I love the 11th Black Crusade because Abaddon's forces get completely scattered and it seems like whatever his plan was has likely been rendered moot, then he just stumbles into an Ork Waagh and is like "fuck it, we ball"
“Why, lord?” (Abaddon insanely vaporizes the fool with a blast from one of the Talon’s many inbuilt weapons…then thinks about it) “Because we are still Astartes. Now KILL THEM ALL!”
This is awesome. I feel like Arbitor Ian is really one of the last real 40k lore channels. There are a few 40k channels out there that honestly do a disservice to 40k and its lore. This channel has really gave me a desire to look deep into 40k lore.
This channel, Lieutin, Major Kill and The Remembrancer are my favorites. edit - also, how could I forget Wes and Sandman! And I get it, Majorkill's content isn't for everyone, but I enjoy his humor. There, I said it.
Hmmm previous comment got removed. Check out Vox in the Void for awesome audiobooks, and Warrior Tier. I’d make more but some Warhammer lore guys are apparently verboten, so I cannot. Isn’t Warhammer for everyone?
Absolutely love this video! I know people tend to hate on Abaddon, but I genuinely like the rewrite to the Black Crusades to have been accomplishing secret objectives. To me it would make sense for Abaddon to maintain control over the traitors by repeatedly thrusting them into conflict and keeping even them distracted from Abaddon's master plans.
I think the reason it seems like a retcon is because from the Imperial PoV, the Black Crusades seemed like individual attempts at conquering, and much of the lore is written from the Imperial PoV. But terraneaux is correct, from the Chaos PoV, it was intended to be one big plan from the point it solidified in the lore.
idk man, it does seem like a bit of a ass pull “yah, every time I failed? actually they were all successes! I didnt care about loosing x y or z, I just wanted the artifact!” If a few of them were like that, id think its reasonable. like the 3rd, 5th and 11th were actually successes. but making them all go to plan just seems lazy.
The Lamenters. The closest thing the Imperium (and, to an extent, the entire setting) has to actual good guys and all they get for it is being hated by everyone, constantly on the brink of collapse, and the Salamanders stealing their spotlight.
ADB's black legion books are really good, would highly recommend them as they make Abaddon and the black legion itself far more interesting than the generic BBEG army they look like at first
When I first started reading the Horus Heresy series I could not figure out why ANYONE would follow a boring, pointless fool like Abaddon. He was easily one of the worst characters in the series. Then I read ADB’s Black Legion, of which I am still waiting for the third book, damn it, and it made sense because in those novels Abaddon is a character that traitor Astartes would follow to the death.
Great video! You might be interested to know that, as you suggested, in "Vigilus Ablaze", the Eldritch Needles of Nemesis Tessera, the Gates of the Kromarch's Citadel and the Black Obelisks of Monarchive have all been confirmed to be made of Noctilith and that they were indeed Abaddon's targets in their respective Black Crusades.
My dude Arbiter Ian here telling us his upload schedule is going to be much worse as he's busy until after Christmas... Proceeds to have the most uploads of all the folks I subscribe to. Seriously impressed and love the video :]
I am proud to say that I owned that second edition Chaos Codex. My best friend brought it back to me from the UK and it still had the price tag on it (in pounds). My own Black Crusade never really got off the ground beyond one squad of metal Iron Warriors. But I did paint them. So I can still claim I was there in the beginning. I eventually did collect more than 3000 points of Iron Warriors, but it took me till 2023! So I did finish what I started, eventually 😅
I do like the idea that the Black Crusades were about accomplishing covert goals for Abaddon. But sometimes people forget the Imperium also lost weapons and war gear and even titans that couldn't be replaced. You have got to give the Despoiler credit by bringing out a huge invasion force to cause as much destruction and distraction from his true targets.
It makes so much more sense when the 13 Black Crusades are presented as individual events in a single ongoing campaign, rather than as individual crusades. It reframes the narrative where Abaddon was defeated and driven back into the Eye in previous Crusades, and instead shows that he succeeded each time, putting the pieces into place for a greater ongoing plan. This video made it all make sense for me!
I'd read the little Lexicanum blurbs, and was always curious about additional context. Great video, I knew you'd deliver the goods when you got around to this subject. Congrats on 100k. I've caught every upload since that very first timeline video 🤘
The historical Christian Crusades varied in size from massive (at the beginning) to being small toward the end. Christian Crusades weren't just proclaimed for the liberation of the Holy Land. The Vatican also declared Crusades against the incursion of muslims into South Eastern Europe. So not all Crusades were created equalling or on a grand scale. It makes sense that some of the Black Crusades would be less momentous than others because that's how it worked in real history as well.
A historical note: I used the word "Vatican" but during some of the time of the later Crusades, the Schism had broken the Catholic Church into two factions with two seperate Popes. One was based in France, the other in Italy, but neither one inhabited the Vatican. England took one side. France the other. This was during the 100 Years War.
Ah, the “I fell 12 times, but got up every time until I finally won on my 13th attempt” model of insane perseverance. Something we should all aspire to, aside from, ya know, all the murder.
Nice one! I've wanted to see what the crusades were, one at a time in order, like this for a while now. People making memes dissing on Abaddon and he's out here playing 3-D chess. The overall effect is a net positive for the setting as well, imo, as now we don't need some convoluted reason for Chaos warbands to be out of the Eye. Now they have a nice highway with lots of off-ramps that makes it easier (lore-wise) for them to engage with any faction in the 40-verse. Thanks Ian, you're a legend!
Another fine bulletin from the Arbitor. I suspect that the Gothic War would be a prime candidate for such treatment in the future; BFG is arguably Games Workshop's best game and the lore behind it is wonderful.
The Gothic War is a great example of what I wish GW did instead of advancing the plot - flesh out the history and tell us an interesting story without fundamentally changing the setting.
Regarding the Ghost War, in the book “Dante”, commander Dante is frustrated that the Blood Angels had almost been wiped out then, and have struggled to be at full force ever since- which surely helped reduce their effectiveness in defending against future crusades too
I love your tone and delivery, reminds me of my buddy back home with the power squint and confidence. Great content, you should consider releasing your presentations as a written book 👌🏽 thanks again for the informative and engaging story of Abaddon vid!
I fought in the 13th Black Crusade, back in 3rd Edition. Biiiig battles, lots of fun. Was kinda pissed when 7th changed the result, but now I can accept it, gotta EVENTUALLY advance the story.
Abaddon also has the advantage of time dilation in the eye. While it may be a few years in between every crusade, the defenses are generations apart and the current defenders are probably defending what makes the last attack seem like a legend or a myth
I find a similar thing with painting handles are craft knifes. I use very small round ones and all the others with fancy handles just feel like they get in the way.
to be honest, I at first entered a little sceptical, a bit used to the 13th Black Crusades being jokes about. I apologise for that. This was done PERFECTLY and very well. I recently finished both Black Legion books and learning more about them, it made me appreciate them more and more. A lot of respect for doing this topic well and enjoyably, will definitely be checking more of your videos now
They may be spread over 10,000 years, but like was mentioned. Time moves differently in the warp. While it may appear to those in real space, to be a very slow and drawn out load of crusades over vast periods of time, to those who were in the warp, this could have been a series of swift strikes over 100 or so years.
Abbadon's Black Crusades attempt to harness the, well, _chaotic_ nature of Chaos warbands, mostly to act as diversions for his own targeted strikes. It's difficult to juggle both the competing interests of the Dark Gods and the thousands of feuding CSM warbands populating the Warp. But Abbadon relishes a challenge, and is willing to take as much time as he needs to prosecute his war against the Imperium. As revealed in the Arks of Omen, Abbadon believes where Horus failed was by trying to decapitate the Imperium. But naturally, even if Horus has succeeded, he would have continued to fight loci of resistance for years after. Because the Imperium isn't the Emperor, it's everyone who believed in his vision. Imperial remnants would never stop fighting, and Horus would in that timeline what the Imperium has done in the canon one: fight a neverending war against insurgents. Abbadon's purpose was different: dismantle the Imperium piece by piece, so when he finally came for Terra, it would be totally alone. In that way, spending 10,000 years to bring about the cracking of the galaxy itself seemed like time well spent.
To be fair Horus Lupercal and his brothers even those who remain viable to this day rebelled against their 'father' and it was a personal fight for their perceived freedom from his >insert HR problems here< for them. Where Abaddon and nearly all the Traitor's, Renegades and force's to be raised since are fighting a political, moral and economic war against the Imperium. It's really a difference in SCOPE from both a writing perceptive and ofcourse META game play one the former you become which ever Legion/character represents you best. The later you can just self insert your own lore, characters, etc without issue as it's such a open melting pot of ideas.
When I read the background in 2e as a kid, I always thought the Wolf Time, Rhana Dandra, Da Big Fight and Abaddon's 13th Black Crusade were all references to the same thing - the end of the world, the apocalypse. Back in 3e when the 13th Black Crusade was supposed to play out, I gotta say I wasn't too impressed. The supplements and stuff they released were really cool, and the Lost and the Damned remains one of the few times that Chaos has matched the background on the table top. But playing the End of Everything out as a world wide campaign seemed shortsighted to me. I didn't want a moving story, I liked the setting and it's mysteries much more. I'd really loved the Armageddon campaign, and thought that the 13th Crusade was not a great idea in comparison. Now GW has sort of delivered properly on the Crusade, I think it's still pretty underwhelming. The giant Warp rift seems to not do much really, and the splintered section of the Imperium which is the most interesting part does not seem to get much play. That said, Spears of the Emperor is a great little novel. I dunno. I think the seeds for the dissatisfying present of 40K were sown all the way back then.
Rando:"Sir we have a literal planet destroying super ships on standby an torpedo's that can core out a planet why didn't you use those when the shield was down?! Also we spent incalculable manpower an resources just to barely capture 3 of these irreplaceable relics. Abby: "ch.. chuck a blackstone fortress at them" ☹
@lokensicarius9347 that's not what happened, Abaddon tried to destroy Cadia in the start and only because of Trazyn it failed, the fortress was already destroyed when he threw it, so it wasn't any sacrifice to him
Abaddon is no idiot, that much is abundantly clear. Even before Heresy when he was a devout follower of Horus, he had mind of his own about things. It was good to see the scale of his vision. It would also stand to reason that time was on his side. As it was said, in The Eye time has no meaning, and on top of that space marines live very long lives as it is. And as time progressed in the Imperium, the generations changed, some things became forgotten, given how information gathering and preservation in Imperium is not always at its best. And I doubt that Inquisition made it any easier for everyone either, given all their secrecy, faction infighting and inquisitors turning rogue or too radical to be taken seriously by the rest of them. So yeah, it's no wonder Abaddon's plan worked so well. The Imperium was actively helping him in achieving it, albeit involuntarily.
The 14th crusade will likely be in response to Gulliman pushing across the Great Rift into imperium Nihilus. I would assume the Lion will also be present during this crusade.
I like that they've fleshed out abbadon a bit recently. He's basically a favoured son of a favoured son, still devoutly loyal to Horus, unlike many of his traitor brother who are now just tools for the ruinous powers. He's playing them in their game as much as they think they're playing him. The Cadia book I think did well to set him on how, absolutely resolute he is in achieving his one goal. Destroy the imperium. Finish his masters work.
22:53 Wait, "two SEPERATE chapters BOTH called the Celestial Swords" got destroyed??? Well, now at least I know I don't have to feel bad about stealing someone else's chapter name, let alone their color scheme XD
I can't help feel the retcon is just to make Abbadon NOT a big, repeated failure, like a villain in a series of films (I'll get you next time! Mu ha ha ha) but instead is a cunning plan that were actually a success. Really.
I just think it's great that abbadon as two ways to view him. Theres how gw want us to view as this machiavelian 4d chess sort of guy. And theres the view of how most people grew up with the guy who failed all those times because 13 just sounds cool. It also didn't help his model back then was wonk. Only a matter of time until he couldn't put the bar of sucess any lower than it already was. Thats definitely precious.
Ahhh I remember when the original 13th Black Crusade GW event was run. A global 40k campaign where each battle had an effect on the outcome. Imperials kicked ass at that event. Shame to see it all retconned into this mess.
What book is that timeline from? (Picture) Is it from the fall of cadia book (gathering storm)? Ive just got a copy but havent read it yet, going deep on the hostory of the lore currently 💪🏽
People kind of forget. To the Imperium it looks like ten thousand years of failed incursions, but because Abbadon is in the Warp from his perspective it probably feels closer to perhaps maybe a few decades of decisive campaigning.
Great video. What I really hate about this lore, is what always bothers me with Chaos Space Marines stories - in the end, their only ploy is to do a dark ritual. There are cool bits, characters and scenes, but they tend to always come back to this one trick/trope.
Yeah, they had this plot device about the blackstone and stuff and it's just all they ended up being about. In a way, it makes the warp even less interesting because it follows a fairly predictable "physics" that you can control and direct. It systemises what should be madness made manifest.
I have a series on the Arks of Omen. Basically, they happen a while after the 13th Black Crusade. It's unclear if there are gonna be any more Black Crusades since his goal seems to have been achieved and chaos is just everywhere now.
@@ArbitorIan i watched that when you brought them out, how ever i will have to watch it again as i might start to understand and piece things together!! Sorry i have to rely on you as im an old fashioned fart that likes to hold a book and read it. Currently its a case of stalk GW library and buy as and when certain books pop up!! So you are one of my 40k history lesson!! 😊
Arbitor Ian: a normal person educating me (in simple language) on 40k lore.
A diamond in a coalfield.
I love the 11th Black Crusade because Abaddon's forces get completely scattered and it seems like whatever his plan was has likely been rendered moot, then he just stumbles into an Ork Waagh and is like "fuck it, we ball"
“Why, lord?”
(Abaddon insanely vaporizes the fool with a blast from one of the Talon’s many inbuilt weapons…then thinks about it)
“Because we are still Astartes. Now KILL THEM ALL!”
Abby captured a lot of Ork Psykers for his ritual.
See, if Luigi Cadorna had just launched a thirteenth battle of the Isonzo, he would have broken through. But that quiter stopped at twelve.
'Luigi the Despoiler' has a certain ring to it
well the germans did and they broke through right?
It-s-a-me Luigi!!
This is awesome. I feel like Arbitor Ian is really one of the last real 40k lore channels. There are a few 40k channels out there that honestly do a disservice to 40k and its lore.
This channel has really gave me a desire to look deep into 40k lore.
This channel, Lieutin, Major Kill and The Remembrancer are my favorites.
edit - also, how could I forget Wes and Sandman!
And I get it, Majorkill's content isn't for everyone, but I enjoy his humor. There, I said it.
Not to forget Oculus Imperia.^^
@@_walruseater Major Kill is a clickbait riding brodude. Not a fan.
Hmmm previous comment got removed.
Check out Vox in the Void for awesome audiobooks, and Warrior Tier. I’d make more but some Warhammer lore guys are apparently verboten, so I cannot.
Isn’t Warhammer for everyone?
@@No_nameOGnot for those who don’t want it to be for everyone - they won’t be missed though
Absolutely love this video! I know people tend to hate on Abaddon, but I genuinely like the rewrite to the Black Crusades to have been accomplishing secret objectives. To me it would make sense for Abaddon to maintain control over the traitors by repeatedly thrusting them into conflict and keeping even them distracted from Abaddon's master plans.
It wasn't a rewrite. It was always the case that his Black Crusades were an escalating plan that were dealing serious blows to the Imperium.
I think the reason it seems like a retcon is because from the Imperial PoV, the Black Crusades seemed like individual attempts at conquering, and much of the lore is written from the Imperial PoV. But terraneaux is correct, from the Chaos PoV, it was intended to be one big plan from the point it solidified in the lore.
idk man, it does seem like a bit of a ass pull “yah, every time I failed? actually they were all successes! I didnt care about loosing x y or z, I just wanted the artifact!”
If a few of them were like that, id think its reasonable. like the 3rd, 5th and 11th were actually successes. but making them all go to plan just seems lazy.
I love the tiny dig at the Lamenters.
They really always get messed up through mostly no fault of their own.
The Lamenters. The closest thing the Imperium (and, to an extent, the entire setting) has to actual good guys and all they get for it is being hated by everyone, constantly on the brink of collapse, and the Salamanders stealing their spotlight.
I need a version of Twelve Days Of Christmas but with the Black Crusades as the theme
When it comes to 40k lore videos, the field really is divided into two groups: Ian and Everyone Else.
ADB's black legion books are really good, would highly recommend them as they make Abaddon and the black legion itself far more interesting than the generic BBEG army they look like at first
This. I loved that series especially the kaion guy idk why but I loved his character
When I first started reading the Horus Heresy series I could not figure out why ANYONE would follow a boring, pointless fool like Abaddon. He was easily one of the worst characters in the series.
Then I read ADB’s Black Legion, of which I am still waiting for the third book, damn it, and it made sense because in those novels Abaddon is a character that traitor Astartes would follow to the death.
I’m only a minute or so in and the point that “Black Crusades” is an *Imperial* term for what happened is why I love your analysis of 40K stories 💪🏾🙏🏾
Great video! You might be interested to know that, as you suggested, in "Vigilus Ablaze", the Eldritch Needles of Nemesis Tessera, the Gates of the Kromarch's Citadel and the Black Obelisks of Monarchive have all been confirmed to be made of Noctilith and that they were indeed Abaddon's targets in their respective Black Crusades.
My dude Arbiter Ian here telling us his upload schedule is going to be much worse as he's busy until after Christmas... Proceeds to have the most uploads of all the folks I subscribe to. Seriously impressed and love the video :]
I am proud to say that I owned that second edition Chaos Codex. My best friend brought it back to me from the UK and it still had the price tag on it (in pounds). My own Black Crusade never really got off the ground beyond one squad of metal Iron Warriors. But I did paint them. So I can still claim I was there in the beginning.
I eventually did collect more than 3000 points of Iron Warriors, but it took me till 2023! So I did finish what I started, eventually 😅
The battlefleet gothic artwork is so iconic up their with so many other pieces used on many of the big distribution box sets. 👍
This video is everything I love about this channel. Engaging yet concise recap of established canon perfectly paced. Well done
I do like the idea that the Black Crusades were about accomplishing covert goals for Abaddon. But sometimes people forget the Imperium also lost weapons and war gear and even titans that couldn't be replaced. You have got to give the Despoiler credit by bringing out a huge invasion force to cause as much destruction and distraction from his true targets.
It makes so much more sense when the 13 Black Crusades are presented as individual events in a single ongoing campaign, rather than as individual crusades. It reframes the narrative where Abaddon was defeated and driven back into the Eye in previous Crusades, and instead shows that he succeeded each time, putting the pieces into place for a greater ongoing plan. This video made it all make sense for me!
I always look forward to your lore videos. You have a way of bringing the original 40k alive and make all the events seem like real history.
I'd read the little Lexicanum blurbs, and was always curious about additional context. Great video, I knew you'd deliver the goods when you got around to this subject.
Congrats on 100k. I've caught every upload since that very first timeline video 🤘
The 4th BC strikes me as Abby's Istvaan moment, where he weans out certain elements from his forces during a grinding siege.
The historical Christian Crusades varied in size from massive (at the beginning) to being small toward the end. Christian Crusades weren't just proclaimed for the liberation of the Holy Land. The Vatican also declared Crusades against the incursion of muslims into South Eastern Europe. So not all Crusades were created equalling or on a grand scale. It makes sense that some of the Black Crusades would be less momentous than others because that's how it worked in real history as well.
A historical note: I used the word "Vatican" but during some of the time of the later Crusades, the Schism had broken the Catholic Church into two factions with two seperate Popes. One was based in France, the other in Italy, but neither one inhabited the Vatican. England took one side. France the other. This was during the 100 Years War.
Ah, the “I fell 12 times, but got up every time until I finally won on my 13th attempt” model of insane perseverance. Something we should all aspire to, aside from, ya know, all the murder.
You only lose when you stop trying.
@@PinkyJustice Chaos are Anarchists
Nah we getting spooky
@@PinkyJusticethe imperials or the chaps followers ?
@@megaduck7965 yes?
Nice one! I've wanted to see what the crusades were, one at a time in order, like this for a while now. People making memes dissing on Abaddon and he's out here playing 3-D chess. The overall effect is a net positive for the setting as well, imo, as now we don't need some convoluted reason for Chaos warbands to be out of the Eye. Now they have a nice highway with lots of off-ramps that makes it easier (lore-wise) for them to engage with any faction in the 40-verse. Thanks Ian, you're a legend!
Abbadon has seen all of the Rocky movies. It's not about how hard you can hit. It's about how hard you can get hit and keep moving forward.
Excellent context and setup for this otherwise difficult topic to do justice to :)
Another fine bulletin from the Arbitor. I suspect that the Gothic War would be a prime candidate for such treatment in the future; BFG is arguably Games Workshop's best game and the lore behind it is wonderful.
The Gothic War is a great example of what I wish GW did instead of advancing the plot - flesh out the history and tell us an interesting story without fundamentally changing the setting.
Your pronunciation of Sigismund was awesome. 😮
Finally someone covers this holistically
Regarding the Ghost War, in the book “Dante”, commander Dante is frustrated that the Blood Angels had almost been wiped out then, and have struggled to be at full force ever since- which surely helped reduce their effectiveness in defending against future crusades too
I love your tone and delivery, reminds me of my buddy back home with the power squint and confidence. Great content, you should consider releasing your presentations as a written book 👌🏽 thanks again for the informative and engaging story of Abaddon vid!
How poorly is the war going?
"Allied Aeldari forces".
Ah, that bad huh?
Congrats on 100k! Well earned.
@01:19 wow, haven't seen that bit of artwork in a while (chaos terminator by, i think, adrian smith). what a treat!
FOR CHAOS!!!! Great video! Thank you.
Incorporating the black crusades into your chaos warband lore for bands loyal to, cajoled or coerced by Abaddon is so much fun.
Really enjoyed this. Great balance of length, detail and creative delivery. Very fun subject matter choice too.
100k! Congrats Ian, that’s huge! Hip hip HOORAY!
This video is absolutely epic. Wow. Just a tremendous channel here for the lore!!
I fought in the 13th Black Crusade, back in 3rd Edition. Biiiig battles, lots of fun. Was kinda pissed when 7th changed the result, but now I can accept it, gotta EVENTUALLY advance the story.
Awesome video. Thank you for keeping it concise, informative and entertaining. Keep up the good work.
Abaddon also has the advantage of time dilation in the eye. While it may be a few years in between every crusade, the defenses are generations apart and the current defenders are probably defending what makes the last attack seem like a legend or a myth
I find a similar thing with painting handles are craft knifes. I use very small round ones and all the others with fancy handles just feel like they get in the way.
Nice! I've missed your lore videos ❤
WOW... you actually made Black Crusade 1 - 12 seem not underwhelming for me.
Good job!
Love it when Ian drops some lore in time for my Saturday coffee in bed. Perfection.
Bit much to call them all crusades, one was just him going shopping for a bit.
😂,
Have you ever been to a Black Crusade Friday event?
It's a warzone in its own right! 😁
I would love to see you do the lore about the Betalis Campaign and the Doom of Mymeara as a whole in your style.
to be honest, I at first entered a little sceptical, a bit used to the 13th Black Crusades being jokes about. I apologise for that. This was done PERFECTLY and very well. I recently finished both Black Legion books and learning more about them, it made me appreciate them more and more. A lot of respect for doing this topic well and enjoyably, will definitely be checking more of your videos now
They may be spread over 10,000 years, but like was mentioned. Time moves differently in the warp. While it may appear to those in real space, to be a very slow and drawn out load of crusades over vast periods of time, to those who were in the warp, this could have been a series of swift strikes over 100 or so years.
Huh, First? What Tzeenchian magic is this?
You're actually the 1,011th Comment. Time and Numerical Order is meaningless in the Warp.
The 8th Black Crusade.
By the way, the guys at Poorhammer recommended your channel!
I love that the 11th was just Abaddon winging it after his plan went drastically wrong and just ends up with him fighting a random Ork Waaagh.
Love these campaign videos - should do one dedicated to the gothic war
Abbadon's Black Crusades attempt to harness the, well, _chaotic_ nature of Chaos warbands, mostly to act as diversions for his own targeted strikes.
It's difficult to juggle both the competing interests of the Dark Gods and the thousands of feuding CSM warbands populating the Warp. But Abbadon relishes a challenge, and is willing to take as much time as he needs to prosecute his war against the Imperium.
As revealed in the Arks of Omen, Abbadon believes where Horus failed was by trying to decapitate the Imperium. But naturally, even if Horus has succeeded, he would have continued to fight loci of resistance for years after. Because the Imperium isn't the Emperor, it's everyone who believed in his vision. Imperial remnants would never stop fighting, and Horus would in that timeline what the Imperium has done in the canon one: fight a neverending war against insurgents.
Abbadon's purpose was different: dismantle the Imperium piece by piece, so when he finally came for Terra, it would be totally alone.
In that way, spending 10,000 years to bring about the cracking of the galaxy itself seemed like time well spent.
To be fair Horus Lupercal and his brothers even those who remain viable to this day rebelled against their 'father' and it was a personal fight for their perceived freedom from his >insert HR problems here< for them.
Where Abaddon and nearly all the Traitor's, Renegades and force's to be raised since are fighting a political, moral and economic war against the Imperium.
It's really a difference in SCOPE from both a writing perceptive and ofcourse META game play one the former you become which ever Legion/character represents you best. The later you can just self insert your own lore, characters, etc without issue as it's such a open melting pot of ideas.
love your lore videos . long format is the best
Choosing when and where to fight is incredibly powerful.
Despoiler alert!
"From shame and shadow recast, in black and gold reborn" -Second Black Legion Warcry
Fantastic overview of a fun topic, great work sir! and many gz on 100k subs *\o/*
I love how you used both pronunciations of Abaddon thru out the video. xD
When I read the background in 2e as a kid, I always thought the Wolf Time, Rhana Dandra, Da Big Fight and Abaddon's 13th Black Crusade were all references to the same thing - the end of the world, the apocalypse.
Back in 3e when the 13th Black Crusade was supposed to play out, I gotta say I wasn't too impressed. The supplements and stuff they released were really cool, and the Lost and the Damned remains one of the few times that Chaos has matched the background on the table top. But playing the End of Everything out as a world wide campaign seemed shortsighted to me. I didn't want a moving story, I liked the setting and it's mysteries much more. I'd really loved the Armageddon campaign, and thought that the 13th Crusade was not a great idea in comparison.
Now GW has sort of delivered properly on the Crusade, I think it's still pretty underwhelming. The giant Warp rift seems to not do much really, and the splintered section of the Imperium which is the most interesting part does not seem to get much play. That said, Spears of the Emperor is a great little novel.
I dunno. I think the seeds for the dissatisfying present of 40K were sown all the way back then.
Congrats on 100k beast
If at first you dont succeed, try, try, try, try, try, try, try, try, try, try, try, try again and chuck a blackstone fortress at them
Rando:"Sir we have a literal planet destroying super ships on standby an torpedo's that can core out a planet why didn't you use those when the shield was down?! Also we spent incalculable manpower an resources just to barely capture 3 of these irreplaceable relics.
Abby: "ch.. chuck a blackstone fortress at them" ☹
@lokensicarius9347 that's not what happened, Abaddon tried to destroy Cadia in the start and only because of Trazyn it failed, the fortress was already destroyed when he threw it, so it wasn't any sacrifice to him
Needed to act quickly, Cadia plot armor shields were recharging
Abaddon is no idiot, that much is abundantly clear. Even before Heresy when he was a devout follower of Horus, he had mind of his own about things. It was good to see the scale of his vision. It would also stand to reason that time was on his side. As it was said, in The Eye time has no meaning, and on top of that space marines live very long lives as it is. And as time progressed in the Imperium, the generations changed, some things became forgotten, given how information gathering and preservation in Imperium is not always at its best. And I doubt that Inquisition made it any easier for everyone either, given all their secrecy, faction infighting and inquisitors turning rogue or too radical to be taken seriously by the rest of them. So yeah, it's no wonder Abaddon's plan worked so well. The Imperium was actively helping him in achieving it, albeit involuntarily.
The 14th crusade will likely be in response to Gulliman pushing across the Great Rift into imperium Nihilus. I would assume the Lion will also be present during this crusade.
Damn, Ian made Abaddon a credible threat and subtle tactical terror. Funny how good a retconned story can be when told all in one go
I like that they've fleshed out abbadon a bit recently. He's basically a favoured son of a favoured son, still devoutly loyal to Horus, unlike many of his traitor brother who are now just tools for the ruinous powers. He's playing them in their game as much as they think they're playing him.
The Cadia book I think did well to set him on how, absolutely resolute he is in achieving his one goal.
Destroy the imperium. Finish his masters work.
Love the mention of Kasyr Lutien. Best map in Dawn of War
This is epic ..i knew most of this from.the eye of terror book rules herm stuff ..😂 but so much more here 🤟
My new favorite video you've done.
22:53 Wait, "two SEPERATE chapters BOTH called the Celestial Swords" got destroyed??? Well, now at least I know I don't have to feel bad about stealing someone else's chapter name, let alone their color scheme XD
yes more 40k cosy goodness
"hold my beer... again" -Abaddon probably
Thanks for this video. It will help me decide which books to buy on Audible.
I love Abaddon going on exactly 13 crusades then stopping so as not to spoil the meme.
I love what gathering storm did, it turned the Long War into a guerilla war in the scale of the galaxy.
BEST LOREHAMMER UA-camR. 100% keep it up Ian. You are awesome
I think a fun fact is that now 10,000 years after the Horus heresy Abaddon is older than Malcador and ever was in life
I can't help feel the retcon is just to make Abbadon NOT a big, repeated failure, like a villain in a series of films (I'll get you next time! Mu ha ha ha) but instead is a cunning plan that were actually a success. Really.
Its not about the destination its about the friends we made along the way!
You made my weekend man!!!
I just think it's great that abbadon as two ways to view him. Theres how gw want us to view as this machiavelian 4d chess sort of guy. And theres the view of how most people grew up with the guy who failed all those times because 13 just sounds cool. It also didn't help his model back then was wonk. Only a matter of time until he couldn't put the bar of sucess any lower than it already was. Thats definitely precious.
The important thing is that, in the actual GW lore, he never failed 12 times. That's entirely an invention of fan memes.
This is just personal but I think atleast a few of the older attempts should but just attempts. Not all of them as apart of one singular plan
Ahhh I remember when the original 13th Black Crusade GW event was run. A global 40k campaign where each battle had an effect on the outcome. Imperials kicked ass at that event. Shame to see it all retconned into this mess.
that timeline graphic is nice
Is the Arks of Omen campaign not just the 14th Black Crusade??
The very best in the game, superb
Congratulations on 100k subscribers 👏
Hey Ian I’d really like to hear you cover some stuff on age of Sigmar
Welcome to the Black Crusade by My Chaotic Romance
What book is that timeline from? (Picture) Is it from the fall of cadia book (gathering storm)? Ive just got a copy but havent read it yet, going deep on the hostory of the lore currently 💪🏽
People kind of forget. To the Imperium it looks like ten thousand years of failed incursions, but because Abbadon is in the Warp from his perspective it probably feels closer to perhaps maybe a few decades of decisive campaigning.
Congratulations on 100K subs!
Abaddon is the true hero of the setting.
Great video. What I really hate about this lore, is what always bothers me with Chaos Space Marines stories - in the end, their only ploy is to do a dark ritual. There are cool bits, characters and scenes, but they tend to always come back to this one trick/trope.
It's kind of the only way they can invite their demon pals to the party
Yeah, they had this plot device about the blackstone and stuff and it's just all they ended up being about. In a way, it makes the warp even less interesting because it follows a fairly predictable "physics" that you can control and direct. It systemises what should be madness made manifest.
Siege on terra as primarch hubris is fantastic justification to tie up the fluff come on abbadon! All the best for ur war against the tyranids lol!
Does any of this link up with the vashtor Arkifane stuff, if i understand correctly Abbadon was involved with that too!! ?
That’s what happened next, after the fall of Cadia, while guilliman is doing Indomitus/Plague Wars
@@HistoritorJimaldus this time line gets confusing at times!! Lol
I have a series on the Arks of Omen. Basically, they happen a while after the 13th Black Crusade. It's unclear if there are gonna be any more Black Crusades since his goal seems to have been achieved and chaos is just everywhere now.
@@ArbitorIan i watched that when you brought them out, how ever i will have to watch it again as i might start to understand and piece things together!! Sorry i have to rely on you as im an old fashioned fart that likes to hold a book and read it. Currently its a case of stalk GW library and buy as and when certain books pop up!!
So you are one of my 40k history lesson!! 😊
Vigilus Campaign next? Great vid!
Ah yes, the Baker’s Dozen of Crusades.
imagine taking 10.000 years to do a puzzle, the armless indeed