What's the difference between a classical and a Flamenco guitar?
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- Опубліковано 1 кві 2015
- A run down of the differences between the two main arrangments of a nylon string guitar: guitars made specifically for playing classical music, and those built to excel at the many styles of flamenco.
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Two best ways to explain the difference between a violin and a fiddle.
1) It's a violin when you sell it, but a fiddle when you buy it.
2) A violon has strings, a fiddle has strangs.
The difference between water and H2O is thay water is what you drink and H2O is what makes up water
The bridge on the fiddle may have a more shaved bridge in order to make it easier to play double stops, but yeah. Exact same instrument just called differently depending on music played.
Bruh, I’m digging that Lord Farquaad hair....
lmfao
Nice😂
you didn't have to do him like that
pick 3 milord
@@f.i.l.d.e.p.s lmao I just remembered that line from the executioner guy in shrek. Lol I'm gonna rewatch shrek because of you dude
I was told that Flamenco guitars had some sociological reasons for their design. Due to the venues they were played in, some of the adaptations were made to get a brighter louder sound to cut through the noise of the venue, at the cost of reducing sustain.
Also, because they generally accompanied singers, mid-range was quieter to allow the singer to feature. Just from book-learning really, I am no expert.
I've played classical guitar since I was 12, and I didn't even know this lol. Thank you!
Most flamenco guitars do have spruce tops. However this one cat by the name of Paco de Lucia R.I.P. almost always played a cedar top conde hermanos in a pretty serious fashion.
Yeah sure, why then not shell out like 15-20 k $ and buy a Conde cedar top? And, you might have to wait six months before you'll get it too!
@@TheHesseJamesdon't you have spruce in your country?
great presentation - thanks, David!
Thank you for clearing this for me.
Music stores around here do not have staff that know this basic information. Thank you so much for this video that cleared up the two guitars definition.
*Explanations highly clear but in-depth, yet organised. Nice demonstrations and examples.* 10/10 + #NewSub!
As he briefly touched on, it's kind of much ado about nothing unless you're advanced or professional. For beginning and intermediate players either works great. And for those of us who have played steel string forever and are wanting to try to transition to classical, the flamenco style is awesome as the action is more familiar. If the action is crazy high and you don't enjoy playing it, you won't!
Thank you so much for your clear explination of the differneces between a classical and a flamenco guitar. I am a composer in the midst of writing a new Guitar Concerto and found your comments very helpful.
very informative and straightforward. didnt know about the top protector, thnx alot for the information
Excellent explanation about a recurrent topic of discussion. Good job David.
This was a really well done video. It's not often that I leave positive comments on a video but you did a great job with the explanation.
To my ear a properly set up flamenco guitar's fret buzz provides a snare drum undertone that adds dimension to the percussive presentation. Usually played behind a singer and dancer this fret buzz and finger tapped percussion allows a single guitar to sound like a small combo sound wise. Just my opinion. Great video David.
very interesting David! I wasn't aware of the differences until now. thank you for the well delivered information. cheers!
Very useful comments. Thanks for sharing and keep up the good work.
That was one of the best, most concise and easy to understand explanation, for players of any abilities. Thanks. After many years of playing Classical and steel string Acoustic, I learned something worthwhile again.
I studied flamenco back in my days and one feature of a flamenco guitar (however, I have never tested, because I have never had access to many flamenco guitars) is that the box is slightly shallower. Also, the wood of the box is thinner thus making flamenco guitars much lighter. Both of these add features designed to give the snappy, sharp tone unlike classical guitars that prefer more deeper and long lasting tone. All together, the flamenco guitar is designed to have the sharp tone because a guitar plays along signing and dancing (especially stepping), and if not for the bright tone, I might be difficult to hear.
Yes. This is what I was expecting to hear. Body not as deep, thinner, maybe even bracing differences. But instead we learn that he has simply failed to adequately lower the action on his classical, and thinks that's the difference. I have heard, that the strong tone of a classical is boosted by leaving the strings high, but am myself more concerned with how it would boost the torque on the neck, and with no adjusting rod, that means big money work or the garbage can for your guitar eventually. I lowered my classical action fairly low, and I can assure you it didn't make it sound like a guitar with a different body design.
@@michaelmcnally4868 I am not much familiar with setting strings higher or lower. Setting them higher will definitely have an effect on right hand techniques because any small adjustment can make a big difference on catching strings. This is seen and experienced while using capodaster (capo). I played some pieces on, say, 3rd with capo, but when playing without capo it was way different and more difficult due to finger muscle memory.
@@jackswiatek5221 I am new to adjusting saddles, so I got curious and searched youtube. Watched a video by Thames who I believe makes luthier quality classical guitars in the UK, though he sounded more like an American. The video was more about an extended saddle which allows you to adjust the setup height by sliding it back and forth. But anyway he said on the low E the height was a little over 3/32. That's 94 thousandths. And with the extended taller section (the saddle is ~1.75in longer than normal) slid all the way in, it would be raised to 5/32in(156 thousandths). 3mm=0.118" 4mm=0.157". I have in my notes that somewhere in the low 3's is good for the low E, 3.2=0.126". I remember that this quote is from someone who is doing setups a lot lower than what I commonly saw advised for classical, but I agreed with him. Now for steel string guitar, the guys that want an easy to play setup are like maybe in the 70's (thousandths) for the low E.
It is not only the forces on the neck that are higher with a high setup. The strings are also pulling more directly upward at the bridge, which puts more upward pull on the sound board, and a raised sound board is a common problem, more humidity related if the setup is correct. This is what makes me think that the guys out there saying a classical needs to be 5 or 6mm or something like that (at the neck body junction) are just helping to make more work for luthiers.
@@michaelmcnally4868 What you are saying is probably very correct. I don't approach playing guitar on that mathematical measurements. Some guitars are harder, some softer, some guitar makers specialize in one or both, etc, etc, etc. A guitar is a tree converted into a musical instrument and each one of them has a unique soul... or at least it should. I would imagine none is the same and each one of them will tend to have different attributes even if made to the same specs. One of the major one is that you can't make each guitar from the very same piece of wood, and driven from the differences in wood is the quality of the instrument and its sound.
I have heard that making good classical and flamenco guitars is becoming more and more difficult mainly due to the pollution in which trees tend to twist when growing and thus having uneven grain, or grain is too thick, etc, etc, etc. Study of itself.
@@michaelmcnally4868 Watch these. Two very different methods on making a guitar. I will try to put a link to it next, but sometimes youtube delete links. So put these into youtube
Making a Guitar | Handcrafted Woodworking | Où se trouve: Greenfield Guitars
Documental de la construcción artesanal de las guitarras Francisco Bros.
Guitarras Francisco Bros
David, Thank your time, kindness and talent to pass others your wisdom. Keep going!
+Mikao Kavako (Kidmann) Thanks for watching!
Very informative video, thanks for taking the time..😊
So glad I watched this video, thanks for posting!
Thanks for an amazingly thorough comparison!
Would like to see more guitar vids from you - excellent playing!
Valuable information. Thanks for this video
Good info. Thank you David.
Thank you for explaining this. This is a useful video.
Thanks for clearing that up!
So knowledgeable... Being a Spaniard, it's just my 👂 who knows about all this, my head needed some more information. Thanks! 🙏
Great video, that helped me a lot.
Thank you
Ole Viller, Denmarm
thanks for this valuable info, I always though there was something different between both.
Great video, man. Thanks so much for posting.
Great video, great explanation. ¡Felicidades, gran trabajo!
Great video. Thank you.
I'm looking through your older classical guitar videos for perspectives. Thank goodness you still have these up. :)
I took a lot of them down.
@@DVSPress Ah well, then I'm grateful for the ones I was able to watch.
Thank you so much for this interesting video. Many flamenco solo player like to play a guitar with a high action because they want to have a clear tone with no buzzing strings. A classic guitar has more diversity of sound and you can play a lot of different styles of music. (From Barock to Latin)
Good review thanks, additional to your information: inside the guitar there are some differences at the construction too (the number and position of the "abanicos"), in flamenco guitar, the sound is brighter and fast, but must dissapear faster than in classical guitar, that is realy important to play faster and strong without having all the sound at the same time.
Wow! I've been playing classical guitars for 20 years. This video and the comments have taught me something new!
Thanks so much David..👍😊Warm cheers..👍😊🎶
This is really helpful, thanks a lot.
Very Informative....Thanks!
Very informative! Thank You!
Thanks for stopping by!
This was a great video. Thank you so much!
Awesomely explained! Thank you!
Nicely explained and demonstrated....
Very informative, thanks mate.
Brilliant video David!!!!
Outstanding video, Thanks.
Very cool video. Thank you!
Interesting and helpful. I’ve seen video of Flamenco greats like Paco de Lucia playing a cedar top sometimes.
thank you man, that was great explanation!
very helpful for my intended purchase. Thanks ✌🏽
You just taught me something. Thank you.
Hi David , I'm your new student , I'm 67 years old and I love flamenco music , specifically Rumba , I find your teaching unbelievable simple , practical ,easy to understand , in a few minuets I learned so much and not only that , but you have clarify so many myth and wrong believe about the guitar types, strings etc etc , muchas garcias desde Vancouver . Pepe
Jose H Thanks for stopping by and watching! Let me know if there is anything I can help you with.
yes I will thanks , very kind
Boomer
Wow great info...thanks a lot learned a lot
Awesome review!
Nice explanation. Thank you!
Thanks. That was very helpful.
Thank you. I've been looking for nylon string and do much finger picking style and wanted a nice nylon smooth sound. I shy from the wide neck ... so will look for a flamingo... would like cutaway as well as pick up in it...
Thank you, very helpful!
Dave, thank you for teaching us the elements that makes up a flamenco guitar. I wonder if you could share a resource on the elements of the clapping. In flamenco there is a distinct clapping that I could never get down. Even though I have Andalucian roots and actually lived in Southern Spain with my grandmother, no one ever really taught me in detail what you have.
There are loads of Spanish speaking channels here on YT that will teach you any compas.
Good explanation, thanks a lot !
Very informative video.
Thanks for that comparison, you made my day! 👍
Great info. Thanks
great video man thanks!
Very informative; thanks.
very useful information thanks
From someone who knows very little about guitars and music...thank you. Great explanation.
Thank you! Very Intersesting Channel you got going here!
Very usefuuuuul informations ,, tnx a lot👌
great video, thank you
Thank you this helped!
Excellent and Spot on
Great video
Good video. Gracias hermano.
I absolutely love the guitar David!
your face had a glow while holding your flamenco guitar after classical one :)
Well done--thanks!
Helpful thanks
😹I kept thinking my cat was crying to come in (she was actually outside, ready to come in) - but then I realized it was from your video! Thanks for the great info!
Great video!
Thanks!
thnx, man! useful comparison indeed!
There is no historical evidence that shows any difference between classical and flamenco instruments with regards to the basic construction of the instrument and many players and builders say there is none. Pepe Romero says a test of a guitar - as far as how good a sounding guitar it is - is if it sounds good for both classical and flamenco. It is true that the percussive techniques used in flamenco playing require protecting the top with a golpeador and cedar being a softer wood may not be an ideal choice although there are luthier who use it. Flamenco players have a preference for a lower action, but that's a player preference not an instrument preference. A blues player getting their action set lower on their tele doesn't change the instrument from being a tele. As a guess many guitar historians think that the light back and sides were used on cheaper instruments because cypress was easier to obtain and less costly, and since the gypsies who played flamenco did not have a lot of money played them they became associated with flamenco guitars. If you can find a fine cypress bodied guitar set up for classical playing you should play it, they are awesome, perhaps better than the much more common Indian rosewood. The instrument with nylon strings that we all know and love really should be called the Spanish guitar, as this is the culture that has brought it to us, whether we play flamenco music, or classical music on it. We don't refer to any other guitar by the style of music that gets played on it. Classical pianists have a preference for Steinway and Bosendorfer pianos where jazz players prefer Yamahas but we just call them pianos. I have spent lots of time in Spain and played many instruments, a really good flamenco and a really good classical will sound the same when your back is turned as long as the player does not play hard and cause it to buzz. Flamenco builders are beginning to promote the difference between flamenco and classical instruments, but in my opinion it's more a marketing notion. As far as the tonal differences you can find a vast array of tonal palettes in both "classical" and "flamenco" guitars. Bright, punchy, crisp, full, round, etc. are terms that you will hear to describe either. There seems to be a preference for a bit brighter sound in flamenco, but players who specialize in playing baroque music as opposed to latin american will have different ideas about the ideal tone from the instrument. That doesn't make it a different instrument. I build Spanish guitars, if the player is going to be playing flamenco style it will get a golpeador on it, if they play only classical it will not. The action will be set by the players preferences and physical characteristics. I have set up many guitars for younger players or players with very small hands with a low action in order to make it easier for them to play- some flamenco players have their action set quite high if they have large powerful hands.
+Bob St. Cyr I've addressed this elsewhere in the comments, but I shall sum up:
The classical and flamenco guitar are different arrangements of the same instrument, this is true. However, those differences exist and I am constantly asked about them, hence this video.
My classical and flamenco guitar have very different tonal characteristics, and I desired this for stylistic reasons. I have many guitars, and I have many because they each do different things. So it is with these. It is a bigger difference than a Steinway and a Yamaha, in my not-so-humble opinion.
I will not doubt your quote from Pepe, but I have heard the opposite from other members of the Romero family, and, perhaps more importantly, I hear the opposite often from flamenco players.
Thanks for stopping by and good luck.
same guitar just the way they treat them and they don't treat them the same way :)
vei dorje Of course not.
FWIW, Pepe Romero is not someone that any real flamenco guitarist would want to emulate. He sounds classical, including when he's trying to play what little he has left of flamenco. Don't get me wrong, he's a fantastic guitarist and I have great respect for him. But flamenco no es. So I would take his advice with a huge grain of salt.
If you have the money then you re going to get what you want. It really comes down to preference. Some people who only have one guitar whether it be flamenco or classical are to play whatever they want to play on it. If you have the means then you re going to buy what you prefer when it comes to sound and what action you re looking for. For years I played flamenco on a classical guitar. But years later now with money I own both types of guitars. But at times I’ll play Spanish on the classical and classical on the flamenco guitar. Just depends.
Same with the piano. I play recitals every so often. If it’s a voice type of concert I prefer Yamaha or Baldwin that have a higher brighter sound. Bosendorfers are just too light when there’s that much sound. If it’s a piano recital I prefer Steinway (pre 70s if possible)
In short it comes down to what suits your taste, what sounds good and feels good to groove on.
Very helpful, thank you. Do you have any experience or thoughts on the Camps Mod SP- 6?
Hi! Just to say that there is one crucial issue that needs to be corrected. One of the main differences between classic and flamenco have to do with the scale. This issue plays an important role in virtually all of the aspects (tone, sonority, playability ...). Classic 650 millimeters, Flamenco, 660. BEst
awesome explanation
Keep in mind some flamenco guitars are dark wood at the front, a brand that makes this type of guitar is Cordoba and Paco de Lucia himself played many songs with a dark top guitar. Im not sure if it was cedar tho, im pretty sure it was spruce with a dark finish. So for anyone seeing this, just know there are many flamenco guitarists that have played with a dark top. Many flamenco guitars try to be fancy and look slick by changing the type of finish on the wood. Just always make sure it says Spruce on the details dont rely on the colour too much.
Nice one. Greetings from Spain.
thanks i learned a thing or two with this video.
Hi, David. I can't remember where, I had read something about the benefit of flamenco guitars having lighter (maybe wood-made?) tuners. I guess it had something to do with player's posture/fatigue issues. I'm just curious about it. Have you heard/are you informed regarding that matter ?
For some strange reason, this video of yours pops up all the time, even though I don't play the guitar.
I bumped by chance into an old man at my swimming session a few years ago. He worked with Pepe Martinez and "looked after" (he and his family put him up in his house and stuff) in the 60's or early 70's here in the UK and was with him when he did a few TV appearances and other performances. Long story cut short, he was gifted a Flamenco guitar by Pepe which he still had years later. Eventually he couldn't play any more due to age and took it to a local guitar studio. They took one look at it and offerred him a fairly hefty sum and that is the end of my little story.
good points, esp fretboard position on soundboard.... nice.
dear David
thanks for taking your time to make a guitar like this
However, I would like to add some points. There are great flamenco guitars made with Cedar Top, even Redwood top sometimes. Great flamenco virtuoso like Serranito, Manolo Sanlucar, Juan Serrano... all play great Jose Ramirez guitars made of Cedar top and Rosewood (Indian or Brazilian) back and sides. Many of the most famous guitars are also made with Cedar top: Gerundino Fernandez, Hermanos Conde, Valeriano Bernal... Spruce is just a more popular choice :D
Thanh Huynh Thanks for stopping by and watching! Your comment may actually illicit another video on the history of the flamenco guitar. Jose Ramirez (the original Jose Ramirez, who died quite a while ago) didn't explicitly make "flamenco" guitars. He just made guitars, and flamenco player will adapt whatever is suitable - Carlos Montoya played often on a "classical" guitar because of its better bass range compared to the cheap cypress and peg guitars that were popular in the then-budding flamenco scene. You're going to play whatever is the best available - and certainly in the past that was often cedar.
However, in the context of this video, I'm talking mostly about modern guitars, and in the modern era spruce is a near-universal choice for a flamenco guitar. Likewise in my experience flamenco-specific performers have all used spruce-topped guitars. There's nothing to say you can't use cedar (or even something else), just that it seems really rare to choose it for that style. Guitar makers are aware of this. As a result, virtually all the guitars you will find that are set-up as or marketed as flamenco guitars will have a spruce top.
For my part, I really do prefer cedar for most things; unfortunately that has fallen out of favor a bit in the classical world as well.
Additionally, I might add that I don't think I ever saw Juan Serrano play a cedar top guitar, either in practice or in concert. When I was a student of his (in the early 2000s), he played mostly guitars made by David Macias. They were all spruce-topped, so I presume he held similar opinions on spruce to other artists. There are always exceptions, though, so play what sounds best for your style and interpretation! Thanks for watching!
David Stewart Just a correction, Jose Ramirez did make a guitar that was influenced by the guitars flamencos used - called the tablao guitar. He also made guitars out of cypress.
thanks for replying. Yes, all of your info and perspectives are true. I only put in my 2cents on the " Spruce top flamenco guitars" based on my experience.
Wwish all of other arguments could come to this level of healthi-ness :)
Thanks for the video! I have a Valeriano Bernal La Serrania from Spain. Fairly sure it's a flamenco, but I prefer classical music and style more. Can I learn classical style and music on it or is that not recommended?
I like your guitars my friend. Good day.
ridiculously helpful tyvm
+Dovah Kitteh Glad to hear it!
Hi! I want to learn how to play guitar and flamenco has to be one of my favourites. Should I get a classical guitar and learn the flamenco basics and then if I like it or once I get better, then maybe buy a flamenco guitar? thanks in advance.
Whatever is available and good is what I would play. You can always add a golpeador (top guard) to a classical guitar to protect it from the flamenco techniques.
Don't do that
Go for a flamenco class and buy a flamenco negra guitar
You can use this guitar for classical or bossa also
julia5naugusto1 @555
ur not from america are you? "u" in favorite I think french people say it with a u Just saying...
Get both, ;)