VW Id.3 - Testing how much more efficient the heat pump is
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- Опубліковано 26 сер 2024
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Hi Chris...your wind screen is schmutzig! I kept rubbing my iPad and the schmutz didn’t go away!
What's even more spectacular is that his car is also heavier than yours as he has a heavy glass roof and other equipment that's not in your car.
Awesome cars, and thanks for the data! One more thing to consider: The black ID.3 will naturally gather more heat, so the efficiency difference might be a little less when comparing two cars of the same color.
Signed, Jealous in America
24°C! I recall a race in Norway with an Ioniq, a new Leaf and an old Leaf. At night and all had heating off to spare electricity, driving in a thick winter jackets 😆
Great test, thanks! In Canada VW just made the heat pump an option for 2023 ID.4's but they have little info on what exactly it does and what its best use case is. A deep dive with a VW heat pump expert would be a very helpful video if you are looking for ideas. Thanks again for all your great and helpful videos.
Awesome test, would be great to repeat it at different temps, like at -10 C and +10, +20 C, just to see how the difference plays out.
And also please with a more normal cabin temperature like 21°C. Each extra unnecessary degree in temperature exponentially increases the difference. 24°C is a bit of an overkill.
The heat pump extracts heat from outside air and other car systems inverters, motor, battery (shared coolant loop).
This is why the black ID3 arrived with a colder battery and charged slower. Some of the efficiency gained with the lower heat consumption is then lost with the car trying to heat up the battery to get higher speed. That is why the numbers don't add up at the end, the black ID3 also used a few kwh trying to heat up the battery.
Also take into account that all the metal pipes and extra weight of the heat pump system around as deadweight in the summer so negatively affecting consumption in the other part of the year.
I hope radiant heating integrated into dashboard and door panels will be implemented by more OEMs. A small strip can heat you up with 100-200 watt, saves weight, energy and reduces complexity.
I doubt it adds that much weight from the schematics posted at the GE forum but then the Heatpump versions uses CO2 as a different coolant which needs more pressure
The heat pump does not use the battery as an energy source, it uses the inverter, motor and outside air. Since it is a CO2 System (world's first mass manufactured green system) it can use those sources at way lower temperatures than a confidential R1234yf system could.
The weight gain compared to the regular non heatpump ID.3 is basically irrelevant, just a couple of kilos. You just need some more valves, one more heat exchanger and components that are built to cope with the stresses if heart pump operation to transform an A/C system into a heatpump.
@@Denkmaschine Then how does it pre-heat the car when its plugged in?
@@davewozere2k9 Well, If the car has been charged with AC, it can use the warm water from the inverter. If not, it can still use the potential energy of the outside air. If that is not enough, it just uses the regular ptc heater, just like the regular car. A heatpump can only use what it's environment provides. ;)
Thats a great way to explain it. I want to get the Mustang Mach E but it has no heat pump.
Ford said it didn't want to add it because of the extra weight.
But like you said, in the summer I'll have less weight.
Also I read the heat pump technology is very complex.
Purely speaking on the break even point for the imho too expensive heat pump it just means that you have to drive forever. Thanks for the great test.
Thank you for the excellent Test and especially, that you have shown the kWh at Charging station to get back to 80%. This reduces the risk that VW is just falsifying the values. Would be also interesting If you compare different cars
I have been planning to buy an EV and really this channel has everything i need ... From car reviews, range tests, comparisons, general information on electric cars , literally every info i ever need is here .. thanks man
You are very welcome. That is my goal
Thank you very much for your time and effort to both of you! Nice to have the heat pump in the ID.3 Tour version 👍⚡️
I like how you got the mic with an extension cable, i had the same idea but never saw anyone do it, i feel validated 🤩
fabulous real world comparison. your videos are the best!!!
Great comparison! Thanks for going to so much trouble, to Knut as well.
Nice review. I hope it could be done at temps lower than -10.
It will not get that cold here
I will in few weeks. I just can't wait for my ID. 3 to arrive in Slovenija. Dang. I can't wait for it. Lmao.
2:31 "He is here in the back...I hope you can see"
*Shows empty rear bench*
This is actually creepy, I hope there will be no invisible shovel guy some time...
🙈😂
So conclusion: a heat pump really helps!
But the test was a bit slow and very hot (85 km/h with 24° C). The faster the drive, the lower the heating consumption per 100 km. With 130 km/h and 21° C maybe only around 3% more range.
@@jenscs the main benefit of the heat pump is when starting with a cold car.
10 short trips with a frozen car will make the diffrence....long long trips with low speeds also.
its not cute...its a dump feature. the charging curve should always be the same at given point. Senseless!
@@JohnDoe-vx3z Oh, I thought, in the first moment after start the PTC-element works mainly/faster, but I'm not sure.
@@jenscs The heat pump kicks in pretty quickly. Also the ID.3 heat pump will work down to -25C so it will make even bigger difference in lower temperatures.
Chris, thank you for this comparison. I wish that VW also had the the direct heating defroster - this is very helpful in below freezing temperatures, when it is snowing and/or sleeting and/or freezing rain. The temperature you had for this test is probably about ideal for the heatpump. As the temperature drops, it is harder and harder for it to gather the heat, and eventually, it has to supplement the heatpump with - resistance heating.
Do you both have the same generation of software?
Yes
Ok, so my estimation of 10% higher consumption was not that far off. But you need to drive a lot of miles to offset the price of the heat pump.
it's more about the additional range than price
@@general236 depends. If you buy the 77kWh version, the range loss probably doesn't make a difference anymore. But I'd also recommend it for the smaller batteries.
@@JohnDoe-vx3z than you're without the tow hook :D
And drive those miles mostly in winter...
Before i even watch this , judging by title This is best !!! Thank yal !!
Thanks for another great video stay safe and safe travels
Great test, I'm satisfied that I ordered the Max with a heat pump.
I think there might be a difference in battery temperature because your HVAC took additional power from the battery. Also his heat pump might use heat from the battery.
Interesting review. I ordered an ID.3 with a heatpump last week.
A Heat pump is a nice thing.
@@BatteryLife Hello, I would like to ask what is the different? R-1234yf and R-744? Thank you!
Great test thanks! I suspect that your friend's car with the heat pump charged slightly slower after the test because the heat pump had done it's job transferring heat from the battery to the cabin. It's a pity the cars didn't have Car Scanner running so that you could see the battery temperatures.
As far as I know. VW id cars don't use heat from the battery
Could be the charging point regarding the charging speed difference. I was using ionity and only getting 38kw at one charger - moved to a different charger and got 120kw
Thanks for your test. I'm looking for a newer EV than my 7 year old Leaf. I'll stop worrying about whether it has a heat pump now. Nice to have, but not vital.
Place where I live (Northern Finland) the January average temperature is below -10°C. Here all ID.3 and ID.4 models have heat pumps. I am waiting for my ID.4 to come in April 2021.
It could be -35°C at lowest here.
In another channel they did it with a e-niro, in a simpler way. They heated both cabins and measured time to get the temperature, it is very different and de consumption was measured in odometer of the car.
That was a great comparison. Thank you to you both! I believe the ID4 coming to Canada will have the heat pump standard which will help even more in colder temperatures. Love your channel! VW should be paying you for these tests!
Thanks for the test! Very useful indeed.
Main benefit is more range you can get :)
After about two hours of driving, the PTC car had used 84 cents more electricity. The heat pump option costs 1243 EUR (3% more next year), so you‘d have to drive close to 3000 hours in winter for it to pay for itself. Clearly, the heat pump doesn‘t make financial sense.
However, I got it in my ID.3 so I could be lazy in winter and not really think about the heater, so I can turn on the heater 10 minutes before I get to the car or go an extra 20-30 km before recharging. Was it worth it? Probably not, but hey, financially, a used e-Golf would be far more economical. :-)
In lower speed like city driving the difference will be much higher
There ist no significant heat pump effect at city ranges because of instationary cycle.
my two observations..
1. very inefficient at 16-17 kWh/ 100km, it should be around 13-14 at that temperature and speed!
2. why is the charging not at 90-100kW?
2. Battery was cold
Cold air is denser. More air molecules to push out of the way per km. 13 is not realistic.
Much better efficiency, but the cost savings are not going to pay it off. I'd go for it just for the range boost.
10:19 But you have a simple air conditioner with R1234yf that any garage can handle. Not the new R744 CO² with >80 bar pressure. The seals are very sensitive and it's difficult to keep the system tight. In addition, a regular climate maintenance may be carried out in the future. After all, the heat pump has an influence on the WLTP consumption.
Seems like something was wrong with the heat pump in the ID.3 in the nextmove test 10 days ago.
the heat pump here does what one would expect.
We don't know. Maybe in my test the sun warmed up the black car more.
But it doesn't save much under even good conditions, ~1kWh per hour. On short drives the car uses resistive heating to warm up the car fast and it can't take any energy from the battery cooling since it's not on temperature. The first nextmove test shows that, if you aren't driving it can't get any benefit from the heat pump since it generates the heat primary from the battery and motor cooling loop. If you want better max range in the winter you have to buy the 77 kWh battery and not the 56 with a heat pump. Financially on short range the heat pump won't be profitable at 1200€ upgrade cost.
My maths might be wrong, but if you take just the price of the heatpump at €1243, you would need to drive nearly 244000km to make back the cost!
@timemachine_194 but you get a different coolant (CO2) compared to the non WP version which is a good thing!
Correct. Need to drive a long way to recoup the cost of HP
@timemachine_194 as far as I understand it yes it’s one system which can cool & heat battery & passengers evflux.pro/id3-cooling-and-heating/
Maybe Double or much more (244000*2= 488000km) because in summer you don´t need Heatpump, an most people drive much more km in summer, and don´t forget the complicated service of Heatpump (witch co2). conzentrated co2 call kill humans...ok thats also good for nature ;-)
@@gerij.8594 CO2 as coolant is a good thing for the environment and it allows the heatpump to work in lower temperatures -> evflux.pro/id3-cooling-and-heating/
Regarding the last question: you cannot extrapolate charge values to get the battery capacity.
An ID3 charging 10% in 1 hour and using 3 kwh to heat up the batery and with charging loss, will end up using 5,8 + 3 = 8,8 kwh. That does not mean it has 88 kwh usable capacity, it just has higher loses.
Also your ID3 has a top buffer. I would be very surprised if you have less than 100% capacity at the moment.
Great test.
👏🏻👏🏻Chris & Knut! Salt & Pepper ID.3s
That is funny!
Vielen Dank für diesen Test. Interessant wäre der Vergleich im Stadtverkehr. Meine Durchschnittsgeschwindigkeit über mehrere Wochen liegt bei 40-50 km/h... Dann ist der Heizungsverbrauch schon ein wesentlich höherer Anteil als auf der Autobahn...
We do like our toys.
I drive the same car (with Heatpump)at a maximum of 20 degrees Celsius. At 24 degrees Celsius, the consumption is of course quite high.
To test a difference it is easier with a higher temp.
I would like to see this test but in the winter
I think you should repeat the test when it is colder. It has been quite warm here in southern Germany this late November.
There is one confounding factor unaccounted for. Black cars absorb sunshine to heat. White cars reflect light & reduce heat retention. Best to repeat this test in evening after sunset..
No they don't have any impact. It has been tested.
In modern cars the color of the car does not impact the interior temp.
The window surface has a lot of impact. But here we have the same car.
I think the problem is in the charger. You can't assume both chargers will work the same. One can have a problem. Also battery temperature can be different because maybe you heat them differently(heat pump against PTC).
Did he had heater on when charging? Because what I understand the heat pump is cooling the battery when producing heat to the cabin. Or then it can be that battery was that much cooler from being cooled for the whole trip.
Battery is being cooled on both cars when needed. If the heat pumps takes heat from the battery pack while driving in the cold, then it could be colder.
Hallo ihr als VW id3 Fahrer , habe ich eine Frage zur vw ladekarte we Charge. Habt ihr die ? Was kostet die monatlich und was kostet DC Gleichstrom laden die kWh?
Danke
Maybe those two Ionity chargers aren't exactly the same?
They should be
This is the test I’ve been waiting for. As I could drive 200km a day x5 times a week would make a difference. Would it be more if colder
i think different charge speeds could also be because of different batterie temperatures. Isn´t it possible to read the batterie temp via obd2?
Sehr interessant! Wenn man von 21° statt 24° C und 130 km/h Autobahntempo statt 85 km/h ausgeht, dann sinkt der Heizungsverbrauch pro 100 km deutlich (ca. Häfte). Und gleichzeitig steigt noch der Antriebsverbrauch, so dass die WP prozentual dann wohl nur ca. 3% mehr Reichweite bringt. Ein großer 77er Akku kostet den 2 bis 3-fachen Aufpreis ggü. der WP (bei gleicher Ausstattung, sofern das zu vergleichen geht) und bringt immer ca. 30% mehr Reichweite. Interessant wäre noch ein Kurzstreckenvergleich mit und ohne WP, wobei das Auto zwischenzeitlich immer abkühlt und die gefahrene Geschwindigkeit niedriger ist.
PS: Bitte optional automatische Untertitel aktivieren (oder kommt das noch von selbst?).
Thank you! Very interesting! One question: Do the cars have the same tyres?
0:15 "Exact same Rims and Tires"
Great test. Thank you. But why 24C? No one drives like that in winter? Could it be more realistic to do test at 20-21? I bet the difference would not be that big
I wanted to see a good difference and it was only 2 to 3 degrees. If it is 3 degrees colder, than 21,inside would be the same.
Do you know the reason why you don't receive full 100kw charging speed at 20% SoC? Last weekend I had an ID3 for a longer test drive and after 100km on the highway (1-2 °C outside) I plugged in at Ionity and only got about 39-45kw charging speed. As far as I know the ID3 has heated battery system. Is this just a software issue at the moment or is the battery heating system not working properly?
That is normal. Battery cold. Preheating battery with navigating to Ionity will come in a software update.
@@BatteryLife Thanks for the answer! :) Do you know if that will work only for ionity chargers or every fast charger that is highlighted in the navigation update that will come in the future?
You can preheating the battery at HPC-Charger. The symbol/ touch you can find it in the charging menu at the left side. So you increase charging.
@@karl-heinzoehling483 isn't that just for cabin heat while charging? (like auxilary heating on i3?)
@@Andre1980stavanger It's für Battery heating too. Press the bottom in order to start battery heating. The i3 hasn't such special heating bottom, but heating via App.
Thanks, great video, and very interesting.
I have an EV6 and the heat pump is a £900 extra, I doubt here in the UK it will ever pay for itself, but if range is all important, then yes.
I charge at home for 5p/unit,and rarely have to use public chargers, so the extra cost of heating for a few months a year is negligible, but if you want max range, and pay Ionity rates, then, maybe.
It’s the cold. Losses in and losses out thru inverter. Same capacity
Coole Idee für ein Video.
Seriously 24 degress 😲 hot.. Sweating temperatur.
I use 21 degress in My car.
So think for most People the difference will be more or less 5%
But what if it is colder outside?
The energy required by the heater is proportional to the delta T, so 24-3 = 21 vs 21-3=18 -> at 3° outside air temp, the heater would need 15% less power at 21° vs 24°. Noticeable, but not all that much. Moral of the story: set the heater to what makes you comfy (21° for me as well) :-)
Wow, those chargers are expensive. I pay 1/6th or about 1.04 EUR / 100km for at home charging (15KWH) in Vancouver, Canada
About charging speed. With heatpump less power out of battery means it was running colder and that equals slower charging?
No way a power draw difference of 1,2kW would do something to the battery temp. When driving takes 16kW.
I think because you started at a lower SOC your battery temp was higher at the 30% SOC that he started at. So technically your battery was warmer, probably allowing for a faster charge.
Is there a preheating system in the ID.3? Similar to Tesla with the Tesla app? Where you can turn on heat and heated seats while ID.3 is plugged in and outside?
Yea there is, its called "we connect id" but it aint as advanced.
I’ve just bought a 1st plus, does anyone know if VW can add in a wireless phone charger?
If you do your own wiring to get power there. Yes
Hi, I am planning to get an Skoda Enyaq iV80 77kwh battery. Same platform as Id3/ID4. Max one way trip would be around 160km. Soft winters here, 7c to -5c. Now I am thinking; should I go for the heat pump or in stead go for Full Led Matrix lights? Any advise?
Full led matrix is awesome. Headpump helps though.
so if his battery holds more kWh than yours than his 80 % is more range automatically.
there is also what is the price difference between heat pump car and not as this is what you need to make back over time to make it worth having.
Are those the entry battery 49kWh ID3s lol?
Because discharged energy amounts are very strange:
-White ID 1.44*17.7=25.488/0.60=42.48 kWh
-Black ID 1.44*16.5=23.76/0.51=46.58 kWh
I believe the 1st Edition only comes with the 58kWh pack.
But you only calculated 80% of the battery. Not full.
ID3 First is a 62kwh with 58kw directly available.
@@BatteryLife Chris, you both started with 80%, right? Or did you reset both tripmeters after black ID 12v reboot?
Chris - did the other id3 owner had your software update? May explain the capacity difference.
Also I guess the SOC may have been slightly off in your case also because of slightly colder battery (you didn't drive 400km before).
Anyhow great test!!!
Same software
@@BatteryLife thanks! Love the BMS accuracy then lol
danke
Okäi, batt wei dont ju schpiek tschörmen?
Hallo Chris, ich glaube ihr habt beim letzten Laden ein Fehler gemacht. Knut hatte die ganze Zeit seine Heckklappe offen, sodass die Heizung die ganze Zeit den Innenraum stark aufheizen musste. Dadurch hat er mehr Strom beim Laden verbraucht.
Heizung war bei beiden aus beim Laden!
A smaller than expected difference in charged or rather delivered kWh between both cars could be realized in (the unlikely) case he forgot to shut down the heater while having his hatch wide open all the time. 🤔
Hello Chris, and thanks for your test! Could you tell me if there is a way to check heat pump presence in the car? I'm waiting for my ID3 with this option ;-)
Turn on the heat, put thw fan on low. If there is a louder fan going on kmder the hood. You have a heat pump ;)
The heat pump has a fan to work. The ptc heater is completely silent. Only the climate fan runs with it.
@@BatteryLife Thank you and ok, like my wife's I3 then ;-)
hi read this on another site The easiest way to found out if the car has a heat pump or not is to search the yellow label in the "engine room", with the informations about the refrigenant on it. If it tells you that the car use R744 (CO2), it will have a heat pump, otherwise not (then it will be R1234yf on the label).
@@Bruce-bz5ci thanks, i 'll check this 😀👍
So does this mean you lost some 8% of your battery capacity in just a few months of ownership and roughly 10 000 km driven?
I don't know. I know 5% is normal in every EV in the first few months.
@@BatteryLife I suspect it has more to do with the test temperature. 2020 being what it is, maybe there will be another 19° day before Spring? If so, it would be interesting to see another 3-100% charge test to measure the capacity.
I really want my next car to be an EV(ID3 being a good candidate for my choice) but range and battery degradation plays a big role in that the decision. Chris your tests really help and thanks a lot for taking the time. I am always looking at your Google drive file with the results of your tests :)
@@BatteryLife Please see my answer above. There is very little degradation in the first years with all cars with a buffer and thermal management.
Note that Tesla does NOT have a buffer... you see any degradation immediately.
But newer batteries (Tesla too) have better cell formation and Lithium doping in the manufacturing stages. This reduces the initial battery degradation and the 8% buffer that the ID3 has (brutto/netto kwh) helps hide long term degradation.
Your car will mintain its specs and range well.
So as a conclusion, what is the range difference of a full battery driving in winter conditions on highways with or without the heat pump?
Hi, thanks for compare, BUT another thing - consumption of id3 seems to be too much high.. Cruise control set to 85km/h on the highway..??! by cca 17kw/100km... What about consumption by usually legal speed 130km/h?? Sorry but BEV must have to go loooong way of inovation before they will be really usable on highway... (i have BEV too, - friend of electromobility, but this si not good efficiency from VW for year 2020)
@timemachine_194 thx for reply
You are useing power for phones ect. Does that make a difference in consumption of power?
No. This comes from the 12V battery and that is being charged the whole time anyway.
@@BatteryLife that does make sense. 12 V recharge will only happen when needed. However the consumption by phones and cameras are insignificant compared to heart and driving.
Did his trip meter "since charge" also not work? Have you checked those too?
Also: those charging speeds weren't great... 🤔 (we know it can do better 😉)
No tripmeter worked. Batteries were cold.
@@BatteryLife Ah, too bad..
hi... I'm new owner and I have question about heat pump. how do you hnow it's working? I have it but can't compare heating efficienty with someone who doesen't have it?
when does pump start work? does it trigger right on when cabine temperature is set few degrees above outside temp? do I need to A/C turn on or not?
I bought it but how can I tell is it working? :)
The heat pump is your heating in the car.
If you put the climate,on heating the cabin, it is on.
We others have a ptz heater.
@@BatteryLife thanks. to I have to turn on A/C to start heatpump? it's not working if A/C is off?
If you do not heat or cool the cabine it is off.
hhhh，chris，you make the socks which vw send you into mask? hhhhh
also wheels can make a difference.. you compared 19" with 20" am I right?
No. As it says in the video. We are having the exact same winter tires plus rims on the car.
What ? I can buy a ID3 without heat pump, why ?
They decided to do that. Mine was not even possible to get one.
@@BatteryLife i thought vw learned from mistakes it made on the e-golf. You can buy that without CCS plug and only 7.2kw onboard charger. My boss did so because he had no clue about electric cars. Our company e-golf is now basically a bricked car that can only be used in city driving and the resell value in 2024 will be 0.
This still doesn't answer the question is the heat pump worth it.
If the pump is an option should I buy it if mainly my journeys are short.
UA-camrs are obsessed with range and most people don't drive large distances in one go.
What you gain in the winter you lose in the summer. Id3 with heat pump uses CO2 gas for the climate control instead of R1234YF. CO2 is less efficient and uses more power
Chris, what % difference would you expect at +5 degrees Celsius? Thanks
No idea
I thought VW promisses 30% more range?
All depends on the temperature and the heat settings.
@@BatteryLife I thinq VW means 30% of heating Energy, this makes physically sense. I also miss a heat pump in my model 3, but over 1000 Euro for a heat pump makes no sense.
In this case I would buy the max, where it's included. And after all test I have seen and also my test driving, I would prefer the E-Corsa or Mokka-E. But hopefully the big VW software update will change a lot of the strange software bugs of the ID3, especially the confusing menu structure.b
@@BatteryLife and speed
Hi,
By your ID3 experience during winter time AC left ON or OFF what is the difference in consuption ? Does heat pump works of AC is OFF ? Still new to the car only 2 weeks. Watching your videos to get more info 😊 Thanks for nice info 😊
Hmm, but his car is black so it would get heated more by the sun, that should also make some difference. I don't know how much that would be. Perhaps you should have waited for a cloudy day, or even done it in the evening when it's dark.
Not as easy as you think to coordinate that.
@@BatteryLife Sure, I understand you can't just pick any time. It may not matter all that much, your white car also gets hot in the sun.
Darn it VW! You said it "wasn't a big difference." UGH!
How crazy expensive charging is...
Depends on where. What country, at what time,...
@@BatteryLife the price you have shown in this video is very high. It is the cost of fuel: diesel would be cheaper, petrol slightly more expensive then in your video for the same route and driving style.
18kWh im Schnitt bei Autobahntempo 90.
Das ist ja ein Verbrauch, der sich mit der SUV-Riege messen kann...
Und wenn bei SOC 20% am HPC Lader mit 60 kW geladen wird, dann ist der id auch nicht gerade ein Ladewunder...
Soll das etwa so sein, dass man auf Langstrecken immer möglichst den Akku leer fährt um schnell zu laden???
Und über ne halbe Stunde von 29% auf 80% ist auch nicht wirklich rekordverdächtig...
Also BMS technisch haut mich der id definitiv nicht vom Hocker.
Lang lebe der Ioniq.
Bei 2 grad mit Heizung auf 24 grad. Ist das völlig ok. Im Sommer bei 90 km/h ohne AC hatte ich 129 Wh/km
Never buy any E car WITHOUT a Heat Pump. Its false economy. The Heat Pump is highly efficient and will not only give you much longer Driving Range in the winter, but it will allow you to heat the car continuously at 24 Degrees C. and it will add strong resale value in the future. always BUY the heat pump model car !
You don't really need to wear face masks if you're outside and keeping distance. 😀 Or is that some German law?
They probably robbed a bank afterwards ;-)
It is a facewarmer.
Making sure!
No we don't need to wear face masks if we're outside. But there are many internet warriors, so better wear a mask while shooting a video ;)
I don't really see a reason to not be careful
black car gets much hotter inside on a sunny day.
this test is wrong.
That is a misconception.
The German car club ADAC tested the difference in temp in cars with different colours. No difference on modern cars.
Leave it to the German company to make you pay extra!
How can it be that VW releases a car without heatpump? Talk about shooting yourself in the foot. Also, we dont have the time to waste energy, sustainable or not.
Northern european countries all get it with heatpump. Middle and southern can get it without.
From start is non sense.
You are comparing apples with pears.
Sling those mask in the bin and I will listen to you.
Grow up
For the love of god, just buy a bluetooth mic
Stupid face masks