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Joe Bennett on CNN: Did Ed Sheeran plagiarize "Let's Get It On?" (answer: no)
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- Опубліковано 29 кві 2023
- Professor Joe Bennett talks to CNN about the Ed Sheeran copyright infringement case, in which Sheeran is accused of copyright infringement due to allegedly plagiarising from Let's Get It On (1973, Gaye/Townsend) in the 2014 song Thinking Out Loud (Sheeran/Wadge). Prof Bennett shares the defendants' view that both songs are built on (similar but non-identical) chord progressions that have appeared in many songs across several decades.
joebennett.net
I’m sick of these lawsuits. There are a zillion songs out there and the odds are that some songs are going to sound similar. It’s ridiculous. Sick of the greed of people. So glad Ed won.
They found 104 songs with the same cord progression. Some predating let's get it on. So, who you gonna sue now?
@@Meagainx3 not picking sides here but can you give examples of songs that have used that same chord progression before let's get it on?
@@erikmachado4489 “Different Drum” Stone Poneys
“Live and Let Die” Paul McCartney
Just look up songs with the I-iii-IV-V chord progression.
@@erikmachado4489: I can name a couple of dozen, but you need to take me to court to find out.
@@SunnyHF-nf4bc thanks for the info. From what I have been reading as well. The inspiration also came from, "Crazy Love" by Van Morrison. But I appreciate the response.
So did Baa Baa Black Sheep infringed Twinkle Twinkle Little Star? 🤔
Doesn't matter. Both of them are public domain, meaning the songwriters and the estate died centuries ago so nobody can claim it.
Hahaha! I love this comparison.
And the alphabet song
A difference between, inspired work, and passing it off as your own.
Those are variations on the same French folk song. Mozart wrote 12 variations.
ua-cam.com/video/9jz49TX0Dn4/v-deo.html
Chord progressions cannot and should not be copyrighted. If that becomes the case, then pop for the last 40 years is in big trouble.
Good it should be that music suck
If the Blues I-IV-V Progressiion was copyrighted the Rolling Stones would be in a lot of trouble.
Correct and future pop music would be in jeopardy
He’s using the same drum pattern, bass style and similar BPM. Give me a break regarding chord progression.
@@tonyc8752 hahhaha wow, a music doctor is in the house hahahahaha. Sorry , but these People just want a cut from Ed's earnings, they are broke and need something to feed their families hahahha
A jury of "peers" in a case like this should be 100% a jury of musicians -- because fellow musicians are the peers of both parties in a case like this.
Just in case you missed it : the law suit against Ed Sheeran *was not brought by the family or estate of Marvin Gaye* . Ed *won* his 8 year defense against a case brought by *the family, estate and their artists rights management company of Marvin's co - writer on the song, Ed Townsend* . The reporting does not show any actual involvement of the family of Marvin Gaye• This case was nearly without merit, so I have no idea why Mr Sheeran was forced to miss his grandmother's funeral to defend himself ( trial was prolonged several days by motions from the other side's attorneys ).
This time there is no apparent connection with Marvin's family (but that is still unclear. However, every other time someone got sued they were the ones behind it and they were very public about it. So when I wrote they should pay that money back, that is what I was referring to.
Then if they didn't think the same way - they should have been supportive of Sheeran. But we didn't hear anything from them. Silence.
The comedy band, Axis of Awesome demonstrated this perfectly years ago in their piece, four chords, where they laid about 50 songs over one 4 chord pattern in just a few minutes.
I just came from Axis of Awesome.
Back when Jordan was a boy
Original compositions are MELODY & LYRIC. Chord progressions cannot and should not ever be copyrighted. Otherwise, all musicians and songwriters and producers should just shut down the music industry, forever. The GAYE family are over reaching again, just like "Blurred Lines". Modern music is still so young compared to classical music to potentially be destroyed in less than one century because of trying to own chords. No.
Exactly
Townsend family
@@rujackswing618 Bass line appeared in “You know my name” by the Beatles in the 1960s. So, did Ed Townsend steal that then?
The tempo and drum beat? 😂
The drum beat is a 4/4 groove with a simple syncopation on the kick.
And the tempo. Do I really need to address how absurd bringing that up was?
And the chord progression, appeared in the “Different Drum” by the Stone Poneys in 1967. Did Marvin Gaye steal that, too?
@@SunnyHF-nf4bc It doesn't Matter about the Chords or the Music.. It is the feel Sorry For Me & My Team Cause we are Stressed for Copping a lot of Folks music. I got a Family to Feed.... My Grand Mother's Whole Tribe were Shot Down By US Army, they were in the way.. Obama Wouldn't Give Indians Half of 24 Billion US Corps Stole From them..
All I Say is Prepare for the Storm that 's Coming.. Peace..
Planet Earth don't Care about any Songs..
@@rujackswing618 You really don’t get it, do you? The only thing unique about Let’s Get It On was Marvin Gaye’s vocals. Take Marvin Gaye’s vocals off, and you’re simply left with an extremely standard track for 1973.
WOW! CNN actually produced something worth watching. Well done, mateys.
Wow...I was thinking the exact same thing.
I was watching thinking it's gonna come anytime now.
But it didn't.
I feel like the black man was rooting for Mavin Gaye's estate to win, until he was proved that he was wrong.
They do not lie like fox"news"
I like this guy from CNN - he actually appears interested in his guests.
I would agree with you he seems to have a sincere curiosity that often is replaced with a ego or whatever
@@turkwendell6904 He does seem like a good dude and always seems to have a happy demeanor when called for.
Only after he got over the shock that their mashup was bullshit! I think he was expecting the professor to say that Sheeran absolutely did copy the Gaye track.
Not the same melody, just chords are similar... like thousands of other songs!
Liar
Just waiting for the descendants of Mozart to sue Bach at this point. Like Bach said, "there's only 12 notes" when he was accused.
Joe I appreciate your explanation which was so clear. I as well as many learned alot from that brief interview. I'm just curious who's making these claims. I'm a music lover and I can hear the chord progressions. As you said many pop songs uses. Good thing Ed didn't cave.
This is deceptive. They transposed the songs to the same key (they're not) to make them sound more similar.
Edit: I just heard the Berklee professor point this out, which is good. To the untrained jury ear, they would sound much more similar simply because they were played in the same key.
The Gaye estate won against Blurred lines and that was in a totally different key than the original. Like the professor said these lawyers play on the ignorance on the jury.
CNN sucks
Also, The second chord in the progression is different. "Thinking Out Loud" plays a MAJOR chord, where "Let's Get It On" plays a different MINOR one. The key has been transposed and since the ACTUAL tempo of "Thinking...." is 78bpm and the ACTUAL tempo of "Let's" is 83 bpm, they also equalized the tempo to make this fit. Tricks.... smoke and mirrors.
A quick consultation with a music professor would have prevented a lot wasted time and resources and an stress for an innocent person.
Look at the anchor's face when the expert said "absolutely not." It's so subtle but you can see it go from 🙂 to 😐 to 😠.
Great explanation, examples and nicely hosted.
Nicely explained, and what a lovely way to end the discussion. Townsends camp was trying to make a quic buck and very rightly, got shafted.
Professor forgot to mention another song with that similar loop - "When you say nothing at all" by Ronan Keating
Many songs use the same chord sequence, but only one has almost identical instrumentation, rhythm (down to the syncopated chords). Anyway I'm glad that there was no plagiarism (and I don't think there should be), but it's a little more than just using the same chord sequence.
The only thing that people think it "sounds" similar is the chords and the drum beat, and those are the very most simple chords and simple beat.
4 chords. That's all there is people.
Pop songs are not gonna sound super different.
New Miley.Cyrus song sounds like Bruno Mars. Bruno Mars sounds like a lot of 70's tunes.
"Sounds like" is not enough to accuse people of stealing.
Let the guy sing.
When he copies exact sound and melodies then there will be a case.
It's a chord progression. If Someone wants to copyright a chord progression than the whole music community is under threat
If only we had more time for segments like this on the news
@1:14 the disappointment in the black dude’s face is priceless hahahaha😈
Oh my he played the same chords well so did about 1 million other songs.
So, the anchor is fascinated. You could see in his face that he was dissappointed that Sheeran won this lawsuit.
Dont worry. He'll soon be following Don Lemon
Yes, he was clearly sideswiped when the professor said this is no way plagiarism. Perfectly making the point that a jury trial is a big risk. Ed did the same as the professor did, in court, and showed the jury multiple songs over the same chord sequence.
How could this even be a case or go to court? Nothing similar.
So....we still van play the I IV V .... without being sued?
Its just a chords progression,its not like ice ice baby where they copied the bass riff all through out the song
Yeah look up "axis of awesome 4 chord song" Literally all American pop music uses the same chords i - v - vi - iv. Same thing in Japan, but with the iv - v - iii - vi progression.
@@ztcr6 Give me a break
Then why aren't their a ton of lawsuits?
More dumb white people logic...lol
@@ztcr6 Where would a young song Writer of today get that R& B Style of Play.. He Play the Song LGIon to get the groove & then placed His words on top.. Not the whole song... But if he told the Truth on How he Created the Song he would lose.. Why should anyone lose sleep over a rich person fighting to Keep more money.. He is Not the Only One.. when singer can't Write they pull out the OLD 45 Hits & they ain't Sharin.. Peace...
ES has Too many songs that used Other folks Music... ESP Handmaid....
@@ztcr6 lol, the "idea" of what exactly?
@@ztcr6 What "IDEA" are you referring to? The lyrics and melodies are completely different.
The big question here is whether this is being driven by the greed of descendants rather than living artists: there have been a plethora of greed relatives chasing a payday. Artists seem not to do this unless it’s a really egregious rip off…
Very interesting. The same thing could be said of "Stay with Me" from Sam Smith and "I Won't Back Down" from Tom Petty and the Heartbreakers, which have commonplace elements
Chord progression is never a question of copyright. Melody is, note progression.
He said that United States doesn't use music experts on the Jury. Not exactly true. The public doesn't know if or if not. American Judicial system has Voir Dire, where the judge and attorney will ask questions to see if they are suitable to not have bias. Now depending on the Judge & Attorneys they may want all music experts, some or no music experts. Also you might have it settled by Arbitration or Mediation with expert(s) reviewing and presenting their takes on if/if not it's plagiarism.
It's true. You comparing apples and oranges.
This is bs. Its because blurred lines lawsuit worked so they tried it again SMH.
Completely different styles no infringement
So did Happy Birthday to You" infringed Good Morning To You"🤣
It seems to me that Marvin's no talent family is just making a living out of others hard work. Maybe people that used the same sequences before Marvin should sue them for all the royalties they have gotten through the years.
It wasn't Marvin's family who sued Ed Sheeran. It was the estate of Ed Townsend, Marvin's co-writer. That's the job of an estate, to protect assets.
So should he be sued for perfect vs amazing grace too? This is the outcome when work of art is translated to money making. These two songs are close but dissimilar. There are many songs out there when arranged in such a way creates perfect harmony as what was arranged. There is limited notes in a music scale yet zillion of songs already written. Why would we be surprise when two or more songs coincidentally are quite alike at certain point?
You can own words, but you cannot own chords. Not the case, then all of the musicians have infringed somehow. The chords were long there before any musician.
Wrong...Copyright is not just about WORDS. Bet you feel pretty STUPID.
we should all pay royalties to Mozart and Bach Familys for having composed every single harmony possible to use ..... ? Ridiculous
This is a problem inherent to music. Sing the ABC song that kids sing to learn their ABCs and sing Twinkle, Twinkle, Little Star and see if you notice any difference or similarity. Also, there are many, many songs that are so similar in beat, chord progression, etc., but those are the basic building blocks of songs. Saying no one else could ever use them is like someone saying using bricks in more than one building steals someone's idea. When you understand that there are only so many notes, so many chords, so many drumbeats, etc., or else the other possible patterns, they don't sound like music, which is why people don't try to make songs with them. This is also why so many songs sound so similar.
This Court Case just Made a Bunch of Future Dance Floors Rock Even better tho.
Totally different.
Marvin Gaye’s family needs to relax.
Ed Sheeran doesn’t need to copy anybody’s music. Period
You already typed a full stop.
He does though quite evidently😂😂😂😂
@@asmichl31 so what other song has he stolen, according to you.
@@davidroyl2241 there is another video on it😂 but no scrubs is one of them if you are wanting a quick name
But he did. So there’s that!
yes it is copy right infringement. Let's Get It On is a R&B and Thinking out Loud is a Pop song they should sound so similar with two different genre's. If both were pop song them the match up would be common
Oh dear
Marvin Gaye DID NOT invent the I, IV, V chord change. If Sheeran lost this case, music would change forever.
I wouldn't have put these songs together at all
The family of Marvin Gaye is damn greedy..
Facts
No, they're actually protecting his estate because recording artists will and have sampled his music without getting clearance
You just don’t like the idea of blacks getting money. Just admit it. You probably say ghetto lottery when a cop kills a black for no reason. You don’t send your condolences you start to pocket watch.
Except his family had nothing to do with this suit, it was the family of the guy who produced the song.
How about you do even 10 seconds of research before saying things you know nothing about.
@@seitanman4146 that proves my point. He’s just against blacks getting any kind of restitution
Theyre sorta similar but they arent. But there is all kinds of music, of even different genres, that share the same rhythm and bass lines that are completely different tunes.
This was an ace segment
Such a stupid lawsuit. I hope the Gaye foundation had to pay back ALL of the lawyer fees
There's only so many chords. And actually, the 2nd chords are different, technically. Gaye is playing an F#minor chord, and Sheeran is playing a D/F#....... DIFFERENT!!!!
They are not even close. Its so different
Not even close. How lame. So glad the jury got it correct
Not the same chords 😮😮
If he's copied the chords like hundreds of other song's which has been proven then why not if he copied the words then that's different.
2:49 "Thinking Out Loud"
2:55 "Let's Get it On"
3:24 The Marvin Gaye progression. Interesting lesson
Thanks bro and good call
How would you call 1000 lawyers (i would add bankers and politicians) at the bottom of the sea?
A good start...
Tons of artists today are looping other artists sounds and using them as part of their own. This is more common then snacking at night.
Yeah right! And "If I had A Hammer" for more examples
Hello CNN.... Look who won the case. You should have reported on the shady history of the person who filed that lawsuit...but u would'nt 😅
well Kandi Burruss had to chase him down for using the No Scrubs sample on Shape of You, lol
Not the case! Sheeran's team reached out to Kandi prior to release. It was agreed and all writers were credited and receive their due royalties. Its documented as part Sheerans writing process, he has a team looking at similarities due to all the copyright shite!
@@trickyrickymtb5622 To clarify, per info in the Judge's ruling in the UK "Shape" /"Oh Why" trial where the "No Scrubs" situation was discussed as similar fact evidence in detail, THERE IS NO INTERPOLATION OF 'NO SCRUBS" in "Shape of You" anyone who reads music can clearly see that.
What REALLY happened was INITIALLY Ed wanted to INTENTIONALLY interpolate a bit of melody and include the phrase "TLC on the Jukebox" in Shape. He had his team make an official request to TLC's team for clearance BEFORE THE RELEASE OF "SHAPE" . TLC's team did NOT immediately respond to Ed's team's request for clearance.
Since he didn't have a response to the request, he REMOVED the proposed interpolation in the initial draft of the song and replaced it with a DIFFERENT melody and changed the lyric to "Van the Man on the Jukebox".
When he eventually released the song without the interpolation or the lyrics he believed clearance was no longer necessary, (the judge in the UK case agreed it shouldn't have been required). However, TLC COMPLAINED they still wanted credit and royalties even though the interpolation and lyric WAS NOT USED, their complaint spawned the internet smear campaign of Sheeran by TLC fans making accusations of "theft" of "No Scrubs", like the pathetic video of the girl pounding chords on a piano singing the meshed lyrics... which proved nothing other than the progressions were similar. TLC knew of Sheeran's earnest request for clearance and his decision to remove the interpolation when he hadn't received their Team's response in time, yet TLC never defended him against the "theft" accusations from their fans because it gave them leverage to get the $$$ they wanted.
In the end, Sheeran gave TLC credit and generous royalties and he received official clearance from TLC though none was really necessary. To this day, people keep making the baseless accusation that Sheeran "stole" the melody of "No Scrubs" He didn't even use it. It is disconcerting that Kandi and TLC never publicly defended Sheeran and to this day never admitted what REALLY happened. $$$ is all that matters to some I suppose.
@@mgray7927 correct, my point exactly, he wasn't 'chased down' as the OP misleadingly suggested.
Love this explanation! Still sounds very similar 😂
Im not a fan of Sheeran. I think he’s overhyped, but I dont think its stolen music. There are zillions of songs. Somewhere sometime some of these tunes will inevitably have similarities at some point. Basically, when i heard Sheerans song the first time, MarvinGayes song never came to mind.
Ed found songs using the same/similar chord progressions that came out before Marvin Gaye. So was Gaye plagiarising 🤔
I hope that host does not claim to be a journalist or a music expert.
This is a discrace leave ed sheeran alone he is a true musician who doesn't have to copy anyone ❤
rhythms, beats, half beats, quarter beats cannot be copyrighted. and itsxa FORM OF INTELLIGENCE to be able to distinguish between same or similar rhythm and musical notes.
same with re: SPEAKING and I've *seen* dishonest people use the fact the far too many people do NOT possess that kind of intelligence and the use this against the masses in a few different ways, one being they'll speak with a certain rhythm, cadence, 'singing' their untrue sentence/speaking in the way a truthful person would say it in a natural way.
another example I just saw a few weeks ago, another twist on how many people are easily fooled by cadence combined with music notes or people who know how to use their 'normal' speaking voice or their 'normal' excited speaking voice in a dishonest fashion:
2 scammers were being confronted by someone who spoke a 💯% truth about what the scammers did and when the scammers began talking again they pretended that what the honest guy said was proof that they had 'owned' him.
because they claimed, as they pointed at him on the video screen, hooted and hollered and bounced up & down in their chairs, they claimed he had just made many mistakes with what he said. they were behaving the way some *honest* people would when an honest person catches thieving scammers lying and if finally vindicated.
and I don't even know if it has an official name, the technique but many actors use the same skill set when they want to emphasize something they're saying to offer up a certain kind of effect.sone comedians do this, too for effect.
and many years ago I knew a very narcissistic, mentally ill person who was always 'acting.' she had a habit of trying to look a certain way to people who could *see* her but were too far away to actually hear, clearly anyway, what she was sayin. just to give an example of *her* brand of weirdness because it's truly one of the most bizarre things I've ever witnessed in a person.
and I guess she didn't mind doing it to me and a few other supposed 'good friend's of hers when *we* could hear her and were still dumb teens ourselves - and for whatever's reason in moments like that we were each a captive audience..due to whatever odd circumstances we found ourselves in..and me and the other people even talked once about how it seemed like she was orchestrating 'trapping' us in ways that gave her those opportunities. since we had to see her ever day at school and in our very small community where we all lived.
and we thought maybe she didn't mind acting weird like that with us maybe because we'd known each other most of our lives and she was just too comfortable? I do not know:
but she would be talking about, say, what she had that morning for breakfast *but* she *BEHAVED* as if she was an authority reprimanding someone..with her hands on her hips or pointing at someone, wagging her finger in their face or gesticulating in some other way. so a far away person could hear her but only really the pattern of her speech more than the detailed words.
and I know it's a strange comparison re: the Sheeran case but because it's such a similar issue re: how people use the 'music' of their voice that's what it reminded me of.🫤
No
You knew he was going to say "absolutl;y not" as soon as the question was asked, besides who needs his opinion anyway when i have my ears to tell me. Imagine the backlash if the prof had called him out, probably be clearing his desk and being escorted out.
Wasn't let's get it on ripped off too from even earlier songs? Didn't Marvin have to go to court for copyright? So now it's not how original it was. Although great song but stop !
SIMILAR and SAME is different!
Same groove, that's all.
Liar
They have totally different vibe...
If this copyrighted infringement? Lol Bollywood would sue everyone as they cover alllll the tunes in classical music 😂😂😂
My song made it to cnn.
Axis of awesome brought me here
I say no
from do re mi ... you cant create a billions of songs
is this a 4 chords song
Nope.
@@morganross6399 but didn't Ed Sheeran say it's a four chord song
@@turkwendell6904Are you referring to Let's Get It On, which doesn't have a chorus. Thinking It Out Loud has a chorus which uses other chords.
There missing THE ROOT of The Song !!!....any Music goes by Those ROOTS !!
Reminds of that lawsuit Jay z had for the song “big pimpin”
They paid for the sample the family got greedy and wanted more 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
progression and percussion should be off limits. Lyrics and melody should be the only sections that should be IP.
Spoken like a true white person...
Totally different tune. But really close.
Totally not close at all. The melodies are completely different. The similarity is the chord progression. And even that is not the exactly the same.
People dont understand 4chords can sing any songs ..only musicians can understand...this chords are way use before...for people who don't understand music....better start learn its way better more then 4 chords.....i dont knw y this fucker have to sue edseeran.....his just talent...thats all....stop looking for unnecessary drama or attentions....he works hard for that song
Yup, so many of these people crying foul obviously do not have a proper music education.
Lawyers shouldnt be allowed near music.
Cool. Now play Earth Angel
U can clearly hear it
1:02 not the same at all, different key, different melodic line, you can play any 3 or 4 popular songs of any genre, style, and they will sound similar. Why? Because hit songs appeal in the same way, and they inspire more songs. Terre are only so many beats in music, and only so many chord progressions. Blues all use the same ones, country the same, pop the same. The lawsuit was bullshit money grab.
The miusic industry needs some type of software like "Shazam", that reports how similar one piece of music is to another and what parts are covered by copyright and what parts are not.
No, it does not.
You think they don’t
They have it and it shows he stole let's get it on...
@@msp5138 Then they should have presented this evidence at the trial, because Sheeran showed the chord progression was used in many songs that were around before "Let's Get It On" was written.
@@MrSitemaster2 It is Not about the Chords.. He took his guitar in & Manipulated folks who don't know Music.. That Chord thing is a Lie.. They sued for what was on the Recording.. MC Hammer Made Rick James Rich again from Rick's Bass Line.. Not Melody Or Words... He built a Song Using Marvin's Music.. I don't think it is Wrong.. But he will do it again & again.. this is how he Writes.. By using OPP to build New Material...
He Has a Hold Gang of Songs that Belong to Other People Property first... Why would he Play LGIon @ his Concerts...
He'll Laugh His Butt all the way to the BANK...
CONGRATS ed Sheran. That's a REBUKE to those filing copyright case with a HUGE AMOUNT! Rebuke to the MONEY LAWYERS. Worst is they must pay the LAWYER of Ed, imagine for 8 yrs.... KARMA.
This is funny.they really need money.
So the fuck what the words are totally different
Stupid stupid stupid case !! Ppl trying to get rich off making up cases to appear as fraud. They should be sued for the acquisition.
It’s the no name artists with no talent who borrow cord sequences. But then again compare to movie industry… similar movies come out at same times always copy ideas. How come they are not sued?
Marvin Gaye’s estate must be drying up they need some extra cash flow lol
#heresthething
Don’t sound anything alike