Too much gun??
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- Опубліковано 8 вер 2024
- What do people mean when they say too much gun?
Instead of just one that is too big for owner, it is known to clay aNd game shooters as something else all together.
Enjoy
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Driving around in my Ferrari with the Remington 870 in the passenger seat....that's how I roll.
I roll in a pick up with a mac 10...kinda same
@@rjacobherman I roll because I'm fat lol 😂
Maybe this is my American perspective but I feel like people tend to have way to much cartridge rather than way to much gun.
Amen most people would be better off with a 20 or 28 GA than a 12
This is so true. It's due to social pressure, if you show up with anything besides a 12ga, you'll worry about being called a sissy. Sub-gauges are usually all you need.
@@cbro553 not necessarily that, more like guys are dragging 7 pound 12 bores out into the marshes and shooting 1-3/8 oz. 3-1/2" cartridges at ducks, then complaining about how the gun beats them to death. Personally, if these guys would drop down to a 3" 1-1/8 oz. cartridge my opinion is they'd kill more birds since they'd recover from recoil faster and get better second or third shots. Or if they wanted to throw that extra 1/4 oz. of shot, you should go up to 9.5 pound or more 10 bore, but a gun being "heavy" isn't much of a selling point so the industry won't push them...
You are absolutely right buddy. You don't use a Driver to sink a 10 yard putt!
I shoot sporting only and started with 12ga 10 years ago and haven't touched a 12 in 5 years. 20ga is my main choice, would shoot 28ga more if it wasn't so expensive.
Is it really too much gun if you just like it and dont give a toss if your form is perfect ect.. just enjoy shooting and to hell with the critics
There is much to be said for liking and trusting your equipment. That builds trust in your equipment and trust in your self and a desire to improve. Also learning your equipment to know the strengths and weaknesses is a benifit. I bought a cheap gun, took lessons, shot every chance I had. I didnt wait to plateaue to improve my gun, I bought a better gun to remove the cheap gun from the equasion and help my confidence. My shooting partner uses damascus sxs hammer guns and shoots almost as well as I do. He shoots what he likes and trusts. His arent as reliable as my modern guns though.
Reminds me of a quote from the film Dawn of the dead
"The only person who could miss with this gun is the sucker with enough bread to buy it"
Great quote from George Romero’s finest hour
I’m not a big shotgun guy. In the 90’s I was invited to shoot a charity event.
Explained the situation to my then FFL and they set me up with a Browning Citori Sporting Clays Lightening 12.
It’s the only O\U I’ve ever really shot.
I had a clays instructor look at it on me a year or so ago. And he said it fit me perfectly. 🤷🏼♂️
I may shoot clays once a year or two. So it’s fine.
Being a Big Blaser rifle guy, the F3 always appealed to me. But I never could justify it. I shoot rifles for a living. I shoot shotguns for laughs.
Better to keep it fun. The less I know the better probably.
Good video.
Regards,
Marky
Your last sentence is a truth many forget!
Your post hit close to home. I had a Citori low rib Lightning Sporting Clays that I did ALL my clay shooting with. I foolishly sold it to a coworker as I had moved to a different gun. That particular gun though fit me like a well broken in pair of shoes and when I missed I knew exactly what I did wrong making it easy to correct. The gun was also rock solid in function and durability. It had logged 70,00] rounds by the time I sold it and it wasn't loose.
@@parrisgeorge9708 sometimes in life, I just defer to experts. The shotgun guys say the Citori fits me like it was fitted. Why...why change it? 🤷🏼♂️
No every gun has to be a project.
Regards,
Marky
@@John1911 BINGO! MY biggest issue is that I have trouble leaving well enough alone when something's good.
Too much in the head is probably the biggest problem
welditmick Or too much in the trousers lol.
in our country (Georgia) , most people when they start hunting buy cheap Russian Baikal and learn with it, they are cheap and durable, specially i am talking about old Baikal, this guns are exact copy of browning and some other beautiful and exiting guns.
Very useful video. Explained exactly what I wanted or rather needed to know. I am new to this and looking to buy my first gun. I am fortunate for once in my life to be able to afford pretty much anything gun wise that I might want and after adsorbing so much information exactly as Jonny explains I could very easily go out and buy too much gun. Jonny's explanation is completely transferable word for word apart from GUN to a different sport which I am competent in, one in which I constantly try to dissuade people at all levels, but especially new starters from buying equipment too advanced as it holds them back and hinders them from progressing. I am going to take Jonny's advice from this and some of his other video's and go and get some lessons, I have a couple of clay grounds near by so I will try both and hopefully find an instructor who works for me, plan to try and shoot a few different guns and then settle into some basic lessons before making first purchase. My other sport is slalom water skiing and I would love to buy that high end ski, but skiing on the right ski for my level means I am a better and more successfully competitor. There is a silver lining though when I go out and with my basic ski and absolutely smash it and beat the guy's on too much ski. Maybe I will get the same satisfaction one day at the clay ground if I put the work in. Thanks too Jonny for another excellent video and very informed advice.
Nigel
Being 71 years of age, fatigue can be a real problem. I have had a really good experience with 28 bore. I use a Fausti Dea 28 bore 30" for everything from clays to pheasants. For hunting I have a leg up by using Federal Premium custom shop TSS ammo.
As a tall and skinny guy (6'2" and 165 lbs), I've found that a 7 pound game gun fits my body size and shape well. My 12 bore side by sides and 30" 20 bore over/under fit well here.
Fair comment about the muscles, I just used a club Browning for 7 or 8 lessons then bought a DT10 and definitely not too much gun. I improved hugely and quickly with a better gun.
Hmm. Why do I have a .45ACP? Because they don't make a .46ACP. But I'm American. That's what we do.
I love this! Too much gun... I’ve always had too much gun when you look at it like this, but I love beautiful shotguns and have a gun safe full of them. My wife says the EELL sounds like a huge bra, but she loves to shoot it too. We both shoot in the 80s and find that we don’t shoot any better with European guns than we do with Japanese Guns. She was listening to me talk this week and said that I was starting to sound like " that bloody guy you're always watching on UA-cam". Thanks for your insight and all the great videos. I know they take a ton of work. Cheers.
Very good advice....you need to learn to walk before you can run. I remember seeing an episode of Top gear with Richard Hammond getting to 'have a go' in a formula 2 or 1 car (probably 2) and the car was far too much for him, it was so far above his skill level that he couldn't control it. He could barely get it to move off the grid at first. I'm only new to shooting, but I'm grateful for the advice/experience/guidance given in this video and also from the instructors at my club who have been invaluable. Thanks Jonny and all involved ;-)
RE the Top gear car, as i remember it was a Benetton F1 (Fernando Alonso).
Your so Wright!
I Started with a 525 and it was a great gun.
Then 1 year on I move up to Pro sport 725 and found it hard for 3 months
Well hitting 83 to 90 most of the time now and loving the pro sport!!!
...add a choice of chokes and adjustable stock and you have the full recipe for 'Too Much Gun'.
I rarely use the phrase but did once when the guest of a friend on a goose hunting trip showed up with a Spanish 10 ga magnum double. He was about 5'6" and weighed maybe 150 lbs. He had walked into a gun store and just asked for something appropriate for goose hunting. If I'm going to be in the field all day, I don't use a 12 ga. It's really too much for all upland birds and a very light 20 ga double is ideal, so that's what I usually carry. Very comfortable and my birds are just as dead on the wing as anyone's.
Nah... if I had the money I’d buy ‘too much gun’ as I just want one !
I’m about to buy my first Miroku (ML11) but would take a Perazzi or Pro Sport or DT11 ACS any time.
I don’t think it’s too much gun... I’m too little a shooter....so perhaps your argument is spot on !
I own a Blaser F3 and have an older Perazzi MX8 on the way and only score around 70/100. I enjoy using it though so is it really too much gun? The shotgun world is full of snake oil anyway...a blaser does not help me shoot any better then my silver pigeon but i enjoy using it. what else really matters?
Enjoy his posts. And thank you for the advice.
I started shooting a few years back. First I picked up a 400. I decided to get a O/U . I had the means to get a more expensive gun.
I looked at some that I could have spent double than what I did. I went with a beretta 686 black onyx pro sporting on sale .. basically its a silver pigeon with a different look. Paid same as a regular 686.
Best decision I've made . I was honest with myself, shoot the gun well. And have no regrets. My confidence in the purchase came from one of his videos.. thank you TGS.
My boy in the army says if your gun is heavy then more pushups
Not just starting out can be aflicted by "too much gun". I underwent major reconstructive chest surgery in November. I was unable to shoot for 6 months before that. Just returned to the clays field this month and it has been difficult to regain the muscle memory and tone. I also learned my 626 nolonger fits. A quick recoil pad change fixed the fit and constant practice is slowly rebuilding muscle and memory.
It's like in the bike world, some people go straight for a hayabusa or an R1 and just end up a worse rider than someone who started on a 125 or a 250
Hi Jonny another great video especially as the man you describe is me to a T. Had a couple of lessons, not shot guns before, got my license but then the dreaded COVID has stopped play😩. So the lockdown period had given me plenty of time to do some research and save some cash, I’ve got circa £3k to spend. So I get it the first and foremost thing I need to do is get a gun that fits me well. I also recognise that yes I need to learn to shoot, build up muscle and muscle memory. So I figure I have 3 options 1) buy a circa £500 gun and put shed loads of cartridges through it to get my competence levels up - the trade in value of this option when moving up is putting me off this option 2) buy a couple of circa £1500 guns say beretta Silver pigeon and Browning 525 which seem to be consistently the top selling guns in uk over recent times so must be good - can afford both so maybe twice the fun or is this TOO MUCH GUN for a novice like me? 3) buy something nice like a Beretta 692 black which I know you like? Is this TOO MUCH GUN if I can find one that fits? Just thought of option 4) buy a Silver pigeon or 525 and something more tradition like an AYA? I guess I have options which is great, what I don’t want to do is be the newbie at my local club who turns up with a scratty gun that people look down their nose at me, equally, I don’t want to have people saying that guys got TOO MUCH GUN. I’m not that competitive just want to go to local club breaks some clays on a weekend and then go to the pub for lunch a a couple of beers, I’m not planning on being club champion but I do want to shoot well. Will be grateful if any seasoned advice - keep up the good work J 👍
Good flinch on the big boy !!!
Loved this one , great video.
I started with various cheap game O/Us then bought myself a Beretta 682 supersport , fantastic gun I used for everything from roughshooting to clays.
I then decided to treat myself to a new gun and bought a Beretta 686 Black Onyx , it was awful , I couldn't hit a thing didn't improve over a year .
Sold it and bought another 682 supersport with 28" barrels and back to hitting everything.
I guess it's just what suits you.
Well, the 686 IS a step backwards.. Maybe that's your point?
@@TheSoundOfTwang not really more sideways.
It was more a case of shoot what fits you , I just never gelled with the 686.
There was no cost aspect as they cost the same as they were both secondhand.
I'm 71 years old and I find the "too much gun" is very true, I've shot a 32" Browning Pro Sport for a few years now, but it weighs 8lb 12ozs and is a fair lump to move quickly. I'm now shooting an 8lb Beretta Urika and the difference is like chalk and cheese, so easy to move and the recoil is reduced too.
Unfortunately, guns are very ofter seen in the same light as cars - They have to have the 'right' badge on the bonnet!
Your advice is absolutely correct. Your gun has to become almost a part of your body if you are going to get the best from whatever skills you have.
The advice of a good, qualified and independent coach, can make a world of difference to your ultimate selection. The cost of such advice pales into insignificance, compared to swapping and changing because you bought 'too much gun'.
Great piece Jonny!
Still use my b rizzinni 12 bore ou
Sporter got it second hand in 1986 for £350
Lightweight and accurate
Even though you waffled a lot I agree. My 686E is too much gun for when I do my local club clay shoot but at a dedicated clay ground it performs better with the targets just a bit further out.
Excellent video topic! I am finally ready to graduate from my type 2 citori w/high post barrels after YEARS. I believe that too many Shooters want the best too soon, and are simply not ready. I am stil not up for a Blaser F3, but shooting all disciplines, maybe a Fabarm Elos N2 Allsport or CG is the next gun for me. After another 3 years, maybe I'll be ready for the next level. Buy once, cry once is not always the best route for growth.
Just make sure the gun is fitted to you properly. Then you will grow into it and enjoy it. I've used all of the shotguns you've mentioned in this video. Only thing that was important is that it was properly fitted for you. If not, you will struggle with it and it becomes too much gun.
I started deer stalking with a Bergara B14 synthetic in .308 with a Leupold scope at a cost new of £1800 and it shot sub moa at 100 yd’s out of the box with my own loads . A good starter gun and easy to shoot and I didn’t have to be too careful with it . A year later after seeing other shooters rifles and thinking I need something like that I bought a Sako 85M Classic de luxe blued with grade 5 walnut stock in 30 06 and Leica scope . Again it shot sub moa with my own loads but after a bit of load development . It cost over £6000 . It looked the dogs but was it too much gun . Well no not for me but I didn’t enjoy shooting it as much as the Bergara and I don’t know why , maybe loyalty to my first hunting rifle that was lighter and I didn’t have to worry about marking the stock etc .
Stick it your shoulder and shoot it. If you hit consistently then that is a good gun for you. I've been around a few shoots with people with let's face it (Expensive guns) and they could not hit a barn door with them. They would be as bad with a medium or lower priced gun as well. It's like stereo systems of old. I quite like vinyl and have a quite, very decent turntable amp speakers etc, Maybe my cloth-eared experience with that will not convince the mp3/4 crowd. It is the meat behind the metal with the ability to smash clays. As it can't be a total waste of money if you have the disposable income to enjoy something you may or not be good at. My MK38 and B725 will do me well I'm sure. Anyway love the vids, keep them coming. Always a joy!
Were does the 694 come in
There's a saying we use in field target shooting. All the kit, shoot like a tit. Basically you can buy the most expensive kit money can buy. But until you take the time to learn how you shoot and how it shoots it's going to make little difference to your results.
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@Chaim Uriah instablaster =)
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I think that "too much gun" commonly refers to the person who either buys over his spouse-assigned spending allowance or who buys something complex without having basic skills and knowledge to use it. It can also mean that a person decided to bring a heavy gun to a hunting trip and decides to abandon it along the trail halfway through.
FACT: There is no such thing as "too much gun" unless you are single-handedly managing to damage and chew up the club's steel target collection. Now that doesn't mean you should change guns, just change the shooting venue.
Too much gun. What's that mean? It's like too much money. No such thing. It's like a girl too pretty with too much class. A car too fast. No matter what they say I've done I ain't never had too much gun.
makes perfect sense johnny I started with a mk70 7 and half pound in weight and just upgraded to a xs pro which is under 8lb mk 70 shoots the same not much difference and it takes a lot of time to get used to the weight difference I shoot better with the mk 70 than I do with the xs pro
So right. First shot something lighter on lessons and before having my licence but convinced myself “buy the best you can afford”...got myself a lot lovely Pro sport and its too much gun! Find it hard to handle for much instinctive shooting style and now not enjoying shooting as much as I did. Tired working out in lockdown but alas same results. Should I just learn to shoot the Prosport or trade in?
Is a Yildiz pro too much gun for a first gun?
Who is Jim (5.47)?
Does this make a caes for getting a cheaper turkish gun, so you can get to know the way you shoot or what you want from a gun. ? Like I always say buy a cheap bike n tent because only buy doing it do you learn what you need / like.
Hi Jonny - all just 'too much info' for me to take in - IMO and I'm NO expert! buy a gun you like and can love and learn to shoot it well?? - unless of course its 'too much gun' for you! 😍😍
Hmmm...... I shoot strictly clays/skeet with shotguns and currently using Larona Eibar (which I love but she's seen better days) and have a ProSport 32" on its way to local ffl. Never touched one before because if its not a 680 series no store around here stocks them. I was convinced it was the right gun, but this video has me wondering. I'm a huge human so assumption was I could handle it, but you have me second guessing. How different is it going to be??? Great channel btw!! Love the content and honestly!!
So basically you should be saying “learn and become very familiar with whatever gun you buy.”
Like with most sports- people believe you need the best to be good, facts are the difference between say a k gun or perazzi or the likes and an entry level decent 525 or the likes in terms of mechanical advantage are minimal, the top level guns are fully customizable and are for olympic level guys who need that 1% advantage. Buy what fits you best, practice and spend lots of money on clays and cartidges and you will be good, myself i shoot old winchester 101s and consistently high scores, in no way a pro but they fit me well and i shoot alot- so i shoot well. Buy what fits and decent enough to last a long time
“Fuck you,” thats what we say when someone tells us we have “too much gun”. Buy the best equipment that you can afford, because if you have any mild interest in improving, you’ll eventually wind up there anyways. Why go through the process of buying, and selling off for a loss over the course of 6-8 shotguns before you get what you like.
Banging a fence post in with a 12 bore Baikal is TO MUCH GUN,,,,a 20 bore is plenty .
0:45 Is that the posh TGS shooting a pump action with a tacti-cool bullet sleeve on the side. Rabble rabble rabble.
Tis! Funny video, its on the channel give it a watch.
It’s a mossberg 500 with magpul stock forend bit of fun
Not been smoking that plant in the picture Jonny ? 😈😁
Thanks for the great vid 👍
You mean Purdey or anything above £5000. But the opposite is also true. I shoot here in France and there is a regular guy who comes along with a couple of cheap and nasty guns which he cannot improve on and is basically rubbish with. If he bought a decent gun, say, a Beretta 692 he would improve massively.
"You can't always get what you want, but if you try sometimes, well, you might find, you get what you need." Mr M. Jagger esq.
I am not a shooter, anticipating that however. Between your lines, i perceive that there is. potentially at least,
a huge difference between a game gun and competition guns. They may not be, if i understand what you have said, even compatible for the other purpose. I.E. the one designed for either purpose, game or competition, is ill suited for the other. You're teaching, I'm learning, I think. Herman Meilinger( on my spouses Mac).
Your video with Simon, with the Dickson, suggested that gun balance maximizes pointing speed, an advantage inherent to certain SxSs. Simon suggests to me, that swing technique controls that performance. Doesn't that suggest that the technical performance features of competition guns may be compensating for control better left to swing technique. If that is true, then SXSs have been the ultimate guns all along, but intolerant of unschooled "swings". Regardless, you have my attention. Great stuff!
Very informative.About to buy a gun. Not shoot clays for 30yrs last gun Lamber sporting.👍
I truly enjoy the video. So I am looking for advice. I’ve been shooting sport clays and 5 stand for about 5 years. I currently shoot a Mossberg International silver reserve II with 12 bore 32” barrels. I average in the lower 60’s depending on the course. I have fallen in love with the idea of a beretta 694. Is that to much gun?
Could you do a video on the Churchill method of wing shooting? It's my preferred method and it's not talked about very much. I know it's not the easiest for beginners as it requires a good amount of muscle memory and knowledge of gun fit but it can provide alot of benefits for trap and skeet shooters as well as hunters alike. Huge fan of the channel, keep it up!
Too much gun? Well I put a Mamoth 63g through my A400 Xtreme Plus, and that is the only time I have noticed the Kick-off working. Took me by surprise and nearly my head off. However, it also shoots 21g and I still can’t hit anything. When will your simulator be up and running?
Maybe gun shops should be brutally honest with customers. I asked should I buy cheaper or go straight in.. i was told you'll get used to it.. When I bought my first gun, a 694 the shop had no issue selling me it. I did say it was my first gun too. Now struggling with it ... so tried again and bought pro sport! 🤦♂️ felt great trying it out but I feel I massively ran before crawling.. anyone got a silver pigeon for sale ...
Have an expert fit the gun to you properly. It will work.
And the answer is blaser F-16
I don't shoot shotguns but I can relate to this 👍
Too much gun means too much recoil
my head hurts !!!
Great video guys
If a gun doesn't like the way I shoot, then I pull out mid 1960s era Fred Bear recurve bow, and shoot dove out of the air. ; )
True story.
Men with guns are like Women with Lois Vitton handbags. That's way too much handbag.£££££
Good point Jonny.
Hi TGS,
So while not in the UK. I am about to buy a O/U and will use it for a mix between rabbits, foxes and clays.
I can get a new MK70 sporter. Or there is a 2019 beretta silver pigeon second hand that someone has just traded in for just about the same price.
Can’t afford both. What would be your pick?
@TGS Outdoors This makes me think: I am 6' 3". I have got a Browning 723 S1 with 30" barrels and the palmswell... On a good day at Skeet, I hit 11 out of 15. Is the 725 too much gun for me?
I presume you have stock spacers in there?
@@tgsoutdoors Yes, I have the medium thickness pad installed. Length of pull is now just shy of 15" (38 cm, to be exact). I have pretty long legs and arms. My jeans are 36 inches long, for instance.
Guns aren't like in games... you don't "level up" to better ones once you gain XP from "missions" lol. when you start out, try other people's guns out to figure out what you like and don't, then buy what will do what you want it to do, that is in your budget. I've shot since I was 8, and still can't stand heavy or excessively long guns; I used to carry Machine guns for the army lol. most shotguns and rifles that weigh half or better of what a M249 weighs are rather silly to me.
the old saying You Can't Buy a Score
But you can cheat yourself one 😂
Buy a lanber sporter do anythg you want. For 450 quid
I want to buy a Browning 525 SL how do you know what's too much gun if you can't try before you buy? Lol
For a first gun, just get a Yildiz SPZ ME steel, problem solved.
why spend too much when you don't even know if you like the sport first?
Just starting out at all this, I understand the "to much" or you won't get its potential from it, thats the same in any sport, what about something you could grow with and develope your skills? So you only buy one (for now 🤣) or would you be better with a budget shot gun to start, and learn to shoot with somthing not so great and then progress?
I'm really really confused now....
John, ref the other half being 44 kilos, in my 72 years I have been with several young loverly lady's with thighs weighing more than that .
😂 I am familiar with their kind also
Do u sell good quality air rifles up at TGS might take a trip up sometime soon when covids gone
That's why you learn to ride a motorbike with a 50cc engine not a 1200 cc 200mph monster .
Buy a 20 bore !
I have to laugh at Jonny's reference to the 50 S&W being too much gun for a burglar. Fact is that most people who have spent a fair bit around firearms wont even dust off the 50 S&W, they will leave it locked up in the safe and choose a far more devastating firearm to defend themselves. That being a 12 gauge Shotgun. With a load of #1 buck you have near 500 grains of 30 caliber balls numbering a count of 16 and moving at roughly 1300 feet per second.
That said I do get where Jonny is coming from concerning "Too much Gun". I started busting Clays shooting Trap in 2018 and Now have that sport down pretty well. This summers project is learning to shoot Skeet. Also picked up a 20 Gauge 686 to go with my 12 Gauge 686 Sporting. Last weekend was a 300 round weekend evenly divided between the 20 and the 12 over both Saturday and Sunday. Sunday we had some pretty gusty conditions and I had a much easier time catching up to wind driven clays with the 20 than I did with the 12. Quite simply on Sunday my 12 gauge was too much gun.
Too little gun?
Cracking topic for discussion
Oh yes!
Much more interesting
Lol where I come from it's known as "all the gear no idea" or of course "more money than sense" but I see where you're coming from. However is it too much to shoot pigeons off my neighbours shed roof with a 50 BMG ?
How long have you got...?😆 I was in conversation with a world champion clay shot the other day who confessed he could not hit clays with a side by side but shot game ok with one, even though it was not his usual gun. Too much gun or too reliant on technique? It’s a fascinating question.
Too reliant on technique is a very interesting concept 🤔
@@tgsoutdoors ... I thought that might resonate. I firmly believe (and teach) that the highest level in game shooting is to free the subconscious mind so that you are not consciously in control of the shot. We Europeans call it 'The Flow Experience'; the Americans call it 'The Zone'; but the real experts in this field come at it from a completely different angle.