I use a clip on drum mic live on my 5 string and have installed a noiseless P90 pickup in my 6 string banjo. I put that through a DI and straight to the desk. Sounds great!
I really enjoyed this video, thanks for taking the time to talk through the different Mic options. Also enjoyed the relaxed and informal nature to it....easier to take in the info. :D I play banjo in a band most weekends often with minimal space so feedback (when we need to be loud) can be an issue interns of my proximity to the FOH. Therefore we use EIM as there is no need to add fuel to that fire so to speak. From your video I was drawn to the Audio Technica Pro 70 option as a mic offers so much more than a transducer/ pickup in my opinion....as you explained we don't hear the banjo like that so it would need some manipulation (roll off the low end). I've just bought a Gold Tone CC 50 RP which has a closed back ...Id like to use the Audio Technica Pro 70 option but have no idea how that will impact the sound. My instincts tell me there will be more low end as it can't really escape due to the closed back. With that info, whats your thoughts? lastly what do you think of transducers like the K&K Banjo Twin for example? Thank you in advance, really appreciate any insight. :)
Hey mate Interesting you bring this up. I just joined a fairly loud blues/country band, where they want me to occasionally play banjo. With an easy 100db level (including bass and drums), there’s no way a mic, whether out front, or my AT Pro70 rig, would cut it. K&K mini would be superior, even if you’re loosing the tone of the banjo. When I had a K&K dual mini on my first Deering, I would always run it through a Boss EQ7 pedal, both to boost level (passive transducer), and shape the tone to be closer to what it is acoustically. I suspect if you use something higher end, like an LR Baggs DI with EQ, you could get further. Maybe I’ll get one installed on my 6 string banjo and do a follow up vid? Otherwise, let me know how you go
You bet! I’m in the process of buying one today! In large part to your video. Its gorgeous and in almost like new condition. I’d send you some pics if I could.
I got it today and I believe its a 2015 or 2016 model according to Donald Zepp. It has the 3 piece neck, ebony fingerboard and overlays like yours and looks identical except for the color of the rim cap which is a darker color. Serial number 2984. Sounds awesome too. Also its in mint shape, not a mark on it, as is the brown bump case. So lucky to have found it.
Great video!! Thanks for the info. Do you think the Pro-70 would sound decent in a resonator banjo for a small band situation? I tried a Gold tone ABS banjo mic today. I clips to the outside and bends over the head, but had a lot of feedback probs, even at low volume without a band. I'd bought a Gold Tone SMP + ( magnetic / wound coil pickup that attaches to the rod inside ) but it just does NOT sound like a banjo anymore. PS: Great to come across a fellow Aussie banjo Player. Not many of us around.
Hey mate There’s a few of us around :) For a resonator you could try a K&K under bridge style transducer. You get more of that piezo ‘thwack’ at the front of the note but they’re pretty great at feedback suppression (much better than an internal mic).
Nice. For recording i use often drums tom microphone (with fantom alim )Do you try kna piézzo ? I try one in m'y tenor and sound good. For my 5 strings i gor a Myers and thats good too. If someone got other experience about piezzo ?
Great video! I play clawhammer and was looking to increase volume if playing outside so I got the Shure SM57 mic and hooked it to a LD amp. Just was curious best position to place mic? Front of pot? To the side? Under the neck? Also if ok to use a wind screen on the mic?
Hey mate I’m sure there’s some difference where you point it but assuming the rim rings fairly evenly I don’t think it makes a difference (like the bout on guitars do).
The guy you saw live, did he have a resonator on the back of his banjo? It seems like your shirt may be absorbing some of the frequencies and the AT Pro 70 might sound even better if you install it inside of a banjo with a resonator on the back? Have you tried this at all. I appreciate you.
Hey mate He played an open back, like me. I agree with the absorption - puffer jacket may not be the best for a mic shootout. I used to own a Deering Goodtime open back that had a clip on resonator - that was a little louder. Most clawhammer players use an open back banjo for the sound, rather than closed back for the volume.
I was surprised at how pleasant the AT Pro 70 inside the instrument was. What feedback issues have you encountered with it? I also remember Chris Ludecke's sound - it was good. Is that all he used, can you recall, or did he carry any gadgets of any sort too?
G'day Bruce. There are issues having the Pro 70 inside the pot, especially if using foldback. Obviously, not much shielding in between a condenser mic pointing right at a speaker! If I recall correctly, Chris said he ran no/low foldback on that mic. I do the same, especially as most gigs I do I'm in very confined spaces, almost on top of the foldback wedges. However, I've discovered you can put enough through them to get a reference before any serious feedback probs. Re: Chris' setup - on one stage I saw him play he may have had an instrument mic (57, condenser?), micing from the front, as well. On the smaller one, it seemed like it would have just been internally mic'd. Keep in mind, his setup has probably changed over the years too!
For what it's worth and for both of you, I just saw Chris play yesterday and he said he was using (and had long used) an Audio-Technica PRO 35, which seems to be a clip-on and small condensor mic but not quite as mini and lavalier-like as the Pro 70. To my ear the banjo sounded fabulous and very naturalistic. The fact Chris always seems to play solo and likely needs almost no monitoring helps him avoid any feedback trouble, I suspect. Just hearing himself acoustically would be enough, I imagine, having sung and played banjo from the same stage (albeit crammed with far fewer people!). Chris mentioned the thin wire cable can break down during heavy gigging, but he felt the mic was such a reasonable price and so readily available and worked so well with his banjo that it was still the best choice for him. (Looks like prices have gone up a fair bit since he last bought one, though, at least here in Canada!) If you're still looking for a pickup, you might want to check out the Jones-Hatfield Banjo Pickup. It's spoken of in almost hushed tones in the Banjo Hangout forum, quite reasonably priced, and I've been quite happy with how it's sounded on my banjo. It's not exactly mic sound but it's a decent simulation of one and doesn't make me wince the way most pickups do.
Good to hear! I’ve picked up an old AT headset mic that I’m going to extract the capsule out of and use for my other banjo. I may do a comparison at some point
Thank you for this video. I am trying several mics and placements to find the right sound and I couldn't find anything yet that I completely in love with. I have some nice large condensers. They seem to pick up ambient room noise too much (say a furnace heater's fan or something else, may be even echo from walls). I can clearly hear more sound from the large condensers than the Shure SM57. So far I like the SM57 much more than the more expensive large condensers. The tiny condenser that you attached in the back is interesting. It makes the bass pretty boomy. But I heard lot of unwanted pickups from that mic. From the 4 samples you provided, I think I liked the SM57's sound best here too. Your last large condenser sounded a bit thin to me. May be you placed the mic a bit far away? What have you found new since you posted this video? What is your favorite mic for home recording?
Thanks for the feedback! The 57 is safest live, as it doesn't really pick up the room. You're right with that last clip - I only realised after editing that it sounded different to the opening, due to placement further away. I haven't really got to play live this year (understandable). Recording at home I've used my AT4033A large condenser. However, my new go-to mic that I have set up in my home studio is the sE VR1 Ribbon Mic. I've really liked its characteristics, and dig the pickup pattern that picks up the room.
@@JoelK I am into clawhammer banjo playing as well. I have tried dynamic, LDC and SDCs so far. USB top end mics. Interestingly I got only good results with SM57. These are all raw sound (unedited). I have been considering giving ribbon mics a try but don't want to spend a fortune. If there is one good one under 400$, I might consider. Will you please, please do me a favor and share some samples contrasting your LDC, SM57 and the new Ribbon mic? jeetray11@gmail.com
@@JoelK only home recording. From a small office room. In front of the computer monitor. I prefer to have the mic 2/3 feet away. Problem with sm57 is it needs to be invasive (i.e. too close).
Good question. I've been asking some other banjo players about the same thing! My suggestion is the pot in general. I could be wrong, but for general clawhammer (chordal/'rhythm'), I'm not sure mic placement would matter heaps. Maybe for more melodic stuff a small diaphragm condenser mic pointed where the neck meets the body might pick up some more high end (like a guitar), and maybe some of the finger strokes. I'm not sure banjo works like that. Dunno? What do you reckon?
Sounds "FAB" mate!!! Cheers
I use a clip on drum mic live on my 5 string and have installed a noiseless P90 pickup in my 6 string banjo. I put that through a DI and straight to the desk. Sounds great!
I really enjoyed this video, thanks for taking the time to talk through the different Mic options. Also enjoyed the relaxed and informal nature to it....easier to take in the info. :D
I play banjo in a band most weekends often with minimal space so feedback (when we need to be loud) can be an issue interns of my proximity to the FOH. Therefore we use EIM as there is no need to add fuel to that fire so to speak.
From your video I was drawn to the Audio Technica Pro 70 option as a mic offers so much more than a transducer/ pickup in my opinion....as you explained we don't hear the banjo like that so it would need some manipulation (roll off the low end).
I've just bought a Gold Tone CC 50 RP which has a closed back ...Id like to use the Audio Technica Pro 70 option but have no idea how that will impact the sound. My instincts tell me there will be more low end as it can't really escape due to the closed back.
With that info, whats your thoughts? lastly what do you think of transducers like the K&K Banjo Twin for example?
Thank you in advance, really appreciate any insight. :)
Hey mate
Interesting you bring this up. I just joined a fairly loud blues/country band, where they want me to occasionally play banjo. With an easy 100db level (including bass and drums), there’s no way a mic, whether out front, or my AT Pro70 rig, would cut it.
K&K mini would be superior, even if you’re loosing the tone of the banjo.
When I had a K&K dual mini on my first Deering, I would always run it through a Boss EQ7 pedal, both to boost level (passive transducer), and shape the tone to be closer to what it is acoustically.
I suspect if you use something higher end, like an LR Baggs DI with EQ, you could get further.
Maybe I’ll get one installed on my 6 string banjo and do a follow up vid?
Otherwise, let me know how you go
Thank you so much, very informative.
You’re welcome mate
Great video - thank you!
Thanks!
I see that it is a Ramsey Student model banjo. Sounds great!
Thanks mate! 12 years on and I’m still happy I bought it!
You bet! I’m in the process of buying one today! In large part to your video. Its gorgeous and in almost like new condition. I’d send you some pics if I could.
@@dannydavenport1767 upload a vid to UA-cam when you’ve got it and put the link in a comment
I got it today and I believe its a 2015 or 2016 model according to Donald Zepp. It has the 3 piece neck, ebony fingerboard and overlays like yours and looks identical except for the color of the rim cap which is a darker color. Serial number 2984. Sounds awesome too. Also its in mint shape, not a mark on it, as is the brown bump case. So lucky to have found it.
@@dannydavenport1767 good work! What’s the rim material? I got mine from Zepp’s too
not sure what the rim cap material is, but it looks like a dark rosewood maybe?
Thank you for a very detailed approach, I like your relaxed way of telling the things!
What is the song called at the very beginning of your clip?
Thx
Just something I made up
Great video!! Thanks for the info. Do you think the Pro-70 would sound decent in a resonator banjo for a small band situation? I tried a Gold tone ABS banjo mic today. I clips to the outside and bends over the head, but had a lot of feedback probs, even at low volume without a band. I'd bought a Gold Tone SMP + ( magnetic / wound coil pickup that attaches to the rod inside ) but it just does NOT sound like a banjo anymore. PS: Great to come across a fellow Aussie banjo Player. Not many of us around.
Hey mate
There’s a few of us around :)
For a resonator you could try a K&K under bridge style transducer. You get more of that piezo ‘thwack’ at the front of the note but they’re pretty great at feedback suppression (much better than an internal mic).
Nice. For recording i use often drums tom microphone (with fantom alim )Do you try kna piézzo ? I try one in m'y tenor and sound good. For my 5 strings i gor a Myers and thats good too. If someone got other experience about piezzo ?
Good to hear the myers works.
Is that a Ramsey student model banjo? thanks.
Great video! I play clawhammer and was looking to increase volume if playing outside so I got the Shure SM57 mic and hooked it to a LD amp. Just was curious best position to place mic? Front of pot? To the side? Under the neck? Also if ok to use a wind screen on the mic?
Hey mate
I’m sure there’s some difference where you point it but assuming the rim rings fairly evenly I don’t think it makes a difference (like the bout on guitars do).
And windscreens cut down a little bit of the high end frequencies. Can be useful for passive EQing
@@JoelK thanks for the info
The guy you saw live, did he have a resonator on the back of his banjo? It seems like your shirt may be absorbing some of the frequencies and the AT Pro 70 might sound even better if you install it inside of a banjo with a resonator on the back? Have you tried this at all. I appreciate you.
Hey mate
He played an open back, like me.
I agree with the absorption - puffer jacket may not be the best for a mic shootout.
I used to own a Deering Goodtime open back that had a clip on resonator - that was a little louder.
Most clawhammer players use an open back banjo for the sound, rather than closed back for the volume.
I was surprised at how pleasant the AT Pro 70 inside the instrument was. What feedback issues have you encountered with it? I also remember Chris Ludecke's sound - it was good. Is that all he used, can you recall, or did he carry any gadgets of any sort too?
G'day Bruce. There are issues having the Pro 70 inside the pot, especially if using foldback. Obviously, not much shielding in between a condenser mic pointing right at a speaker!
If I recall correctly, Chris said he ran no/low foldback on that mic. I do the same, especially as most gigs I do I'm in very confined spaces, almost on top of the foldback wedges. However, I've discovered you can put enough through them to get a reference before any serious feedback probs.
Re: Chris' setup - on one stage I saw him play he may have had an instrument mic (57, condenser?), micing from the front, as well.
On the smaller one, it seemed like it would have just been internally mic'd.
Keep in mind, his setup has probably changed over the years too!
For what it's worth and for both of you, I just saw Chris play yesterday and he said he was using (and had long used) an Audio-Technica PRO 35, which seems to be a clip-on and small condensor mic but not quite as mini and lavalier-like as the Pro 70. To my ear the banjo sounded fabulous and very naturalistic.
The fact Chris always seems to play solo and likely needs almost no monitoring helps him avoid any feedback trouble, I suspect. Just hearing himself acoustically would be enough, I imagine, having sung and played banjo from the same stage (albeit crammed with far fewer people!). Chris mentioned the thin wire cable can break down during heavy gigging, but he felt the mic was such a reasonable price and so readily available and worked so well with his banjo that it was still the best choice for him. (Looks like prices have gone up a fair bit since he last bought one, though, at least here in Canada!)
If you're still looking for a pickup, you might want to check out the Jones-Hatfield Banjo Pickup. It's spoken of in almost hushed tones in the Banjo Hangout forum, quite reasonably priced, and I've been quite happy with how it's sounded on my banjo. It's not exactly mic sound but it's a decent simulation of one and doesn't make me wince the way most pickups do.
Good to hear! I’ve picked up an old AT headset mic that I’m going to extract the capsule out of and use for my other banjo. I may do a comparison at some point
Thank you for this video. I am trying several mics and placements to find the right sound and I couldn't find anything yet that I completely in love with. I have some nice large condensers. They seem to pick up ambient room noise too much (say a furnace heater's fan or something else, may be even echo from walls). I can clearly hear more sound from the large condensers than the Shure SM57. So far I like the SM57 much more than the more expensive large condensers.
The tiny condenser that you attached in the back is interesting. It makes the bass pretty boomy. But I heard lot of unwanted pickups from that mic. From the 4 samples you provided, I think I liked the SM57's sound best here too. Your last large condenser sounded a bit thin to me. May be you placed the mic a bit far away?
What have you found new since you posted this video? What is your favorite mic for home recording?
Thanks for the feedback!
The 57 is safest live, as it doesn't really pick up the room.
You're right with that last clip - I only realised after editing that it sounded different to the opening, due to placement further away.
I haven't really got to play live this year (understandable).
Recording at home I've used my AT4033A large condenser.
However, my new go-to mic that I have set up in my home studio is the sE VR1 Ribbon Mic.
I've really liked its characteristics, and dig the pickup pattern that picks up the room.
@@JoelK I am into clawhammer banjo playing as well. I have tried dynamic, LDC and SDCs so far. USB top end mics. Interestingly I got only good results with SM57. These are all raw sound (unedited). I have been considering giving ribbon mics a try but don't want to spend a fortune. If there is one good one under 400$, I might consider.
Will you please, please do me a favor and share some samples contrasting your LDC, SM57 and the new Ribbon mic?
jeetray11@gmail.com
@@jeetray11 Sure mate. I’ll see what I can do before Christmas
@@jeetray11 is this for live or recorded solutions ?
@@JoelK only home recording. From a small office room. In front of the computer monitor. I prefer to have the mic 2/3 feet away. Problem with sm57 is it needs to be invasive (i.e. too close).
Any thoughts on mic placement?
Good question. I've been asking some other banjo players about the same thing!
My suggestion is the pot in general. I could be wrong, but for general clawhammer (chordal/'rhythm'), I'm not sure mic placement would matter heaps.
Maybe for more melodic stuff a small diaphragm condenser mic pointed where the neck meets the body might pick up some more high end (like a guitar), and maybe some of the finger strokes. I'm not sure banjo works like that. Dunno?
What do you reckon?