysis which are constantly misattributed and there are no credible sources as to who said it first. I've heard it attributed to Freud, Lacan and many other analysts who certainly didn't say it, but who actually was the author? No idea.
56:06
...Not to mention physical, Brady. Ow!
Yeah, harry is simply not ready to resolve this yet, despite everything (and kinda get over himself). Dora has moved on, he hasn't..
Plus there’s a lot he doesn't remember. He remembers the feelings but not the details..
re: logic chiming in. Way back in ep 1 I think I made a comment about passive checks. Those are the ones where the dice are not rolled but you just see [X succeeded] in chat and that decide over whether I the skill cimes in or not. You got Logic to 4 somehow, which is the passive check threshhold for medium difficulty checks which are by far the most numerous. As I said back then, if you want a skill to talk a lot and feel like a central part of your character get it to 4. I don't want to make it too mechanic for you by giving exact numbers, but the difference between a skill at 3 and at 4 is enormous and will feel extremely different.
Really epitomizes this search for something beyond and a failure to grasp at it
Gestalt therapy seems like a really cogent approach to Disco Elysium with how much the game situates the past as this caustic ghost of a thing
Fritz Perls... Frittte Girl...
Oh boy this will be "fun"