This is an absolutely great idea ! I am also , soooo glad you are going to use a bench and rest during these . I " used " to watch a guy here on YT that would " freehand " all the " accuracy " video's he did . Drove me nuts . And he is a X military guy ?! There is a reason the USMC , Army and the services use rest when " zeroing " your weapon in MC Boot or BCT . Anyway , can't wait for the rest of this series . I am also shocked the M&P won !!
I have a 7" M41 and feel the same way. Having a number of '70's era S&W revolvers, I agree with Mr. Funk about the quality of the SA trigger pull he has on his M18. My M41's trigger is every bit as good as that, and the long sight radius adds to the precision available. I routinely get 1-1/2" groups at 15 yards, standing freehand. I'll have to try a few from a sand bag.
I’ve shot several, really drives tacks, I would call them the Cadillac of .22’s. I used to shoot bullseye matches weekly and have shoot many different.22 handguns including some of the high end euro imports and of all them the 41 is tops followed by the top high standard models.
@@tomallen6073 I agree. My HS Victor is one fine shooter and has a better trigger than a 41 (hard to believe I know). But fragile in a way the 41 isn't. My 41 has eaten bricks of CCI stinger. A real no no in a HS Victor.
Back in the 80's and 90's, I shot on the police department pistol team. We competed in both PPC and indoor Bullseye competition. Bullseye was all shot at 25 yards, and we had a rimfire event and a centerfire match each month. Initially the league rules only allowed revolvers, so like most other guys, I shot a K-38 and a K-22 which were both fine revolvers. The biggest challenge was the rapid fire event, having to thumb cock the pistol and get off five shots in 10 seconds offhand while still holding the shots in the black. I credit the discipline instilled by this competition with improving all my other shooting. But in the mid-90's the league rules changed to allow semi-automatic pistols. In centerfire, I went with a Colt Gold Cup to avoid having to thumb cock the gun, and to take advantage of the larger hole punched by the .45 ACP, which would often break a scoring line on the target and pick up a point or two. But then I went on the hunt for a decent .22 automatic for the rimfire match. I started out with a Ruger MK II Target with the 5.5 inch bull barrel. It wasn't bad, but the stock trigger made it hard to do really well with. I then went with the Model 41 Smith and Wesson with the long barrel. It was the most accurate .22 I had ever fired, before or since. The problem was that mine was finicky about ammo, and steadfastly refused to feed/fire anything other than CCI Green Tag, which I couldn't always get. I finally went back to a Ruger, which was a .22/45 model with a Volquartsen match trigger. If I did my part, that gun would stay in the 10 ring at 25 yards. It liked Federal Gold Medal Match, but oddly enough also liked super cheap Winchester Wildcat. Go figure. My favorite non-match .22 was a thoroughly disreputable looking S&W Model 18 that came to me in a trade for $150. It had been treated to an awful re-bluing job, but man, that revolver would shoot. I used it to keep down the crow population in my neighbor's vineyard. Shots at 40 and 50 yards were absolutely no problem, but a crow is a tough bird, so pretty soon I went with an old Model 15 loaded with wadcutters for my pest control chores.
It is just extremely cool to make long, accurate shots with a handgun! By the way, I have found that Winchester wildcat ammunition to be fairly accurate as well.
Nice! The most accurate .22 handgun I ever shot is my dad's old S&W K22 Masterpiece. That thing is insanely accurate. My brother has it now, since my dad passed away, so its still in the family.
Good for you.. keep it in the family I have a 1936 outdoorsman which is what they called the K22 before it was one. It goes with me most trips out shooting. I know that guys who claim to love the 44 mags I bring will end up shooting the little gun before the day it over. in actual testing best I could... the K22/outdoorsman will hold its own with about anything. couple of friends have older olympic grade 22 pistols that will of course beat it but... not by that much! At one time Smith claimed the outdoorsman or K22 would shoot 2" groups at 50 yards. not sure that is true and I can't do it but I can hit a soda can terrorist at 50 yard more often than not. When they shoot it people always say.."this thing was made in 1936?"
@@hrfunk Any really cool guns I have that people think I paid a fortune for? they pretty much fell into my lap for one reason or another I paid $60 for my K22/outdoorsman his dad died and he just wanted cash. I even told him it was worth way more... The lie was.. I told him 'but not to me' My Python? buddy got it with about 10 other handguns for $400 each from a guy who inherited em and the gun store was lowballing him. Buddy brought it over and it would not even unlatch... he asked me to fix it. Who could put a sideplate on wrong? someone had ten minutes work and one new screw fixed it. 98% mint. Told the guy I wanted it. I had saved his butt at work a time or two and he said.. 'just keep it" I gave him the $400 he had paid but could have had it for free. Like you I am a table top gunsmith probly know less than you.. friends and friends of friends will bring me guns to look at. Some are way past my pay grade but some are pretty simple.. I never charge anyone but I will tell em 'the part is $100 say.. show em on the puter. they don't even want the gun anyway so say.. "give me $200 and it is yours" at this point I am glad to be between wives! LOL.. at 73 I may almost be done with that anyway LOL
Doing this video with only one type of ammo and calling it a "one and done" was a great idea. You're right, multiple ammo brands would have been longer and may have caused different scenarios based on the ammo, etc.. Of course, that also increases the chance of human error. Great job, more of these types of videos would be a good idea. BTW, although it wasn't my favorite firearm used in the competition, I chose the M&P simply because it was newer and probably had less rounds through it. Yes, I know that you can't simply go by that but for some reason that's what seemed right and that's how it turned out.
I CANNOT BELIEVE you're using the Wolf ammo! I was going to post a comment recommending that people try it, with the caveat that every setup is different (even my bipod front-to-back location seems to play a part), and thus may yield different results. Note that I've only used the Wolf Match EXTRA which, based on pricing, is a step up from the Match TARGET. In my Ruger Precision bolt-action, it beats EVERYTHING, including all the Eley I've tried (though I haven't tried ALL the Eley), up to and including two varieties of Tenex (which is STRANGE, since the Wolf is PRODUCED by Eley!), a few varieties of Lapua (though Polar Biathlon came close), etc. One likely competitor that I HAVEN'T tried is the Lapua X-ACT which, based on PRICING ALONE (MSRP over $40/50, but should be available for $30/box) , had better be the BEST, since the Wolf can be had for 1/3 the price!
H&R model 950 22lr is the most accurate handgun I've owned, more so than my m&p 22c and ruger mark II. Made in '82, 5.5" barrel. The sights are big and easy to see and the da/sa trigger is excellent. Everyone who touches it shoots it well, which makes for a fun/good experience for every level of shooter. It's balanced just right and easy to hold steady on target.
I have a HS Victor that is most accurate. I used to shoot at empty 45acp shells at about 20 feet. I hit quite a few. The problem was then finding them in the grass. I finally found one with a perfect hole through the center, still have it.
I bought a S&W Victory .22 because it was relatively cheap ($350). It is my most accurate handgun. It out shoots my original Python, S&W 629, and Kimber Gold Match II. So a variety of top of the line from major manufacturers. It also shoots very well for me. That is off hand outside blasting catfood cans at 25 yards. I was very surprised at the rapid fire accuracy as off hand and rapid fire is generally not the best test of accuracy. A S&W Model 41 is on my wish list.
I was eyeing a Victory as well after my ex purchased one as her first handgun. I went with the Ruger Wrangler instead and I still wonder if I made the right decision
Enjoyed this test very much. My best target .22 pistol is a Ruger stainless MkII 6 1/2 " slab-sided barrel. It will do 1" at 25 yrds off the bench, also with Wolf ammo. Look forward to many more of these tests. DJ
I'd agree, Ruger Govt. Competition Target model. MK3. Slab side 6-7/8". nickel groups supported or with olympic ammo maybe dime or hair under at 25yds. My competition, squirrel and bunny gun! Wolf, CCI, Eley, RWS & Lapua it loves, esp Eley Club orange box.
Howard, I am going to LOVE this series . . . thank you, and I urge you to produce similar videos. I, too, was amazed with the M&P’s accuracy, although my M&P 1.0 9mm 4.25 inch barrel police model has consistently been a surprisingly accurate (in comparison to other polymer / striker autoloaders). I’d add a quick word for the Smith M18; I own a 1947 or ‘48 S&W K14 Target Masterpiece (cambered in .38 Special, with a six inch barrel). It is superbly accurate. Obviously, it predates MIM parts, CNC machining and the other excellent, modern, cost savings innovations. BUT real ARTISANSHIP (imho) supplants all those things. When K Frames left Springfield, Massachusetts, a few decades ago, they generally were both exceptionally high quality and very accurate.
My Sport King was a jamomatic. Its only saving grace was the large square front sight the previous owner had installed on it. A decade ago I finally purchased a spare magazine and to my surprise it solved the jamming issue. They are fun pistols to shoot and I love the rapid barrel removal and field stripping. These features alone place it head and shoulders above any Ruger MK series pistol.
High Standard pistols do not have a feed ramp as most other pistols and rely on the feed lips of the magazine to position the bullet into the chamber. Adjusting the magazine lips will solve feeding problems. There is a tool available that will do this, but it takes a bit of trial and error to do the adjustment. Having a working magazine to use for reference is a big help. Most non factory magazines are not properly hardened and will get out of adjustment more frequently than genuine H.S. magazines.
@@Jddvs Thanks, but I eventually decided not to attempt any further repairs on the old mag. Instead, I now use it for training purposes so stud nets learn how to clear jams. At that mission it excels. 🙂
I've got that same HI Standard sporting. It's been in wild places and provided many meals. It's been kinda replaced by an new Ruger MKIV tactical 22/45 with red dot.
I would have not laid a bet on the S&W M&P either. I have only owned one rimfire handgun purchased in 1982. The Ruger Single -Six. It's part of my varmint hunting battery. It was originally a 9" barrel. I had cut to 7.5 to make it a perfect fit into a Bianchi flap holster. New sights were installed. The front is a bead that allows for precise alignment. On a central Oregon ranch the landowner asked me to thin out the ground squirrels that had so much burrowing that is fence fell over. The Ruger was warm as I kept it up for two hours. I think 30 yard at the most and down to 10 yards. Still need to watch out for irrigation equipment beyond so not all opportunities were taken. Going to pick up a Ruger LCRx 3" in .22 WMR today at my LGS.
Very nice video H R. My Bride has a S&W MP-22 compact and I and her find it to be a very fun to shoot pistol. I also enjoy shooting my Glock Model 40 in 22. Both 22s are fun and MUCH cheaper to shoot then their 9mm/40S&W big brothers. My most accurate pistol was a government issued S&W Model 66 with 4" barrel; it would shoot 1/2 dollar sized groups at 15 yards during qualification.
@@hrfunk I shot it one day at 100 yards on a B-27 target and put 4 out of 6 in the upper body and then got cocky and tried head shots and put one just to the right and one just to the left of the head. Great trigger and it broke like glass. Loved that pistol but lost it when we switched over to S&W 6906s.
@@samhendriks1807 10lbs in D/A seems to be a better than average trigger. My best triggers are around 9 or 10 lbs in D/A and 2 1/2-3ish on S/A.I only have Smith S/A D/A revolvers. Ruger's look clunky to me.
I love shooting 22lr in rifle and handguns. I've owned and shoot a couple that you showed, all are super nice plinkers. But I've always found that no matter the brand our action that CCI ammo works. Great video 👍👍
I've found that CCI MINIMAGS 40gr solids has the best combination of reliability and accuracy in semi-autos . I don't often carry .22lr, but when I do...MiniMags...😉
I shot a M& P compact for the First time two weeks ago down in Texas with some Military Friends. We were shooting for Fun at 25 yards Offhand! None of Us Received Your Results but, NOT One Magazine Shot Ever Left the 7 Ring! I Was Extremely Impressed by the Reset!!! Banging away on the 12 Inch Steel Target As Fast as Any of Us Could Master?!?! The Four of us went thru Over Two Hundred Rounds! It is my Next Purchase!? Hope mine Upholds the Quality and Accuracy of the one I shot! I was also Blown away by the Revolvers Accuracy! Still CAN'T Beat Old School Handcrafted! Thanks For Sharing This Video
My most accurate .22lr pistol is my Colt Woodsman Match Target. From my limited research on the serial number, I believe it was manufactured between 1939 and 1940. My dad picked it up sometime in the 1960’s when he left the navy. I don’t shoot it much as it’s in beautiful condition and I have other .22 handguns but when I do, it’s a real tack driver.
Thank you SIR for a video that's very close to my HEART. I'm a ADVID target shooter of pistols and rifles preferably in 22lr because there are SO MANY really NICE COOL old 22lrs pistols and rifles, so cheap to shoot without busting the BANK. I've got a Hi-Standard Sport King SK100 with a 6.75" barrel, 5.5" S&W model 41, Browning Buck Mark Bullseye/ Silhouette (got both barrels 7.25" & 9.5") and a interesting old single shot Czech target pistol with a 9.5" barrel. Keep up the GOOD WORK PROMOTING THE 2nd AMENDMENT.😉😁👍🙏 I NEED TO DO A 19:27 LIKE YOU DID WITH MY TOYS.😁👍
Wow I love that high standard.. I purchased about 20 years ago a Browning Buckmark .22 lr ..4in barrel .. one of the nicest factory triggers to ever come out... Extremely accurate...
Thanks for you video. The most accurate 22 lr Pistol I own is my 25 + year old Model S&W 41 with the 5 1/2 inch heavy barrel. I have obtained groups well under an inch at 25 yards with low cost 22 LR ammo. I had one lot of 22 lr HV Blazer bulk ammo that would deliver consistent groups well under an inch at 25 yards sometimes just one ragged hole. It is not picky on ammunition and hardly ever jams.
I have a red Leupold Gilmore rifle dot on my 7.5" Smith 41 barrel. I pulled over on a 100-yard target after a 25-yard sight in. 10" low, but 5 shots went into about 1.25" group. Surprised the heck out of me.
to me it is obvious that the pistols you did best with have sights that are similar to what you use most. your eye is more accustomed to that sight picture. if you were to spend several days shooting just the target sights your group would tighten up but then after your groups with the M&P and the 19 revolver would open up. it is all about the balance between mind and body IMO.
I had to watch this vid again Howard. I have been into .22 pitsol { uh, misspelling intended } shooting lately. I have a great old gravel pit on BLM land I can ride my quad out to only 4.5 miles from my driveway. I have literally blanketed the ground there with spent .22 shell casings. All my other various casings come back home with me to get recharged to make the trip to the pit once again. Anyway I wanted to comment on two .22s I have been shooting lately. One is a Browning Buckmark and the other a S&W .22 Victory. I have other .22 pitsols but these are my two favorites. Now I have owned two model 41s in the past but hands down my favorite .22 is the S&W .22 Victory. I like it better than even the 41s I had. I was considering putting one of those " purty " Volquartsen barrels on it but reallized what a wonderful stock barrel I had, so decided to keep it. I did dress it up a bit with some very tasteful bead blasting, a Tandemcross trigger and Halo charging loop, and some LOK grips. OOHHH Howard.......it are purty ! And I think the stock sights are wonderful on that gun. I do have a Burris Fastfire III red dot for it also but I actually do my best shooting with the stock open sights. That .22 is wonderfully accurate !! But I also very much enjoy my Browning Buckmark UDX. It also is a very, very accurate .22. I also put LOK grips on it and dare I say it..........I did the Higgis Flip on the trigger and replaced the guide rod with a better design. Fun gun !!! Fun guns !!! Doug.
That sounds great Doug! I’ve been wanting to try a Victory Model for quite a while, but I just haven’t gotten to it yet. I don’t believe I’ve ever shot a Buckmark either, but they seem like very nice handguns. There’s something very relaxing, and just plain fun, about shooting .22s. I probably need to do it more often. Thanks for the comment!
Some years ago I fired my 60's Browning Medalist from a plastic bench at an indoor range - 50 feet. The first 8 shots went into one slightly ragged hole. Then I got excited and threw the last two slightly off.
Nice video! I think the ammo/gun combination (if the gun liked the ammo that was used) is a major factor here. I was surprised the Model 18 did not do better. My 18-2 loves LRN and hates FMJ. My most accurate pistol is my Magnum Research 1911G with a Nelson Custom 22 Converter. Thanks for doing this test!
I had a 22A and shot mountains of ammo through it. The weak spot is in the design where the bolt slams into the back of the breech. That energy is transferred through the locking block and will eventually crack the frame over top of the trigger. SW replaced mine with a Victory. On paper the Victor is a better pistol, but I miss my 22A.
I think the old adage, "they dont make em like they used to" isnt true about some modern guns. The tighter machine tolerances of new manufacturing is definitely something that is beneficial.
I’ve got two of them that’s just about a tie. First is a 1970’s S&W model 17. It’s the gun I learned to shoot handguns with. I put thousands upon thousands of rounds through it and got very proficient. Then comes a Ruger mark II. It is scary accurate when I do my part. Nowadays I shoot a Glock 19 with a conversion unit on it. It’s not as accurate as the others but it’s the gun my granddaughters like to shoot. They’re spoiled. Anything I can do to spend more time with them, I do. When they get a bit older I’ll put the 9mm slide on it and give the guns to them when they get old enough. Any 22 is just plain fun to shoot. Thanks for another great video sir. It dredged up some memories from way back.
Proper bullseye guns with great ammo (and high quality sights) make a huge difference. My Marvel conversion shoots sub-inch at 50 yards with Eley Club.
Yes, I did enjoy this, HR. A good fun day at the range and it made a good video. WMT ammo was a good all around choice, too. I expected that HS Sport King to do better but the sights kind of handicapped it. The Ft. Campbell Pistol Team used HS handguns and so did a lot of other military marksmanship teams. They were hard to beat. I still have my M-18 4" S&W. Don't think I ever shot groups with it but it was death on tin cans and I did in several squirrels and rabbits when I happened to have it with me when the opportunities came up.
I had a very early model 22A with the 7" barrel. Also picked up a 5" bull barrel for it. That was back when I could get bricks of .22 for I think $5/1K. I shot that gun so much that eventually I wore it out, and S&W replaced it with a new Victory. Can't complain about that considering I got about 20 years of enjoyment from it.
Great video! I have my dad's hi standard model B and I know what you mean about the sights. I also have my grand dad's bird's head grip S&W in 22 short and it seems all handguns of those eras have the same rudimentary sights. I guess shooters than were more instinct shooters. At any rate keep them coming and I would most definitely like to see accuracy tests between different category of firearms...
Heck yeah, more of this series please. Love all my firearms, but have a special affinity for my 22LRs, especially the safe full of pistols and revolvers. In my case my SW model 41 is the one I shoot best.
I would’ve not expected that result either, like you I have many .22’s including a colt frontier scout and a high standard. I would’ve put my money on the 22A or high standard. Sights play a large roll. Would really like a S&W 41 but never can justify the expenditure, maybe someday. Good to see other enthusiasts and their collections. Thanks for taking the time to make this video.
I've had the S&W M&P 22 Compact for years and I enjoy plinking with it on 10 inch steel plates and just overall cheap practice. Nice cheap ammo and it's fun.
Thanks for a fun video. I can't get to the range as often as I'd like (who can?); watching this video is the next best thing. Oh, I was born in 1955, and I learned to shoot in 1966 with a Colt Woodsman and a 1911 re-barreled in .22 cal. Perfect for an 11-year-old boy! --Old Guy
That was fun. We always learn several things, not just the focus of the video. I was mainly watching your bench set up - a folding table and pistol butt on top of two sandbags. Was that sturdy for you? What's your opinion of putting the pistol frame on the bags? Now I want to take my 22s to the range and figure out which one to use in the 2023 Turkey Shoot ar our club. I won a turkey with the Model 617 6" last year. You also introduced the concept of same ammo to pick the most accurate pistol, then experiment with different ammo on that one pistol.
Thanks Scott! I rest the butt of the grip on the bag because the recoil impulse more closely replicates the results that might be expected if the shots were fired unsupported. It’s “sturdy enough.”
Mine is Ruger Mk3 Government Competition Target Model with wedge frame to frame fitup. 6-7/8" bull barrel slab side. Keeps golf ball moving at 25-50 yds. Second was not mine, a Haëmerli 208. More accurate then I was. Also enjoyed a Feinwerkbau and a Walther Olympic, unknown but very recent models for training. Feinwerkbau was a few tens of grams trigger pull! Fun to shoot!
I had a Ruger Hunter MkIII 22 I traded for a S&W 19-5, 4". That Ruger was something else for making little groups. I do not have a 22LR handgun now. I need to fix that. I have plenty of 22LR rifles. They all shoot very nicely.
Another very well-done video sir! I enjoyed the content and certainly appreciate your hard work in producing these quality videos for us to enjoy. You make it look easy, but I know from experience what it takes to set up the camera shots, the post production editing and taking the time from family and friends to pursue your passion. I always look forward to your productions.
I agree, David. And in this video I was thinking, this is why hrfunk was a good firearms instructor -- he walks through the shot groups, the discussion of sights types and what each person's eye may be drawn toward, and why the groups ended up looking as they did. He mentions trigger differences. And he walks us through it patiently. Reminds me quite a bit of another favorite on YT, GunBlue490.
I think your difficulty of the sights as you described is valid. Getting on in age doesn't help the situation. I think a proper set of sights on the High Standard, and the 41 should make both of those guns shine over the other ones. Traditionaly those guns are used in compition all over the world and set up correctly, will smoke the others. I'd like to see you do three five shot groups and take a little more time to line up each shot. Adjust your sights, because at ten yards you can see the holes and subconsciously, you're making adjustments. Or, move the targets out to twenty or twenty five yrds. On the revolvers, mark on of the cylinders so you can keep track and test to see which five are the most consistant and use the best five for your test. Just my thoughts.
Great test I do not own a 22 handgun and was very interested in the results. I would not have guessed the M&P would have won. But I believe your testing criteria was valid. If I buy a 22 I'd strongly consider the M&P as well as a K frame revolver.
Really enjoyed this! Looking forward to the series. As in this video,sometimes we are really surprised at what a particular firearm can do. Thank you H.R.
Excellent comparison video, thanks for sharing! Definitely impressed with the M&P. I'm still kicking myself for not getting one before the handgun sale ban here in Canada, as I use an M&P for Canadian Police Combat Association competition, and a .22 would have been a great way to extend my practice budget with the more affordable ammo. Thanks again, HR, and have a great day!
My first .22 pistol was a Browning Buckmark Camper which I bought circa 2011…from the first mag, FTF. It kind of soured me on semi-auto .22 pistols. I did have some good experiences with the S&W Victory but wound up going with the Ruger Wrangler because I love revolvers (as I frequently mention) and the price was hard to beat. Unfortunately, long story short, I had to send the Wrangler back to the mothership and Ruger is sending me a replacement pistol. I just can’t win with .22 handguns 😂
The first pistol I ever shot was at age 5; my Father's Colt Woodsman that he had purchased new in 1929. He was behind me with his hands around mine and only one cartridge in the pistol. I've witnessed him make some truly remarkable shots with that pistol. But it's not the most accurate .22 pistol I've ever shot. That honor goes to my Erma ESP-85 that I bought new in 1986. I enjoyed your video but bet on the Hi-Standard, a manufacturer that made some amazingly accurate target pistols.
I have to agree with SGT MAJ Trapp. The most accurate 22 I have ever fired is a S&W model 41. There are many accurate 22lr handguns and one must try a wide selection of ammunition to find which one works best in a particular gun. The very first handgun I ever had was a German copy of the Colt Frontier Six and it was unbelievably accurate for a revolver that cost $46.00 . Point is, there are lots of tack drivers out there. How much fun can we have finding the best?!
S&W model 41 is a great bullseye gun, and I wish I had one! Right now for my bullseye .22, I shoot a Ruger mk2 with a Clark trigger and a BoMar rib and sights. I also have the same on my Gold Cup. Nice to have the same sight picture on both bullseye guns.
Enjoyed the video. I believe this is a great idea for a video series. Looking forward to seeing more of them. Keep the great videos coming. I like all of them.
My two most accurate 22LR handguns are the S&W Model 41 and S&W 617-6 shot revolver. I also own a Ruger Single Six and Single Ten, and Ruger Wrangler. The issues I have with the Ruger SA's is with the sight picture. Due to my eyes and I have to wear tri-focal lenes makes shooting accuracy very difficult. This is not a revolver issue but my eyes are my eyes! Back in the day when I competed in 22LR bullseye match my go to was my Browning Buckmark Target! I wish I never traded it in for another firearm. Great video and as alway's awesome shooting.
Hi Chief! I do like the shooting comparison testing, and I'd love to see you get your hands on a S&W Model 41, a Colt Woodsman Match Target, and a High Standard Victor to do some further testing. I think that you would really enjoy it as well. I own all of those as well as a few others and I really enjoy taking them out and trying them against one another. I put red dots on all of mine as I'm getting older but it's some of the best fun to have on the cheap.
Mechanical accuracy can be affirmed or completely disregarded if the auxiliary influences adversely effect the shooters ability to use it. I.E: grip, trigger and sights - among other possible influences but for brevity we'll use those three. If the grip is uncomfortable - you're not getting a good group. If the trigger is heavy and gritty - you're not getting a good group. If the sights obscure the target, or provide too much play for the shooter to visually distinguish between being on target or off - you're not going to get a good group. Bullseye competition guns are not simply flights of fancy, they at the way they are: for a reason.
@@hrfunk The best science is always fun, and by that I mean practical application engineering. Laboratory work is for stiffs who want to debate the plausibility of dimensional math, field testing is for engineers who chuckle and say "watch this."
Have you considered a video on using 22lr as a training aid? The Army used 22lr adapters. My police academy used .22 lr revolvers on the first day of training, and your Smith Auto looks useful in the same way.
I consider 1966 a very good year; that's when I was born too. My most accurate handgun/s: S&W 41 5" and Ruger Old Army 7 1/2". Both can stay under 1 inche at 15 yards & under an inch & a half at 25 when my eyes are up to it. Neither one has ever edged out the other.
@hrfunk Sadly Ruger stopped making them 10-15 years ago & prices for used ones are going up. Last one I saw for sale was $800. Most I paid for one was $500( I have 3) & it came with a cartridge cylinder as well. I've only fired the one, the others are collectors.
The only barrel lengths I'm aware of were 7 1/2 adjustable sight & 5 1/2 fixed sight both in blue or stainless. I have less trouble with rust from my blued blackpowder guns than stainless as long as I care for them right. My stainless ROA is the one I shoot because it's the first one I bought but I replaced my stainless rifles with blue for that reason. Never use nitro solvents on blackpowder guns; I use Windex with vinegar to clean(some say it hurts bluing but I haven't seen that) or boiling water - no soap - Ballistol to wipe down with & Bore Butter, Ox Yoke or Crisco for bullet lube. Hope you find one soon!
Good morning HR. Nice idea for a series. You could do each caliber in your collection and then a shoot off for the best overall. Great choice on the Wolf ammo. It gives Eley performance at a much better price. In good rifles it makes 1 ragged hole at 50 yards. The first handgun I owned was a .22 single action, single shot Savage 101. Couldn't hit much with it. I started bullseye competition with a 5" bull barrel Ruger pistol. Eventually worked up to the most accurate handgun I've ever owned, a Walther GSP. The 50 meter factory test target looked like it was shot with a rifle. Would like to see you on Utreon. I'm subscribed to Forgotten Weapons and a couple of others there. They can post content that would get them banned here on UA-cam.
My experience, I have never been able to get tight little groups with fiber optic sights. Kind of the same experience you had. I would have put my money on the Smith Revolver. Great video
In case anyone from the " HASBRO " company is watching this video I think Mr. HR Funk has the perfect head to model the next re-issue of the 12" GI Joe Action Figures. All he needs is a manly looking scar on his cheek. To get him to sign the contract they may have to rename the new Action Figure series " Jarhead Joe " .
@@hrfunk All you need to close the deal would be if your hands had " Kung Fu Grip ". I would insist on the 12" series. Those 3" figures were an insult to the American fighting man. Besides, how could a 3" Joe take Barbie out on a date? His feet wouldn't reach the pedals of his M-151A1 Jeep.
Thanks for sharing, the results are interesting for sure. I have never benched my 22s nor tried to pair them with specific ammo. I do find it disappointing that the groups were not tighter at that range and agree that sights can contribute to that. Having put many rounds through my New Frontier , I find it amazingly accurate and at some point put some red nail polish on the front sight to help with the sight picture. I would suspect my S&W 41 is probably my most accurate 22 handgun and is far more accurate than I am. At some point I want to put a MRD on it and do some testing.
The s&w Mdl. 41 is supposed to shoot one inch at 50 yards.A lot of rifles can’t do that. I use to shoot NRA style bulls eye, the last year I shoot with my 41 I finished high expert in a league of 255 competitors.
Had my 'Ruger single six (.38 frame) since '59 or '60, well worn but still works fine. Also the full cartridge belt and quick-draw holster, got really fast with it back then, no way I'd win a face-down now. Always fun anyway.
I have one 22lr handgun. A Ruger Mk III that someone put a mag release lever 0n. It is also a bull barrel. I haven’t shot that in a long long time. Mainly because of how expensive ammo is. I can make 9mm for under $2/50. 38spl for about the same. Good video though. I’m not surprised at the outcome since, for the last 20 years you have been shooting an M&P of some sort for duty…..
Oh yeah, I enjoyed it! Punching holes in paper is what I love to do. BTW, I have discovered S&B "Club" .22lr to be nearly as accurate as the expensive brands. And It can be purchased for about $4 a box. Looking forward to the next accuacy test.
Thanks hrfunk, I liked this one a lot. Great to hear your thoughts on the different sights, and which ones are more instinctive/easier for you to use. Is your favorite a plain black set, with defined right angles etc? I'd imagine that if you like the crisp black metal silhouettes, the fiber optic's dot would be distracting, not sharp or right-angles enough for what you find easier to resolve. Since I spend much more time on RDS, if I use irons I prefer that glowing blob up front, it reminds me more of the RDS dot reticle. Plain black iron sights are very slow for me to resolve. That M&P group was very impressive. And each of the others was precise, even if the groups were a bit shifted from center. The flier oddballs seemed to me like typical .22LR finickiness, firearm vs ammo, and ammo consistency itself.
Thanks Sean. For pure target work I prefer the sharp, square sights. If acquisition speed becomes a factor, then fiber optics, dots, etc are my preference.
First off, I just found this site, and I’ve watched a few of your videos. Thanks, they are informative and entertaining for me. Accuracy of any firearm (pistol/rifle) seems to be always an approximation. One day with all conditions being close to the same, you get tight groups, and then another time with the relative same conditions not so tight… . So, nothing is really absolute with accuracy comparisons. Still, I enjoy the testing you did, thanks. I’m not one who shoots at 10 yards, 20 feet, 50 feet distances. Sure, I’ve read where most firearm confrontations occur at or less than 7 yards. But I’m not shooting my .22 LR Ruger Competition at 10 yards. I’ve always thought 25 yards is the minimum to shoot for accuracy evaluation in a pistol. That’s my take on it. If I’m thinking of using a pistol (whatever caliber) to train with for “self defense”, then sure maybe at a shorter distance might be a choice I’d consider. Still, 25 yards and greater, knowing your firearm is accurate out to that distance is a absolute confidence builder (for me). Enjoying your videos, and this is by no means a negative review. (I agree that the fiber optics sights are great for relative accuracy, but precise target shooting with open sights? Maybe not so much, but a great boon for combat (if that’s the right term) shooting trying to pick up that front sight… . Thanks
Haven’t checked your videos recently (publisher due-dates-ARRGH!), but, as always, you are thorough, methodical, and pleasant. I will have to log in more often. Thank you for sharing your expertise with us!
Funk Sir, I would love to see more of this type of video from you, absolutely. I was rooting for the High Standard 1st and the SW18 2nd. For all intents and purposes though I am not surprised the M&P won based on trigger time and muscle memory !?!
Surprise, surprise.😄 Makes me want to get out my second series Colt Woodsman and see how it compares to that High Standard. They did have some nice pistols back in the day.
Try the S&W model 41. Mine shoots better than most people that shoot it. I shot my best 3 shot group with it at less than 0.200'' center to center shot with a Trijicon RMR on it. They have great triggers, sites and a build quality that can't be beat
I had a 22A with a dot sight on it, almost anyone shooting it could hit exactly where they wanted. I didn't really go for the style, and eventually sold it, but it was probably the most accurate handgun I have ever had / shot.
Mine has always been very accurate too. As I mentioned in the video, I thought it was one of the front runners in this competition. I might give it another try with a different sight, and see how it does.
@@hrfunk I had a dot sight that was probably one MOA, my 12 year old daughter could hit tiny targets, like a poker game target, or a darts target, so could most anyone that shot it. It was the most accurate combo. I even had two friends that were jealous, that sought out to buy one, so they could shoot as well. I had sent it in to Smith and Wesson, for some updates, of which, I do not remember what they were.
M&P shows the quality put in, not taking anything away from the others which have great reputations. Love videos like this HR! Great job!
Thanks Dan!
This is an absolutely great idea ! I am also , soooo glad you are going to use a bench and rest during these . I " used " to watch a guy here on YT that would " freehand " all the " accuracy " video's he did . Drove me nuts . And he is a X military guy ?! There is a reason the USMC , Army and the services use rest when " zeroing " your weapon in MC Boot or BCT . Anyway , can't wait for the rest of this series . I am also shocked the M&P won !!
The 5" Model 41 S&W .22 was the most accurate pistol I've ever owned or fired.
Same here.
I have a 7" M41 and feel the same way. Having a number of '70's era S&W revolvers, I agree with Mr. Funk about the quality of the SA trigger pull he has on his M18. My M41's trigger is every bit as good as that, and the long sight radius adds to the precision available. I routinely get 1-1/2" groups at 15 yards, standing freehand. I'll have to try a few from a sand bag.
I've got a 7'' model 41 and its the most accurate handgun I've ever shot. It shoots better than most people can hold it
I’ve shot several, really drives tacks, I would call them the Cadillac of .22’s. I used to shoot bullseye matches weekly and have shoot many different.22 handguns including some of the high end euro imports and of all them the 41 is tops followed by the top high standard models.
@@tomallen6073 I agree. My HS Victor is one fine shooter and has a better trigger than a 41 (hard to believe I know). But fragile in a way the 41 isn't. My 41 has eaten bricks of CCI stinger. A real no no in a HS Victor.
Back in the 80's and 90's, I shot on the police department pistol team. We competed in both PPC and indoor Bullseye competition. Bullseye was all shot at 25 yards, and we had a rimfire event and a centerfire match each month. Initially the league rules only allowed revolvers, so like most other guys, I shot a K-38 and a K-22 which were both fine revolvers. The biggest challenge was the rapid fire event, having to thumb cock the pistol and get off five shots in 10 seconds offhand while still holding the shots in the black. I credit the discipline instilled by this competition with improving all my other shooting.
But in the mid-90's the league rules changed to allow semi-automatic pistols. In centerfire, I went with a Colt Gold Cup to avoid having to thumb cock the gun, and to take advantage of the larger hole punched by the .45 ACP, which would often break a scoring line on the target and pick up a point or two. But then I went on the hunt for a decent .22 automatic for the rimfire match. I started out with a Ruger MK II Target with the 5.5 inch bull barrel. It wasn't bad, but the stock trigger made it hard to do really well with.
I then went with the Model 41 Smith and Wesson with the long barrel. It was the most accurate .22 I had ever fired, before or since. The problem was that mine was finicky about ammo, and steadfastly refused to feed/fire anything other than CCI Green Tag, which I couldn't always get. I finally went back to a Ruger, which was a .22/45 model with a Volquartsen match trigger. If I did my part, that gun would stay in the 10 ring at 25 yards. It liked Federal Gold Medal Match, but oddly enough also liked super cheap Winchester Wildcat. Go figure.
My favorite non-match .22 was a thoroughly disreputable looking S&W Model 18 that came to me in a trade for $150. It had been treated to an awful re-bluing job, but man, that revolver would shoot. I used it to keep down the crow population in my neighbor's vineyard. Shots at 40 and 50 yards were absolutely no problem, but a crow is a tough bird, so pretty soon I went with an old Model 15 loaded with wadcutters for my pest control chores.
It is just extremely cool to make long, accurate shots with a handgun! By the way, I have found that Winchester wildcat ammunition to be fairly accurate as well.
Nice! The most accurate .22 handgun I ever shot is my dad's old S&W K22 Masterpiece. That thing is insanely accurate. My brother has it now, since my dad passed away, so its still in the family.
I wish I could find one of those for anything resembling a sane price!
My grandfather had one with a long eye relief scope on it my cousin has it scene he passed
Good for you.. keep it in the family I have a 1936 outdoorsman which is what they called the K22 before it was one. It goes with me most trips out shooting. I know that guys who claim to love the 44 mags I bring will end up shooting the little gun before the day it over. in actual testing best I could... the K22/outdoorsman will hold its own with about anything. couple of friends have older olympic grade 22 pistols that will of course beat it but... not by that much! At one time Smith claimed the outdoorsman or K22 would shoot 2" groups at 50 yards. not sure that is true and I can't do it but I can hit a soda can terrorist at 50 yard more often than not. When they shoot it people always say.."this thing was made in 1936?"
@@hrfunk Any really cool guns I have that people think I paid a fortune for? they pretty much fell into my lap for one reason or another I paid $60 for my K22/outdoorsman his dad died and he just wanted cash. I even told him it was worth way more... The lie was.. I told him 'but not to me' My Python? buddy got it with about 10 other handguns for $400 each from a guy who inherited em and the gun store was lowballing him. Buddy brought it over and it would not even unlatch... he asked me to fix it. Who could put a sideplate on wrong? someone had ten minutes work and one new screw fixed it. 98% mint. Told the guy I wanted it. I had saved his butt at work a time or two and he said.. 'just keep it" I gave him the $400 he had paid but could have had it for free. Like you I am a table top gunsmith probly know less than you.. friends and friends of friends will bring me guns to look at. Some are way past my pay grade but some are pretty simple.. I never charge anyone but I will tell em 'the part is $100 say.. show em on the puter. they don't even want the gun anyway so say.. "give me $200 and it is yours" at this point I am glad to be between wives! LOL.. at 73 I may almost be done with that anyway LOL
Doing this video with only one type of ammo and calling it a "one and done" was a great idea. You're right, multiple ammo brands would have been longer and may have caused different scenarios based on the ammo, etc.. Of course, that also increases the chance of human error. Great job, more of these types of videos would be a good idea. BTW, although it wasn't my favorite firearm used in the competition, I chose the M&P simply because it was newer and probably had less rounds through it. Yes, I know that you can't simply go by that but for some reason that's what seemed right and that's how it turned out.
Any time I take someone shooting especially for their first time I take my S&W 422. Always a confidence booster when they can hit the target!
I CANNOT BELIEVE you're using the Wolf ammo! I was going to post a comment recommending that people try it, with the caveat that every setup is different (even my bipod front-to-back location seems to play a part), and thus may yield different results.
Note that I've only used the Wolf Match EXTRA which, based on pricing, is a step up from the Match TARGET. In my Ruger Precision bolt-action, it beats EVERYTHING, including all the Eley I've tried (though I haven't tried ALL the Eley), up to and including two varieties of Tenex (which is STRANGE, since the Wolf is PRODUCED by Eley!), a few varieties of Lapua (though Polar Biathlon came close), etc.
One likely competitor that I HAVEN'T tried is the Lapua X-ACT which, based on PRICING ALONE (MSRP over $40/50, but should be available for $30/box) , had better be the BEST, since the Wolf can be had for 1/3 the price!
H&R model 950 22lr is the most accurate handgun I've owned, more so than my m&p 22c and ruger mark II. Made in '82, 5.5" barrel. The sights are big and easy to see and the da/sa trigger is excellent. Everyone who touches it shoots it well, which makes for a fun/good experience for every level of shooter. It's balanced just right and easy to hold steady on target.
I have a HS Victor that is most accurate. I used to shoot at empty 45acp shells at about 20 feet. I hit quite a few. The problem was then finding them in the grass. I finally found one with a perfect hole through the center, still have it.
I bought a S&W Victory .22 because it was relatively cheap ($350). It is my most accurate handgun. It out shoots my original Python, S&W 629, and Kimber Gold Match II. So a variety of top of the line from major manufacturers. It also shoots very well for me. That is off hand outside blasting catfood cans at 25 yards. I was very surprised at the rapid fire accuracy as off hand and rapid fire is generally not the best test of accuracy. A S&W Model 41 is on my wish list.
I was eyeing a Victory as well after my ex purchased one as her first handgun. I went with the Ruger Wrangler instead and I still wonder if I made the right decision
Enjoyed this test very much. My best target .22 pistol is a Ruger stainless MkII 6 1/2 " slab-sided barrel. It will do 1" at 25 yrds off the bench, also with Wolf ammo.
Look forward to many more of these tests. DJ
I'd agree, Ruger Govt. Competition Target model. MK3. Slab side 6-7/8". nickel groups supported or with olympic ammo maybe dime or hair under at 25yds. My competition, squirrel and bunny gun! Wolf, CCI, Eley, RWS & Lapua it loves, esp Eley Club orange box.
Howard, I am going to LOVE this series . . . thank you, and I urge you to produce similar videos. I, too, was amazed with the M&P’s accuracy, although my M&P 1.0 9mm 4.25 inch barrel police model has consistently been a surprisingly accurate (in comparison to other polymer / striker autoloaders).
I’d add a quick word for the Smith M18; I own a 1947 or ‘48 S&W K14 Target Masterpiece (cambered in .38 Special, with a six inch barrel). It is superbly accurate. Obviously, it predates MIM parts, CNC machining and the other excellent, modern, cost savings innovations. BUT real ARTISANSHIP (imho) supplants all those things. When K Frames left Springfield, Massachusetts, a few decades ago, they generally were both exceptionally high quality and very accurate.
I wholeheartedly agree. Those were some great old wheelguns. I'm not sure. We'll see you there like again.
My Sport King was a jamomatic. Its only saving grace was the large square front sight the previous owner had installed on it. A decade ago I finally purchased a spare magazine and to my surprise it solved the jamming issue. They are fun pistols to shoot and I love the rapid barrel removal and field stripping. These features alone place it head and shoulders above any Ruger MK series pistol.
High Standard pistols do not have a feed ramp as most other pistols and rely on the feed lips of the magazine to position the bullet into the chamber. Adjusting the magazine lips will solve feeding problems. There is a tool available that will do this, but it takes a bit of trial and error to do the adjustment. Having a working magazine to use for reference is a big help. Most non factory magazines are not properly hardened and will get out of adjustment more frequently than genuine H.S. magazines.
@@Jddvs Thanks, but I eventually decided not to attempt any further repairs on the old mag. Instead, I now use it for training purposes so stud nets learn how to clear jams. At that mission it excels. 🙂
I've got that same HI Standard sporting. It's been in wild places and provided many meals. It's been kinda replaced by an new Ruger MKIV tactical 22/45 with red dot.
I hope you keep this series going. It is eye-opening.
I would have not laid a bet on the S&W M&P either. I have only owned one rimfire handgun purchased in 1982. The Ruger Single -Six. It's part of my varmint hunting battery. It was originally a 9" barrel. I had cut to 7.5 to make it a perfect fit into a Bianchi flap holster. New sights were installed. The front is a bead that allows for precise alignment. On a central Oregon ranch the landowner asked me to thin out the ground squirrels that had so much burrowing that is fence fell over. The Ruger was warm as I kept it up for two hours. I think 30 yard at the most and down to 10 yards. Still need to watch out for irrigation equipment beyond so not all opportunities were taken. Going to pick up a Ruger LCRx 3" in .22 WMR today at my LGS.
Very nice video H R. My Bride has a S&W MP-22 compact and I and her find it to be a very fun to shoot pistol. I also enjoy shooting my Glock Model 40 in 22. Both 22s are fun and MUCH cheaper to shoot then their 9mm/40S&W big brothers. My most accurate pistol was a government issued S&W Model 66 with 4" barrel; it would shoot 1/2 dollar sized groups at 15 yards during qualification.
Very cool! You have got to love an accurate wheelie!
@@hrfunk I shot it one day at 100 yards on a B-27 target and put 4 out of 6 in the upper body and then got cocky and tried head shots and put one just to the right and one just to the left of the head. Great trigger and it broke like glass. Loved that pistol but lost it when we switched over to S&W 6906s.
Too bad it got away.
I've got the Smith 617 revolver with the 6'' barrel. Pretty accurate but a very heavy trigger.
Hi there, i had the same 617 in 6“ an early no dash 6 shooter, what do you call heavy? SA/DA trigger weights?
Greetings
@@samhendriks1807 Mine is well over 12lbs on double Action. I don't shoot S/A but that was over 4lbs.
Ok, thatrealy a bit on the heavy side. Mine was just under 10lbs, arround 9.8 pounds.
@@samhendriks1807 10lbs in D/A seems to be a better than average trigger. My best triggers are around 9 or 10 lbs in D/A and 2 1/2-3ish on S/A.I only have Smith S/A D/A revolvers. Ruger's look clunky to me.
My Ruger MKII 6 7/8 " is a tack driver If I recall you have a Colt Woodsman ?? They are also very accurate !!
I love shooting 22lr in rifle and handguns. I've owned and shoot a couple that you showed, all are super nice plinkers. But I've always found that no matter the brand our action that CCI ammo works. Great video 👍👍
Thanks Jim!
I've found that CCI MINIMAGS 40gr solids has the best combination of reliability and accuracy in semi-autos . I don't often carry .22lr, but when I do...MiniMags...😉
I shot a M& P compact for the First time two weeks ago down in Texas with some Military Friends. We were shooting for Fun at 25 yards Offhand! None of Us Received Your Results but, NOT One Magazine Shot Ever Left the 7 Ring! I Was Extremely Impressed by the Reset!!! Banging away on the 12 Inch Steel Target As Fast as Any of Us Could Master?!?! The Four of us went thru Over Two Hundred Rounds! It is my Next Purchase!? Hope mine Upholds the Quality and Accuracy of the one I shot! I was also Blown away by the Revolvers Accuracy! Still CAN'T Beat Old School Handcrafted! Thanks For Sharing This Video
You're welcome Mike . Thanks for watching!
My most accurate .22lr pistol is my Colt Woodsman Match Target. From my limited research on the serial number, I believe it was manufactured between 1939 and 1940. My dad picked it up sometime in the 1960’s when he left the navy. I don’t shoot it much as it’s in beautiful condition and I have other .22 handguns but when I do, it’s a real tack driver.
Good video Mr. Funk. Totally agree on the best iron sight shape, square rear notch, sharp corners on the front.
I got that Colt Frontier Scout in '63, my second revolver in .22. Frist was an old H&R trapper, nine shot. made in the twenties.
Those are great old-time wheelguns!
Thank you SIR for a video that's very close to my HEART. I'm a ADVID target shooter of pistols and rifles preferably in 22lr because there are SO MANY really NICE COOL old 22lrs pistols and rifles, so cheap to shoot without busting the BANK. I've got a Hi-Standard Sport King SK100 with a 6.75" barrel, 5.5" S&W model 41, Browning Buck Mark Bullseye/ Silhouette (got both barrels 7.25" & 9.5") and a interesting old single shot Czech target pistol with a 9.5" barrel. Keep up the GOOD WORK PROMOTING THE 2nd AMENDMENT.😉😁👍🙏 I NEED TO DO A 19:27 LIKE YOU DID WITH MY TOYS.😁👍
Wow I love that high standard.. I purchased about 20 years ago a Browning Buckmark .22 lr ..4in barrel .. one of the nicest factory triggers to ever come out... Extremely accurate...
Thanks for you video. The most accurate 22 lr Pistol I own is my 25 + year old Model S&W 41 with the 5 1/2 inch heavy barrel. I have obtained groups well under an inch at 25 yards with low cost 22 LR ammo. I had one lot of 22 lr HV Blazer bulk ammo that would deliver consistent groups well under an inch at 25 yards sometimes just one ragged hole. It is not picky on ammunition and hardly ever jams.
I have a red Leupold Gilmore rifle dot on my 7.5" Smith 41 barrel. I pulled over on a 100-yard target after a 25-yard sight in. 10" low, but 5 shots went into about 1.25" group. Surprised the heck out of me.
to me it is obvious that the pistols you did best with have sights that are similar to what you use most. your eye is more accustomed to that sight picture. if you were to spend several days shooting just the target sights your group would tighten up but then after your groups with the M&P and the 19 revolver would open up. it is all about the balance between mind and body IMO.
A 9mm pistol comparison will be most interesting. For me it's a four way toss up between my BHP, CZ 75B, RIA 1911 and my S&W 5906.
I had to watch this vid again Howard. I have been into .22 pitsol { uh, misspelling intended } shooting lately. I have a great old gravel pit on BLM land I can ride my quad out to only 4.5 miles from my driveway. I have literally blanketed the ground there with spent .22 shell casings. All my other various casings come back home with me to get recharged to make the trip to the pit once again. Anyway I wanted to comment on two .22s I have been shooting lately. One is a Browning Buckmark and the other a S&W .22 Victory. I have other .22 pitsols but these are my two favorites. Now I have owned two model 41s in the past but hands down my favorite .22 is the S&W .22 Victory. I like it better than even the 41s I had. I was considering putting one of those " purty " Volquartsen barrels on it but reallized what a wonderful stock barrel I had, so decided to keep it. I did dress it up a bit with some very tasteful bead blasting, a Tandemcross trigger and Halo charging loop, and some LOK grips. OOHHH Howard.......it are purty ! And I think the stock sights are wonderful on that gun. I do have a Burris Fastfire III red dot for it also but I actually do my best shooting with the stock open sights. That .22 is wonderfully accurate !! But I also very much enjoy my Browning Buckmark UDX. It also is a very, very accurate .22. I also put LOK grips on it and dare I say it..........I did the Higgis Flip on the trigger and replaced the guide rod with a better design. Fun gun !!! Fun guns !!! Doug.
That sounds great Doug! I’ve been wanting to try a Victory Model for quite a while, but I just haven’t gotten to it yet. I don’t believe I’ve ever shot a Buckmark either, but they seem like very nice handguns. There’s something very relaxing, and just plain fun, about shooting .22s. I probably need to do it more often. Thanks for the comment!
Really like the High Standard Sport King. Looking forward to more in this series.
Some years ago I fired my 60's Browning Medalist from a plastic bench at an indoor range - 50 feet. The first 8 shots went into one slightly ragged hole. Then I got excited and threw the last two slightly off.
Don’t you hate when that happens?
Nice video! I think the ammo/gun combination (if the gun liked the ammo that was used) is a major factor here. I was surprised the Model 18 did not do better. My 18-2 loves LRN and hates FMJ. My most accurate pistol is my Magnum Research 1911G with a Nelson Custom 22 Converter. Thanks for doing this test!
You're welcome. Thanks for watching!
I had a 22A and shot mountains of ammo through it. The weak spot is in the design where the bolt slams into the back of the breech. That energy is transferred through the locking block and will eventually crack the frame over top of the trigger.
SW replaced mine with a Victory. On paper the Victor is a better pistol, but I miss my 22A.
I think the old adage, "they dont make em like they used to" isnt true about some modern guns. The tighter machine tolerances of new manufacturing is definitely something that is beneficial.
My Ruger 22/45 with a bull barrel is my favorite plinker. I have a Volquartsen trigger and a Burris Fast Fire 3. Super fun.
I’ve got two of them that’s just about a tie. First is a 1970’s S&W model 17. It’s the gun I learned to shoot handguns with. I put thousands upon thousands of rounds through it and got very proficient. Then comes a Ruger mark II. It is scary accurate when I do my part. Nowadays I shoot a Glock 19 with a conversion unit on it. It’s not as accurate as the others but it’s the gun my granddaughters like to shoot. They’re spoiled. Anything I can do to spend more time with them, I do. When they get a bit older I’ll put the 9mm slide on it and give the guns to them when they get old enough. Any 22 is just plain fun to shoot. Thanks for another great video sir. It dredged up some memories from way back.
You're welcome Max. Thanks for watching!
Very interesting. I would’ve put money on the model 18 or the High Standard, at least they tie in the cool factor.
Proper bullseye guns with great ammo (and high quality sights) make a huge difference. My Marvel conversion shoots sub-inch at 50 yards with Eley Club.
Very cool!
Interesting accuracy comparison between some fine handguns.
Yes, I did enjoy this, HR. A good fun day at the range and it made a good video. WMT ammo was a good all around choice, too. I expected that HS Sport King to do better but the sights kind of handicapped it. The Ft. Campbell Pistol Team used HS handguns and so did a lot of other military marksmanship teams. They were hard to beat. I still have my M-18 4" S&W. Don't think I ever shot groups with it but it was death on tin cans and I did in several squirrels and rabbits when I happened to have it with me when the opportunities came up.
Great to see you have at least 1 of your Grandparents legacy tools. I suspect you have more and could produce a whole episode showing those off.
I had a very early model 22A with the 7" barrel. Also picked up a 5" bull barrel for it. That was back when I could get bricks of .22 for I think $5/1K. I shot that gun so much that eventually I wore it out, and S&W replaced it with a new Victory. Can't complain about that considering I got about 20 years of enjoyment from it.
Great video! I have my dad's hi standard model B and I know what you mean about the sights. I also have my grand dad's bird's head grip S&W in 22 short and it seems all handguns of those eras have the same rudimentary sights. I guess shooters than were more instinct shooters. At any rate keep them coming and I would most definitely like to see accuracy tests between different category of firearms...
Im a 66 model too. B4 watching I bet on the HS High Standard
Heck yeah, more of this series please. Love all my firearms, but have a special affinity for my 22LRs, especially the safe full of pistols and revolvers. In my case my SW model 41 is the one I shoot best.
Very interesting, these comparisons ! Looking forward to a future lever action's chapter and also the 45Colt handguns.
I would’ve not expected that result either, like you I have many .22’s including a colt frontier scout and a high standard. I would’ve put my money on the 22A or high standard. Sights play a large roll. Would really like a S&W 41 but never can justify the expenditure, maybe someday. Good to see other enthusiasts and their collections. Thanks for taking the time to make this video.
Mine was a Thompson Center contender.scoped, I could break eggs reliably at 100yds.
I've had the S&W M&P 22 Compact for years and I enjoy plinking with it on 10 inch steel plates and just overall cheap practice. Nice cheap ammo and it's fun.
For me it's my High Standard Victor, perfect balance for steady aim and light crisp 2 pd trigger pull
Thanks for a fun video. I can't get to the range as often as I'd like (who can?); watching this video is the next best thing. Oh, I was born in 1955, and I learned to shoot in 1966 with a Colt Woodsman and a 1911 re-barreled in .22 cal. Perfect for an 11-year-old boy! --Old Guy
That was fun. We always learn several things, not just the focus of the video. I was mainly watching your bench set up - a folding table and pistol butt on top of two sandbags. Was that sturdy for you? What's your opinion of putting the pistol frame on the bags? Now I want to take my 22s to the range and figure out which one to use in the 2023 Turkey Shoot ar our club. I won a turkey with the Model 617 6" last year. You also introduced the concept of same ammo to pick the most accurate pistol, then experiment with different ammo on that one pistol.
Thanks Scott! I rest the butt of the grip on the bag because the recoil impulse more closely replicates the results that might be expected if the shots were fired unsupported. It’s “sturdy enough.”
Mine is Ruger Mk3 Government Competition Target Model with wedge frame to frame fitup. 6-7/8" bull barrel slab side. Keeps golf ball moving at 25-50 yds. Second was not mine, a Haëmerli 208. More accurate then I was. Also enjoyed a Feinwerkbau and a Walther Olympic, unknown but very recent models for training. Feinwerkbau was a few tens of grams trigger pull! Fun to shoot!
I had a Ruger Hunter MkIII 22 I traded for a S&W 19-5, 4". That Ruger was something else for making little groups. I do not have a 22LR handgun now. I need to fix that. I have plenty of 22LR rifles. They all shoot very nicely.
I agree, Mike , you really do need to fill that void in your collection! Thanks for watching!
I really enjoyed your test. I think we all have fond memories of our first 22. Thanks
Another very well-done video sir! I enjoyed the content and certainly appreciate your hard work in producing these quality videos for us to enjoy. You make it look easy, but I know from experience what it takes to set up the camera shots, the post production editing and taking the time from family and friends to pursue your passion. I always look forward to your productions.
Thank you, David!
I agree, David. And in this video I was thinking, this is why hrfunk was a good firearms instructor -- he walks through the shot groups, the discussion of sights types and what each person's eye may be drawn toward, and why the groups ended up looking as they did. He mentions trigger differences. And he walks us through it patiently. Reminds me quite a bit of another favorite on YT, GunBlue490.
I think your difficulty of the sights as you described is valid. Getting on in age doesn't help the situation. I think a proper set of sights on the High Standard, and the 41 should make both of those guns shine over the other ones. Traditionaly those guns are used in compition all over the world and set up correctly, will smoke the others.
I'd like to see you do three five shot groups and take a little more time to line up each shot. Adjust your sights, because at ten yards you can see the holes and subconsciously, you're making adjustments. Or, move the targets out to twenty or twenty five yrds. On the revolvers, mark on of the cylinders so you can keep track and test to see which five are the most consistant and use the best five for your test. Just my thoughts.
Great test I do not own a 22 handgun and was very interested in the results. I would not have guessed the M&P would have won. But I believe your testing criteria was valid. If I buy a 22 I'd strongly consider the M&P as well as a K frame revolver.
I enjoyed this HR... and I would have bet on the Model 18. Yes, more of these please.
Really enjoyed this! Looking forward to the series. As in this video,sometimes we are really surprised at what a particular firearm can do. Thank you H.R.
Toss up between a few. Model 41 Smith, High Standard Victor, vintage Smith K22.
Excellent comparison video, thanks for sharing! Definitely impressed with the M&P. I'm still kicking myself for not getting one before the handgun sale ban here in Canada, as I use an M&P for Canadian Police Combat Association competition, and a .22 would have been a great way to extend my practice budget with the more affordable ammo. Thanks again, HR, and have a great day!
Same to you Clint. thanks for watching!
My first .22 pistol was a Browning Buckmark Camper which I bought circa 2011…from the first mag, FTF. It kind of soured me on semi-auto .22 pistols. I did have some good experiences with the S&W Victory but wound up going with the Ruger Wrangler because I love revolvers (as I frequently mention) and the price was hard to beat. Unfortunately, long story short, I had to send the Wrangler back to the mothership and Ruger is sending me a replacement pistol. I just can’t win with .22 handguns 😂
Too bad. I hope your new Wrangler is a good one.
the Kadet adapter 2 conversion kit for the CZ 75 series is pretty sweet.
The first pistol I ever shot was at age 5; my Father's Colt Woodsman that he had purchased new in 1929. He was behind me with his hands around mine and only one cartridge in the pistol. I've witnessed him make some truly remarkable shots with that pistol. But it's not the most accurate .22 pistol I've ever shot. That honor goes to my Erma ESP-85 that I bought new in 1986. I enjoyed your video but bet on the Hi-Standard, a manufacturer that made some amazingly accurate target pistols.
I don't blame you. I thought that one was a front runner as well. Thanks for watching!
I have to agree with SGT MAJ Trapp. The most accurate 22 I have ever fired is a S&W model 41. There are many accurate 22lr handguns and one must try a wide selection of ammunition to find which one works best in a particular gun. The very first handgun I ever had was a German copy of the Colt Frontier Six and it was unbelievably accurate for a revolver that cost $46.00 . Point is, there are lots of tack drivers out there. How much fun can we have finding the best?!
A lot!
S&W model 41 is a great bullseye gun, and I wish I had one! Right now for my bullseye .22, I shoot a Ruger mk2 with a Clark trigger and a BoMar rib and sights. I also have the same on my Gold Cup. Nice to have the same sight picture on both bullseye guns.
Have a Ruger Hunter Stainless MKIII that is just a laser beam, am amazed how good it is every time I shoot it
Enjoyed the video. I believe this is a great idea for a video series. Looking forward to seeing more of them. Keep the great videos coming. I like all of them.
My two most accurate 22LR handguns are the S&W Model 41 and S&W 617-6 shot revolver. I also own a Ruger Single Six and Single Ten, and Ruger Wrangler. The issues I have with the Ruger SA's is with the sight picture. Due to my eyes and I have to wear tri-focal lenes makes shooting accuracy very difficult. This is not a revolver issue but my eyes are my eyes! Back in the day when I competed in 22LR bullseye match my go to was my Browning Buckmark Target! I wish I never traded it in for another firearm. Great video and as alway's awesome shooting.
Thanks Bob!
Hi Chief! I do like the shooting comparison testing, and I'd love to see you get your hands on a S&W Model 41, a Colt Woodsman Match Target, and a High Standard Victor to do some further testing. I think that you would really enjoy it as well. I own all of those as well as a few others and I really enjoy taking them out and trying them against one another. I put red dots on all of mine as I'm getting older but it's some of the best fun to have on the cheap.
Mechanical accuracy can be affirmed or completely disregarded if the auxiliary influences adversely effect the shooters ability to use it. I.E: grip, trigger and sights - among other possible influences but for brevity we'll use those three. If the grip is uncomfortable - you're not getting a good group. If the trigger is heavy and gritty - you're not getting a good group. If the sights obscure the target, or provide too much play for the shooter to visually distinguish between being on target or off - you're not going to get a good group. Bullseye competition guns are not simply flights of fancy, they at the way they are: for a reason.
I agree. This video was meant to be fun, not necessarily scientific.
@@hrfunk The best science is always fun, and by that I mean practical application engineering. Laboratory work is for stiffs who want to debate the plausibility of dimensional math, field testing is for engineers who chuckle and say "watch this."
Have you considered a video on using 22lr as a training aid? The Army used 22lr adapters. My police academy used .22 lr revolvers on the first day of training, and your Smith Auto looks useful in the same way.
I've actually produced one or two videos like that. It's been a few years, but they are still up.
@@hrfunk thanks!
I consider 1966 a very good year; that's when I was born too.
My most accurate handgun/s: S&W 41 5" and Ruger Old Army 7 1/2". Both can stay under 1 inche at 15 yards & under an inch & a half at 25 when my eyes are up to it. Neither one has ever edged out the other.
Very cool! I would love to have a ROA!
@hrfunk Sadly Ruger stopped making them 10-15 years ago & prices for used ones are going up. Last one I saw for sale was $800. Most I paid for one was $500( I have 3) & it came with a cartridge cylinder as well. I've only fired the one, the others are collectors.
I know they stopped producing them. I saw one recently at a gun show. I think it was priced at $800 for a 6.5” blued version.
@hrfunk Grab the next one you see. They're worth it. I would have paid that if I didn't have what I do.
The only barrel lengths I'm aware of were 7 1/2 adjustable sight & 5 1/2 fixed sight both in blue or stainless. I have less trouble with rust from my blued blackpowder guns than stainless as long as I care for them right. My stainless ROA is the one I shoot because it's the first one I bought but I replaced my stainless rifles with blue for that reason. Never use nitro solvents on blackpowder guns; I use Windex with vinegar to clean(some say it hurts bluing but I haven't seen that) or boiling water - no soap - Ballistol to wipe down with & Bore Butter, Ox Yoke or Crisco for bullet lube. Hope you find one soon!
Good morning HR. Nice idea for a series. You could do each caliber in your collection and then a shoot off for the best overall. Great choice on the Wolf ammo. It gives Eley performance at a much better price. In good rifles it makes 1 ragged hole at 50 yards. The first handgun I owned was a .22 single action, single shot Savage 101. Couldn't hit much with it. I started bullseye competition with a 5" bull barrel Ruger pistol. Eventually worked up to the most accurate handgun I've ever owned, a Walther GSP. The 50 meter factory test target looked like it was shot with a rifle.
Would like to see you on Utreon. I'm subscribed to Forgotten Weapons and a couple of others there. They can post content that would get them banned here on UA-cam.
Thanks John. I saw that video from forgotten weapons. I am contemplating moving to that platform. Stay tuned!
@@hrfunk Let us know if you start posting on Utreon. I'll subscribe and like on both platforms to help keep up your numbers.
My experience, I have never been able to get tight little groups with fiber optic sights. Kind of the same experience you had. I would have put my money on the Smith Revolver. Great video
Thank you!
In case anyone from the " HASBRO " company is watching this video I think Mr. HR Funk has the perfect head
to model the next re-issue of the 12" GI Joe Action Figures. All he needs is a manly looking scar on his cheek.
To get him to sign the contract they may have to rename the new Action Figure series " Jarhead Joe " .
Ha, ha! I take that as quite the compliment!
@@hrfunk All you need to close the deal would be if your hands had " Kung Fu Grip ".
I would insist on the 12" series. Those 3" figures were an insult to the American fighting man. Besides, how could a 3" Joe take Barbie out on a date? His feet wouldn't reach the pedals of his M-151A1 Jeep.
Terrific video! Narration and results are excellent. Thanks!
Thanks for sharing, the results are interesting for sure. I have never benched my 22s nor tried to pair them with specific ammo. I do find it disappointing that the groups were not tighter at that range and agree that sights can contribute to that. Having put many rounds through my New Frontier , I find it amazingly accurate and at some point put some red nail polish on the front sight to help with the sight picture. I would suspect my S&W 41 is probably my most accurate 22 handgun and is far more accurate than I am. At some point I want to put a MRD on it and do some testing.
Ditto on the model 41, particularly at 24 and 50 yards.
The s&w Mdl. 41 is supposed to shoot one inch at 50 yards.A lot of rifles can’t do that. I use to shoot NRA style bulls eye, the last year I shoot with my 41 I finished high expert in a league of 255 competitors.
Had my 'Ruger single six (.38 frame) since '59 or '60, well worn but still works fine. Also the full cartridge belt and quick-draw holster, got really fast with it back then, no way I'd win a face-down now. Always fun anyway.
I have one 22lr handgun. A Ruger Mk III that someone put a mag release lever 0n. It is also a bull barrel. I haven’t shot that in a long long time. Mainly because of how expensive ammo is. I can make 9mm for under $2/50. 38spl for about the same. Good video though. I’m not surprised at the outcome since, for the last 20 years you have been shooting an M&P of some sort for duty…..
I love this idea/series...........would love to see you do episodes with the calibers I shoot: .38Spl/.357 and 9mm
Thanks! Stay tuned.
Oh yeah, I enjoyed it! Punching holes in paper is what I love to do. BTW, I have discovered S&B "Club" .22lr to be nearly as accurate as the expensive brands. And It can be purchased for about $4 a box. Looking forward to the next accuacy test.
Thanks! I'll keep an eye out for some.
How does the the S&B compare with CCI Standard Velocity, which I consider to be the best of the "cheap" stuff, coming in at about $4 as well?
@@kentuckybowl-o-sticks you can’t hardly beat CCI🙏🏻🇺🇸💯🤙🏻
Another fun one!
I'd be curious if the Taurus tx22 would rank with these?
Thanks for sharing brother!
🇺🇲👍🇺🇲✌️🇺🇲
Thanks hrfunk, I liked this one a lot. Great to hear your thoughts on the different sights, and which ones are more instinctive/easier for you to use. Is your favorite a plain black set, with defined right angles etc?
I'd imagine that if you like the crisp black metal silhouettes, the fiber optic's dot would be distracting, not sharp or right-angles enough for what you find easier to resolve. Since I spend much more time on RDS, if I use irons I prefer that glowing blob up front, it reminds me more of the RDS dot reticle. Plain black iron sights are very slow for me to resolve.
That M&P group was very impressive. And each of the others was precise, even if the groups were a bit shifted from center. The flier oddballs seemed to me like typical .22LR finickiness, firearm vs ammo, and ammo consistency itself.
Thanks Sean. For pure target work I prefer the sharp, square sights. If acquisition speed becomes a factor, then fiber optics, dots, etc are my preference.
@@hrfunk Thank you!
I hope you also do a comparison on .22 Magnum revolvers and pistols.
I don’t own any .22 Magnum firearms. Sorry!
Have an old HS Supermatic Citation. It's a shame the Company is gone, mine prints groups you can cover with an aspirin.
First off, I just found this site, and I’ve watched a few of your videos. Thanks, they are informative and entertaining for me. Accuracy of any firearm (pistol/rifle) seems to be always an approximation. One day with all conditions being close to the same, you get tight groups, and then another time with the relative same conditions not so tight… . So, nothing is really absolute with accuracy comparisons. Still, I enjoy the testing you did, thanks. I’m not one who shoots at 10 yards, 20 feet, 50 feet distances. Sure, I’ve read where most firearm confrontations occur at or less than 7 yards. But I’m not shooting my .22 LR Ruger Competition at 10 yards. I’ve always thought 25 yards is the minimum to shoot for accuracy evaluation in a pistol. That’s my take on it. If I’m thinking of using a pistol (whatever caliber) to train with for “self defense”, then sure maybe at a shorter distance might be a choice I’d consider. Still, 25 yards and greater, knowing your firearm is accurate out to that distance is a absolute confidence builder (for me). Enjoying your videos, and this is by no means a negative review. (I agree that the fiber optics sights are great for relative accuracy, but precise target shooting with open sights? Maybe not so much, but a great boon for combat (if that’s the right term) shooting trying to pick up that front sight… . Thanks
You're welcome. Thanks for watching!
Haven’t checked your videos recently (publisher due-dates-ARRGH!), but, as always, you are thorough, methodical, and pleasant. I will have to log in more often. Thank you for sharing your expertise with us!
My pleasure. Thanks for watching!
@@hrfunk And, by the way, you have done a great job of keeping your weight down; you are an example to us all. May God (continue to) bless you.
Funk Sir, I would love to see more of this type of video from you, absolutely. I was rooting for the High Standard 1st and the SW18 2nd. For all intents and purposes though I am not surprised the M&P won based on trigger time and muscle memory !?!
Surprise, surprise.😄 Makes me want to get out my second series Colt Woodsman and see how it compares to that High Standard. They did have some nice pistols back in the day.
Yes they did. Thanks for watching Lane!
Try the S&W model 41. Mine shoots better than most people that shoot it. I shot my best 3 shot group with it at less than 0.200'' center to center shot with a Trijicon RMR on it. They have great triggers, sites and a build quality that can't be beat
I have always wanted to shoot one. Hopefully, one day I will have the chance.
I had a 22A with a dot sight on it, almost anyone shooting it could hit exactly where they wanted. I didn't really go for the style, and eventually sold it, but it was probably the most accurate handgun I have ever had / shot.
Mine has always been very accurate too. As I mentioned in the video, I thought it was one of the front runners in this competition. I might give it another try with a different sight, and see how it does.
@@hrfunk I had a dot sight that was probably one MOA, my 12 year old daughter could hit tiny targets, like a poker game target, or a darts target, so could most anyone that shot it. It was the most accurate combo. I even had two friends that were jealous, that sought out to buy one, so they could shoot as well. I had sent it in to Smith and Wesson, for some updates, of which, I do not remember what they were.
with the revolvers you had to reposition after cocking with the auto you stayed in the same position every shot.
I would like to see more comparison videos. Thanks Howard.
Definitely enjoyed your accuracy test and would love to see more. Thanks for the video and have a great afternoon 😊.