Yes cause they did not put it fully clear here but after she turned them back to human they had a feast and one of them noticed late that they were leaving and rushed drunk as he was and fell from rooftop breaking his neck. Jay was planning mention but in the end did not fit in.
Fun Fact: I read somewhere that the ancient greeks saw Circe as a villain because she is a women who acted like a man. Through her power to turn men into pigs, she made herself forcefully equal to the male dominated world at the time. She treats Odysseus like a soldier would treat a war prize, in some versions forcing him to lay with her to free his men. Villainized because she is autonomous. Greek mythology is just so cool!😎
its funny cuz forcing him to lay with her to free his men is absolutely a villainous thing to do, but they considered it villainous for completely the wrong reasons
I’m SO happy you did Gigi’s animatic for this song! I love all the little character details they put in. How Circe undoes and re-ties her hair, how she circles Ody, how the nymphs are weary when they see Ody but relax when Circe assures them it’s okay. The way the color palette changes when she mentions the Underworld, and the animation for the smoke, how it’s all sketchy looking. Ugh I could gush about this animatic forever. I also just love this Circe design. She’s kind of has a lion motif happening. It’s really neat. The little drawing at the end card with Ody missing his wife and Circe just looking so done. It’s so cute and funny. Frick I love the Circe saga so much.
Circe protects her nymphs from all men because of how dangerous all men have been to them. But Odysseus when she served herself to him on a silver platter said “I miss my wife” and she thought “all men EXCEPT”. Which is why she helped him. Because he was the first man she had ever met who wasn’t a pig.
Side note at the end of the song you see a man dancing on a roof... that is Elpenor who dies by being drunk and falling off the roof.. and is then un-remarked. later in the saga is a CUT SONG that was going to be about Elpenor and his death but J decided it would be distracting and slow down the story. but if you are doing a death count of men you find out the numbers that 1 person dies without note. That was Elpenor. Elpenor us mentioned in lyrics in the livestream as one of the singers.but that is the only place J has put him in the saga.
I'm firmly in the opinion that changing Circe's role in the story improves the narrative - not simply because of some "modern sensibilities", but because it did not make much sense in the Odyssey in the first place. Ody should not be interested in Circe, since his established motivation IS the passionate love for his wife (and Greeks had whole philosophy schools on types of love; Penelope is his "Eros", his "madness" that he'd do anything for). And Circe should not be interested in him either. Why would she want some guy who broke into her house and threatened her with a sword? It makes MUCH more sense for the seduction to be a ploy to kill him rather than a sincere gesture. So for the sake of logic and things making sense, this outcome is much better on multiple levels. ...Also I'm pretty sure Ody and Circe were most likely not an inteded ship in an older, pre-Homer version of the story. Greeks were serial shippers, who made fanfics of their own fanfics of a pantheon all the freaking time. Ody x Circe is JUST the type of ship that would happen over time, simply based on the "hot dude and hot chick were in a room together" premise. So by the time Homer wrote this story down the concept was probably popular enough to make the cut. It just makes Odysseus sooo much more "impressive" as a hero if he manages to seduce a powerful sorceress, on his quest to get home TO HIS LOVING WIFE. Riiiiight.....?
So here’s something funny: the creator accidentally made a mathematical error it’s actually still been 10 years not 12 years but by the time the creator had this pointed out and he realized it’s true it was already too late
Odysseus not staying with Circe for years is definitely a creative liberty that Jorge took. Epic takes a lot of creative liberties for the purpose of adapting it to fit its intended message, especially in its second act. One example that’s already happened is that in the original, Poseidon never appears. I’m sure he’s mentioned, but he doesn’t come down, confront Odysseus, and drown his entire fleet like he does in Epic.
*chanting* Ody was not a cheater, that was a bastardized version created by romans (who hated him) and modern girlboss retellings that most likely didn't even read the original. Ody was not a cheater, that was-
@@PandaBear221Bthose kids weren't in Homer's version anyway. Odysseus bloodline is quite literally cursed not to have more than 1 son in each generation. It was contradictory. Also it was 100% not consensual. Especially Calypso. Any other version is roman and the Romans hated Odysseus so they villainize him way more ( no hate or anything, just saying)
@@PandaBear221B I think in original story (if I did read original story) he does on condition for her to free his men I will be honest... if something happened to friends of my wife and she "did the deed" to save them... I would be bit heart broken and slightly angry but won't consider that as cheating because there is a hostage situation here. I am not gonna ruin my marriage because of a thing that my significant other did without desire to do so. Reminder: These men are the men he is talking to for 10 years. They survive thx to each others help, he is no longer their king he is literally friend to them. He cares about them so much that he is willing to take risk of turning into a pig to try saving them blindly and unconditionally.
All the songs in the Troy saga come back in bits and pieces throughout epic. And many melodies and rhythms come back to remind you of previous parts of the story and it adds a deeper meaning each time you hear them. The underworld holds a lot of meaning from both previous songs and future ones by changing the feelings behind melodies and rhythms you have already heard. Everything from the Troy saga to the Circe saga get a bit of a different meaning after the underworld. And they are going to find a prophet who knows the future which is very fitting for how the saga changes the meaning of so much.
I think its interesting that across both song 3 and 4, Circe never really loses the upper hand. Despite her beast being slain, and a literal sword at her throat, the power dynamic never has her losing. Every advantage is in his favor, and Odysseus is still losing, and ends up literally on his knees begging her to help.
There are quite a few songs that chain immediately into one another with zero pause (Polyphemus-Survive, Done For-There are other ways, others in the future), many artists start or end their animatics with a small part of the adjacent song like the previous one. Never really ends up being a spoiler, so I wouldn't worry. I will say though, there are certain songs that I'd recommend putting in a single video because of how connected they are (don't want to mention names to avoid spoilers)
Enjoy the underworld saga. I think the whole of epic becomes very playing with your emotions. I agree that it needs to be a musical, i always say epic will be bigger then Hamilton
I agree that you couldn't do a character like Circe justice in just one song, so having multiple dedicated to her to let the audience know what she's capable of and why she acts the way she does was a smart move on Jay's part. In terms of Underworld animatics I'd recommend BrittPowPixel's for Underworld, Ximena's for No Longer You and either Gigi's or Britt's for Monster.
I'm not sufficiently well-versed in ancient Greek sociology. Was fidelity in marriage considered a similarly serious, important ethical norm as it is today? (Not saying people don't cheat today, but it is generally considered unethical to do so, open relationships being rare exceptions). Was cheating (by men, by the way) actually frowned upon? Especially at the time Odyssey was written - I think we are still way before even Socrates, Plato or Aritotle, probably by a few hundred years. And as I remembered, they very much shaped the understanding of moral and ethos. So, really, I just wonder if Jorge forms Odysseus into this more faithul character and re-aligns the focus of Epic from the original Odyssey simply because he wants to presents a piece to his audience that is closer to their standards and way of thinking, then the original piece which obviously refected ethical norms from 2-3 thousand years ago, in a very different society.
@@thomasdwyer1690 oh, I never realized Scylla was a nymph, but I don't think he's responsible for her becoming a monster? the version I've always heard is that a man (Glaucas, or something similar), fell in love with Scylla and went to Circe in hopes of getting a love potion but Circe was in love with him so she gave him something that would turn Scylla into a monster instead so that he wouldn't love her anymore. Can you explain how Posiedon is involved, I don't know a lot about Scylla's mythos :)
@@evanwebb6374 there are many alternate stories of the same scenario, in a different one it is posdeidon that screws up the love potion not circe. I forget the reason why though
"43 remain under your command..."
*odysseus sails away from island of Circe
"42 remain under your command?"
Yes cause they did not put it fully clear here but after she turned them back to human they had a feast and one of them noticed late that they were leaving and rushed drunk as he was and fell from rooftop breaking his neck. Jay was planning mention but in the end did not fit in.
@@galadballcrusher8182 Elpenor living his best life.
Talya and Jorge did a live action version of part if this song and the knife was a plastic fork and it was so funny-
Fun Fact: I read somewhere that the ancient greeks saw Circe as a villain because she is a women who acted like a man. Through her power to turn men into pigs, she made herself forcefully equal to the male dominated world at the time. She treats Odysseus like a soldier would treat a war prize, in some versions forcing him to lay with her to free his men. Villainized because she is autonomous. Greek mythology is just so cool!😎
its funny cuz forcing him to lay with her to free his men is absolutely a villainous thing to do, but they considered it villainous for completely the wrong reasons
And what she do with Scylla :/
I’m SO happy you did Gigi’s animatic for this song! I love all the little character details they put in. How Circe undoes and re-ties her hair, how she circles Ody, how the nymphs are weary when they see Ody but relax when Circe assures them it’s okay. The way the color palette changes when she mentions the Underworld, and the animation for the smoke, how it’s all sketchy looking. Ugh I could gush about this animatic forever.
I also just love this Circe design. She’s kind of has a lion motif happening. It’s really neat.
The little drawing at the end card with Ody missing his wife and Circe just looking so done. It’s so cute and funny.
Frick I love the Circe saga so much.
Same! All the lion motifs too. Such a great animatic. It's probably my favorite saga too
Circe protects her nymphs from all men because of how dangerous all men have been to them. But Odysseus when she served herself to him on a silver platter said “I miss my wife” and she thought “all men EXCEPT”. Which is why she helped him. Because he was the first man she had ever met who wasn’t a pig.
o7, Elpenor on the roof there at the end. 42 left under his command, now.
omg... I didnt even realize until you said so :o
I love that little detail
I should not find that as funny as I do🤣🤣🤣
Side note at the end of the song you see a man dancing on a roof... that is Elpenor who dies by being drunk and falling off the roof.. and is then un-remarked. later in the saga is a CUT SONG that was going to be about Elpenor and his death but J decided it would be distracting and slow down the story. but if you are doing a death count of men you find out the numbers that 1 person dies without note. That was Elpenor. Elpenor us mentioned in lyrics in the livestream as one of the singers.but that is the only place J has put him in the saga.
I'm firmly in the opinion that changing Circe's role in the story improves the narrative - not simply because of some "modern sensibilities", but because it did not make much sense in the Odyssey in the first place. Ody should not be interested in Circe, since his established motivation IS the passionate love for his wife (and Greeks had whole philosophy schools on types of love; Penelope is his "Eros", his "madness" that he'd do anything for). And Circe should not be interested in him either. Why would she want some guy who broke into her house and threatened her with a sword? It makes MUCH more sense for the seduction to be a ploy to kill him rather than a sincere gesture. So for the sake of logic and things making sense, this outcome is much better on multiple levels.
...Also I'm pretty sure Ody and Circe were most likely not an inteded ship in an older, pre-Homer version of the story. Greeks were serial shippers, who made fanfics of their own fanfics of a pantheon all the freaking time. Ody x Circe is JUST the type of ship that would happen over time, simply based on the "hot dude and hot chick were in a room together" premise. So by the time Homer wrote this story down the concept was probably popular enough to make the cut. It just makes Odysseus sooo much more "impressive" as a hero if he manages to seduce a powerful sorceress, on his quest to get home TO HIS LOVING WIFE. Riiiiight.....?
Remember.
He is an Ancient Greek. 😂
Nah, I agree with you tho.
So here’s something funny: the creator accidentally made a mathematical error it’s actually still been 10 years not 12 years but by the time the creator had this pointed out and he realized it’s true it was already too late
Odysseus not staying with Circe for years is definitely a creative liberty that Jorge took. Epic takes a lot of creative liberties for the purpose of adapting it to fit its intended message, especially in its second act. One example that’s already happened is that in the original, Poseidon never appears. I’m sure he’s mentioned, but he doesn’t come down, confront Odysseus, and drown his entire fleet like he does in Epic.
*chanting* Ody was not a cheater, that was a bastardized version created by romans (who hated him) and modern girlboss retellings that most likely didn't even read the original. Ody was not a cheater, that was-
I’ve read the Odyssey. Translated from the Greek. And Odysseus slept with Circe and Calypso. As a matter of fact he had two kids with Circe.
@@PandaBear221B But it was not consensual
@@alexeysimushov4971 debatable. But, either way, it's just a story. And Jorge chose to go another route. So let's just enjoy it.
@@PandaBear221Bthose kids weren't in Homer's version anyway. Odysseus bloodline is quite literally cursed not to have more than 1 son in each generation. It was contradictory. Also it was 100% not consensual. Especially Calypso. Any other version is roman and the Romans hated Odysseus so they villainize him way more ( no hate or anything, just saying)
@@PandaBear221B I think in original story (if I did read original story) he does on condition for her to free his men
I will be honest... if something happened to friends of my wife and she "did the deed" to save them... I would be bit heart broken and slightly angry but won't consider that as cheating because there is a hostage situation here. I am not gonna ruin my marriage because of a thing that my significant other did without desire to do so.
Reminder: These men are the men he is talking to for 10 years. They survive thx to each others help, he is no longer their king he is literally friend to them. He cares about them so much that he is willing to take risk of turning into a pig to try saving them blindly and unconditionally.
All the songs in the Troy saga come back in bits and pieces throughout epic. And many melodies and rhythms come back to remind you of previous parts of the story and it adds a deeper meaning each time you hear them.
The underworld holds a lot of meaning from both previous songs and future ones by changing the feelings behind melodies and rhythms you have already heard. Everything from the Troy saga to the Circe saga get a bit of a different meaning after the underworld. And they are going to find a prophet who knows the future which is very fitting for how the saga changes the meaning of so much.
Ah yes! You don’t think you need the tissues until you NEED the tissues. It doesn’t hit you until Jorge decides that it’s gonna hit you. Much love ❤
I think its interesting that across both song 3 and 4, Circe never really loses the upper hand. Despite her beast being slain, and a literal sword at her throat, the power dynamic never has her losing. Every advantage is in his favor, and Odysseus is still losing, and ends up literally on his knees begging her to help.
Circe is so pretty in this animatic!! The art style is great!!
"I can't get you home, but I'll get you to the Underworld instead"
Circe, sweetie, if this weren't a musical that would sound like a threat.😂
Next saga is the end of act one and it is so gooood ❤❤❤
Animatic recommendations for the next saga:
BrittPowwPixel or TheeArteest for The Underworld,
Ximena Natzel for No Longer You
and Gigi for Monster
I second all of these
I think in the stories for this some of it is debatable whether it was consensual on Odysseus end
There are quite a few songs that chain immediately into one another with zero pause (Polyphemus-Survive, Done For-There are other ways, others in the future), many artists start or end their animatics with a small part of the adjacent song like the previous one. Never really ends up being a spoiler, so I wouldn't worry. I will say though, there are certain songs that I'd recommend putting in a single video because of how connected they are (don't want to mention names to avoid spoilers)
Enjoy the underworld saga. I think the whole of epic becomes very playing with your emotions.
I agree that it needs to be a musical, i always say epic will be bigger then Hamilton
The most recent saga is going to be the hardest to adopt to stage.
“She sent them on their merry way.” Weeeellll I wouldn’t say merry.
I agree that you couldn't do a character like Circe justice in just one song, so having multiple dedicated to her to let the audience know what she's capable of and why she acts the way she does was a smart move on Jay's part.
In terms of Underworld animatics I'd recommend BrittPowPixel's for Underworld, Ximena's for No Longer You and either Gigi's or Britt's for Monster.
In the original Odyssey, Odysseus does not give in to Circe, is only child is Telemachus. (sorry if my english is bad ^^")
I'm not sufficiently well-versed in ancient Greek sociology. Was fidelity in marriage considered a similarly serious, important ethical norm as it is today? (Not saying people don't cheat today, but it is generally considered unethical to do so, open relationships being rare exceptions). Was cheating (by men, by the way) actually frowned upon?
Especially at the time Odyssey was written - I think we are still way before even Socrates, Plato or Aritotle, probably by a few hundred years. And as I remembered, they very much shaped the understanding of moral and ethos.
So, really, I just wonder if Jorge forms Odysseus into this more faithul character and re-aligns the focus of Epic from the original Odyssey simply because he wants to presents a piece to his audience that is closer to their standards and way of thinking, then the original piece which obviously refected ethical norms from 2-3 thousand years ago, in a very different society.
Be ready the underworld will destroy you
My favorite saga is done! Now we go to hell!
Poseidon is the one responsible for circe losing one of her nymphs, 10 bucks if you guess what the name of the nymph is.
Ooh, I didn't know Posiedon was the reason for that, I just assumed they were other sailors, who was the nymph?
@@evanwebb6374 Scylla, Poseidon is responsible for her being the monster she is, why do you think he never goes to her lair.
@@thomasdwyer1690 oh, I never realized Scylla was a nymph, but I don't think he's responsible for her becoming a monster? the version I've always heard is that a man (Glaucas, or something similar), fell in love with Scylla and went to Circe in hopes of getting a love potion but Circe was in love with him so she gave him something that would turn Scylla into a monster instead so that he wouldn't love her anymore. Can you explain how Posiedon is involved, I don't know a lot about Scylla's mythos :)
@@evanwebb6374 there are many alternate stories of the same scenario, in a different one it is posdeidon that screws up the love potion not circe. I forget the reason why though