RE: Hydrogen - any tower with an empty slot can go get more hydrogen remotely to have on hand for local delivery, thereby increasing the total amount of hydrogen you can get per minute. Many planets had multiple towers that were basically otherwise idle and could have been sending out ships to go get remote hydrogen.
Unfortunately hydrogen throughput via ILS is one of those 'forever' problems in the game and why you can never really ignore the logistical math regardless of the style you build. When you need a lot of hydrogen you're gonna burn through more than one tower/ten logistic ships can supply, and when you have multiple towers requesting it you're gonna have to find providers for those towers so you can keep a constant flow going. Spoiler: Constant is never going to be as constant as you'd like it to be. Also the math is never clean, even with warpers because of planet orbits and whatnot. It's one of the biggest weaknesses of the black box design philosophy Francis is doing, hydrogen to deuterium is hydrogen-hungry no matter how you approach it. Especially when you go stamping down those processes everywhere. One suggestion (in terms of finding providers) is that for all your builds that make excess hydrogen? Put a splitter in there with an output prioritized to a tower that local/remote supplies hydrogen. Hydrogen will fill the tower there first and then the excess can be bled off to be turned into something else/burned in a generator.
The other solution I've employed is taking advantage of the fact that fractionators are 1:1 H:D, while the colliders are 2:1. I'll slap down a planet of fractionator builds, and then for thing like SCRs, call in Deuterium directly where it's needed. No super-bulky, inefficient, power-hungry machines!
In the mall, it's nice to use minimal or sensible capacity in the tower for end products, and keep stores in outside boxes. That way, when you empty a supply tower in outside system, the vessels don't plop 2000 artificial suns every time you fill up a dozen from a tower, that took hours to craft. If that makes sense.
Life is just simpler when we build longitudinally on a planet. I understand why you chose to build latitudinally, it's different and more challenging. But unnecessarily complicated. Still fun to watch a new idea.
You know, with these kind of designs it would be lovely to see you revisit Factorio with Space Age. The new DLC gives you a few planets that each demand a different build style (one needs a constant flow, one is all about liquids, one is good with bots, and one needs heat piping everywhere). It would be neat to see what you'd come up with there!
I was thinking about the same. I also must admit that I have not watched FJ since SA dropped 😬 due needing to bring back calcite and rebuild smelting before I can set up the EM plants on Nauvis
Great video, as per usual ;-) Why not top the tip of the pizza slice with strange anihilation fuel rod production? I really love them in my game, and they require strange matter, which can get rid of your hydrogen For the mining setup: You got single ILS for each resource. No need to put down more towers, just add iron ore to the coal/stone towers that probably won't be utilized too heavily? You can even do that off-planet in the i-key logistics managing interface. I also usually never put logistic vehicles and warpers in the mining-planet ILS, because "pushing" is limited to 10 ships, but requesting (like you do for hydrogen) is only limited by how fast you can get ore into the tower, when each requesting ILS has their own 10 ships to use. I'd rather put more ILS on the production side. Fractionators cap out at 144/min (72 without proliferation, which makes more sense), so I'd say they are similarly space-efficient compared to MPCs that are huge and give you 120/min. Personal tastes vary. I think you also underestimate the amount of deuterium you can directly mine from gas giants for free. As a last comment, proliferting hydrogen-to-deuterium conversion for 100% speed-up would mean you only need half the particle colliders, which saves space (not power). Additionally, in terms of CPU-cycles and your 2.4TW plans that "saving" of buildings might be worth it!
You should fly out and watch the rockets and solar sails being absorbed into the sphere. The animations are beautiful. Flying through the solar-sails shooty-shooty is also beautiful, though they do strobe a lot.
The problem w/ a power pole blueprint is environmental obstructions that break the chain. They need to have a mode like "not enough buildings" where you can go in and fix the things that can't be placed. Also, doing that to a lot of planets really bogs the game down quicker (Speaking from experience).
(~) 17:20 For power poles around the planet, remember that sensor towers, wind, and solar(?) buildings have a power provider range which allow you to push/pull power around the planet where you need it. :) Also if you can integrate sensor towers and have polar defenses, it means no dark fog can land on the planet. Something proven by other youtubers. Though I'm curious if your plasma cannon tactic will work personally. :)
Having done something similar, (making a giant sphere around a blue giant star), I can say that you will need so so so many more solar sails and launchers. You can probably 10x your solar sail launching facilities on that planet. I had a planet with maybe 70% of the surface covered in launchers that ran constantly to fill out my shell. Think my processor choked before I actually ended up finishing it, but I got up to TW of power from that thing.
The relationship between mining efficiency and resource usage is a bit complicated. I once did the maths and found that if you constantly increase mining efficiency and the resource patches are large enough to start with (enough for ~500000 white datamatricies), then they will never deplete (in total).
I have had some possibly-silly thoughts regarding why it is a good idea to proliferate the Antimatter Fuel Rods. This despite the proliferation not giving extra power. 1/ an Artificial Star goes from 72mw to 144mw maximum output 2/ the burn rate is maximum, not “it will burn at x2 rate regardless” This creates a power-buffer for your planets that use the AMR. Normally, if it would require 10 Artificial Stars to power and then you start drawing 15-worth the planet would fall over until you went to drop another 5-10 Artificial Stars on it. With potential double output rate, all that happens is the existing ramps up to match. The same when using the Strange Annihilation Rods. Smaller footprint that can cover expansion well. There is always the improvement in burn-rate in the mech fuel chamber. That can be a bonus as well. Thoughts?
Yet another possibly-silly thought: Strange Annihilation Fuel Rods take 8 AMR to produce and hold 10x the energy (+20% bonus). They provide 144mw for 5x as long in an Artificial Star. Proliferation might double the output rate, haven’t checked. Some of the hydrogen left over from fire ice > graphene could be converted to deuterium for the Strange Matter required.
I suspect a power pole blue print could include a space for the anti hive turret caps on the poles. I also wonder if it could include space for the combat towers that make laying down blueprints faster. Basically hit the planet in layers. aka paste in power, paste in construction paste in combat towers all leaving the bands along the equator clear. That way when the factory blue prints get laid down everything is ready for them and basically no running around is required. I almost wonder if building a few of those combat/construction towers into the blueprints wouldn't be useful at the start - maybe they wind up being vestigial in the end but who cares if they make pasting faster / easier.
The ability to selectively deconstruct on a per-planet level is one of the big things this game needs. I did make a powernet blueprint with BAB lines so the shield generators are build right away. Its almost more work to collect them afterwards then it is to fly the round manualy.
On a slice you can use the edge of one side for stuff. Prolif on fuelrods does increase their max power but only for the lower level one's Do you have a way to send you a blueprint code? I dont quite understand the logic here. Yes, the coliders are more space efficient for Deut. But at the same time you have a large chunk free next to the suns and you are shipping in twice the Hydrogen atm. The ships probably even flying to orbitals collectors in other system. The planet around a giant should have mushrooms collecting directly, maybe even with a dedicated route. How about having some of the sail launcher target a differently angled orbit? Shooting down relay stations is a good way to have fun. You might want to limit the mall towers to 100 plasma input, that way you dont get 2k delivered each time.
I forget, does this game have logic gates that can be triggered when certain conditions are met, like in Factorio or Oxygen Not Included? Like, for example, such as activating or deactivating when power is above or below a certain level for example? If so, then could a little bit of automation be set up, so that all of the hydrogen byproducts get priority in getting consumed and turned into electricity before the antimatter gets consumed and turned into electricity?
19:48 Pet peeve time: No, you did NOT "tell a lie". Conflating lies with errors is a mistake. From Websters dictionary: Lied; Lying: 1. To make an untrue statement with INTENT to DECEIVE. 2. To create a false or misleading IMPRESSION. (Ie, twisting the truth, lying by omission, etc.) Lying requires INTENT by a liar (though lies can be passed on to an unwitting patsy by an original liar). An UNINTENTIONAL falsehood can be called a mistake, an error, mispeaking, or false. Villains too often get away with bold face lies by claiming that they merely 'mispoke', then turn around and persecute anyone with honest disagreements by calling them 'liars'. The inability to understand the difference between lies and errors, and the ease with which the two concepts are confused, underpins some of the most dangerous propaganda that divides modern society. This confusion isn't just restricted to villains, it has become extremely fashionable and infectious across all of society.
RE: Hydrogen - any tower with an empty slot can go get more hydrogen remotely to have on hand for local delivery, thereby increasing the total amount of hydrogen you can get per minute. Many planets had multiple towers that were basically otherwise idle and could have been sending out ships to go get remote hydrogen.
Unfortunately hydrogen throughput via ILS is one of those 'forever' problems in the game and why you can never really ignore the logistical math regardless of the style you build. When you need a lot of hydrogen you're gonna burn through more than one tower/ten logistic ships can supply, and when you have multiple towers requesting it you're gonna have to find providers for those towers so you can keep a constant flow going. Spoiler: Constant is never going to be as constant as you'd like it to be.
Also the math is never clean, even with warpers because of planet orbits and whatnot. It's one of the biggest weaknesses of the black box design philosophy Francis is doing, hydrogen to deuterium is hydrogen-hungry no matter how you approach it. Especially when you go stamping down those processes everywhere.
One suggestion (in terms of finding providers) is that for all your builds that make excess hydrogen? Put a splitter in there with an output prioritized to a tower that local/remote supplies hydrogen. Hydrogen will fill the tower there first and then the excess can be bled off to be turned into something else/burned in a generator.
The other solution I've employed is taking advantage of the fact that fractionators are 1:1 H:D, while the colliders are 2:1. I'll slap down a planet of fractionator builds, and then for thing like SCRs, call in Deuterium directly where it's needed. No super-bulky, inefficient, power-hungry machines!
0:26 Had to pause because I head "MegaTwatts" instead of MegaWatts. Haha!
same
Yep
Checks out
You really missed the opportunity to name that blueprint "Power Pole".
ExtEEEEEEEEEEND!
I like the part where Francis said "is Francis time" and franci'ed all over the place
Francis'd *all* over
In the mall, it's nice to use minimal or sensible capacity in the tower for end products, and keep stores in outside boxes. That way, when you empty a supply tower in outside system, the vessels don't plop 2000 artificial suns every time you fill up a dozen from a tower, that took hours to craft. If that makes sense.
Life is just simpler when we build longitudinally on a planet.
I understand why you chose to build latitudinally, it's different and more challenging. But unnecessarily complicated. Still fun to watch a new idea.
You know, with these kind of designs it would be lovely to see you revisit Factorio with Space Age. The new DLC gives you a few planets that each demand a different build style (one needs a constant flow, one is all about liquids, one is good with bots, and one needs heat piping everywhere). It would be neat to see what you'd come up with there!
Honestly I'm surprised he hasn't mentioned Space Age at all anywhere.
Would love to see how he handle Gleba XD
I was thinking about the same. I also must admit that I have not watched FJ since SA dropped 😬 due needing to bring back calcite and rebuild smelting before I can set up the EM plants on Nauvis
Great video, as per usual ;-) Why not top the tip of the pizza slice with strange anihilation fuel rod production? I really love them in my game, and they require strange matter, which can get rid of your hydrogen
For the mining setup: You got single ILS for each resource. No need to put down more towers, just add iron ore to the coal/stone towers that probably won't be utilized too heavily? You can even do that off-planet in the i-key logistics managing interface. I also usually never put logistic vehicles and warpers in the mining-planet ILS, because "pushing" is limited to 10 ships, but requesting (like you do for hydrogen) is only limited by how fast you can get ore into the tower, when each requesting ILS has their own 10 ships to use. I'd rather put more ILS on the production side.
Fractionators cap out at 144/min (72 without proliferation, which makes more sense), so I'd say they are similarly space-efficient compared to MPCs that are huge and give you 120/min. Personal tastes vary. I think you also underestimate the amount of deuterium you can directly mine from gas giants for free. As a last comment, proliferting hydrogen-to-deuterium conversion for 100% speed-up would mean you only need half the particle colliders, which saves space (not power). Additionally, in terms of CPU-cycles and your 2.4TW plans that "saving" of buildings might be worth it!
You should fly out and watch the rockets and solar sails being absorbed into the sphere. The animations are beautiful.
Flying through the solar-sails shooty-shooty is also beautiful, though they do strobe a lot.
The problem w/ a power pole blueprint is environmental obstructions that break the chain. They need to have a mode like "not enough buildings" where you can go in and fix the things that can't be placed.
Also, doing that to a lot of planets really bogs the game down quicker (Speaking from experience).
I think that "100x power generation" button on the artificial sun you clicked is part of the sandbox mode? Makes it easier to power a base!
Actually, illumination follows the inverse square rule so a candle that burns 10 times as bright will burn 1/100th as long.
(~) 17:20 For power poles around the planet, remember that sensor towers, wind, and solar(?) buildings have a power provider range which allow you to push/pull power around the planet where you need it. :) Also if you can integrate sensor towers and have polar defenses, it means no dark fog can land on the planet. Something proven by other youtubers. Though I'm curious if your plasma cannon tactic will work personally. :)
Having done something similar, (making a giant sphere around a blue giant star), I can say that you will need so so so many more solar sails and launchers. You can probably 10x your solar sail launching facilities on that planet. I had a planet with maybe 70% of the surface covered in launchers that ran constantly to fill out my shell. Think my processor choked before I actually ended up finishing it, but I got up to TW of power from that thing.
The relationship between mining efficiency and resource usage is a bit complicated.
I once did the maths and found that if you constantly increase mining efficiency and the resource patches are large enough to start with (enough for ~500000 white datamatricies), then they will never deplete (in total).
Always like FJ content
I have had some possibly-silly thoughts regarding why it is a good idea to proliferate the Antimatter Fuel Rods. This despite the proliferation not giving extra power.
1/ an Artificial Star goes from 72mw to 144mw maximum output
2/ the burn rate is maximum, not “it will burn at x2 rate regardless”
This creates a power-buffer for your planets that use the AMR. Normally, if it would require 10 Artificial Stars to power and then you start drawing 15-worth the planet would fall over until you went to drop another 5-10 Artificial Stars on it. With potential double output rate, all that happens is the existing ramps up to match.
The same when using the Strange Annihilation Rods. Smaller footprint that can cover expansion well.
There is always the improvement in burn-rate in the mech fuel chamber. That can be a bonus as well.
Thoughts?
Yet another possibly-silly thought:
Strange Annihilation Fuel Rods take 8 AMR to produce and hold 10x the energy (+20% bonus). They provide 144mw for 5x as long in an Artificial Star. Proliferation might double the output rate, haven’t checked.
Some of the hydrogen left over from fire ice > graphene could be converted to deuterium for the Strange Matter required.
I suspect a power pole blue print could include a space for the anti hive turret caps on the poles. I also wonder if it could include space for the combat towers that make laying down blueprints faster. Basically hit the planet in layers. aka paste in power, paste in construction paste in combat towers all leaving the bands along the equator clear. That way when the factory blue prints get laid down everything is ready for them and basically no running around is required.
I almost wonder if building a few of those combat/construction towers into the blueprints wouldn't be useful at the start - maybe they wind up being vestigial in the end but who cares if they make pasting faster / easier.
The ability to selectively deconstruct on a per-planet level is one of the big things this game needs.
I did make a powernet blueprint with BAB lines so the shield generators are build right away.
Its almost more work to collect them afterwards then it is to fly the round manualy.
On a slice you can use the edge of one side for stuff.
Prolif on fuelrods does increase their max power but only for the lower level one's
Do you have a way to send you a blueprint code?
I dont quite understand the logic here. Yes, the coliders are more space efficient for Deut.
But at the same time you have a large chunk free next to the suns and you are shipping in twice the Hydrogen atm.
The ships probably even flying to orbitals collectors in other system.
The planet around a giant should have mushrooms collecting directly,
maybe even with a dedicated route.
How about having some of the sail launcher target a differently angled orbit?
Shooting down relay stations is a good way to have fun.
You might want to limit the mall towers to 100 plasma input, that way you dont get 2k delivered each time.
You messed up. That much power is 69,420 MW
I have noticed you never played Stanley's Parable... It is an oldie, but goldie. Can you give it a shot? I think you would be surprised.
Hey! Any thoughts on trying Factorio new DLC? I’ll love seeing you playing it! ❤
The solution (and the problem) is typically more DAKKA
Would reducing the Warp from 12AU speed up the hydrogen collection or are the gas giants in use far enough away that the warp distance doesn't matter?
Should've been 69,420 mega-twatts
I forget, does this game have logic gates that can be triggered when certain conditions are met, like in Factorio or Oxygen Not Included? Like, for example, such as activating or deactivating when power is above or below a certain level for example?
If so, then could a little bit of automation be set up, so that all of the hydrogen byproducts get priority in getting consumed and turned into electricity before the antimatter gets consumed and turned into electricity?
Unfortunately not
19:48 Pet peeve time: No, you did NOT "tell a lie". Conflating lies with errors is a mistake.
From Websters dictionary:
Lied; Lying:
1. To make an untrue statement with INTENT to DECEIVE.
2. To create a false or misleading IMPRESSION. (Ie, twisting the truth, lying by omission, etc.)
Lying requires INTENT by a liar (though lies can be passed on to an unwitting patsy by an original liar).
An UNINTENTIONAL falsehood can be called a mistake, an error, mispeaking, or false.
Villains too often get away with bold face lies by claiming that they merely 'mispoke', then turn around and persecute anyone with honest disagreements by calling them 'liars'. The inability to understand the difference between lies and errors, and the ease with which the two concepts are confused, underpins some of the most dangerous propaganda that divides modern society. This confusion isn't just restricted to villains, it has become extremely fashionable and infectious across all of society.
@0:17 69 thousand mega what's of power? that's not metric, is there an extra t in there somewhere?
Fasted I've ever been on a video(1 minuet).
21:00 Lol. I heard 'Methyr'. Yep.
you ever try factorio?
He has whole factorio series. All it would take is to open playlists
This game is like ONI but its just systems and no mining .. and no dupes to manage.
Still not my cup of 14 year old scotch but 2 ice chunks.
When scaling up is made easy, someone is not playing Factorio. Good shit Keep it up sir!
You can turn off those terrible voice overs that happen whenever you start flying or warping.
i appreciate min/max...but the needless constraints you impose upon yourselves
Pointless comment