Iver Johnson vs Colt: 1911 38 Super Shootout!
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- Опубліковано 15 вер 2024
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Great video! Thanks for showing the 38 super some much needed love. In today’s world of high speed bullets and high tech ammunition the 38 super gets left out. Can’t wait for more.
I just really like that cartridge. Thanks for watching!
Me too, it’s always been one of my favorites. I carried my Colt government model Super 38 for years. I just recently stopped carrying it. I’ve hunted with it as well with success. Well anyway thanks again.
Pretty cool. Thnx.
I have two, both 1911A1's, one Auto-Ordnance Corp and one Rock Island Armory, both shoot very well. The Auto-Ordnance now belongs to my youngest son, the Rock Island is mine. I've found that the 147 grain Hornady XTP feeds with out any problems at a velocity of 1050, (average), velocity. I like it.
I have an RIA in .38 Super. I was able to find ammo for it during the last ammo shortage when 9mm was not available. I love the cartridge and it's history. My theory of ammo diversity served me well. Loved the video!
Thanks Mike! Watch for more videos on this pistol/cartridge coming soon.
Great video! This is one of the only gun channels that I actually always watch the whole video. Always great content.
Thank you!
Hello h r. When you started laughing when you drove that tack with the Iverson Johnson I was laughing with you! Well done devil dog! Don day
Nice Target Sponsorship HrFunk 😀😇😀👍🏼
Thanks Chris! I'm pretty excited about it. I hope I can talk them into implementing some of my target ideas.
Well done on that tack! There's definitely something special about this caliber. I think a new rear sight will give that IJ a new lease on life.
I've got one on the way. Watch for an update in the future!
Thanks for the video! I have a Colt 1911 .38 Super that a purchased new in 2013. It is a great gun and cartridge combo. I've taken it out to the Linebaugh shoot in Cody WY and was hitting plates at 230 yds standing unsupported regularly. Fantastic cartridge!
I think so too. It’s amazing that it isn’t more popular.
I know the name's been sold, but as an Arkansan, I enjoyed seeing the Iver Johnson perform so well. Iver Johnson used to be headquartered in Jacksonville, Arkansas. Great video!
Thank you!
My Dad loved his Colt 1911a1 chambered in .38 Super. His opinion was the 9mm was for kids.
Very nice handguns all of it love I have a iver 38 super and a ria 38 super love the 1911 thanks señor god bless you
Gracias Jose!
First off to ER JG: NICE GUN! That is sexy. Thank you for sharing that with us. Cadillac.
When I evaluate the results on a target I am not as concerned about the elevation or High-to-Low on it as I am the width of the group. Even if it is low, maybe in the 8 ring, is it still within the right-to-left boundaries of the 10 ring side-to-side? We're looking for consistency, and then we can fix whatever the problems are, as long as we have consistency can can diagnose the elevation issue. I think the Tanfoglio needs more round put through it and I half expect that the groups will tighten up.
Good video, good shooting. Nice targets!
Thanks Frank. I was thinking the same thing about the Tanfoglio.
Hi. Howard
Excellent vídeo
Thanks Paulo. I’m glad you liked it.
@@hrfunk Very interesting targets. Size is real. Brazilian Federal Police targets are so small, shoulder width is just 20 inches
I have a long standing love for the 38 Super. A few companies produce defensive ammunition for it now. My favorites are the ones with the Barnes all copper hollowpoint. Very impressive in gell.
I have had good results with the SIG V-Crown in 38 Super. It pushes the bullet fast enough to give consistent expansion results. My handloads at reasonable book velocities give wicked results with XTPs. The additional velocity over a 9mm or 9mm +P ensures good bullet performance without over-pressuring the gun.
Another excellent video from you. I really look forward to Wednesdays and Saturdays.
Thanks Bob!
Back in my day in LE there’s a lot of talk in those days about more officers being shot by women and by men. The theory was that men sort of let their guard down when they’re dealing with a woman in one way or another. I don’t know if that still true or whether it was even true back then. But during my time in the one officer I knew that was shot and killed was shot by a woman.
Since the focus of the video was 38 super, it would have been nice to see the cartridges.
I showed them previously when I reviewed the HOP .38 Super. Here’s a link: ua-cam.com/video/MM59Agxv0eQ/v-deo.html
@@hrfunk Thanks, How would this compare to a 10mm for penetration I wonder. Are you going to buy one of those 1911 in .38?
I’m doing some trading with HOP for the Iver Johnson. I may well produce a very non-scientific penetration test in the future.
I completely agree with you about the Colt!!!!
When you were shooting from the bench, you could just see the fine quality of the bluing as it reflected the light!
I’m not sure when that thing was made but the finish was great and it was marked “Super 38.” My best guess is 1950’s.
Just a work of firearm fine art!
Nice job . Yeah , pretty hard to figure out why that Johson was shooting that low .
My best guess is they put the same sights on it that they use on the .45.
@@hrfunk Yeah , that makes sense .
First things first. Yes I did enjoy watching this video, but to be honest. I can't remember watching one of your videos that I didn't enjoy. I have a problem, 1911s keep following me home. The good news is there is no 12 step program for my problem, if there is please don't tell me. So far 17 of them have found homes in my accumulation of things that go bang. Number 16 is a 6" Iver Johnson Eagle XL, that I bought as a companion piece for my 7" AMT HARDBALLER. Build quality seems quite nice and the trigger pull is very good. Better than either of my Colts. But they are both series 80s. My IJ is in 45 as is the HARDBALLER. I have yet to get either of them to the range. But your results with your IJ give me great hope. My only 38 Super is a single stack RIA that is a joy to shoot. I discovered that the 9mm barrel and recoil spring from my double stack RIA 22TCM/9mm fits in my 38 Super and when I asked my gunsmith his opinion, he examined it and told me it should work just fine. So many projects so little range time. As long as you keep producing them, I will keep enjoying them. I'm retired Army. I once went with my post pistol team to Quantico to show the Marine team there how it's done. I would like to tell you how we beat them without mercy. I would like to tell you that, but I cannot tell a lie. They beat us like rented mules. But then they took us out to dinner at a very fine Seafood restaurant. Semper Fi Marine.
Thanks Doug! I hope you never find a cure for your addiction!
Interesting! Other than sight adjustment, that IJ did surprisingly well. The .38 Super has always been a bit controversial, with frequent debates about accuracy, discussion of whether specific guns headspace on extractor or case mouth, but the potential is there.
I really like the cartridge and the IJ definitely demonstrates its accuracy potential.
That Iver Johnson is a keeper. I have an Iver Johnson XL 6" that I converted to 460 Rowland. It now shoots almost a foot high, so I'll be replacing the front sight with a taller post. My groups, even with 45 ACP, are not nearly as tight as yours.
I'm doing some horse tradind with HOP, and I'll be keeping the IJ. I already have a new rear sight on the way.
@@hrfunk Good for you.
Someday I will have a .38 Super Colt, someday
Don’t wait too long. You’re missing out!
Sir, I opine that .38 Super is an excellent cartridge for self-defense, especially when loaded with either Speer Gold Dot 124-gr bullets (Product No. 3998) at 1,350-fps or the 147-gr bullets (Product No. 4002) at 1,150-fps muzzle velocities. The cartridge maximizes the potential of both bullets in handguns without resorting to the use of a PCC.
Those sound like great loads Chris. The 124 grain velocity matches what I get with my own handloads (but I use a Nosler JHP). HOP Munitions manages to get another 30-50 fps with their 124 grain bullets. I’m be a big fan of the 38 Super and it’s capable of outstanding performance when loaded to its potential.
Thanks for a super quick response. I just checked the Iver Johnson website and they don't list the .38 super, I wonder if it is a special order. The base price .45 is about $200. over the RIA base .45. I don't remember seeing you do a video on RIA but I have seen others that rate the guns pretty well. I've owned Colt's series 70s in .38 super, 10 mm, and .45 and loved them, the only problems I ever experienced was with reloads bought at gun shows, but wit any name brand ammo they were great. My first pistol bought after discharge from the Army was a new 1911.
You're welcome. Looks like I reviewed my RIA pistol back in the summer of 2019. Here's a link to the video: ua-cam.com/video/iFBcR9o6PGE/v-deo.html
Have you ever looked at the Guncrafter Industries 1911 chambered in .50GI?
No. That doesn’t sound familiar.
What are your thoughts on the Rock Island vs Iver Johnson, fit, finish, quality? Really like your channel.
Thank you, Ed! The finish on this pistol is utilitarian. Considering the quality I see in the rest of the firearm, it would appear that's where they spent a good deal of their money in production. They do offer a variety of different finishes, including some fairly radical designs, but this one is basic parkerizing. Not surprisingly, the more nicely finished pistols cost a bit more.
I would rate the Iver Johnson higher in the fit and overall quality. I have an RIA, and it’s a good pistol, but I think the IJ is a little more tightly fit and it seems to be more accurate.
Thank you hrfunk. During the first 23yds accuracy shoot, the Iver Johnson had me wondering -- "how good is that group that's just off-camera?" Was thinking the sights might be off, you proved my guess correct and the pistol was very accurate.
Does that Colt have many rounds through it, vs the Iver Johnson? Could that explain the more Cadillac smoothness?
On the Tanfoglio -- I hear those are CZ 75 clones geared to competition. Have you shot CZ 75 pistols much? I wonder how they compare to 1911s, that's why I ask.
PS that was great work with the marksman's hold on the tack driving. Bravo!
Thanks Sean. I have no idea how many rounds that Colt has cycled. I think the smoothness comes from when it was made, though. It came from an era when there was still a lot of hand-fitting done by Colt.
I do own a CZ75 as well as a P01 (essentially a compact 75). They are great pistols in their own right. The Tanfoglio appeared to be a very high quality copy of the competition CZ’s.
@@hrfunk Thank you. Your pleasure in shooting that loaned Colt was clear both when you were shooting, and when you were talking about it. I liked your joking, "yes, I will give it back" because I was thinking you would like to hang onto it a bit longer!
How would you describe the differences between a 1911 and a CZ 75, from your perspective? Ergonomic, function, etc. I've yet to fire or handle a 75, but did get to shoot a P01 that was very impressive. It had been smithed though, wasn't stock. But that trigger was buttery.
The stock CZ75 (and the P01 for that matter) have a fairly smooth D/A pull and a pretty clean S/A, but it’s likely that neither will match the feel of the tuned model you were shooting. The ergos of the 75 are very good. The grip feels like it was designed for my hand and the muzzle points very naturally for me. I’ve always found them to be very accurate as well. It’s hard to compare it to a 1911 because I’m such a fan of them (the 1911 that is). In general, I would say the CZ feels better in the hand and it has a lower bore axis to help reduce muzzle flip. The 1911 will usually have a better trigger and (depending upon the specific pistol in question) I think it (the 1911) is a little more accurate.
@@hrfunk Very nice, thoughtful observations. I truly appreciate it. Thank you hrfunk.
Interesting presentation. Speaking of targets, I recall in my former life having to deal with a high level inquiry concerning the use of photo targets depicting kids. Apparently there was a company out there that had used kids in hostage targets. Well needless to say we didn’t have any but boy talk about the proverbial crap hitting the fan. It really shed some light to my lower level guys on how careful you have to be with things as basic as buying targets or even using samples of targets that someone might find objectionable and how this can be used by detractors against your interests to achieve their political objectives.
You've got to love these modern times.
I really enjoyed this video, possibly because I am so .38 Super inexperienced , but principally because it was so much fun. My uncle retired from the Air Force in (approximately) 1962 and soon thereafter retired to Mexico. I can’t verify the truth of the following information, however he reported 1911A1’s chambered for .38 Super were extremely popular and widely carried, because Mexican law prohibited ordinary citizens from using “military caliber” handguns (which, of course, included the .45 ACP).
Thanks Roy. Your uncle's information was/is correct. I had a lot of fun with this video. It's probably one of my favorites from the last several months. I hope everyone else enjoys it too.
I remember in Mexico in the mid - 80's non-military weaponry WAS the Law.... But of course The Sinaloa's never did follow rules or Laws.
Wait.... the Iver Johnson Arms are currently in production? I thought they stopped making them like 10 years ago. Well that's awesome news. Iver Johnson was a pretty good company. I used to own an IJ M1 carbine and it was excellent, especially for what it was. I hope the new Iver Johnson Arms lives up to the name!
The name is still around, but obviously the company is different. I saw their booth at the NRA show last week so they’re definitely still around. Aside from a problem with the sight regulation, the one IJ pistol I own is pretty good.
Good shooting and good shooting guns...
On the Iver Johnson...you may want to check the barrel fit. Put three rounds into the magazine with the headstamp on the rounds all the same way. Shoot all three rounds and check to see where the firing pin strike is in relation to the center of the primer. If it is low then the barrel lugs are going too far up into the slide lugs causing misalignment with the slide/sights. I just had the same thing happen to me fitting a Colt Defender 9mm with a .38 Super barrel.
Was wondering what year your Colt SUPER .38 was made...
I’m not sure. It was definitely an older pistol.
If is older than 1990 and still has the original headspace on the case rim barrel you may want to replace it with one that headspaces on the mouth. You will be amazed how much more accurate it is.
My 1969 went from 3' patterns at 50 yards to 3" groups with only the addition of a BarSto barrel.
I also have several guns with the same set of MMC sights as on your Colt...
That pistol, as I mentioned in the video, does not belong to me. If it did, I don’t think I would alter it.
@@hrfunk ...new barrel will drop in without any alteration of the gun. Can be pulled right out and the original put back in.
I do consider the 1911 to be out dated. But I would like to have one in .38 super.
That iver Johnson was very impressive for out of the box condition!
I thought so too.
I've heard that the Winchester 9 x 23 is the rimless equivalent of the 357 Magnum. It doesn't seem to have caught on though. The 38 Super is just fine for me. I have a Colt 1911A1 Series 70 made in 1975. Nothing like a Cadillac! // Also, I have the same problem with my Win. 9422 lever action rifle (made in 1999), as you have with your Iver Johnson 1911A1. Windage, left to right, my rifle is excellent, but it keeps putting my groups 6 inches below my sight picture. The rear sight is just not able to go any higher, nor the front sight any lower. Time for the gunsmith!
Groo here
Hr , the Target gun may be one that does not like to be benched [I have some] Dont let the but touch or strike the rest, dont grip with the support hand.
Rather , push the shooting INTO the support hand and push both hands into the bag I have had very good luck at 100 yds using same.
I enjoyed this video!! I don't have any 38 super firearms, but I got a lot out of this video. Very clear precise and informative!!. I have a friend that has a Tangfolio and it shoots well, but I have not shot it for a long time, so I cannot honestly tell you how well for a comparison. Your video on this was very sharp and clear. I almost felt I was right next to you throughout the whole video!!!!
You seem to be getting more relaxed and are having a better smoother flow throughout your videos. I sensed you enjoyed making this video and Hope that guy gets his colt back eventually.
This is not meant to be a critique of your videos!! Just my impression and the enjoyment I received!! Keep making great videos!!
Thank you! (I did return that Colt, grudgingly)
Well done Marine. Your new sponsor has a new customer.
Thank you!
I'm willing to bet the IJ pistol had .45 acp sights installed on it.
I was thinking the same thing.
File that front sight down on that IJ and it will be one hell of a shooter.
I found another solution: ua-cam.com/video/701sddesW9A/v-deo.html
I have a spectacular astigmatism that naturally placed my shots low and to the left, much like the Iver Johnson...I took my Comp/Carry Springfield 1911A1 .45 ACP to a master gunsmith who worked at Aberdeen Prov. Ground Museum Md. as a small arms expert. He milled a Bar-Sto Adj. Rear Sight on. He had me adjust it to my "good eye" and put it in a BEHEMOUTH steel vice rest with a barrel laser, and then ran 9 shots with three different targets (27 shots) All hit the left edge of center, he took a Kennedy Coin and covered one large torn hole on each. It WAS the rear sight. So... it's most likely is the Iver's rear sight....Excellent Grouping, though!!!🎯🏆
I’ve got a new rear sight on the way. Stay tuned for an update!
@@hrfunk 👍 Good Luck...on the right track.✅
👍👍good shooting with all three and I like the targets, especially the one with the woman 😂😂
That Iver looks real tight just a sight issue, bet a little experimentation could get it even tighter, some guns the harmonics are just right from the factory.
A new rear sight is on the way. Stay tuned.
Another great video! Your results with the Colt pretty much mirror what I experienced with the minty four digit s/n original commercial model I owned back in the 70's. Beautiful piece, but then, ammo was mighty tough to come by.
I was wondering about the Tanfoglio, especially the way the piece headspaces. A lot of competition pieces that are built up for the Super have chambers cut so that the round headspaces on the rim, instead of the mouth, and they also cut a 'tighter' chamber, that is, closer to minimum dimensions, that can sometimes make the pieces a bit fussy about ammunition. I also noticed that the Italian Job really started perking up after the bore got fouled up a bit, making me wonder what it would do with a bit more trigger time.
Just a few thoughts.....
Truthfully, I sort of wondered the same thing. That pistol belongs to the owner of HOP munitions, and I really don't know how much it was fired prior to this video. Same as you, I noticed it was shooting much better at the end of the video. I keep wondering if the accuracy and functioning issues we saw early on were simply from a lack of "break in."
Curiously, not a single one of those targets on that website depicts a likely assailant. Must be a coincidence.
@peter The funny thing is they do have one person... of a darker complexion, but it's a 60+ year-old male with a gray beard.
Yep, I have never seen a target depicting a "non-white" assailant. No racism here.
I have seen quite a few, but they are less common these days.
About the Colt, I am certainly not an expert and I can only speak of them from my experience in the Old Corps and one ParaOrd. To me it seems when you fire a 1911 you can feel its mechanical operation and not just the recoil and a smooth running 1911 is mechanical joy. Poly pistols just make bang and for the most part that is good enough.
Outstanding Howard I had a Colt Silver Cup I wish I had kept it. That 38 Super is a good cartridge I did a lot of reloading for it also, on bowling pin shoots it did as well as the .45 & 9mm. All 3 calibers cleared the table of all pins. A set of XS sights (BIG dots) would work well on the Iver Johnson Pistol. I think they should add Asian, Blacks and Hispanic Male and female targets 15 years old to 75 years old to represent all people from all walks of life not just White people but I won't play my Race card because I don't have one.
Love the tack test😎
the frame I saw a female agressor target I knew someone would freak out...
Good morning HR. Another good comparison video. I bet the other 2 guns would have done better on the tack. I'd have a hard time sending that Colt back.
38 Super is a caliber I never tried. At one time though I had a barrel and dies for the 38/45, 45 acp necked down to.357. Cases were a pain in the butt to form. It did give very impressive performance with 125 gr. hollow points. That was long before the 357 Sig. Thanks for the video and have a great weekend.
Same to you John. Thanks for watching!
The 38 Super is still a great cartridge after a century. My RIA 38 Super is very accurate, even out to 40 yards. Replaced the gov't style sights with Trijicon tritium sights, big improvement. Wouldn't swap or sell it for anything.
It's really held it's own hasn't it? The only weakness is the rim and the case doesn't have a lot of extra strength for hot loads. That's why the 9x23 Winchester was created. Both great cartridges!
@@telesniper2 Even at NAMMI pressures, the 38 Super+P is only matched (barely) by an unregulated 9mm +P+, and that is only in loads dangerously over pressured and not approved by any gun maker. Never had case pressure problems with my 38 Super or handloads, but I don't try to push them to the max on the handload charts, just up to about 95%. And the 38 Super handles the heavier bullets better than the 9mm.
HR , what is the difference between 38 super and 9 by 23? You should try a Colt Competition in 38 super.
I would have to consult my reference materials to be certain, but the .38 Auto case (also used for the Super) is semi-rimmed. The 9X23 is a rimless case intended to function better in more modern pistols.
Very nice shooting!!,I like this Iver Johnson pistol very much!! May be with factory sights this gun is POA=POI,by the way ib my Remington R1 1911 GM I have to sim high besarse front sight is too high (POI 3,54" los at 22yds)!!
Yes, you need a slightly higher rear sight. You could also file down the front sight a bit, just be careful not to bake off too much.
@@hrfunk I Will file front sight some .6 to .8mm that are my calculations, thank you for your advice!!
2:33 "...(Armscor) is a little bit more mild..." It's literally 12% lower power factor lol that's a big difference! The first one was over 170 power factor, which is major power in both IPSC and USPSA, whereas the second one was only 150 power factor, which is still at least minor power factor, but not even close to major.
Right. i didn't chrono it, but I have a feeling it wasn't even reaching the publsihed velocity. It felt pretty mild. The good newis is that it functioned well and it's good enough for range use.
The problem is the armscor ammo I have the same issues with my 3 38 super and they are new if I use different ammo no issues
Maybe so. I haven't shot enough of that ammo to be able to offer an opinion.
Thanks for your informative videos. You do a thorough job of giving us some real comparisons
Thank you James!
It is pronounced Tan-fo-lio--the gli in Italian is typically pronounced in a manner similar to the Welsh ll: shape the tongue to say li, then puff a breath around in the process of saying it.
Thank you. My understanding of the Italian language starts and stops with pizza.
I saw that female target and my first thought was that lady that had so much trouble with that. I guess in her world, women were incapable of bad actions. Hopefully the feedback she got made her rethink that (dangerous) position.
That IJ pistol looks like a great pistol for the price.
The only other cartridge that should ever be chambered in a 1911. 😁
The secret to an accurate .38 Super is to ignore the useless "semi-rim" and treat it as a rimless cartridge and headspace it on the mouth of the case. For some reason, Browning's earlier cartridge designs (.25 ACP, .32 ACP and .38 ACP) were semi-rimmed. Perhaps because of earlier handgun design considerations or maybe he though he could grab some of the revolver market also. 🤷♂
By 1905 he figured out the rim wasn't needed, and the .45 ACP and .380 ACP aren't hindered by it.
Colt just upped the loading of the .38 ACP and kept everything else about the case the same. Probably compounding a mistake.
I wonder if, early on, machining tolerances couldn't be kept tight enough to allow headspacing on the case mouth?
@@hrfunk I don't know. Despite being a 1911 and Browning aficionado, I have never read why Browning's earlier cartridges were semi-rimmed and later ones were rimless.
I always surmised *maybe* he thought the case mouth wasn't sufficient to headspace on OR *maybe* he thought he would add a semi-rim that wouldn't hinder feeding in a semi-auto and give revolver manufacturers a reason to pick up the cartridges?
In any case, it was really balls-y of Colt to juice up the .38 ACP and rely on people to read labels and not fire .38 Super in .38 ACP handguns. I guess, in 1929, people could still read and follow label instructions.
@@garyK.45ACP it could be also that, up until that point, metallic cases had pretty much all headspaced on the case rim. The 9mm Luger cartridge is one of the first examples of a rimless case I can think of. News traveled slower in those days. Maybe it took JM a few years to hear about it.
@@hrfunk Probably. The .25, .32, and .38 ACP all came out before the 9mm. The .45 and .380 ACP came after.
I think you are right that the 9mm was the first rimless, straight case (though somewhat tapered) to headspace on the case mouth.
Well Mudd, good as always.
Looks like that IJ might be a good buy.
Always had a soft spot for the Super, does well and gives that little bit extra over the 9 to let me drive the heavier bullets that I prefer.
Sorry you were subjected to the dingbat.
The photo type targets are the best. There is a certain amount of programming necessary to get your mind right, and they help a lot.
I agree. Thanks for watching!
Thanks for the thoughts. I have heard Springfield is going to dis continue their GI Mil spec which would leave the Garrison as their bottom choice, and at current mrsp of $868. I've seen one of the Girsan models advertised around $350, and seen some positive reviews. Unfortunately I am now fully retired and I have to work on a budget. I also remember seeing Kimbers for under $800. Thanks, have a great day.
Do not worry about your Target Trolls. She must not be a equal opportunity type of person?
You provide great presentations all the time. I look forward to your presentations.
The precision out of box with the factory sights vs the accuracy is to me not a big deal. The sights can be dealt with.
The 38 Super is nearly like having Semi Auto 357 Magnum in my book. Of course along came the 357 Sig. The 357 Sig is like shooting a laser beam out of a P226.
The 38 Super is a cartridge that gets pooh poohed a lot by some. My only grip is when I miss a pc of 38 Super brass in the 9MM bucket and it messes up the reloading cycle.
One of my grail guns is a Colt Commander in 38 Super with the factory electroless nickel finish.
I can only imagine shooting a Thompson SMG in 38 Super?
When I was we lad. In Scheels in Fargo they had a set of Sig 220s with european heel mag release aka Browning BDA's.....one in 9MM one in 38 Super & 45 ACP. Always wondered why Sig did not market the 220 in 38 Super?
I think the market swayed so heavily in favor of the 9mm that most manufacturers just went that direction. Were it not for the fact that competitive shooters started using it in the 80s and 90s, the Super would probably not be here today.
@@hrfunk Yeah you are on with the Marketing the 9MM. It is just funny how Bill Wilson built his business on the 1911 in 45 and then comped guns in 45 and 38 super and now the business just about caters to every 9MM platform out there. Sig 320/365 Beretta 92 his own line of 9MM.
Now with cost of ammo dropping and some reloading supplies ie primers getting less expensive... 9MM will never be Wally World Win White Box Cheap @ $10/100 again back in the early 2000's.
The cost to reload the 38 super is the same as a 9MM. People just do not appreciate some aspects of shooting.
Accuracy bad on the Ivar Johnson precision was good
A new rear sight should cure all ills.
@@hrfunk looking forward to the next one with a new sight! Thanks for the great informative video
Good morning HR. Gonna rewind and listen to what you have to say.
Thanks. I hope you enjoy it!
Help me understand something. Old school back in my day was that the best ammunition you had was slow and heavy. Now it seems that everybody has found themselves up with the idea of fast and light. The old theory was that the slow bullet could do better walking as they called it and it’s track rather than just popping straight through. Is slow and heavy now just out of vogue or does it have some advantages over fast and light. I understand about expanding Hollowpoint. I am just talking about is there still considered to be some advantage in heavy and slow. Of course we know everything new is better ha ha. Sometimes getting back to basics is a better solution. Sometimes. I just wonder what your thoughts were. On different days I would use different ammunition because I keep flopping back-and-forth on this
Good luck getting a straight answer to that question. I believe that the last two human beings on the planet will still be debating this issue. Lol Shot placement is the real king!
This subject gets more attention, and more opinions than just about anything else in the firearms world. I have come to the point where I don’t think it’s possible to predict the terminal effect of bullets with any real accuracy because there are just too many variables to account for. I tell people to carry whatever ammo they feel most comfortable with. It will probably do just fine.
I find myself rooting for all the guns you shoot to be a tack driver, but what I realized is it isn’t the gun that’s a tack driver it’s you that are the tack driver lol. Using Kentucky windage proves that
I really enjoyed this video. I love the new targets unfortunately I can't use them at my range they don't allow human caricatures but I can find other targets on the website. You've been having a lot of stoppages at the range lately, how's your fiber? Thanks for the great video!
It seems like stoppages run in cycles. One I get everything ironed out, I’m usually good for a while.
The 38 Super is, well... a super cartridge. Iver-Johnson 1911 pistols are made by Shooters Arms Manufacturing in Cebu City, Philippines. SAM makes a very good 1911 as my two in 45acp have served me well. However, the sights on your IJ would also bother me and I'd have to correct that. As always, an excellent and very interesting video.
Thank you!
Fun video! Thanks! It seemed to me that on the failure drill, you were just a bit slower with the Iver Johnson. Did you think so?
Maybe. It might have been because it was my first run through it.
Can appreciate super 38 but it's not my jam
Same. I only have so much room for ammo.
Too bad. It's a cool old cartridge.
As a CZ fanboy, I automatically roll my eyes when I see those CZ clones aka Tanfo's lol but I guess sometimes a cover can be as good as the original. Like the Hendrix version of "All Along the Watchtower" or the Stevie Ray Vaughan version of "Little Wing" or "Voodoo Child". I know that a lot of people prefer the Johnny Cash version of "Hurt" to the original Nine Inch Nails, but I like the original better because I can relate to it more. I have my own history of addiction, and that's what the original version was about, whereas the Johnny Cash version was more just reflecting on life in general and aging.
I know that Tanfoglio's have a good reputation and they're supposed to be awesome. I've never even held one. I have three CZ's, though.
It was/is a nice handgun. I don't thein it really gives up anything in terms of quality to the CZ's.
I like Jimi's watchtower and like Rod Stewerts version of Angel.
Tanfoglios can be good or bad in the quality department depending on the model and year of manufacture. Some were getting cracked slides and frames at sharp corners near the ejection port. Design changes fixed that for the most part.
Some of their polymer frames get cracks around the magazine release that propagate across the grip frame. I haven't seen any design changes for this one although there may be some gunsmithing done that could save the frame.
If you find a good pistol from them, it should last a very long time, but a handful of them have some pretty unpleasant issues.
I'm a fan of their designs, but I would make sure to examine them while cleaning to be sure that everything is still in good order.
@@hrfunk That's interesting; I thought people really liked Tanfo's. I thought that the main issues with them are that you just don't see them at gun stores and they use their own mags instead of the standard CZ 75 mags. I remember seeing one Tanfo that looked really sweet in my gun book, oh wait actually it's an EAA Witness Gold Team. Tanfoglio isn't the same as EAA, is it? The Phoenix Redback looks pretty sweet too.
I just picked up a used Czechmate a few weeks ago, and bought a TS2 a year ago, and a Shadow 2 the year before that. I'm excited for Steel Challenge and USPSA to start again, and I got a membership at the local gun club last year. The waiting list is over five years, but if you do 24 matches there and email your scores, then you get bumped off the waiting list. It took me about two years to do 24 matches.
Good shooting HR!
The .38 Super is a viable cartridge, with +P JHP rounds preferred for defensive purposes.
That Iver Johnson 1911A1 is a keeper, and like you stated just replace the rear sight!
The smoothness of the Colt may be due to it being more broken in(?)
Thanks. The Colt is an older pistol and i suspect it benefits from a good bit of hand fitting.
@hrfunk. Can you post a link for the targets?
Not without youtube deleting it. The site is "targets on line" all as one word with the dot and com at the end.
@@hrfunk Thanks. No likey utoob
@@hrfunk I posted the link. If the toob is upset it will be at me
@@ElainesDomain they just nuked your comment with the link ED. I was trying to respond to it, and it was gone before I could hit the send button.
@@ElainesDomain I now have a link in the description field for this video. Hopefully that will help.
Great guns & very good shooting. 38 Super is a good old offering & option.
Thanks. I agree.
Your now the number one shooting channel for me, keep er up brother! I would like to see you start to get more and more pistols for review, if you could be the first to put the savage 1911 to the test that would be more than awesome.
Thanks Andrea. I’ll see what I can do!
The Iver Johnson needs different sights.
I’ve got a new rear sight on the way!
@@hrfunk It has a lot of potential for a mid priced handgun.
Interesting video. I never gave any thought to it till this video. And it made me look up the difference between 38 Super vs. 38 Special I learn something new, and I appreciate that. I will stay with the 38 Special and not bother with the 38 Super-the difference is not worth getting into a new caliber for me.
Another thing I noticed. I have not seen any target of people of color or teenage targets. The fear of political correctness, I supposed.
Yes, I intentionally do not use targets like that in UA-cam videos. It's difficult enough to stay on UA-cam without inviting problems.
I have done the Greenwood (Dickens) drill with a number of pistols but my Springfield Milspec at least equaled the performance of my other pistols including pistols with RDS. A $700 1911 is more accurate than any other pistol except a more expensive 1911.
Break break. I went to the range a very bright sunny day and could not locate the dot. Is bright sun the Achilles heel if the RDS?
For some it is. It’s a good idea to check your sight in very bright sunlight to make sure you can still see the reticle,
@@hrfunk Follow up. I have both Holosun red and green dots. I took them out in the bright sun in the backyard and found he green dot to be much more visible in bright sun. You still have to turn them up to max setting which will drastically shorten the battery life.
I’m glad the green works better for you. I don’t notice a lot of difference between the two colors myself. You can extend your battery life if you only turn up the brightness when it’s necessary.
18:30 Very important to use both types of targets in a professional type of practice.. Looking at real life videos from all over the world, females are just as dangerous as males in that type of danger. great video.
I agree. We see examples of that from time to time.
I do not know how this cartridge is not more respected and regarded. It is a great round, it must be the bullet diameter. The 357sig did not do well for long either, I could be wrong, but I think the specs are close as in velocity for same weight bullets. I have never owned a 38super, what is the case length on it. Is it 45acp or 10mm length, or longer? Somebody let me know, I have no real world experience with this round. I just think it looks very good performance wise.
The case length for the .38 Super is .895" (COAL: 1.28"). So it's close to the .45 ACP (.898"/1.275"), but shorter than the 10mm (.992"/1.260")
@@hrfunk thank you sir, interesting indeed. Do you happen to know what pressure it operates at?
Looks like the MAP is 33,350 psi.
For a while ,back in the old days of IPSC, almost everyone was using the .38 super auto. Wish it was more popular. Used to be, the Colt was about your only choice. I started when the .45 ACP,200 gr. Hensley & Gibbs mold # 68, lead TCFP was the # 1 competition round. Over 4.5 grs. Bullseye..think even Cooper used it.
Oh you got one more Subscriber. My friend Stan. He doesn't know it yet though..😆 I had his phone last night when we were talking fixing his Subscription to my channel and I have your channel linked in the end of my last shooting video. So I hit that and Subscribed Him to yours with notifications 😆 next time I see him he'll be asking why is he getting those notifications 🤔 😆 🤣
LOL. Good one.
Ha, ha! Thanks Steve. I hope he enjoys it!
@@ElainesDomain 😆 he's not that technical with his phone. Watches UA-cam on His Big TV at Home...next time I see him he will be like...I keep getting these notifications from this HR Funk guy. I don't even understand why?
😂💯 See That's why I'm one of His best friends 😏😁😂
@@stephendettweiler746 So he's like me but my phone is for phone stuff. No browsing
@@hrfunk whenever I do a non preaching video I put you channel a suggested link a lot of the time. And it's always fun to mess with your friends when you can 😁
Good Shooting and very interesting review!
FWIW, I've been collecting and shooting Tanfoglio Pistols since the mid-1980's, but I've never had to buy
any of their Match Grade Pistols to get very decent performance out of them. I've found that their basic
standard Pistols have excellent accuracy and reliability, with most ammunition.
Thanks! I thought it was impressive pistol, but it's not quite my cup of tea.
Good stuff. I’d be interested in seeing where 147 grain bullets would hit with the IJ. I generally prefer heavier bullets in .38 Super anyway.
Stay tuned Matt.
One observation, of which I have been kind of perplexed by for a long time is shooting a pistol that is basically designed for self defense, and shooting it as a target pistol. The pistol normally doesn't have target type sights, and is not really produced to shoot groups. This seems like a constant, Trying to use a handgun that is a self defense unit, as a target pistol. Sights are lacking, and it can be disappointing. Seems to be a thing. Get a pistol with Target sights, and you will do a lot better.
I thought all these pistols did quite well in terms of their accuracy. The IJ just needs a higher rear sight.
@@hrfunk I have a few pistols that have target type sights, and the shooting results are quite dramatic. I once shot with a friend, shooting .22lr pistols, and I was hitting a little right and low. The pistol had good sights. I told him, I was going to adjust the sights. He thought I was nutty. I adjusted the sights, and was then shooting right on. Sights are a huge part of shooting a pistol. Example, Glock sights with giant dots, not a target pistol. will make.
If, and I ain't holdin' my breath, a major pistol manufacturer came out with DA/SA or DAO model in .38 Super for around $450.00 or so, I would gleefully trade in the only 9 Minimal pistol I own and never look back. Otherwise, I could be persuaded to spend a few dollars on a single action only, G.I., 1911A1, Browning H-P, or CZ-75 clone and at least four quality magazines so that I could train with the .38 Super more efficiently. And by the way. Your female critic, concerning the target, clearly was never attacked by an armed female with murder on her mind. Maybe she, the critic, should enter Law Enforcement and see just how many people, male, female, or whatever have no problem attacking an LEO or LEOs with an edged or projectile launching weapon.
Hey, hrfunk and anybody reading this. I had a black bear encounter, but nothing happened the bear was 50 or so yards away. I was carrying my new 1911. I would like to know is 45acp enough to stop a blackbear or should I invest in a 10mm
You’ll have to wait for an answer from someone who knows more about bears than I do.
So would every iver Johnson 1911 have that same sight problem?
I don't know. I suspect the sights on this handgun or the same ones you used on the .45 ACP version. That might account for the low point of impact with the .38 Super.
I don't have experience with the .38 Super so this is very interesting. It's a round I've always heard discussed but have never been fortunate enough to be around when it was available. Congratulations on hitting that tack while having your view obscured by the pistol, that's not easy to do. Do you really feel like the Iver Johnson is a tack driver, even as near as 7 yards? Great work on the video.
Thank you. I’m a fan of the .38 Super, and I think the Iver Johnson is definitely a tack driver, it just needs a sight correction.
Great video as always HR. With regards to the House of Pain ammo, please don’t refer to it as ‘Hot’, as it is giving what was originally standard for the cartridge. If descriptive terms are to be applied it should be ‘weak’ when referencing the Armscor loads as they are producing 9mm performance not .38 Super.
I can also attest to the difference in ‘feel’ between a SAM 1911 and a Colt (mine is a Govt Special Combat). The Colt just feels far more refined in every way.
Fan and fellow LEO from 🇦🇺
I understand what you’re saying, but it’s far more common these days to encounter ammo loaded like the Armscor (unfortunately).
Chief Funk she calls you Chief Munk as in muddy bog not spelled corectly...man haters club president. Probably thinks you advocate violence against women, doesn't know Meme I suspect. Great video am a long time fan of the 1911 pistols in .38 Super. I own two both 1911 guns one a Dan Wesson Guardian LW Commander the other a Colt Engraved 1911 my so-called BBQ gun. Qualified with both 100%. That hot JHP load I must give a try, used Buffalo Bore now.
You really should give that load a try. I like it a lot.
Howard, if any more women complain about the female target, just tell them it depicts your ex-girlfriend Rachel!! ;-)
HR Funk just shot my mom!
I'm not buying targets that look like people.
They're NOT a threat, they're targets.
I'm sure that the LE agency that investigates me shooting a redheaded blind Asian midget would have issues if my targets were redheaded blind Asian midgets.
Oh no, here we go! (Thanks for watching Stan!)
Blasphemy!
What is?
How DARE you use targets depicting male evildoers! Men are ALL sweet innocent victims 🤣🤣🤣
Interesting comparison, and you may have discovered the targets I've been looking for
I like the targets. Check out their website. They have quite a variety.
@@hrfunk yes, they do!