I think that the plugin should display a video from inside a car driving on a road in a nice landscape. That could trigger out brain to draw less attention to the sound.
The thing, the main thing for me, is that I KNEW what my mom’s car sounded like. It was so familiar. That’s what hasn’t been said-the whole reason for checking your mix in the car is because you’ve listened to so much music in there that you have a reference point. So for this plug-in to really do the most good (for me, not trying to speak for anyone else) would require listening to music for hours upon hours, passively (as mentioned-that was a key statement) through the plug-in. Until you’re completely familiar with it’s sound. Then it would really guide your mix. But, that’s always on us. I suspect the more time you spend with this plug-in, the better and more useful it gets. It’s an intriguing idea.
Downloaded plugin based on this review.. & it actually sounds like a car stereo system... think early to mid 2000s 'Honda Civic' etc... good plugin, works well. Thanks!
I’m so glad you mentioned the passive listening aspect of a car stereo because the first thing I noticed with the plugin turned on, is that (ironically) my front brain stopped picking apart the mix near instantly. It reminded me of the car experience enough that I started listening for enjoyment as opposed to for “information”. The Stereo image was wonky, etc etc…. So I just listened to the song. I love mix referencing my wife’s car but I don’t always have access to it. Downloading this :)
I’m actually kinda amazed at how well this plugin simulates a car stereo. I used it to check my latest master and it tells me everything I need to know. Is it too dynamic, is the top-end too harsh is the kick and bass relationship working? Highly recommend this plugin to everyone!
i had very little luck with this plugin. Tried it several times but didn't help or translate to my car stereo... wouldn't all car stereos need to be the same for this to work well? My mix sounded like mud and this only complicates the issue for me. Reverse engineering has helped... what sounds great in the car then import it into my daw and try to match. Reference basically.
It's a great idea for a plugin, especially if you're an engineer who doesn't know how to drive. One thing I would add to improve it is noise. Like, if you're driving in a car, in addition to the limitations of the sound system, you also have noise from the road and outside, and maybe you have the AC or heater going at full blast.
Yeah I can't drive bc disability and also we don't have a stereo in ours that works rn we just use a Bluetooth speaker lol.. too much of a pain to fix it so.. old van stuff lol
There's basically another plugin that does that same thing you said and it costs like 80$ or so and its a new one by Thenatan iirc so ye that one does that
My theory on why the frequency response of car stereos is SO different from every other playback system is because of road noise. The vibration masks the low frequencies, and instead of adding a sub (increased cost) they just boost the low mids on a default EQ curve so you feel like the bass is present over the road noise
Yeah, I use impulse responses to check how my mixes sound in different spaces all the time. It's a really great tool for doing that. You can find a lot of impulse responses online of different spaces and I highly recommend shifting through them when ur mixing. It's kind of crazy to me that people don't use it that often. You could record concert/festival stages and whatnot and check how it would sound there, but I've yet to find a person that's done that for some reason. Kind of odd. Same with the samples, its kind of hard to find stuff like that, but you can always record them yourself. Although, its a little tedious and you need the right equipment.
@@quietizkept There's many, Melda has one, I think Waves has one too to name a few and a lot of DAWs like Ableton Live or Bitwig both have their own as well. I personally use Kilohearts Convolver. Most of the convolver plugins have demos though, so you can try all of them too see which one you like best.
@@beludobeludo Glad that helped! One thing I'd add also is that; impulse responses from high quality studios are something I'd highly recommend u use if ur on headphones. I think you'll make better mixing decisions.
Also you need to be able to select different styles of driving gloves + motor noise (with mix control) and cudtom air fresheners hanging from the rear view mirror.
Toneboosters (the Dutch brand that is totally underestimated and which I think you should look into but that’s another story) has released a plugin called Isone yeeeaarrrss ago that offers the possibility to emulate a laptop, a mono radio and what not. Currently they also have Morphit with which can simulate crappy earplugs.
Anyone who uses Acoustica Mixcraft is very familiar with TB plugins! MC Pro Studio comes with a decent bundle of TB plugins. Was very sad to see the EZQ discontinued. Super useful little tool
I myself am kind of more sophisticated when it comes to car impulse responses. I only test my tracks on analog car impulses, you know, thee ones where you had to crank it in the front to start the motor. It just sounds better than impulses from modern cars where you just have to turn a key or push a button to start it. Perchance
One thing about Rocket Powered Sound, they seem to listen to consumer feedback, as they did with the Thickify update. Great video Wyste, thanks for this.
For anyone looking for a free alternative, I would highly recommend Beyerdynamics plug-in that does a similar thing. It emulates a car, a 5.1 studio, a regular studio (sounds like Genelecs to me), and a stadium. I’ve been using it for years and I love it.
it would be nice if there would be a road and engine noise, cuz i do feel like it changes what you hear and dont hear, it drowns out the details, as well idk if this plugin would show me if something is too wide, cuz, i had a track with a really wide snare, and it disappeared when i checked the mono in the car, and so i had to layer and hide a smaller mono snare in my track. stuf like this would really help to check the song in a car without exporting and putting it on the phone and all that other crap in the process.
I'll gladly try this out. Not too sure about the EQ/filtering it's using but damn that's a good spatial representation. And since I check from the passenger seat I don't need to flip the panning (UK side driving here lmao)
I think the car test works for a couple of reasons, enhanced low end to overcome road noise and the bizarre speaker set up changes your perspective, but there's an element that realistically can't be replicated by a plugin, which is our familiarity with the space. I know how music feels in my car because I listen to music in my car for a couple hours a day every day. I don't know how music feels in the IR sampled car, different cars have different cavities which have different nodes and reflections. It doesn't make the plugin worthless (I don't like leaving my studio when I'm in the middle of a project to check my mix), but I try to choose reference speakers that I use in everyday life.
Very nice! I have a psychology background, and so I have often wondered how much of an impact do non-musical/ non-audio factors have on the way we experience listening to music. People often say that audio engineers use objective processes and procedures when working with audio. But, at the end of the day, how much of that actually matters if music is listened to while it is being experienced subjectively? Are we always being mindful when we hear music? Or do we sometimes have our mind's full when we listen to music? I believe that is an important distinction that must be made. What are we really attending to? What are we actually engaged with? People don't experience music the way a plugin analyzes music. We aren't spectrographs or loudness meters. We are human beings.
Totally agree Wytse that passive listening can produce insights. I like to make a few walks around the city with my mixes on in-ear headphones. As I'm noticing a coffee shop or park, I kind of forget about the music until all of a sudden a problem pops into my left ear. Or maybe I expected there to be a big bass drop and...nothing, because the translation doesn't work when there's a lot of external ambient noise. From the car test, to standing outside the room when mixing, to even listening through your phone while cooking dinner, there's lots of tiny bits of info to be gained through unconventional monitoring.
Listening on headphones, your IR was ever so slightly different than the plugin's. It was almost identical, but the plugin had this sort of "pressure" to it. I don't know how else to describe it.
an impulse response (convolution) is actually a fancy filter indeed, even if it also has stereo-properties, but linear phase filters use the same technology, that's for sure. this is most comparable with guitar amp sims as they also filter the sounds with impulse responses that are more complex than ordinary filter shapes while simultanously be shorter than delay- or reverb-IRs
It sounds to me like they are messing with the phase to create spacial separation. It turns out that some people are extremely sensitive to phase, and others don’t hear it so much. I am a phase supertaster I guess - I have always detected phase issues right away, and it is sort of a curse because I hear it everywhere. But my mixes are quite phase coherent. That’s the “pressure” you feel btw. To me, this doesn’t really approximate what a car interior sounds like. I just hear phase issues. Plus, my car is quite bassy, as most are. I’m not hearing that reflected in this plugin.
what many people don't get about the car test is that it's not about cheking how your mix sounds in a car, it about checking your mix on a system on that you hear music on on a daily base. that's why this plugin makes no sense to me, you never heard the music you like listening to on that plugin
It’s not about how the mix sounds in a car it’s about how it sounds where people listen to the music which is in a car? Explain how these two things are different.
@@fredbarnes196 it's about checking the mix in your car, on s system that you know and hear casually music on on a daily base. hearing your mix in a random car will bring you absolutely nothing
I'm in the process of mixing a new project as we speak, and will definitely make it this plugins guinea pig!!! This plugin looks like it could kill some note-taking.
my car stereo system can adjust the stereo center for the speaker system that you can move it around in the car. the driver seat is my car stereo center.
Regarding the stereo image and how it seems to be skewed to the right. Next time anyone is in their car listening to music of any sort, realize that most times, depending on the vehicle, your body, especially your left leg may be in front of the drivers side door speaker. In my truck, the door speaker is just about in line with my left shin and when I drive and relax my leg, it leans against the door. When I actively pull my leg away from the door, the stereo image in the car opens up and I get more information from the drivers side speaker. If I allow my leg to lay against the door, in front of the speaker, it sounds like most of the sound is coming from the right side of the car, just like this plugins emulates. Maybe not to THIS degree described in the plugin, but it is a thing.
Cool plugin, but they missed an opportunity here... It should have a button for "road noise." Part of driving is the sound of the road/car and it's pretty loud in most cars. Having that noise underneath in addition would help simulate the experience and be a good test for dynamic range amounts, because overly-dynamic music doesn't do well with road noise.
Since I listen to music in a car a lot, such a plugin is a good idea. To make it a realistic car listening reference I would need the engine and other driving noises that tend to interfere a lot. I barely sit in the car just to listen to music without driving, so this plugin doesn't quite match my experience. Having a second button to add those noises would be pretty cool!
My immediate first thought as soon as Wytse explained what the plugin was, was: What about the stereo field sitting in the driver's seat? They addressed that, but my second thought was exactly yours: What about the engine? There's no point getting TOO exact about these things; there's no substitute for listening in a lot of places.
in the studio i mostly pay attention to production details, and in the car i mostly pay attention to composition and arrangement details - unintentionally.
Two things. I now want to make impulses of my car, living room + hifi, kitchen + Bluetooth speaker. I’d get this but sure it’s better to do it based on you own system. But also if the car animation was drivable, would that help ‘engage car brain’?
I think a good car test would also take into account the type of vehicle and it’s mechanical noises, as well as the engine and road noises. At 100 km/h (dutch motor way speed) the road and engine noise start to over power my car radio, I can only enjoy the audio when I drive 60 km/h on a country road. Also it would make a lot of difference if you got an electric car with a more or less silent motor vs a noisy, heavy vibrating diesel engine. A luxury car would also have a more silent, better insulated interior vs a cheaper car that has squeaky noises and a tin can feel when you open/close the doors. I wonder how hard (or easy) it would be to factor this in the plugin. I have to turn up the radio on the motorway.
I've never seen something like this before. I'm not really up on impulse technology. Definitely some kind of phase situation happening with it. All systems are different, like an 80 Buick, 2020 Audi, wagon, coupe...etc. I think it does a good job of capturing the spirit of what a car stereo could sound like..............and it's free, so why not 💁♂
6:25 100% true. When im dont know where to get a song (mainly at producction level) I just get up of my chair and by listening while I walk arround my my room I usually figure it out
I always thought the idea was 'Reference your mix in YOUR car' as its a familiar space and you know the system limitations. easy to spot when you have cooked the bottom end when your car speakers start farting, etc etc etc....... it's harder to spot the problems on an unfamiliar system and you might end up correcting a problem that is not there.
Only problem is that it doesn't sound at all as how music sounds in my car. With so many car types, speaker quality and so many brands as well as cars with woofers and without it becomes a hard thing to emulate. Hope they built on this idea
These plugins work with headphones and should be noted to use reference tracks with all of them and A/B your mix. But you can’t get rid of room problems with dsp or eq curves. There aren’t many nodes or reflections in cars, especially in the front seat. So not only are you accurately hearing your mix. You’re also accurately feeling the bass. You never need to “know” somebody’s car to properly reference your mix.
Is this a standalone plugin or do u need to run it through protools and if you have to run it thru protools How do I set this up in protools and when I do where do u find it
hmmmmmm.... honestly, the major point to the car test, at least for me, is the bass response. The bass frequencies in a car system basically moves out of the car and don't get trapped inside, giving a tight response that is hard to get in a bedroom. This plugin is not gonna reproduce that effect for me.
It's kind of interesting, what _sort_ of car did they get the impulse response from? I guess that may make some difference (quality of speakers and system and interior layout etc). One question: Do they have left and right hand drive versions?! You're very right about the attention thing. I often notice things in my mix when I'm not _actively_ listening. But then to fix it, I have to switch back to active listening in order to dial the thing out.
I think, this plugin needs some more "effects + noise" that needs to be added. Road noise. Traffic. Perhaps some Brown Noise with some Filtering. I mean, if you want to really simulate a car you need to add the rest of the things that come with driving the car. Not just the sound of the stereo. It would also be cool to have a 'left hand drive / right hand drive / rear seat left / rear seat right' feature as well as other types of vehicles (2 seater, sedan, SUV, hatchback, station wagon) and a Mix button ;) I mean, if you are using this as an FX plugin and you are playing a music track through this filter with these added "benefits" ^, you could use it in many different sound design scenarios. Eg. Film (as the background music + noise of the current scene that is shot in a car ), Each shot could be a different sounding 'car mix' when focused on a character (either front / back). The possibilities are endless actually.
Well Rocket Powered Sounds is the company behind Thickify, which listened to it's audience and updated based on feedback. Part of me says RPS is collectings data and interests to release this concept as a feature of a larger upcoming paid product, and are definitely paying attention.
@@IKARIking67 This is why I made this absolutely ridiculous feature list comment, so that if these features make it to the paid version, we know that the company is just as ridiculous. KEKW
We need to go deeper! There is so much comparison about plugins but we can go to the next level mix checking ! "What car did you check your mix in? " -2003 prius "oh i think 2005 would be more accurant" endless swamp of gear fiddling 🔥
You should create a company that measure your car and produce a IR for your audio studio. Because you have the experience of your own car. Further you can compare other mixes under this plugin condition.
Hearing mixes in my car only helps me if the car is running and the wheels and the motor make their noises. Then these frequencies cancel some parts of the music and I can guess what other people will hear.
Hi Could you do a Pultec shootout with a real one and the UAD one, would love to know what you think, especially following that mastering video where he used one.
I don't understand how this could possibly work. Each car is different as far as system and acoustics. Sounds like all this thing does is add eq, pan a little to the right. My car has it's own personality. It's less detailed in the mids and a bit boxier sounding. Sometimes the transients in the toms completely disappear in the car when I can hear them perfectly in the studio. A plugin like this cannot replace testing in a car.
Unfortunately I'd have to say this plug-in would be inaccurate. Along with with being in music production for 20+yrs im also a car audio enthusiasts. There would have to be more features to this plug-in compensating cabin size, listening position,and time alignment to name a few. In order for this plug-in to be truly useful they would Basically need to create a virtual headunit typcal to what you would find in your vehicle, simulate various speaker sizes, speaker placement, and number of speakers used. Option b would to be able to load a impulse response from your very own vehicle which could be very sloppy an inaccurate if you don't have the right equipment/mics to get a good impulse. I'm glad its free an may have some use ,but theres a ton of work that needs to be done to use this as a reference for checking a mix in a vehicle.
Does it add road noise? What about the higher THD of most auto amps? These are important factors, and make a real road test a good way to test dynamic range
Would love for you to try the vsx from slate been on the fence about them for a year I really don’t know if I should grab them. I travel a lot so it might been what’s needed for the hotel mix
On differeent 'listening modes' - I always Percival tracks way different playing them for some one than when I'm by my self... (Usually (even) more critical) So maybe that also can be a plug-in some one could make 'listening companion' beside on-off switch it could do with a slider between P Apriciation/supporting/comforting and dismissal/disapproving/getadayjob styles. 🤷
The car test works because you are used to listening to radio and music in your car. Thats why I think this plugin is fun, but not necessarily that useful - because you don't have that reference library in your head of listening to a lot of music through it.
This is a cool plugin. Better than running to car in the winter with 3 foot of snow...lol... SO....serious question...since you switched monitoring systems how long did it take for you to get acclimated to the new monitors and was there a vast frquency change???...did you set it up closer to what you had or did you have to re train you brain to adapt the freqencies..?.I have in the past setup so many systems that knowing what you're looking for can be most taxing sometimes...unless you pink noise/frequency test the room...which i know you must have....most of the time that's the key but ears and mind can change...curious. You've done an amazing job on the room by the way. I hope it suits you well. :)
I think the theory would only make sense on headphones no? The stereo thing might be accurate if thats the case but on speakers of different sizes it makes no sense as a "comparative" or translation test. So Passive listening is a skill thats not easy to learn but easy to cheat by doing something else when the tracks playing,,, like Witse said about when he's bouncing...
I tried this app and noticed it being louder on the right, also. I verified this by looking at MStereoScope after applying Car Test on pink noise. This shift to the right may cause people to adjust their panning to the left. People should be warned to take this bias in consideration in order not to mess-up their panning. Generally, it's for broad testing and not for making detailed mixing decisions. If something goes completely lost, it probably needs some work, however. Trying to make something sound perfect with Car Test is not a good idea. It probably makes it sound worse on other systems.
Well if they can do this then they can also do a studio simulator program for the car......RIGHT??😜😜🤣🤣 I like your idea about active vs passive listening.
I contacted them about it because the cartest pulled the sound imo too much to the right compared with other car emulations...the answer i got was rhat they did this on purpose because in a car you are never in the middle.. i think they overdid it and a knob to correct it would be appreciated because im testing often in my car if my tracks are good enough and then the sound is way better and more central...
I think that the plugin should display a video from inside a car driving on a road in a nice landscape. That could trigger out brain to draw less attention to the sound.
With road tyre noise and rumble.
In VR.
play a driving / racing simulator while listening to the track :)... then your focus needs to change
@@NoNameLeft1500 F1 2022 doesn't have a car stereo option what do I do
I have a Bang & Olufsen in my Car… but I will give it a try 😂
The thing, the main thing for me, is that I KNEW what my mom’s car sounded like. It was so familiar. That’s what hasn’t been said-the whole reason for checking your mix in the car is because you’ve listened to so much music in there that you have a reference point. So for this plug-in to really do the most good (for me, not trying to speak for anyone else) would require listening to music for hours upon hours, passively (as mentioned-that was a key statement) through the plug-in. Until you’re completely familiar with it’s sound. Then it would really guide your mix. But, that’s always on us. I suspect the more time you spend with this plug-in, the better and more useful it gets. It’s an intriguing idea.
Downloaded plugin based on this review.. & it actually sounds like a car stereo system... think early to mid 2000s 'Honda Civic' etc... good plugin, works well. Thanks!
I’m so glad you mentioned the passive listening aspect of a car stereo because the first thing I noticed with the plugin turned on, is that (ironically) my front brain stopped picking apart the mix near instantly. It reminded me of the car experience enough that I started listening for enjoyment as opposed to for “information”. The Stereo image was wonky, etc etc…. So I just listened to the song. I love mix referencing my wife’s car but I don’t always have access to it. Downloading this :)
I’m actually kinda amazed at how well this plugin simulates a car stereo. I used it to check my latest master and it tells me everything I need to know. Is it too dynamic, is the top-end too harsh is the kick and bass relationship working?
Highly recommend this plugin to everyone!
i had very little luck with this plugin. Tried it several times but didn't help or translate to my car stereo... wouldn't all car stereos need to be the same for this to work well? My mix sounded like mud and this only complicates the issue for me. Reverse engineering has helped... what sounds great in the car then import it into my daw and try to match. Reference basically.
It's a great idea for a plugin, especially if you're an engineer who doesn't know how to drive. One thing I would add to improve it is noise. Like, if you're driving in a car, in addition to the limitations of the sound system, you also have noise from the road and outside, and maybe you have the AC or heater going at full blast.
And of course some whiney kids shouting: are we there yet?
Yeah I can't drive bc disability and also we don't have a stereo in ours that works rn we just use a Bluetooth speaker lol.. too much of a pain to fix it so.. old van stuff lol
There's basically another plugin that does that same thing you said and it costs like 80$ or so and its a new one by Thenatan iirc so ye that one does that
Also every now and then there is the sound of a cat getting hit.
My theory on why the frequency response of car stereos is SO different from every other playback system is because of road noise. The vibration masks the low frequencies, and instead of adding a sub (increased cost) they just boost the low mids on a default EQ curve so you feel like the bass is present over the road noise
Yeah, I use impulse responses to check how my mixes sound in different spaces all the time. It's a really great tool for doing that. You can find a lot of impulse responses online of different spaces and I highly recommend shifting through them when ur mixing. It's kind of crazy to me that people don't use it that often. You could record concert/festival stages and whatnot and check how it would sound there, but I've yet to find a person that's done that for some reason. Kind of odd. Same with the samples, its kind of hard to find stuff like that, but you can always record them yourself. Although, its a little tedious and you need the right equipment.
Really great advice, Thanks
What kind of plugin or software would one use to apply these impulse responses? I know some reverb plugins use them but is there a dedicated solution?
@@quietizkept There's many, Melda has one, I think Waves has one too to name a few and a lot of DAWs like Ableton Live or Bitwig both have their own as well. I personally use Kilohearts Convolver. Most of the convolver plugins have demos though, so you can try all of them too see which one you like best.
@@beludobeludo Glad that helped! One thing I'd add also is that; impulse responses from high quality studios are something I'd highly recommend u use if ur on headphones. I think you'll make better mixing decisions.
@@Arrvss. Is ther a resource or site that makes finding these Impulse Respose profiles a little more organized that you could recommend?
Also you need to be able to select different styles of driving gloves + motor noise (with mix control) and cudtom air fresheners hanging from the rear view mirror.
You are the smartest Audioguy in the whole WWW! Pure Genius. Bigmouth.
Never enough stuff to test the mixes on. Thx for the video.
Toneboosters (the Dutch brand that is totally underestimated and which I think you should look into but that’s another story) has released a plugin called Isone yeeeaarrrss ago that offers the possibility to emulate a laptop, a mono radio and what not. Currently they also have Morphit with which can simulate crappy earplugs.
Seconded! Toneboosters is a great company.
Anyone who uses Acoustica Mixcraft is very familiar with TB plugins! MC Pro Studio comes with a decent bundle of TB plugins. Was very sad to see the EZQ discontinued. Super useful little tool
I myself am kind of more sophisticated when it comes to car impulse responses. I only test my tracks on analog car impulses, you know, thee ones where you had to crank it in the front to start the motor. It just sounds better than impulses from modern cars where you just have to turn a key or push a button to start it. Perchance
Mixdown to wax cylinder and avoid potholes.
One thing about Rocket Powered Sound, they seem to listen to consumer feedback, as they did with the Thickify update. Great video Wyste, thanks for this.
For anyone looking for a free alternative, I would highly recommend Beyerdynamics plug-in that does a similar thing. It emulates a car, a 5.1 studio, a regular studio (sounds like Genelecs to me), and a stadium. I’ve been using it for years and I love it.
Cheers for this! Any ideas where I can get it? Beyerdynamics link just sending me to the headphones store...
@@simonvegas793 doesn't work with m1 or m2 macs
@@Dagardmusic I have an M1 Mac Studio and it works for me. There was a workaround you had to do but it works
@@simonvegas793 search for Beyerdynamic Virtual Studio
@@NoizeTankCheers bro, found it! :)
it would be nice if there would be a road and engine noise, cuz i do feel like it changes what you hear and dont hear, it drowns out the details, as well idk if this plugin would show me if something is too wide, cuz, i had a track with a really wide snare, and it disappeared when i checked the mono in the car, and so i had to layer and hide a smaller mono snare in my track. stuf like this would really help to check the song in a car without exporting and putting it on the phone and all that other crap in the process.
Passive listening... I never thought about it and makes a lot of sense!
I'll gladly try this out. Not too sure about the EQ/filtering it's using but damn that's a good spatial representation. And since I check from the passenger seat I don't need to flip the panning (UK side driving here lmao)
I think the car test works for a couple of reasons, enhanced low end to overcome road noise and the bizarre speaker set up changes your perspective, but there's an element that realistically can't be replicated by a plugin, which is our familiarity with the space.
I know how music feels in my car because I listen to music in my car for a couple hours a day every day.
I don't know how music feels in the IR sampled car, different cars have different cavities which have different nodes and reflections. It doesn't make the plugin worthless (I don't like leaving my studio when I'm in the middle of a project to check my mix), but I try to choose reference speakers that I use in everyday life.
You can learn how the plugin sounds in your room, though
I love your nails, White Sea 💅
Good video as usual ☺️
nicely done with the replication...
ughhhh nails on POINT today
I have the exact same experience passive listening. Always notice something different. Thanks Wytse, Quality as always.
Regarding passive listening, it would be cool if they put a simple game in there. Something to keep your hands and eyes busy while the plugin runs.
COOL
I love listening in the car! It tells my body and brain that the mix is done, that I can relax and return to being just a music listener.
does it come in a right hand drive version? Best from Ireland
Yes but the song will be Darude - by Sandstorm...
this is actually very useful, I have a very nice sound system in my car with a 12 inch sub, so it's cool to have a different reference point
Very nice! I have a psychology background, and so I have often wondered how much of an impact do non-musical/ non-audio factors have on the way we experience listening to music.
People often say that audio engineers use objective processes and procedures when working with audio. But, at the end of the day, how much of that actually matters if music is listened to while it is being experienced subjectively?
Are we always being mindful when we hear music? Or do we sometimes have our mind's full when we listen to music? I believe that is an important distinction that must be made. What are we really attending to? What are we actually engaged with?
People don't experience music the way a plugin analyzes music. We aren't spectrographs or loudness meters. We are human beings.
good refelction in regards of the psicological implicances of the active/passive hearing !
Totally agree Wytse that passive listening can produce insights. I like to make a few walks around the city with my mixes on in-ear headphones. As I'm noticing a coffee shop or park, I kind of forget about the music until all of a sudden a problem pops into my left ear. Or maybe I expected there to be a big bass drop and...nothing, because the translation doesn't work when there's a lot of external ambient noise. From the car test, to standing outside the room when mixing, to even listening through your phone while cooking dinner, there's lots of tiny bits of info to be gained through unconventional monitoring.
Listening on headphones, your IR was ever so slightly different than the plugin's. It was almost identical, but the plugin had this sort of "pressure" to it. I don't know how else to describe it.
an impulse response (convolution) is actually a fancy filter indeed, even if it also has stereo-properties, but linear phase filters use the same technology, that's for sure. this is most comparable with guitar amp sims as they also filter the sounds with impulse responses that are more complex than ordinary filter shapes while simultanously be shorter than delay- or reverb-IRs
It sounds to me like they are messing with the phase to create spacial separation. It turns out that some people are extremely sensitive to phase, and others don’t hear it so much. I am a phase supertaster I guess - I have always detected phase issues right away, and it is sort of a curse because I hear it everywhere. But my mixes are quite phase coherent. That’s the “pressure” you feel btw. To me, this doesn’t really approximate what a car interior sounds like. I just hear phase issues. Plus, my car is quite bassy, as most are. I’m not hearing that reflected in this plugin.
what many people don't get about the car test is that it's not about cheking how your mix sounds in a car, it about checking your mix on a system on that you hear music on on a daily base. that's why this plugin makes no sense to me, you never heard the music you like listening to on that plugin
Based! :)
It’s not about how the mix sounds in a car it’s about how it sounds where people listen to the music which is in a car? Explain how these two things are different.
@@fredbarnes196 it's about checking the mix in your car, on s system that you know and hear casually music on on a daily base. hearing your mix in a random car will bring you absolutely nothing
I'm in the process of mixing a new project as we speak, and will definitely make it this plugins guinea pig!!! This plugin looks like it could kill some note-taking.
Realphones has this already. Is this just as good? Or better perhaps?
my car stereo system can adjust the stereo center for the speaker system that you can move it around in the car. the driver seat is my car stereo center.
Regarding the stereo image and how it seems to be skewed to the right. Next time anyone is in their car listening to music of any sort, realize that most times, depending on the vehicle, your body, especially your left leg may be in front of the drivers side door speaker. In my truck, the door speaker is just about in line with my left shin and when I drive and relax my leg, it leans against the door. When I actively pull my leg away from the door, the stereo image in the car opens up and I get more information from the drivers side speaker. If I allow my leg to lay against the door, in front of the speaker, it sounds like most of the sound is coming from the right side of the car, just like this plugins emulates. Maybe not to THIS degree described in the plugin, but it is a thing.
Cool plugin, but they missed an opportunity here... It should have a button for "road noise." Part of driving is the sound of the road/car and it's pretty loud in most cars. Having that noise underneath in addition would help simulate the experience and be a good test for dynamic range amounts, because overly-dynamic music doesn't do well with road noise.
Some wind noise as well. 😀
Since I listen to music in a car a lot, such a plugin is a good idea. To make it a realistic car listening reference I would need the engine and other driving noises that tend to interfere a lot. I barely sit in the car just to listen to music without driving, so this plugin doesn't quite match my experience. Having a second button to add those noises would be pretty cool!
My immediate first thought as soon as Wytse explained what the plugin was, was: What about the stereo field sitting in the driver's seat? They addressed that, but my second thought was exactly yours: What about the engine? There's no point getting TOO exact about these things; there's no substitute for listening in a lot of places.
in the studio i mostly pay attention to production details, and in the car i mostly pay attention to composition and arrangement details - unintentionally.
Two things. I now want to make impulses of my car, living room + hifi, kitchen + Bluetooth speaker. I’d get this but sure it’s better to do it based on you own system.
But also if the car animation was drivable, would that help ‘engage car brain’?
Does anyone still do the "listening from the next room" trick? That was my favourite way to hear problems in my mixes. Need a plug-in for that!
Anybody tried "Mix checker Pro"? I would say that's a overall better plugin for referance listening
Love the nail-polish thing! Will try it soon thanks to you, cheers!
He got the right colors on the right digits lol.
So the difference in EQ gets also achieved with an impulse Response and the Reverb alone?
THE BEST TIMIMNG
Left-hand or Right-hand drive? 😅
The stereo field switches heavily to the right with headphones on.
I think a good car test would also take into account the type of vehicle and it’s mechanical noises, as well as the engine and road noises. At 100 km/h (dutch motor way speed) the road and engine noise start to over power my car radio, I can only enjoy the audio when I drive 60 km/h on a country road. Also it would make a lot of difference if you got an electric car with a more or less silent motor vs a noisy, heavy vibrating diesel engine. A luxury car would also have a more silent, better insulated interior vs a cheaper car that has squeaky noises and a tin can feel when you open/close the doors. I wonder how hard (or easy) it would be to factor this in the plugin. I have to turn up the radio on the motorway.
well said and don't forget the type/quality of stereo and speakers in the car.
I've never seen something like this before. I'm not really up on impulse technology. Definitely some kind of phase situation happening with it. All systems are different, like an 80 Buick, 2020 Audi, wagon, coupe...etc. I think it does a good job of capturing the spirit of what a car stereo could sound like..............and it's free, so why not 💁♂
6:25 100% true. When im dont know where to get a song (mainly at producction level) I just get up of my chair and by listening while I walk arround my my room I usually figure it out
Adding mirrors shake could be cool, too ) like a visual indicator when maybe there’s too much low end )
I always thought the idea was 'Reference your mix in YOUR car' as its a familiar space and you know the system limitations. easy to spot when you have cooked the bottom end when your car speakers start farting, etc etc etc....... it's harder to spot the problems on an unfamiliar system and you might end up correcting a problem that is not there.
Only problem is that it doesn't sound at all as how music sounds in my car. With so many car types, speaker quality and so many brands as well as cars with woofers and without it becomes a hard thing to emulate. Hope they built on this idea
Ti amo sempre di più.
These plugins work with headphones and should be noted to use reference tracks with all of them and A/B your mix.
But you can’t get rid of room problems with dsp or eq curves. There aren’t many nodes or reflections in cars, especially in the front seat. So not only are you accurately hearing your mix. You’re also accurately feeling the bass. You never need to “know” somebody’s car to properly reference your mix.
My ears are confusing, the plugin sounded differently when you tested it first from when you compared it.
the plugin is really a good one
Does it model different cars and car stereo units?
Nice plugin!!! Thank you!!!
A passive listening plugin would be great "snake oil'! Great video!
Is this a standalone plugin or do u need to run it through protools and if you have to run it thru protools How do I set this up in protools and when I do where do u find it
hmmmmmm.... honestly, the major point to the car test, at least for me, is the bass response. The bass frequencies in a car system basically moves out of the car and don't get trapped inside, giving a tight response that is hard to get in a bedroom. This plugin is not gonna reproduce that effect for me.
+1
+2
Yeah same here, I need to check in a car for bass, not really anything else, especially the real sub frequencies.
+3
Wouldn't you use white noise for the learn filter?
It's kind of interesting, what _sort_ of car did they get the impulse response from? I guess that may make some difference (quality of speakers and system and interior layout etc). One question: Do they have left and right hand drive versions?!
You're very right about the attention thing. I often notice things in my mix when I'm not _actively_ listening. But then to fix it, I have to switch back to active listening in order to dial the thing out.
Needs my wife saying "Can you turn down the bass?"
I think, this plugin needs some more "effects + noise" that needs to be added. Road noise. Traffic. Perhaps some Brown Noise with some Filtering. I mean, if you want to really simulate a car you need to add the rest of the things that come with driving the car. Not just the sound of the stereo. It would also be cool to have a 'left hand drive / right hand drive / rear seat left / rear seat right' feature as well as other types of vehicles (2 seater, sedan, SUV, hatchback, station wagon) and a Mix button ;)
I mean, if you are using this as an FX plugin and you are playing a music track through this filter with these added "benefits" ^, you could use it in many different sound design scenarios. Eg. Film (as the background music + noise of the current scene that is shot in a car ), Each shot could be a different sounding 'car mix' when focused on a character (either front / back). The possibilities are endless actually.
Yep. Car in the tunnel, in the rain at a level crossing. Even in the garage with the roller door closed and a pipe from the exhaust into the cabin.
@@CFox.7 You need help my dude.
@@yeet_za Relax ! That last requirement is only for sound checking sad songs !
Well Rocket Powered Sounds is the company behind Thickify, which listened to it's audience and updated based on feedback. Part of me says RPS is collectings data and interests to release this concept as a feature of a larger upcoming paid product, and are definitely paying attention.
@@IKARIking67 This is why I made this absolutely ridiculous feature list comment, so that if these features make it to the paid version, we know that the company is just as ridiculous. KEKW
What cheap speakers for mixing do you recommend under 150?? That have the most transparency??
Can you show a video on how to use this plugin? Like how do you mix with it? Especially in terms of the spatial audio.
🤔 hmmm I’m currently listening in my car. Should both sound the same?
Everyone's speakers may not be the same. Results may very.
We need to go deeper! There is so much comparison about plugins but we can go to the next level mix checking ! "What car did you check your mix in? " -2003 prius "oh i think 2005 would be more accurant" endless swamp of gear fiddling 🔥
couldnt focus as i was distracted by your passive nail varnish 😉🤣🤣
if you could do a tutorial on how you use inpulse responce in Reaper's Reaverb
You should create a company that measure your car and produce a IR for your audio studio. Because you have the experience of your own car. Further you can compare other mixes under this plugin condition.
Hearing mixes in my car only helps me if the car is running and the wheels and the motor make their noises. Then these frequencies cancel some parts of the music and I can guess what other people will hear.
i just use reference by sonarworks. haven't had to worry about all these "testing in different environments" stuff ever since.
I use it too and it really helps a lot. I'm wondering if Sonarworks uses Its to or is just some added EQ curves.
Hi Could you do a Pultec shootout with a real one and the UAD one, would love to know what you think, especially following that mastering video where he used one.
now I no longer go by car to take the test!
Slate vsx is pretty tight. Got 2 cars!
I don't understand how this could possibly work. Each car is different as far as system and acoustics. Sounds like all this thing does is add eq, pan a little to the right. My car has it's own personality. It's less detailed in the mids and a bit boxier sounding. Sometimes the transients in the toms completely disappear in the car when I can hear them perfectly in the studio. A plugin like this cannot replace testing in a car.
Unfortunately I'd have to say this plug-in would be inaccurate. Along with with being in music production for 20+yrs im also a car audio enthusiasts. There would have to be more features to this plug-in compensating cabin size, listening position,and time alignment to name a few. In order for this plug-in to be truly useful they would Basically need to create a virtual headunit typcal to what you would find in your vehicle, simulate various speaker sizes, speaker placement, and number of speakers used. Option b would to be able to load a impulse response from your very own vehicle which could be very sloppy an inaccurate if you don't have the right equipment/mics to get a good impulse. I'm glad its free an may have some use ,but theres a ton of work that needs to be done to use this as a reference for checking a mix in a vehicle.
Please do a snake oil on the v2 VSX slate headphone situation!
Does it add road noise? What about the higher THD of most auto amps? These are important factors, and make a real road test a good way to test dynamic range
now do a van test. with the noise of tyres and engine masking the low frequencies
Would love for you to try the vsx from slate been on the fence about them for a year I really don’t know if I should grab them. I travel a lot so it might been what’s needed for the hotel mix
I guess part of the car test is also that you are use to your car speakers - you know how music sounds on them
On differeent 'listening modes' - I always Percival tracks way different playing them for some one than when I'm by my self...
(Usually (even) more critical)
So maybe that also can be a plug-in some one could make 'listening companion' beside on-off switch it could do with a slider between P
Apriciation/supporting/comforting and dismissal/disapproving/getadayjob styles. 🤷
Good Video and nice Nails☺
cool plugin. will def grab a copy of it. might find it useful.
this videos sandstorm song is really cool. I need it. who made it?
Thoughts on the Waves control room emulator plugins? Love this channel!
one could use it for filmmaking and audiobooks to emulate in-car sound.
The car test works because you are used to listening to radio and music in your car. Thats why I think this plugin is fun, but not necessarily that useful - because you don't have that reference library in your head of listening to a lot of music through it.
This is a cool plugin. Better than running to car in the winter with 3 foot of snow...lol... SO....serious question...since you switched monitoring systems how long did it take for you to get acclimated to the new monitors and was there a vast frquency change???...did you set it up closer to what you had or did you have to re train you brain to adapt the freqencies..?.I have in the past setup so many systems that knowing what you're looking for can be most taxing sometimes...unless you pink noise/frequency test the room...which i know you must have....most of the time that's the key but ears and mind can change...curious. You've done an amazing job on the room by the way. I hope it suits you well. :)
Waiting for some gain knob plugin snake oil videos =)
Mix checker pro does Car, Ipad, I phone, ear buds and more. But it's not free.
Do you wash your hair with snake oil?
what model car are we driving? lol
I think the theory would only make sense on headphones no? The stereo thing might be accurate if thats the case but on speakers of different sizes it makes no sense as a "comparative" or translation test. So Passive listening is a skill thats not easy to learn but easy to cheat by doing something else when the tracks playing,,, like Witse said about when he's bouncing...
I tried this app and noticed it being louder on the right, also. I verified this by looking at MStereoScope after applying Car Test on pink noise. This shift to the right may cause people to adjust their panning to the left. People should be warned to take this bias in consideration in order not to mess-up their panning. Generally, it's for broad testing and not for making detailed mixing decisions. If something goes completely lost, it probably needs some work, however. Trying to make something sound perfect with Car Test is not a good idea. It probably makes it sound worse on other systems.
in a car, your head is right next to one speaker and several feet from the other, so it makes sense that the balance would be off.
@@kage-fm Yes, of course you're not sitting in directly the center. However, there is no option to switch the seat.
Pero replica el sonido del auto o no? Por cierto... Que lindas uñitas jeje
Well if they can do this then they can also do a studio simulator program for the car......RIGHT??😜😜🤣🤣
I like your idea about active vs passive listening.
I contacted them about it because the cartest pulled the sound imo too much to the right compared with other car emulations...the answer i got was rhat they did this on purpose because in a car you are never in the middle.. i think they overdid it and a knob to correct it would be appreciated because im testing often in my car if my tracks are good enough and then the sound is way better and more central...