Gotta love this guy's serious inputs for those of us who are planning to eventually upgrade. He's tested the available "upgrades" while rocking the sickest color and aeros! Seems like you're on to something with replacing the fake air vents. Harness the best of what this platform can do! 💪 Let's go!
I had the same issue with cooling on another jdm car I have and thankfully I solved it by not having any added interference in front of the radiator such as that oil cooler.
If this doesn't cut it... there's a guy on CivicXI that did a deep dive into the cooling loop, and his takeaway was: (i) there were too many unnecessary parallel components; (ii) the turbo is integrated into the loop, which causes massive heat soak. He stripped out a lot of the parallel "accessory" items from the loop (transmission cooler, etc.), and he removed the turbo from the loop. Honda includes all those items to ensure everything comes up to temp quickly (since most just drive on the street) and improve emissions. He's had no issues since, and he experiences very high ambient temps (Brazil, I believe). His feedback was, as long as you take your time letting the car warm up and then cool down, you'll be fine (and the turbo, etc. don't need to be included in the loop). You just need to be patient w. warmup and let the turbo cooldown after heavy usage before shutting the car off. (We never used to integrate turbos into the cooling loop... you just let them cool off before parking your car... unnecessary source of substantial heat to the loop.)
Bro I’m trying not to spill everything all at once but I’ll put it this way. You’re the FIRST person besides my guy at Doteki Auto Solutions that understand what the REAL problem is 🤣 so 🤫🤫🤫
I'll try to be patient! 😂 Really excited by this vid, though... I have a DE5, and we've got pretty big vents on the sides of our bumpers, but Honda just uses ducts to route it into the wheel well and around the wheel for aero... gonna have to keep an eye on your approach here and rip those ducts out, I think 😂
It’s not going to be one single thing that fixes it but there’s a trick you can use in Hondata to have the fans run at 100% all the time instead of ramping.
I've been saying for some time....that the Twin oil cooler they did in Hong Kong "TR twin oil cooler" resolves alot of the issues. Couple it with a PWR Track radiator and you are good. However I prefer no oil cooler and all radiator. You can put scoops under your body to feed to your pending twin oil cooler.
@GridZilla thought it would help with better heat extraction. I guess not. Hoping to track mine next year. Fingers crossed, wishing no overheating. Love the series btw.
With all those extra oil coolers, and secondary rad, one can imagine you certainly wont have any cooling issues then. Def cut out the back of the fender lining where you installing the oil coolers, to allow air to flow into the wheel well for additional brake cooling.
Control arms, sway bars, camber arms yes. Technically the FK8 coilovers “fit” but I don’t recommend you go that route. Get FL5 specific coil overs because there are differences in the rear vs the FK8
A CF or FRP insert that’s open would look good. And cut out a square on the fender liner and put a mesh screen, so air can flow out. I hate the fake vents. Also - I never use wiper fluid as well! Thought I was the only one.
Maybe the problem is there is too much in the way before cool air gets to the radiator (AC condensor, oil cooler, inter cooler, parts of the bumper). Maybe a medium sized heater core , say 16"x12" mounted under the tank with a 12V fan and pump pushing hot coolant through through a -8 AN? As soon as you hit 190F, the pump and the fan kicks in. Just a thought.
@@kingjimmykingjimmy Honda Race teams haven’t figured it out. Even with a stock intercooler so with all due respect, no, going back to a stock intercooler isn’t the answer. It may help but it isn’t the silver bullet
Stating the obvious here and I know the overheating is annoying, but you are making significantly more power than the car came from factory. Making way more power generates a lot of heat so it's going to make cooling more of an issue. I'd imagine all your cooling mods would keep your engine pretty cool at stock power levels but making 400+ whp is a lot for track work. It does suck having to potentially add more radiators and oil coolers but it's also a small turbocharged engine so there's some natural limitations there unfortunately with heat capacity.
You’re not wrong and obvious contributors are obvious but even at stock power I can overheat this car. Having said that the additional heat exchangers will help but I think there’s a fundamental issue here that I’m already aware of and will be discussing further in the future
@@GridZilla Got it, well I hope it's something that be resolved so you can keep chasing PB's. It's been fun following along on your progress with this car.
I would have to agree, but perhaps fabricating through the fake vent areas that you removed to force more air towards the engine. And it seems like with the radiator, intercooler and oil cooler, you are limiting forced air flow to the engine.
@@AutoUpG it’s matter of what will return the greatest amount of cooling. The available cooling through the front without adding more coolers is already maxed out so you have to find space for additional cooling. Even if you in theory take some cooling away from the main radiator (which I doubt) , but the net effect is greater overall cooling the. It’s well worth it.
Thanks for the video. How are you reading your oil temperatures cause the factory gauge is a derived figure and not measured with a actual temp probe. Additionally, get rid of the PRL intercooler and get acuity's intake solution when it's released
Only using the factory gauge as of now but when the warning lights come on and the car is telling me to stop driving because of the heat and it’s pulling tons of power it doesn’t matter if it’s an estimate or not because it’s HOT 🤣. My plan is to switch to the PWR Intercooler once that is released. I like the Acuity intake set up but from what I understand you’ll have to delete the AC condenser for it to fit which is a non starter for me but we’ll see once it’s fully released.
I’m sure that this on your radar already Michael but supposedly the recent Honda Performance mods applied to the Acura Type S prototype will also be available in some other form for the FL5 platform as well. I’m specifically referring to the new front clip that houses the dual oil coolers…let alone the other options that reduced the car’s weight by 200lbs. Forgive me if your current oil cooler solution is superior aftermarket wise to Honda’s future option…heard you mention on your one video that testing your new system…results were positive…I just haven’t seen the video showing what your choice was. I’ll find it later…
@@GridZilla yeah it seems like they're developing something. But I'm excited what you can come up with maybe entice a company to support your idea and actually make something available for the public!
A gentleman with a time attack FK8 swore one of the must-have items for proper cooling was hood vents. My assumption is that it allows the existing cooling to be more efficient with greater airflow through the engine bay.
Maybe worth considering once you get your oil coolers installed, graft large openings on your bumper cover to expose for maximum airflow, not sure how you feel about cutting both corners of the bumper cover, #becauseRaceCar
Bro I feel you, enhencing overheating issues without breaking factory layout. larger cooler is a must. Hope to see you're the first to solve FL5 overheating on this planet!
i run a setrab 2.5" thick core for the oil cooler on my 06 sti and ive had great luck with it, my other saving grace was the insulated lines to the oil cooler... aeroquip -10 hose with pyrojacket over the hose because of EJ header location (looked online and it appears the HEL kit just has normal braided lines)
The time is very solid but of course the more power you make the more heat you generate. Once Flex fuel becomes available that will help things a lot too. Ethanol will help lower combustion temps
Stock you likely won’t have these cooling issues. Remember GZ is making like 460+ whp so more power means more heat. Stock guys you should be fine but big horsepower for extended track work on hot days means you need more cooling.
Thanks for showing us this journey. I've got some good ideas that is helpful with my fl5 build. I told myself after building my evo's that I'd never do it again. Now my dumb ass is on ppg website contemplating dropping 7k on anew gears etc. Cars can be worse than drugs lol
These "fake" vents everybody calls em actually serve an aerodynamic purpose to create some downforce up front. Thats why there are these support brackets in there. Its kind of a clever engineering from Honda for a street car. Surely the aerodynamics start to work at 100mph and above. But thats what it is for. I told you get all the crap out in front of the radiator to give it a chance to breathe. But if you need the car for convenience drives with A/C you wont inflate the full potential on track. It will always be a compromise.
For sure… but for me at least that’s kind of the point of my Type R builds was to maximize track limits without overly compromising the street comfort. AC condenser is where I draw the line
With this fake vent exploration, by removing them and installing coolers back there... what you are effectively doing is all the engineering that BMW did on the F8X, which is why there are auxiliary radiators at both those locations, oil cooler and trans cooler at the bottom. Just yank a bumper off an F8X and snap a photo, copy it to the FL5. A 4-cyl is working much harder to do the same thing, so more cooling is always necessary, bonkers that Honda didn't do this. They should just do it, and charge more. People would pay.
While I agree I wish Honda would just do it 97% of people don’t even track their cars so why spend millions more on production costs for less than 3% of your customer base?
The biggest disappointment of SEMA 2024 for me. Tons of CF parts and exterior mods which looks cool but there was absolutely nothing in terms of cooling that was there. I've been watching what other people do. Seem like the solution will be something grass roots
You’re right as it is disappointing but let’s face it. 97% of people are going to track their cars and an even smaller percentage will push the platform hard enough to run into overheating issues so from a company standpoint do you want to aim for the small demographic? Or the large demographic?
Maybe its the design of the engine thats flawed which is Direct Injected. I tracked a rotrex k20 before making over 400whp. Eventually went turbo and made as much as 740whp but tracked with 500whp. No heating issues with a simple mishimoto rad and spal fans upgrade and oil cooler BUT it seems with these type r engines with those upgrades, these engines still overheat... so i believe it just comes down to direct injection. Its garbage. Carbon build up, etc. Garbage.
The direct injection doesn’t help but this motor is in other cars with no cooling overheating issues at all (Reference Ariel Atom, Evasive S2000R) The big difference with the two cars mentioned above is airflow. Ariel Atom the engine sits outside naked to the elements and the S2000 engine bay is long enough to install a proper V mount radiator/intercooler setup. Yes it’s the Engine but it’s also the Engine bay. It’s really meant to house a low HP 1.5L turbo engine. The 2.0 K20C is too much for that engine bay
Gotta love this guy's serious inputs for those of us who are planning to eventually upgrade. He's tested the available "upgrades" while rocking the sickest color and aeros! Seems like you're on to something with replacing the fake air vents. Harness the best of what this platform can do! 💪 Let's go!
Should be an update soon 👊🏽
I had the same issue with cooling on another jdm car I have and thankfully I solved it by not having any added interference in front of the radiator such as that oil cooler.
Yeah some platforms are a little easier to solve for.
If this doesn't cut it... there's a guy on CivicXI that did a deep dive into the cooling loop, and his takeaway was: (i) there were too many unnecessary parallel components; (ii) the turbo is integrated into the loop, which causes massive heat soak.
He stripped out a lot of the parallel "accessory" items from the loop (transmission cooler, etc.), and he removed the turbo from the loop.
Honda includes all those items to ensure everything comes up to temp quickly (since most just drive on the street) and improve emissions.
He's had no issues since, and he experiences very high ambient temps (Brazil, I believe). His feedback was, as long as you take your time letting the car warm up and then cool down, you'll be fine (and the turbo, etc. don't need to be included in the loop). You just need to be patient w. warmup and let the turbo cooldown after heavy usage before shutting the car off.
(We never used to integrate turbos into the cooling loop... you just let them cool off before parking your car... unnecessary source of substantial heat to the loop.)
Bro I’m trying not to spill everything all at once but I’ll put it this way. You’re the FIRST person besides my guy at Doteki Auto Solutions that understand what the REAL problem is 🤣 so 🤫🤫🤫
I'll try to be patient! 😂 Really excited by this vid, though... I have a DE5, and we've got pretty big vents on the sides of our bumpers, but Honda just uses ducts to route it into the wheel well and around the wheel for aero... gonna have to keep an eye on your approach here and rip those ducts out, I think 😂
Hi bro. Do you have the link of the forum discussion for reference. I am seriously interested to work on this.
@@firdausabbasi9468 just follow the coolant lines to your turbo and transmission.
@@firdausabbasi9468 look for Vito.FL5. Dude is really pushing this platform... proprietary tuning, etc.
What about adding a larger cooling fans? Like spal. Removing the factory ones and getting something in that flows more cfm
It’s not going to be one single thing that fixes it but there’s a trick you can use in Hondata to have the fans run at 100% all the time instead of ramping.
I've been saying for some time....that the Twin oil cooler they did in Hong Kong "TR twin oil cooler" resolves alot of the issues. Couple it with a PWR Track radiator and you are good. However I prefer no oil cooler and all radiator. You can put scoops under your body to feed to your pending twin oil cooler.
Oooooh nacaducts ! That’s an idea
If you get a chance, try removing the hood vent rain guard, would like to see if that helps anyhow.
Already removed and that is such a small thing it’s not going to be the make or break
@GridZilla thought it would help with better heat extraction. I guess not. Hoping to track mine next year. Fingers crossed, wishing no overheating. Love the series btw.
@@srivatsanadiger Thanks brotha. Good to see others tracking their Type R’s
With all those extra oil coolers, and secondary rad, one can imagine you certainly wont have any cooling issues then. Def cut out the back of the fender lining where you installing the oil coolers, to allow air to flow into the wheel well for additional brake cooling.
Yeah that’s a given. The air has to go somewhere
Like your videos.
Just curious to know if rear suspension components fk8 would fit in FL5 like shocks spring and control arm
Control arms, sway bars, camber arms yes. Technically the FK8 coilovers “fit” but I don’t recommend you go that route. Get FL5 specific coil overs because there are differences in the rear vs the FK8
A CF or FRP insert that’s open would look good. And cut out a square on the fender liner and put a mesh screen, so air can flow out. I hate the fake vents.
Also - I never use wiper fluid as well! Thought I was the only one.
I now have custom vents for a dual oil cooler set up.
Would be sweet to 3D print a duct or shroud from the bumper opening to the oil cooler for a clean/OEM look also increase efficiency thru the cooler
That is something we’ll look at for sure
Maybe the problem is there is too much in the way before cool air gets to the radiator (AC condensor, oil cooler, inter cooler, parts of the bumper). Maybe a medium sized heater core , say 16"x12" mounted under the tank with a 12V fan and pump pushing hot coolant through through a -8 AN? As soon as you hit 190F, the pump and the fan kicks in. Just a thought.
Not a bad idea but I think there are other more parasitic elements we can address before then.
I’m almost positive if you go back to a stock intercooler you wouldn’t be overheating.
@@kingjimmykingjimmy Honda Race teams haven’t figured it out. Even with a stock intercooler so with all due respect, no, going back to a stock intercooler isn’t the answer. It may help but it isn’t the silver bullet
Stating the obvious here and I know the overheating is annoying, but you are making significantly more power than the car came from factory. Making way more power generates a lot of heat so it's going to make cooling more of an issue. I'd imagine all your cooling mods would keep your engine pretty cool at stock power levels but making 400+ whp is a lot for track work. It does suck having to potentially add more radiators and oil coolers but it's also a small turbocharged engine so there's some natural limitations there unfortunately with heat capacity.
You’re not wrong and obvious contributors are obvious but even at stock power I can overheat this car. Having said that the additional heat exchangers will help but I think there’s a fundamental issue here that I’m already aware of and will be discussing further in the future
@@GridZilla Got it, well I hope it's something that be resolved so you can keep chasing PB's. It's been fun following along on your progress with this car.
@@ZWortek ohh I’ll keep pushing. Thanks for the support!
I would have to agree, but perhaps fabricating through the fake vent areas that you removed to force more air towards the engine. And it seems like with the radiator, intercooler and oil cooler, you are limiting forced air flow to the engine.
@@AutoUpG it’s matter of what will return the greatest amount of cooling. The available cooling through the front without adding more coolers is already maxed out so you have to find space for additional cooling. Even if you in theory take some cooling away from the main radiator (which I doubt) , but the net effect is greater overall cooling the. It’s well worth it.
Thanks for the video. How are you reading your oil temperatures cause the factory gauge is a derived figure and not measured with a actual temp probe. Additionally, get rid of the PRL intercooler and get acuity's intake solution when it's released
Only using the factory gauge as of now but when the warning lights come on and the car is telling me to stop driving because of the heat and it’s pulling tons of power it doesn’t matter if it’s an estimate or not because it’s HOT 🤣. My plan is to switch to the PWR Intercooler once that is released. I like the Acuity intake set up but from what I understand you’ll have to delete the AC condenser for it to fit which is a non starter for me but we’ll see once it’s fully released.
Cant' wait to see your new content sir! Hope everything sorted out!💪
Appreciate it!
I’m sure that this on your radar already Michael but supposedly the recent Honda Performance mods applied to the Acura Type S prototype will also be available in some other form for the FL5 platform as well. I’m specifically referring to the new front clip that houses the dual oil coolers…let alone the other options that reduced the car’s weight by 200lbs. Forgive me if your current oil cooler solution is superior aftermarket wise to Honda’s future option…heard you mention on your one video that testing your new system…results were positive…I just haven’t seen the video showing what your choice was. I’ll find it later…
The HRC Honda race cars use the exact same philosophy applied to my current cooling system 😁 I’ll do a full video break down
Cool! Thanks for the quick response. You’re usually on top of the latest and greatest options CTR wise.👍😁
@@justwingingit1 I try to be. I’m here to push us all forward if I can!
that's where the spoon fl5 endurance car put extra coolers too..
There’s some other tricks they use not prevy to the public but yes they definitely do that
@@GridZilla yeah it seems like they're developing something. But I'm excited what you can come up with maybe entice a company to support your idea and actually make something available for the public!
@@fkhothatchi that’s the idea!
A gentleman with a time attack FK8 swore one of the must-have items for proper cooling was hood vents. My assumption is that it allows the existing cooling to be more efficient with greater airflow through the engine bay.
For sure that’s a must and it’s on the list
Maybe worth considering once you get your oil coolers installed, graft large openings on your bumper cover to expose for maximum airflow, not sure how you feel about cutting both corners of the bumper cover, #becauseRaceCar
I’m ok with it tbh. Trying to get more people interested in the Casale design vents. They made vents for the Spoon race car
Bro I feel you, enhencing overheating issues without breaking factory layout. larger cooler is a must. Hope to see you're the first to solve FL5 overheating on this planet!
👊🏽
i run a setrab 2.5" thick core for the oil cooler on my 06 sti and ive had great luck with it, my other saving grace was the insulated lines to the oil cooler... aeroquip -10 hose with pyrojacket over the hose because of EJ header location (looked online and it appears the HEL kit just has normal braided lines)
Yeah for sure have to go sleeved
@@GridZilla the aeroquip AN hoses alone are rated for 250psi and 300°F continuous temperature before you even run sleeving!
Good progress. Any need to clean up the tune as well? Im sure that played a role
The time is very solid but of course the more power you make the more heat you generate. Once Flex fuel becomes available that will help things a lot too. Ethanol will help lower combustion temps
Stock you likely won’t have these cooling issues. Remember GZ is making like 460+ whp so more power means more heat. Stock guys you should be fine but big horsepower for extended track work on hot days means you need more cooling.
I can and have overheated a stock type r
Thanks for showing us this journey. I've got some good ideas that is helpful with my fl5 build. I told myself after building my evo's that I'd never do it again. Now my dumb ass is on ppg website contemplating dropping 7k on anew gears etc. Cars can be worse than drugs lol
Check out Graffe Gears and thank me later 😉. Call them because their website is tough to navigate. Talk to Andy, tell him I sent you
(786) 264-1706
These "fake" vents everybody calls em actually serve an aerodynamic purpose to create some downforce up front. Thats why there are these support brackets in there. Its kind of a clever engineering from Honda for a street car. Surely the aerodynamics start to work at 100mph and above. But thats what it is for.
I told you get all the crap out in front of the radiator to give it a chance to breathe. But if you need the car for convenience drives with A/C you wont inflate the full potential on track. It will always be a compromise.
For sure… but for me at least that’s kind of the point of my Type R builds was to maximize track limits without overly compromising the street comfort. AC condenser is where I draw the line
Realistically I don’t see how the taking fake vents in front is gonna make more cooling….its barely any air
Just speculation at this point but yes the opening will ultimately need to be larger
Homie, nose hair trimmer. Asap! I’m tired of trying of not trying to focus on it. 👍🏼
🤣 noted
Nose hairs are good it keeps the allergies away.
@@Reptilianoverlord-jc8mt 🤣 I don’t know about that my allergies have been killing new the last week or so
Great content! Very informative. Cheers 🍻
Thank you! 🙏🏽
With this fake vent exploration, by removing them and installing coolers back there... what you are effectively doing is all the engineering that BMW did on the F8X, which is why there are auxiliary radiators at both those locations, oil cooler and trans cooler at the bottom. Just yank a bumper off an F8X and snap a photo, copy it to the FL5. A 4-cyl is working much harder to do the same thing, so more cooling is always necessary, bonkers that Honda didn't do this. They should just do it, and charge more. People would pay.
While I agree I wish Honda would just do it 97% of people don’t even track their cars so why spend millions more on production costs for less than 3% of your customer base?
@@GridZilla Fair point, so I would ask - Why does BMW do it on M3?
@@csboiBMW owners are more likely to track their cars and maybe they overheat on the street without it but don’t know
so pretty much a jason lewis concept.
There will be other elements but the gist of it yeah
Get a hood spacer 😅
I have something better in the works
The biggest disappointment of SEMA 2024 for me. Tons of CF parts and exterior mods which looks cool but there was absolutely nothing in terms of cooling that was there. I've been watching what other people do. Seem like the solution will be something grass roots
You’re right as it is disappointing but let’s face it. 97% of people are going to track their cars and an even smaller percentage will push the platform hard enough to run into overheating issues so from a company standpoint do you want to aim for the small demographic? Or the large demographic?
Maybe its the design of the engine thats flawed which is Direct Injected. I tracked a rotrex k20 before making over 400whp. Eventually went turbo and made as much as 740whp but tracked with 500whp. No heating issues with a simple mishimoto rad and spal fans upgrade and oil cooler BUT it seems with these type r engines with those upgrades, these engines still overheat... so i believe it just comes down to direct injection. Its garbage. Carbon build up, etc. Garbage.
The direct injection doesn’t help but this motor is in other cars with no cooling overheating issues at all (Reference Ariel Atom, Evasive S2000R)
The big difference with the two cars mentioned above is airflow. Ariel Atom the engine sits outside naked to the elements and the S2000 engine bay is long enough to install a proper V mount radiator/intercooler setup.
Yes it’s the Engine but it’s also the Engine bay. It’s really meant to house a low HP 1.5L turbo engine. The 2.0 K20C is too much for that engine bay
The engineers said that those are not fake vents. It is for downforce.
Yeah same for all the “fake” vents in the FK8 but I’m going to repurpose them 😈
First?
👍🏽