i think it would be hilarious if you each picked what you think is the worst commander there is and you each randomly pick one and try to make a deck with it.
Saw feather at deck reveal and saw the others what they were playing and scrolled to the end because I knew the outcome already. Power levels of the decks really should be looked at when fan submitted.
@@jasonholmes5714 As someone who owns and plays a Feather deck of similar power level to Jon's, this episode was kind of illuminating. The deck is massively fun for me to pilot, but watching as a viewer or opponent I realized it was incredibly boring to have to watch play out. The deck has inevitability but it's just playing the same cards over and over which gets stale fast. Couple that with the fact that it doesn't really kill that fast either and you have the feel bad situation of the game essentially being "over" but the game not actually ending for several turns after the Feather deck has control.
Steven is missing his save point from 2 episodes ago, when you all messed up the stack resolution. Steven was leading at the start of this episode, and tied for the season win.
another major thing that happened screwed over stephen, when jon did his boardwipe, it was a -4/-4 effect, so the 2 juris on the field that they said shot stephens big boys would've died with 0 power, so they would've only shot for 0 damage, not 2 and 1 like they thought
You can just feel that everyone playing against Feather was having a terrible time. Seems like they need to have a discussion ahead of time on what everyone is bringing. Really boring game to watch compared to past games and a terrible way to end a season. Appreciate how the rest of the table is able to have a good time regardless of how toxic the deck they are playing against.
I kind of disagree. The deck fit the parameters of the episode, and I'm going to assume that they each knew what the other was playing before the episode started.
@@thenewlollipopjam8248 Ok, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt if this was the first time Jon had a deck that was clearly more powerful than the rest of the table, but it's not and it's become quite common.
@@sxysamurai EXACTLY!!! Jon does this ALL THE TIME! If he is the last chair or losing that season, he takes a theme week deck, does the absolute bare minimum to qualify for the theme, the builds some pile that is clearly outside of what the rest of the table is doing. It’s about the ONLY thing more annoying than him constantly saying “hold on, I might have a response” ALL THE TIME when he knows he doesn’t. Having Jon at the table is like that spikey tournament player we all were happy to leave behind when we started playing Commander instead of competitive formats.
Indications of people having a terrible time: Laughing, joking, smiling, and banter. Like you can say what you want about how the game was imbalanced and not fun to watch, but I don't understand how you can infer that the cast was "having a terrible time."
So the other day Justin announced on Twitter he won't be returning to star city. He will be missed but hopefully Corey stays. He's awesome even though he's new to commander.
Now I love to watch a deck go off as much as the next person but I have to second all the comments of someone should be assessing the power level of the decks. I'm not sure if Jon just drew the nuts or not but most Feather decks I know are insanely powerful and difficult to deal with. Commander pods should have a rule zero conversation somehow. You guys should too. It clearly wasn't a good time for anyone else. These fan submissions decks are always so fun to watch and I hate that we missed getting to see most of the decks at the table. This was an episode I'd have loved to see run back for the funzies with Jon picking another fan submission. Congrats on the "started from the bottom" win. Keep up the great content.
@@WillElliott.t oh that is very interesting. I actually didn't know that! I know they have certain things they frowned upon but didn't know it was a hard nope to certain things. That is good!
@@robertbauerle5592 the repeatable flicker effects to abuse dockside were caused by Feather's ability. The same ability also lets Jon fade many attempts at interaction. Also most of the spells he cast costs are replaced by the Storm Kiln Artist. Dockside and the amount of treasure he had became irrelevant at times because he didn't need a ton of mana to cast his whole hand. It is hard to not point the finger at Feather here. Feather remained the problem throughout.
I don't know if I should happy that Jon finally got revenge and won that game or mad about that being the least enjoyable game of commander I've ever seen someone make others play through lol
I skipped to the end of the episode at around the 20 minute mark. I really dislike Jon and him constantly playing overpowered decks in such a casual group.
@@sxysamurai I have nothing against Jon, I think this was a smart move from someone in last place and kept there all season, it just made a not great watch lol
Jon whines to much when he’s on the receiving end but clearly has no problem playing high power level decks into basically fun decks. 🙄 Wouldn’t even call this a win, was already a win when he revealed feather into those commands.
I just realized now that Justin isn't coming back ever. That's a sad day for sure I wish him well . Its crazy how much influence you had on this series from all the way back from with Mcdarby and West. I've enjoyed so much of the content and thanks for all of it
I was rooting for the alt win-con deck. I tried building something like that once, it turned into a mono blue deck. I used Lier as the commander, though I probably should change that. There was a lot of target player draw spells to be used as bribes. If one player was threatening to me I could give another player cards to deal with the threat. This was kinda fun to watch, but two of the decks didn't get to show what they could do. That is always a negative to a video when one or more cannot show what they could do.
This is like at the end of Cars when Lighting McQueen stops before the end of the finish line to make sure the King finishes his last race and he gets the moral victory, then Chick Hicks crosses the finish line to get the technical win. Remember kids, if you play Feather, you're Chick Hicks . . . No one likes a Chick Hicks
I really like your content and games, guys. But please, try to at least play roughly at the same power level. Jons deck made this episode hard to watch.
I see a lot of people saying they played the Feather/Ephemerate interaction wrong. That is not true, it was played correctly. Per gatherer: If another replacement effect instructs you to exile an instant or sorcery spell, such as that of Dreadhorde Arcanist or the flashback keyword, you may choose to apply Feather's replacement effect first. If you do, Feather's delayed triggered ability will return that card to your hand. As they mentioned, when you have competing replacement effects, you get to choose which to resolve.
Stephen shenanigans trying to survive saved this episode to a point because watching a deck go off while everybody else is trying fun new stuff but not actually competing is not great. Keep up the good work in general.
The deck lists looked fun! Fan deck episodes are always wildly different power levels so the second I saw Jon on Feather I knew it was over. The only other possible contender was Kenrith just cus 5 color good cards.
Well, that was a disappointing end to the season. Feather is a deck on a much different level to the others. He might as well have selected a CEDH deck it was so much stronger than the others. I loved the season as a whole though, so keep it up. Leave the pubstomping though.
Sorry for submitting Feather, seems like it was an unpopular choice :P I can confirm that Jon did draw quite well, though the deck is built to try and do that. I can also say that, presumably due to not knowing the deck since it isn't his, he could have played that game MUCH meaner by flickering Recruiter and using Sunforger more. Also, Jon, you said you made some cuts, but they weren't included in the decklist link. Was it just trimming the fat a bit, cutting a protection spell or two, or some more obnoxious yet not specifically synergistic things like Smothering Tithe?
Everyone's talkin 'bout feather when once again, dockside was the real problem in the game. Feather's main weakness is mana and well-timed removal, and removing the weakness of mana with one very abuseable card makes timing removal extremely difficult.
Sunforger really breaks Feather wide open. It's such a stupidly potent card that if you have enough mana, you basically can't be dealt with. And with how Wizards keeps printing juicy cards that that are both cheap and potent in Feather decks, she just sees such ample amounts of stuff to play. Monstrous deck.
Wondering, if John attacked for lethal commander and and was Angels Graced, would the 'cmdr damage death' happen at the beginning of Stephens next turn? The 21 damage still exists right?
So Jon had a huff and then played a disproportionately powerful deck to play the most tedious game in several seasons? Can we vote to remove points from people?
Feather specifically denotes 'instead of putting it into the graveyard' ephemerate does not go to the graveyard, it goes to exile. When the rebound cast resolves, Feather's trigger would work
Jon really makes some of the episodes difficult to watch, especially when he purposefully chooses to play decks that are way beyond the power level of the table. I was really looking forward to this episode because the points were so close but I had to turn if off at the 20 minute mark because it was clear that Jon's deck was far more powerful than the rest of the table. Really disappointed right now.
Would be cool to see you guys do a multi-week two headed comander. I'm sure you guys have some crazy combos with the amount of cards you have access to.
How do you guys make the custom tokens? I'm trying to figure out a good way to make proxies and custom cards that feel like normal cards when they are sleeved.
Everyone is kinda ragging on the power differential, but archenemy isn’t a bad format. I kinda think everybody already treats Suarez like such anyways. I like that everyone could keep up an entertaining banter, and I wish Suarez did less slowrolling. It’s still an hour of (thank you for editing) content when the game was decided about 20 minutes in.
I did exactly the same. It's incredibly hard for any but the highest power decks to interact with. Unless you counter Feather every time, but then only blue decks can do it. Arguably every player could save their instant removal spell for feather so they could all try to remove it, but this is commander not archenemy.
Ephemerate and Feather: If an instant or sorcery spell's own instructions tell you to exile it or put it anywhere else, it won't try to be put into your graveyard or exiled with Feather's effect, so you won't return it to your hand. 2021-03-19, Gatherer Rulings
I'll admit I was very much rooting for Steven to pull it out in the end with Glacial Chasm and the mechanized production. Game got very degenerate very fast but that's commander sometimes.
Whoever made that feather deck is way to much of a try hard. I can't imagine him having a play group that wants him around lol. Also why isn't dockside banned yet?
That's my deck, and I can confirm that it's not a favorite. That's also in large part due to the fact that, regardless of how the deck works, it's just stronger than the others, so I haven't even played it in a very long time. If I only played that deck no matter what, I'm sure I'd have a hard time finding a consistent pod.
@@tajicbladeofthelegion5474 I won't even submit my aminatou deck bc it's a prison super friends deck, has never lost a game, and has gotten me kicked out of multiple play groups. Some decks just don't belong on this shows
Man Feather is a miserable card, I wonder how that ever made it through play design. Glad Stephen managed to put up a bit of a fight towards the end, that was quite entertaining.
The only way this video could have been redeemed is spoiled because of sunforger. Stephen pulling a Glacial Chasm to stop Jon from playing Solitaire would have been the greatest way to end the season.
Unfortunately, Feather doesn't interact with spells that have Rebound. Rebound is different from Flashback and its cousins, because it doesn't replace the normal "go to the graveyard" part of the resolution, instead it inserts the exile "as the spell resolves", neatly before the usual "go to the graveyard" part. This means that Jon wouldn't have been able to blink the Dockside with Ephemerate indefinitely. I wonder how different the game would've been if they knew about this.
@@TheFixer710 well yes of course for me, who else would I be speaking for? That said, I you read through the comments I'm not exactly the only one, and you could see that the crew wasn't really enjoying it either.
Disappointed with this episode, i was so curious to see the other 3 decks with commanders that like and not see so often, but feather deck take de fun…
Yawn..... The reason I watch this channel is because you all DON'T play stupidly busted decks like the one Jon played in this episode. Very unequal power levels, pretty much just pubstomping this episode. Hope that win was worth it.
Strange how Jon said “what did you guys build your decks for”. And the rest of the table was like “we didn’t build OUR decks!” Seems like they had the same feeling the viewers had, that this deck Jon got ‘submitted’ seemed like just another spikey deck he would build. And if you look back over past season, Jon has a terrible habit of bringing busted decks to theme weeks and pretty much screwing over the whole point. I have a very VERY hard time imaging a fan of the show submitting a Feather deck. I’m sorry, I’m calling BS! ANY fan of the show submitting a deck like Feather would KNOW that it had no chance of getting picked because that not the kind of fun, quirky, cool idea, kind of deck they want submitted. This episode was tough to watch for SO many reasons. The biggest of which was that they actually let this happen. Someone should have stopped this mid shoot and made Jon change decks. If he didn’t like it, leave the damn show! But to bring THAT deck as a supposed “Viewer Submitted deck”, get the entire outta here. The show has been getting increasingly hard to watch since Justin left, and this may have done it for me. This was simply awful.
Sorry John, but: If an instant or sorcery spell’s own instructions tell you to exile it or put it anywhere else, it won’t try to be put into your graveyard or exiled with Feather’s effect, so you won’t return it to your hand. (2021-03-19)
Rebound keyword being the important part of the interaction. ""If you cast this spell from your hand, exile it as it resolves. At the beginning of your next upkeep, you may cast this card from exile without paying it's mana cost". Only after the "rebound" casting was resolved could John have used Feather's replacement effect to put the card into exile and then back to hand on end step.
I don't think this episode is nearly as bad as the comments make it out to be. The guys have a great rapport even when the game turns one-sided. It was fun to watch and listen to the banter. Did Jon bring a deck to purposefully pubstomp? I seriously doubt it. The guys are surprisingly competitive with the points and I actually expected the other decks to be stronger given that. Jon seemed like he expected it too. Maybe an idea for a season finale could be to bring more powered-up decks. Especially if the points are close.
On the topic of Jon's deck being overpowered: it would have felt a lot less so if anyone had been playing counterspells and gotten rid of the flicker spells. This doesn't invalidate what's being said (he had many protection spells after all), but the value train with Dockside might have stopped.
I mean it's tough to fault the other guys for not having counterspells when they've seen like 12 cards and Jon's dropped 2 tutors and has a hand full of protection spells. It definitely would have been nice to see at least one or two counterspells, but I think the feather deck was just genuinely much faster than the other decks at the table. Like, Jeremy started to do stuff just before he got smacked with lethal. Stephen started to get a bunch of junk wincons on the field, but it was just too late. Corey didn't even really get a chance to play his deck before he was dead. I think Feather is a really fast deck to begin with and Jon just got a really good start on top of that. Rough game.
@@andrewb378 I didn't mean to fault the others, mostly to say that counterspells are a weaker point for that Feather deck than the ones the others tried. But still, I guess I agree with what you're saying here.
PLEASE SEE MY COMMENT BELOW FOR MY CORRECTION. As far as I can tell the ephemerate Feather issue was played wrong. Feather's ability only triggers when the spell would go to the graveyard, rebound keeps the card from ever going to the graveyard.
It was played correctly. Both rebound and Feather try to replace the zone to which the spell moves upon resolution, and, when multiple replacement effects try to apply to one object, the object's controller decides the order in which they apply. Therefore, you can choose whether your scenario plays out as you describe or if the first cast just sends the card back to hand.
@@futurewerewolf2198 This is my fault in reading the rulings on Feather. It states that is a card would exile itself then it would never go to the graveyard and Feather could not get it back. Then when I read the reminder text on Rebound it said it was a straight exile not a replacement. After further digging the comprehensive rules state that it is a replacement effect. Therefore it was played correctly.
You guys need to start running triggered ability counters so you can punish people for playing Eerie Interlude. Loved to see Feather never come back again,.
I just wouldn't take the games tbh no reason to waste my time vs a blatantly overtuned card. Maybe with a reprint/revise to only be your endstep but as it stands the value is just too much.
Yeah this right here is a perfect example why I own 2 copies of feather One for her own deck and 1 to put in another deck. Because if you build her right she gets disgusting
Gotta say that all felt toxic. Garbage end to the season and such a shame. When 3 out of four players start saying we have already lost and I don't care 8 mins into a game it's not great viewing.
I think rule zero would help out with the game play, sagas vs a wincon.deck vs feather vs legend tribal doesn’t seem like a fair matchup, I really enjoy the show tho
Love the series... but not this episode. Can we maybe try and balance power levels a bit? We do it with our friends, shouldn't be that hard to do here.
![Planechase Party [Commander VS 304] | Magic: the Gathering Commander Gameplay](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/CkGLzCD115Q/mqdefault.jpg)
![Planechase Party [Commander VS 304] | Magic: the Gathering Commander Gameplay](/img/tr.png)
![This Time, It's Personal! [Commander VS] | Magic: the Gathering Commander Gameplay](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/VibCoKEPrWU/mqdefault.jpg)
![Fan Request Season Finale [Commander VS 320] | Magic: the Gathering Commander Gameplay](/img/n.gif)
Decklists are here! articles.starcitygames.com/magic-the-gathering/commander-vs-305-fan-request-special/
i think it would be hilarious if you each picked what you think is the worst commander there is and you each randomly pick one and try to make a deck with it.
I wasn't so big on Corey at the start, but ive come to love the banter than him and Stephen have developed
this episode was the epitome of everyone saying " i am on a 7" and it not being true
Naw that deck is a 7 lol an 8 at absolute best. He had a strong start. Now the power level was above everyone else’s for sure.
@@mrdjuggernaut In what world is dockside in a 7 lol
@Lucarioguild7 I mean, it's from a pretty meh precon, which is well below a 7. One card doesn't make a deck cEDH.
Jon suddenly plays a way more powerful deck compared to the rest of the group and wins the season because of it... I'm shocked
Jon lost the season because Steven was robbed a point 2 episodes ago, they're tied at the end which goes to Steven, as I believe he won more games.
Jon spiking the table with piles of tutors and dockside with blink effects? Color me shocked.
15 min in and I skipped to the end, because jon had essentially won at that point. kinda unfortunate that jons deck was so overpowered
I didn't even get 15 mins in. I really liked this season but then we get this. :(
Yeah I was the same, I made it about 12 minutes in before I skipped to the end
Grow up ffs
Thanks for the spoiler :)
@@famousstranger8468 ironic
Cory made Jeremy and Jon facepalm was beautiful. Surely a card up his sleeve.
Soon as I saw a Feather Deck I knew the outcome.
Yup. I don’t really want to finish watching. I’m on 17 minutes and Feather is just so miserable to play against, I am having secondhand misery.
@@jasonholmes5714 Yeah I lasted about that long also before stopping. I realized there was no point anymore after that mark. So miserable a watch.
Saw feather at deck reveal and saw the others what they were playing and scrolled to the end because I knew the outcome already. Power levels of the decks really should be looked at when fan submitted.
@@jasonholmes5714 As someone who owns and plays a Feather deck of similar power level to Jon's, this episode was kind of illuminating. The deck is massively fun for me to pilot, but watching as a viewer or opponent I realized it was incredibly boring to have to watch play out. The deck has inevitability but it's just playing the same cards over and over which gets stale fast. Couple that with the fact that it doesn't really kill that fast either and you have the feel bad situation of the game essentially being "over" but the game not actually ending for several turns after the Feather deck has control.
This game is prime example of PTMTGSD for anyone that has played against a Feather deck LOL
Thanks for playing my deck Jeremy! Man Suarez really just took off with the game didn't he lol
Steven is missing his save point from 2 episodes ago, when you all messed up the stack resolution. Steven was leading at the start of this episode, and tied for the season win.
glad i'm not the only one who noticed that one
Second this
another major thing that happened screwed over stephen, when jon did his boardwipe, it was a -4/-4 effect, so the 2 juris on the field that they said shot stephens big boys would've died with 0 power, so they would've only shot for 0 damage, not 2 and 1 like they thought
Leave it to Suarez to pick the most degenerate deck possible :D Always delivers
You can just feel that everyone playing against Feather was having a terrible time. Seems like they need to have a discussion ahead of time on what everyone is bringing. Really boring game to watch compared to past games and a terrible way to end a season. Appreciate how the rest of the table is able to have a good time regardless of how toxic the deck they are playing against.
I kind of disagree. The deck fit the parameters of the episode, and I'm going to assume that they each knew what the other was playing before the episode started.
lol yep i knew within 5 min who would win the game. I play a Feather Deck and mine is no where near as tuned as this one was.
@@thenewlollipopjam8248 Ok, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt if this was the first time Jon had a deck that was clearly more powerful than the rest of the table, but it's not and it's become quite common.
@@sxysamurai EXACTLY!!! Jon does this ALL THE TIME! If he is the last chair or losing that season, he takes a theme week deck, does the absolute bare minimum to qualify for the theme, the builds some pile that is clearly outside of what the rest of the table is doing. It’s about the ONLY thing more annoying than him constantly saying “hold on, I might have a response” ALL THE TIME when he knows he doesn’t. Having Jon at the table is like that spikey tournament player we all were happy to leave behind when we started playing Commander instead of competitive formats.
Indications of people having a terrible time: Laughing, joking, smiling, and banter.
Like you can say what you want about how the game was imbalanced and not fun to watch, but I don't understand how you can infer that the cast was "having a terrible time."
So the other day Justin announced on Twitter he won't be returning to star city. He will be missed but hopefully Corey stays. He's awesome even though he's new to commander.
Corey and Stephen should always sit next to each other, their energy is great!
Now I love to watch a deck go off as much as the next person but I have to second all the comments of someone should be assessing the power level of the decks. I'm not sure if Jon just drew the nuts or not but most Feather decks I know are insanely powerful and difficult to deal with. Commander pods should have a rule zero conversation somehow. You guys should too. It clearly wasn't a good time for anyone else. These fan submissions decks are always so fun to watch and I hate that we missed getting to see most of the decks at the table. This was an episode I'd have loved to see run back for the funzies with Jon picking another fan submission. Congrats on the "started from the bottom" win.
Keep up the great content.
They have a do not play on commander vs list. But I’m not sure how it interacts with the fan submissions
@@WillElliott.t oh that is very interesting. I actually didn't know that! I know they have certain things they frowned upon but didn't know it was a hard nope to certain things. That is good!
Dockside's the problem in that game, not feather btw.
@@robertbauerle5592 the repeatable flicker effects to abuse dockside were caused by Feather's ability. The same ability also lets Jon fade many attempts at interaction. Also most of the spells he cast costs are replaced by the Storm Kiln Artist. Dockside and the amount of treasure he had became irrelevant at times because he didn't need a ton of mana to cast his whole hand.
It is hard to not point the finger at Feather here. Feather remained the problem throughout.
I don't know if I should happy that Jon finally got revenge and won that game or mad about that being the least enjoyable game of commander I've ever seen someone make others play through lol
But DAMN if that isn't awesome that he won off of it! Congrats!
I skipped to the end of the episode at around the 20 minute mark. I really dislike Jon and him constantly playing overpowered decks in such a casual group.
@@sxysamurai I’m about to do the same, but I have nothing against Jon, just against Feather.
@@sxysamurai I have nothing against Jon, I think this was a smart move from someone in last place and kept there all season, it just made a not great watch lol
Jon whines to much when he’s on the receiving end but clearly has no problem playing high power level decks into basically fun decks. 🙄 Wouldn’t even call this a win, was already a win when he revealed feather into those commands.
good ole' dockside extortionist abuse, what a great card
I think you misspelled dumb.
Now I know why Ive never seen feather win they wer all budget decks plus everyone acted like they weren't
I just realized now that Justin isn't coming back ever. That's a sad day for sure I wish him well . Its crazy how much influence you had on this series from all the way back from with Mcdarby and West. I've enjoyed so much of the content and thanks for all of it
I was rooting for the alt win-con deck. I tried building something like that once, it turned into a mono blue deck. I used Lier as the commander, though I probably should change that. There was a lot of target player draw spells to be used as bribes. If one player was threatening to me I could give another player cards to deal with the threat. This was kinda fun to watch, but two of the decks didn't get to show what they could do. That is always a negative to a video when one or more cannot show what they could do.
This is like at the end of Cars when Lighting McQueen stops before the end of the finish line to make sure the King finishes his last race and he gets the moral victory, then Chick Hicks crosses the finish line to get the technical win. Remember kids, if you play Feather, you're Chick Hicks . . . No one likes a Chick Hicks
Bullet train: ''Everything I learned about people I learned from Thomas'' ...and people who play Feather are a bloody Diesel! LOL
Yeah I'm glad I dont know anyone who mains Feather, cause I wouldnt know them for long
finished watching another commander vs video and then this popped up haha! perfect timing
playing with these guys is my dream blunt rotation scenario
I really like your content and games, guys. But please, try to at least play roughly at the same power level. Jons deck made this episode hard to watch.
I see a lot of people saying they played the Feather/Ephemerate interaction wrong. That is not true, it was played correctly. Per gatherer:
If another replacement effect instructs you to exile an instant or sorcery spell, such as that of Dreadhorde Arcanist or the flashback keyword, you may choose to apply Feather's replacement effect first. If you do, Feather's delayed triggered ability will return that card to your hand.
As they mentioned, when you have competing replacement effects, you get to choose which to resolve.
Stephen shenanigans trying to survive saved this episode to a point because watching a deck go off while everybody else is trying fun new stuff but not actually competing is not great. Keep up the good work in general.
Probably should’ve reviewed the power level of these decks before playing…
Welcome to how John picks his decks.
The deck lists looked fun! Fan deck episodes are always wildly different power levels so the second I saw Jon on Feather I knew it was over. The only other possible contender was Kenrith just cus 5 color good cards.
I think we can all agree that Corey regained his dignity after that extra turn episode
Well, that was a disappointing end to the season. Feather is a deck on a much different level to the others. He might as well have selected a CEDH deck it was so much stronger than the others.
I loved the season as a whole though, so keep it up. Leave the pubstomping though.
Please cut the music
Please!
Sorry for submitting Feather, seems like it was an unpopular choice :P I can confirm that Jon did draw quite well, though the deck is built to try and do that. I can also say that, presumably due to not knowing the deck since it isn't his, he could have played that game MUCH meaner by flickering Recruiter and using Sunforger more. Also, Jon, you said you made some cuts, but they weren't included in the decklist link. Was it just trimming the fat a bit, cutting a protection spell or two, or some more obnoxious yet not specifically synergistic things like Smothering Tithe?
The deck imbalance was more unpopular, and yeah he could have played meaner and should have just put everyone out of their misery sooner
John drew incredibly well and the abuse all came from dockside extortionist.
Do love some feather action, but there was a power mismatch this week; probably due to dockside, which should be reserved for cEDH play.
Everyone's talkin 'bout feather when once again, dockside was the real problem in the game. Feather's main weakness is mana and well-timed removal, and removing the weakness of mana with one very abuseable card makes timing removal extremely difficult.
Seriously... There are any number of repeated effects that could abuse dockside. It doesn't make feather broken
It’s Wednesday night and you know what that means Star city games on UA-cam
Sunforger really breaks Feather wide open. It's such a stupidly potent card that if you have enough mana, you basically can't be dealt with. And with how Wizards keeps printing juicy cards that that are both cheap and potent in Feather decks, she just sees such ample amounts of stuff to play. Monstrous deck.
Go Gates! Baldur's Gate is such a good land in dedicated gates decks
Feather is the worst…
Wondering, if John attacked for lethal commander and and was Angels Graced, would the 'cmdr damage death' happen at the beginning of Stephens next turn? The 21 damage still exists right?
So Jon had a huff and then played a disproportionately powerful deck to play the most tedious game in several seasons? Can we vote to remove points from people?
The last replacement effect that comes into play is the correct effects
Feather specifically denotes 'instead of putting it into the graveyard' ephemerate does not go to the graveyard, it goes to exile. When the rebound cast resolves, Feather's trigger would work
Hope to see some beautiful low powered jank today : D
Whoops
I really liked the non jon Suarez decks at least
The Justin Parnell zombie token 😢
Jon really makes some of the episodes difficult to watch, especially when he purposefully chooses to play decks that are way beyond the power level of the table. I was really looking forward to this episode because the points were so close but I had to turn if off at the 20 minute mark because it was clear that Jon's deck was far more powerful than the rest of the table.
Really disappointed right now.
Yeah. Trash episode / typical try-hard Jon.
Yeah I watched it in 3 parts not even because I was busy it was just too hard to watch my boys get massacred
Would be cool to see you guys do a multi-week two headed comander. I'm sure you guys have some crazy combos with the amount of cards you have access to.
How do you guys make the custom tokens? I'm trying to figure out a good way to make proxies and custom cards that feel like normal cards when they are sleeved.
Everyone is kinda ragging on the power differential, but archenemy isn’t a bad format. I kinda think everybody already treats Suarez like such anyways.
I like that everyone could keep up an entertaining banter, and I wish Suarez did less slowrolling. It’s still an hour of (thank you for editing) content when the game was decided about 20 minutes in.
Wow what an exciting game of solitare
As someone who had a feather deck and took it apart because of games like this, this game was no fun.
I did exactly the same. It's incredibly hard for any but the highest power decks to interact with. Unless you counter Feather every time, but then only blue decks can do it. Arguably every player could save their instant removal spell for feather so they could all try to remove it, but this is commander not archenemy.
i hate solitare decks like that
Ephemerate and Feather: If an instant or sorcery spell's own instructions tell you to exile it or put it anywhere else, it won't try to be put into your graveyard or exiled with Feather's effect, so you won't return it to your hand.
2021-03-19, Gatherer Rulings
Even the boys were checked out at 24 mins...Lol
If I’ve learned one thing from this show it’s don’t give Suarez a sunforger.
I'll admit I was very much rooting for Steven to pull it out in the end with Glacial Chasm and the mechanized production. Game got very degenerate very fast but that's commander sometimes.
Also another example of why Dockside is wayyy too strong a card and should probably be banned in commander.
Whoever made that feather deck is way to much of a try hard. I can't imagine him having a play group that wants him around lol. Also why isn't dockside banned yet?
That's my deck, and I can confirm that it's not a favorite. That's also in large part due to the fact that, regardless of how the deck works, it's just stronger than the others, so I haven't even played it in a very long time. If I only played that deck no matter what, I'm sure I'd have a hard time finding a consistent pod.
@@tajicbladeofthelegion5474 I won't even submit my aminatou deck bc it's a prison super friends deck, has never lost a game, and has gotten me kicked out of multiple play groups. Some decks just don't belong on this shows
Not that it matters, but I think the director missed Jon shocking in his Sacred Foundry. Great end of season!
I kind of miss the individual mics. Audio quality was much better than a single area mic
totally agree
Good stuff. I need to submit a deck...
Green trying to win with 20
+ power creature is just the most green way to win.
Man Feather is a miserable card, I wonder how that ever made it through play design. Glad Stephen managed to put up a bit of a fight towards the end, that was quite entertaining.
I'm curious, when a season ends how does one submit a deck to potentially feature on the finale?
Ha, a battlecruiser jank extreme gates deck and 2 other janky nonsense against the 9/10 power level Feather deck. I mean is anyone surprised?
"You wanna go get an ice cream after this big guy?"
The only way this video could have been redeemed is spoiled because of sunforger. Stephen pulling a Glacial Chasm to stop Jon from playing Solitaire would have been the greatest way to end the season.
Unfortunately, Feather doesn't interact with spells that have Rebound. Rebound is different from Flashback and its cousins, because it doesn't replace the normal "go to the graveyard" part of the resolution, instead it inserts the exile "as the spell resolves", neatly before the usual "go to the graveyard" part. This means that Jon wouldn't have been able to blink the Dockside with Ephemerate indefinitely.
I wonder how different the game would've been if they knew about this.
It would have worked from the upkeep rebound cast. definitely could have changed things, but I think the eerie interlude is what broke the game
@@jamespatterson5644 True indeed
Do you have n overview on who won how many seasons? would be interesting to see the development :)
For everyone complaining about this one S17E4 Justin decimates the table with a nutty draw just as bad as Jon's here
Might I suggest a "house" ban list? Dockside Extortionist being the 1st card on it lol.
And this is why you don't play Feather outside cEDH. This was one of the most boring games you folks have ever recorded.
agreed my man it was like watching solitaire
Yep if they weren't forced to stay there I'd have scooped and went on with my day. No reason to waste my time vs something that blatantly overtuned.
For you
@@TheFixer710 well yes of course for me, who else would I be speaking for? That said, I you read through the comments I'm not exactly the only one, and you could see that the crew wasn't really enjoying it either.
I just bring out turgid when I see feather. After one game, they put the deck away.
Yo, sometimes game end up like this. Does it suck for the other three, yeah? But they tried. Good show, and hope the comments don't get ya down.
Disappointed with this episode, i was so curious to see the other 3 decks with commanders that like and not see so often, but feather deck take de fun…
Yawn..... The reason I watch this channel is because you all DON'T play stupidly busted decks like the one Jon played in this episode. Very unequal power levels, pretty much just pubstomping this episode.
Hope that win was worth it.
Strange how Jon said “what did you guys build your decks for”. And the rest of the table was like “we didn’t build OUR decks!” Seems like they had the same feeling the viewers had, that this deck Jon got ‘submitted’ seemed like just another spikey deck he would build. And if you look back over past season, Jon has a terrible habit of bringing busted decks to theme weeks and pretty much screwing over the whole point. I have a very VERY hard time imaging a fan of the show submitting a Feather deck. I’m sorry, I’m calling BS! ANY fan of the show submitting a deck like Feather would KNOW that it had no chance of getting picked because that not the kind of fun, quirky, cool idea, kind of deck they want submitted. This episode was tough to watch for SO many reasons. The biggest of which was that they actually let this happen. Someone should have stopped this mid shoot and made Jon change decks. If he didn’t like it, leave the damn show! But to bring THAT deck as a supposed “Viewer Submitted deck”, get the entire outta here. The show has been getting increasingly hard to watch since Justin left, and this may have done it for me. This was simply awful.
we need a go fund me for corey's haircut
I liked this video, simply for the hidden hand joke.
Sorry John, but:
If an instant or sorcery spell’s own instructions tell you to exile it or put it anywhere else, it won’t try to be put into your graveyard or exiled with Feather’s effect, so you won’t return it to your hand.
(2021-03-19)
Rebound keyword being the important part of the interaction. ""If you cast this spell from your hand, exile it as it resolves. At the beginning of your next upkeep, you may cast this card from exile without paying it's mana cost".
Only after the "rebound" casting was resolved could John have used Feather's replacement effect to put the card into exile and then back to hand on end step.
Think Steven misused the Baulders Gate, It costs 2 and then taps for X mana
No he was using his Sol ring to activate it everytime.
@@BjornStellar Ahh, that makes more sense.
could stephen had of targeted a treasure token to get rid of all treasures with oblivion ring?
No because he could just sacrifice the targeted treasure in response.
Corey missed a play by not targeting a Treasure token with Detention Sphere, therefore shitt9mg down Jon's Mana base/boost
Jon could have sacrificed the token in response which would fizzle the ability.
I don't think this episode is nearly as bad as the comments make it out to be. The guys have a great rapport even when the game turns one-sided. It was fun to watch and listen to the banter. Did Jon bring a deck to purposefully pubstomp? I seriously doubt it. The guys are surprisingly competitive with the points and I actually expected the other decks to be stronger given that. Jon seemed like he expected it too. Maybe an idea for a season finale could be to bring more powered-up decks. Especially if the points are close.
Feather being a boring pain. As usual.
On the topic of Jon's deck being overpowered: it would have felt a lot less so if anyone had been playing counterspells and gotten rid of the flicker spells.
This doesn't invalidate what's being said (he had many protection spells after all), but the value train with Dockside might have stopped.
I mean it's tough to fault the other guys for not having counterspells when they've seen like 12 cards and Jon's dropped 2 tutors and has a hand full of protection spells. It definitely would have been nice to see at least one or two counterspells, but I think the feather deck was just genuinely much faster than the other decks at the table.
Like, Jeremy started to do stuff just before he got smacked with lethal. Stephen started to get a bunch of junk wincons on the field, but it was just too late. Corey didn't even really get a chance to play his deck before he was dead. I think Feather is a really fast deck to begin with and Jon just got a really good start on top of that. Rough game.
@@andrewb378 I didn't mean to fault the others, mostly to say that counterspells are a weaker point for that Feather deck than the ones the others tried. But still, I guess I agree with what you're saying here.
Corey needs his own color now
Corey Team Cobalt
@@danteishere7792 Corey Cobalt sounds great actually yeah
PLEASE SEE MY COMMENT BELOW FOR MY CORRECTION. As far as I can tell the ephemerate Feather issue was played wrong. Feather's ability only triggers when the spell would go to the graveyard, rebound keeps the card from ever going to the graveyard.
It was played correctly. Both rebound and Feather try to replace the zone to which the spell moves upon resolution, and, when multiple replacement effects try to apply to one object, the object's controller decides the order in which they apply. Therefore, you can choose whether your scenario plays out as you describe or if the first cast just sends the card back to hand.
@@futurewerewolf2198 This is my fault in reading the rulings on Feather. It states that is a card would exile itself then it would never go to the graveyard and Feather could not get it back. Then when I read the reminder text on Rebound it said it was a straight exile not a replacement. After further digging the comprehensive rules state that it is a replacement effect. Therefore it was played correctly.
You guys need to start running triggered ability counters so you can punish people for playing Eerie Interlude. Loved to see Feather never come back again,.
Last week: "Let's shoot Suarez for 14."
This week: "Buenos diaz, f*** bois."
oh no dockside is busted…..
Steve just needed bane of progress
he tried to use spot removal with damn, feather decks just have so much instant speed protection
@@BloodMoonGo yeah but could he save treasure it would really hurt him
Why does John always picks the most powerful deck between all them??
I have never once ever played a game with Feather in it that was fun.
Yeah, feather is annoying
I just wouldn't take the games tbh no reason to waste my time vs a blatantly overtuned card. Maybe with a reprint/revise to only be your endstep but as it stands the value is just too much.
@@afrosamurai3847 Very well put
Jon is feeling himself too much
Yeah this right here is a perfect example why I own 2 copies of feather One for her own deck and 1 to put in another deck. Because if you build her right she gets disgusting
How often do you lgs hop because I can't imagine you'll have opponents for long running something that anti interaction.
I sent a decklist to Jeremy on Twitter but I think it was way too late, maybe next season!
Well I guess that is one way to end a season…
I know they can't just concede but this was a pretty big non game
why didn't Steven just get a gond gate so he stops being a turn behind
Go to game two, this one is over, this is called a loop
Gotta say that all felt toxic. Garbage end to the season and such a shame. When 3 out of four players start saying we have already lost and I don't care 8 mins into a game it's not great viewing.
But they werent wrong mana positive dockside flickering with sunforger tool box and recur-able board protection against some janky decks it was over.
I think rule zero would help out with the game play, sagas vs a wincon.deck vs feather vs legend tribal doesn’t seem like a fair matchup, I really enjoy the show tho
feather isnt fair against alot of decks
@@zacharybecker8228 that’s why I think rule zero would have helped
@@AnticlimacticPangolin also didnt help he misplayed the ephemerate wrong which would have set him behind a turn or two
@@zacharybecker8228 totally agree, I know it slows the game but they really need rule checking (that isn’t Jon)
All Jon had to do was NOT tutor for the dockside. Might have been a game then. Ah well.
Feather is a beast
You mean feather is easy mode lol
Love the series... but not this episode. Can we maybe try and balance power levels a bit? We do it with our friends, shouldn't be that hard to do here.