The beauty of the two-step process is that you only have to explain it once. You can then simply say "two step process" for your friends (and enemies) to understand what you mean.
Thanks for the videos! How do you feel about rappelling down two ropes joined together with a flat overhand with long tails? Also, I wonder if the tree in your video would fail before your flat overhand. ;)
Probably a stupid question Rich, but what do you mean by loaded down its major axis? Do you mean on the narrow side of the sort of triangular-looking knot where the 2 tails of the overhand knot stick out? (And double checking, but you are saying an overhand on a bend is the same thing as a water knot, right? i.e. Different names for identical knot. But you don't like the term water knot?). Thanks
Not a stupid question, but not sure I can give a really clear answer. Look at the video starting at 2:50. That is a knot being pulled perpendicular to it's axis and is being pulled apart. When loaded on the major axis you will not see that.
I am picking nits about the names. A bend is used when connecting one end of rope (or cord or webbing) to another end. The water knot is a bend, but it is commonly referred to as water KNOT.
Bill Proctor and Richard Delaney have demonstrated that using the flat overhand for the wrap three pull two when one is wearing heavy gloves is actually safer because the water knot or overhand bend is almost impossible to tie unless you take your gloves off. taking your gloves off may not be permissible in certain situations. Glad to see you find it acceptable too. Personally I prefer cordage. Have built some absolutely bomber anchors with wrap 6 pull 5 with 6mm cordage. Cordage doesn't suffer the same strength loss failure mode as the wrap 3 pull 2 tape anchor. The tape anchor suffers from failure at the carabiner. One strand goes one way and the other strand goes the opposite way thus inducing friction. Cordage on the other hand tends to lay side by side and doesn't suffer similar friction failure. Of course for rapping wrap 3 pull 2 with webbing is heller strong enough for that job.
I mentioned in the video -- what is most commonly called a water knot is actually a bend. In most instances a bend is the appropriate choice for setting up an anchor. There are occasions when an overhand knot is a better choice.
Hi Rich, I enjoy your videos. What do you think of this critique of the water knot? ua-cam.com/video/mXe-8GmS08k/v-deo.html I would usually only use it to rig an abseil from a tree that it is far back from the cliff edge and the rope won't easily pull around the tree without it. I think I will use the wrap 3 pull 2 (with two back to back flat over hands ;)) when I'm replacing the in situ webbing at the crag as it looks the strongest for in situ webbing. What do you think? Thanks again.
Regarding the critique of the water knot ... It's good information. Everyone should know about this potential failure mechanism and take steps to avoid it. Referring to the water knot as the death knot is a bit extreme. I've been using this BEND for many many years and will continue to use it. If someone is concerned about their ability to identify situations where there is a potential for this failure mechanism, perhaps they should switch to a different bend.
I apologise, but I have searched for videos and information on the 'Axis' of the knot etc, and have not been successful. What the heck is the major 'Axis' of the knot? Sorry in advance. lol. Or, show me???
You are trying to make a differination between a bend and knot but it is purpose not form. W water knot is a knot unless you join two different pieces of webbing. There is no difference between a bowline and a webbing loop.
None of this is really relivent to canyoneering as it seems most centimeters accept a higher degree of risk. 1100lb, though wrong, is still strong enough.
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Love that two-step process!
Love the two-step process😮😂
With the correct technique and implementation, it can be an effective teaching tool.
Hahahahaha still laughing I was not expecting the slapping part hahaha
The beauty of the two-step process is that you only have to explain it once. You can then simply say "two step process" for your friends (and enemies) to understand what you mean.
It is a valuable technique that will serve you well in many situations in life.
Love the bit from 4:49 "if you were my partner..."
Thank you for showing the webbing once it failed. Helps me gain a better understanding!
Clear and concise. Very helpful, thanks!
Thank you, Gary.
I'm unsure how the 2 step process works... Perhaps a video demonstrating it would clarify 😉
Thank you for making these!
You do great job man, I found your channel and I like it, it confirms and increases my rope knowledge. Keep it up.
Thanks for the videos! How do you feel about rappelling down two ropes joined together with a flat overhand with long tails?
Also, I wonder if the tree in your video would fail before your flat overhand. ;)
I will have another video soon about the flat overhand in rope, also known as the EDK (European Death Knot).
For my own education. Why not use a figure eight instead? Thanks for the great videos.
Figure eight is my go-to for rope and cord. Knots in webbing are primarily based on the overhand.
@@CanyonsCrags Thank you for the reply. Is figure 8 just too cumbersome or weaker with webbing? Why not always use the 8?
It’s because of the geometry of webbing. It will lay flat on itself in an overhand knot resulting in it getting tighter as force is applied.
Who are the 3 that "thumbs downed" this video. Implement 1st step on them.
this is basicly a test of weather person went trough any propper training in "ropework" or not....
Probably a stupid question Rich, but what do you mean by loaded down its major axis? Do you mean on the narrow side of the sort of triangular-looking knot where the 2 tails of the overhand knot stick out? (And double checking, but you are saying an overhand on a bend is the same thing as a water knot, right? i.e. Different names for identical knot. But you don't like the term water knot?). Thanks
Not a stupid question, but not sure I can give a really clear answer. Look at the video starting at 2:50. That is a knot being pulled perpendicular to it's axis and is being pulled apart. When loaded on the major axis you will not see that.
I am picking nits about the names. A bend is used when connecting one end of rope (or cord or webbing) to another end. The water knot is a bend, but it is commonly referred to as water KNOT.
Bill Proctor and Richard Delaney have demonstrated that using the flat overhand for the wrap three pull two when one is wearing heavy gloves is actually safer because the water knot or overhand bend is almost impossible to tie unless you take your gloves off. taking your gloves off may not be permissible in certain situations. Glad to see you find it acceptable too. Personally I prefer cordage. Have built some absolutely bomber anchors with wrap 6 pull 5 with 6mm cordage. Cordage doesn't suffer the same strength loss failure mode as the wrap 3 pull 2 tape anchor. The tape anchor suffers from failure at the carabiner. One strand goes one way and the other strand goes the opposite way thus inducing friction. Cordage on the other hand tends to lay side by side and doesn't suffer similar friction failure. Of course for rapping wrap 3 pull 2 with webbing is heller strong enough for that job.
Why wouldnt you just use a water knot, and if you had enough webbing clip into a double wrap?
Seems safer to me.
I mentioned in the video -- what is most commonly called a water knot is actually a bend. In most instances a bend is the appropriate choice for setting up an anchor. There are occasions when an overhand knot is a better choice.
Haha Bitch slap. Love it!
I need this in German😀
Es tut mir Leid. Ich spreche kein Deutsch.
Canyons & Crags No problem I need more time to unterstand english :)
Hi Rich,
I enjoy your videos.
What do you think of this critique of the water knot? ua-cam.com/video/mXe-8GmS08k/v-deo.html
I would usually only use it to rig an abseil from a tree that it is far back from the cliff edge and the rope won't easily pull around the tree without it.
I think I will use the wrap 3 pull 2 (with two back to back flat over hands ;)) when I'm replacing the in situ webbing at the crag as it looks the strongest for in situ webbing.
What do you think?
Thanks again.
Regarding the critique of the water knot ... It's good information. Everyone should know about this potential failure mechanism and take steps to avoid it. Referring to the water knot as the death knot is a bit extreme. I've been using this BEND for many many years and will continue to use it. If someone is concerned about their ability to identify situations where there is a potential for this failure mechanism, perhaps they should switch to a different bend.
What I think about using a flat overhand for a wrap 3 pull 2 when the webbing will be left behind is addressed in the video.
Canyons & Crags thanks for your experienced feedback Rich.
Like the content, made sense! Renaming, "Bro Slap"! Your other term seems unnecessary.
There are many occasions in life when bitch slapping absolutely is necessary. PC is BS
@@CanyonsCrags How about some bro slapping!!
@@jenniferstockwell5498 why?
I apologise, but I have searched for videos and information on the 'Axis' of the knot etc, and have not been successful. What the heck is the major 'Axis' of the knot? Sorry in advance. lol. Or, show me???
Weird audio at the start
You are trying to make a differination between a bend and knot but it is purpose not form. W water knot is a knot unless you join two different pieces of webbing. There is no difference between a bowline and a webbing loop.
None of this is really relivent to canyoneering as it seems most centimeters accept a higher degree of risk. 1100lb, though wrong, is still strong enough.
LOL. Those crazy centimeters.