I spent 31 years as a corporate staff photographer for a major US airline. Boring work most of the time, but it gave me the opportunity to do street photography all over the world.
parr's work is wonderful-his advice here is pretty standard for any creative profession, not sure what the other commenters are upset about. commercial success is not likely; you should do it because you love it. if it becomes your job, great, but that shouldn't matter to you
I think making artworks comes from a certain leisure in time and in mind. Even being obsessed with it is a validity from that state of mind. Unfortunately not everyone has that. And some need to struggle for the base. What I don’t feel right is that some tendency of people put themselves in a center of judging and it make the truth unclear. Parr’s view of failure is only his.
I've done workshops with amazing photographers, I've watched lectures.. they all say exactly this. It's the honest truth of making it in any creative or arts based field. But that means making it as in Martin Parr would know your name.. So, that of course doesn't mean you can't have some success with mediocre work.
@@ting6184 I'm not sure I understand the entire point you are making, but I believe Parr is being honest and how hard it is to successfully learn a craft well enough, then find a vision, pursue it, not care what others say about your work, and find your own voice that are unique and create images that connect and tell a story. As most of the comments infer here, that's true of anything in art, science, law etc. Very few people start early enough and are gifted enough to find their way through all this. He is not knocking the amateur photographer who is striving to improve. Just saying most will not make it to the point where they can earn a living with a unique voice. I don't believe he is including the vast majority of professional photographers who make a living doing museum reproduction work, weddings, corporate headshots, etc. He's just pointing out (IMHO) that you need the knowledge, planning, skill, and a bit of luck and much goes into getting there.
He who makes no mistakes makes nothing. The path to success is littered with failure. Don't give up without a fight. As long as your failures make you better than you were, you are on the right track.
I did an apprenticeship as a photographer when I was in my 20s. Then I put it on the shelf for nearly four decades. Now I'm retired and I can put everything I've learned to good use without any pressure, any need to earn money with it or to satisfy a customer.
The sunday photographer.. 4 decades !!! Do really think you should have started again.. Pictures of a family pet and birthdays.. Don't really cut it.. Or family vactions for that matter
@@robertbutts9835 I actually didn't do photography at all. Family and trips was done by my wife. Now I'm doing large format portraits as paper direct positives in my own little home studio and street photography with a Rolleiflex TLR. Directly from my wheelchair. And I CLA and restore old pre-war cameras. It's fun. Thinking about my own YT-channel as the Wheelchair Photographer. 😉
@@Dahrenhorst do it! I myself started a UA-cam channel about nature photography 18 months ago, after retiring from 40 years in the Federal government. I was an art major in college and, despite my successful civil service career, I never fully gave up wanting to create. And now, I do with no real pressure. We're not getting any younger. Do it and have fun!
He is a remarkable photographer and this is excellent advice. I have a BFA from Art Center College of Design, a renowned school in Los Angeles. I spent the better part of 20 years in the '70s and '80s as a commercial/industrial photographer. I made a decent living. I saw my bread and butter accounts leaving my area and correctly interpreted the trend as the tip of the iceberg. I had an unusual opportunity and returned to school and earned a BS in Computer Science and rode the wave of the PC boom. It afforded me the chance to send two children through graduate school and help my wife earn her Masters and PhD. My colleagues who stuck with photography didn't fare nearly as well. The few who were able to stick it out eventually succumbed to the digital revolution which has made the market hyper competitive. There's hardly a week that goes by that I don't pick up a camera at least once. I'm having as much fun as I've ever had with photography. He's right, very, very few photographers, no matter what their area of interest, will be able to make the transition to full time pro.
@Gabroe;e Lopez I could be wrong, but I would argue it's not first, but it is a major component. Obsession might be a bit strong and unhealthy. I would replace it with you need to be driven (and there is a difference). I have no idea of MP would agree with me, but as with music, dance, photography, science etc. the ability to go places and create images that have not been created before requires a lot of love for what you do and drive to understand what others have done and your innate ability to then see the world from a different perspective well enough to communicate it uniquely. There is an awful lot to learn and to quote Louis Pasteur "Chance favors the prepared mind".
Fail upwards. That's the key to success. It's only a failure if you didn't learn anything from it. Otherwise it's just a mistake or a learning curve. Even Gordon Ramsey failed with his first restaurant. This is where you have to be obsessed to make it work.
well that was genius. I never understand and underestimated how hard this craft is. Being photographer myself i faced a lot of challenges - beibg upset and depressed with my work , not having good photographs or even doubting myself. This advixe will keep me going
I was in The Martin parr foundation a month or two ago now and I almost had a heart attack when I looked into the back room out of curiosity and saw him sat on a sofa smiling
Get the pleasure of making photos that are your special vision. For a tiny fraction of us that will mean success. For the rest of us we find satisfaction with the pleasure we attain.
I realize his demeanor seems a bit arrogant and blunt, but there is a lot of truth to his comments. You have to realize that he has seen the profession of Photography devolve from a well paid craft to an underpaid, overcrowded field that is awash with photographers simply trying to earn enough to pay for their hobby, while holding down some other job that provides steady income. The transition from film to digital capture has all but destroyed the photography profession -- although, on the plus side, it has grown the passion for photography. Speaking purely from a professional standpoint, prior to digital capture and especially modern digital cameras, very few people were willing to attempt doing it professionally -- you had to have the technical skill to be confident that you were capturing usable images on film -- that requirement held many photo enthusiasts at bay. That all changed with digital capture.
It was different back in the film days. Taking the picture was only the first part of the process. Then you had to process the negatives and print in a dark room. This took patience and skill and sometimes luck. Color printing was particularly difficult. It took many years of dedicated experience to be a photographer. Back in the days photographers were real artists, not just any blogger with a cell phone.
you know that we have a fair amount of places that do darkroom developing, ranging from institutions to literal stores right? it’s still very much alive today given the current state of the digital photography world. some like it because of the aesthetic, some like it because of the process, but whatever the reason, it’s still here and to stay.
Nonsense. Harry Gruyaert moved to digital when Kodachrome was discontinued. Film has nothing to do with being a 'Real' Photographer. You think if digital was available in the 70s photographers wouldn't use it?
He's correct, but also wildly incorrect. If like Parr, your branch of photography is entirely based around documentary, then there's truth to what he's saying. On the other hand, his version of quantifying success becomes less and less relevant as you consider the myriad of other photography branches. Try applying his opinions to still life, portraiture, or any of the various types of commercial photography, and his logic starts to fail. Finally, apply his opinions to fine art practice, and it really begins to crumble.
I think fine art photography is an even tougher subject (BTW, when I read "fine art", I usually think of black and white minimalistic/long exposure images, like Michael Kenna, Brett Weston, Joel Tjintjelaar etc). Yes, their photos are wonderful, and if you can make a living with it, more power to you, especially if you have a strong connection with your specific audiences. But for most of us hobbyists, like Parr's words "unless you are obsessed... or almost like a disease", that's going to be tough. If you want money, probably start with something more "practical" like wedding or product photography. Then after you have a strong reputation and networking, pursue art like the way you want.
Good point, and something to consider, in the narrow context that Parr is talking about (documentary, Magnum photographer). This video clip does seem a bit doom and gloom to me though, as Parr’s logic is so ambiguous, it could apply to many different things and still ring true. To excel at something at such a high level, yes one does almost have to be obsessed to a degree. With all of that being said, I tend to like photos from Magnum rather than looking at a portrait of a model that’s been done a billion times over. No story, no context, just a studio background and an attractive body.
I think he just means to say that it is unlikely that someone working in the "creative" industry will become an internationally renowned star in his or her genre. Which means that someone is able to work on just one topic, which is the dearest for his or her heart, for decades. Which means that someone is being hired because of this topic, and being paid a lot of money for being this person. I know a few people in the "creative" industry who will likely never get there. Be it in music, design, photography, fine art or else. Instead, they're just doing a decent job every day, based on a proper qualification, usually working on multiple topics in parallel, and they're making a living from this. Some of them even have a fan club. That's entirely possible, it still takes a lot of talent, and they're fine with it.
Tbh still life, food, portraiture are made by 20 yo content creators on Instagram, not full time photographers. And they’re doing a great job, it’s just no longer a proper full time job.
I went to an interview for a place at Farnham on their degree program back in the day where he was a lecturer (1988). I spoke about his work New Brighton (Last Resort) at the interview. It was one of three Uni's I was applying to. My lecturers all said that of the three Uni's, Farnham would be the dead cert to offer me a place. I didn't get the place. I've got an awful feeling that Parr was on the interview panel and I spoke a load of tosh about his work. Never mind I went to Plymouth College of Art and Design instead. Have worked in Photography ever since.
I think his advice is great, if we were still in the 80's and 90's. But we are not. Not mentioning stuff like understanding marketing, sales and supply/demand really says a lot. For great 2022 advice you are much better off listening to someone like Taylor Jackson or Pye Jirsa. That is of course with all due respect for this gentlemen.
Ive heard him on some podcasts and he's quite toxic imo. Although what he says is probably true he can be quite condescending and rude, more so that what I believe his ability deserves. I know I am in the minority but am entitled to an opinion all the same.
I don’t agree. What is success? For Parr it’s something completely different from others I believe. In most places you can definitely make a living from photography. Big cities are challenging ofc, a lot of competition.. but it’s not THAT hard. There are so many bad photographers making a living out of it, it’s ridiculous…
At first sight, I liked his thoughts. But then I realized that he is arrogant. There's no such thing as a complete failure. And his measurements of success and recognition do not necessarily apply to others.
Commercial photographer here. There's merit to what Martin Parr says, but like any other source-no matter who they may be-you need to take it with a pinch of salt. You need to carefully quantify and qualify what he is saying. Were I to offer advice, it would be this > If you have a burning, obsessive desire to be a photographer, then find the niche [or two] that most appeals to you, research it to determine if making a living at it is in any way viable, then, if you still have a burning desire to pursue it, make a plan and go after it. And if you do, give it your all. No half measures...110 percent effort. But here's the important bit: After five years, if you've not reached your objectives, or are not seeing clear signs those objectives are on the horizon, then it's time to move on. This advice can apply to any pursuit in life. For the simple reason that none of us have that much time on this Earth to waste chasing something that isn't bearing fruit. Always remember that if you don't pursue a burning ambition to do something, you'll always wonder one day if you might have succeeded. Regret is not an emotion you want to harbor towards the end of your life. And failure to succeed at something is not failure - it's a life lesson that may provide valuable insights to you later in life as you tackle something else. No experience is wasted.
I think his version of success for a creative professional is to avoid homelessness - different time back then when the term “starving artist” was the rule.
Yet Instagram UA-cam etc is littered with young ‘talking heads’ offering advice who genuinely believe that they are ‘brilliant’ photographers in his league based purely on their ‘like’ count …
I have to say it was a little bit disappointed with the interview. I feel like his take on photography is a little bit jaded. I have been a photographer for about 10 or so years now and there's a lot more that goes into photography than just chance. Chance photos happen and sometimes they can be the best, but it often takes looking for and making opportunities that bring about the best photos. I think that anyone can be a photographer, but there is something about storytelling within photography that is just a strong and as important as what an artist would do with a painting. You cannot tell stories by just shooting photos At random. There has to be a lot of thought that goes into it. One of the most important parts is interaction with people, or the environment that you're shooting in. If you're shooting a landscape you should be paying attention to the sun, the clouds, the wind. If you're shooting a portrait, there are many things to be paying attention to. Especially the mood of the person that you are photographing. What story are you trying to tell? Film or digital, it doesn't matter to me, telling a story is what is most important. Stop going about looking to shoot the next greatest photo, shoot great photos everyday. Great photos are shot by great storytellers. Anyone can take a picture, but not everyone can tell a story. If you are bored with your photography, shoot from different angles, direct your subjects, or shoot at odd times of the day. Shoot in full sun, shoot at night, stop making excuses for being bored. Photography is fun all the time because each opportunity is a chance to tell a story.
Seems like a lot of these “photographers” say the same thing ironically 😂 Same thing bukowski said about poetry but it’s all nonsense, photography like poetry comes under an art form and most art can’t be judged soooo if you like photography or even love it, just continue and learn more and more and if you happen to make a dime from it good for you and if you don’t, keep the passion for it is yours 🦋😌
Of course it can be judged. You need to agree on the criteria and it those criteria will change based on the type of photograph. A good sports photo will need to do X; a good fashion photo will need to do Y; etc.
Rather go broke trying to make a living as a photographer then working a shit job and being miserable because I didn’t try to make it, but you know if I do fail I’ll always still be doing photography and creating images which at the end of the day is the most important part
Although I know what Mr. Parr is trying to communicate, I don’t appreciate his “candor”. 99.999% of us “photographers” won’t reach the HEIGHTS of fame. All we want to do is make competent images on purpose. Not accidentally. The same goes for professional sports. We want to make birdies, home runs and touchdowns, like the pros. We “know” world-wide fame is limited to a few. But we can still dream…
When did he ever say the word "fame" ? Clearly you must be doing it for the wrong reason and not for the love of the art. He said making a living, which is true.
Parr seems to have a very shallow definition of success.. If you can make a living at something that makes you happy, then you’re ahead of most people. That’s a long way away from being a failure. What snobbery.
Right from the 'horses mouth.' If you get ten great images a year, you've done well.... Sobering. I thought if I got two decent images per roll 36 exposures, I was doing well, but, that is just over confidence according to this.
It depends where your bar for 'great' is. Ultimately it is genre specific. Sports is one example. How could you compare that to a fashion photograph. You cannot. For a guy like Parr great means ICONIC. I have been photographing for 40 years. I have none of those, lol.
I spent oodles of time in the photography section at Concordia University (Montreal) just pouring over portfolios. Thinking that over time and practice some kind of osmosis would occur, subconsciously. I never felt that it was the camera that made the difference, it's the observation through the viewfinder. Of course exposure control is important if one wants to isolate elements in the field of view. I was trying to get into the Communication Arts programme at Concordia back in the early seventies. Didn't make it in. Their doctrine was 'shoot shoot shoot shoot, print.' Assigned camera was an Olympus Trip35. Nothing else.
I think this is good advice but the art form has transformed. You could run the 8K video continuously and pull the decisive moments from the stills now. Bound to get more than 1 per year. Kidding!
I don’t know what he’s talking about…I quit my 9-5 job to pursue photography and never looked back….In march it will be a year….if you love something pursue it….
To have an image you made become part of common history, or even more so, become a photographer in history of the world, is COMPLETELY OUT OF YOUR CONTROL. So just go out, and pursue that passion....I would suggest maybe not at the expense of food and home.
I highly disagree. Basically he is saying the only way to "make it" is to give up everything for your career and have no life outside of it. Well, he is projecting mightily there. Maybe that's what he had to do (and I pity his wife and kids if he has any), but that's not the law.
The fact that you might be willing, after hearing this, to take photographs for their own sake, shows your determination. Never mind this clown: Go for it.
The truth is you honestly will probably not make money off of photography especially if you don’t know the right people.It’s very saturated and people don’t see the value in it.He’s right don’t waste your time.If you are not a white dude with a $100,000 camera with an accent you might as well give up!
Quizás la mayoría de los fotógrafos que vivimos de la fotografía comunicamos mejor a través de las imágenes que con las palabras, el señor Parr es un gran ejemplo
I think he is referring to "artistic photography". As opposed to “wedding photography” or “commercial photography”. Many photographers make a living outside artistic photography. It’s not easy at all, but yeah I think Martin Parr was referring to his own area of expertise.
The arrogance of the man! If young, budding photographers listen to him they will get nowhere. If you have the eye, the artistic talent and enthusiasm you will probably make it. Nobody said it was easy. Martin Parr’s body of work is a continuous trail of nothingness. I have never seen anything of his that is creative. He has somehow got himself a name and now people follow him and think he must know what he’s talking about. He’s a bit like Andy Warhol is to the art world, nothing really artistic. Just take a look at his ‘Life’s a Beach’ series. Just a beach photographer. I’ve seen better work at some amateur camera clubs. Perhaps that would be a good introduction to the art, find a good club and study. Going to college or Uni won’t bring out any creativity. Do your own thing, kids!
I’m a street/pro photographer and he lives near me. I thought I was the only photographer who was totally unimpressed by his work. I’ve been a pro photographer for 32 years so I’ve been around a long time, but I cannot work out how the hell he got where he did with that body of work. Just my opinion.
Well what terrible advice. He said you have to look at lots of photographers work to get your own voice or style. That’s totally wrong. You follow your own path because if you get influenced by other photographers then where is your uniqueness.
Not in every way, every word has been used but the world will never be out of new stories. Each new born is different, each year is different, you are different in your mind, in your body. What nonsense to think like that.
Look, if you like photography, enjoy photography, that's all that matters. Don't let this guy break your heart, just do what you do. . Don't quit cause some dinosaur opened his big mouth. Check these guys out: Andre Kertesz, Annie Leibovitz, Brassai, Bruno Barbey, Christina Garcia Rodero, David Yarrow, Deborah Turbeville, Diane Arbus, Don Mccullin, Edward Steichen, Elliot Erwitt, George Hurrell. Henri Cartier-Bresson, Irving Penn, Jane Brown, Julia Margaret Cameron, Larry Fink, Larry Towell, Mary Ellen Mark, Peter Lindbergh, Raymond Depardon, Sebastio Salgado, Steve Mccurry, W. Eugen Smith, Walker Evans, William Klein. Don't you let 'nobody' steal your joy!! God gave you that, Life gave you that. You pick up your camera and create, it's your passion, something unique to you. Peace.❤💋😼💥
*Watch our full interview with Martin Parr right here:*
ua-cam.com/video/ibqDOm3i0eA/v-deo.html
I spent 31 years as a corporate staff photographer for a major US airline. Boring work most of the time, but it gave me the opportunity to do street photography all over the world.
How can I sign up
That is awesome!
Wow, the very idea of a corporate staff photographer for a airline almost sounds like fiction now
You must have the best job ever.. you must have some cracking images.
@@jusjay3834 I assume you have to be a pretty good photographer first.
Martin Parr is a massive inspiration for me, without him I'd never have quit photography.
Ill pay that
That's sad pal. I would have loved to have seen your efforts.📷
Ha ha ha, brilliant.
😅😅😅👍
lol
parr's work is wonderful-his advice here is pretty standard for any creative profession, not sure what the other commenters are upset about. commercial success is not likely; you should do it because you love it. if it becomes your job, great, but that shouldn't matter to you
I think making artworks comes from a certain leisure in time and in mind. Even being obsessed with it is a validity from that state of mind. Unfortunately not everyone has that. And some need to struggle for the base. What I don’t feel right is that some tendency of people put themselves in a center of judging and it make the truth unclear. Parr’s view of failure is only his.
I've done workshops with amazing photographers, I've watched lectures.. they all say exactly this. It's the honest truth of making it in any creative or arts based field. But that means making it as in Martin Parr would know your name.. So, that of course doesn't mean you can't have some success with mediocre work.
@@ting6184 I'm not sure I understand the entire point you are making, but I believe Parr is being honest and how hard it is to successfully learn a craft well enough, then find a vision, pursue it, not care what others say about your work, and find your own voice that are unique and create images that connect and tell a story. As most of the comments infer here, that's true of anything in art, science, law etc. Very few people start early enough and are gifted enough to find their way through all this. He is not knocking the amateur photographer who is striving to improve. Just saying most will not make it to the point where they can earn a living with a unique voice. I don't believe he is including the vast majority of professional photographers who make a living doing museum reproduction work, weddings, corporate headshots, etc. He's just pointing out (IMHO) that you need the knowledge, planning, skill, and a bit of luck and much goes into getting there.
@@dance2jam you might not see what I try to point out but your words inspired some awareness.
I think MP is just saying “photography as a common profession is gone. Try and find your own way.” Priceless advice.
Probably the best and most honest photography advice I’ve ever heard.
He who makes no mistakes makes nothing. The path to success is littered with failure.
Don't give up without a fight. As long as your failures make you better than you were, you are on the right track.
I don't mind watching this because I've already accepted my failure.
I did an apprenticeship as a photographer when I was in my 20s. Then I put it on the shelf for nearly four decades. Now I'm retired and I can put everything I've learned to good use without any pressure, any need to earn money with it or to satisfy a customer.
The sunday photographer.. 4 decades !!! Do really think you should have started again.. Pictures of a family pet and birthdays.. Don't really cut it.. Or family vactions for that matter
@@robertbutts9835 I actually didn't do photography at all. Family and trips was done by my wife. Now I'm doing large format portraits as paper direct positives in my own little home studio and street photography with a Rolleiflex TLR. Directly from my wheelchair. And I CLA and restore old pre-war cameras. It's fun. Thinking about my own YT-channel as the Wheelchair Photographer. 😉
@@Dahrenhorst do it! I myself started a UA-cam channel about nature photography 18 months ago, after retiring from 40 years in the Federal government. I was an art major in college and, despite my successful civil service career, I never fully gave up wanting to create. And now, I do with no real pressure. We're not getting any younger. Do it and have fun!
He is a remarkable photographer and this is excellent advice.
I have a BFA from Art Center College of Design, a renowned school in Los Angeles. I spent the better part of 20 years in the '70s and '80s as a commercial/industrial photographer. I made a decent living. I saw my bread and butter accounts leaving my area and correctly interpreted the trend as the tip of the iceberg. I had an unusual opportunity and returned to school and earned a BS in Computer Science and rode the wave of the PC boom. It afforded me the chance to send two children through graduate school and help my wife earn her Masters and PhD.
My colleagues who stuck with photography didn't fare nearly as well. The few who were able to stick it out eventually succumbed to the digital revolution which has made the market hyper competitive.
There's hardly a week that goes by that I don't pick up a camera at least once. I'm having as much fun as I've ever had with photography. He's right, very, very few photographers, no matter what their area of interest, will be able to make the transition to full time pro.
You can't fail if you're always learning....
Words of wisdom. Truly a great man to articulate the way of photography under 3 minutes
The obsession concept explains really a lot, I love that MP places it first...
@Gabroe;e Lopez I could be wrong, but I would argue it's not first, but it is a major component. Obsession might be a bit strong and unhealthy. I would replace it with you need to be driven (and there is a difference). I have no idea of MP would agree with me, but as with music, dance, photography, science etc. the ability to go places and create images that have not been created before requires a lot of love for what you do and drive to understand what others have done and your innate ability to then see the world from a different perspective well enough to communicate it uniquely. There is an awful lot to learn and to quote Louis Pasteur "Chance favors the prepared mind".
A great piece of advise, Martin Parr is an excellent photographer and he doesn't take it for granted
I have the obsessed disease. 📸 I’m earning a living on photography. 💪🏽
thank you so much for the encouraging words ...
Yes absoluteluy spot on.
One of the most motivating speeches I've heard in a long time 🙄🤦🏻♂️!
brilliant advice, should be printed inside each and every photo mag.
I hope you are still enjoying photography but have stopped buying photo mags now. A magazine's only purpose is to sell the advertisers kit.
Don’t tell me I’m going to fail!
Fail upwards. That's the key to success. It's only a failure if you didn't learn anything from it. Otherwise it's just a mistake or a learning curve. Even Gordon Ramsey failed with his first restaurant. This is where you have to be obsessed to make it work.
well that was genius. I never understand and underestimated how hard this craft is. Being photographer myself i faced a lot of challenges - beibg upset and depressed with my work , not having good photographs or even doubting myself. This advixe will keep me going
I was in The Martin parr foundation a month or two ago now and I almost had a heart attack when I looked into the back room out of curiosity and saw him sat on a sofa smiling
Some say he's still there to this day
@@nigeltang776 Haha!! Good one!
In this fast paced visual World, photos are more important than ever.
And yet worth less and less
Get the pleasure of making photos that are your special vision. For a tiny fraction of us that will mean success. For the rest of us we find satisfaction with the pleasure we attain.
who cares about failing. if you enjoy taking photographs, how is that a failure.
Never listen to people like this plot your own path & keep going
ya and rip off Fatboy Slim
I realize his demeanor seems a bit arrogant and blunt, but there is a lot of truth to his comments. You have to realize that he has seen the profession of Photography devolve from a well paid craft to an underpaid, overcrowded field that is awash with photographers simply trying to earn enough to pay for their hobby, while holding down some other job that provides steady income. The transition from film to digital capture has all but destroyed the photography profession -- although, on the plus side, it has grown the passion for photography. Speaking purely from a professional standpoint, prior to digital capture and especially modern digital cameras, very few people were willing to attempt doing it professionally -- you had to have the technical skill to be confident that you were capturing usable images on film -- that requirement held many photo enthusiasts at bay. That all changed with digital capture.
Appreciate the honesty
Forget it. Kie, packing up, it was nice for a bit. Love his work. Let me know if anyone needs a camera.
I guess I could use a new camera lol
It was different back in the film days. Taking the picture was only the first part of the process. Then you had to process the negatives and print in a dark room. This took patience and skill and sometimes luck. Color printing was particularly difficult. It took many years of dedicated experience to be a photographer. Back in the days photographers were real artists, not just any blogger with a cell phone.
Facts !! I just started and I want to learn all that…The art of photography
What do you mean back in the film days, you can still shoot and develop film. The filmstocks and chemicals are still produced.
you know that we have a fair amount of places that do darkroom developing, ranging from institutions to literal stores right? it’s still very much alive today given the current state of the digital photography world. some like it because of the aesthetic, some like it because of the process, but whatever the reason, it’s still here and to stay.
@@damienkphoto don't even need a full darkroom, just get a Patterson tank
Nonsense. Harry Gruyaert moved to digital when Kodachrome was discontinued. Film has nothing to do with being a 'Real' Photographer. You think if digital was available in the 70s photographers wouldn't use it?
While I hate Parr's work, I love his championing of the Photobooks.
He's correct, but also wildly incorrect. If like Parr, your branch of photography is entirely based around documentary, then there's truth to what he's saying. On the other hand, his version of quantifying success becomes less and less relevant as you consider the myriad of other photography branches. Try applying his opinions to still life, portraiture, or any of the various types of commercial photography, and his logic starts to fail. Finally, apply his opinions to fine art practice, and it really begins to crumble.
I think fine art photography is an even tougher subject (BTW, when I read "fine art", I usually think of black and white minimalistic/long exposure images, like Michael Kenna, Brett Weston, Joel Tjintjelaar etc). Yes, their photos are wonderful, and if you can make a living with it, more power to you, especially if you have a strong connection with your specific audiences.
But for most of us hobbyists, like Parr's words "unless you are obsessed... or almost like a disease", that's going to be tough. If you want money, probably start with something more "practical" like wedding or product photography. Then after you have a strong reputation and networking, pursue art like the way you want.
Good point, and something to consider, in the narrow context that Parr is talking about (documentary, Magnum photographer).
This video clip does seem a bit doom and gloom to me though, as Parr’s logic is so ambiguous, it could apply to many different things and still ring true. To excel at something at such a high level, yes one does almost have to be obsessed to a degree.
With all of that being said, I tend to like photos from Magnum rather than looking at a portrait of a model that’s been done a billion times over. No story, no context, just a studio background and an attractive body.
I think he just means to say that it is unlikely that someone working in the "creative" industry will become an internationally renowned star in his or her genre. Which means that someone is able to work on just one topic, which is the dearest for his or her heart, for decades. Which means that someone is being hired because of this topic, and being paid a lot of money for being this person. I know a few people in the "creative" industry who will likely never get there. Be it in music, design, photography, fine art or else. Instead, they're just doing a decent job every day, based on a proper qualification, usually working on multiple topics in parallel, and they're making a living from this. Some of them even have a fan club. That's entirely possible, it still takes a lot of talent, and they're fine with it.
Tbh still life, food, portraiture are made by 20 yo content creators on Instagram, not full time photographers. And they’re doing a great job, it’s just no longer a proper full time job.
I went to an interview for a place at Farnham on their degree program back in the day where he was a lecturer (1988). I spoke about his work New Brighton (Last Resort) at the interview. It was one of three Uni's I was applying to. My lecturers all said that of the three Uni's, Farnham would be the dead cert to offer me a place. I didn't get the place. I've got an awful feeling that Parr was on the interview panel and I spoke a load of tosh about his work. Never mind I went to Plymouth College of Art and Design instead. Have worked in Photography ever since.
More like a career in tall stories….😂💀
Too bloody true
Words of wisdom 😍
I think his advice is great, if we were still in the 80's and 90's. But we are not. Not mentioning stuff like understanding marketing, sales and supply/demand really says a lot. For great 2022 advice you are much better off listening to someone like Taylor Jackson or Pye Jirsa. That is of course with all due respect for this gentlemen.
Just like that! Great!
Ive heard him on some podcasts and he's quite toxic imo. Although what he says is probably true he can be quite condescending and rude, more so that what I believe his ability deserves. I know I am in the minority but am entitled to an opinion all the same.
You are correct well said.
I don’t agree. What is success? For Parr it’s something completely different from others I believe. In most places you can definitely make a living from photography. Big cities are challenging ofc, a lot of competition.. but it’s not THAT hard. There are so many bad photographers making a living out of it, it’s ridiculous…
At first sight, I liked his thoughts. But then I realized that he is arrogant. There's no such thing as a complete failure. And his measurements of success and recognition do not necessarily apply to others.
Actually he sounds pretty down to earth imo. He just makes it clear earning a living doing photography is almost impossible nowadays.
@@allrain I think there is a certain clique of photographers that don't allow others in - if you are in you are in... and if you aren't well....
I think you hit the nail on the head...
Commercial photographer here. There's merit to what Martin Parr says, but like any other source-no matter who they may be-you need to take it with a pinch of salt. You need to carefully quantify and qualify what he is saying.
Were I to offer advice, it would be this > If you have a burning, obsessive desire to be a photographer, then find the niche [or two] that most appeals to you, research it to determine if making a living at it is in any way viable, then, if you still have a burning desire to pursue it, make a plan and go after it. And if you do, give it your all. No half measures...110 percent effort.
But here's the important bit: After five years, if you've not reached your objectives, or are not seeing clear signs those objectives are on the horizon, then it's time to move on.
This advice can apply to any pursuit in life. For the simple reason that none of us have that much time on this Earth to waste chasing something that isn't bearing fruit.
Always remember that if you don't pursue a burning ambition to do something, you'll always wonder one day if you might have succeeded. Regret is not an emotion you want to harbor towards the end of your life. And failure to succeed at something is not failure - it's a life lesson that may provide valuable insights to you later in life as you tackle something else. No experience is wasted.
Mistakes are our biggest learning tools
"On Becoming a Photographer" Bill Jay and David Hearn
Too many cynical old timers like this in the industry. Your version of success may not be the same as mine.
I think his version of success for a creative professional is to avoid homelessness - different time back then when the term “starving artist” was the rule.
What is your version of success?
Yours are wise words.
Great advice.
Yet Instagram UA-cam etc is littered with young ‘talking heads’ offering advice who genuinely believe that they are ‘brilliant’ photographers in his league based purely on their ‘like’ count …
I have to say it was a little bit disappointed with the interview. I feel like his take on photography is a little bit jaded. I have been a photographer for about 10 or so years now and there's a lot more that goes into photography than just chance. Chance photos happen and sometimes they can be the best, but it often takes looking for and making opportunities that bring about the best photos. I think that anyone can be a photographer, but there is something about storytelling within photography that is just a strong and as important as what an artist would do with a painting. You cannot tell stories by just shooting photos At random. There has to be a lot of thought that goes into it. One of the most important parts is interaction with people, or the environment that you're shooting in. If you're shooting a landscape you should be paying attention to the sun, the clouds, the wind. If you're shooting a portrait, there are many things to be paying attention to. Especially the mood of the person that you are photographing. What story are you trying to tell? Film or digital, it doesn't matter to me, telling a story is what is most important. Stop going about looking to shoot the next greatest photo, shoot great photos everyday. Great photos are shot by great storytellers. Anyone can take a picture, but not everyone can tell a story. If you are bored with your photography, shoot from different angles, direct your subjects, or shoot at odd times of the day. Shoot in full sun, shoot at night, stop making excuses for being bored. Photography is fun all the time because each opportunity is a chance to tell a story.
Now this is a photographer.. So unlike Canada's Ted Grant who believes color is about cloths and bnw is the soul..
Seems like a lot of these “photographers” say the same thing ironically 😂
Same thing bukowski said about poetry but it’s all nonsense, photography like poetry comes under an art form and most art can’t be judged soooo if you like photography or even love it, just continue and learn more and more and if you happen to make a dime from it good for you and if you don’t, keep the passion for it is yours 🦋😌
Of course it can be judged. You need to agree on the criteria and it those criteria will change based on the type of photograph. A good sports photo will need to do X; a good fashion photo will need to do Y; etc.
Don’t make photography your primary source of income. Get a high paying job, do your photography on the side.
Lol. high paying job for what ?
Rather go broke trying to make a living as a photographer then working a shit job and being miserable because I didn’t try to make it, but you know if I do fail I’ll always still be doing photography and creating images which at the end of the day is the most important part
Although I know what Mr. Parr is trying to communicate, I don’t appreciate his “candor”. 99.999% of us “photographers” won’t reach the HEIGHTS of fame. All we want to do is make competent images on purpose. Not accidentally. The same goes for professional sports. We want to make birdies, home runs and touchdowns, like the pros. We “know” world-wide fame is limited to a few. But we can still dream…
When did he ever say the word "fame" ? Clearly you must be doing it for the wrong reason and not for the love of the art. He said making a living, which is true.
Clearly…you didn’t understand his advice…don’t even try.
Parr seems to have a very shallow definition of success.. If you can make a living at something that makes you happy, then you’re ahead of most people. That’s a long way away from being a failure. What snobbery.
Can't stand his work, but his advice here is valuable and correct.
So the, this question becomes crucial: whether or not you should take his advice seriously?
Right from the 'horses mouth.' If you get ten great images a year, you've done well.... Sobering. I thought if I got two decent images per roll 36 exposures, I was doing well, but, that is just over confidence according to this.
It depends where your bar for 'great' is. Ultimately it is genre specific. Sports is one example. How could you compare that to a fashion photograph. You cannot. For a guy like Parr great means ICONIC. I have been photographing for 40 years. I have none of those, lol.
I spent oodles of time in the photography section at Concordia University (Montreal) just pouring over portfolios. Thinking that over time and practice some kind of osmosis would occur, subconsciously. I never felt that it was the camera that made the difference, it's the observation through the viewfinder. Of course exposure control is important if one wants to isolate elements in the field of view. I was trying to get into the Communication Arts programme at Concordia back in the early seventies. Didn't make it in. Their doctrine was 'shoot shoot shoot shoot, print.' Assigned camera was an Olympus Trip35. Nothing else.
I misread the thumbnail as "You are probably going to jail" and was so confuse.
Just like my modern dance career I got into photography for the money. ;)
I think this is good advice but the art form has transformed. You could run the 8K video continuously and pull the decisive moments from the stills now. Bound to get more than 1 per year. Kidding!
i agree with all this, but his IG looks not that especial for me, although some cool random photojournalism
He's right that you're probably not going to make a living from it. Same with any artistic endeavour. I wish him well.
I don’t know what he’s talking about…I quit my 9-5 job to pursue photography and never looked back….In march it will be a year….if you love something pursue it….
Yeah, there is plenty of money to be made. People just suck at business lol
To have an image you made become part of common history, or even more so, become a photographer in history of the world, is COMPLETELY OUT OF YOUR CONTROL. So just go out, and pursue that passion....I would suggest maybe not at the expense of food and home.
I highly disagree. Basically he is saying the only way to "make it" is to give up everything for your career and have no life outside of it. Well, he is projecting mightily there. Maybe that's what he had to do (and I pity his wife and kids if he has any), but that's not the law.
Is that his house?
The fact that you might be willing, after hearing this, to take photographs for their own sake, shows your determination. Never mind this clown: Go for it.
Pretty much if you use a flash you can capture the sme kind of style and image as this guy. Nothing new here.
마틴 파 사진작가
The truth is you honestly will probably not make money off of photography especially if you don’t know the right people.It’s very saturated and people don’t see the value in it.He’s right don’t waste your time.If you are not a white dude with a $100,000 camera with an accent you might as well give up!
Told the holy truth. lol
99.999999999% of the greatest photos ever taken were not his, period
You say go out everyday but pictures can also be taken inside! Don't forget it 😉
his body and voice are aging 20 years apart
He has cancer I think.
@@stephen_mcateer cancer sucks- I think he looks fine for his age, just saying I would think I'm listening to a 40/yo, not nearly 70
A street photographer who's spent just a little bit too much time at the beach.
I think it was Tony Ray-Jones that said, “American photographers have the street, British photographers have the beach.”
I did all of these things, since 1977, and my advice, is, MOVE TO EUROPE WHERE PEOPLE GIVE A SHIT.
Has Martin put out another book of fatties yet? I love when he does fat people books.
Sound interesting.
Haha. So many average photographers are making a living from it. I don't have a clue what he's smoking
Quizás la mayoría de los fotógrafos que vivimos de la fotografía comunicamos mejor a través de las imágenes que con las palabras, el señor Parr es un gran ejemplo
I think he is referring to "artistic photography".
As opposed to “wedding photography” or “commercial photography”. Many photographers make a living outside artistic photography. It’s not easy at all, but yeah I think Martin Parr was referring to his own area of expertise.
@@SeaUrchinFilms true
I was thinking the same thing
Define "making a living". How many do you know who make a decent living as a full time professional? Do you?
not true you can make a living from it if you learn business first.
Negative much? Jesus.
Almost like a desease
The arrogance of the man! If young, budding photographers listen to him they will get nowhere. If you have the eye, the artistic talent and enthusiasm you will probably make it. Nobody said it was easy. Martin Parr’s body of work is a continuous trail of nothingness. I have never seen anything of his that is creative. He has somehow got himself a name and now people follow him and think he must know what he’s talking about. He’s a bit like Andy Warhol is to the art world, nothing really artistic. Just take a look at his ‘Life’s a Beach’ series. Just a beach photographer. I’ve seen better work at some amateur camera clubs. Perhaps that would be a good introduction to the art, find a good club and study. Going to college or Uni won’t bring out any creativity. Do your own thing, kids!
I’m a street/pro photographer and he lives near me. I thought I was the only photographer who was totally unimpressed by his work. I’ve been a pro photographer for 32 years so I’ve been around a long time, but I cannot work out how the hell he got where he did with that body of work. Just my opinion.
Well what terrible advice. He said you have to look at lots of photographers work to get your own voice or style. That’s totally wrong. You follow your own path because if you get influenced by other photographers then where is your uniqueness.
martin who?
Photography is dead. Simply everything has been photographed.
what a terrible opinion to have.. that’s like saying music is dead because every note has already been played
@@salazeug Almost every song in the pop charts is built around the same four chords. And it's nothing new.
Not in every way, every word has been used but the world will never be out of new stories. Each new born is different, each year is different, you are different in your mind, in your body. What nonsense to think like that.
@@AymericCostaReal for sure that is the reason photography is valued less than ever before.
@@chrisecker9341 I don't understand your point
Look, if you like photography, enjoy photography, that's all that matters. Don't let this guy break your heart, just do what you do. . Don't quit cause some dinosaur opened his big mouth. Check these guys out: Andre Kertesz, Annie Leibovitz, Brassai, Bruno Barbey, Christina Garcia Rodero, David Yarrow, Deborah Turbeville, Diane Arbus, Don Mccullin, Edward Steichen, Elliot Erwitt, George Hurrell. Henri Cartier-Bresson, Irving Penn, Jane Brown, Julia Margaret Cameron, Larry Fink, Larry Towell, Mary Ellen Mark, Peter Lindbergh, Raymond Depardon, Sebastio Salgado, Steve Mccurry, W. Eugen Smith, Walker Evans, William Klein. Don't you let 'nobody' steal your joy!! God gave you that, Life gave you that. You pick up your camera and create, it's your passion, something unique to you. Peace.❤💋😼💥