Chances of continuing this style of series for MICROshift Centro and LTWOO? Wouldn't mind seeing a shootout of FSA K-Force WE, Shimano Ultegra and the SRAM - Campagnolo equivalents
Nice review guys, and again, kudos for giving these cheaper alternatives a fair shakedown. So on the cassette front, the hybrid aluminium and steel one you have here is pretty decent in my experience, but the aluminium teeth are noticeably thicker, so the indexing at the back needs to be _spot on_ to get decent shifting out out them. Also those nutt brakes are dreadful, especially with the stock pads! I've always maintained that you can get decent braking out of a mechanic disc setup like this, the keys are some decent hybrid hydraulic calipers (JuinTech’s F1’s or Zrace Br-005's come to mind), some decent pads, compressionless housing, and a proper bedding in process. Everyone rags mechanical disc, but when setup well, for everyday riding they are more than capable in my opinion. Anyway keep up the good work gents! 👏👏👏
We need more videos like this! Not everyone is a dentist, not everyone is a weight weenie. This groupset is way better than tiagra/apex and a fraction of the cost.
I'd love to see how this handles 50k miles of riding before saying it's better. Of course, you've very much gotten your money's worth with any of these groups long before that but I've gotten over 50k miles on Apex and that group is still going strong on a friend's bike...probably 75k miles now
@@veganpotterthevegan That's what i was gonna say. May seem like a great idea now, but some components look rather iffy. Like those plastic parts in the brake lever that already have quite a lot of play. It looks like that plastic is gonna snap after not that much use.
I upgraded a 1980's steel road bike to sensah Pro 11 speed. I personally think the shifting performance is up there with the 105 groupset on my tarmac sl6. This groupset has reignited my love for my winter steed
Think its worth mentioning, that Sensah only makes the leavers + front & rear derailleur 🙂🙂 Other parts such as crank and cassette are from various other Chinese manufacturers. Nice review btw. 👍🙂
I purchased the sensah empire pro 2 x 12, with the oversize pulley wheel and the carbon fiber shifters. Amazing performance, I'm more than happy with it. I upgraded my bike with a 12 speed groupset, by a fraction of the cost compared to the new shimano 105 12 speed, the so called "groupset of the people".
Like Trace Velo said, with some key substitutions this can be the basis of a really light and high performance groupset. Obvious places to start would be the brake calipers and crankset. Couple those with an aero wheelset and some good tires and you will have high end feel and speed for a fraction of the price.
totally agree! considering that you can buy this on a lever + fd + rd config, you can simply opt for better cassette, crankset, chain, cables, and caliper. Even then it would still only cost you about half of the better alternatives. If I can have 90% of the bigger brand performance for half the price, I'd take it
Crank and brakes aren't from Sensah who are only making the shifters and derailleurs. This video might give people the wrong impression and steer them away from it. Sensah's parts have existed for years now and people are satisfied with them at a fraction of the cost of the big 3. Also from Aliexpress you could have gotten a better crank and hybrid cable/hydraulic brakes and for a little more $ the end result would have been worlds better.
I put them on my 1980s Nishiki Olympic, (now 2 x 9S), and they're just fine. It weighs 9.74 kg with lights, bottle cage, bell and computer. It's a joy to ride.
Wow. That was such a reasonable, fair review. I particularly liked the way you contextualised the performance and weight at this price point. I thought your suggestions for swapping different parts in was a good one, too. I think I’ll stick with what I have, but it’s good to know that there are all kinds of options.
I've been riding the 11 speed rim brake version for over a year now. Changed the front derailleur for a105 and the brakes for 105. Works really smooth no issues
I've got 12 speed Sensah on my Eddy Meckx San Remo in conjunction with second hand Rotor 3d crankset, (£120) with rim brakes. The advantage to a long throw is more leverage, easy one finger shifting on the hoods....... Now the front derailleur, Ioads of chain drop (Rotor chain wheels) which I couldn't dial out no matter what I did, changed for a Sram rival front and no problems. I have another set for my latest restomod build, a Giant Cadex 980c, the carbon matches the carbon on the frame, I have carbon fsa cranks and chain wheels for this, will see what's its like at the front when built. You are probably aware, L Twoo have just released a 12 speed fully hydraulic groupset for £280 (shifters, derailleurs, brake calipers). I just love your bike build videos.
Well done! For rim brake options I recommend Fouriers! Been running a set for 2 years now. They’re made of CNC’d aluminium and lighter than the Dura Ace set they replaced! As far worrying about not shifting and braking at the same time entering a turn……..🤦♂️ You go boy, I wouldn’t dream of it! Still in all a fair review 👍💕🚴🏼✌️
Hi, Everyone knows that you're sponsored by Shimano and thank you guys for making Sensah so popular via your channel. Bad advertisement doesn't exist 😀 and both videos GCN did about Sensah just gaining Sensah groupset popularity. Well done! I'm sure if you put Shimano 105 mechanical levers with this cable brakes, cassette and the crank, the bike will be heavier and will have the same stopping performance. This is nothing to do with Sensah Empire which is a mechanical groupset, lighter than mechanical Shimano 105, cheaper and 12s. I personally have Ultegra, hydrolic 105, sora and Sensah Empire 2x11. I love Sensah shifting and rim brakes performance. There many happy cyclists using Sensah and many expensive bike builds with it. There many fantastic positive videos about Sensah as well. The most important think is that another Chinese company Ltwoo starts selling road and gravel fully hydrolic groupsets as I mentioned few days ago. Shimano stopped offering mechanical groupsets and shifted to DI2 electronic groupset with very expensive maintenance as spare battery is £130. For this price you can get a whole Sensah groupset. I'm so happy that companies like Sensah and Ltwoo give us cheap and reliable groupsets alternatives and I will be grateful if you keep talking about them. Best regards 😉
Hi folks, finally you come into sense to review some lower range price point brand which some of your viewer able to afford. Kudos to you all and keep reviewing cheaper brands since it will add variety in your videos
I've build an allez sprint rim brake with the empire 11s, used it as second bike but i've done some big ride over 200km and 4000m elevation, it was perfect. Selled it 1 year later at 10€ more than what i've paid it😄
In regards to brake lever positions, the British do things differently with their brake lever setups guys, meaning their front brake lever setup is on the right side and vice versa (reversed front & rear braking NOT shifting). This is why it's impossible for them to up-shift whilst applying full front braking with that type of setup. What do I mean? Well as Alex was saying in the video, he said it's impossible to up-shift his RIGHT lever (rear mech) whilst applying full front braking on that same lever. This is because in the U.K. they reverse their brake lever setups. With North American setups, the front brakes are used on the LEFT lever, freeing up the right lever (which is the rear mech & rear brake lever) so that you can still up-shift quite easily with this setup.
I ride with the 11sp sensah. Knocked over a kilo off the bike. Running the higher spec light weight pr2 crankset though. Made for a great upgrade over the old sora set up.
Heavy rain going down a long steep descent would prob be interesting ,.. As mentioned upgrading to side pull rim brakes would be best route... Long lever throw might get annoying as well on a long ride with constant gear changing.. But otherwise what's not to like for the price.. Needs competition in the market to keep Shimano thinking about what they can charge :).
Campagnolo centaur is still available as a rim brake groupset. 480ish for a complete 11sp system. Reliable and nicely finished components. Sensah is great to revive an old bike frame into winter bike service. I didn't like it all that much because of the lever throw and indeed poor front shifting.
Thanks for the review. I know some don’t like second hand, but I still believe you can’t beat my brilliant Trek, which cost about £400 with some new bits, and is light, carbon and equipped with Ultegra (mechanical, rim brake)
I've used these shifters and i find they are amazing when paired with Shimano ultegra 11 speed derailleurs and cassette, you can pick 11 speed ultegra derailleurs on ebay for £50 for both. That's when the shifters come into their own, because ultegra shifters are silly money second hand.
Super testing...! I like your channel, it´s gorgeous...! What kind of free hubs do you need to mount an Ali Express 12-speed groupset? Is it the same as with the Shimano 12-speed parts?
Disappointed by the video but not surprised from a Shimano sponsored channel. I've been running it for months without issue, yes I upgraded the brakes but you can use fully mechanical brakes perfectly well. It's a £300 groupset, 12 speed with carbon bits, and it works and takes abuse. I could spend more but don't see the point. Saying you have to push the lever too far to change gear sounds like you really struggled to find anything else to complain about. In the real world you don't even notice, and ive never felt the need to brake and change gear in the 30 years I've been riding bikes
Good video Alex. I have a pretty good pension so I don't see myself buying that cheap a group set but, no one never knows what "tomorrow" mite hold for us, so this video showed me just how cheap a cheap group set really can be, tankx. I waited 8 months and spend 350 bucks for a new 10-33 SRAM Red cassette, which by the way shifts way better then the Sram Force cassette it replaced.
I have tried both the Sensah and MicroShift 11 speed setups and although the Sensah setup is lighter and works well enough for the price point, I thought the MicroShift shifting was better especially at the front and on a par with a Shimano mid-range setup using Rim brakes. The MicroShift has a paddle and a second small downshift lever on the hood a bit like the Campag kit. If you are building up a dedicated winter bike or a bike that just sits on your smart trainer and gets sweaty give these options a try!
My old Tiagra shifters are now 10 years old and still work well and have never had a fault. I’m not convinced, seeing those levers flex when you pull on the brake, that they would last as long
Yup. Fitted that 12’er around 2 years ago , think it was just out and beat Shimano to market. Have not problem but did upgrade to a longer carbon large wheel arm. Love it for the price magic.
My rim brake Vitus Vitesse Sensah build with 50mm wheels is the 💣! Currently weighing in at 7.4kg with pedals, cages and computer mount. I have ridden 5,000 miles on mine and think it’s great. The Sensah is my favourite groupset that I have vs GRX 600 and 105 5600. The downshifts are like a gun going off ❤
Hahahah I also have a Rim Brake Vitus Vitesse Evo with Sensah. Grabbed the Vitus frame on sale in summer from Wiggle and built up an Ali xpress build. Got it down to 8KG with a set of Mavic Aksiums. Gonna have to chase that 7.4 kg that you have managed with some nice carbon wheels. Happy riding!
@@statosphereonline2008 me too it’s a lovely frame. I had me Sensah on a 2009 TCR and swapped it over to the Vitus. I currently run Prime RR 50s. I’m looking for a set of tubular Zipp 202s for the hilly days.
Ok so a workable system but perhaps not for high end amateur racers. Seems like a good positive result. Mechanical disk brakes sre greatly improved by better cables but nobody seems to rate the Nutt brakes very highly. I m really pleased that yu have eventualy done a review for this, to be honest its a very long time since 105 was the group set for the people.....
I run the Sensah Empire Pro groupset on a couple bikes. First of all I would never have used that crankser, Senicx makes a beautiful crankset that's $30.00 more than the one you purchased and if you want good braking on a budget get rim brakes, you'll save weight and money. I built a complete Carbon Fiber bike for $1351.00 that weighs 7.7Kg . I did switch the front derailleur for Shimano but that upgrade was less than $40.00.
The ZRace crankset I just received looks just like an older Rotor… with rings and a BB for less than $100 delivered - I doubt it will last as long but hard to beat for the money. I also only paid a little bit more for a used but vgc Ultegra 6800 group set on theBay
My left shifter {front derailleur} has a mid stroke position, if I’m on the big rear sprocket and small front and change to rear mid range a half press sets front cage to a mid position preventing chain rub,then a full press puts chain onto large front ring, or allows use of smallest rear from smallest front.
My brake callipers look different to yours. Mine are cable operated hydraulic callipers. Came with 140 discs front rear but upgraded mine to 160 front.
Mmh ich. Have a Sensah Phi 10x rear shifter and I must say it was really fast setup and works perfect. On the other side the shimano was harder to set it at same shifting. But I use a shimano rear derailleur and not a Sensah. The shifting itself is some think over when you ride shimano before
For the brakes, it might be worth looking into the Catazer HB-100 calipers. They're hybrid hydraulic/cable pull, with a small master cylinder inside the caliper itself. They're a massive upgrade over regular cable disc calipers and can be found for around 40usd for a pair. Also, compressionless brake cable housing helps too... But maybe not as much when there's that much slop in the lever body itself...
Regarding the compressionless housing, it's always the series of springs that come to mind. If the cable housing they picked was easier to compress than the lever, then they might have reached that limit and THEN the lever started flexing (which is still not ideal). If it's the other way around, though, then it could be a pretty big problem. And yes, compressionless housings and hybrid calipers are the way to go.
Senicx cranksets breakdown: PR: 2x PR2 direct mount chainrings DUB axle PR3 direct mount chainrings 24mm axle PR4 bolt-in chainrings 24mm axle GR 1x (all direct mount) GR 2 DUB axle GR 3 24mm axle
Guys, it is highly important that if you are going to give a critical analysis of non-sponsored group sets and other products, that you temper your criticism just as you temper your thoughts on sponsored content. This is essential so that you don't come off as shrills for sponsored bike brands. I see the work you guys do, and you really try and give it to us as straight as you can. And are out for the consumer first. It's a fine line to walk, and it feels as if you walk it as well as one can be expected to do so. But on this one, Alex you should have measured the braking distance so that we could get factual data and not just the personal opinion of a former pro cyclist. I doubt that your standards would be the same as Joe blow cyclist. And an accurate measurement of stopping power elevates anyone claiming any bias on your part. Also, I think the measurement of this groupset in any way with those well-known on this channel is totally unfair. The only question is is this a good value for your money? Do you get good value for $300 bucks?
I disagree with every point you made LOL. Intrinsic in talking about value is comparison to what it’s trying to copy or displace in the market so yes, you compare it to what you get otherwise when you spend money on a group set. In the end this is a cheap product that comes with its compromises and pointing those out is no sin. The shimano stuff they’re sponsored by is a standard in the industry for a reason. If something performs better than it you say so, if something does worse you say so.
I've been quite happy with the sensah 1x12 (empire pro shifters, srx rd, 11-46 cassette, juin r1 brakes, jagwire compressionless housing) on my soma double cross. I like the shifting feel (crispy Sram-esque clicks) and braking performance better than my ultegra r8000 rim brake build on my scott addict. There is the lever flex as mentioned in the video, and the build quality isn't as good as ultegra.
A lot of good information. This sounds hopeful for the non-racer. For example, I never needed better/stronger braking power than a good pair of dialed in rim brakes. I don’t need them to be as strong as hydro-brakes. We might actually be living in a good time for the non-competitive cyclists.
What other budget items should you cover? I think the quality Chinese carbon bike companies should be covered more. Not the risky brands, but the brands that riders seem to have taken too, and generally get good reviews. The companies that have demonstrated good C/S. they deserve your attention. As they already have the cycling communities attention. I see certain brands out there over and over again. The Yoeleo's, Trifox, Elite, and Winspace's of the world ( all UCI approved products) are here in the marketplace, so I would love to here from you guys what you think of these bikes and their performance. I think it's the only space you guys might be late when it comes to cycling, and I think the legacy brands and their growing prices are opening a door for cheaper quality competition. I hope they are noticing the consumers seeking alternative choices because they are priced out or price conscious about bikes and the cost of accessories too.
L-TWOO is coming out with a new hydraulic brake groupset that compares to 105/ultegra for only 170 pounds soon. Hope we can get a 2nd part of this series with that groupset. Also rumors say Sensah is working on an electronic groupset.
@@4knetic723 why does that matter? Just put it on your bike and ride, then you can't see any of the names and bling anyway :) Or paint over the names like we used to in the 90s.
So does everyone with their electronic shifting shift under high load? I figured folks still briefly backed off a bit so as not to grunch their chain and gear teeth.
Thanks GCN! You're starting to "see the light". We had enough of $13K TdF bikes and 3D-printed titanium frames. 99% of your viewers can't afford or dont care enough about that bling to miss their next rent or mortgage payment. We mere mortals care most about best value gear and bang-for-the-buck components from the likes of Sensah and other AE Chinese brands. Keep taking pages from Luke @ Trace Velo and China Cycling. THIS IS THE WAY!
Alex, I noticed you said you don't like old school downtube shifters but one thing I love about Shimano SIS is the fast positive accurate shifts it provides into any gear you choose, as good or better than any electronic system.
My biggest emergency braking moment came from a deer running in front of me. I was going downhill at about 40mph at the time. I ended up locking my rear, resulting in myself having to catch my balance in a slide. I ended up pulling over at the next opportunity to collect myself after almost crashing twice in 5-10 seconds at high speed.
A fair review but I think you missed a few points. You'd need to buy a few of them at a time to make sure you've got compatibility when you prang it or wear it out especially when it's 12 speed due to the aftermarket pricing. People that use their bike a lot would be far wiser to get a Claris or Sora groupset. Can you replace individual parts on this? EG; Prang a rear mech or lever, is it a whole new groupset?
Amazing fact- the shimano sora levers have comparable flexibility to sensah levers. I didn' check higer tier shimano levers, but i guess they are flexible too
Honestly, the amount of flex in the Sensah levers surprised me - so I tried the same thing with my Sora levers right after seeing this video. While there is a bit of movement, there's not half as much flex as the Sensah levers.
Shimano's marketing strategy is showing.... Their groupset price points have gone up substantially and it's leaving a gap in the market. 105 is no longer the 'Groupset of the People'. Shimano are banking on Tiagra filling that role in the future and we can expect to see an extensive revamp to 4700. In the meantime, companies like Sensah are filling that gap, and if Shimano does not act fast, they may find the door closed on them - as consumers are looking for the value that 105 used to bring. Creating doubt about the value of Sensah and other Chinese groupsets is a way to delay that. The Sensah stuff is pretty good - though I agree with you that the front derailleur is indeed a bit 'naff'. Otherwise, it does the job well, and represents great value where there is now, a gap. Sensah's weakness is that they are dependent on cable shifting - but even so, an upgrade to semi hydraulic calipers like Juin (or now ZTTO) can deliver better braking (within the context of cable actuated disc brakes) - though it does mean spending a bit more. The real danger to Shimano is when Sensah and others start to deliver on hydraulic braking - as LTwo has just done. Personally, I'm a big Shimano fan, but they need to quickly get on with the job of delivering value at the lower-mid end of the market fast....or Sensah et al will eat their lunch.
Shimano can go pound sand. In fact, they should. They introduced the Di2 105, which probably nobody asked for, just to justify yet another price hike, as if there weren't already two lineups with Di2. Now there's three, equally unaffordable. Add to that the fact that electronic shifting is actually cheaper to manufacture than mechanical, yet it's exponentially more expensive, and you get a clearer picture about Shimano.
I just put the 11 speed sensah pro on my cafe racer. I went 1x so no opinion of the FD. The chain was garbage and the cassette was meh. With that said the shifters and RD work great. I replaced the chain with an ultegra chain and the cassette with a 105 cassette and quite honestly it shifts better than my full ultegra does at the back. The rim braking is also very good. Im a big guy and am able to power slide with them. Just my experience.
I guess the big question is how does it perform long-term? I have the Sram Apex 1x11 on my bike and I can squeeze 6-7000 km out of the cassette, 1500-2000 km out of the chain and 10.000 km the chain ring before having any issues. The Sram Apex mechanical groupset cost around 600 eur with the TRP HY-RD brakes. Does anyone have any experience with the L-two or Sensah groupsets for 10000 km or more?
![Lp. Последняя Реальность #107 РОДНОЙ ДОМ [Финал] • Майнкрафт](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/IK3QKzKUlHM/mqdefault.jpg)
What other budget bike tech would you like to see us feature on the channel? 👇
cheers! I think it would be nice to see a review on that 'Ride Now' cheap TPU inner tubes from aliexpress as well.
Chances of continuing this style of series for MICROshift Centro and LTWOO?
Wouldn't mind seeing a shootout of FSA K-Force WE, Shimano Ultegra and the SRAM - Campagnolo equivalents
LT-WOO just dropped a full Hydro system, that might be worth a look.
A bottom bracket showdown.
definetly the brand new L-TWOO hydraulic 2x12 for around 320£ or so
Nice review guys, and again, kudos for giving these cheaper alternatives a fair shakedown. So on the cassette front, the hybrid aluminium and steel one you have here is pretty decent in my experience, but the aluminium teeth are noticeably thicker, so the indexing at the back needs to be _spot on_ to get decent shifting out out them. Also those nutt brakes are dreadful, especially with the stock pads! I've always maintained that you can get decent braking out of a mechanic disc setup like this, the keys are some decent hybrid hydraulic calipers (JuinTech’s F1’s or Zrace Br-005's come to mind), some decent pads, compressionless housing, and a proper bedding in process. Everyone rags mechanical disc, but when setup well, for everyday riding they are more than capable in my opinion. Anyway keep up the good work gents! 👏👏👏
Started a trend Luke
The Master has spoken 👌
🥖🥖🥖🥖🥖
The goat 🥖🥖🥖🥖
🥖
We need more videos like this! Not everyone is a dentist, not everyone is a weight weenie. This groupset is way better than tiagra/apex and a fraction of the cost.
Just follow tracevelo, see comment above.
I'd love to see how this handles 50k miles of riding before saying it's better. Of course, you've very much gotten your money's worth with any of these groups long before that but I've gotten over 50k miles on Apex and that group is still going strong on a friend's bike...probably 75k miles now
@@veganpotterthevegan That's what i was gonna say. May seem like a great idea now, but some components look rather iffy. Like those plastic parts in the brake lever that already have quite a lot of play. It looks like that plastic is gonna snap after not that much use.
Apex is so much better.
I upgraded a 1980's steel road bike to sensah Pro 11 speed. I personally think the shifting performance is up there with the 105 groupset on my tarmac sl6. This groupset has reignited my love for my winter steed
Agreed, the coverage of the Sensah front mech's performance ("laggy under load", etc.) reminds me of the performance of 105 on my older Allez.
Exactly what I was thinking of doing to an old Masi framset. Build it w affordable new.
@@hoser7706 you won’t regret it, I bought the sensah pro with a metal sti levers and it had been great. Groupset minus the crank was £130
@@iaintrotter455 excellent, thank you!
I'm about to start this process with an 80's Italian frame
I recently went from 9 speed Sora to 11 speed Sensah and noticed a nice improvement in shifting performance. Plus it saved a chunk on weight.
I'm tempted to go down a similar route to replace old style DuraAce levers and faulty rear mech for a fraction of the price of new DuraAce.
Think its worth mentioning, that Sensah only makes the leavers + front & rear derailleur 🙂🙂 Other parts such as crank and cassette are from various other Chinese manufacturers. Nice review btw. 👍🙂
I purchased the sensah empire pro 2 x 12, with the oversize pulley wheel and the carbon fiber shifters. Amazing performance, I'm more than happy with it.
I upgraded my bike with a 12 speed groupset, by a fraction of the cost compared to the new shimano 105 12 speed, the so called "groupset of the people".
Like Trace Velo said, with some key substitutions this can be the basis of a really light and high performance groupset. Obvious places to start would be the brake calipers and crankset. Couple those with an aero wheelset and some good tires and you will have high end feel and speed for a fraction of the price.
Yeah absolutely! This is basically the perfect use case for a groupset like this!!!
totally agree! considering that you can buy this on a lever + fd + rd config, you can simply opt for better cassette, crankset, chain, cables, and caliper. Even then it would still only cost you about half of the better alternatives. If I can have 90% of the bigger brand performance for half the price, I'd take it
Crank and brakes aren't from Sensah who are only making the shifters and derailleurs. This video might give people the wrong impression and steer them away from it. Sensah's parts have existed for years now and people are satisfied with them at a fraction of the cost of the big 3.
Also from Aliexpress you could have gotten a better crank and hybrid cable/hydraulic brakes and for a little more $ the end result would have been worlds better.
I ride on Sensah Ignite Shifters - love them! Also love that you guys are covering more affordable builds
I put them on my 1980s Nishiki Olympic, (now 2 x 9S), and they're just fine. It weighs 9.74 kg with lights, bottle cage, bell and computer. It's a joy to ride.
L-Twoo (who makes groupsets in this price point also) just released a hydraulic road and gravel groupset.
Wow. That was such a reasonable, fair review. I particularly liked the way you contextualised the performance and weight at this price point. I thought your suggestions for swapping different parts in was a good one, too. I think I’ll stick with what I have, but it’s good to know that there are all kinds of options.
The shifting is almost identical to Shimano Ultegra mechanical. Further proof of my belief that we are all being fleeced.
Great video! I also love that you guys are covering stuff like this. Everyone loves some options.
Welcome to the dark side. 🙌 The most difficult question regarding these components is what to do with all the money you save.
I thought cheaper, more affordable but same or better quality components are on the bright side...
go for an epic ride across china?!
sifu
A nice lunch or dinner would always be welcomed
I've been riding the 11 speed rim brake version for over a year now. Changed the front derailleur for a105 and the brakes for 105. Works really smooth no issues
The video I was waiting for! 🙏
Looks like a great groupset for the 99%! Thanks for highlighting an option for us mere mortals out here 👍
I've got 12 speed Sensah on my Eddy Meckx San Remo in conjunction with second hand Rotor 3d crankset, (£120) with rim brakes. The advantage to a long throw is more leverage, easy one finger shifting on the hoods....... Now the front derailleur, Ioads of chain drop (Rotor chain wheels) which I couldn't dial out no matter what I did, changed for a Sram rival front and no problems.
I have another set for my latest restomod build, a Giant Cadex 980c, the carbon matches the carbon on the frame, I have carbon fsa cranks and chain wheels for this, will see what's its like at the front when built.
You are probably aware, L Twoo have just released a 12 speed fully hydraulic groupset for £280 (shifters, derailleurs, brake calipers).
I just love your bike build videos.
Well done!
For rim brake options I recommend Fouriers! Been running a set for 2 years now. They’re made of CNC’d aluminium and lighter than the Dura Ace set they replaced!
As far worrying about not shifting and braking at the same time entering a turn……..🤦♂️ You go boy, I wouldn’t dream of it! Still in all a fair review 👍💕🚴🏼✌️
Hi, Everyone knows that you're sponsored by Shimano and thank you guys for making Sensah so popular via your channel. Bad advertisement doesn't exist 😀 and both videos GCN did about Sensah just gaining Sensah groupset popularity. Well done!
I'm sure if you put Shimano 105 mechanical levers with this cable brakes, cassette and the crank, the bike will be heavier and will have the same stopping performance. This is nothing to do with Sensah Empire which is a mechanical groupset, lighter than mechanical Shimano 105, cheaper and 12s.
I personally have Ultegra, hydrolic 105, sora and Sensah Empire 2x11.
I love Sensah shifting and rim brakes performance. There many happy cyclists using Sensah and many expensive bike builds with it.
There many fantastic positive videos about Sensah as well. The most important think is that another Chinese company Ltwoo starts selling road and gravel fully hydrolic groupsets as I mentioned few days ago. Shimano stopped offering mechanical groupsets and shifted to DI2 electronic groupset with very expensive maintenance as spare battery is £130. For this price you can get a whole Sensah groupset.
I'm so happy that companies like Sensah and Ltwoo give us cheap and reliable groupsets alternatives and I will be grateful if you keep talking about them. Best regards 😉
Agree
There are many unknown treasures to be found in AliExpress. I am very glad you tried this one out.
Really nice review. I am building the 1x11 carbon one now. That group has no crank or brakes, so mostly the stronger points of this group, it seems.
When I started racing in the mid 90s I switched from 105 to Dura Ace...it was the shorter throw...that made the difference. The winning difference.
Very nice review GCN, nice to see some affordable components in this age of $10K+ bikes!
You should check out the new Ltwoo groupset next. It is a mechanical groupset with hydraulic disc brakes.
I'm so hyped for that.
I think that will be the game changer.
Hi folks, finally you come into sense to review some lower range price point brand which some of your viewer able to afford. Kudos to you all and keep reviewing cheaper brands since it will add variety in your videos
I've build an allez sprint rim brake with the empire 11s, used it as second bike but i've done some big ride over 200km and 4000m elevation, it was perfect. Selled it 1 year later at 10€ more than what i've paid it😄
Enjoyed this vid crew!
In regards to brake lever positions, the British do things differently with their brake lever setups guys, meaning their front brake lever setup is on the right side and vice versa (reversed front & rear braking NOT shifting). This is why it's impossible for them to up-shift whilst applying full front braking with that type of setup. What do I mean? Well as Alex was saying in the video, he said it's impossible to up-shift his RIGHT lever (rear mech) whilst applying full front braking on that same lever. This is because in the U.K. they reverse their brake lever setups. With North American setups, the front brakes are used on the LEFT lever, freeing up the right lever (which is the rear mech & rear brake lever) so that you can still up-shift quite easily with this setup.
Ltwoo just launched a hydraulic road groupset, i hope you guys can review those
I ride with the 11sp sensah. Knocked over a kilo off the bike. Running the higher spec light weight pr2 crankset though. Made for a great upgrade over the old sora set up.
Wahooo! Can’t wait for this….
This is the way guys. Thank you!
I had a gravel bike that I built up with their one by shifter and mech set, it was fantastic.
I’ve got older Claris (2015) with cable discs. This seems like the perfect upgrade.
Heavy rain going down a long steep descent would prob be interesting ,.. As mentioned upgrading to side pull rim brakes would be best route... Long lever throw might get annoying as well on a long ride with constant gear changing.. But otherwise what's not to like for the price.. Needs competition in the market to keep Shimano thinking about what they can charge :).
Trace Velo gives a more in-depth and critical review …
Campagnolo centaur is still available as a rim brake groupset. 480ish for a complete 11sp system. Reliable and nicely finished components.
Sensah is great to revive an old bike frame into winter bike service. I didn't like it all that much because of the lever throw and indeed poor front shifting.
I put Sensah 9 speed shifters on my old Ultegra 6500 9 speed bike and I really like them, definitely the best performance / price option out there!
Rick I have 2 bikes , both 20 years old and I still use Ultegra 6500 9 speed, faultless in performance.
I replaced the buggy 105 - 5600 shifters of the sense model (PHI). By the second day, I got used to it. Pleases with pleasant and accurate work.
Thanks for the review. I know some don’t like second hand, but I still believe you can’t beat my brilliant Trek, which cost about £400 with some new bits, and is light, carbon and equipped with Ultegra (mechanical, rim brake)
Great review……. In depth and honest! Can you do some carbon wheels from Ali Express/ china now next 🤔😀🤞🏻
I've used these shifters and i find they are amazing when paired with Shimano ultegra 11 speed derailleurs and cassette, you can pick 11 speed ultegra derailleurs on ebay for £50 for both. That's when the shifters come into their own, because ultegra shifters are silly money second hand.
wait a sec, so you can run 12 speed sensah shifter with ultegra 11 speed? 11 or 12 speed setup?
@@Fauz11ukman They do the carbon shifters in 11 and 12 speed. The Team groupset is shimano compatible, the Empire one is SRAM compatible.
@@markdurdle7710 with 11 speed version i already know, because this video about 12 speed version, i wanna know that mix with 11 speed or 12 speed
@@Fauz11ukman Other people on youtube have tried it and it kind of works. Shifting isn't as good though.
Super testing...! I like your channel, it´s gorgeous...! What kind of free hubs do you need to mount an Ali Express 12-speed groupset? Is it the same as with the Shimano 12-speed parts?
Currently using Sensah Ignite (9 speed groupset). Might consider upgrading honestly
Disappointed by the video but not surprised from a Shimano sponsored channel. I've been running it for months without issue, yes I upgraded the brakes but you can use fully mechanical brakes perfectly well. It's a £300 groupset, 12 speed with carbon bits, and it works and takes abuse. I could spend more but don't see the point. Saying you have to push the lever too far to change gear sounds like you really struggled to find anything else to complain about. In the real world you don't even notice, and ive never felt the need to brake and change gear in the 30 years I've been riding bikes
Good video Alex. I have a pretty good pension so I don't see myself buying that cheap a group set but, no one never knows what "tomorrow" mite hold for us, so this video showed me just how cheap a cheap group set really can be, tankx. I waited 8 months and spend 350 bucks for a new 10-33 SRAM Red cassette, which by the way shifts way better then the Sram Force cassette it replaced.
I have tried both the Sensah and MicroShift 11 speed setups and although the Sensah setup is lighter and works well enough for the price point, I thought the MicroShift shifting was better especially at the front and on a par with a Shimano mid-range setup using Rim brakes. The MicroShift has a paddle and a second small downshift lever on the hood a bit like the Campag kit. If you are building up a dedicated winter bike or a bike that just sits on your smart trainer and gets sweaty give these options a try!
I've only ridden Microshift a few times and while I do think the shifting is solid, I'm not a fan of the feel of shifting with it.
My old Tiagra shifters are now 10 years old and still work well and have never had a fault. I’m not convinced, seeing those levers flex when you pull on the brake, that they would last as long
GCN finally made a video someone like me would actually try 😀
This is a nice group set, but I have the better version, high value, low price, 😊
The Empire Strikes back: Shimano Shivers, hearing of the approaching Electronic Groupset from Sensah!
I hope that sensah and the other companies make high end material and no elektronic gimmicks !!
Yup. Fitted that 12’er around 2 years ago , think it was just out and beat Shimano to market. Have not problem but did upgrade to a longer carbon large wheel arm. Love it for the price magic.
My rim brake Vitus Vitesse Sensah build with 50mm wheels is the 💣! Currently weighing in at 7.4kg with pedals, cages and computer mount. I have ridden 5,000 miles on mine and think it’s great. The Sensah is my favourite groupset that I have vs GRX 600 and 105 5600. The downshifts are like a gun going off ❤
Hahahah I also have a Rim Brake Vitus Vitesse Evo with Sensah. Grabbed the Vitus frame on sale in summer from Wiggle and built up an Ali xpress build. Got it down to 8KG with a set of Mavic Aksiums. Gonna have to chase that 7.4 kg that you have managed with some nice carbon wheels.
Happy riding!
@@statosphereonline2008 me too it’s a lovely frame. I had me Sensah on a 2009 TCR and swapped it over to the Vitus. I currently run Prime RR 50s. I’m looking for a set of tubular Zipp 202s for the hilly days.
@@gilesbenbow ahhh yes those amazing prime rims..gotta grave me some off those, too!
Cool video now let's see some more cheap bike challenges
Quick tip: just upgrade to shimano front mech and 12 speed cassette, with juin cable actuated hydraulic brakes, this groupset will be on another level
Ok so a workable system but perhaps not for high end amateur racers. Seems like a good positive result. Mechanical disk brakes sre greatly improved by better cables but nobody seems to rate the Nutt brakes very highly. I m really pleased that yu have eventualy done a review for this, to be honest its a very long time since 105 was the group set for the people.....
I run the Sensah Empire Pro groupset on a couple bikes. First of all I would never have used that crankser, Senicx makes a beautiful crankset that's $30.00 more than the one you purchased and if you want good braking on a budget get rim brakes, you'll save weight and money. I built a complete Carbon Fiber bike for $1351.00 that weighs 7.7Kg . I did switch the front derailleur for Shimano but that upgrade was less than $40.00.
Hope you will review Chinese trigger shifters and brake levers for flat or alt bar setup, rim brakes too.
For a 2x11 road rim brake bike project, which groupset would you choose? Sensah Empire or Ltwoo R9? I'd be using either with Shimano or Sram brakes
I think its great to see these budget alternatives! It seems ironic that some of the cheapest hydraullic MTB disc brakes are made by Shimano.
The ZRace crankset I just received looks just like an older Rotor… with rings and a BB for less than $100 delivered - I doubt it will last as long but hard to beat for the money.
I also only paid a little bit more for a used but vgc Ultegra 6800 group set on theBay
My left shifter {front derailleur} has a mid stroke position, if I’m on the big rear sprocket and small front and change to rear mid range a half press sets front cage to a mid position preventing chain rub,then a full press puts chain onto large front ring, or allows use of smallest rear from smallest front.
My brake callipers look different to yours. Mine are cable operated hydraulic callipers. Came with 140 discs front rear but upgraded mine to 160 front.
How 's the crankset holding up? I've read reviews that the cranks's chainring bolts tend to get loose overtime. Is it true?
I used a Chinese groupset from Ali Express, on my gravel bike build , it isn’t as smooth as shimano but gets the job done
Mmh ich. Have a Sensah Phi 10x rear shifter and I must say it was really fast setup and works perfect. On the other side the shimano was harder to set it at same shifting.
But I use a shimano rear derailleur and not a Sensah.
The shifting itself is some think over when you ride shimano before
For the brakes, it might be worth looking into the Catazer HB-100 calipers. They're hybrid hydraulic/cable pull, with a small master cylinder inside the caliper itself. They're a massive upgrade over regular cable disc calipers and can be found for around 40usd for a pair.
Also, compressionless brake cable housing helps too... But maybe not as much when there's that much slop in the lever body itself...
Regarding the compressionless housing, it's always the series of springs that come to mind. If the cable housing they picked was easier to compress than the lever, then they might have reached that limit and THEN the lever started flexing (which is still not ideal). If it's the other way around, though, then it could be a pretty big problem. And yes, compressionless housings and hybrid calipers are the way to go.
What brake pads fit? Finding replacements for consumables can be a pain.
The weird shifting throw is because of the 100+ of pattents from the big 3.
Isn’t this groupset from China though? They don’t tend to care too much about patents and IP.
@@rob-c. but some of them do. Thats why they try to circumvent the patents.
Harry Mac racing quite successfuly on Elves frame and sensah groupset.
So what you're saying is if I swapped to this from my Shimano DuraAce 9150 I might notice the difference?
Yeah waiting to see that shimano 105 di2 componets put onto this build, crank, chain, casset and a better wheelset
Senicx cranksets breakdown:
PR: 2x
PR2 direct mount chainrings DUB axle
PR3 direct mount chainrings 24mm axle
PR4 bolt-in chainrings 24mm axle
GR 1x (all direct mount)
GR 2 DUB axle
GR 3 24mm axle
Looks a quick bike
Guys, it is highly important that if you are going to give a critical analysis of non-sponsored group sets and other products, that you temper your criticism just as you temper your thoughts on sponsored content. This is essential so that you don't come off as shrills for sponsored bike brands. I see the work you guys do, and you really try and give it to us as straight as you can. And are out for the consumer first. It's a fine line to walk, and it feels as if you walk it as well as one can be expected to do so.
But on this one, Alex you should have measured the braking distance so that we could get factual data and not just the personal opinion of a former pro cyclist. I doubt that your standards would be the same as Joe blow cyclist. And an accurate measurement of stopping power elevates anyone claiming any bias on your part. Also, I think the measurement of this groupset in any way with those well-known on this channel is totally unfair. The only question is is this a good value for your money? Do you get good value for $300 bucks?
I disagree with every point you made LOL. Intrinsic in talking about value is comparison to what it’s trying to copy or displace in the market so yes, you compare it to what you get otherwise when you spend money on a group set. In the end this is a cheap product that comes with its compromises and pointing those out is no sin. The shimano stuff they’re sponsored by is a standard in the industry for a reason. If something performs better than it you say so, if something does worse you say so.
I've been quite happy with the sensah 1x12 (empire pro shifters, srx rd, 11-46 cassette, juin r1 brakes, jagwire compressionless housing) on my soma double cross. I like the shifting feel (crispy Sram-esque clicks) and braking performance better than my ultegra r8000 rim brake build on my scott addict. There is the lever flex as mentioned in the video, and the build quality isn't as good as ultegra.
A lot of good information. This sounds hopeful for the non-racer. For example, I never needed better/stronger braking power than a good pair of dialed in rim brakes. I don’t need them to be as strong as hydro-brakes.
We might actually be living in a good time for the non-competitive cyclists.
What other budget items should you cover? I think the quality Chinese carbon bike companies should be covered more. Not the risky brands, but the brands that riders seem to have taken too, and generally get good reviews. The companies that have demonstrated good C/S. they deserve your attention. As they already have the cycling communities attention. I see certain brands out there over and over again. The Yoeleo's, Trifox, Elite, and Winspace's of the world ( all UCI approved products) are here in the marketplace, so I would love to here from you guys what you think of these bikes and their performance. I think it's the only space you guys might be late when it comes to cycling, and I think the legacy brands and their growing prices are opening a door for cheaper quality competition. I hope they are noticing the consumers seeking alternative choices because they are priced out or price conscious about bikes and the cost of accessories too.
L-TWOO is coming out with a new hydraulic brake groupset that compares to 105/ultegra for only 170 pounds soon. Hope we can get a 2nd part of this series with that groupset. Also rumors say Sensah is working on an electronic groupset.
I genuinely hate that name with every bit of my soul.
why do chinese brands always have to choose such stupid and goofy names?
@@4knetic723 why does that matter? Just put it on your bike and ride, then you can't see any of the names and bling anyway :) Or paint over the names like we used to in the 90s.
@@4knetic723 Because the name was originally in Chinese. Just saying, Bianchi means toilet in Chinese but no one complains😄
So does everyone with their electronic shifting shift under high load? I figured folks still briefly backed off a bit so as not to grunch their chain and gear teeth.
Finally a budget review that isn't a joke crap review
Thanks GCN! You're starting to "see the light". We had enough of $13K TdF bikes and 3D-printed titanium frames. 99% of your viewers can't afford or dont care enough about that bling to miss their next rent or mortgage payment. We mere mortals care most about best value gear and bang-for-the-buck components from the likes of Sensah and other AE Chinese brands. Keep taking pages from Luke @ Trace Velo and China Cycling. THIS IS THE WAY!
Alex, I noticed you said you don't like old school downtube shifters but one thing I love about Shimano SIS is the fast positive accurate shifts it provides into any gear you choose, as good or better than any electronic system.
My biggest emergency braking moment came from a deer running in front of me. I was going downhill at about 40mph at the time. I ended up locking my rear, resulting in myself having to catch my balance in a slide. I ended up pulling over at the next opportunity to collect myself after almost crashing twice in 5-10 seconds at high speed.
Please also review the new L-Twoo R Series
A fair review but I think you missed a few points. You'd need to buy a few of them at a time to make sure you've got compatibility when you prang it or wear it out especially when it's 12 speed due to the aftermarket pricing. People that use their bike a lot would be far wiser to get a Claris or Sora groupset. Can you replace individual parts on this? EG; Prang a rear mech or lever, is it a whole new groupset?
Ltwoo now have a 12 speed hydraulic groupset for 300 quid 😁 good bye 105 🤣🤣🤣
Can you get spares if the groupset wears out?
Maybe shifters, front and rear mech for winter hack! Keep them cheap and replace, at that price!
Amazing fact- the shimano sora levers have comparable flexibility to sensah levers. I didn' check higer tier shimano levers, but i guess they are flexible too
Honestly, the amount of flex in the Sensah levers surprised me - so I tried the same thing with my Sora levers right after seeing this video. While there is a bit of movement, there's not half as much flex as the Sensah levers.
Ltwoo have just released a fully hydraulic 11 and 12 speed for under £200
not me pressing the notification too fast lol
Can anyone tell me what parts needed to upgrade to make this bike better? Thnks😊
Shimano's marketing strategy is showing.... Their groupset price points have gone up substantially and it's leaving a gap in the market. 105 is no longer the 'Groupset of the People'. Shimano are banking on Tiagra filling that role in the future and we can expect to see an extensive revamp to 4700. In the meantime, companies like Sensah are filling that gap, and if Shimano does not act fast, they may find the door closed on them - as consumers are looking for the value that 105 used to bring. Creating doubt about the value of Sensah and other Chinese groupsets is a way to delay that. The Sensah stuff is pretty good - though I agree with you that the front derailleur is indeed a bit 'naff'. Otherwise, it does the job well, and represents great value where there is now, a gap. Sensah's weakness is that they are dependent on cable shifting - but even so, an upgrade to semi hydraulic calipers like Juin (or now ZTTO) can deliver better braking (within the context of cable actuated disc brakes) - though it does mean spending a bit more. The real danger to Shimano is when Sensah and others start to deliver on hydraulic braking - as LTwo has just done. Personally, I'm a big Shimano fan, but they need to quickly get on with the job of delivering value at the lower-mid end of the market fast....or Sensah et al will eat their lunch.
Shimano can go pound sand. In fact, they should. They introduced the Di2 105, which probably nobody asked for, just to justify yet another price hike, as if there weren't already two lineups with Di2. Now there's three, equally unaffordable. Add to that the fact that electronic shifting is actually cheaper to manufacture than mechanical, yet it's exponentially more expensive, and you get a clearer picture about Shimano.
I just put the 11 speed sensah pro on my cafe racer. I went 1x so no opinion of the FD. The chain was garbage and the cassette was meh. With that said the shifters and RD work great. I replaced the chain with an ultegra chain and the cassette with a 105 cassette and quite honestly it shifts better than my full ultegra does at the back. The rim braking is also very good. Im a big guy and am able to power slide with them. Just my experience.
Can you test the sensah's groupset for gravel?
I guess the big question is how does it perform long-term? I have the Sram Apex 1x11 on my bike and I can squeeze 6-7000 km out of the cassette, 1500-2000 km out of the chain and 10.000 km the chain ring before having any issues. The Sram Apex mechanical groupset cost around 600 eur with the TRP HY-RD brakes. Does anyone have any experience with the L-two or Sensah groupsets for 10000 km or more?
Those flexing brake hoods might crack one day.