Blanchard's slam against women at the end is especially outrageous & offensive given that earlier he said he realizes how quickly & often men who are AGP become misogynistic & abusive to the women in their lives, subjecting them to behaviors the women find "degrading" & "repulsive" - & that the misogynistic abusiveness many of these men end up embracing gets directed at women more generally.
I thought it was a reference to libfems, in which case he's not wrong. A huge problem in the fight against self-id is the handmaidens prostrating themselves to men in dresses.
I was disturbed by how he was saying that just because women experience behavior from ags that effect them the same way as misogeny recognized as the patriarchy doesn't mean it is the ideology of what is causing it. I am sure incels would argue it isn't the root of their ideology either - women not recognizing their superior manhood and not getting laid when they wanted is. Men from past decades would argue they were protecting women from themselves and their inferior intelligence. He waved off the effect on women while they all nodded along. AGs see women as props to their own desire, much like men that see women as a means to sex and an heir or a politician who needs to look just right. They have sexualized the idea of woman for their own fetish .I also didn't like that they were acting like AG were as legitimate in support for transition as someone with gender dysphoria, like we should all publicly fund and participate in a fetish as legitimate, like women don't find it insulting to say biological men who like to abuse their spouses and threaten biological women should be publically validated in surgeries that insult any woman without porn tits or a specifically feminine face? Might as well be Caitlyn Jenner, telling women the hardest thing about being a woman is deciding what to wear.
If you have him on again ask him this: When you were sending all these men out to do the 'real life test', to what extent did you consider the needs and rights of women, into whose spaces you were sending them? Who gave you the right to do that? Did you even ask women what they thought?
@@eveeve9758 When the TRA say 'We've been using your toilets for decades', that is the fault of Blanchard and his colleagues who decided they could without ever asking us.
(@25 min, look at Helen's face) So, Dr. Blanchard, my husband went off when I was nursing our months old baby and taking care of our 3 year old. Didn't know where he was. You make it sound like this was nothing. NOTHING. MY HUSBAND WAS AWOL. I HAD NO MONEY FOR CLOTHING AND FOOD.
Ray has to get a bit in about how women are also to blame, whilst at the same time completely ignoring the fact that it was the medical profession, male dominated at the time, that enabled this by coming up with a 'treatment' that supported men to perform their fetish in public. No one asked women if this was ok and it's just further proof that men don't see women as whole human beings. Nobody thought of the impact of this 'treatment' on women at all & no one held Ray to account for that. He's just seen as an expert, but he is also an enabler. Just because it was possible to do SRS doesn't mean it was ethical. It had an impact on society not just individuals & no one should've been telling these men it was ok for them to live 'as a woman,' because that would be impossible.
Not only do they not see women as whole beings, they do not see women at all, as evidenced by three men largely ignoring and talking over the only woman in the room. I mean Graham tried a bit but Arty didn’t even seem to notice how much he dominated the conversation.
I agree. He also makes it sound like women were like "hm i'm bored, let's convince men to develop misogynistic fetishes that compel them to invade our spaces and erode our rights!" Like sure there are lots of women enabling these abusive creeps but the abusive creeps still wield a lot of power over most women by virtue of being men. Men have been trained all their life to prioritize their sexual desires over all else, especially women's health or happiness. And women have also been trained to prioritize men's sexual desires over all else, even themselves. Autogynephilic men are abusing women into this position and Ray here just blamed the women for being abused. Absolutely disgusting. I have lost the little respect i had for him. His typologies may be useful but his enabling of them at the expense of women is unforgivable.
So it was Arty's let's understand and excuse Agp's show....it was pretty much a given this was where the mess was heading. Women do not have to pander to delusional or narcissistic men full stop. How many times and in how many ways do we have to tell men NO!
@@Qrtuop honestly I really don't know it seems a real blind spot that he can't see the very act of men declaring themselves women and other men giving them permission to live 'stealth' as a woman' whatever the hell that means as a treatment for their sexual fetish is anything other than disgustingly abusive towards women. Reducing women and girls to forced props and validation tools in their delusional sexual fantasy of themselves will never cease to shock me.
Excellent point by Helen, that women live a very different life from men. Which is Why no male can ever fully understand what it’s like to be female. That’s why it’s insulting to women to suggest that a man is a woman, or a man that wears a dress is indistinguishable from a woman. He might have achieved a look & a persona, but he is still a man. Another aspect to add to Helen’s point, is that often mothers of males who become trans, have the motherly protection factor in there. Because of the way girls are raised, along with the messaging of society, the safety issue, and the mothering instinct of some women, this all contributes to women enabling men taking advantage. Look, I don’t care if men want to wear dresses; we just have to stop affirming them, by agreeing to them being in female spaces, taking & twisting language, taking our sports. Open the bandwidth of being males and leave women alone.
I don’t theoretically have a problem with mxn wearing dresses either. The problem is that in reality hetero mxn only do it for sexual reasons. Yes, some might do it as a laugh or to get attention for a moment but the reality is any het guy who wants to wear dresses for real is an AGP. There’s no way around it.
if paraphilias are innate, why are they tied to social norms (femininity & feminization, master/slave relationships ecc) and artificial gimmicks (certain clothes, shoes, etc)? how can julia serano's whipping girl be innate if it fetishizes a certain submissive social role for women? I'm not an expert at all, but I can't make sense of this. paraphilias (as opposed to orientations) sound learned to me cause they need stereotypes, tropes and gimmicks to fetishize.
Autogynephilia is innate in the sense that an individual male has heterosexuality that is biased towards internal rather than external stimuli. The fetishism involving women's clothes comes from the erotic targeting that associates the clothing that covers certain areas (panties for example) that are hardwired into the brain of a heterosexual male.
@@ebflegg I thought he was referred to as a psychologist, "sexologists" are medical professionals who try to study the act of sex. Most often presenting themselves as telling women and girls to indulge in the abusive fetishes of their husbands and boyfriends, and that if they don't like to just suck it up or "think about it in a different way." I would highly, highly suggest Sheila Jeffrey's various talks where she touches on the subject of sexologists, as she actually saw their rise in power and has an incredible mind.
While Helen was MAGNIFICENT in defending women in her little speech at the end, shame on Arty and Graham for also not speaking up against RB's misogynistic diatribe and blaming women. Helen should not have been left to defend women on her own.
Do you think Helen is incapable of holding her own? You think she needs Graham and Arty to come to her rescue? When RB said some women are responsible for the rise in this ideology, he was right. Women are brought up to be nice, sympathetic, nurturing and kind and without realising they have held the door open wide for MRAs. Helen pointed that out. She didn't need her "gang" to back her up.
@@talldrinkofwater5259 Judith Butler and Ruth Hunt are female. They haven’t done anything ‘kind’ because of their socialisation and without realising the implications. Attacking Blanchard won’t make uncomfortable facts go away. Being a real feminist means knowing that women have agency and they don’t always use it in the best interest of their sex
@@talldrinkofwater5259 I didn't mean that she wasn't capable of holding her own or needed 'rescuing'. But Arty and Graham should ALSO have spoken up many times during the discussion, especially when RB started to blame women. Instead, Arty just carries on dominating the discussion with his own interest. I just meant that it should not be only Helen 'on her own' challenging RB. She did a good job.
To be fair, I genuinely think they may have been thinking 'wtfff'?? Helen was just the faster thinker in this situation but Ginner was about to say something. His face was slowly dropping throughout Ray's comment although I think he might have been smiling and nodding at one point. Not sure what on earth Arti was thinking though with his comment. It just seemed pandering after Ray's comment. It would be interesting to see what the discussion was off camera after this video.
@@ebflegg Women didn't make up "psychology" and "sexology" and called it "science". Women didn't make up a trans humanism or the "science" that is the normalisation and academification of male paraphilias, It's all men. -
We have our own battles. We don't need to understand AGPs we just need them to stay the hell away from women and kids. AGPs themselves say they were affected by hypno cissy porn. Also if it isn't a fetish why do so many have other fetishes ? The Bugs Bunny thing was one of JS and even he says he doesn't know reality from retrospective justification any more. The woman stuff at the end was out of the MRA playbook. Blanchard is not a detached professional. No professional totally is. His perspective has also bern formed by working with AGP men, so will be slanted. This issue is divisive and is causing problems. Understanding them is not a priority, it is not even ours to worry about. Time would have been much better spent talking to trans widows. Agreed with comments you need to add a Lesbian to the team. DJ Lippy would be great
@@Imsuper656 doesn't effect women and kids directly in terms of safeguarding so not something I wish to think about. Same would apply though. If that is what they are doing, they should leave gay men the hell alone.
Men’s sexuality seems like it can get so easily broken and misdirected. You don’t see women buying men’s dirty underwear and socks on the internet to masturbate with.
My respect and gratitude for Helen Staniland's ability to calmly articulate women's position in this mess just went up several times. I am so glad she spoke up to Blanchard's angry rant against women at the end. And he did the little blow off smirk and okay after she finished. He clearly doesn't understand women's positon in this or how society molds and trains women's submission and support of abusers. Blanchard knows about as much about being a woman as AGPs do. There are holes in Blanchard's ideas that I can drive a clown car through. His job was to "transition" people so his theories support "transitioning". Still a male fetish! And I would ask any eagle eye to rewatch this episode and see Blanchard's obvious misogyny.
Agreed. I don't know how long I could've sat there patiently hearing this kinda stuff and though she didn't say much (because they were talking over her most of the time...), I'm glad she got a final word in towards the end during Ray's angry rant on women and it was a very important one, the subject of female socialization and hopefully if they do bring Ray back in the future, they'll talk more about it and how Trans ideology takes advantage of it towards women.
@@wellsorted you seem to say "society molds and trains women's submission and support of abusers" as an excuse for them doing so. I am asking you if there are men who are also "trained" and "moulded" by society to support male abusers of women and if they are then also excused.
helen it's so true. women have different experiences and it's more dangerous and difficult for them to oppose men. even women (mainly younger girls) who want to fight for justice and for women rights feel the need to specify they don't "hate" men (like criticizing and analysing male violence was an attack to all men themselves) and actually they want to help men too, they also are victims and "focusing on women somehow hurts men" etc, often shifting the focus from women to men - like the simple act of centering women was aggressive vs men. the "most marginalized and targeted" group (as trans people are described everywhere) hold a huge power over women just because of this victim representation they give of themselves, and the fact they're males has a role in this too imo. women that aggressive and with such a large % of sexual crimes would never get this amount of power among other women.
We all often feel the need to say "not all x" and it's just fuzzy language stuff. I see a lot of women sayng "Men do this. Men do that". I know they don't mean all men but rhetoric translates badly to some and 1 in 10 people really do mean "all men". Regardless, it feels like an attack. We all know what this is like cause it's the same for talking about men, trans or whatever. So, now and then.. we say "not all men" or "not all trans people" or whatever, to deliniate. It's annoying. It feels like we shouldn't have to but there it is. Doesn't hurt, I suppose.
Even *if* you had tweeted something hateful, as long as you are not directly harassing or threatening someone, it should not be a police matter. The attitude to freedom of speech in this country is disgraceful.
@@VF555xx Exactly! insane, an anonymous man's online threat to woman has more precedent for violence in the real world than a woman posing a threat to a "transwomen" aka a fucking man.
Ray trying to deflect the blame for AGP's originally being told to 'live as a woman' ( including invading women's spaces ) and given x sex treatments, by a typical MRA tactic at the end there was an unexpected twist. Majority of abuse I've received has been overwhelmingly from males. The additional behavioural issues we often see alongside AGP - entitlement, narcissism, sexism, rage, violence, co morbid paraphilias has made this a very dangerous condition to unleash on society. None of this was acknowledged nor links to porn. If we can't put Jack back in the box we have to keep him out of women's rights and spaces. Done being kind. Repeal the GRA. Build third spaces. Ray - women were never asked if we wanted to share our private spaces with males. We didn't then and we don't now.
I think we might need to start locking them up until we can figure out what the hell is going on. I seriously wonder if the messing around in utero (by the likes of Maria New) hasn't adversely affected the mental stability of feminised male foetuses.
@@humanistanimal Lock up 3% of all males? That's... ambitious. That's almost as many men as there are gay men. (Estimate of the number of men with AGP comes from Lawrence 2011.)
@@humanistanimal Yes, and might be inflating the numbers because of it. But Lawrence does acknowledge it's a very rough estimate. Blanchard says in the interview that he thinks it's probably less than that.
Sry for flooding but impt to add why blanchard says dont blame men ... hard to take responsibility but facts n stats show where vast majority of the harm lies imho.
I'm not a psychologist but I have real difficulty accepting that misogyny (even if unconscious) is not a cause or at least a factor in the development of AGP. The whole concept frames women as fetish object and collection of stereotypes of femininity rather than human beings in our own right. For centuries, we were regarded as men's property as were the children women gave birth to and even the money they earned or inherited.
THANK YOU for bringing this up!!! Blanchard speaks as though this “sexuality” just arises out of nowhere. It doesn’t explain ANY fetishistic behaviour to say “it’s just the way things are” and not examine WHY he thinks this is the case.
How many straight men see women as fetish objects and a collection of stereotypes, rather than as people? Plenty. Does that mean that misogyny causes heterosexuality?
I’ve got to say, I don’t think there was nearly enough push back to some of the things Blanchard got away with saying unquestioned. The case he mentioned about the fetishistic AGP acting out for entirely sexual purposes… was approved as a good candidate? I kept waiting for someone to say “oh my god, that’s disgusting.” But nobody did. And “living as a woman” = “wearing dresses” isn’t this what we’re supposed to be against? One thing no one mentioned is that the manifestation of AGP is entirely sexual. No one thought to ask ‘is it really a good idea for to enable these men to unleash their sexual appetite on the whole of public society? Is it really healthy for them to give into the fetish all day, every day? What about the impact that has on women and women’s rights? What does it mean for how they see women as things they can possess and perform?’ Also, his conclusion on how AGP is innate is unscientific and baseless. You shouldn’t have just let him say that as if it’s a proven fact. Porn is absolutely an influence. There are too many accounts for it not to be the case. I don’t think he answered Jennifer’s question honestly either. In order for a man to act on AGP, he has to have some misogynist values; varying degrees from man to man, but you can’t say that the sexual fetishization of owning a woman’s body is not inherently misogynistic. And Ray making a final pop at women for his last word, as if men aren’t the billionaires driving the movement, as if men aren’t the ones taking advantage of women and benefitting the most; bless Helen for speaking up, but fuck off Ray. Idiot doesn’t even know that Elmer Fud is the hunter and the pig is PORKY PIG.
Cant wait for Karen to record a response to his shite. Ugh, and half the time after he said something heinous Arty would be like WOW SO DEEP AND INSIGHTFUL 🥴 Arty was fanboying hard- and it makes sense, really, I mean him and Ray both have quite a bit of interest and EmPaThY for the men in full-time womanface.
clownworld heretic same. Too bad they likely wouldn’t have Karen on to talk about this from a woman’s perspective. She’s certainly read enough about AGP. At least Graham and Helen were pushing back and asking slightly challenging questions a little bit at times (not enough), but I have to wonder if Arty’s “empathy” (I would say enabling) for AGP is a bit of a bad influence.
@@PhoenixWolfAnime Arty is a fraud who's getting attention for being an ally when his actual concern for women is shallow and performative. No man in their right mind would sit through as many shows as he has an$ come to the con lusion that AGPs need compassion. And certain not from women. Hes a disgrace and has no right taking a spot away from an actual woman to talk about this. This is not affecting gay men, its affecting all females, and yet he sits there nodding his dopey head and is not listening to any of what the women have to say, but rather ignoring them and putting out b.s. about how AGPs an orientation and women need to be respectful and compassionate. NO, it is not. And NO, we do not.
@@clownworldhereticmyron1018 yes I noticed this too. It was basically an excited conversation between the two of them about male sexuality, and with no consideration given to women and AGPs' children at all.
I’m sorry I just can’t believe that some of this isn’t caused by porn, which is part of our culture. Example - a man finds himself turned on by high heeled shoes. Now, if we lived in a century in which they had not yet been invented, I think it’s hardly likely that someone would have conceived of a shoe fetish. Nor could I imagine it if high heeled shoes had been coded as menswear all of this time. I honestly think some of these sex researchers just won’t permit themselves to believe that porn is ever a problem.
@Marjia Adamskiā They were originally intended for horse-riding, to keep feet in the stirrups. Of course ladies rode side-saddle. Walking in them is damaging to feet and legs. I love it when, on a night out, women just give up trying to walk in heels, and go barefoot. Don't carry those tortuous contraptions home with you - throw them away!
@Marjia Adamskiā That's a derailing point. Louis XVI or whomever it was did not wear stilettos. Modern high-heels are devices to sexualize women and limit their mobility. Why be so disingenuous?
Arty really comes across as a fanboy. What was that pathetic story about working in the same building as Ray? I noticed Graham cut in to try and save Arty from his obvious ‘fanboy homage to the sexologist god’ moment.
What about the plight of the trans widows and the children of the marriage? The only major mention of women was Ray Blanchard turning his fire on them towards the end!
Thank you Archibald. I had to leave the chat because Blanchard arrogantly does not address the wives and children. I have a very negative take on Blanchard now, and I get why he refused to answer the letter I sent him 20 years ago. The only thing I come away with is that Blanchard says the connections btw AGPs and teens are spurious. Of course, he takes no responsibility. No understanding of the flaws in his own very research.
@@happilyretired2868 Brava! I was following you in the chat. I really wish Helen had picked up on some of the comments, not that they would have let her speak anyway.
@@femalism1715 I appreciate that, FL! I was trying to make cogent refutations. The fact is, we are all being gas lit, when told we must affirm anyone who pretends they are someone else.
I like Graham and, obviously, Helen and this show is good for a recap but I do love Karen Davis and TT Exulansic for an uncompromising female perspective.
Empathy isn't the strong suit of most men..no, not all men, but I think a very high percentage lack empathy for women. I think this has gotten worse bc of porn. We are seen as objects now.
Arty, I'm sorry, but this was a poor response from you. I understand that when Ray came out with that at the end, you might not have been expecting it and didn't have time to digest it, but you completely glossed over the mic-drop women-blaming comment he came out with. Instead of supporting Helen, you thought it was more important to extend sympathy to poor Ray who has to work in this difficult field, rather than risk upsetting this important man by supporting Helen and disagreeing with him. I understand that in this kind of video interview situation it must have been really awkward, and you were probably trying to smooth the waters at the end of the video, but it was the wrong call and came across as a bit fawing.
@@Asphyxia612 strangely I often think she interrupts Graham often not letting him finish his point. It’s usually Arty who is the most silent. She was quiet because she didn’t like what she was hearing, which seems a little hypocritical.
While I have read some of Blanchard’s work I do not believe he is on the same page as the rest. Some of the comments made my stomach turn. Seems to have a genuine dislike of women and seems to think it’s acceptable for fetishistic men to access women & children’s spaces. Helen is fantastic though. So on point, zero BS.
Right. They say they may have him on again and hopefully next time we''ll have more input from Helen and hopefully an additional woman guest (please let it be Karen Davis).
What was worse was the apparent non-reaction from Arty and Graham. I'm giving Graham the benefit of the doubt as he seemed somewhat fatigued by being sidelined in the discussion. Arty... I want to know what his deal is.
yes, and it was the very animated, defensive anger in his little speech about "cis hetero women" that was was so deeply disconcerting. If he merely wanted to make a point that many women, too, are complicit, he could have done so without that unwarranted vitriolic energy - smacks of misogyny. Hope we don't hear from him again. He seems very old guard in his attitude and approach. Perhaps there are people who could offer more current, and more feminist (?!) analyses.
@@CatrionaRuadh Absolutely. Nobody here is in denial that there are women who cheerlead for the trans agenda but the way he talked sounded like he was shifting so much of the blame onto women as a whole. Very unpleasant tactics.
@@NenaDiMartinez Are you saying women are not responsible when they protest and advocate for trans rights? (In much larger numbers than men do). When are women responsible? Ever?
A little too much sympathy for AGPs on display throughout. Women are better off without these men, and we should not have to endure their presence or their behaviour.
Blanchard said on Twitter that he only realized in the late summer of 2021 that "GC" feminists are critical of gender itself, not just of transgenderism. Which indicates he has chosen to ignore what feminists have been saying since de Beauvoir published "The Second Sex" in 1949. He's willfully tuned out 70 years of feminist analysis and activism.
@@crista6899 not really...she made a good point that's all. But seeing how vicious some of these handmaids are, you have to draw a line between understanding and telling them to fu%k off.
Well the end of this video wasn't awkward AT ALL, was it??! This was a sneaky move by Ray, and was an unsolicited final note too. It very much seemed like he had kept that comment in his pocket so he could mic drop at the end. I don't think he wanted to debate that view and allow Helen time to respond, although respond she did. Under the surface, despite the effect this has had on women' rights, it seems like what he's really annoyed about, what he REALLY cares about, is that men are being unfairly tarnished in this debate. Unbelievable that when women participate in anything bad, these men expect them to shoulder at least 50% of the blame.
How proud was Blanchard of his grandiose analogy that dressing up as something you're not to get psychological relief/sexual gratification is the same as a diabetic needing insulin to NOT DIE?! And to have the temerity to go on a podcast and, again, grandiosely make a point of ending on a chauvanistic statement blaming women for the perverted, vile, misogynistic, abusive behaviour of men - which he has enabled - thereby singling out the lone female host and putting her in a horrible position, then dismissing her passionate, and very valid, rebuttal with a smile and an 'okay' - deplorable.
Was writing a considered comment but in the end, I deleted it. Think I can sum it up more succinctly by saying that this Mess was a mess. Props to Helen for standing up for the female side of things and also Graham for his efforts. I think this interview would have perhaps been better if it had been a one on one between Arty and Ray on his own channel.
I have no interest in watching a fan boy gush over a misogynist clinician who has enabled paraphilic men to use women as props in their sexual fetish and then tries to blame women for what he did.
@@toni6053 Well said. I think most of us with any sense found it all thoroughly distasteful. It disturbs me that Arty is probably totally oblivious as to why this episode and the way he was in it has upset many viewers. Are we supposed to watch the next one and go back to believing that he's staunchly on the side of women after this embarrassing performance? Only Helen provided any resistance to the revolting misogyny that was being displayed by their guest. I'm all for having controversial people on but not if the interviewer/s willfully ignore any questionable opinions and fail to bring them to account. I've loved TMWI since it started but I feel I've lost some confidence in the set up now. I suppose it would be too much to ask Arty to explain himself?
@@OuterSpaceOwl tbh I expect Arty just feels attacked right now and probably angry and upset that he's getting this much flak, but he needs to reflect on the fact women are not obliged to be willing props in our exploitation. Not one of them questioned Blanchard on why he and his fellow clinicians set themselves up as gatekeepers without apparently ever discussing the ethics of giving paraphilic men their permission to deceptively use women in their fetish. I don't always agree with the mess but I think it is important to see things from different perspectives but this one has proper lost me.
? He described women’s sex drives as different from men, said paraphilias were less common in females, accurately referred to the ROGD phenomenon amongst girls, etc.... evidently his expertise concerns male paraphilias, but isn’t that why he was invited to speak...?
@@ebflegg as I said I think it was good he spoke and he is obviously very knowledgeable about men and he was very interesting, but the way he spoke about women I think was a little dismissive at times.
@@polopadic7954 some women don’t. And most can’t through vaginal penetration alone. Way too many men don’t care about their partner’s pleasure, and a whole lot of women fake orgasm.
@@rexlandy2996 Yeah AGPs are not abusive to women, as if their whole schtick is not impersonating sexist tropes of women, as if that is not misogyny. As if these men didnot entrench their misogynist fetishes, while believing women were objects, from the first moment. That he thinks this is innate orientation is uUnbelievably blind. He is a gaslighting MRA. I am sure he grew up as a misogynist, but some way, some how, I think woman has hurt his fragile ego, recently, and true to form, he lashes out at women. That anger is a little too big, alittle too rehearsed. And his misogyny just jumped out throughout the interview (that was conducted mostly with Arty as his yes man), but then he delivered a full slap at the end, which was obviously planned by him. Arty needs to go. He postured AGP once again as another sexual orientation, which completely ignores some of the major aspects of AGP. He was a pig in sheet, maneuvering the discussion to his preconceived beliefs. The way Helen was treated was also despicable. These men are determined to make a fool of her. Leave Helen, do your own thing and the viewers will follow you and leave this putrid pile misogyny behind.
@@harrison6143 The pic of the ribbons tied onto a fence was in the 'shape of a noose' so he was really scared. I like mentally and emotionally strong men, the complete opposite of 'men' like Paisley.
Something important: Both Freud and Baumeister (although he is not in the same league as F in terms of influence or body of work) believe men create culture. Certainly they have an incredible influence on culture. But male power is used to keep "lesser men" and women "in their place." But women create culture also. It's just that we have to look deeper into history outright and use the investigative techniques of other disciplines to discern women's part. It is that we must learn to see more clearly and understand better what women do and what women have done, have written,. Men have traditionally ignored the work and the contribution of women. To see the work and the importance of women in culture (and not exclusively the culture of the home and how that shifts in response to other forces in society) requires a monumental shift in perspective. Most men are not ready for that shift. They keep refusing to see it. Women know the pushback from men and the danger of opposing men, as Helen implicitly and explicitly explained. That's why liberal women and conservative women exist. That is why there is a rather alarming so-called traditional woman on the USSC now. That is why even when edited by women, literary journals are loathe to speak in women's voices even when allowing in a minority fashion women's articles to appear in those journals. That's why there are so many women who support the patriarchal churches or extreme orthodox Judaism and conservative Judaism, or any religion whatsoever. And why women are so mistreated within Islam and Hinduism and Sikhism and Buddhism and speak out at their peril or simply speak out to totally deaf ears. There are always good men and good women. But the definition of good men has never included speaking up for women. Even for men, doing so also is dangerous, because so few men do it. Graham's experience bears this out.
The point stressed by Ray that pornography cannot create an autogynephiliac ‘a nuovo’ in his words, begged the second question about what does create the conditions in a young person or child that leads to them experiencing this type of pornography as a ‘revelation’, again in Ray’s words. I don’t have much doubt that all our sexual flowerings (and much else) come from the cultural and social soup we arrive into at birth. So what is already present in the mini autogynephile that responds with a shock of recognition to the viewing of that type of erotica? I assume he isn’t saying it’s part of our genetic makeup? Our personality? If that was the case it would occur in women, at least more than it does. Also we wouldn’t see such different sexual habits and customs in different societies if society itself wasn’t the thing that ‘planted’ the seed. I really wanted to know if he’d done any research at all into the primal part of these leanings. I get the feeling he hadn’t. I also felt he was uninterested in the social and cultural obstacles that women live through, the things that shape us ongoing, everyday, in a way that doesn’t flow the same way back to men. As Helen touched on at the end.
This is very confusing - why would any ‘gender-critical’ person be interested in hearing from someone who spent a significant amount of his career approving reassignment surgery? Not sure why Graham is getting so excited.
Because Blanchard is the one who figured out autogynephilia and presented robust evidence that it's real. Trans activists hate him with unbridled fury because he demonstrated that AGPs are typical males with a paraphilia--not actually 'women on the inside'.
@@SchrodingersTransCat blanchard just put a name on what women who've been mocked in various ways by men since birth know is a reality. well-paid, fetish-enabling men like Ray are heard, women are not. i'm very sorry i ever used a term coined by the man.
@@jenniferk9082 Have you heard of Henry Osborn? He was president of New York's American Museum of Natural History in the early 20th century. By most accounts, he was a racist arsehole who pushed eugenics. He was also the guy who named and described Tyrannosaurus Rex. Should we stop using his name for that dinosaur because we don't like his political views?
I stopend watching when I saw Graham talking over GNC Centric (who is way more intelligent than him) ages ago, and then she left the show. And I was like welp, guess I'm out too.
As I said in the chat- ALRIGHT HELEN!! I'll say that Blanchard is brilliant, valuable to this conversation, and experienced in his field, I appreciate his contributions more than I can say. However I am also so thankful to have a woman's voice in this. At the very end, when it was mentioned by Blanchard that there's a lot of women behind this movement as well (sadly very right!), Helen bravely reminds the men why this is, at least the primary motivators (which explains why it's primarily straight women behind the men in charge of this movement). Men are fighting for men. And women are fighting for men. Because men are [generally] socialized to prioritize themselves and what they want, while women are socialized to prioritize men and do what they want. Do whatever you need to get by. Don't be seen as a prude nor wh*re, not too "easy" but not too mouthy. So much so that even mainstream liberal feminism has come to revolve around the interests of men- porn, prostitution, TQ+. Thank you all, and I appreciate you ALL for having this conversation. Love to all of you ❣️
I concur: YAY Helen! That would have been a crushing way to end without Helen's final DEFENSE. This doctor reflects where the field has gone: he is unimpressive at best; an average run-of-the-mill misogynist - which warps his psychological generalizations. Having heard him interviewed by women psychologists, I anticipated this
I totally disagree. So many women are behind this movement not because they are taught to prioritize the feelings of men, but because ideological capture, whether it's critical race theory, intersectionality, or gender ideology, is considered the "right side of history."
@@simfimpim Who determined this cause to be the right side of history? MEN and their handmaidens. Young lesbians today who support this know nothing of the lesbian struggles within the USA women's movement, the indoctrination of lesbians to side with gay men during the 90s police abuse, the identification with gay male attitudes towards sex.
@@simfimpim that's certainly how they rationalize it, but imo the way more women than men support these people and the way even feminist groups (Lol) and feminist discourse have been totally captured and hijacked by queer groups (that are usually lead by males) can have another explanation too. Otherwise we should think that women are more susceptible to ideological capture, and I don't think that's the case. Of course they want to feel righteous and they would never want to be seen as "bad" (a motivational driver behind many clueless leftists in the gender war), but there is also a way bigger backslash vs women when they dare to step out of line. Are women more interested in social justice for some reason, and consequently are more susceptible to the emotional blackmail of the whining transactivists? maybe, but we should also not forget that a the voice of a woman out of the chorus is perceived way differently. just look at the "karen" meme. women who speak for themselves and their rights are seen as evil, entitled, spoiled, privileged. women interested in protecting women spaces are seen as evil maiden aunts: how dare they focus on their safety and dignity, how dare they have boundaries.
I can accept everything Ray said and still say women aren’t here to affirm the paraphilias of men. And if society, particularly men in society, weren’t so homophobic in there treatment of very feminine men behaving and dressing however they wanted then maybe there’d be less inclined to think the only way they can live comfortably alongside those homophobic men in society is to escape them by transitioning to gain protection from women in our spaces.
Such a good point about society being homophobic and patriarchal. In fact in Iran, where a gay guy can be legally executed, and where a feminine man would be viciously excoriated by other men even if he wasn't gay, the government happily pays for the guy to get "feminization" surgery and live as a woman. "Trans the gay away" is just the 21st century version of conversion therapy from the 1990s; and I'm so scared for the children growing up in this climate of homophobia.
I agree, women aren’t here to affirm men’s fetishes or any male sexual behaviour. It seems to me the reason men like Blanchard enabled AGP men in the first place, is because they see women as nothing more than objects to be used for men’s sexual pleasure, they simply don’t care how enabling AGPs negatively impacts women. Homophobia is rooted in misogyny, the idea behind homophobia (when it is directed at gay men), is that it is women who are created to be used as sexual objects by men, so when men have sex with other men, they are viewed by other men as lowering the social status of all men to women’s status. This is why men punish them and want to push them into a ‘non men’ category or the women category. And this is exactly what we see in Blanchard’s own words ‘…one way societies can deal with homosexual individuals, give them a role, let them be useful, but treat them as something different’. In my opinion societies treat gay men as ‘non man’, so that the category of men retains its high social status and women’s remains low, it is a way to ensure a male dominant society is not threatened. Historically homosexual behaviour between men was often acceptable in some societies and even widespread, as long as the men involved didn’t threaten the social order. For example, in ancient Rome it was acceptable for male slave owners to have sex with their male slaves, as long the male slave owner was the one doing the penetrating. It was acceptable for men to have sex with other men in the Roman army, as long as the man doing the penetrating was of a higher rank than the man being penetrated. In other ancient societies e.g. Greece, etc, it was acceptable for young males and older males to have sex together, as long as the older male (who had higher social status) was the one who was doing the penetrating, it was even considered a rite of passage for young males in some of these societies (many would consider that CSA). Then there are societies where some men are put into a ‘third sex’ category and it is considered acceptable for men to have sex with these men, e.g. in India, Thailand, etc. In a male dominant society sex is inextricably linked to social status, i.e. there are those who are for men’s sexual use; who have a lower social status, and those who are the users; who have a higher social status. My point is male homosexual behaviour can be accepted in a male dominant society, as long as the men involved know their place in society, and don’t threaten the system of male dominance. By saying some ‘feminine’ gay men can be moved into the women category, they are allowing them to be gay in a way that does not threaten the system of male dominance, the ideology is misogynistic and homophobic at its core.
The worst mess ever. Sorry. Ray Blanchard hasn't got a clue about the male-female dynamics in society. His lack of awareness annoyed me. Women are having a hard enough time in this debate without his negative contribution based on his male world perspective.
I agree. I have my doubts about it being based on lack of awareness though. He's a learned man so it's not outside his capability to be more aware, just not a priority I think.
@@elizabethwalker7756 I think he was the one to get Graham to mute her a few messes back. Graham takes a lot of personal abuse from trolls but Karen asked 1 question and boom! time out
I do want to add one more thing. If Blanchard was at a place encouraging an elderly man to have these Cosmetic surgeries back in 1980, I am quite certain it wasn’t women encouraging that back then. I had never heard of anyone suggesting that transsexuals were women before the mid 1990’s, and even then, it was rare to hear that as a statement. His assertion that women are proponents of tra, is also ignoring all of us who oppose, and it ignores the numerous women who have been chased out of public discourse with proverbial pitchforks for objecting. Because women are erased from the discussion, it leaves the very few Aunt Lydia’s that are visible, making it appear that women are larping for this, when it is, in fact, a very small minority of women pushing this bs. Ray needs to get his facts straight there.
Ray had some nerve to turn the situation that we're in back on women when Helen mentioned earlier in the video that the reason why so many women went along with (and still go along with) trans ideology is because of female socialization. Women are raised and brought up differently than men, not taught to be as assertive (especially towards men), more so back in the day and I'm glad that Helen doubled down on this again towards the end when Ray was ranting about how women are just as much to blame for the gender woo madness. Look at what happened to women like JK Rowling, Maya Forstater, the one elderly woman who got assaulted at a speakers' corner by TRAs back in 2017, and just any woman who dares to go against the tranz ideology. They get harassed, location doxxed, r@pe threats, jobs threatened (some even fired from their jobs), and even physically assaulted sometimes. Other women will see this behavior and be too afraid to come out against the ideology for fear of being made an example of by the ire of TRAs and thus, they feel like they have to go along with the ideology or risk damaging their lives in the process and unlike JK Rowling, these are every day women who can't afford to lose their source of income. Female socialization is a hard (and sometimes even risky) thing for women to break out of. More men need to understand this when it comes to this topic.
All people are responsible for their choices. Male or female, right or wrong. Both men and women are intimidated into silence or even acquiescence. Crazy to say it's all one sex's fault, or that it can't be people from one sex's fault. It's difficult for everyone to stand up for the truth.
Exactly. Ppl need to keep their kink at home. I don't want to shame them, I just don't want to have to see that. This is just another Kink - no matter how scientifically Ray sees it.
Stigmatising AGP and driving it underground works hand in glove with denial of AGP in the TRA milieu. Thus the importance of a scientific light on the issue and an analysis of why TRA has such a misogynist slant. As Blanchard explained, these men have a drive that is easily turned against women who won’t give these men what they want.
It is frankly disgusting that Blanchard specifically mentions the culpability of women in all of this. It betrays his obvious disdain for women. Thank-you Helen for your rebuttal to this.
He was just stating a fact. Polling shows far more women in favour of "trans rights" than against to them, where it's the opposite among men. If there was any truth to Helen's claim about women being pressured to go along with men, then why do the polls show otherwise?
Why oh why are we supposed to give one single solitary damn about AGP men and their feelings? A man with a paraphilia will happily destroy the safety and comfort of every woman and child around him to indulge his fetish. And now these AGPs are now trying to enshrine their demands into law and criminalize actions by women who are trying to keep basic boundaries and safeguarding in place. I am fed up. Graham, I appreciate what you're trying to do but this wasn't on. Blanchard is the patron saint of perverts and misogynists and the harm he's done to women and children is unforgivable.
You have phrased this very well. I have great gratitude toward Graham and always will. He is doing a great service and he must have been stunned by the hate rant. Arty chooses to fawn over AGP men and treat them like innocent victims like any narcissists flying monkey. They are narcissistic sex fetishists-not poor confused victims. Narc's genius is playing the victim card while destroying lives. Helen pulled off what I never could have. Calmly answering this man who apparently barely registers women on the human scale.
@@wellsorted Agreed. Graham, at great personal cost to himself, has stood up for women and for that I will always be appreciative. Having Blanchard on wasn't malicious on his part but I do think he neglected to dig deep into Blanchard's history. He's an old school sexist practitioner who didn't consider as important the harm he was doing to women when he sent those AGP's into women's spaces.
@@nicksherreard1215 This may come as a shock to you but "engaging with" and "uncritically accepting the views of/enthusiastically fanboying over" are not the same. Engaging with different view points is important in order to test the reasonableness of your own views, and to ensure you dont have massive blindspots that can lead to false conclusions. Doesnt mean you have to change your mind or agree with the people you engage with.
The interview with RB was terribly disappointing. Really Arty and Glinner should've shut up already, and let Helen ask about women's interest in this mess. She is the one who should have been questioning RB from the get-go. Instead, we got to 1hr into the whole thing before she got to speak, nd then only 3m for her before Glinner jumps back in. (Her expression spoke volumes, though.) Arty was fascinated, not disgusted, and Glinner refers to women's anger while not putting Helen front and centre. Then at the end RB blames women for pushing the transsexual agenda, completely ignoring the pressures on women to conform to men's desires, especially sexual ones. What an idiotic cop-out on his behalf. (1) That guy who transitioned at 70?!!! Was that even ethical? What about e.g. osteoporosis? And was this man really led to think he would be able to live his life as a woman, given he'd lived 70 years as a boy, then a man? What about his family? (2) Why is no-one challenging RB's description 'sex reassignment', which is impossible? It sounds like a hangover from the old world of "sex changes" back when no-one believed women can have penises and most transsexuals were homosexual MTF. (3) Those men who liked masturbating in female underwear: if they were married, did RB ever talk to the wives, alone, and ask them how they would cope with their husbands' behaviour? I'm really surprised-no, scrub that. I am totally not surprised that RB apparently failed to consider when he was working, just how toxic and entitled AGPs can be for those around them, while here he expresses concern only on the societal level (what would happen if there were a "caste" of AGP men) and not about individuals. (4) Wanting to cut off a limb need not be a paraphilia. It could be an autofeedback/proprioception disruption where the brain does not recognize the limb as belonging to the subject.
I appreciate Blanchard's experience, knowledge and insight, but he is a man telling women that they have to go along with men's fantasy that men can call themselves women. He's been told numerous times on Twitter and I'm sure elsewhere, that he needs to be mindful of this. Men cannot be women, and what the H does 'LIVE AS A WOMAN' mean Dr. Blanchard? Because it is a mystery to all women. Women are not a dress, makeup, hair, clothes, presentation and they are not just a bunch of body parts that AGP men are thinking they are. This conversation is insulting to say the least, that a bunch of men are helping men to women's spaces, names and pretending that this is ALRIGHT. I too would like to hear what Helen thought, she was quiet, and I can only assume she was thinking similar things as the rest of all womanhood. When women have body dysphoria, it is about wanting to identify out of their sexualized oppression and if men don't understand this and just talk about women as if we are a minor side act to men in this, we aren't and won't make any progress. Great to have the conversation, but you need to bring in the feminist framework, stop talking about women, and not involving women's reality
I noticed that Arty had a lot more to say than usual. He was very animated esp. in the last half of the episode. Seems the others had a hard time getting a word in.
I diasagree about the porn. I don't think Dr Blanchard realizes how much porn is being consumed. That's right, Graham- "what if the cartoon was on 24 hrs a day?" Yes, Graham, you are right.
I don’t trust sexologists after finding out how much crap has gone into "researching and categorizing" human sexuality. We’re in this mess because they indulge these delusions which lead to them pathologizing (and excusing) yet another facet of male sexuality.
There have been recent studies about this. A very good article came out recently about the very real addiction of porn and how the taste for perversity and violence goes up all the time like any addiction.
Glinner @ circa 23:00 had the numbers reversed - in the Quillette article and elsewhere Blanchard & Bailey said 25% of the men were HSTS, 75% were AGP.
This convo overlooks all the men who went to places where no "gatekeeping" was done, such as the Bouros clinic in Casablanca and Stanley Biber's in Trinidad, CO. The only men subjected to "gatekeeping" were the ones who had to get approval coz the govt was going to pay, or who wanted surgery from an establishment medical center like Johns Hopkins.
I don't owe agp any compassion. I don't want those disgusting creeps anywhere near little girls and vulnerable women. If they want to feel better they need to cure their perversion, not force their perversion on the rest of society. And I'm not even a feminist. At all (saw my mom abusing my dad too much, I guess). But I'm on the side of radfem on that issue.
Wtf did I just watch? An AGP apology episode? Srsly? Am I supposed to think this helps the GC movement? How? So disappointed, specially with Arty... All starry eyed, and excited to host Blanchard, who didn't hesitate to show his true colours at the end. SMH...
It was a nauseating performance from Arty. Why do people fawn to the professions? As far as I can see it’s the meddling of men like Blanchard that has fucked us all.
I am angry after watching this episode. I absolutely do not agree that men with autogynaephilia should be treated with compassion. That is because autogynaephilia is founded in misogyny. The sexual arousal these men experience when they present or imagine themselves as women stems from their belief that women are sexual objects for consumption. In a society in which women are fully respected and seen as equal with men, there would be no autogynaephilia. I also fundamentally disagree with Blanchard that porn plays no role in this surge of rapid onset gender dysphoria. There is no way that a child's developing brain is not negatively impacted by constant consumption of hard core pornography.
Yes, children are exposed to and groomed with extreme, degrading misogynistic porn at earlier and earlier ages, which is a new thing. I think that this is quite possibly creating Parraphillias and is a hideous societal ill more generally as well. It's a large topic and I hope that various groups that are fighting it gain ground. There was a lot that could have been gone into more in this interview but time constraints and the sheer amount of overlapping and troubling issues within this topic meant that many things couldn't be dealt with much depth but I am pleased that AGP is being discussed openly even if imperfectly. The format of a live interview with a guest for a short amount of time constraints the exploration of a topic in a way that writing an article does not.
So basically what you're saying is that men who have sexual fantasies about women do so because they inherently only view women as sexual objects? Got it.
@@shannynmartin3157 If a white man found it arousing to dye his skin, undergo facial surgery, dress in stereotypical clothing and enact stereotypical behaviours he associated with black men, as he found it sexually arousing, I would consider that sexually objectifying black men. If a white man said what he found most arousing of all was the idea of being a black slave on a planation, and being treated badly due to being black, I would consider him to be aroused by racism. If one can see the revolting racism in this, but not the revolting misogyny in AGP, they need to figure out why they think misogyny is acceptable and why they don’t see women as humans worthy of respect.
@@carmelmulroy6459 maybe Graham should stop interrupting her which he does in other podcast and he is ware of this because he apologises for interrupting. Granted he's gotten better at not interrupting both of them but if "our own" is interrupting our own then they need to be called out on it.
Blanchard seems to see nothing wrong with enabling AGP men to violate women’s boundaries, as long as the man feels better about himself. Men like Blanchard prioritise what benefits men, over what is best for society, in particular what is best for women in society. The person who is confusing things here is Blanchard. AGP is clearly rooted in misogyny, to anyone who sees women as human beings who happen to be born female, and not as dehumanised objects. It is clear AGP men view women as nothing but sexist stereotypes, sexual submission, and dismembered body parts. It is a fetish that epitomises the misogyny in society. I would say men develop AGP because we live in a male dominated society, where women are viewed as dehumanised sexual objects, if we lived in a society where women were not viewed this way, I don’t think men would feel sexual arousal by imagining themselves as women. De-stigmatising and enabling it enables the misogynistic view of women driving AGP to become socially acceptable. That is before we even get into the fact these men violate women’s boundaries, and right to consent. In my opinion it is a fetish that should always be condemned, in a society that values women as human beings, who happen to be born the female sex. Blanchard also seems to simply ignore how the reward system in the brain works. There is plenty of evidence that when an object becomes associated with pleasurable feelings, that object itself can cause pleasure, such as addicts experiencing arousal in the pleasure centres of the brain when they see needles, as the pleasure from drugs becomes associated with needles, the click of a zippo lighter becomes associated with the pleasure that comes from smoking etc. Since sexual pleasure by its very nature is pleasurable, it would indicate that sexual likes can be conditioned in much the same way, and some have developed sexual desires for inanimate objects in this way. For example, someone feels sexual pleasure with and focuses on an object, and imbues the object with desirable qualities, after repeated incidences of feelings pleasure doing this, the thing itself becomes associated with pleasure and the desirable qualities the person has imbued in it, that object is then what the person is attracted to, and desires. The same with p0rn, if someone experiences sexual pleasure while watching it, and they repeatedly engage in it and feel pleasure when doing so, they reenforce the association with whatever is in the p0rn and pleasure, fairly soon the thing they are watching will become what they desire. It is the way the reward system in the brain works, the neuro connections become stronger, the more a person engages in a pleasurable activity. Blanchard, like many men, ignores this, because it does’t fit his view of the world.
I was definitely interested in hearing Graham’s point here and disappointed he was cut off but I guess in the heat of live discussion these things happen.
@@pollyjay1264 Fair enough. To me this didn't look like two people accidentally interrupting each other (happens a lot with online calls) so much as Arty running with that and doubling down/having a mini-tantrum.
Same. If there isn't some kind of apology or comment made in the next episode, and they carry on like this episode was some big triumph, I'll be most displeased!
I like this podcast, but I often think the interviews are badly planned. The Blanchard interview would have been much better had it involved Graham, Helen and Arty taking it in turns to ask Ray pre-planned questions. Instead, it felt like Graham and Arty vying with each other to ask Ray long anecdote-based questions (some of which were outside of Ray's remit anyway), while Helen (perhaps understandably) barely spoke.
@@Whitsundial but she did make her point quietly and with dignity, I felt Ray was waaaaay behind the agps of today, and after seeing Jennifer's interview which I felt was excused and mansplained away, he did not understand in any way the trauma this fetish inflicts on women and children unfortunate enough to be in the agp sphere. His disdainful attitude showed how much he is behind the ball. I really hope he never appears on THEAI anytime soon.
I’m glad it wasn’t all pre-written questions. Anyway all three of them had plenty of time to reflect on what they wanted to ask Blanchard about. For me, the main thing missing was commentary on how and why autogynephilia is so denied in the trans activist milieu. It seems to me that this denial underlies much of the aggressive and sexist behaviour, and the public ignorance of the issue and its significance. Blanchard is I think well aware of this and could have spoken to the issue
@@ebflegg With Graham, Helen and Arty, they’re so permanently exasperated by TRA nonsense that they almost can’t help but go off on endless tangents and sidebars. Graham in particular seems to have so many bugbears and theories about why all this madness is happening, that it’s almost too much for him to contain. I understand why that’s the case, and it works fine when the three of them are talking to each other. But it’s a terrible set-up for interviewing guests.
I'm sorry but I have to disagree with Ray on a few points - I know he is a so called 'expert' in this subject but I think the influence of social media and instant access to online porn has a massive impact on this subject especially in ROGD - the espedential rise in young girls transitioning is convincing enough to scream social contagion, we saw it with anorexia, self harm, bulimia etc. I think Graham was right with the comment "what if the the cartoon was on all day 24/7?" This is way more complexed and we may not ever get answers. I was also disappointed that he blames women, why can't men take responsibility for their actions - no one is forcing adult men to appropriate women they are doing it themselves and trying to make us play along with their delusion.
I love the term “misogyny” being bandied around for a lot of people to like that bloody top comment. God almighty. There is some delusion on this side of the fence as well.
Just a thought. Could not all the women that Mr "I failed an audition for a crowd scene extra part" has targetted in this way simply launch a joint counterclaim of harrasment and wasting police time?
A small faction of Scots are bringing such shame to us. Please believe me, the majority of us are nothing like the MPs in the Scottish National Party. The Glorious Leader should resign, so VILE. Nor are we like the shit messed up 'actors' and 'comedians'. I'm so sorry Ceri 💜
When Blanchard says that he believes that there has to be some latent aspect of a paraphilia in someone’s brain that allows them to then go forward with it after viewing it ( pornography, images etc) or reading about it, rather than a paraphilia being implanted from nothing due to viewing it, does he mean the latent aspect is neurological or psychological? Surely if it’s psychological then it could be ‘implanted’ especially if viewing is undertaken at a young age? There are transsexuals who have stated that their father was a cross dresser. Did these sons have the same neurological aspect as the father or was it the impact of the behaviour of their fathers on them at such a young age?
Blanchard's view is simple fetish formation. Some aspect of erotic pleasure arises from an early introduction of sensory excitement from objects. His complete approval and encouragement to make it inclusive to society is objectionable, repugnant.
@@Whitsundial calling these men women then is extremely repugnant for no other reason than a woman ( her body and her clothing etc) is objectified for erotic pleasure. How do these men ( Ray etc who worked in rbis field early on ) justify allowing these men into women’s spaces and us having to ( by law) consider them women. It’s misogyny of the highest degree.
Sexual desires for particuar things can be conditioned, many men don’t want to acknowledge this, as to do so raises too many questions that they don’t want to think about. Conditioning is when something pleasurable (such as sexual pleasure) is repeatedly paired with something that is not pleasurable in and of itself, e.g. an object, thought, image, scenario etc., resulting in it becoming associated with sexual pleasure. This association then causes that object, thought, image, scenario etc., to be the thing the person desires, as it has become associated with sexual pleasure. Some AGPs admit they have conditioned this fetish in themselves in this way. For example, this young man explains how he conditioned himself to be AGP, by pairing sexual pleasure with thoughts of being a women repeatedly, until the association became so strong he developed AGP. He says: ‘as a AGP when I was younger I would pretend to be a female during arousing myself. So I would do certian things to make myself look like a female, and I would very much arouse myself to that thought, and it become very, very strong I must say. Before I began doing this I wasn’t AGP, I wasn’t born with a sexual attraction to myself as a female. I don’t believe, you’re simply not born with this, it is something that is developed though something you have done, by a action. There has been a few talks, on whether a self directed target location stems from an inability for the brain to map out another person as a sexual target location, therefore it is targeted on something the brain knows very well, which is yourself. I mean this could be true. But as from my experience I can say 99% even a 100% that my experience that I had has caused this erotic target location error to be targeted on myself’. m.ua-cam.com/video/ZADqgmUSoVo/v-deo.html
@@RB-jl2qb i still get the feeling it's all about their mothers somehow - yeah i know freud was wrong but maybe on this one right? Im also thinking of when paris fell WW2 ... they blamed it on the young women ...lots of collaborators in this Mess
Two things in this episode were not entirely accurate: 23:10 Graham gets Blanchard's stats on the prevalence of HSTS and AGP the wrong way around. In that Quillette interview ('What is Autogynephilia?' 2019, Louise Perry), Blanchard said that AGPs were the majority even in the 80s: "When I looked at the relative numbers of autogynephilic and androphilic gender-dysphoric males back in 1987, the autogynephilic cases were already a majority, approaching 60 percent. The proportion had reached 75 percent by 2010, and it might be even higher now." 55:53 Ray Blanchard commits a shocking error: he says Elmer Fudd was a pig! That's Porky Pig, not Elmer Fudd! Elmer is the guy with the gun who is always hunting wabbits! BLANCHARD DEBUNKED! (... kidding.)
@@VioletFemme1111 Yes, I think the general public still assumes that most transwomen are HSTS, i.e. dysphoric homosexual males. "Well, they're into men--they're not going to perve on women in the changing room. What's all the fuss about?" Even if they've heard of AGP, they may think it's a rare phenomenon instead of the overwhelming majority. I've seen journalists dismiss it in a couple of lines like it's some quirky sideshow. Ironically, in the 90s and early 2000s, trans activists themselves insisted that AGPs must be rare. By the late 2000s, when the prevalence of fetishistic arousal among transwomen had become too well-documented to ignore, the activists did a U-turn and started claiming that it was evidence they were women on the inside. Because women like admiring themselves in the mirror too, right? It's totally the same thing as getting off on ironing! /s
That the men left absolutely no room for Helen to speak for the majority of this conversation (and yes, they were crowding her out), even while acknowledging that they were doing that, and then the slam at women in the end, says it all. It was in itself an analogy for women's position and voice in all of this. For Blanchard to speak with contempt towards the women who are supportive of what AGPs want and paint them as villains is just pure unadulterated blame-the-victim stuff. We are trained to have our voices blotted out unless we are helping men in some way. Yes, there is way more nuance to all of this than I've just written, but that is the overall truth of it. EDIT: Just watched Graham's emotional video about Arty and just want to say that while it was infuriating to watch the Blanchard video I would never intend my pushback to be bullying, and respect everyone involved. I hope they realize that, especially at the end, this interview just felt like a stab and the reaction is in proportion to the contempt that was shown for women. I appreciate everything that this videocast is trying to do and appreciate all of your hard work.
When those boys who claim to be women start to live like us, then I'll reconsider my position I want them to cook, clean, launder, chauffeur anda full time caretaker..
better conforming to that gender stereotype doesn't make them women any more than wearing dresses and lipstick. I don't expect we'll see it though. Selfishness is a big part of their decisions.
DP has another account he uses to creep on people who are critical of him. I forget the name, if I can find it ill post it here so everyone can block him.
The basic advice for anyone who is "invited" to visit the coppers for a discussion/chat is very simple-say nothing and get a lawyer.It is an intimidatory tactic and is often used when a complaint is received with little supporting evidence IE they are on a fishing expedition.I hope Ceri gives them nothing and lets them stew.
Blanchard's slam against women at the end is especially outrageous & offensive given that earlier he said he realizes how quickly & often men who are AGP become misogynistic & abusive to the women in their lives, subjecting them to behaviors the women find "degrading" & "repulsive" - & that the misogynistic abusiveness many of these men end up embracing gets directed at women more generally.
yeah wot a bitter sting. edit - shows he knows he's implicated, fears caught out?
I thought it was a reference to libfems, in which case he's not wrong. A huge problem in the fight against self-id is the handmaidens prostrating themselves to men in dresses.
I was disturbed by how he was saying that just because women experience behavior from ags that effect them the same way as misogeny recognized as the patriarchy doesn't mean it is the ideology of what is causing it. I am sure incels would argue it isn't the root of their ideology either - women not recognizing their superior manhood and not getting laid when they wanted is. Men from past decades would argue they were protecting women from themselves and their inferior intelligence. He waved off the effect on women while they all nodded along. AGs see women as props to their own desire, much like men that see women as a means to sex and an heir or a politician who needs to look just right. They have sexualized the idea of woman for their own fetish .I also didn't like that they were acting like AG were as legitimate in support for transition as someone with gender dysphoria, like we should all publicly fund and participate in a fetish as legitimate, like women don't find it insulting to say biological men who like to abuse their spouses and threaten biological women should be publically validated in surgeries that insult any woman without porn tits or a specifically feminine face? Might as well be Caitlyn Jenner, telling women the hardest thing about being a woman is deciding what to wear.
What he said is true though, women are much more likely than men to support trans rights.
So ur finally realising that this whole movement is full of misagnoistic?
If you have him on again ask him this: When you were sending all these men out to do the 'real life test', to what extent did you consider the needs and rights of women, into whose spaces you were sending them? Who gave you the right to do that? Did you even ask women what they thought?
@@eveeve9758 When the TRA say 'We've been using your toilets for decades', that is the fault of Blanchard and his colleagues who decided they could without ever asking us.
@@Gerry_Davies absolutely. Indeed, they told them they SHOULD.
And what does "live as a woman" even mean? Being female isn't playing dress up.
@@Gerry_Davies you don't think many of them were already doing it on their own? the man is a misogynist, but he was also treating many misogynists.
@@ilfautdanser9121 Blanchard and his colleagues gave them official permission.
Great point
(@25 min, look at Helen's face) So, Dr. Blanchard, my husband went off when I was nursing our months old baby and taking care of our 3 year old. Didn't know where he was. You make it sound like this was nothing. NOTHING. MY HUSBAND WAS AWOL. I HAD NO MONEY FOR CLOTHING AND FOOD.
Ray has to get a bit in about how women are also to blame, whilst at the same time completely ignoring the fact that it was the medical profession, male dominated at the time, that enabled this by coming up with a 'treatment' that supported men to perform their fetish in public. No one asked women if this was ok and it's just further proof that men don't see women as whole human beings. Nobody thought of the impact of this 'treatment' on women at all & no one held Ray to account for that. He's just seen as an expert, but he is also an enabler. Just because it was possible to do SRS doesn't mean it was ethical. It had an impact on society not just individuals & no one should've been telling these men it was ok for them to live 'as a woman,' because that would be impossible.
maybe after they saw Stepford Wives ... what could go wrong haha
Not only do they not see women as whole beings, they do not see women at all, as evidenced by three men largely ignoring and talking over the only woman in the room. I mean Graham tried a bit but Arty didn’t even seem to notice how much he dominated the conversation.
I agree. He also makes it sound like women were like "hm i'm bored, let's convince men to develop misogynistic fetishes that compel them to invade our spaces and erode our rights!"
Like sure there are lots of women enabling these abusive creeps but the abusive creeps still wield a lot of power over most women by virtue of being men. Men have been trained all their life to prioritize their sexual desires over all else, especially women's health or happiness. And women have also been trained to prioritize men's sexual desires over all else, even themselves.
Autogynephilic men are abusing women into this position and Ray here just blamed the women for being abused.
Absolutely disgusting. I have lost the little respect i had for him. His typologies may be useful but his enabling of them at the expense of women is unforgivable.
So it was Arty's let's understand and excuse Agp's show....it was pretty much a given this was where the mess was heading. Women do not have to pander to delusional or narcissistic men full stop. How many times and in how many ways do we have to tell men NO!
Why does Arty insist on defending AGPs? It baffles me.
@@Qrtuop honestly I really don't know it seems a real blind spot that he can't see the very act of men declaring themselves women and other men giving them permission to live 'stealth' as a woman' whatever the hell that means as a treatment for their sexual fetish is anything other than disgustingly abusive towards women. Reducing women and girls to forced props and validation tools in their delusional sexual fantasy of themselves will never cease to shock me.
@@Qrtuop Job security. He supposedly bartends at a trans bar where hardly anyone there knows how GC he is. i find that hard to believe in Tranada.
@@tweederslatour4105 Oh, good point about his job! I'd forgotten all about him bartending at a trans bar.
@@Qrtuop maybe arty is a closeted HSTS? doesnt strike me as a closeted AGP given he claims to be gay
Excellent point by Helen, that women live a very different life from men. Which is Why no male can ever fully understand what it’s like to be female. That’s why it’s insulting to women to suggest that a man is a woman, or a man that wears a dress is indistinguishable from a woman. He might have achieved a look & a persona, but he is still a man. Another aspect to add to Helen’s point, is that often mothers of males who become trans, have the motherly protection factor in there. Because of the way girls are raised, along with the messaging of society, the safety issue, and the mothering instinct of some women, this all contributes to women enabling men taking advantage.
Look, I don’t care if men want to wear dresses; we just have to stop affirming them, by agreeing to them being in female spaces, taking & twisting language, taking our sports. Open the bandwidth of being males and leave women alone.
Exactly!!
I don’t theoretically have a problem with mxn wearing dresses either. The problem is that in reality hetero mxn only do it for sexual reasons. Yes, some might do it as a laugh or to get attention for a moment but the reality is any het guy who wants to wear dresses for real is an AGP. There’s no way around it.
if paraphilias are innate, why are they tied to social norms (femininity & feminization, master/slave relationships ecc) and artificial gimmicks (certain clothes, shoes, etc)? how can julia serano's whipping girl be innate if it fetishizes a certain submissive social role for women? I'm not an expert at all, but I can't make sense of this. paraphilias (as opposed to orientations) sound learned to me cause they need stereotypes, tropes and gimmicks to fetishize.
Ray is very similar to sexologists, can't understand that there is a possibility of a world where women are not at the bottom.
@@kamrynloewen6978 well said, Sister
Autogynephilia is innate in the sense that an individual male has heterosexuality that is biased towards internal rather than external stimuli. The fetishism involving women's clothes comes from the erotic targeting that associates the clothing that covers certain areas (panties for example) that are hardwired into the brain of a heterosexual male.
@@kamrynloewen6978 He is a sexologist, isn’t he? What do you mean?
@@ebflegg I thought he was referred to as a psychologist, "sexologists" are medical professionals who try to study the act of sex. Most often presenting themselves as telling women and girls to indulge in the abusive fetishes of their husbands and boyfriends, and that if they don't like to just suck it up or "think about it in a different way." I would highly, highly suggest Sheila Jeffrey's various talks where she touches on the subject of sexologists, as she actually saw their rise in power and has an incredible mind.
While Helen was MAGNIFICENT in defending women in her little speech at the end, shame on Arty and Graham for also not speaking up against RB's misogynistic diatribe and blaming women. Helen should not have been left to defend women on her own.
Do you think Helen is incapable of holding her own? You think she needs Graham and Arty to come to her rescue?
When RB said some women are responsible for the rise in this ideology, he was right. Women are brought up to be nice, sympathetic, nurturing and kind and without realising they have held the door open wide for MRAs.
Helen pointed that out. She didn't need her "gang" to back her up.
@@talldrinkofwater5259 Judith Butler and Ruth Hunt are female. They haven’t done anything ‘kind’ because of their socialisation and without realising the implications. Attacking Blanchard won’t make uncomfortable facts go away. Being a real feminist means knowing that women have agency and they don’t always use it in the best interest of their sex
@@talldrinkofwater5259 I didn't mean that she wasn't capable of holding her own or needed 'rescuing'. But Arty and Graham should ALSO have spoken up many times during the discussion, especially when RB started to blame women. Instead, Arty just carries on dominating the discussion with his own interest.
I just meant that it should not be only Helen 'on her own' challenging RB. She did a good job.
To be fair, I genuinely think they may have been thinking 'wtfff'?? Helen was just the faster thinker in this situation but Ginner was about to say something. His face was slowly dropping throughout Ray's comment although I think he might have been smiling and nodding at one point. Not sure what on earth Arti was thinking though with his comment. It just seemed pandering after Ray's comment. It would be interesting to see what the discussion was off camera after this video.
@@ebflegg Women didn't make up "psychology" and "sexology" and called it "science". Women didn't make up a trans humanism or the "science" that is the normalisation and academification of male paraphilias, It's all men. -
is there ever going to be something men do that women aren't blamed for ???
has there ever been?
any examples anyone?
We have our own battles. We don't need to understand AGPs we just need them to stay the hell away from women and kids. AGPs themselves say they were affected by hypno cissy porn. Also if it isn't a fetish why do so many have other fetishes ? The Bugs Bunny thing was one of JS and even he says he doesn't know reality from retrospective justification any more. The woman stuff at the end was out of the MRA playbook. Blanchard is not a detached professional. No professional totally is. His perspective has also bern formed by working with AGP men, so will be slanted. This issue is divisive and is causing problems. Understanding them is not a priority, it is not even ours to worry about. Time would have been much better spent talking to trans widows. Agreed with comments you need to add a Lesbian to the team. DJ Lippy would be great
You don't belive that women can have a fetish about wanting to be a gay man?
@@Imsuper656 doesn't effect women and kids directly in terms of safeguarding so not something I wish to think about. Same would apply though. If that is what they are doing, they should leave gay men the hell alone.
Well said Lesley!
She’s bisexual
Men’s sexuality seems like it can get so easily broken and misdirected. You don’t see women buying men’s dirty underwear and socks on the internet to masturbate with.
My respect and gratitude for Helen Staniland's ability to calmly articulate women's position in this mess just went up several times. I am so glad she spoke up to Blanchard's angry rant against women at the end. And he did the little blow off smirk and okay after she finished. He clearly doesn't understand women's positon in this or how society molds and trains women's submission and support of abusers. Blanchard knows about as much about being a woman as AGPs do. There are holes in Blanchard's ideas that I can drive a clown car through. His job was to "transition" people so his theories support "transitioning". Still a male fetish! And I would ask any eagle eye to rewatch this episode and see Blanchard's obvious misogyny.
Agreed. I don't know how long I could've sat there patiently hearing this kinda stuff and though she didn't say much (because they were talking over her most of the time...), I'm glad she got a final word in towards the end during Ray's angry rant on women and it was a very important one, the subject of female socialization and hopefully if they do bring Ray back in the future, they'll talk more about it and how Trans ideology takes advantage of it towards women.
@@KaiDecadence I have a feeling Ray doesn't care much about women's opinions.
And society doesn't mold and train men's submission and support of abusers?
@@aaron4952 ?
@@wellsorted you seem to say "society molds and trains women's submission and support of abusers" as an excuse for them doing so. I am asking you if there are men who are also "trained" and "moulded" by society to support male abusers of women and if they are then also excused.
4th mother to be targetted, Kellie Jay/Posie Parker has also had this experience.
Very specific and purposeful targeting. Hedging your bets by exploiting the vulnerability of women with dependents, TRAs?
helen it's so true. women have different experiences and it's more dangerous and difficult for them to oppose men. even women (mainly younger girls) who want to fight for justice and for women rights feel the need to specify they don't "hate" men (like criticizing and analysing male violence was an attack to all men themselves) and actually they want to help men too, they also are victims and "focusing on women somehow hurts men" etc, often shifting the focus from women to men - like the simple act of centering women was aggressive vs men. the "most marginalized and targeted" group (as trans people are described everywhere) hold a huge power over women just because of this victim representation they give of themselves, and the fact they're males has a role in this too imo. women that aggressive and with such a large % of sexual crimes would never get this amount of power among other women.
We all often feel the need to say "not all x" and it's just fuzzy language stuff. I see a lot of women sayng "Men do this. Men do that". I know they don't mean all men but rhetoric translates badly to some and 1 in 10 people really do mean "all men". Regardless, it feels like an attack. We all know what this is like cause it's the same for talking about men, trans or whatever. So, now and then.. we say "not all men" or "not all trans people" or whatever, to deliniate. It's annoying. It feels like we shouldn't have to but there it is. Doesn't hurt, I suppose.
Even *if* you had tweeted something hateful, as long as you are not directly harassing or threatening someone, it should not be a police matter. The attitude to freedom of speech in this country is disgraceful.
@@VF555xx Exactly! insane, an anonymous man's online threat to woman has more precedent for violence in the real world than a woman posing a threat to a "transwomen" aka a fucking man.
"I am standing in the light and I find myself unafraid" Ceri. Awesome.
What a brilliant quote from a brave woman
@@tuanwhiting So brave that she blocks criticism. Worship someone else who can actualy handle a debate.
@@DaveThompsonfairlife4all you shouldn't talk about yourself like that it's clearly a deflection and find you insignificant,run along little boy.
@@DaveThompsonfairlife4all What were you debating with her about when she blocked you, out of curiosity?
Ray trying to deflect the blame for AGP's originally being told to 'live as a woman' ( including invading women's spaces ) and given x sex treatments, by a typical MRA tactic at the end there was an unexpected twist. Majority of abuse I've received has been overwhelmingly from males.
The additional behavioural issues we often see alongside AGP - entitlement, narcissism, sexism, rage, violence, co morbid paraphilias has made this a very dangerous condition to unleash on society. None of this was acknowledged nor links to porn. If we can't put Jack back in the box we have to keep him out of women's rights and spaces. Done being kind. Repeal the GRA. Build third spaces. Ray - women were never asked if we wanted to share our private spaces with males. We didn't then and we don't now.
I think we might need to start locking them up until we can figure out what the hell is going on. I seriously wonder if the messing around in utero (by the likes of Maria New) hasn't adversely affected the mental stability of feminised male foetuses.
@@humanistanimal Lock up 3% of all males? That's... ambitious. That's almost as many men as there are gay men.
(Estimate of the number of men with AGP comes from Lawrence 2011.)
@@SchrodingersTransCat Lawrence is an AGP.
@@humanistanimal Yes, and might be inflating the numbers because of it. But Lawrence does acknowledge it's a very rough estimate. Blanchard says in the interview that he thinks it's probably less than that.
Sry for flooding but impt to add why blanchard says dont blame men ... hard to take responsibility but facts n stats show where vast majority of the harm lies imho.
I'm not a psychologist but I have real difficulty accepting that misogyny (even if unconscious) is not a cause or at least a factor in the development of AGP. The whole concept frames women as fetish object and collection of stereotypes of femininity rather than human beings in our own right. For centuries, we were regarded as men's property as were the children women gave birth to and even the money they earned or inherited.
THANK YOU for bringing this up!!! Blanchard speaks as though this “sexuality” just arises out of nowhere. It doesn’t explain ANY fetishistic behaviour to say “it’s just the way things are” and not examine WHY he thinks this is the case.
I think what is happening is merely an extension of that over time.
Yes, they see women as objects because they fail to comprehend our humanity. It's scarcely deep.
It absolutely is.
How many straight men see women as fetish objects and a collection of stereotypes, rather than as people? Plenty. Does that mean that misogyny causes heterosexuality?
I’ve got to say, I don’t think there was nearly enough push back to some of the things Blanchard got away with saying unquestioned. The case he mentioned about the fetishistic AGP acting out for entirely sexual purposes… was approved as a good candidate? I kept waiting for someone to say “oh my god, that’s disgusting.” But nobody did. And “living as a woman” = “wearing dresses” isn’t this what we’re supposed to be against? One thing no one mentioned is that the manifestation of AGP is entirely sexual. No one thought to ask ‘is it really a good idea for to enable these men to unleash their sexual appetite on the whole of public society? Is it really healthy for them to give into the fetish all day, every day? What about the impact that has on women and women’s rights? What does it mean for how they see women as things they can possess and perform?’ Also, his conclusion on how AGP is innate is unscientific and baseless. You shouldn’t have just let him say that as if it’s a proven fact. Porn is absolutely an influence. There are too many accounts for it not to be the case. I don’t think he answered Jennifer’s question honestly either. In order for a man to act on AGP, he has to have some misogynist values; varying degrees from man to man, but you can’t say that the sexual fetishization of owning a woman’s body is not inherently misogynistic. And Ray making a final pop at women for his last word, as if men aren’t the billionaires driving the movement, as if men aren’t the ones taking advantage of women and benefitting the most; bless Helen for speaking up, but fuck off Ray. Idiot doesn’t even know that Elmer Fud is the hunter and the pig is PORKY PIG.
Cant wait for Karen to record a response to his shite. Ugh, and half the time after he said something heinous Arty would be like WOW SO DEEP AND INSIGHTFUL 🥴 Arty was fanboying hard- and it makes sense, really, I mean him and Ray both have quite a bit of interest and EmPaThY for the men in full-time womanface.
clownworld heretic same. Too bad they likely wouldn’t have Karen on to talk about this from a woman’s perspective. She’s certainly read enough about AGP. At least Graham and Helen were pushing back and asking slightly challenging questions a little bit at times (not enough), but I have to wonder if Arty’s “empathy” (I would say enabling) for AGP is a bit of a bad influence.
@@PhoenixWolfAnime Arty is a fraud who's getting attention for being an ally when his actual concern for women is shallow and performative. No man in their right mind would sit through as many shows as he has an$ come to the con lusion that AGPs need compassion. And certain not from women. Hes a disgrace and has no right taking a spot away from an actual woman to talk about this. This is not affecting gay men, its affecting all females, and yet he sits there nodding his dopey head and is not listening to any of what the women have to say, but rather ignoring them and putting out b.s. about how AGPs an orientation and women need to be respectful and compassionate. NO, it is not. And NO, we do not.
@@clownworldhereticmyron1018 yes I noticed this too. It was basically an excited conversation between the two of them about male sexuality, and with no consideration given to women and AGPs' children at all.
@@PhoenixWolfAnime Enabling is a much more accurate word to use, good point.
I’m sorry I just can’t believe that some of this isn’t caused by porn, which is part of our culture. Example - a man finds himself turned on by high heeled shoes. Now, if we lived in a century in which they had not yet been invented, I think it’s hardly likely that someone would have conceived of a shoe fetish. Nor could I imagine it if high heeled shoes had been coded as menswear all of this time.
I honestly think some of these sex researchers just won’t permit themselves to believe that porn is ever a problem.
Of course they don't. They, like porn itself, serve only to support and enforce male supremacy.
@Marjia Adamskiā They were originally intended for horse-riding, to keep feet in the stirrups. Of course ladies rode side-saddle. Walking in them is damaging to feet and legs. I love it when, on a night out, women just give up trying to walk in heels, and go barefoot. Don't carry those tortuous contraptions home with you - throw them away!
All of it is caused by porn. ALL OF IT.
@Marjia Adamskiā That's a derailing point. Louis XVI or whomever it was did not wear stilettos. Modern high-heels are devices to sexualize women and limit their mobility. Why be so disingenuous?
Yes - Ray has this wrong - porn drives this stuff
Arty really comes across as a fanboy. What was that pathetic story about working in the same building as Ray? I noticed Graham cut in to try and save Arty from his obvious ‘fanboy homage to the sexologist god’ moment.
Arty's gay
All the pedo apologists worked in the same building too 🧐
What about the plight of the trans widows and the children of the marriage? The only major mention of women was Ray Blanchard turning his fire on them towards the end!
Thank you Archibald. I had to leave the chat because Blanchard arrogantly does not address the wives and children. I have a very negative take on Blanchard now, and I get why he refused to answer the letter I sent him 20 years ago. The only thing I come away with is that Blanchard says the connections btw AGPs and teens are spurious.
Of course, he takes no responsibility. No understanding of the flaws in his own very research.
@@happilyretired2868 he is imho a mysoginist and I was so glad Helen at last got a chance to make her point
@@JaneA544 he shrugged and laughed in response to Helen's earnest words.
@@happilyretired2868 Brava! I was following you in the chat. I really wish Helen had picked up on some of the comments, not that they would have let her speak anyway.
@@femalism1715 I appreciate that, FL! I was trying to make cogent refutations. The fact is, we are all being gas lit, when told we must affirm anyone who pretends they are someone else.
Thank you for your voice Helen. 💜 These men can be so out of touch with women's point of view. Even when we repeat it over and over and over....
I like Graham and, obviously, Helen and this show is good for a recap but I do love Karen Davis and TT Exulansic for an uncompromising female perspective.
Empathy isn't the strong suit of most men..no, not all men, but I think a very high percentage lack empathy for women. I think this has gotten worse bc of porn. We are seen as objects now.
Its because they dont care. They dont respect us, they dont see us as people with rich internal lives independent of men.
@@Peter-ov6xh I've watched lots of Karen's vids, but I've never heard of TT Exulansic! I'll have to look her up!
Arty, I'm sorry, but this was a poor response from you. I understand that when Ray came out with that at the end, you might not have been expecting it and didn't have time to digest it, but you completely glossed over the mic-drop women-blaming comment he came out with. Instead of supporting Helen, you thought it was more important to extend sympathy to poor Ray who has to work in this difficult field, rather than risk upsetting this important man by supporting Helen and disagreeing with him. I understand that in this kind of video interview situation it must have been really awkward, and you were probably trying to smooth the waters at the end of the video, but it was the wrong call and came across as a bit fawing.
I would appreciate if Helen could do a recap, voice over, of what she was thinking through this. 😂🫀
Yes I noticed Helen was unusually silent.
Did you see her facial expressions?
@@supermamabee9143 he's so clueless!!
@@Asphyxia612 strangely I often think she interrupts Graham often not letting him finish his point. It’s usually Arty who is the most silent. She was quiet because she didn’t like what she was hearing, which seems a little hypocritical.
I've watched one and half of these shows and just couldn't take it any more. The Two Men Talking Over a Woman Show.
While I have read some of Blanchard’s work I do not believe he is on the same page as the rest. Some of the comments made my stomach turn. Seems to have a genuine dislike of women and seems to think it’s acceptable for fetishistic men to access women & children’s spaces.
Helen is fantastic though. So on point, zero BS.
Right. They say they may have him on again and hopefully next time we''ll have more input from Helen and hopefully an additional woman guest (please let it be Karen Davis).
@@KaiDecadence
Blanchard has said his piece, end of, over. His further opinion is of no use to us.
That "last word" from Ray was so weird and so victim-blaming.
What was worse was the apparent non-reaction from Arty and Graham. I'm giving Graham the benefit of the doubt as he seemed somewhat fatigued by being sidelined in the discussion. Arty... I want to know what his deal is.
yes, and it was the very animated, defensive anger in his little speech about "cis hetero women" that was was so deeply disconcerting. If he merely wanted to make a point that many women, too, are complicit, he could have done so without that unwarranted vitriolic energy - smacks of misogyny. Hope we don't hear from him again. He seems very old guard in his attitude and approach. Perhaps there are people who could offer more current, and more feminist (?!) analyses.
Yeah, it's the first rule of misogyny. "Women are responsible for what men do"
@@CatrionaRuadh Absolutely. Nobody here is in denial that there are women who cheerlead for the trans agenda but the way he talked sounded like he was shifting so much of the blame onto women as a whole. Very unpleasant tactics.
@@NenaDiMartinez Are you saying women are not responsible when they protest and advocate for trans rights? (In much larger numbers than men do). When are women responsible? Ever?
Just look at Helen's face
A little too much sympathy for AGPs on display throughout. Women are better off without these men, and we should not have to endure their presence or their behaviour.
Blanchard seems to be oblivous to the feminist analysis of gender.
Its incredibly obvious he looks down on women & hardly thinks about them
No, he is aware, he just doesn't agree with it lmao
He seems to be oblivious to women, full-stop.
@M Soh is a sexist genderist too with a low opinion of most women.
Blanchard said on Twitter that he only realized in the late summer of 2021 that "GC" feminists are critical of gender itself, not just of transgenderism. Which indicates he has chosen to ignore what feminists have been saying since de Beauvoir published "The Second Sex" in 1949. He's willfully tuned out 70 years of feminist analysis and activism.
Thank you Helen. So glad you got that in at the end. X
I don't feel that Mr Blanchard answered the question of pawn in good faith.
He came across quite bitter when allocating women their blame at the end.
oh well done Helen for the final comment. She is the bomb.
just wish she ended with a little 'Fuck you Ray' at the end.
@@crista6899 not really...she made a good point that's all. But seeing how vicious some of these handmaids are, you have to draw a line between understanding and telling them to fu%k off.
Who thinks that no women push this agenda? What does he think we mean when we talk about 'handmaidens'?
Nice to hear from Ceri - solidarity.
He clearly has never listened to anything feminists say. It's easier to beat a strawman and cry about it.
@@leptoceratops Or grandiosely liken a man 'needing' to dress up as a woman to get his kicks to a diabetic needing insulin to live.
@@zoeevans6410 Ugh, just disgusting and offensive.
Well the end of this video wasn't awkward AT ALL, was it??!
This was a sneaky move by Ray, and was an unsolicited final note too. It very much seemed like he had kept that comment in his pocket so he could mic drop at the end. I don't think he wanted to debate that view and allow Helen time to respond, although respond she did.
Under the surface, despite the effect this has had on women' rights, it seems like what he's really annoyed about, what he REALLY cares about, is that men are being unfairly tarnished in this debate.
Unbelievable that when women participate in anything bad, these men expect them to shoulder at least 50% of the blame.
Felt like he was waiting the whole interview to say it. A lot of anger there.
@@pollyjay1264 I agree. I think he relished the opportunity.
@@pollyjay1264 Yes, a man who is clearly angry and contemptuous of women. Why else would he send perverts in dresses into women's restrooms?
It was but at least Helen got a word in and provided a very good explanation of why some women can be seemingly blindly supportive of the ideology.
How proud was Blanchard of his grandiose analogy that dressing up as something you're not to get psychological relief/sexual gratification is the same as a diabetic needing insulin to NOT DIE?!
And to have the temerity to go on a podcast and, again, grandiosely make a point of ending on a chauvanistic statement blaming women for the perverted, vile, misogynistic, abusive behaviour of men - which he has enabled - thereby singling out the lone female host and putting her in a horrible position, then dismissing her passionate, and very valid, rebuttal with a smile and an 'okay' - deplorable.
Was writing a considered comment but in the end, I deleted it. Think I can sum it up more succinctly by saying that this Mess was a mess.
Props to Helen for standing up for the female side of things and also Graham for his efforts. I think this interview would have perhaps been better if it had been a one on one between Arty and Ray on his own channel.
If Arty had his way, then the content would not be fit for UA-cam 😛
@@Peter-ov6xh Oo-er! 😳
I have no interest in watching a fan boy gush over a misogynist clinician who has enabled paraphilic men to use women as props in their sexual fetish and then tries to blame women for what he did.
@@toni6053 Well said. I think most of us with any sense found it all thoroughly distasteful. It disturbs me that Arty is probably totally oblivious as to why this episode and the way he was in it has upset many viewers. Are we supposed to watch the next one and go back to believing that he's staunchly on the side of women after this embarrassing performance? Only Helen provided any resistance to the revolting misogyny that was being displayed by their guest. I'm all for having controversial people on but not if the interviewer/s willfully ignore any questionable opinions and fail to bring them to account. I've loved TMWI since it started but I feel I've lost some confidence in the set up now. I suppose it would be too much to ask Arty to explain himself?
@@OuterSpaceOwl tbh I expect Arty just feels attacked right now and probably angry and upset that he's getting this much flak, but he needs to reflect on the fact women are not obliged to be willing props in our exploitation. Not one of them questioned Blanchard on why he and his fellow clinicians set themselves up as gatekeepers without apparently ever discussing the ethics of giving paraphilic men their permission to deceptively use women in their fetish. I don't always agree with the mess but I think it is important to see things from different perspectives but this one has proper lost me.
It was very interesting but Ray obviously has no idea about women, womens lives or how our characters are generally very different to men
? He described women’s sex drives as different from men, said paraphilias were less common in females, accurately referred to the ROGD phenomenon amongst girls, etc.... evidently his expertise concerns male paraphilias, but isn’t that why he was invited to speak...?
@@ebflegg as I said I think it was good he spoke and he is obviously very knowledgeable about men and he was very interesting, but the way he spoke about women I think was a little dismissive at times.
His speciality is AGP/dysphoric men......
@@polopadic7954 How on earth do you derive that from what he said?
@@polopadic7954 some women don’t. And most can’t through vaginal penetration alone. Way too many men don’t care about their partner’s pleasure, and a whole lot of women fake orgasm.
Jesus Graham wth was this? That man showed his true colours, I would not watch him again and let Helen speak please
Well it was very instructive in a most unflattering way for whom, besides Ray, I choose not to say...
Yeah, his "final word" was disappointing at best.
That AGP apologist was disgusting. Misogyny dripping off his 'porn has no effect, AGPs aren't abusive' spiel. Dire.
@@rexlandy2996 Yeah AGPs are not abusive to women, as if their whole schtick is not impersonating sexist tropes of women, as if that is not misogyny. As if these men didnot entrench their misogynist fetishes, while believing women were objects, from the first moment. That he thinks this is innate orientation is uUnbelievably blind. He is a gaslighting MRA. I am sure he grew up as a misogynist, but some way, some how, I think woman has hurt his fragile ego, recently, and true to form, he lashes out at women. That anger is a little too big, alittle too rehearsed.
And his misogyny just jumped out throughout the interview (that was conducted mostly with Arty as his yes man), but then he delivered a full slap at the end, which was obviously planned by him.
Arty needs to go. He postured AGP once again as another sexual orientation, which completely ignores some of the major aspects of AGP. He was a pig in sheet, maneuvering the discussion to his preconceived beliefs.
The way Helen was treated was also despicable. These men are determined to make a fool of her.
Leave Helen, do your own thing and the viewers will follow you and leave this putrid pile misogyny behind.
@@aidancross9756 He's probably an ally to 'the GC cause', which is a huge, disparate, strategic alliance. He's no ally to women or children though.
Is David Paisley the guy who had a meltdown about ribbons ?
Yes. But it was a very scary ribbon...
Yes
@@harrison6143 😆 lol 🤣
@@harrison6143 The pic of the ribbons tied onto a fence was in the 'shape of a noose' so he was really scared.
I like mentally and emotionally strong men, the complete opposite of 'men' like Paisley.
Would he be OK with a sash I wonder?
Something important: Both Freud and Baumeister (although he is not in the same league as F in terms of influence or body of work) believe men create culture. Certainly they have an incredible influence on culture. But male power is used to keep "lesser men" and women "in their place." But women create culture also. It's just that we have to look deeper into history outright and use the investigative techniques of other disciplines to discern women's part. It is that we must learn to see more clearly and understand better what women do and what women have done, have written,. Men have traditionally ignored the work and the contribution of women. To see the work and the importance of women in culture (and not exclusively the culture of the home and how that shifts in response to other forces in society) requires a monumental shift in perspective. Most men are not ready for that shift. They keep refusing to see it. Women know the pushback from men and the danger of opposing men, as Helen implicitly and explicitly explained. That's why liberal women and conservative women exist. That is why there is a rather alarming so-called traditional woman on the USSC now. That is why even when edited by women, literary journals are loathe to speak in women's voices even when allowing in a minority fashion women's articles to appear in those journals. That's why there are so many women who support the patriarchal churches or extreme orthodox Judaism and conservative Judaism, or any religion whatsoever. And why women are so mistreated within Islam and Hinduism and Sikhism and Buddhism and speak out at their peril or simply speak out to totally deaf ears. There are always good men and good women. But the definition of good men has never included speaking up for women. Even for men, doing so also is dangerous, because so few men do it. Graham's experience bears this out.
The point stressed by Ray that pornography cannot create an autogynephiliac ‘a nuovo’ in his words, begged the second question about what does create the conditions in a young person or child that leads to them experiencing this type of pornography as a ‘revelation’, again in Ray’s words. I don’t have much doubt that all our sexual flowerings (and much else) come from the cultural and social soup we arrive into at birth. So what is already present in the mini autogynephile that responds with a shock of recognition to the viewing of that type of erotica? I assume he isn’t saying it’s part of our genetic makeup? Our personality? If that was the case it would occur in women, at least more than it does. Also we wouldn’t see such different sexual habits and customs in different societies if society itself wasn’t the thing that ‘planted’ the seed. I really wanted to know if he’d done any research at all into the primal part of these leanings. I get the feeling he hadn’t. I also felt he was uninterested in the social and cultural obstacles that women live through, the things that shape us ongoing, everyday, in a way that doesn’t flow the same way back to men. As Helen touched on at the end.
de novo = anew
Three misogynist men. Poor Helen.
Thank you, Helen.
This is very confusing - why would any ‘gender-critical’ person be interested in hearing from someone who spent a significant amount of his career approving reassignment surgery? Not sure why Graham is getting so excited.
Bc it’s a scientist looking old man lol
Graham and Arty are fanboys of the misogynistic dude
Because Blanchard is the one who figured out autogynephilia and presented robust evidence that it's real.
Trans activists hate him with unbridled fury because he demonstrated that AGPs are typical males with a paraphilia--not actually 'women on the inside'.
@@SchrodingersTransCat blanchard just put a name on what women who've been mocked in various ways by men since birth know is a reality. well-paid, fetish-enabling men like Ray are heard, women are not. i'm very sorry i ever used a term coined by the man.
@@jenniferk9082 Have you heard of Henry Osborn? He was president of New York's American Museum of Natural History in the early 20th century. By most accounts, he was a racist arsehole who pushed eugenics.
He was also the guy who named and described Tyrannosaurus Rex.
Should we stop using his name for that dinosaur because we don't like his political views?
Allies don't constantly interrupt the only woman on their panel. It's not just this episode.
She was repeatedly asked if she wanted to say anything.
...and then talked over. Cmon Helen SPEAK UP. Demand space. They are never going to give it. You've got to take it.
I stopend watching when I saw Graham talking over GNC Centric (who is way more intelligent than him) ages ago, and then she left the show. And I was like welp, guess I'm out too.
Yes! I lost interest when Benji left too. We don't need allies if this is the best they can do.
These men are wildly misogynist. All of em.
As I said in the chat- ALRIGHT HELEN!! I'll say that Blanchard is brilliant, valuable to this conversation, and experienced in his field, I appreciate his contributions more than I can say. However I am also so thankful to have a woman's voice in this. At the very end, when it was mentioned by Blanchard that there's a lot of women behind this movement as well (sadly very right!), Helen bravely reminds the men why this is, at least the primary motivators (which explains why it's primarily straight women behind the men in charge of this movement). Men are fighting for men. And women are fighting for men. Because men are [generally] socialized to prioritize themselves and what they want, while women are socialized to prioritize men and do what they want. Do whatever you need to get by. Don't be seen as a prude nor wh*re, not too "easy" but not too mouthy. So much so that even mainstream liberal feminism has come to revolve around the interests of men- porn, prostitution, TQ+.
Thank you all, and I appreciate you ALL for having this conversation. Love to all of you ❣️
I concur: YAY Helen! That would have been a crushing way to end without Helen's final DEFENSE. This doctor reflects where the field has gone: he is unimpressive at best; an average run-of-the-mill misogynist - which warps his psychological generalizations. Having heard him interviewed by women psychologists, I anticipated this
I totally disagree. So many women are behind this movement not because they are taught to prioritize the feelings of men, but because ideological capture, whether it's critical race theory, intersectionality, or gender ideology, is considered the "right side of history."
@@simfimpim Who determined this cause to be the right side of history? MEN and their handmaidens. Young lesbians today who support this know nothing of the lesbian struggles within the USA women's movement, the indoctrination of lesbians to side with gay men during the 90s police abuse, the identification with gay male attitudes towards sex.
@@Whitsundial You think that only men drove in this ideology? That (some) feminists had no hand in it?
@@simfimpim that's certainly how they rationalize it, but imo the way more women than men support these people and the way even feminist groups (Lol) and feminist discourse have been totally captured and hijacked by queer groups (that are usually lead by males) can have another explanation too. Otherwise we should think that women are more susceptible to ideological capture, and I don't think that's the case.
Of course they want to feel righteous and they would never want to be seen as "bad" (a motivational driver behind many clueless leftists in the gender war), but there is also a way bigger backslash vs women when they dare to step out of line. Are women more interested in social justice for some reason, and consequently are more susceptible to the emotional blackmail of the whining transactivists? maybe, but we should also not forget that a the voice of a woman out of the chorus is perceived way differently. just look at the "karen" meme. women who speak for themselves and their rights are seen as evil, entitled, spoiled, privileged. women interested in protecting women spaces are seen as evil maiden aunts: how dare they focus on their safety and dignity, how dare they have boundaries.
I can accept everything Ray said and still say women aren’t here to affirm the paraphilias of men. And if society, particularly men in society, weren’t so homophobic in there treatment of very feminine men behaving and dressing however they wanted then maybe there’d be less inclined to think the only way they can live comfortably alongside those homophobic men in society is to escape them by transitioning to gain protection from women in our spaces.
I agree. It all comes back to patriarchy and its rigid sex stereotypes.
Karen's just done an episode about that entire point ripping it apart over on 'You're Kidding Right'
Such a good point about society being homophobic and patriarchal. In fact in Iran, where a gay guy can be legally executed, and where a feminine man would be viciously excoriated by other men even if he wasn't gay, the government happily pays for the guy to get "feminization" surgery and live as a woman. "Trans the gay away" is just the 21st century version of conversion therapy from the 1990s; and I'm so scared for the children growing up in this climate of homophobia.
I agree, women aren’t here to affirm men’s fetishes or any male sexual behaviour. It seems to me the reason men like Blanchard enabled AGP men in the first place, is because they see women as nothing more than objects to be used for men’s sexual pleasure, they simply don’t care how enabling AGPs negatively impacts women.
Homophobia is rooted in misogyny, the idea behind homophobia (when it is directed at gay men), is that it is women who are created to be used as sexual objects by men, so when men have sex with other men, they are viewed by other men as lowering the social status of all men to women’s status. This is why men punish them and want to push them into a ‘non men’ category or the women category. And this is exactly what we see in Blanchard’s own words ‘…one way societies can deal with homosexual individuals, give them a role, let them be useful, but treat them as something different’. In my opinion societies treat gay men as ‘non man’, so that the category of men retains its high social status and women’s remains low, it is a way to ensure a male dominant society is not threatened.
Historically homosexual behaviour between men was often acceptable in some societies and even widespread, as long as the men involved didn’t threaten the social order. For example, in ancient Rome it was acceptable for male slave owners to have sex with their male slaves, as long the male slave owner was the one doing the penetrating. It was acceptable for men to have sex with other men in the Roman army, as long as the man doing the penetrating was of a higher rank than the man being penetrated. In other ancient societies e.g. Greece, etc, it was acceptable for young males and older males to have sex together, as long as the older male (who had higher social status) was the one who was doing the penetrating, it was even considered a rite of passage for young males in some of these societies (many would consider that CSA). Then there are societies where some men are put into a ‘third sex’ category and it is considered acceptable for men to have sex with these men, e.g. in India, Thailand, etc. In a male dominant society sex is inextricably linked to social status, i.e. there are those who are for men’s sexual use; who have a lower social status, and those who are the users; who have a higher social status. My point is male homosexual behaviour can be accepted in a male dominant society, as long as the men involved know their place in society, and don’t threaten the system of male dominance. By saying some ‘feminine’ gay men can be moved into the women category, they are allowing them to be gay in a way that does not threaten the system of male dominance, the ideology is misogynistic and homophobic at its core.
The worst mess ever. Sorry. Ray Blanchard hasn't got a clue about the male-female dynamics in society. His lack of awareness annoyed me. Women are having a hard enough time in this debate without his negative contribution based on his male world perspective.
I agree. I have my doubts about it being based on lack of awareness though. He's a learned man so it's not outside his capability to be more aware, just not a priority I think.
It had to be done. Now the face, voice, research, ideology are welded into a mass of AGP appreciation.
@@rehumanizeXX in order to understand things, you have to want to understand them.
do you think this was Arty's doing? He seems to be the only one who likes this man. Karen Davis is so right.
@@elizabethwalker7756 I think he was the one to get Graham to mute her a few messes back. Graham takes a lot of personal abuse from trolls but Karen asked 1 question and boom! time out
I think there is no way to know how deep the misogyny goes. What do you think, Helen??
Disappointing to see it accommodated & in part re-enacted by the supposedly male allies here …:(
@@TheBiancap - I agree- this was a really tough one to watch.
I do want to add one more thing. If Blanchard was at a place encouraging an elderly man to have these Cosmetic surgeries back in 1980, I am quite certain it wasn’t women encouraging that back then. I had never heard of anyone suggesting that transsexuals were women before the mid 1990’s, and even then, it was rare to hear that as a statement. His assertion that women are proponents of tra, is also ignoring all of us who oppose, and it ignores the numerous women who have been chased out of public discourse with proverbial pitchforks for objecting. Because women are erased from the discussion, it leaves the very few Aunt Lydia’s that are visible, making it appear that women are larping for this, when it is, in fact, a very small minority of women pushing this bs. Ray needs to get his facts straight there.
Ray had some nerve to turn the situation that we're in back on women when Helen mentioned earlier in the video that the reason why so many women went along with (and still go along with) trans ideology is because of female socialization. Women are raised and brought up differently than men, not taught to be as assertive (especially towards men), more so back in the day and I'm glad that Helen doubled down on this again towards the end when Ray was ranting about how women are just as much to blame for the gender woo madness. Look at what happened to women like JK Rowling, Maya Forstater, the one elderly woman who got assaulted at a speakers' corner by TRAs back in 2017, and just any woman who dares to go against the tranz ideology. They get harassed, location doxxed, r@pe threats, jobs threatened (some even fired from their jobs), and even physically assaulted sometimes. Other women will see this behavior and be too afraid to come out against the ideology for fear of being made an example of by the ire of TRAs and thus, they feel like they have to go along with the ideology or risk damaging their lives in the process and unlike JK Rowling, these are every day women who can't afford to lose their source of income. Female socialization is a hard (and sometimes even risky) thing for women to break out of. More men need to understand this when it comes to this topic.
There are no mans movement pressuring women to accept AGP. Other than AGP themselves.
All people are responsible for their choices. Male or female, right or wrong. Both men and women are intimidated into silence or even acquiescence. Crazy to say it's all one sex's fault, or that it can't be people from one sex's fault. It's difficult for everyone to stand up for the truth.
Ceri is so lovely. I’m furious this is being done to her.
I was shocked she was being threatened with arrest, then I looked at her twitter page and discovered she was a bully!
@@DaveThompsonfairlife4all I looked and she's not.
@@DaveThompsonfairlife4all what do you mean a bully? I looked at her Twitter and couldn't see anything close to bullying on there.
@@DaveThompsonfairlife4all What, specifically, did she say that made her a bully in your opinion?? Got links?
AGPs should have stayed behind closed doors where women and children didn’t have to see and deal with them.
to be fair a lot of us do stay behind closed doors.
@@Jomoko89 well then she obviously isnt talking about you just those that do expect public participation.
Exactly. Ppl need to keep their kink at home. I don't want to shame them, I just don't want to have to see that. This is just another Kink - no matter how scientifically Ray sees it.
Stigmatising AGP and driving it underground works hand in glove with denial of AGP in the TRA milieu. Thus the importance of a scientific light on the issue and an analysis of why TRA has such a misogynist slant. As Blanchard explained, these men have a drive that is easily turned against women who won’t give these men what they want.
Completely agree.
we all leaned in when she finally spoke.
It is frankly disgusting that Blanchard specifically mentions the culpability of women in all of this. It betrays his obvious disdain for women. Thank-you Helen for your rebuttal to this.
He was just stating a fact. Polling shows far more women in favour of "trans rights" than against to them, where it's the opposite among men. If there was any truth to Helen's claim about women being pressured to go along with men, then why do the polls show otherwise?
@@hoodoo-man
The societal expectation to "be kind" is much stronger for women.
@@entity30068 It's not an expectation. Women are kinder.
How could you forget Posie Parker - 4 kids, spent night in a holding cell! Here's her advice ua-cam.com/video/C7UdEFlGAwc/v-deo.html
Why oh why are we supposed to give one single solitary damn about AGP men and their feelings? A man with a paraphilia will happily destroy the safety and comfort of every woman and child around him to indulge his fetish. And now these AGPs are now trying to enshrine their demands into law and criminalize actions by women who are trying to keep basic boundaries and safeguarding in place. I am fed up.
Graham, I appreciate what you're trying to do but this wasn't on. Blanchard is the patron saint of perverts and misogynists and the harm he's done to women and children is unforgivable.
You have phrased this very well. I have great gratitude toward Graham and always will. He is doing a great service and he must have been stunned by the hate rant. Arty chooses to fawn over AGP men and treat them like innocent victims like any narcissists flying monkey. They are narcissistic sex fetishists-not poor confused victims. Narc's genius is playing the victim card while destroying lives. Helen pulled off what I never could have. Calmly answering this man who apparently barely registers women on the human scale.
@@wellsorted Agreed. Graham, at great personal cost to himself, has stood up for women and for that I will always be appreciative. Having Blanchard on wasn't malicious on his part but I do think he neglected to dig deep into Blanchard's history. He's an old school sexist practitioner who didn't consider as important the harm he was doing to women when he sent those AGP's into women's spaces.
@@TheRecoveringZombie As you said, Blanchard is one of the patron saints of this mess we are in. He has a lot to answer for.
The target of our ire is Blanchard, not Graham.
@@Whitsundial Agreed. I think Graham was caught off guard by this mess.
Arty certainly has shown himself to be a sycophantic fan of male sexologists here. And quite self-centered too. And dare I say a bit of creep.
What happened to “we need to engage with people we disagree with?”
@@nicksherreard1215 This may come as a shock to you but "engaging with" and "uncritically accepting the views of/enthusiastically fanboying over" are not the same.
Engaging with different view points is important in order to test the reasonableness of your own views, and to ensure you dont have massive blindspots that can lead to false conclusions. Doesnt mean you have to change your mind or agree with the people you engage with.
The interview with RB was terribly disappointing. Really Arty and Glinner should've shut up already, and let Helen ask about women's interest in this mess. She is the one who should have been questioning RB from the get-go. Instead, we got to 1hr into the whole thing before she got to speak, nd then only 3m for her before Glinner jumps back in. (Her expression spoke volumes, though.) Arty was fascinated, not disgusted, and Glinner refers to women's anger while not putting Helen front and centre.
Then at the end RB blames women for pushing the transsexual agenda, completely ignoring the pressures on women to conform to men's desires, especially sexual ones. What an idiotic cop-out on his behalf.
(1) That guy who transitioned at 70?!!! Was that even ethical? What about e.g. osteoporosis? And was this man really led to think he would be able to live his life as a woman, given he'd lived 70 years as a boy, then a man? What about his family?
(2) Why is no-one challenging RB's description 'sex reassignment', which is impossible? It sounds like a hangover from the old world of "sex changes" back when no-one believed women can have penises and most transsexuals were homosexual MTF.
(3) Those men who liked masturbating in female underwear: if they were married, did RB ever talk to the wives, alone, and ask them how they would cope with their husbands' behaviour? I'm really surprised-no, scrub that. I am totally not surprised that RB apparently failed to consider when he was working, just how toxic and entitled AGPs can be for those around them, while here he expresses concern only on the societal level (what would happen if there were a "caste" of AGP men) and not about individuals.
(4) Wanting to cut off a limb need not be a paraphilia. It could be an autofeedback/proprioception disruption where the brain does not recognize the limb as belonging to the subject.
Cope, seethe, and rope
Who are these men (other than the AGP) that are pressuring women to accept AGP?
I appreciate Blanchard's experience, knowledge and insight, but he is a man telling women that they have to go along with men's fantasy that men can call themselves women. He's been told numerous times on Twitter and I'm sure elsewhere, that he needs to be mindful of this. Men cannot be women, and what the H does 'LIVE AS A WOMAN' mean Dr. Blanchard? Because it is a mystery to all women.
Women are not a dress, makeup, hair, clothes, presentation and they are not just a bunch of body parts that AGP men are thinking they are. This conversation is insulting to say the least, that a bunch of men are helping men to women's spaces, names and pretending that this is ALRIGHT. I too would like to hear what Helen thought, she was quiet, and I can only assume she was thinking similar things as the rest of all womanhood.
When women have body dysphoria, it is about wanting to identify out of their sexualized oppression and if men don't understand this and just talk about women as if we are a minor side act to men in this, we aren't and won't make any progress. Great to have the conversation, but you need to bring in the feminist framework, stop talking about women, and not involving women's reality
disappointed with the male hosts on this occasion
I genuinely think Graham was taken aback by Arty's performance. He did try to get Helen in.
I think Graham tried his best to navigate a difficult situation.
@@magdalenerose924 Perhaps he needs to do better, somehow.
@@lidahall5928 I think so
Graham did his best but Arty was talking over the top him
Hardcore porn clearly shapes minds and our society.
I noticed that Arty had a lot more to say than usual. He was very animated esp. in the last half of the episode. Seems the others had a hard time getting a word in.
I noticed that too, I think that's because he has a soft spot for AGPs. No longer a fan. 🚮
Arty is a bit insecure and probably feels that he should get more credit for this even though it's Graham's show.
@@DuchessofKuvuki More like a hard spot for them..... ;)
@@DuchessofKuvuki
I think he has a fetish for fetishism 🤪
But, he does expound well on topical GI issues.
@@el2i-y8z Homophobe
You just know that Karen Davis is going to do a kick-ass, barn-storming commentary on this!
I love Karen's passion,she says it like it is.
Yep, she's doing an astoundingly great job at breaking it all down so far.
Is it just me or was Arty really stepping on Graham and Helen and even Ray, at times?
I diasagree about the porn. I don't think Dr Blanchard realizes how much porn is being consumed. That's right, Graham- "what if the cartoon was on 24 hrs a day?" Yes, Graham, you are right.
Yeh, he seemed very out of touch. I wonder if that's because he's been retired for a while and the uptick in porn usage happened in the last 10 years.
I don’t trust sexologists after finding out how much crap has gone into "researching and categorizing" human sexuality. We’re in this mess because they indulge these delusions which lead to them pathologizing (and excusing) yet another facet of male sexuality.
@@photent Agree!
@@spacecase4984 - Absolutely!!
There have been recent studies about this. A very good article came out recently about the very real addiction of porn and how the taste for perversity and violence goes up all the time like any addiction.
Tired of arty.
Glinner @ circa 23:00 had the numbers reversed - in the Quillette article and elsewhere Blanchard & Bailey said 25% of the men were HSTS, 75% were AGP.
This is important and makes a lot of sense, Thanks for this info.
This convo overlooks all the men who went to places where no "gatekeeping" was done, such as the Bouros clinic in Casablanca and Stanley Biber's in Trinidad, CO. The only men subjected to "gatekeeping" were the ones who had to get approval coz the govt was going to pay, or who wanted surgery from an establishment medical center like Johns Hopkins.
Blanchard totally discredited himself with his attitude toward women and his attitude toward cross dressing men.
I don't owe agp any compassion. I don't want those disgusting creeps anywhere near little girls and vulnerable women. If they want to feel better they need to cure their perversion, not force their perversion on the rest of society. And I'm not even a feminist. At all (saw my mom abusing my dad too much, I guess). But I'm on the side of radfem on that issue.
And it's reasonable to feel this way, especially since AGPs are linked with other sexual paraphillia.
Wtf did I just watch? An AGP apology episode? Srsly? Am I supposed to think this helps the GC movement? How? So disappointed, specially with Arty... All starry eyed, and excited to host Blanchard, who didn't hesitate to show his true colours at the end. SMH...
It was a nauseating performance from Arty. Why do people fawn to the professions? As far as I can see it’s the meddling of men like Blanchard that has fucked us all.
Wow. That really was quite a mess of an interview alright. What on earth guys??!!
*With Blanchard I mean. First rule of Misogyny? Blame women for what men do. Cheeses wept!
I am angry after watching this episode. I absolutely do not agree that men with autogynaephilia should be treated with compassion. That is because autogynaephilia is founded in misogyny. The sexual arousal these men experience when they present or imagine themselves as women stems from their belief that women are sexual objects for consumption. In a society in which women are fully respected and seen as equal with men, there would be no autogynaephilia. I also fundamentally disagree with Blanchard that porn plays no role in this surge of rapid onset gender dysphoria. There is no way that a child's developing brain is not negatively impacted by constant consumption of hard core pornography.
Yes, children are exposed to and groomed with extreme, degrading misogynistic porn at earlier and earlier ages, which is a new thing. I think that this is quite possibly creating Parraphillias and is a hideous societal ill more generally as well. It's a large topic and I hope that various groups that are fighting it gain ground. There was a lot that could have been gone into more in this interview but time constraints and the sheer amount of overlapping and troubling issues within this topic meant that many things couldn't be dealt with much depth but I am pleased that AGP is being discussed openly even if imperfectly. The format of a live interview with a guest for a short amount of time constraints the exploration of a topic in a way that writing an article does not.
So basically what you're saying is that men who have sexual fantasies about women do so because they inherently only view women as sexual objects? Got it.
@@shannynmartin3157 She's saying that the men who view pornography to the extent that he wants to be a woman view them as sexual objects.
@@shannynmartin3157 If a white man found it arousing to dye his skin, undergo facial surgery, dress in stereotypical clothing and enact stereotypical behaviours he associated with black men, as he found it sexually arousing, I would consider that sexually objectifying black men. If a white man said what he found most arousing of all was the idea of being a black slave on a planation, and being treated badly due to being black, I would consider him to be aroused by racism. If one can see the revolting racism in this, but not the revolting misogyny in AGP, they need to figure out why they think misogyny is acceptable and why they don’t see women as humans worthy of respect.
@@shannynmartin3157 No, I did not say that.
and again, Graham, you interrupt her
Maybe we shouldn't be attacking our own.
@@carmelmulroy6459 maybe Graham should stop interrupting her which he does in other podcast and he is ware of this because he apologises for interrupting. Granted he's gotten better at not interrupting both of them but if "our own" is interrupting our own then they need to be called out on it.
That Blanchard interview was grotesque. Shame on the two men for nodding along to Blanchard's misogynist rant at the end. Ugh. So so disappointing.
These predatory abusive men should be shunned from society when this cools down.
Blanchard seems to see nothing wrong with enabling AGP men to violate women’s boundaries, as long as the man feels better about himself. Men like Blanchard prioritise what benefits men, over what is best for society, in particular what is best for women in society.
The person who is confusing things here is Blanchard. AGP is clearly rooted in misogyny, to anyone who sees women as human beings who happen to be born female, and not as dehumanised objects. It is clear AGP men view women as nothing but sexist stereotypes, sexual submission, and dismembered body parts. It is a fetish that epitomises the misogyny in society. I would say men develop AGP because we live in a male dominated society, where women are viewed as dehumanised sexual objects, if we lived in a society where women were not viewed this way, I don’t think men would feel sexual arousal by imagining themselves as women. De-stigmatising and enabling it enables the misogynistic view of women driving AGP to become socially acceptable. That is before we even get into the fact these men violate women’s boundaries, and right to consent. In my opinion it is a fetish that should always be condemned, in a society that values women as human beings, who happen to be born the female sex.
Blanchard also seems to simply ignore how the reward system in the brain works. There is plenty of evidence that when an object becomes associated with pleasurable feelings, that object itself can cause pleasure, such as addicts experiencing arousal in the pleasure centres of the brain when they see needles, as the pleasure from drugs becomes associated with needles, the click of a zippo lighter becomes associated with the pleasure that comes from smoking etc. Since sexual pleasure by its very nature is pleasurable, it would indicate that sexual likes can be conditioned in much the same way, and some have developed sexual desires for inanimate objects in this way. For example, someone feels sexual pleasure with and focuses on an object, and imbues the object with desirable qualities, after repeated incidences of feelings pleasure doing this, the thing itself becomes associated with pleasure and the desirable qualities the person has imbued in it, that object is then what the person is attracted to, and desires. The same with p0rn, if someone experiences sexual pleasure while watching it, and they repeatedly engage in it and feel pleasure when doing so, they reenforce the association with whatever is in the p0rn and pleasure, fairly soon the thing they are watching will become what they desire. It is the way the reward system in the brain works, the neuro connections become stronger, the more a person engages in a pleasurable activity. Blanchard, like many men, ignores this, because it does’t fit his view of the world.
This is SUCH a great comment, thank you
Great, insightful comment.
@@olgaradulovic7684 Yes! It's a shame we can't pin it.
You nailed it.
This interview was a disgrace and Blanchard is a virulent, unrepentant misogynist.
Fantastic!! Thank you for sharing your input. Eloquently explains the massive problems with Blanchard's "analysis".
This was awful.
Arty's behaviour at 57:10 should be enough to see him booted off the show.
I was definitely interested in hearing Graham’s point here and disappointed he was cut off but I guess in the heat of live discussion these things happen.
@@pollyjay1264 Fair enough. To me this didn't look like two people accidentally interrupting each other (happens a lot with online calls) so much as Arty running with that and doubling down/having a mini-tantrum.
Yeah Arty was very disappointing here.
so disappointing
Ceri is a brilliant strong woman! 💚
Really? Blocking people because they ask difficult questions is "brilliance" is it? She is a bully.
@@DaveThompsonfairlife4all Nope she is not. You saying she is does not make that any more true.
If you don't like her then say that.
Otherwise Shhh
@@DaveThompsonfairlife4all Did she block you? What were these "difficult questions" she avoided?
I'm standing in the light and I find myself unafraid" Beautiful!
So disgusted by this episode, left a bitter taste in my mouth.
Same. If there isn't some kind of apology or comment made in the next episode, and they carry on like this episode was some big triumph, I'll be most displeased!
Same
What's wrong with it?
I like this podcast, but I often think the interviews are badly planned. The Blanchard interview would have been much better had it involved Graham, Helen and Arty taking it in turns to ask Ray pre-planned questions. Instead, it felt like Graham and Arty vying with each other to ask Ray long anecdote-based questions (some of which were outside of Ray's remit anyway), while Helen (perhaps understandably) barely spoke.
Helen was quietly observing and what can a woman comment on with two male aficionados of AGP on the panel raving on.
@@Whitsundial but she did make her point quietly and with dignity, I felt Ray was waaaaay behind the agps of today, and after seeing Jennifer's interview which I felt was excused and mansplained away, he did not understand in any way the trauma this fetish inflicts on women and children unfortunate enough to be in the agp sphere. His disdainful attitude showed how much he is behind the ball. I really hope he never appears on THEAI anytime soon.
I’m glad it wasn’t all pre-written questions. Anyway all three of them had plenty of time to reflect on what they wanted to ask Blanchard about. For me, the main thing missing was commentary on how and why autogynephilia is so denied in the trans activist milieu. It seems to me that this denial underlies much of the aggressive and sexist behaviour, and the public ignorance of the issue and its significance. Blanchard is I think well aware of this and could have spoken to the issue
@@JaneA544 To be honest, he just comes across as any male academic of a certain age defending his turf.
@@ebflegg With Graham, Helen and Arty, they’re so permanently exasperated by TRA nonsense that they almost can’t help but go off on endless tangents and sidebars. Graham in particular seems to have so many bugbears and theories about why all this madness is happening, that it’s almost too much for him to contain. I understand why that’s the case, and it works fine when the three of them are talking to each other. But it’s a terrible set-up for interviewing guests.
I'm sorry but I have to disagree with Ray on a few points - I know he is a so called 'expert' in this subject but I think the influence of social media and instant access to online porn has a massive impact on this subject especially in ROGD - the espedential rise in young girls transitioning is convincing enough to scream social contagion, we saw it with anorexia, self harm, bulimia etc. I think Graham was right with the comment "what if the the cartoon was on all day 24/7?" This is way more complexed and we may not ever get answers. I was also disappointed that he blames women, why can't men take responsibility for their actions - no one is forcing adult men to appropriate women they are doing it themselves and trying to make us play along with their delusion.
I feel bad for Helen, seriously. She shouldn't have had to suffer through 3 men's misogyny to make a very obvious point.
Why didn't she speak before the minute she spoke? None of the guys were asked to speak, they just did.
I love the term “misogyny” being bandied around for a lot of people to like that bloody top comment. God almighty. There is some delusion on this side of the fence as well.
@@renan27023 You’re absolutely right. 😃
Just a thought. Could not all the women that Mr "I failed an audition for a crowd scene extra part" has targetted in this way simply launch a joint counterclaim of harrasment and wasting police time?
NEVER go voluntarily to the Police and ALWAYS, once arrested, ensure you have a Lawyer with you, and always respond with 'No Comment'
A small faction of Scots are bringing such shame to us.
Please believe me, the majority of us are nothing like the MPs in the Scottish National Party. The Glorious Leader should resign, so VILE. Nor are we like the shit messed up 'actors' and 'comedians'.
I'm so sorry Ceri 💜
When Blanchard says that he believes that there has to be some latent aspect of a paraphilia in someone’s brain that allows them to then go forward with it after viewing it ( pornography, images etc) or reading about it, rather than a paraphilia being implanted from nothing due to viewing it, does he mean the latent aspect is neurological or psychological? Surely if it’s psychological then it could be ‘implanted’ especially if viewing is undertaken at a young age? There are transsexuals who have stated that their father was a cross dresser. Did these sons have the same neurological aspect as the father or was it the impact of the behaviour of their fathers on them at such a young age?
Read Gail Dines on this aspect.
Blanchard's view is simple fetish formation. Some aspect of erotic pleasure arises from an early introduction of sensory excitement from objects. His complete approval and encouragement to make it inclusive to society is objectionable, repugnant.
@@Whitsundial calling these men women then is extremely repugnant for no other reason than a woman ( her body and her clothing etc) is objectified for erotic pleasure. How do these men ( Ray etc who worked in rbis field early on ) justify allowing these men into women’s spaces and us having to ( by law) consider them women. It’s misogyny of the highest degree.
Sexual desires for particuar things can be conditioned, many men don’t want to acknowledge this, as to do so raises too many questions that they don’t want to think about.
Conditioning is when something pleasurable (such as sexual pleasure) is repeatedly paired with something that is not pleasurable in and of itself, e.g. an object, thought, image, scenario etc., resulting in it becoming associated with sexual pleasure. This association then causes that object, thought, image, scenario etc., to be the thing the person desires, as it has become associated with sexual pleasure.
Some AGPs admit they have conditioned this fetish in themselves in this way. For example, this young man explains how he conditioned himself to be AGP, by pairing sexual pleasure with thoughts of being a women repeatedly, until the association became so strong he developed AGP. He says: ‘as a AGP when I was younger I would pretend to be a female during arousing myself. So I would do certian things to make myself look like a female, and I would very much arouse myself to that thought, and it become very, very strong I must say. Before I began doing this I wasn’t AGP, I wasn’t born with a sexual attraction to myself as a female. I don’t believe, you’re simply not born with this, it is something that is developed though something you have done, by a action. There has been a few talks, on whether a self directed target location stems from an inability for the brain to map out another person as a sexual target location, therefore it is targeted on something the brain knows very well, which is yourself. I mean this could be true. But as from my experience I can say 99% even a 100% that my experience that I had has caused this erotic target location error to be targeted on myself’.
m.ua-cam.com/video/ZADqgmUSoVo/v-deo.html
@@RB-jl2qb i still get the feeling it's all about their mothers somehow - yeah i know freud was wrong but maybe on this one right? Im also thinking of when paris fell WW2 ... they blamed it on the young women ...lots of collaborators in this Mess
Two things in this episode were not entirely accurate:
23:10 Graham gets Blanchard's stats on the prevalence of HSTS and AGP the wrong way around. In that Quillette interview ('What is Autogynephilia?' 2019, Louise Perry), Blanchard said that AGPs were the majority even in the 80s:
"When I looked at the relative numbers of autogynephilic and androphilic gender-dysphoric males back in 1987, the autogynephilic cases were already a majority, approaching 60 percent. The proportion had reached 75 percent by 2010, and it might be even higher now."
55:53 Ray Blanchard commits a shocking error: he says Elmer Fudd was a pig! That's Porky Pig, not Elmer Fudd! Elmer is the guy with the gun who is always hunting wabbits! BLANCHARD DEBUNKED! (... kidding.)
Thanks for posting that, I've wondered about that and it's a good peaking discussion Stat.
@@VioletFemme1111 Yes, I think the general public still assumes that most transwomen are HSTS, i.e. dysphoric homosexual males. "Well, they're into men--they're not going to perve on women in the changing room. What's all the fuss about?" Even if they've heard of AGP, they may think it's a rare phenomenon instead of the overwhelming majority. I've seen journalists dismiss it in a couple of lines like it's some quirky sideshow.
Ironically, in the 90s and early 2000s, trans activists themselves insisted that AGPs must be rare. By the late 2000s, when the prevalence of fetishistic arousal among transwomen had become too well-documented to ignore, the activists did a U-turn and started claiming that it was evidence they were women on the inside. Because women like admiring themselves in the mirror too, right? It's totally the same thing as getting off on ironing! /s
Thanks for that info, I will check out the Quillette article and spread it around. 😃
CERI....EVEN IF YOU GET ARRESTED REMEMBER....YOU ALWAYS HAVE THE RIGHT TO REMAIN SILENT!
And if you don't get arrested you have the right to leave.
That the men left absolutely no room for Helen to speak for the majority of this conversation (and yes, they were crowding her out), even while acknowledging that they were doing that, and then the slam at women in the end, says it all. It was in itself an analogy for women's position and voice in all of this. For Blanchard to speak with contempt towards the women who are supportive of what AGPs want and paint them as villains is just pure unadulterated blame-the-victim stuff. We are trained to have our voices blotted out unless we are helping men in some way. Yes, there is way more nuance to all of this than I've just written, but that is the overall truth of it. EDIT: Just watched Graham's emotional video about Arty and just want to say that while it was infuriating to watch the Blanchard video I would never intend my pushback to be bullying, and respect everyone involved. I hope they realize that, especially at the end, this interview just felt like a stab and the reaction is in proportion to the contempt that was shown for women. I appreciate everything that this videocast is trying to do and appreciate all of your hard work.
To them all criticism is "bullying". You have nothing to apologize for, this comment is well-written and direct and not disrespectful at all.
When those boys who claim to be women start to live like us, then I'll reconsider my position I want them to cook, clean, launder, chauffeur anda full time caretaker..
That would ruin their cosmetic routines. 💄
better conforming to that gender stereotype doesn't make them women any more than wearing dresses and lipstick. I don't expect we'll see it though. Selfishness is a big part of their decisions.
DP has another account he uses to creep on people who are critical of him. I forget the name, if I can find it ill post it here so everyone can block him.
The basic advice for anyone who is "invited" to visit the coppers for a discussion/chat is very simple-say nothing and get a lawyer.It is an intimidatory tactic and is often used when a complaint is received with little supporting evidence IE they are on a fishing expedition.I hope Ceri gives them nothing and lets them stew.
I wish that throngs of women would simply follow the failed gay actor around all day long. Never make a threat or speak a word, just follow.
Arty Ziff AGPologist. #Eurgh
All the love,strength and power to Ceri ❤