Bass Drum Pedals Drive Types - Sound Pure Gear Tips
Вставка
- Опубліковано 12 сер 2018
- In this video, Sound Pure drums specialist Paul Spencer talks about the 4 different drive types in bass drum pedals. How do these different types feel under your foot? Check out Paul's rundown on this topic.
Check out our pedals at www.soundpure.com/search/drum...
This gear is available for our exclusive, free demo Try Before You Buy program. Just give us a call at (919) 682-5552, or email us at sales(at)soundpure.com.
Sound Pure is an instrument and pro audio shop specializing in high-end and boutique gear. Check out our gear demos, how to videos, and gear comparisons, and then reach out to our experts to help you make an informed purchase. We're here to help you find the perfect gear for your needs.
Having played on the first generation of Tama's Iron Cobra since 1995, and playing fast metal averaging speeds at over 210-220 bpm, I can say that chain drive pedals can be just as fast as direct drive if they are set up properly. I've seen plenty of disappointed faces when I show people what I'm playing after a show. All expected to see Axis or Trick or whatever, and got old school instead.
Gene Hoglan plays a set of single chain Camco pedals. 'Nuff said.
What I will say, however, is that after 25 years, I found my old friends just weren't able to transition into the more technical stuff that I now want to play. Speed was not an issue, but stopping and starting with speed was, as was a lack of articulation for more intricate patterns. I ended up buying the Pearl Demon Drives and within minutes, because of the similar approach with higher spring tension (higher than the Trick or Axis pedals), I was able to play them instantly, and within 6 hours was able to play parts perfectly that I had been recently struggling with. If it hadn't been for the newer, more intricate material, however, I would still be playing the Cobras.
So don't rule out one pedal or another based on some of the misconceptions out there. But indeed, as Paul says here... experiment with them. Not everyone needs a $1200+ Czarcie Kopyto pedal (though they are damn nice!)
I guess Im randomly asking but does someone know of a trick to get back into an Instagram account??
I was dumb forgot the account password. I would love any assistance you can offer me.
@Gerald Braxton thanks for your reply. I got to the site through google and im waiting for the hacking stuff now.
Looks like it's gonna take quite some time so I will reply here later with my results.
@Gerald Braxton It worked and I actually got access to my account again. I am so happy:D
Thanks so much, you saved my ass :D
@Dorian Rowan no problem xD
Great Explanation!! Cut and Clear. Exactly what I was looking for
HELL YEAH!!!
Finally i understand this. Its nice u can find every bit of info like this on utube..
Thank you! This is exactly what I was looking for!
Good job reviewing. Now I understand this better.
I recently played a Premier 252 after a gap of 35 years and it felt like yesterday. So fast and responsive. Best pedal I ever played.
Picked up a vintage Ludwig Speed King about 2months ago,took it apart cleaned and greased it up....that thing has everything you could ever want.....
I can't believe Ludwig didn't continue making them! I had a Speed King years ago also, when it started squeaking, I just cleaned and oiled it.
Good news!
@@davidfarmer8317 They recently reissued it with a couple of upgrades.
Thx for the comparison. I am a beginner, albeit a guitar and bass player for nearly two decades
Great video - thanks. Lots of good pointers. The direct drive's non-flexible linkage ties the movement of the beater to that of the foot plate, so beater bounce is always restricted by the mass of the plate. With a softer linkage the pressure on foot plate can be released, allowing the beater to bounce almost unrestricted. For me, this enables playing fast doubles and even drags (which I struggle with on my Speed King direct linkage pedal - but then it's almost an antique ; - ).
Also, the cam action of chain & belt drive pedals actually accelerates the beater while the speed of the foot plate is constant. This is a more energy-efficient way of driving the beater. So I'm not so sure about the whole speed claim around direct drive. It comes down to individual technique and power I guess. Maybe metal players use direct drive because it's the most robust, and it translates their speedy foot technique flawlessly to the beater without needing the assistance of an accelerator-cam action.
I never knew any of this. I use a double chain drive dw 3000 pedal for death metal and its a total bear getting it going and it’s exhausting. This was very informative.
awesome video. thanks fellas!
Amazing video man! Thanks!
Great video! Thanks!
Very nicely done, gonna go with the strap drive. Thanks. = )
Thanks for the suggests.
This helped a lot
Very helpful video
Awesome video. Been looking at an Axis as a rock drummer.
Very helpful.
The Iron cobra Hp900 series has finesses that makes them much lighter feeling even though they are double chain
I've never played on a strap pedal. Sounds interesting. I may have to seek that out.
Always used the Speed King and second vote would be strap drive when I've tried them.
Very intelligent accurate video. Many drummers do not know what they're actually looking for. Many also think that the fastest pedal is what they want or need. And many times that is not true. I'm glad you pointed out that the high end Ferrari type pedals are fabulous but need to be understood and DRIVEN CORRECTLY. With great speed it is required great responsibility. You should also compare the high end speedsters so drummers can make a decision which one to go for. I have several high end pedals but my favorites are the double Axis X short board pedal and the Sleishman double center loaded pedals, which is a bit slower than the Axis but is easier to negotiate. Still once you understand how to setup the Axis and learn what an Axis can do, it's hard to favor anything else. I.M.O
What lavalier microphone are you using? The audio sounds great!
EXCELLENT EXPLANATION !!! \,,/
Great for those who have the resources and time to trial one product to another. In my experience, I have used the stock Tama pedals that came with my 90 Granstar since 90, while testing out the newer products. I believe other factors that affect sound like, drum head weight, beater choice, micing techniques and ultimately front of house mixer settings may also be adjusted to achieve desired sound. I have been able to save loads of money because of this. But trust me, if I was corporately sponsored I would still use my 90 Granstar pedals
THANK YOU!!!
I find that I get as much power on a strap drive pedal as I do a chain drive. I think one has to factor in the type of beater as well because that is the sole point of contact with the bass drum. But in terms of the mechanics leading up to the point where the beater makes contact with the bass drum head, I find that the strap drive allows me to thrust the beater forward with a kind of fluid acceleration that I don't always get with a chain drive pedal. The rebound was equal to that of the action. My first kit came with a strap drive pedal, then I used chain drive pedals for years after that. Then I did a gig 4 years ago and the rental kit came with a Yamaha strap drive and I was like "f* ** me!!! I had greater speed and the amount of power on the strokes was no less that of a chain drive pedal at all. I did shorten the beater length as I usually do on all the pedals I work with so that contributes to the speed too. After that gig, I searched for a good condition second hand strap drive pedal on Ebay and got a 90's Yamaha standard for about 9 USD.
I'm certain that the lateral play on the single drive pedal has nothing to do with the single chain, but the fact that the pedal doesn't have a base plate, as pedals had to be portable to be transported with a drum set by cab or bus, which is why they fold like that.
Yip! Great call. If the base-plate at the heel of the pedal were to tolerance, you could have fishing line pulling the beater with most likely just Microns of play near the cam end of things.
@@remotexpolde It also depends on the hinge. A small amount of play at the hinge may translate to a noticeably greater amount of play at the cam end of the footboard, though not nearly as much as a pedal without a base plate, of course.
Do you think direct drive pedals would be a good option for djent and metalcore were there's a combination of both 16th notes and faster 32nd notes as well?
I love my axis pedals .I had the dw chain 9000 didnt worknfor me .
Mapex Falcon is all 3 😂 the drive can be converted to whatever. So... I think I'll get that 😆
yes they tend
To the point...short and crisp
Help me decide, Im struggling. I dont know what to buy, either Gibraltar 5711 single chain drive or a Vex double pedal double chain drive. I kinda want to explore with the double peds but Kinda want to stay on a single pedal . Help me pls sorry for bad english
Best pedal I've ever used was the Ghost pedal. Would love to see an updated version
I'm quite surprised to find out belts are stronger and more durable than double chains
@Stork Legs exactly! That's like saying a timing belt on a car is more durable than a timing chain. I've never had a chain on a bass drum pedal break, and I've never had a timing chain break.
@@leeschmitz993 if anyone breaks a chain or worse, a double chain, you’re driving too hard!!
Depends on the belt. I believe I heard somewhere there are carbon fiber belts now. (Not to mention Harley Davidson use Belt Drive on most, if not All of their large format engines. ..for like, Decades. I'm just guessing here, but if there were problems with using belts on some of the most torque-heavy engines on the road, used to haul 680lbs of bike (plus 180lbs of rider) effortlessly off the starting line... they might've switched to chain by now.
"Surprised", yes.. lol More like "untrue..".
What strap drive pedal is that? I’m lookin for something to replace my strap DW 6000 pedal, which is $250 now smh.
Would a direct drive double pedal be good for someone who’s wanting to work on playing stuff like thrash metal or metal core? I want to work on being able to play smoother and faster. I’m not really into heavy death metal, but I just wanna be able to play really fast with out so much weight behind it
There's an old saying: it's the Indian, not the arrow. In other words, a thousand dollar pedal is not going to make you a better drummer. Practice will
direct drive pedals are extremely professional :-)))))))
Im fixing some used ones I bought
tried a single chain drive, but for softer playing, NOISE of chain engaging over toothed cam annoying... Speed Kings RULE!
Forgot drumnetic magnetic drive.. I'd like to see that compared..see if people like it...
Twenty two?
@@Jackson-yj6tm Oh Yurr
Has anyone ever experimented with doubling up the strap drive to give the pedal a heavier feel similar to a double chain pedal? I have no idea if it works but I just thought of it while watching the video.
No, but I suspect it would make the pedal virtually unplayable because it would be too rigid. Try it and see what happens! Maybe I'm wrong and you'll like the result.
As a heavier than most player, and who also played a single chain pedal straight, touring/studio for over 20 years and not a single issue with my single chain pedal... (my double ply head on the other hand.. that's another story).. but this nonsense is exactly that. If Single Chain were That much of an issue, there would be a 99% increase of bicyclists being stranded on the road as they put their entire Weight on their chains... Not just one 'half- leg' of power in varying degrees. *Are the chains on pedals maybe a little lighter gauge? Possibly for cheaper pedals, but even still.. Go check out a bike chain and compare to your pedal. *Also, I might ad, Motorcycle chains are also single chains.. and while the touring bikes have thick ones, Dirt bikes/mini bikes- especially very small 2 stroke engines and accompanying thinner chains (which are still capable of ripping your limbs off) are literally pulling multiple Horsepower through these things. Unless your chain is built out of gummy bears, Strength is not what the focus should be on. HOWEVER, Touching on the difference between single and double chains in regards to moving extra mass.. This is where it comes down to what's right for an individual player. I have a double chain pedal as well and no matter where I put the adjustments, it is significantly more of a 'struggle' (for lack of a better term), playing very long gigs and keeping speed up for doubles, etc.. Which is why I am on the hunt for a single chain again. I want to personally put this to bed once and for all. *There is Also the Very underrated art of playing along to your favorite records (how I learned drums as an amoeba).. so while speed is something I could care less about in the Songs that I play, being able to keep up with Mr. Mcbrain on a quiet Sunday is where I would enjoy having the agility and lighter feel of a single chain pedal. (not to be mistaken for a lighter impact). Cheers! Hope this helps somebody out there behind all these 1's and 0's ~
You have some great phrases & command of English! Chain made of gummy bears, great image.
And I agree. Even though I am probably a much lighter player than you, I’ve been playing single chain drive pedals for nearly 40 years. Never a single break, issue, or mechanical failure on a gig or recording session.
On the other hand, I’m curious to try direct drive, just to try something different after all these years.
@@rhythmfield Thanks man.. Lol Appreciate it. Also, just fyi: I tested this guys " Single Chain Wiggle " BS across 3 pedals I own.. the single chain drive I have against the Dual chain drives - the latter with the most play made by a top manufacturer here in the US. . . All I can say is, Chain count matters not. Period. It comes down to quality control and build tolerances in the heel plate. (Single chain was less than 1mm side to side at chain end. New dual chain... ...eeesh....... it had so much play in it I think this one was meant for an amusement park challenge : STRIKE A SOLID HIT ON A BASS DRUM, WIN A CANDY CANE-SHAPED PLUNGER!!! ..I sorta get what these guys are trying to do.. And that would be fine.. if it wasn't entirely based on fiction/opinion. Cheers!
I'm a death metal drummer of 32 years and I'll still take strap drive over anything
do you know any death metal drummer use belt? most of them i see use direct drive
What brand/model is the 3rd pedal? The belt drive?
Lucas Jacks Its an old Premier 252 strap version.
Lucas Jacks ...and with compression spring system like the Trick pedals nowadays.
@@njramalho Tama king-beat had that compression system in 1978.
@@scottlowell493 Premier had the 252 in 1977. You can see on the Premier catalogue drums & accessories from 76/77 & Modern Drummer article from 77.
www.drumarchive.com/premier/
moderndrummer.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/md1.pdf
The 252 was the first of its kind. Alot of brands copied the compression spring after
Anybody know if a direct drive pedal would make sense for a jazz player (I’m a low volume player usually, feathering, acoustic)-I don’t care for blast beats or 500 BPM singles.
Old school jazz drummers have typically used strap drive. Why not go to your local music store and out some different types and go with whatever feels best to you
@@jmb92555 Thank you, that’s a good idea. I’ve been playing for over 50 years so typically I just go for chain drive standard high-quality pedals like DW 5000 and I love the more heavy duty 9000 - just wanted to try something new. So I purchased one of these high-end Pearls, it’s great, incredibly smooth action and beautifully built, put it actually reaches a little too high on a small base strong, you can’t quite get near the center with it. I realize these high tech pedals are typically used for heavy music, but I’m always reaching for something different and experimenting
@@rhythmfield Was it the Demon Drive pedal? That's a great one. I've owned a couple of them. One of the best built pedals ever. If I was a jazz drummer I think I'd find a good used vintage Premier 252. Reasonably quick and great control. You should be able to find a good one for under $100. My favorite all time pedal is the Taye XP-1 but they're very hard to find. I like to modify and upgrade older pedals. I'm using an old Mapex that I hotrodded. It almost keeps up w/ my top of the line DW5000. The 5000 may not look heavy-duty but it is a very durable pedal. I know several tour drummers who use them. I couldn't finish this vid bc there were so many falacies in the first minute or so I knew it was a waste of time. I seriously doubt that guy is even a drummer. Good luck and try that 252 if you can.
I didn’t even know those existed damn, time invest in new gear for drums
What is the strap drive pedal?
Nathan Maze It’s an old Premier 252. When I was buying my first “real” pedal back in ‘88, I spent a lot of time at our big local store trying a bunch of pedals out, and the Premier was one of them. Unfortunately, it looked and felt like a piece of industrial machinery under my foot and wasn’t nearly as smooth or responsive as I had hoped, no matter how I adjusted the compression spring. Interestingly, the similar Yamaha 900 wasn’t very good either, even though it was their flagship at the time but used a tension spring. DW also made a killer strap drive 5000 pedal that Mike Bordin used with Faith No More, and it was outrageously light and quick. I took the easy way out and settled on a Camco.
Yep. Premier 252. It superseded the 250 favored by Cozy Powell. The 252 was incredibly advanced for its time and had more adjustment than just about any other pedal on the market when it came out.
dude what's that beater on the single chain?
It's from Trick drums (Dominator model)
Direct drive isn't just for metal.
He didn't say it was, he merely used those genres as examples for possible use-cases.
He also said mentioned blast beats and fast double-kick, which aren't exclusive to metal or even heavy music.
i don't know if i want a dw 5000 pedal or a direct drive pedal
Our drum specialist would love to help you decide if you give us a call!
I play all the time and I always end up going back to my funky old Speed King. Because I'm so used to it, nothing else seems to feel right. Just saying.
I’m not upgrading anything until I deserve a direct drive or long board whatever...
Which is going to be a long long way off
generally speaking
A couple of disagreements:
1. I don't understand why a double chain drive would have a heavier feel than a strap drive. Cam shape and beater weight have way more of an impact on how heavy or light a pedal feels.
2. Direct drive pedals are more responsive because they are typically better-made pedals. Not because of the linkage. Axis, Trick, etc. are what you think of when you think direct drive. Those are precision-made pedals so, of course, they will be incredibly responsive.
Well... Never buy pedals for 500-10000000000 $ because you only will be good if you play alot
After playing direct drive i could never go back to chain
So for S's and G's ..Side to side movement is less about the single chain and more about the shitty hinge at the heel plate. ( you can see this in this video even.. O_o ( ! ) ...easy for people to make this mistake. I thought so at one point as well, until I saw an actual bass drum pedal and not a toy. Single chain, (& not even bearings at heel hinge, just really good bushings), didn't move at all. Any machinist can tell you the integrity of any moving part and how well it operates for a given function depends on tolerances, design and just good assembly. U-joints are a great example of this.. (Also, drummers still special order Single-Chain DW 5000 pedals). Whether you're a fan of DW or not, they wouldn't make a single chain pedal if this was a consequence of just a single chain. (6000 Series is based on some of the classic pedals from the 60's for instance.) Cheers!
For sausage and geotta..... 😂
and now you can see the scam. direct drives are just a fucking bar a metal but they charge you out the ass for it, and a chain w/cam, which is a complicated piece of engineering, is very cheap. direct drives shouldn't cost anymore than any other way of connecting to the mallet
Ridiculous comments. People with any technique don't break single chains (not on DW's anyway), then he says "double chains are more responsive", no, it is ADDED WEIGHT. More weight doesn't equal more responsiveness, that's not how physics work... THEN goes on to explain how staps are stronger than chains (straps WILL stretch, chains (with the forces we are talking about) will not.. I'm outtie-5000..
I agree with this comment. Also, the added weight of another chain compared to a single chain is negligible compared to the weight of the beater, distance of the beater from the pedal, spring tension, and the shape of the cam.
When he says about the direct drive pedal how you dont need to do much movement wise to work them that is becuase all of that hardware at the top of the pedal is so you can add a trigger more than likely which in my opinion is why direct drives are pointless becuase most extreme metal drummers use triggers any way wich is not them playing when reaching speeds o 230 to 250 bpm onwards
That isn't true at all. They are just good at double bass. You can go to some insane tempos with proper technique without putting in all that much power, trigger is just for the sound
So why when I saw r Lee Stanton playing for thy art is murder inbetween a song he hit his kick drum once and it played blazing fast 32 notes called using triggers to achieve fast tempos those pedals are an expensive waste of money yeah ok you may play faster on them but not to achieve playing 300 bpm
You are wrong about that. Triggers are for volume purposes ONLY. The Death Metal drummers are playing at the speed you hear it at. I’ve been playing drums for 28 years and I’ve worked for a major musical equipment supplier for 19 years doing instrument repair so I know what I’m talking about. If a Death Metal Drummer makes a mistake like playing out of time, you will hear the mistake even better with triggers than without. Drummers like:
John Longstreth- Origin
Dave McGraw- Cattle Decapitation
Flo Mourner- Cryptopsy
Spencer Prewitt- Archspire
Lord Marco- Rings of Saturn
and many more are playing there songs at the speed you hear it. Triggers DO NOT PLAY THE DRUMS FOR THEM! You should know what your talking about before you start running your mouth about things you have no clue about.
What the fuck is the thing attached on the side of the 3rd pedal? A cowbell?
give me your hair
Show the pedals then ffs!!!!
I still use my dw5000 chain drive with my single bass drum kit, it's the closest thing to recreating John Bonham's historic Kick Drum on the song Good Times bad times