Ignore the formula for CDS, Debuff Duration and Buff Duration. It's updated in game and you can see the exact number to the decimal now after Diminish Returns.
very very very useful, we knew the description of stats wasnt completely correct when the game first launched on KR (now they edited it so its a bit less confusing), but you guys did an amazing work figuring out all the formulas etc. Thank you!
Dang dude that is some really helpful info. I'm glad people like you and your friends still exist. This is the kind of old school math that makes the gameplay so much more fun
@@EliEli.MMOPVP already did on 3 discord, not many ppl but still something :D I was seeking for this info badly but did not found any back then to understand how do i build my tank and bigger question WHY do i have to build like that after evasion changes on KR.
I feel the same about the heavy attack chance since day 1 of the game, it's a stupid stat, a rng chance to hit twice can never be balanced, and it would fix the short time to kill of the game.
Eli bro I need a quick last minute wand/staff leveling guide on what stats to choose and what skills to pick. Any chance you have one of those lieing around?
I think thats all build for old skill In new skill all change event totaly change if special skill come out I main suport wand / staff at last updt kr everyting at wand skill is chagnge but thats fun In pvp i can kil 11 asist 24 at ain suport 🤣🤣🤣
@@EliEli.MMOPVP so if my fireball burn stack deals 30 damage before the stat application, it will be 45 per stack right? Or it applies for the whole damage like for 10 stacks of fire in the example forementionet that would be 315 with the additional damage?
@@CHACHENWAGENTV It depends on your skill damage boost. You use the SDB formula to calculate the % dmg increase. Change Time for Punishment to the SDB increase variant and check your Fireball burn stack without the TfP buff, then check it with the TfP buff.
hi, mit der formel für cd abklingzeit haut das nicht hin oder ich bin zu doof. ich hab laut gear 19,90% cd. nach dieser formel müsste ich dann tatsächlich 18,94% haben. angezeigt im spiel sind unter meiner 19,90% dann aber nur 16,597%. ich gehe mal davon aus das der wert der im spiel angezeigt wird dann auch stimmt. stimmt was bei meiner rechnung nicht oder der formel. ich setzte mal ein 19,90/(1+19,90)=18,94%. so sollte es doch richtig sein oder?
Hi, Cooldown Speed formula has changed since it was first made. Just use the in-game number they already calculate for you for Debuff Dura, Buff Dura, and Cooldown Speed.
@@EliEli.MMOPVP OK, that of course makes it difficult to calculate how high the CD will be in the end. I'm just testing a little until the EU release. The question is also how high focus from the rod affects the existing CD.
Hey Eli, So the looks of this video appears that the advice that you've given coincides with the T/L build BEFORE the new update that Korea got which includes the new "skill expressions". Have you been able to test the number with relation to the new update? Does it matter at all? I'm just curious cause I imagine there are new passives for each weapon that could add/take away from the formulas. Thanks for your time!!
I haven't tested the new stats. The information in this video is still relevant luckily. Just new evasion and endurance skill debuffs that should be considered in your gear planning, but formulas and stat conditions are still the same.
Great explanations. One thing I am wondering about - isn't endurance basically the superior defensive mechanic for every weapon type outside of SNS and dagger? Seems like its just more consistent at reducing damage and avoiding "one shots". Also what is your take on evasion vs endurance stacking for the open beta? My guild suggested for everyone to go evasion but it seems like a bad idea if people know that prioritizing hit is important to counter that. Are there enough evasion sources early in the game to "outscale" enemy hit?
Hi, yes to your first question. Also, yes green melee and ranged gear can easily get over 1k+ Hit. The builds EPH are sharing with ranged and melee players achieve this easily with blue weps.
hey there, stupid question to check if i got it right in the meth for skill damage boost, assuming u full trait a ring to 80 skill damage boost that would then be (80 / 1080) * 100% would mean its an increase of roughly 7.4% dmg done (factoring out everything else for simplicity)?
Hello, I've heard quite a few times that evade has a hidden dimishing return. The example given was that if you had 2000 more evade than your opponent hit, it would still only be 66% evade. That should be 100%. mathematically even 200%. Is that true about the dimishing return? So basically the same as described for the crit in the video you posted here.
Hi, almost every single stat has diminishing returns. I have a video with formulas that you can use to understand what your actual stat value is vs it's countering stat.
@@EliEli.MMOPVP is this not the video :) ? i see here that every 10 points evade over the enemy hit is 1% evade. i see no dimishing return. I ask this specifically because I built 2 builds, one with over 2000 evade for all 3 damage types and one where I ignored melee evade. If there is no dimishing return with Evade everything is fine, if there is I have to think about something.
@@chrisbaddabum I said it in the text doc and I believe also in the video that the stat description in game is not accurate to what it actually is. Simplest way to understand is that when you have 1k Crit Hit, it does not equal 100% critical hit chance. Not in PvE nor PvE. There are always diminishing returns (stat/(stat+1000), and then reduction from its counter stat.
Its strange, but when we tested on korea, when prs have around 1.4k evasion and another have around 200hit - it seems like he miss more than 50%, almost every spell
Were you testing with basic attacks? Basic attacks ignore the formulas and conditions. Also, the rule of never missing only applies if someone's Hit is MORE than someone else's Evasion. Not Vice-Versa. Only with Endurance would more Endurance vs Crit result in zero crits with abilities only.
Hi, i plan to play wand/staff, would like to build some Stun res to not get rammed by GS users, wondering if it's worth it. You can hardly get 500~ stun res with proper T2 equip sacrificing other stats, while a GS user can stack 500 stun chance easily by default. So, if i understood the math, at very best you can pair with him and it's stunning blow skill will stay at 80% chance, or you can forget taking it, and maybe his stun goes up to 100% i dunno. Doesn't look worth that much for only that 20% at best, and having low stun res value look useless, you go high or nothing. Maybe it's better -debuff duration and forget stun res. Any suggestions? Thanks for your useful tips.
is there anything you can do about stun resist it seems like a dead stat when greatsword users can stack 700+ chance you can only stack close to 400 it seems pointless
Mobs and Bosses are mostly melee. It's not worth prioritizing gear to counter them since you can clear PvE perfectly fine in PvP gear. Eventually build a 4p Trans set for PvE.
My builds are on a website. I've replied with them in a bunch of comments already. Everything about the game is changing this Tuesday which is why I didn't put them in videos or descriptions. I will change everything this Tuesday with new Tripod and Rune systems and weapon balancing.
Hey bro! Love the vid. You mentioned that a tank gets more evasion as more enemies are near him, but this is not accurate. Your passive increases defense, not evasion (unless I am missing sth). Could you please explain then, if perhaps Endurance > Evasion for tanks?
@@shino3463 If you are referring to Skilled Evasion, targets need to be provoked first. Not very easy to do in clamps, considering you can Provoke up to 5 targets.
@@0skillsPVP Oh no that's not how it works. So the first part of Skillfull Evasion provides you 300 Magic and Range evasion no matter what as long as you are around enemy targets (it won't show in your stat sheet either). The second part only increases evasion by an ADDITIONAL amount vs provoked targets. The Rare and Epic bonuses only increase evasion by the amount they state on top of the 120 vs Provoked targets.
Yea, because if you actually LISTEN, I say auto-attacks does not get affected by stats the same way as skills. You need to srsly ask questions when you clearly know nothing instead of cursing and/or making false assumptions.
@@EliEli.MMOPVP first of all, you neither said it in the video nor is it written in the linked file, the second thing is today I will check if it works on skills as you say and AA is mutch part of dmg
@@gorn3662 I did say it in the video and I also reference how stats work with "skills". If you came here to be a skeptic for whatever reason, that's weird. And I didn't say AA is not a part of damage, it's just clearly not calculated the same as Skill Damage which is also why Skill Damage and Auto-Attacks are two different colours. You came into the comments section cussing and and making assumptions instead of asking questions, so if you don't like the energy you're getting back that's your problem.
@@EliEli.MMOPVP But according my pov since yesterday, It was also seems like p2w tho, wy think Eli? And game basically dominated by whales and hard-core guilds, it's not that easy for beginners huh?
@@khunmotun The game has P2W in it, but there is no content locked from F2P players because of it, and F2P won't fall behind because of it either. The top PvPers who are also my static mates on KR and the NA betas are all F2P players. Because TL uniquely allows F2P players to make the swipable currency (Lucent), F2P players can progress really well and enjoy cash shop items, including Battle Pass. If you're not in a strong guild siege will be hard, but wars are 1v1 so it's less about zerging. There are also lower tier stones for less hardcore guilds.
Ignore the formula for CDS, Debuff Duration and Buff Duration. It's updated in game and you can see the exact number to the decimal now after Diminish Returns.
very very very useful, we knew the description of stats wasnt completely correct when the game first launched on KR (now they edited it so its a bit less confusing), but you guys did an amazing work figuring out all the formulas etc. Thank you!
Dang dude that is some really helpful info. I'm glad people like you and your friends still exist. This is the kind of old school math that makes the gameplay so much more fun
Thank you
This is the most beginner wanted video for building your character. Well done mate :)
big fan - thanks Jeri, subbed. 👍
hey useful simple guide really well made thanks :) hope you do more of these for various aspects of the game your voice is great for it
Thanks a bunch!!
I wanted this info half year ago, but TY so much, it will help a lot for global release.
No worries! Please feel free to share. It's so hard to watch people poorly geared dying so fast and confused why they got blown up.
@@EliEli.MMOPVP already did on 3 discord, not many ppl but still something :D
I was seeking for this info badly but did not found any back then to understand how do i build my tank and bigger question WHY do i have to build like that after evasion changes on KR.
@@Klannahar Thank you! And glad it was helpful.
bro i was on the edge of my seat for that cliffside duel at the end 😭
Hahahaha!
Nice voice, short and clean explanation! Sub and I'm looking forward to seeing the next video
Thanks Shino! Feel free to share with your guildies :D
The only helpful person for this game
Haha there are defos some others. I'm just one of the few who posts :D ! Thank you!
very helpful video mate ty
Thank you!
Thnak you for the video!
@@leoGa-79 No worries!
I feel the same about the heavy attack chance since day 1 of the game, it's a stupid stat, a rng chance to hit twice can never be balanced, and it would fix the short time to kill of the game.
Eli bro I need a quick last minute wand/staff leveling guide on what stats to choose and what skills to pick. Any chance you have one of those lieing around?
I'd also benefit from a guide on this
OBT build only. questlog.gg/throne-and-liberty/en/character-builder/BeastWithTheCuneiformRake
Skill Builds:
Leveling/Fresh 50 - questlog.gg/throne-and-liberty/en/skill-builder/sNZgM53ilGyL?build-id=30
Wand/Staff Lvl 50 PvP ZvZ - DPS Focus - questlog.gg/throne-and-liberty/en/skill-builder/sNZgM53ilGyL?build-id=466
Wand/Staff Lvl 50 PvP ZvZ Support Focus - questlog.gg/throne-and-liberty/en/skill-builder/sNZgM53ilGyL?build-id=467
Solo PvE - questlog.gg/throne-and-liberty/en/skill-builder/sNZgM53ilGyL?build-id=468
Dungeon - questlog.gg/throne-and-liberty/en/skill-builder/sNZgM53ilGyL?build-id=469
@@517Vi posted
I think thats all build for old skill
In new skill all change event totaly change if special skill come out
I main suport wand / staff at last updt kr everyting at wand skill is chagnge but thats fun
In pvp i can kil 11 asist 24 at ain suport 🤣🤣🤣
@@EliEli.MMOPVPw
Btw skill wand can bost 200 skill dmg bosst
Staf can make eva + hit 440 buf at skill lvl 1 😂
so I thought heavy attack chance 600=60%, so it was wrong , we need to stack more...
hehe
does skill damage boost or additional damage boost affect DoT effects somehow?
Yes!
@@EliEli.MMOPVP so if my fireball burn stack deals 30 damage before the stat application, it will be 45 per stack right? Or it applies for the whole damage like for 10 stacks of fire in the example forementionet that would be 315 with the additional damage?
@@EliEli.MMOPVP also the question is does the DoT damage amps apply before flat damage boost or does it apply after?
@@CHACHENWAGENTV It depends on your skill damage boost. You use the SDB formula to calculate the % dmg increase. Change Time for Punishment to the SDB increase variant and check your Fireball burn stack without the TfP buff, then check it with the TfP buff.
Do we know if damage reduction works against dots / magic spells and such ?
Wow literally wastes no time and cuts to the point, and super solid info found no where else.
Thank you!
Great video!
Thank you!! Feel free to share with your guildies.
@@EliEli.MMOPVP It was shared with me from the guild haha, we've been talking about it so I went to check it out
hi, mit der formel für cd abklingzeit haut das nicht hin oder ich bin zu doof. ich hab laut gear 19,90% cd. nach dieser formel müsste ich dann tatsächlich 18,94% haben. angezeigt im spiel sind unter meiner 19,90% dann aber nur 16,597%. ich gehe mal davon aus das der wert der im spiel angezeigt wird dann auch stimmt. stimmt was bei meiner rechnung nicht oder der formel. ich setzte mal ein 19,90/(1+19,90)=18,94%. so sollte es doch richtig sein oder?
Hi, Cooldown Speed formula has changed since it was first made. Just use the in-game number they already calculate for you for Debuff Dura, Buff Dura, and Cooldown Speed.
@@EliEli.MMOPVP OK, that of course makes it difficult to calculate how high the CD will be in the end. I'm just testing a little until the EU release. The question is also how high focus from the rod affects the existing CD.
Hey Eli,
So the looks of this video appears that the advice that you've given coincides with the T/L build BEFORE the new update that Korea got which includes the new "skill expressions". Have you been able to test the number with relation to the new update? Does it matter at all? I'm just curious cause I imagine there are new passives for each weapon that could add/take away from the formulas. Thanks for your time!!
I haven't tested the new stats. The information in this video is still relevant luckily. Just new evasion and endurance skill debuffs that should be considered in your gear planning, but formulas and stat conditions are still the same.
KING
I LOVE YOU
Haha, thank you!
Great explanations. One thing I am wondering about - isn't endurance basically the superior defensive mechanic for every weapon type outside of SNS and dagger? Seems like its just more consistent at reducing damage and avoiding "one shots".
Also what is your take on evasion vs endurance stacking for the open beta? My guild suggested for everyone to go evasion but it seems like a bad idea if people know that prioritizing hit is important to counter that. Are there enough evasion sources early in the game to "outscale" enemy hit?
Hi, yes to your first question. Also, yes green melee and ranged gear can easily get over 1k+ Hit. The builds EPH are sharing with ranged and melee players achieve this easily with blue weps.
@@EliEli.MMOPVP Thanks
hey there, stupid question to check if i got it right in the meth for skill damage boost, assuming u full trait a ring to 80 skill damage boost that would then be (80 / 1080) * 100% would mean its an increase of roughly 7.4% dmg done (factoring out everything else for simplicity)?
Yes.
do I need to crit in order to heavy mele attack? or if I have both I can have random x2 from any of those or its just x4 or nothing?
Nope. You can heavy attack without it being a critical hit.
Hello, I've heard quite a few times that evade has a hidden dimishing return. The example given was that if you had 2000 more evade than your opponent hit, it would still only be 66% evade. That should be 100%. mathematically even 200%. Is that true about the dimishing return? So basically the same as described for the crit in the video you posted here.
Hi, almost every single stat has diminishing returns. I have a video with formulas that you can use to understand what your actual stat value is vs it's countering stat.
@@EliEli.MMOPVP is this not the video :) ? i see here that every 10 points evade over the enemy hit is 1% evade. i see no dimishing return. I ask this specifically because I built 2 builds, one with over 2000 evade for all 3 damage types and one where I ignored melee evade. If there is no dimishing return with Evade everything is fine, if there is I have to think about something.
@@chrisbaddabum I said it in the text doc and I believe also in the video that the stat description in game is not accurate to what it actually is. Simplest way to understand is that when you have 1k Crit Hit, it does not equal 100% critical hit chance. Not in PvE nor PvE. There are always diminishing returns (stat/(stat+1000), and then reduction from its counter stat.
sick video
Thank you! Feel free to share with your friends.
How much mana reg do you need for wand/bow support? should i get it on every gear i can or whats the number i should be looking for?
I like 350-400.
Its strange, but when we tested on korea, when prs have around 1.4k evasion and another have around 200hit - it seems like he miss more than 50%, almost every spell
Were you testing with basic attacks? Basic attacks ignore the formulas and conditions.
Also, the rule of never missing only applies if someone's Hit is MORE than someone else's Evasion. Not Vice-Versa. Only with Endurance would more Endurance vs Crit result in zero crits with abilities only.
Hey Jeri, what about Off Hand chance, how it works, does it stack with heavy attacks, any details on this would be highly appreciated, thanks!
Oh I'm Eli. Jeri is my friend. Off-Hand can heavy.
@@EliEli.MMOPVP so that would make it x4 than ?
@@LivelyAndrew Yes, very OP> Heavy Attack is a stupid stat imo.
Hi, i plan to play wand/staff, would like to build some Stun res to not get rammed by GS users, wondering if it's worth it. You can hardly get 500~ stun res with proper T2 equip sacrificing other stats, while a GS user can stack 500 stun chance easily by default. So, if i understood the math, at very best you can pair with him and it's stunning blow skill will stay at 80% chance, or you can forget taking it, and maybe his stun goes up to 100% i dunno. Doesn't look worth that much for only that 20% at best, and having low stun res value look useless, you go high or nothing. Maybe it's better -debuff duration and forget stun res. Any suggestions? Thanks for your useful tips.
Hi, yes! Stun Res is not worth because of this reasoning and Debuff Dura provides more reliable value.
Do you have a Bow/Wand Leveling Guide?
I don't at the moment sorry. I haven't had much time to play this week until today. So I will be working on a bunch of stuff from today, onwards!
@@EliEli.MMOPVP No worries. Take your time.
what is the stat collision? I dont understand
Collision are pushes and pulls. So like chain pull from SnS, or the Shield push skill, or Vortex arrow, etc.
Can I use plate armor as wand bow healer?
Absolutely! Do not get hung up on the armor type. It's about stacking the proper amount of evasion or endurance.
is there anything you can do about stun resist it seems like a dead stat when greatsword users can stack 700+ chance you can only stack close to 400 it seems pointless
Not at the moment :(
So.. if i play healer i must get endurance traits ? 1melee-2magic-3range?
No, not exactly. If you don't use daggers then run Endurance. I like Plate armour because it gives most Defense stats and Melee and Ranged Endurance.
does mobs and bosses have endurance? is it worth going 1000+ in pve?
Mobs and Bosses are mostly melee. It's not worth prioritizing gear to counter them since you can clear PvE perfectly fine in PvP gear. Eventually build a 4p Trans set for PvE.
@@EliEli.MMOPVP question was more about does dagger lowers endurance for bosses in pve so other party members have higher crit ?
Bro, go to a website where you put together your build and leave it in the video links, you look like mayonnaise when you don't do that
My builds are on a website. I've replied with them in a bunch of comments already. Everything about the game is changing this Tuesday which is why I didn't put them in videos or descriptions. I will change everything this Tuesday with new Tripod and Rune systems and weapon balancing.
Hey bro! Love the vid. You mentioned that a tank gets more evasion as more enemies are near him, but this is not accurate. Your passive increases defense, not evasion (unless I am missing sth). Could you please explain then, if perhaps Endurance > Evasion for tanks?
Read first sword passiv its plural
@@shino3463 If you are referring to Skilled Evasion, targets need to be provoked first. Not very easy to do in clamps, considering you can Provoke up to 5 targets.
@@0skillsPVP Oh no that's not how it works. So the first part of Skillfull Evasion provides you 300 Magic and Range evasion no matter what as long as you are around enemy targets (it won't show in your stat sheet either). The second part only increases evasion by an ADDITIONAL amount vs provoked targets. The Rare and Epic bonuses only increase evasion by the amount they state on top of the 120 vs Provoked targets.
@@EliEli.MMOPVP Yeah about the 1st part I agree, even tho imo it's a bit lacking. Endurance seems the way to go - pending ofc the upcoming updates.
@@0skillsPVP Definitely!
first
Bulshit abaut evasion, my friend in duel had less evasion tahn my hit and somtimes i miss AA
Yea, because if you actually LISTEN, I say auto-attacks does not get affected by stats the same way as skills. You need to srsly ask questions when you clearly know nothing instead of cursing and/or making false assumptions.
@@EliEli.MMOPVP first of all, you neither said it in the video nor is it written in the linked file, the second thing is today I will check if it works on skills as you say
and AA is mutch part of dmg
@@gorn3662 I did say it in the video and I also reference how stats work with "skills". If you came here to be a skeptic for whatever reason, that's weird. And I didn't say AA is not a part of damage, it's just clearly not calculated the same as Skill Damage which is also why Skill Damage and Auto-Attacks are two different colours. You came into the comments section cussing and and making assumptions instead of asking questions, so if you don't like the energy you're getting back that's your problem.
I've no idea about this game but I've been watching ur videos lol, It's healer sake I guess
Haha, thank you! It will be a great game NA launch. Totally recommend trying it out.
@@EliEli.MMOPVP But according my pov since yesterday, It was also seems like p2w tho, wy think Eli? And game basically dominated by whales and hard-core guilds, it's not that easy for beginners huh?
@@khunmotun The game has P2W in it, but there is no content locked from F2P players because of it, and F2P won't fall behind because of it either. The top PvPers who are also my static mates on KR and the NA betas are all F2P players. Because TL uniquely allows F2P players to make the swipable currency (Lucent), F2P players can progress really well and enjoy cash shop items, including Battle Pass.
If you're not in a strong guild siege will be hard, but wars are 1v1 so it's less about zerging. There are also lower tier stones for less hardcore guilds.