Is Mario Kart Unfair? | GAME PSYCH
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- Опубліковано 28 вер 2024
- This is GAME PSYCH, and today will are exploring the so called "unfair AI" of Mario Kart, specifically, the AI drivers of Mario Kart 8 Deluxe. Sometimes it feels like the CPU isn't playing by the rules, and it can be incredibly frustrating. It's time to put this theory to the test, and figure out why Mario Kart AI can be so unforgiving.
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/ nikmoe
Official Channel Music
/ nikmoe - Ігри
That one CPU who always takes the shortcut on cheeseland
Fuckin Larry
SniperSquid yes! In the third lap. That happens pretty often for me on Sweet Sweet Canyon too.
SniperSquid Go fuck yourself Toad
Crystal Pearl jew
NoOneCares wot
Nintendo, If you introduce me a Red Shell and a Green Shell by their color, don't expect me to call the Blue Shell by its original name
lariusx14 my nephew calls it the battle shell
it's a koopa shell for green and a paratroopa shell for red
shitshell
Actually the blue shell is called a seeky seeky shell, fact from science.
Funny I never even knew it was called a spiny shell
Oh, they're unfair. Not with just items, but they defy the game's physics as well. I'm sure we all seen them take sharp turns quickly without even drifting while maintaining their speed.
It's okay, we can too now because of smart steering
you can actually do the same thing if you quickly spam the accelerate button around a corner keeping most of you rmomentum and making the turn
They also speed up when further behind - far more than you do.
Yes!!
They also don’t spin when hit by lightning
The DS and Double Dash Ai was pretty tough, they are constantly accelerating and reaching topspeed of starpower in 150cc/Mirror.
Double Dash (supposedly) has the tamest rubberbanding AI. They only start to speed up once you play 150cc.
IIRC, Double Dash also has a technique where players can use MiniTurbo to dodge blue shells, (with frame perfect timing....) which makes it even more appealing to hardcore fans of the series.
I thought the DS ai was great!
catlover67803 Same here!
@catlover
The DS AI would accelerate for no reason in some cases. Some AI with obviously slower vehicles would still reach a higher speed than me on straights. It still doesn't make sense to me.
If the cpu AI is fair, explain the ridiculous snipes the cpu's can get. the cpu's have more of an aimbot, humans have more of a luck when sniping with greens and bannanas.
I do agree with you, the CPU's have impressive aim, I was behind one with a Bob-Omb on MK7 on Piranha Plant Slide, the few turns before the finish line, the one with the Bob-Omb threw it at the COM that was ahead of it on another turn and hit it directly. But that completely diminishes in 50cc, they can't aim for shit there.
humans have pot shots and hope, and lady luck flips them off.
I play races where I get sniped in fucking off road
Steena I agree
Other way around
That moment in Mario Kart DS where a red shell curves round your defensive item.
Actually if you go straight then it won't hit you. I feel this stops the defensive item from making you invincible.
I've discovered something I'm now quite sure of which only adds an extra layer to our frustration with the AI in MK8. And I haven't seen anyone else talk about it. Apologies if they have: When we get items, we have to wait for the whole stupid wildcard animation before we can use them. I have seen time and time again, AI enemies pick up items and use them on me IMMEDIATELY. That is a crazy advantage.
AI in Mario Kart 8 have a set item pattern set only to screw you over. When playing offline, you will most likely see these combos happen to you while in first:
Shock + Blue
Red + Blue
Shock + Red
Coin (1st place) + Red (2nd place)
Super Horn (held as defense) + Shock (+ red/blue sometimes)
Super Horn (held as defense) + Boo stealing it
you forgot Super Horn + boo stealing it + blue shell
Trent Mkw
Do people not know you can fall of the edge of the map to avoid a blue shell it saves around 2 seconds
KarateCreeper thats not viable if the ai is too close to you, they will just end up passing you by if you do that sometimes.
1 more red shell coming up get out defense just as soon as it’s about to hit you… BOO ATACK ( hit by red shell)
Shock + Blue isnt even bad its better for you because the shock cancels the blues impact.
You completely missed the mark on this. I don't think people are talking about random items, it's one of the main mechanics, you expect it.
No. The Ai is rigged. Not with items. With stats. They can keep full speed, and at the same time turn have a better turning radius than the best handling in the game. They also have max speed at all times, regardless of cart combo, and choose to use it usually when the player is second, preventing them to catch up.
Nicolas Allen Which Mario Kart are you talking about?
ALL OF THEM
-200cc
The AI can drive at top speed without having to drift (Neo Bowser City, Grumble, Music Park) and take sharp corners without having even losing speed even if they have the lowest handling stats. I saw an AI Rosalina going full speed at Grumble Volcano with a star and she took a sharp 90 turn and just continued like nothing happened.
The AI can also instantly brake to avoid obatacles on the tracks. Moo Moo Meadows is a good example: The AI goes at top speed at all of a sudden they hit the brakes and continue to drive safely.
Hell, the one thing that truly annoys me is that when a CPU is behind you, it's impossible to get it off your tail because it will always get a sliptream boost. No matter where you turn the AI will always stick behind you unless you hit the brakes.
Nyxael's Hub
About that slipstream thing....
It's so satisfying to watch them try it when I have a banana in tow, only to deploy it last second and see them spin out. Then I laugh at them as their position drops.
Nyxael's Hub Lol play Rainbow Road from N64 on 200c and watch as the AI literally zips from one side of the track to the other in under a second to get the boosts. The best AI will hit every boots every single time on that track.
Ohoho MK8Deluxe is unfair, but not on computer end. On other player end at least for me. Every race goes like this:
-I have pretty good skill and when items are scarce i tend to be in the lead
-red shell
-item box
-coin
-blue shell
-red shell
-red shell
-Finally gets double item box
-2x coins
-red shell
-red shell
-end in 9th
-leave game
I swear, there are only 4 items in this game, coin, red shell, blue shell, and star. I get hit by all of them at any time i can. I am a turtle magnet.
i am a coin and bananna magnet
No no, the AI I've experienced turns on a dime, instantly, and can drive through grass at normal speed on the road, plus sometimes my dad couldn't pass them with a star. That's pretty unfair.
TOTINOS Someone made a mkwii custom track that's all off road, it's impossible to win
jakinator agreed
1. some characters have better off road stats than others
2. the way that AI turns (at least the way you described it) only really applies to 200cc
Like someone said, it depends on the characters, and what cc.
@@someguy86 two years to late
FIRST!!! *Get hit by a blue shell* Aww... 399th
You spent the entire video talking about items, ignoring the fact that the AI actually does cheat (rubberband, take sharper turns than human players and gain weight as to not get pushed), which I thought this video was about, y'know?
Well here is your awnser
They dont cheat
That don't rubber band, look it up. They just don't. Research.
@@someguy86 nah. In wii i fucking see the ai speeding up to catch me faster than I can even boost. I refuse to believe they don't rubberband
@@siradmin6791 In wii they probably do but its about mk8 and mk8d and not wii
@@someguy86 They absolutely do cheat in 8 and it’s really obvious in multiplayer mode. If a player is first place the computer opponents will make it difficult for the other player to keep up.
Are you actually going to answer the actual question? Or just talk about psychology that has to do with the "perception" of unfair?
You are a moron
Um...He did...Its perception, smart one.
+Dodoki, I know this is old, but I made a response concerning the video and thought maybe your two critics could have a read. Here it is copy pasted:
"TL;DR Video didn't answer if game was unfair, it only answered if the AI blatantly cheats. It deals with human psychology more than it does the mechanics of how the AI works
Okay most everyone in the comments who disagrees with this video are disagreeing for the wrong reasons. Thus making it appear as if there are no arguments against the video because the majority of people reading the comments simply see the bad arguments and end up having a bad case of confirmation bias.
+Dodoki brought up a good question with him saying, "Are you actually going to answer the actual question? Or just talk about psychology that has to do with the "perception" of unfair?" Which prompted a couple people to call him names and parrot the arguments of the video that don't actually answer his question.
This video did not answer the question of whether or not the game is unfair. It did answer the question of whether or not the AI cheats. There is a difference.
For instance, I've no doubt in my mind the game doesn't give better items to, nor accelerate the AI in any way different to the player. That would be *cheating*. What I am unsure of is whether or not the AI collectively races against the player and has a bias about using their items on the player specifically. If true then that is *unfair*.
The video did not answer the main gripe we have with the AIs racing he sets out with as an example at 0:24 in that they sometimes basically gangbang the player. Now I'm not saying the AI is specifically designed to do this, it could just be random chance. However, I've had it happen enough that I believe it is intentional game design for them to sometimes unfairly pile drive you together. Prove me wrong, I'd love to know the true answer."
well there is a rubber band mechanic built into the game. If you are too far ahead it actually increases their speed and acc. until they are within a certain distance of the player. they even talked about it at either agdq or sgdq can't remember which one though. he didn't talk about it tho :( it actually is programed to screw with the player. just look at mc 64 ohh boy it is soooooo much worse there but meh.
Squirtgar nope, rubber hand isn't in this one.
I don't even have to watch to say yes, it is rigged, especially in 200 cc. How tf is dry bowser in the tri wheeler thing that has crappy af handling supposed to whip around a 180 without drifting and not hit a wall. Or get triple mushrooms in first. All of which and more I have seen. Oh yeah, I somehow almost forgot. Babywheights out-speeding bowser on a straight away. Bull crap I say
They also tend to use what characters prefer more. Heavier characters have high speed and weight, but lack handling, and putting them with a bike compliments the both of them. Lighter characters don't go as fast and don't weigh as much. A kart weighs more than a bike, so putting them with a kart would suit them better. Normal characters are fine with either. For example, in MKWii, everyone used Funky Kong with the Bowser Bike. That's because he goes so well with that. But other than that yes, the AI is rigged getting better items in higher positions.
The AI is able to pull of turns that a human player can't. As well as hit you with green shells while facing a different direction. And the AI doesn't need full coins to go max speed. But like the video said, these are done because the AI can't keep up with a human who can adapt and learn. Once you learn the AI's patterns, you can exploit them. The AI also makes up for their "cheating" by magically slowing down on the final lap of most races. And in certain races like Yoshi Valley, they always go the long way or bump into the fence on the shortcut.
@ Po-ke Watch
"I've done this myself on Mario Kart Wii, that is when I quit the series" Mario Kart Wii was unfair because the RNG was so abusable. Among a dozen other problems like bumping killing your momentum, bad track design, endless boosting and etc. I also wanted to quit the series with Mario Kart Wii because it was so awful. But then I tried Mario Kart 8 and literally every problem Mario Kart Wii had was fixed. It's amazing how big of a change Mario Kart 8 is.
And this video is addressing the idea that the AI is cheating in Mario Kart 8. Which it really isn't. In Mario Kart Wii, it was well over half the races, the AI would get endless red and blue turtle shells on lap 3 and throw them all perfectly right before the finish line. In Mario Kart 8, this hardly ever happens. The blue turtles show up more randomly and Reds spawn less. The red turtle shells actually seem to spawn the most in lap 1 and blues in lap 2 from my experience. The AI doesn't just save them all for the very end of lap 3 and pummel you with them. I also get a much higher frequency of Lightning Bolts. Which if you're in first place, lightning bolts actually help you. As everyone behind you loses an item and you all remain at the same speed. If anything, being in first place is too strong in Mario Kart 8.
its only in 200cc
I drive that shitty tri wheeler and have been able to complete about hal fof the 200 cc maps with 3 star. but i also pair it with wheels and kite that balance the stats.
little tip, in mairo kart 8 deluxe. I found out it's impossible for you to have 2 coins in your item spots. So if you pick up a coin, hold onto it. the next item is garenteed to be something else
if it were fair, you would not get hit with 4 red shells in first place by the comp, they would take out 2nd place if they played normally then take that spot, the computer waits untill its ahead of everyone else to launch their attacks, thats what makes it unfair. 2nd place is not likely to get 3 red shells but if they do thats fine, in the wii version, they get you with 4, so to get those odds, 3rd place gets 3 red shells and 2nd gets 1, launches 2nd places shell, THEN SWITCHES with 3rd place so 3rd place launches their shells. it is rigged
rune w jade What's also possible is that 2nd Place gets three Red Shells, and 3rd Place gets three to one Red Shell. The 2nd Place CPU wastes all their Red Shells on you, and 3rd Place passes second, via Red Shell or otherwise, and then uses their last Red Shell on you. It's not rigged, it's just bad luck.
this is going to happen with every game that has randomness in it
rune w jade no way
Computer drives don't attack each other they only attack you . trust me I did a test where I did not move for the whole race looking at the mini map none of the Cpu drivers ever attacked each other
v
I've got no objections to getting coins in 1st place online.
Getting coins in 5th-6th place, while everyone around you is on stars and bullet bills? That's a broken game and I refuse to support it. It needs reform.
You have to play smart in Mario Kart
apagan0075 That doesn't help when most things are luck-based.
Smart? Coins are _utterly useless_ against other players with invulnerability and weapons. In fact, they should be scrapped in favor of more speed boost orientated items.
And when I inevitably get knocked back to 8th-10th place and the game gives me single mushrooms is when I turn the game off in disgust (this has happened many times). This is not balanced at all.
abloogywoogywoo Yo mean being vulnerable in 1st. I know coins are problem but what do you mean by putting more boost power ups for 1st place racer or below 1st? Cause a mushroom is rare for 1st place.
apagan0075 It's not as rare as you think. I get it at least once every other race.
ok I will have a banana (get blue shelled).fine I will use a horn (gets booed).ok last time I will have green shells and a horn on me (gets lightning bolted).
any game with RNG will have that type of moment
i think that ai is unfair because they got better luck when getting items, they got consistent luck while players got random luck; plus as a player, i have seen that some ai's have different statistics when they combine character, car, wheels and glider than the statistics a player got with the same combination, for example i pick rosalina and she is a speedy character and sometimes toad passes me, this can't be fair because in normal circumstances (no items, straight road, no off-road mistakes) rosalina is faster than toad but he passes me anyways, that's impossible, no, I'm not lying
Fercho210991 u are right
Thats fake, I did a experimento and a peach, being 7th got an banana. _. xd
I'll tell you about unfair! I was playing Mario Kart Double Dash and I saw a Com stop and back up to let Wario pass them, every time we played Wario ended up in first place and all them coms helped him get there
Being consistent doesn't matter if you lose at the last second because of a blue shell.
Let me save you 9:36 minutes:
Yes. It's unfair.
In Mario Kart DS, I was playing the VS mode, GCN Baby Park, 150cc, normal difficulty. Out of the blue, on the last three laps, a total of FOUR blue shells hit me, plus an extra two red shells and a green shell, not to mention a banana and a fake item block. Somehow, I still won first place.
The computer DEFINETLY is unfair, whenever I get hit I get hit by 5 more things after it and fall into 8th place. Every time.
A good coin tip is if you have 10 coins already, keep hold of your coin
1. It allows you to gain back coins after being hit
2. When you next run into an item box, you are guaranteed to get an item that isn't a coin
And this is why you smuggle items.
Coolduude 2 even if you smuggle an item into first, its guaranteed in MK8:D that a Ghost item will take that item away at the last second. They are programmed to do that.
Coolduude 2 yes fuck yes
Well, on 200cc the AI actually IS unfair. In 200cc the AI drivers seem to simply use their 150cc settings modified to work in 200, wich enables them to take much tighter turns than the player, giving them an unfair advantage.
Mkwii is unfair, take the footage from the beginning you can't block blue shells if you're consistently in first place, then the crash, then the red shell because the blue shell blew your potential defense, etc
Trick: If you have a coin in first but no protection: hold it! Until you drive to the next item box. You are normally not able to get 2 coins at once so you'll get some kind of protection.
I play online and currently have 105 first places on 250 races. I don't want to brag but to get such a good ratio, there is truly skill involved. The trick basically (for me at least) is to have a combo that drifts and has a bit more speed than acceleration. Then, become first, preferably at the beginning of the race and drive over every coins, that way the racers behind you have a severe speed disadvantage. Of course, always aim for the double item blocks to play defence; a trick to get defensive items is to hold a coin and have only one free space when passing on a single item block, odds are you won't get another coin. If you fulfil these conditions, you have yourself a 1 third or 1 half first place ratio!
Eh
The AI aren’t programmed to win for themselves, they’re programmed to make you lose.
I know I'm SUPER late, but a lot of people aren't even taking what he's saying into consideration. I read a comment that said AI cheat the most on 200cc. They gave an example using Dry Bowser, the Bone Rattler, and Monster Tires(I think) saying that such a combo with low handling can't keep up with you. I've tested this combo and it's not hard at all. This combo has little to no handling and I was still able to at least stay on the track and keep good speed. (And I'm an inward biker!) I've actually spent a lot of time playing against AI and noticed that they won't even drift when they need to. They just turn. Turning is initially faster when coming around certain corners. And the thing about 200cc and AI...is that they're not even that good. EVEN IF you set them to the highest difficulty. If you truly know what you're doing, then you'll get a decent lead, no problem. 200cc Grand Prix are the easiest Prixs(in my opinion).
I think everyone fails to understand why things like this happen. (Multiple blue shells, AI getting bullet bills in 5th, randomly getting items, etc.) is because when the player has a huge lead, the game has to become more fair. This is arguably better than what Mario Kart Wii does, bunching all the AI together and hitting you with a bunch of items at once. I’m a veteran at MK8 and the Deluxe version, and even though I get hit by 2 or 3 blue shells each race and often I get hit by lighting and blooper, this is only the game trying to counter with a challenge, hence making it more fair.
Yeah. It's not just the AI getting Bullet Bills in fifth because you have a great lead, it happens to human players too.
Me: *has all 3 green shells around him
Ai:*throws 3 red shells and none of them hit my green shells
my counter argument is the computer's design is unknown. It could be programmed to use whatever item it gets on a kart immediately, or it could have an AI of sorts to calculate where you are going to be for what is available to it. When the computer controls 11 NPC's it has alot it can work with. However, if they are programed to "use upon acquiring" then you go into RNG.
Yes the computers are set to reach the finish line in a certain time which your supposed to be able to manipulate. The computer has been known to make maneuvers no human player can replicate. And i'm sure the computer players are doing the same in all the mario kart games.
The thumbnail is just cute. Mario and Bowser is hugging each other with cars!
It annoys me so much that the map is disabled in this video
I've noticed that the AI stats are basically irrelevant, though. I've seen AI with similar builds to mine, so their top speed should be right about the same, but somehow they out speed me in a straight line.
Also, on the topic of coordinated attacks, AIs seem to chain items on humans more than on other NPCs. 20% of all my races end with me going from 1.5+ laps firmly in 1st to finishing in 10th because a good six or more items stun locked me at the finish. Getting chained like that makes you completely unable to function, and the worst part is I hardly ever see it happen to computers; maybe a red shell then a bomb aimed for a human, but never such huge bursts as a green shell, momentum off the ledge, Lakitu drops you in front of a banana, suddenly you take a red, then a bomb next to you, capped by a star, then a lightning bolt so you can't even drift for a bit either.
I would say that I am very skilled at mk8, but there was this one Ludwig that beat me on 200cc by 11 points.
Please remember the SNES game that gave certain characters items at random intervals. I'm not talking about the item box, but characters like Luigi use Stars every 5 seconds. It's actual bullshit
In Mario Kart Double Dash, if CPUs are too far away from the players, they will ignore the hazards on the course. I do not think it applies in Mario Kart 8 but this is one example of unfair AI in a Mario Kart game.
5 times in a row at 150CC I finished 3th in DK Jungle. The last race. Every time the last TURN of the lap. EVERY time the same items. The same moment. The same scene. It's unbelievable..
Defense doesn't matter in MKDS, red shells *go around* bananas and will turn around if they miss. They can sometimes even go through a triple shell shield.
Can people stop complaining about “2nd place got triple reds when I was in 1st” ? It depends on how far away you are from the player, not the place.
"mariokart isn't so unfair, you can use defense" yeah it's so fair when a green shell hits both me and my banana, and when I get lightning struck right before I would use a horn to deflect the blue shell at the end of the track on the last lap and not end up in first unlike I otherwise would have
You can get upwards of 7-8 blue shells in mkw when frontrunning. Not to mention item combos like blue/red, pow/red, pow/blue(gets rid of shroom), shock/blue.
*But I swear to god, though. I rocked ass at Mario Kart Wii, but MK8D is much harder for me. This really should not be a thing.*
Lap 3
Finish line ahead
*HIT BY EVERY ITEM IN EXISTENCE*
Mario Kart 8 isnt unfair. I unlocked everything and beat it in less than 2 weeks(it would have been one week but time trials sucked)
I will never believe any of this. I was playing 200 cc on whatever cup Wario's Gold Mine is on, and I was far ahead in 1st. When I looked at the map, I saw the Inkling Boy, who had been in 2nd the whole half of the race, used a Bullet Bill and got ahead of me.
I'm pretty sure you only get Bullet Bills in 11/12th place.
Plus, I've noticed that there will be more bananas will be in places that I drive more. For example, if I cut a corner, then there will be more bananas in that area.
Spineys/Blue Shells don't reward the thrower at all, making them one of the worst items to pick up, despite how game changing they are.
If you know you're better than your opponents, try staying in second and drag a banana/shell behind you. Then hit the driver in 1st place with it at the end of the last lap.
Have you tried playing the Grand Prix in Mario Kart Wii??? It’s SOOOOOO merciless!!! As if YOU are their only target when they get a cloud, mega shroom, or star! When I move to the right to try to get out of the way, they ALSO move to the right to mercilessly try to hit me with these items! Even if I also move to the left, they SWERVE in the same direction I swerve! Why am I the only target?!?! Why doesn’t the AI pick someone else to hit?!?!
"One of my friends will always save a blueshell untill the last moment to cause me the most pain" i think you need some better friends.
I beg to differ. I’ve gained even a half-a-track advantage from CPUs in MK8, however had the CPU on my ass every single second in MKWii.
the reason i call it bullshit is because there have been way too many times where the blue shell attacks me *instead* of the driver in 1st. half the time, i could be in 5th place and the damn thing explodes on *me* instead! that wasn't a hypothetical, by the way. *THAT EXACT SCENARIO HAS HAPPENED TO ME OVER A DOZEN TIMES!*
There's rubberbanding, and there's the BS of AI getting 4 red shells in 2nd place! I'm dead serious, I keep track of how many item boxes I pass, which ones have doubles, and how often I get Red Shells thrown at me. If there's one thing I noticed is that I'm getting red shell thrown at me more often than I should. Unless 2nd place can get the Triple Red Shells (which is down-right BS if that's the case) then the only other way the AI can be hitting me so often with red shells is if the AI in 3rd place is working with the one in 2nd and both are swapping positions, just to keep red shells coming at me. It's one thing to make it challenging for the player, but it's downright BS if the AI are getting better items than players in general!
Not that it really matters, you don't get anything for 3-star ranks across all GPs or even get to show it off online like you did in Mario Kart Wii.
It's not the items that feel unfair, it's the timing. Why does the AI always use a lightning bolt when I'm mid jump with triple items, causing me to stop, fall, lose my items, and like 7 coins all at once?
Well, MK8 is more balanced than MK8D. Double items increase chances for obliterating 1st place, besides boos almost always steal your best 1st place items. Countless times have I finally gotten a superhorn only to be immediately stolen before a spiny shell explodes on my face.
One time an AI ran off the road and hit me with a super horn when I was already falling to my doom.
I've played MK8 and MK8 deluxe soooo much that I stay in first place pretty much every race, even on 200cc. It's not even a challenge for me anymore. I used to set the game mode to random course selection, 48 tracks, and I'm pretty sure I got first on every race quite a few times (I reached 10,000 coins in, like, a month lol).
Online, though? That's the only game mode that makes me feel anything.
Pain. The feeling is pain.
"Online multiplayer is harder than the hardest singleplayer difficulty" I'm calling bullshit. I can come 1st in nearly every race online, yet AI drivers just spam me with all their items at once, constantly. They only go for the player, not each other. Whereas players go for everyone. The AI is unfair because they are coded to target the player.
Alright, newer Mario Kart games may have tame AI, but games like Double Dash and MKWii have AI that LITERALLY CHEAT. In Double Dash, 50cc is a joke, 100cc is challenging, and 150cc/Mirror Mode is IMPOSSIBLE! In Wii the AI are just evil. PURE EVIL. Also, BABY PARK.
The ai still might be unfair. In the old Mario karts the ai used to be given unnatural speed to compete with the player, an advantage no human could have. I don’t know if Mario kart 8 is employs these kinds of buffs to enhance com players but it’s interesting to see in action on Mario kart 64
I noticed the player firehopping a lot in this video.
Lil tip? It actually slows you down considerably in Deluxe.
Even Online is unfair, As a Veteran, sometimes I'll be Dominating every Match. After, I'll be Getting Smashed by every item In Existence.
The problem is that the AI goes faster if you go fast, if you slow down, the AI slows down.
Kinda makes your efforts worthless.
Mario kart online is fun but man is it rough when you get hit two red shells before you hit the finish line while you're in first.
In singleplayer, though, the AI are only focused on killing YOU, not eachother.
The AI has a shorter delay between picking up item boxes and being able to use the item than the player so there is a short time after the first item box of a race where an AI can hit you with an item and it is literally impossible for you to have an item to defend yourself with. Therefore the AI is unfair.
Okay, okay, hear me out, 150cc Mirror, last race, you want that sweet golden kart, you're in first place, you know how to defend yourself and you are blessed with a super horn, you're really close to the goal, and the sound of the Blue Shell appears, you're not worried, since you have a horn, but literal LITERAL FRAMES AWAY FROM THE BLUE SHELL BEING IN HORN RANGE, YOU GET STOLEN YOUR HORN FROM A BOO, if that's not bullshit, I don't know what is.
And it's not a one time thing, it happens a lot, or you get hit with lighting, loosing the defense you had and then blue shell
There is a game with really unfair AI. Pokemon Emerald. The Battle factory is the realm of cheating AI's. When the AI lands three critical hit in a row and you on the other hand, keep missing your attacks, you can't blame your skills.
MKWii sucks when you're close to the edge and then a large character knocks you off wario's gold mine
I have never played a single Grand Prix that didn’t end with a blue shell knocking me out of first place right after my super horn got Lightninged or ghosted out of my hand
the ai is unfair. rubber banding, increased power item possibilities, and generally ganging up on the player, even when they're not in first place. these are things found in ever mario kart game, down to the very first. it's a fun game that i still play, don't get me wrong, but i enjoy playing with actual people far more than i do with ai since real people have the same crappy luck that i do. they also don't suddenly go twice as fast as me, just because they're a couple places behind.
I don't have an issue with the AI until the 200cc mode. These bastards are driving 200cc on Neo Bowser City _(arguably the hardest 200cc track)_ without drifting and WITHOUT any issues.
Yeah, the AI are unfair without a doubt.
To me the AI seems to have one very big difference, they don't seem to move like normal players. While playing 200CC grand prix you see AI turn extremely quickly without drifting etc. Not sure if this just looks like it or they actually are cheating, but to me it looks *a lot* like they turn abnormally
Lol one thing I love doing to my bro is the second he recovers from a shell a dart past him and throw a bomb behind me and it hits him it's so funny
From what I remember with Mario Kart, the "AI" would magically slow down to help you 'catch up' if too far behind or get every awesome powerup when you are too far ahead of everyone. To me thats not called "unfair" thats called GREAT game programming , Keeps the game FUN. If you played the game to win EVERY game because you are too good, then the game is now boring and you move on, If you lose all your games because you cant play well, then you move on because its not FUN. To me this is balance and keeping you playing :)
Mk8 item system is to blame. It's based on how far you are from 1st place. If the lead player gets to far away from the pack they roll mostly coins and everyone else gets all the good shit. If 2nd place pulls away too 1st will still have a decent chance of rolling other items (like those assholes that keep rolling double Bob-bombs by the time I get red shell or boomerang to stop them) to defend them self.
So I was racing in the Mushroom Cup on 50cc (to grind coins) and as I was about to overlap a couple of computers, they both got Bullet Bills. (This happened multiple times btw)
From my experience CPUs are annoying but manageable. If you consistently take the tightest lines and play defensive you can get away from the thing we all fear. The pack.
If you need to defend cheating as “a feature” that means the game was designed poorly. Simple as that. This franchise is 30 years old, there are enough systems to create actual difficulty.
Blur > Mario Kart
3 items, switch between at any time, and much more realistic physics.
So the other definition of rubber banding where ai players get an impossible speed boost absolutely happens in Mario kart. It's most noticable in 64.
I got three stars on every 200cc grand prix without smart steering, and it only took me a few days to do. 8DX's AI doesn't cheat nearly as bad as 64's or Super's did.
here's my problem,I tested how fair the blue shells were. I was in 1st place during an entire race in 50cc. I got blown by 3-5 blue shells. I stayed back and let a computer be in 1st on 50cc. they literally got hit by 0-1 blue shells.
I'm pretty sure in regular MK8, that the CPU get their items from boxes INSTANTLY
No. No to all of this.
Story:
Me:3rd
CPU: Second
Friend: 1st
I watch cpu throw green shell, miss 1st. Friend watches green shell pass him, he gets hit by a red shell, I watch cpu who threw green shell do victory pose, pass said green shell.
Tell me how that's fair?
I was playing on an emu though, so that COULD have been a glitch.
2:21 Not for me. Any and every point that I have a banana peel, green shell, or red shell, I hold it behind me until I would begin wasting item boxes.
Okay having analyzed what he said and having gone back to the game, I found something interesting. I first played on single player then I went online, after I went back to older Mario karts as far back as double dash since I personally find that’s the best one. First I find racing against real people to be easier, and way more fun then racing A.I., but this can be chalked up to me being a good racer, right? Well I kept this in the side for now. Second what I found is the item scheme in Mario kart 8 deluxe is bull, through the addition and replacement of some specific items such as coins, and allowing bombs in first, 3 red shell drops in second, means the amount of RNG that can screw a racer over, not because he/she is a bad racer, but purely off of bad luck is the highest out of any game. Third is A.I. do have some rubber banding, what do I mean by this, well, during a race I was rocking my normal of Rosalina with the hylian bike set up, its the final lap and I am at my top speed, banana shield in place, and the finish line I knew was just around the corner, then comes in toad rocking the beetle and what appeared to be small blue wheels that I never use, he beats me on the straight stretch and zooms ahead around the corner with no items? Does anyone else see something wrong here? This happened to me I’ve lost count over the amount of times. So why do I find racing real people easier? Why is the system so luck dependent? Do the A.I. actually have rubber banding? Well I might find racing other people easier due to me getting put up against people who are not as good as I am, and I’m not saying I’m the best but I am pretty good so, maybe. Why is the system so luck dependent is due to this allowing those who are not as good have more of a chance to get first place which is bull because there are better ways to do this.
This is just somethings that I found while playing the game. Anyone else have the same issues or experiences?
To battle this we need to make an AI that is taught by Q learning to play Mario kart
Look into the raw data of the game, the AI *literally* have an unfair advantage. They get stronger items at lower distance intervals.
That moment when u finally get a Super Horn than someone gets a boo item and takes the horn
I have gone back in MKTV and seen an ai throw three separate redshells one after another
In Mario Kart 8, you should technically have a 1 in 12 chance of winning. That doesn't seem fair though.
From the beginning, Mario Kart has always given the AI an edge against you. Even in the first game the AI drivers are granted special powers, like Bowser's fireball and DK's infinite banana peels.
Except Human players don't benefit from Rubber-Banding (accelerated speed the further back you are), which A.I DO benefit from. No matter how fast you drive the A.I will ALWAYS catch up.