Hey man sucks to lose friend over a job. I learned that the hard way as well, which is why I now longer do work for friends anymore. Hope this helps go towards what you lost out on. Happy Holidays from my Family to yours.
I've worked with and for several friends over the years, and have come to the conclusion that any work i do for a friend or family is donated/free. I'll never expect payment or to even be acknowledged for the work done.
@@BlunderCraft_Workshopexactly. I’ll move mountains for friends but will never expect payment. If it’s something that has to be bought then I’ll let them know they buy the supplies I’ll help out. I’ll even go with them to show them what to buy. That way I’m only out labor. Anyways, what’s that quote from A Bronx Tale? “they’re never gonna bother you again. They’re never going to ask for money again. They are out of your life for $20. You got off cheap. “ $1500-3000 isn’t as good of a deal but still a cheap price to pay to learn someone’s character.
I'm an amateur wood worker, but I'm a professional mechanic. I almost never work for family or friends. Most of the time I just tell them I'm super backed up and refer them to someone else. If it's a family member in a financial bind, I just do the repair for free. None of this "pay me when you can" or whatever, because I know that, if I do that, and they never pay me back, I'll resent it a bit. If the deal from the beginning is that I'm just doing it for free, I'm fine with it. And, if at some point, they show up insisting that I take their money (and I will), that's just a bonus.
Geez, some people. It is always important to get it in writing, with everyone, including friends and family. Thanks for the reminder. May you make the money back from UA-cam, thanks, and product sales 10 fold. You are good people.
Even if you won't go after him, you and others should know that you DO have a leg to stand on. The finished table is proof of work, complimented by the fact you have a video of you documenting the work you did. This is what small claims court is for. A judge will know you didn't do this work for free or as a favor so in the extreme case of Dick denying that money was involved, the judge will consider the skilled labor hours you put in and determine a value, which I guarantee will be above $1k. If anything, file a small claim, make a video, and show your viewers that you and they, given the comments I've read, can absolutely get compensated. YOU are the nice guy, don't be a defeatist and let the scummy guy win.
This guy might have been a friend at one time but he's not anymore and he certainly isn't nice. Thanks for posting your experience. Life makes you smarter!
Pretty safe to say you are not the first and won't be the last to make the mistake of doing a job for a friend or family... A lesson I too learned the hard way. At the time I felt really pissed off, but I got over it and moved on just as I am sure you will. All the best to you and yours in '25
One thing I learned after many years in the military and working for the government: If it isn't written down, it never happened. Words to live by regardless of who you are dealing with, family, friends, or the general public. Some people have bad memories and won't remember conversations, other people are malicious and will try to take you for everything they can. What comes around, goes around, and eventually Dick will get his in the end, especially since he's going to be reminded of everything every time he looks at the table and/or has to answer questions about it.
I'm sorry to hear that. I learned long ago not to take projects for family or friends unless it is a gift. These situations often go sideways and can damage the friendship.
Yeah there's no such thing as money among true friends. You don't loan money or charge friends. Or you don't have them as friends for long. I've noticed that once money enters the picture friendships are close to over.
Man that sucks Chris, I've learned from a good friend that when you do business with friends you do business first and be friends later. Hope you will get enough revenue to get compensated for this. All the best to you and your family ❤
Chris - You are a true gentleman. Wishing you better ‘luck’ going forward in the future. Working for (or with) friends and or family can cause all kinds of strife. I personally would not do it going forward as I too have had poor outcomes as result of going down this path. I agree with you wholeheartedly as well everything must be documented. Better luck in 2025, wishing you and your family all the best. 😊
Amen to everything you're saying, sir. An ex of mine (that I was still on very good terms with) had some pasture and dirt work job that she wanted me to do. We were very slow at my day job, so thought I'd go make some cash. Was told $xxx at first to come out and help, then told $xxxx to get all this other stuff done too. No texts, nothing in writing. Spent 3 days in mid August in Texas -reworking her pasture for drainage, removing trees and reshaping her pond because it was so low. Come to settle up and she changes her story to "I was going to pay you hourly." This lady just spent $6K for a pet camel (yes, an actual 🐫) and decided to only pay me 1/3 of what was originally said. I was livid and we have not spoken since. It's sad times when people you thought you could trust, want nothing more than to use you. On the flip side, how did the table turn out? Do you have any final pics?
That’s a shame. I hope the camel was worth it. The video of the entire building is on my channel. It’s just a few videos back. So go to the channel click videos and you’ll see it.
So sad this happened Chris. I watched the video of you making that table and it was a ton of work and turned out beautiful. I hope you will be compensated one way or another. Many years ago a dear friend who was an extremely talented carpenter told me he never does work for friends. I didn't know why and didn't ask. Years later I had experiences like hiring a neighbor who owned a professional tree trimming company to trim my trees. His crew dropped limbs on a metal horse corral & gate doing a lot of damage. I was never compensated for that and our friendship was never the same again. At that point I understood why my carpenter friend said what he did. I have been asked many times to do work for friends but always politely decline with some excuse that doesn't hurt their feelings like I don't have time, etc. It's the best way to keep from losing friends. Your video will help many and I'm sure you learned a lot during this very unpleasant process so in a way it helped a lot of people. Thanks for sharing and best wishes for a very happy New Year to you and your family!!!
I feel for you, sorry things went down that way. Gotta try and be exact as possible when striking those deals. Wording is key. x2,x3 is a lot more then a "bit" so I can see their side too. I hope things clear up but hey that is a beautiful table. There's reward in that.
You are such a nice guy Chris and you don’t deserve this treatment. I hope you had a special Christmas with your family and that 2025 is happy and successful. Ray from the UK 🌞
Thank you for highlighting the importance of establishing written terms on jobs for everyone’s protection! I’m a house painter and had to chase down payment from the retired father of a client last year, it was a total nightmare. I, too, neglected to put the scope of work and payment terms in an actual document and I almost lost a month’s wages over it with no legal recourse. I hope you’re able to help a lot of independent contractors out there cover their assets, you’re a good man for sharing your mistakes to help others avoid them!
Same thing happened with me. I trusted my friend to pay me for building a table for his new home and asked for he and his wife to pay me what they felt the table was worth arterial expenses. Apparently it was valued at compliments and gratitude alone and nothing more despite the many hours i spent working on the project.
Similar circumstance happened to me, but I didn't get totally stiffed. I made the table, they loved it, but then said they hit a financial hardship and couldn't buy it. I ended up selling it, but it wasn't a cheap build and I brunt the entire cost as you have here. I think the name you chose for your friend was fitting.
Long time contract negotiator / marketing rep… rule one I always pushed on the team was the better the relationship the more detailed the contract / statement of work. Got pushed back all the time that “hey we are good friends - I trust them… etc”… Great that is exactly why the contract (and detail) is required. The relationship is so important it is vital to protect it from misunderstandings. Memory fades by ink takes a really long time (and digital doesn’t fade at all). Sorry it happened to you… but $3000 isn’t bad for a huge lesson and now knowledge to pass along to others. All the best..
Yep, when I worked for a financial institution we used to call it having “skin in the game”. The client had to anti up their end first, in your case a deposit up front, some say 50% but I when I worked for myself usually worked on 20%. As you said documentation is king. Sorry for your loss hopefully you can recoup via this video and hey gloves are off use his table to sell your services to others “look what I can do”. All the best for 2025
Thanks for sharing Chris. Unfortunate, that he conveniently forgot the additional conversation. I think he knew how much this kind of work costs and was taking advantage of your kind nature and "friendship". Friends don't screw friends over. Good lesson for all. You have amazing content and great products. Keep up the good work, positive attitude, and maybe we can all avoid the Dicks of the world. Hope you had a Merry Christmas and wishing you a Happy New Year.
So sorry to hear this story. It also highlights how the people that don't do what we do have absolutely no understanding of what we do or the years of learning and perfecting your skills to get to the place where you are capable of taking this project on. You are a good and honorable man Chris, move through your life knowing that to be true. P.S. even $3,000.00 was a gift!
Sorry this has happened to you. Had a similar situation, though way less amount of money involved, and it caused such disbelief that a "friend" would be so uncaring. I admire your attitude about this situation, and hope for a wonderful 2025 for you and your family
Sorry this happened to you, Chris. You are a good man and people like this just need to be upstanding and not take advantage of people trying to make an honest living with talents they possess. Sorry again, great lesson shared and Happy Holidays to you and your family!
Communication is key. Initially it should have been made clear the price was an estimate based on the information available at the time. But then when the full scope of the job became known it has to be made clear that the previous job is over and a new deal must be struck.
True , but better yet not just generally communication, rather “set expectations “ so not only $ but also time and quality. Fill in the triangle of “fast, good, cheap, pick two”
My girlfriend surprised me with one of your sander holders for Christmas. I put it together and can’t wait to try it out. Love your channel. Can’t wait to try some more of your products.
Sorry to hear that , it’s a shame that you can’t trust anyone anymore.. I would just make things and don’t take any projects that someone else wants done…. Thanks for sharing Chris ..
Chris I’m so sorry this happened to you it just sucks that there’s people like that in this world I went into business with a friend and in the end it was a very very costly and painful experience and it cost my so much money so I know how you feel. You are such a great person just from watching your videos seeing how you talk about your kids and wife and after purchasing items from your website and seeing the love and care you put into how your packages look when you’re customers receive them. Keep being that great guy and you’re friend Dick just like my friend Dick will someday get there karma. God bless you and your family Happy New Year 🎊🎉🍾🍻
Just had this happen to me. Quoted a reasonable price for a simple job. Customer kept adding changes and needed it sooner than originally stated. Nothing in writing and nothing up front trying to be a nice guy and ended losing money and most importantly time i could have been working on other projects. Lesson learned. Get it in writing.
Commenting on this video for the Algorithm for you and your family. It's been a long time since I watched that first video of your window Cabinet that did horrible for you but drew me in as a fan. LOL Lessons learned and continue to move forward. Blessing in the new year Chris. I now run a business of my own and completely understand and sympathize with you and your "friend" Blessings to you and your family in 2025.
My first large build almost broke my business. Took 94 days to get a check (they misplaced it), I was paid in full. I didn’t ask for 50% down as I thought they would write a 12k check on delivery. That wasn’t the case. Hope this video helps others
That was what I call, a fair weather friend, the least little bit of a bad weather, and they are gone! Much respect for you posting this lesson online!
Sorry to hear this. I learned the hard way also. But luckily it was only a 10th of what you lost. Hope this video go viral. And may 2025 be a great year for you.
FROM PAST EXPIERENCE AS A HANDYMAN/JACK OF ALL TRADES MASTER OF NONE, ALWAYS BIENG SOUGHT OUT BY FAMILY AND FRIENDS, I RESORTED TO THE PRATICE THAT BEFORE I DO ANY KIND OF WORK PROJECT, AND I WILL NOT DO IT AT ALL OR DO FOR FREE IF BEFORE I CHARGE IF I DO NOT WANT TO LOSE MY RELATIONSHIPS WITH FRIENDS OR FAMILY. THAT IS JUST HOW PEOPLE ROLE AND I HAD TO LEARN THAT THE HARD WAY. HAPPY HOLIDAYS!!!!!
As soon as "Richard" came out, I knew "Dick" would soon follow, lol. I'm also guilty of not making written contracts, but also being burned before, I now require 50% or cost of materials up front, whichever is higher. Most of my projects aren't in the 4 digit range though. In that case, I'd say a contract is definitely in order. On the bright side, you learned a couple valuable lessons here, and it will hopefully help others from making the same. Thanks for the video.
I’d rather hang with someone who is fair over nice. Nice doesn’t mean good. Don’t worry, you’ll end up on top in the long run…because you’re good and fair.
I am so sorry to hear you have been let down that way. That sucks. Your work is worth way more than you were asking even at the higher price. Your work is so cool buddy. I hope the New Year brings you and yours better friends and happy times. Hi Pixies!
"Richard?". You got that right. Would love an update ... Whether it is YT "currency" or a check. God bless, thanks for sharing this lesson, and Blessings for the New Year.
Feel for you. I almost had the same thing happen to me with my best friend. He Wanted an epoxy and carved coffee topographical map table of the Chesapeake bay. I found a 7 ft slab for 400$ which was a steal and when I told him the cost of materials would be 1200$ he said "yeah but you could negotiate the price of the wood down". I told him the price was a steal and he'd need to send 400 so I could purchase it to start the project. He said yeah I can send 300-350 or whatever. That was my clue. I dropped it, he hasn't mentioned it again.
I got burned for 8k in unpaid work from someone that I considered a friend. I considered it an expensive lesson in "trust." I needed that money but not at the expense of my sanity or freedom. Lesson learned and going forward I document everything and over-communicate...
This is terrible, I’m sorry that happened to you! I think you picked the perfect name for him. I always put things in writing and for big jobs, I get paid half up front and half upon completion. That said, I haven’t done much for friends and family, so I don’t know if I would have followed my own rules if I were in your situation. I will now. Hang in there, I hope this video helps compensate you for your loss.
Hi Chris, that whole situation is a real bummer, friend or no friend he is a completely dishonest person, as you said, a very big lesson has been learnt, I would like to wish you and your family A Very Happy New Year, best regards for 2025, best regards from Australia, Les
Not sure what state you're in but in Texas, you can record anything you are party to. 100%legal all phone calls and conversations and the other person doesn't have to know at all.
That’s stinks. I’m sorry to hear that. I have had that happen to me before but not to that amount. I made a rule for any custom work 1/2 of cost upfront or payment of wood and supplies. I was just having a conversation with some friends discussing how hard it is to price and do work for family and friends. I hope this video brings in triple of your cost. I hope you have a great New Years
Yeah... That's difficult, Chris. 😕 Doing business with friends and families... Don't usually work well. Anyway, happy holidays! Stay safe there with your family! 🖖😊
I am a hobby woodworker, but that being said, I’ve been making custom entry doors, fancy garden gates, built in cabinets, pantries, sewing cabinets, furniture, etc for 35 years. I’ve made many custom works for acquaintances or friends of friends without issue. I always give them a drawing and wait for approval before giving the price. I discuss the pricing before the project starts and provide a spec sheet with pricing prior to approval and starting the project. Never had a problem until I do work for friends… THEN I feel like I’m being nickel and dimed and questioned as to why I can’t make the same thing for the IKEA price. I finished a custom bathroom vanity for a friend during the pandemic. Communicated that the price of materials/hardware/sheet goods had skyrocketed. She still wanted to go through with the project. I quoted a high price to guard against the jacked up supply prices and told her that it may come in slightly less and had her sign the work order. She made a change order halfway through which I accommodated and I communicated that it would cost an additional $ amount which she agreed to. Her bathroom contractor was slow and I had completed the project but he wasn’t ready to install so I held onto the cabinet for 3 months waiting for him. The bathroom is finally done and she calls me to tell me that she found a cabinet online that she just loves and wants to back out. I ask her where she’s going to install the custom vanity that I built for her because I am not going to eat the cost of building it for her bathroom and I have a signed work order. In the meantime, the online purchase arrives and it’s a piece of crap so now she calls back and tries to play nice because the bathroom is done except for the sink/vanity. She got it a month later at the original quoted full price plus the additional cost for the change order. No discount from me.
As you say, documentation is very important. In my own opinion, NEVER mixing money with friendship is possibly even more important. Hope the video helps right the wrong! 👍
Document everything amd always bid high, never low. Sucks you got bit trying to help a "friend", but maybe we can learn something from this adventure. Thanks for sharing!
I don't usually engage with any internet drama, because I don't want to feed the algorithm the info that this is the content I care about, but in this case I'm compelled to leave a comment. I have to say I disagree with a lot of people here and you (the author of the video) that you should not do work for friends. People say this because this way they avoid being hurt (mostly emotionally, but sometimes monetarily as well). But I disagree. You should take a risk for a friend, you should be willing to sacrifice yourself for a friend. That's what being a friend is in the end. That's exactly what you did by offering your help, quoting a small fee and doing an awesome job. A true friend would not let their friends get hurt by something they did. If I was your customer, even without being your friend and without knowing your situation, I would not sleep knowing I have possibly wronged you. I would pay no matter what, and then end the friendship if I believed in my "principles". This person was never your friend, you just believed he was. Now you've paid the price of finding out the truth. But you will not make the same mistake with him. However, please, don't make your other friends suffer for that. Friends help other friends. At the very least, friends don't intentionally hurt other friends. I've been hurt by "friends" before, and I've given up on a few, but it makes me appreciate real friends that much more, even if I don't have that many.
"I disagree with a lot of people here and you (the author of the video) that you should not do work for friends. People say this because this way they avoid being hurt (mostly emotionally, but sometimes monetarily as well). But I disagree. You should take a risk for a friend, you should be willing to sacrifice yourself for a friend. That's what being a friend is in the end." I'm with you, up to a point. I'm certain that I could trust many of my friends and relatives on the basis of a verbal agreement, but I would say that it depends on how well you know the friend. Further, yes, in principle, take a risk for a friend, but think about how big a risk that is; can you afford it if they fail to come through?
@@PJRayment Yes, you are right, I did sound a bit extreme, but do everything with moderation. It would be crazy to risk too much for an unreliable person. It is better to test friendships with smaller risks. Also, making sure you have expectations clear from the start (meaning, set price, documented agreements etc) is definitely a good idea, and I assume Chris is not going to make THAT mistake again.
Dick has no appreciation for a your time, energy, or workmanship. Not someone I would ever talk to again (your much more laid back and cool then I would be, good for you). Thank you for sharing and the advice.
Good that you learned from your mistake. I haven't had to learn that mistake because I treat everyone as a client and document everything. I even gave a client back his entire amount paid for a piece that I wasn't satisfied with and thought it was wrong to charge him for what I did. Hopefully, "Dick", will see this and reconsider. Either way, life is too short to worry about losing friends. Strangers are just friends that you haven't met yet. All of your clients are strangers and potential friends. Communication is essential. Enjoy the holidays and keep producing.
Chris, sorry to hear that this happened to you. Dealing with friends & family is tough (sometimes). This "friend" perfectly demonstrated the definition of "Dick move". Hopefully you'll find a good home for that beautiful table. Love the slab top and that base is very cool~! Best wishes to you and your family for the New Year~!
That sucks, and why I won't do business with family or friends for cash. I either do it for free, or I'm not doing it for them. I learned that lesson years ago when I was building custom PC's.
Always always always in writing so that all expectations are clear and always take $ down. For me it was half of the initial estimate. That way the client and I always had 'skin in the game'. I had a reason to complete the work (complete payment) and they had $ in it and kept the honest. If they don't settle up you can always keep the work hostage (watermarked or possession) until they pay.
My sentiment is: Don't do work for friends or family unless you are prepared and can afford to be unpaid. Don't lend money to friends or family unless you accept and can afford the possibility that it may not be paid back. The effect on the relationship can vary, but it will be the last time for either of the two happens.
Not the first time this has happened and definitely won't be the last (in the grand scheme of business, not specifically you). I have a hell of a time pricing my work to people I know but have been lucky up to this point to be compensated by friends who keep telling me to stop undercutting my prices. Overall a good lesson in the video albeit a tough one for your business. Hoping the adsense at least makes up a good portion of your loss on this one.
Ran into similar scenario with a different product (wine) where a festival ordered wine, it was delivered and after the event was over going out of business was the tactic.
This guy is no friend or this guy is not a nice guy. It is disgraceful that somebody can do something so horrible. Happy new year Chris to you and your family
Man, I hate that for you. I learned years ago, when my husband and I owned a landscaping company, to always write up a contract. No matter how small the job or how “nice” the client - ALWAYS do a contract and always get a 50% deposit up front. I know hindsight is 20/20 and this “friend” wasn’t expected to screw you over, but hopefully you’ll at least recoup your money with this video. And, Chris, I agree with the others in the comments - he’s not a friend, and he’s not a nice guy. “Richard” definitely earned his nickname in this case. Wishing you and yours a very blessed and happy new year. 😊
What a crying shame. I’m so sorry for how all that BS went down. I did a similar live edge slab table for a friend of mine. Fortunately I had years of experience as a contractor to know that the difference between a successful and an unsuccessful job usually came down to the frequency and depth of communications. In the case of my friend/client I kept him apprised of the consumables (sandpaper, resin, finishes, crating materials, etc.) and, most importantly, my shop time. We agreed that he would pay for all of the hard costs and a certain hourly rate for shop time. At the end of the day I showed him some market comparables for the type of the table and he was only too happy to pay. The table that you built and the one I did was probably worth $10,000 or more. One advantage that I had was that I had possession of the table. He was only too happy to pay. Your assessment is correct in my view, communications are the key to a successful project.
That sucks man, had it happen to me but with land and developing it for a home. Verbal conversation and then after putting in around $10,000 in septic, groundwork, and electrical he ghosted me and I lost out on all work done through denial and the he said syndrome...
Hey man sucks to lose friend over a job. I learned that the hard way as well, which is why I now longer do work for friends anymore. Hope this helps go towards what you lost out on. Happy Holidays from my Family to yours.
Chris Castagner is now the sponsor of this video. Thank you so much for the kind words and the tip. A super thanks indeed.
I've worked with and for several friends over the years, and have come to the conclusion that any work i do for a friend or family is donated/free. I'll never expect payment or to even be acknowledged for the work done.
I want to know if your "friend's" first name is Peter or Paul, as that would make him a complete P Rick. Keep smiling karma will come for P Rick.
@@BlunderCraft_Workshopexactly. I’ll move mountains for friends but will never expect payment. If it’s something that has to be bought then I’ll let them know they buy the supplies I’ll help out. I’ll even go with them to show them what to buy.
That way I’m only out labor.
Anyways, what’s that quote from A Bronx Tale? “they’re never gonna bother you again. They’re never going to ask for money again. They are out of your life for $20. You got off cheap. “
$1500-3000 isn’t as good of a deal but still a cheap price to pay to learn someone’s character.
I read in a book of business sayings published around 1900. One of them said, “Make friends out of customers not customers out of friends”.
This is am important lesson to learn. Thanks for sharing and I’m going to take this information to heart. 😎👍
Amazing point here we’ll heard thank you
I'm an amateur wood worker, but I'm a professional mechanic. I almost never work for family or friends. Most of the time I just tell them I'm super backed up and refer them to someone else. If it's a family member in a financial bind, I just do the repair for free. None of this "pay me when you can" or whatever, because I know that, if I do that, and they never pay me back, I'll resent it a bit. If the deal from the beginning is that I'm just doing it for free, I'm fine with it. And, if at some point, they show up insisting that I take their money (and I will), that's just a bonus.
Happened to me too…. Merry Christmas!!
Geez, some people. It is always important to get it in writing, with everyone, including friends and family. Thanks for the reminder. May you make the money back from UA-cam, thanks, and product sales 10 fold. You are good people.
He isn't a nice guy if he doesn't stick to his word. If your word is no good, you're no good. Love ya bud.
Even if you won't go after him, you and others should know that you DO have a leg to stand on. The finished table is proof of work, complimented by the fact you have a video of you documenting the work you did. This is what small claims court is for. A judge will know you didn't do this work for free or as a favor so in the extreme case of Dick denying that money was involved, the judge will consider the skilled labor hours you put in and determine a value, which I guarantee will be above $1k.
If anything, file a small claim, make a video, and show your viewers that you and they, given the comments I've read, can absolutely get compensated. YOU are the nice guy, don't be a defeatist and let the scummy guy win.
I totally agree with you on this. Make this an episode.
Wow ouch. Sorry to hear. I like that your audience looks to be overwhelmingly supportive.
That's a good lesson for everyone to learn. Document, document, document. Thanks for sharing.
This guy might have been a friend at one time but he's not anymore and he certainly isn't nice. Thanks for posting your experience.
Life makes you smarter!
Pretty safe to say you are not the first and won't be the last to make the mistake of doing a job for a friend or family... A lesson I too learned the hard way. At the time I felt really pissed off, but I got over it and moved on just as I am sure you will. All the best to you and yours in '25
Thank you so much, Phil
One thing I learned after many years in the military and working for the government: If it isn't written down, it never happened. Words to live by regardless of who you are dealing with, family, friends, or the general public. Some people have bad memories and won't remember conversations, other people are malicious and will try to take you for everything they can. What comes around, goes around, and eventually Dick will get his in the end, especially since he's going to be reminded of everything every time he looks at the table and/or has to answer questions about it.
Seriously, it’s almost symbolic. Feeding your family on a table that was stolen. Smh
I'm sorry to hear that. I learned long ago not to take projects for family or friends unless it is a gift. These situations often go sideways and can damage the friendship.
Yeah there's no such thing as money among true friends. You don't loan money or charge friends. Or you don't have them as friends for long. I've noticed that once money enters the picture friendships are close to over.
You are right, document everything. In the end that is the only thing that protects both parties. Also, for custom work get money up front.
Man that sucks Chris, I've learned from a good friend that when you do business with friends you do business first and be friends later. Hope you will get enough revenue to get compensated for this. All the best to you and your family ❤
Chris - You are a true gentleman. Wishing you better ‘luck’ going forward in the future. Working for (or with) friends and or family can cause all kinds of strife. I personally would not do it going forward as I too have had poor outcomes as result of going down this path. I agree with you wholeheartedly as well everything must be documented. Better luck in 2025, wishing you and your family all the best.
😊
Amen to everything you're saying, sir. An ex of mine (that I was still on very good terms with) had some pasture and dirt work job that she wanted me to do. We were very slow at my day job, so thought I'd go make some cash. Was told $xxx at first to come out and help, then told $xxxx to get all this other stuff done too. No texts, nothing in writing. Spent 3 days in mid August in Texas -reworking her pasture for drainage, removing trees and reshaping her pond because it was so low. Come to settle up and she changes her story to "I was going to pay you hourly." This lady just spent $6K for a pet camel (yes, an actual 🐫) and decided to only pay me 1/3 of what was originally said. I was livid and we have not spoken since. It's sad times when people you thought you could trust, want nothing more than to use you.
On the flip side, how did the table turn out? Do you have any final pics?
That’s a shame. I hope the camel was worth it. The video of the entire building is on my channel. It’s just a few videos back. So go to the channel click videos and you’ll see it.
So sad this happened Chris. I watched the video of you making that table and it was a ton of work and turned out beautiful. I hope you will be compensated one way or another. Many years ago a dear friend who was an extremely talented carpenter told me he never does work for friends. I didn't know why and didn't ask. Years later I had experiences like hiring a neighbor who owned a professional tree trimming company to trim my trees. His crew dropped limbs on a metal horse corral & gate doing a lot of damage. I was never compensated for that and our friendship was never the same again. At that point I understood why my carpenter friend said what he did. I have been asked many times to do work for friends but always politely decline with some excuse that doesn't hurt their feelings like I don't have time, etc. It's the best way to keep from losing friends. Your video will help many and I'm sure you learned a lot during this very unpleasant process so in a way it helped a lot of people. Thanks for sharing and best wishes for a very happy New Year to you and your family!!!
I’m with you. Friends are not good business.
I feel for you, sorry things went down that way. Gotta try and be exact as possible when striking those deals. Wording is key. x2,x3 is a lot more then a "bit" so I can see their side too. I hope things clear up but hey that is a beautiful table. There's reward in that.
Definitely need to document everything. We had a similar issue with a client, verbal change orders... didn't go well at the end of the job.
A true Richard in every sense
That lesson is worth FAR more than the money! Thank you for sharing it with us. Happy New Year
I hope Dick has friends who know of your channel and see this video and put two & two together... They'll know his true nature.
Nice job taking the high road, Chris. You did the right thing and for that, you can sleep at night.
Sorry about your experience Chris. I hate that for you. You are a great guy. Love your videos and your cute daughter when she does her cameos.
Thanks!
Jimmyjam838 is now the sponsor of this video. Thank you, sir.
You are such a nice guy Chris and you don’t deserve this treatment. I hope you had a special Christmas with your family and that 2025 is happy and successful. Ray from the UK 🌞
Thank you for highlighting the importance of establishing written terms on jobs for everyone’s protection! I’m a house painter and had to chase down payment from the retired father of a client last year, it was a total nightmare. I, too, neglected to put the scope of work and payment terms in an actual document and I almost lost a month’s wages over it with no legal recourse. I hope you’re able to help a lot of independent contractors out there cover their assets, you’re a good man for sharing your mistakes to help others avoid them!
Same thing happened with me. I trusted my friend to pay me for building a table for his new home and asked for he and his wife to pay me what they felt the table was worth arterial expenses. Apparently it was valued at compliments and gratitude alone and nothing more despite the many hours i spent working on the project.
Similar circumstance happened to me, but I didn't get totally stiffed. I made the table, they loved it, but then said they hit a financial hardship and couldn't buy it. I ended up selling it, but it wasn't a cheap build and I brunt the entire cost as you have here. I think the name you chose for your friend was fitting.
Dang bro, that sucks to hear! Thanks for sharing your experience
Long time contract negotiator / marketing rep… rule one I always pushed on the team was the better the relationship the more detailed the contract / statement of work. Got pushed back all the time that “hey we are good friends - I trust them… etc”… Great that is exactly why the contract (and detail) is required. The relationship is so important it is vital to protect it from misunderstandings. Memory fades by ink takes a really long time (and digital doesn’t fade at all). Sorry it happened to you… but $3000 isn’t bad for a huge lesson and now knowledge to pass along to others. All the best..
Yep, when I worked for a financial institution we used to call it having “skin in the game”. The client had to anti up their end first, in your case a deposit up front, some say 50% but I when I worked for myself usually worked on 20%. As you said documentation is king. Sorry for your loss hopefully you can recoup via this video and hey gloves are off use his table to sell your services to others “look what I can do”. All the best for 2025
Thanks for sharing Chris. Unfortunate, that he conveniently forgot the additional conversation. I think he knew how much this kind of work costs and was taking advantage of your kind nature and "friendship". Friends don't screw friends over. Good lesson for all. You have amazing content and great products. Keep up the good work, positive attitude, and maybe we can all avoid the Dicks of the world. Hope you had a Merry Christmas and wishing you a Happy New Year.
Thanks for sharing this difficult story with us Chris. I hope it will eventually get healed.
So sorry to hear this story. It also highlights how the people that don't do what we do have absolutely no understanding of what we do or the years of learning and perfecting your skills to get to the place where you are capable of taking this project on. You are a good and honorable man Chris, move through your life knowing that to be true. P.S. even $3,000.00 was a gift!
Doubled, is a word people would remember, a bit more is very casual and easy to forget after months.
Sorry this has happened to you. Had a similar situation, though way less amount of money involved, and it caused such disbelief that a "friend" would be so uncaring. I admire your attitude about this situation, and hope for a wonderful 2025 for you and your family
Sorry this happened to you, Chris. You are a good man and people like this just need to be upstanding and not take advantage of people trying to make an honest living with talents they possess. Sorry again, great lesson shared and Happy Holidays to you and your family!
You're great honest person keep it going I love your videos and your time and your family
Communication is key. Initially it should have been made clear the price was an estimate based on the information available at the time. But then when the full scope of the job became known it has to be made clear that the previous job is over and a new deal must be struck.
True , but better yet not just generally communication, rather “set expectations “ so not only $ but also time and quality. Fill in the triangle of “fast, good, cheap, pick two”
My girlfriend surprised me with one of your sander holders for Christmas. I put it together and can’t wait to try it out. Love your channel. Can’t wait to try some more of your products.
That’s awesome! Let me know how you like it, I’d love to hear!
@ absolutely. Keep doing what you’re doing.
Sorry to hear that , it’s a shame that you can’t trust anyone anymore.. I would just make things and don’t take any projects that someone else wants done…. Thanks for sharing Chris ..
Chris I’m so sorry this happened to you it just sucks that there’s people like that in this world I went into business with a friend and in the end it was a very very costly and painful experience and it cost my so much money so I know how you feel. You are such a great person just from watching your videos seeing how you talk about your kids and wife and after purchasing items from your website and seeing the love and care you put into how your packages look when you’re customers receive them. Keep being that great guy and you’re friend Dick just like my friend Dick will someday get there karma. God bless you and your family Happy New Year 🎊🎉🍾🍻
Oh Richard. Thanks for sharing.
Just had this happen to me. Quoted a reasonable price for a simple job. Customer kept adding changes and needed it sooner than originally stated. Nothing in writing and nothing up front trying to be a nice guy and ended losing money and most importantly time i could have been working on other projects. Lesson learned. Get it in writing.
Commenting on this video for the Algorithm for you and your family. It's been a long time since I watched that first video of your window Cabinet that did horrible for you but drew me in as a fan. LOL Lessons learned and continue to move forward. Blessing in the new year Chris. I now run a business of my own and completely understand and sympathize with you and your "friend" Blessings to you and your family in 2025.
My first large build almost broke my business. Took 94 days to get a check (they misplaced it), I was paid in full. I didn’t ask for 50% down as I thought they would write a 12k check on delivery. That wasn’t the case. Hope this video helps others
His friendship doesn't sound like a huge loss.
That was what I call, a fair weather friend, the least little bit of a bad weather, and they are gone!
Much respect for you posting this lesson online!
Sorry to hear this. I learned the hard way also. But luckily it was only a 10th of what you lost. Hope this video go viral. And may 2025 be a great year for you.
FROM PAST EXPIERENCE AS A HANDYMAN/JACK OF ALL TRADES MASTER OF NONE, ALWAYS BIENG SOUGHT OUT BY FAMILY AND FRIENDS, I RESORTED TO THE PRATICE THAT BEFORE I DO ANY KIND OF WORK PROJECT, AND I WILL NOT DO IT AT ALL OR DO FOR FREE IF BEFORE I CHARGE IF I DO NOT WANT TO LOSE MY RELATIONSHIPS WITH FRIENDS OR FAMILY. THAT IS JUST HOW PEOPLE ROLE AND I HAD TO LEARN THAT THE HARD WAY. HAPPY HOLIDAYS!!!!!
For whatever it's worth, have been self employed half my life, all across the board, lesson learned!!! At least all you lost was time!!
As soon as "Richard" came out, I knew "Dick" would soon follow, lol. I'm also guilty of not making written contracts, but also being burned before, I now require 50% or cost of materials up front, whichever is higher. Most of my projects aren't in the 4 digit range though. In that case, I'd say a contract is definitely in order. On the bright side, you learned a couple valuable lessons here, and it will hopefully help others from making the same. Thanks for the video.
Richard Cranium?
Wow, really sorry to see this Chris. Hard lesson to learn. All the best in the coming year to you and your family
Thank you, Kurt. I appreciate it.
I’d rather hang with someone who is fair over nice. Nice doesn’t mean good. Don’t worry, you’ll end up on top in the long run…because you’re good and fair.
I am so sorry to hear you have been let down that way. That sucks. Your work is worth way more than you were asking even at the higher price. Your work is so cool buddy. I hope the New Year brings you and yours better friends and happy times. Hi Pixies!
"Richard?". You got that right. Would love an update ... Whether it is YT "currency" or a check. God bless, thanks for sharing this lesson, and Blessings for the New Year.
Feel for you. I almost had the same thing happen to me with my best friend. He Wanted an epoxy and carved coffee topographical map table of the Chesapeake bay. I found a 7 ft slab for 400$ which was a steal and when I told him the cost of materials would be 1200$ he said "yeah but you could negotiate the price of the wood down". I told him the price was a steal and he'd need to send 400 so I could purchase it to start the project. He said yeah I can send 300-350 or whatever. That was my clue. I dropped it, he hasn't mentioned it again.
I got burned for 8k in unpaid work from someone that I considered a friend. I considered it an expensive lesson in "trust." I needed that money but not at the expense of my sanity or freedom. Lesson learned and going forward I document everything and over-communicate...
As I learned in the job I retired from (police officer), documentation is everything. We had a phrase: "If it aint in the report, it didn't happen."
Great video. Will share. Happy new year.
There is a law in nature that is very real and applies to everybody: 'You reap what you sow...'
This is terrible, I’m sorry that happened to you! I think you picked the perfect name for him. I always put things in writing and for big jobs, I get paid half up front and half upon completion. That said, I haven’t done much for friends and family, so I don’t know if I would have followed my own rules if I were in your situation. I will now. Hang in there, I hope this video helps compensate you for your loss.
Hi Chris, that whole situation is a real bummer, friend or no friend he is a completely dishonest person, as you said, a very big lesson has been learnt, I would like to wish you and your family A Very Happy New Year, best regards for 2025, best regards from Australia, Les
Not sure what state you're in but in Texas, you can record anything you are party to. 100%legal all phone calls and conversations and the other person doesn't have to know at all.
That’s stinks. I’m sorry to hear that. I have had that happen to me before but not to that amount. I made a rule for any custom work 1/2 of cost upfront or payment of wood and supplies. I was just having a conversation with some friends discussing how hard it is to price and do work for family and friends. I hope this video brings in triple of your cost. I hope you have a great New Years
Definitely not a friend or a nice guy. You're just getting to see the side of him that you haven't yet
Yeah... That's difficult, Chris. 😕
Doing business with friends and families... Don't usually work well.
Anyway, happy holidays!
Stay safe there with your family! 🖖😊
I am a hobby woodworker, but that being said, I’ve been making custom entry doors, fancy garden gates, built in cabinets, pantries, sewing cabinets, furniture, etc for 35 years. I’ve made many custom works for acquaintances or friends of friends without issue. I always give them a drawing and wait for approval before giving the price. I discuss the pricing before the project starts and provide a spec sheet with pricing prior to approval and starting the project. Never had a problem until I do work for friends… THEN I feel like I’m being nickel and dimed and questioned as to why I can’t make the same thing for the IKEA price. I finished a custom bathroom vanity for a friend during the pandemic. Communicated that the price of materials/hardware/sheet goods had skyrocketed. She still wanted to go through with the project. I quoted a high price to guard against the jacked up supply prices and told her that it may come in slightly less and had her sign the work order. She made a change order halfway through which I accommodated and I communicated that it would cost an additional $ amount which she agreed to. Her bathroom contractor was slow and I had completed the project but he wasn’t ready to install so I held onto the cabinet for 3 months waiting for him. The bathroom is finally done and she calls me to tell me that she found a cabinet online that she just loves and wants to back out. I ask her where she’s going to install the custom vanity that I built for her because I am not going to eat the cost of building it for her bathroom and I have a signed work order. In the meantime, the online purchase arrives and it’s a piece of crap so now she calls back and tries to play nice because the bathroom is done except for the sink/vanity. She got it a month later at the original quoted full price plus the additional cost for the change order. No discount from me.
As you say, documentation is very important. In my own opinion, NEVER mixing money with friendship is possibly even more important. Hope the video helps right the wrong! 👍
Document everything amd always bid high, never low. Sucks you got bit trying to help a "friend", but maybe we can learn something from this adventure. Thanks for sharing!
I don't usually engage with any internet drama, because I don't want to feed the algorithm the info that this is the content I care about, but in this case I'm compelled to leave a comment. I have to say I disagree with a lot of people here and you (the author of the video) that you should not do work for friends. People say this because this way they avoid being hurt (mostly emotionally, but sometimes monetarily as well). But I disagree. You should take a risk for a friend, you should be willing to sacrifice yourself for a friend. That's what being a friend is in the end. That's exactly what you did by offering your help, quoting a small fee and doing an awesome job. A true friend would not let their friends get hurt by something they did. If I was your customer, even without being your friend and without knowing your situation, I would not sleep knowing I have possibly wronged you. I would pay no matter what, and then end the friendship if I believed in my "principles". This person was never your friend, you just believed he was. Now you've paid the price of finding out the truth. But you will not make the same mistake with him. However, please, don't make your other friends suffer for that. Friends help other friends. At the very least, friends don't intentionally hurt other friends. I've been hurt by "friends" before, and I've given up on a few, but it makes me appreciate real friends that much more, even if I don't have that many.
"I disagree with a lot of people here and you (the author of the video) that you should not do work for friends. People say this because this way they avoid being hurt (mostly emotionally, but sometimes monetarily as well). But I disagree. You should take a risk for a friend, you should be willing to sacrifice yourself for a friend. That's what being a friend is in the end."
I'm with you, up to a point. I'm certain that I could trust many of my friends and relatives on the basis of a verbal agreement, but I would say that it depends on how well you know the friend. Further, yes, in principle, take a risk for a friend, but think about how big a risk that is; can you afford it if they fail to come through?
@@PJRayment Yes, you are right, I did sound a bit extreme, but do everything with moderation. It would be crazy to risk too much for an unreliable person. It is better to test friendships with smaller risks. Also, making sure you have expectations clear from the start (meaning, set price, documented agreements etc) is definitely a good idea, and I assume Chris is not going to make THAT mistake again.
It really pisses me off when good people like yourself get taken advantage of.
God Bless
Dick has no appreciation for a your time, energy, or workmanship. Not someone I would ever talk to again (your much more laid back and cool then I would be, good for you). Thank you for sharing and the advice.
Good that you learned from your mistake. I haven't had to learn that mistake because I treat everyone as a client and document everything. I even gave a client back his entire amount paid for a piece that I wasn't satisfied with and thought it was wrong to charge him for what I did. Hopefully, "Dick", will see this and reconsider. Either way, life is too short to worry about losing friends. Strangers are just friends that you haven't met yet. All of your clients are strangers and potential friends. Communication is essential. Enjoy the holidays and keep producing.
Not a Friend!!! I hope the video goes viral.
We shall see. Yeah it’s a shame. What happened?
Been there. Also from a 'friend'. You didn't do anything wrong. I hope your vid here pays out for ya!
Chris, sorry to hear that this happened to you. Dealing with friends & family is tough (sometimes). This "friend" perfectly demonstrated the definition of "Dick move". Hopefully you'll find a good home for that beautiful table. Love the slab top and that base is very cool~! Best wishes to you and your family for the New Year~!
Whatever happened to the table? Thanks for sharing a valuable lesson for sure.
That sucks, and why I won't do business with family or friends for cash. I either do it for free, or I'm not doing it for them. I learned that lesson years ago when I was building custom PC's.
Most states are "single party consent" when it comes to recording conversations. Which means you can record if you are one of the parties.
Most states allow you to record conversations. You might want to check for sure on your state laws.
Love your channel. Sorry you got the shaft. He will get his someday, and then realize how it feels. Keep up the great videos. Happy holidays.
I hope me commenting works in the algorithms favor so you CAN make something out of this event! You didn’t deserve this my friend!
I have nothing to say really, but I appreciate your content, and wish to help with the yt-algorithms.
Chris, for real, this sucks but damn dude, way to advocate for yourself! SO DAMN PROUD, MAN!
Always always always in writing so that all expectations are clear and always take $ down. For me it was half of the initial estimate. That way the client and I always had 'skin in the game'. I had a reason to complete the work (complete payment) and they had $ in it and kept the honest. If they don't settle up you can always keep the work hostage (watermarked or possession) until they pay.
My sentiment is: Don't do work for friends or family unless you are prepared and can afford to be unpaid. Don't lend money to friends or family unless you accept and can afford the possibility that it may not be paid back.
The effect on the relationship can vary, but it will be the last time for either of the two happens.
You know the rules. Money breaks friendships.
NEVER SAY A PRICE FIRST! Always ask the client: how much did you want to spend?
Period. End of the lesson.
Not the first time this has happened and definitely won't be the last (in the grand scheme of business, not specifically you). I have a hell of a time pricing my work to people I know but have been lucky up to this point to be compensated by friends who keep telling me to stop undercutting my prices. Overall a good lesson in the video albeit a tough one for your business. Hoping the adsense at least makes up a good portion of your loss on this one.
Friends and family. If ever compensated, be happy!
That sly wink... I got it Chris.
Ran into similar scenario with a different product (wine) where a festival ordered wine, it was delivered and after the event was over going out of business was the tactic.
This guy is no friend or this guy is not a nice guy. It is disgraceful that somebody can do something so horrible. Happy new year Chris to you and your family
Man, I hate that for you. I learned years ago, when my husband and I owned a landscaping company, to always write up a contract. No matter how small the job or how “nice” the client - ALWAYS do a contract and always get a 50% deposit up front. I know hindsight is 20/20 and this “friend” wasn’t expected to screw you over, but hopefully you’ll at least recoup your money with this video. And, Chris, I agree with the others in the comments - he’s not a friend, and he’s not a nice guy. “Richard” definitely earned his nickname in this case. Wishing you and yours a very blessed and happy new year. 😊
What a crying shame. I’m so sorry for how all that BS went down. I did a similar live edge slab table for a friend of mine. Fortunately I had years of experience as a contractor to know that the difference between a successful and an unsuccessful job usually came down to the frequency and depth of communications. In the case of my friend/client I kept him apprised of the consumables (sandpaper, resin, finishes, crating materials, etc.) and, most importantly, my shop time. We agreed that he would pay for all of the hard costs and a certain hourly rate for shop time.
At the end of the day I showed him some market comparables for the type of the table and he was only too happy to pay. The table that you built and the one I did was probably worth $10,000 or more.
One advantage that I had was that I had possession of the table. He was only too happy to pay. Your assessment is correct in my view, communications are the key to a successful project.
Appreciate the story… sorry it happened… agree it is good to be told so others can learn and hopefully avoid. Be well.
That sucks man, had it happen to me but with land and developing it for a home. Verbal conversation and then after putting in around $10,000 in septic, groundwork, and electrical he ghosted me and I lost out on all work done through denial and the he said syndrome...