Great detailed video. Being able to run your Central AC system off a portable generator, is much better than buying and installing window units. I just installed this same Soft Start on our Lennox 3-ton AC system. We have a Predator 9000/7250 watts generator that I installed a Tri-fuel Kit (Motor Snorkel). The Motor Snorkel is the best Tri-fuel kit you can buy and install. It works very well, with minimal power lose when using NG. That's because you can adjust the air/fuel mixture with the regulator. Unlike already Tri-fuel generator that have fixed jets in the carburetor. The LRA w/o any hard/soft start was 57.1 amps. Our generator, on gasoline, couldn't start our AC. I installed a Hard Start, which bought the LRA down to 37.1 amps. Now our generator could start our AC on gasoline, but not NG. I removed the Hard Start and installed the Soft Start. The LRA came down to 20.8 amps. Now our generator can start/run our AC system and whole house on NG. We do have to turn the AC off, when running high wattage items, like the Microwave, gas dryer, sum pump and coffee maker to name a few. These items will bog the generator down and bring down the hertz well below 60 hertz. On NG, 6000 watts was about the max I was able to safely run on our generator.
Thanks for sharing! I'm always curious to see the difference between a hard start and a soft start and it great that you have numbers. If you get an inverter generator, the frequency will always be the same. I got one because I have a lot of electronics and I didn't want to damage them when I'm on generator power. The THD of regular generators can be pretty bad for electronics. Glad your setup is working out! It's almost cool enough for me to install the motor snorkel. Probably will be getting to that project pretty soon.
The inverter generator is the way to go for that perfect 60 htz. After over 80 hrs. of use with our Predator 9000/7250 watts Tri-fuel generator, we haven't had any issues with our electronics. At this time, I would only buy an inverter generator, when our current one fails.
Quick question I have the same generator predator 9000 what would you recommend for installing soft start or hard start for ac unit and thanks On advanced
This is the exact emergency setup i am working on in my 2800 sq ft 1 year old home here in New Caney TX. This Geny is great as we have had to use it in our new construction neighborhood a few times do to prolonged power outages with an installed Interlock Switch at our panel. The questions I had for my setup running my ac condenser with the exact same geny, you have answered and i am now considering purchasing the soft start. I have only run this geny on gas, but have purchased the nat gas snorkel conversion kit. I am looking forward to your nat gas conversion video. Thanks!
@@davidh3861 the ASY-368-X72-BLUE is rated for up to a 6 ton AC compressor. I just ordered one for my 5 ton unit. Unfortunately, It won't be an apples to apples comparison, because I have a 10,000-wat generator.
I have the same setup (Champion 100520, Trane XR16 4TTR6048J, EasyStart and NG conversion). I haven't tested my system on NG yet because once I installed the EasyStart, the bluetooth app read about 21A live current & 37A for last peak start, which exceeds the capability of the 100520 on NG (roughly 5740W running/7175W starting). I grabbed a new amp meter with inrush metering and it reads much more reasonable 18A running and ~23.5A inrush to the condenser, which is much more expected when you check the LRA/RLA listed by Trane for this model (18.5/124). Waiting for a response back from Microair regarding this now.
That's awesome that you have the same setup! I've been really wanting to test it out with NG, but haven't done the conversion yet. If you already have NG setup, I think it would be fine to just test it out. You won't know unless you try. All that happens if you go beyond the power of the generator will be that it stalls and all the power goes out. I did this a few times before installing the soft start when I was trying to run the AC by itself. Looking forward to hear your findings whatever you do. Thanks for sharing!
Yes, it was surprising to see someone else with the same setup. I have the motor snorkel installed and tested locally but I don't have 30a service pulled over where my gas disconnect is (roughly 90' away unfortunately). I will pull cable once I have some free time and a death wish to spend more time in my attic.
@@effingv Ah, yeah... NG and electricity being in different areas is annoying. I bought a 80' or so long extension cord - it was pretty expensive, especially with how much copper is these days, but I figure it was an investment and gave me a lot of flexibility to have the generator wherever I need.
Just to follow up on this, I got the AC working on NG. I also see the same numbers (37A peak start), but it somehow still works. I'm guessing the EasyStart reading is not completely accurate? I can't imagine the generator being able to generate 8880W peak power... and this somewhat seems to be confirmed by you measuring with an independent inrush meter. If you're interested to see the latest video, it's over here: ua-cam.com/video/Fgqlg9NThBM/v-deo.html Thanks for sharing your experience!
Open the unit and flip the capacitor. Now it’s facing right for the wire. Assuming it’s possible, probably not. Thanks for the video, going this route also.
Thanks for sharing. I learned a lot. I'm really looking forward to your next adventure -- converting to NG. I've seen a lot of videos of folks who did the gas/NG conversion but none of them showed their generator running under load. I'd hate to buy a kit only to discover that NG doesn't have the energy density required to run (at least) my AC.
Probably won’t end up doing this until the fall. 100 degree weather in Texas makes me dread being in the garage for any longer than I have to (call me spoiled)! Thanks for commenting and your support!
I was planning on Purchasing one to put on my AC unit($354) because my 7000 running watt generator want start the AC , But first i removed the Panel on my AC to see if there was room to install the unit behind the cover area I noticed on the back of the cover was a Factory wiring diagram for the AC Unit and noticed it showed a Run Capacitor & a Start Capacitor & Potential Relay on the wiring diagram but the start capacitor & Potential Relay was not installed on my AC unit so i called the AC MFG company to get some more info They said only there Top Tier ($$$) units come from the Factory with Start Capacitor & Relay But i could add to my unit the kit is $350 ($350 for cap & relay ) i said No Thanks , So i did some research on the Part number & I Found a MARS Capacitor (USA Made) with same spec as Factory Start Capacitor online for $9.08 & the Same spec Potential relay for $40.00 ordered both and installed to as the factory wiring diagram shows and Now My Generator Has No Problem Staring the AC unit !! Saved ME over $300 !!
Glad that worked out for you Dan Ray! Yes, I believe what you installed can be bought commercially as a "hard start kit". I opted for the soft start kit, but I believe several people has had success with doing exactly what you described. I think the only significant difference is that the soft start starts the fan a few seconds before the compressor to mitigate more surge, but in terms of having a capacitor for evening out the starting surge requirements, they do the same thing. What you're paying for with the soft start is an electronics control board that can "learn" the power profile of your AC unit. If you can get it to work strictly like you did, great for you! Glad you can save some money and do it on the cheap!
Have converted your generator to natural gas and if so ,does it run the whole house or most of the house...I'm working on the same setup have a duromax 8500 running watts thats with use of natural gas
@@lanceandres62Mine is a multi-fuel generator but you get more power out of gas vs. natural gas. I can run pretty much everything but I have not tested the electric heat on the AHU, electric heat pulls high amps. I only installed a hard start kit and has worked fine so far.
@@lanceandres62you planning on 30amp or 50amp inlet? 30amp inlets have 7500 watts max. 50amp inlets have 12500 watts max I believe. Check your inlet manual to verify your specific unit. Just something I noticed that not many peeps talks about until their generators overheat.
Just got the connection to the house done and I thought my Champion 10,000 start/ 8,000 running watt generator would be able to run alone on it but kept kicking my fuse off. I wonder if this would make it work with my 4 ton AC in Texas heat.
Yeah, a soft start kit might really be able to help you. Look on your AC Condenser and look for LRA and RLA ratings. If you can get the LRA under 41.5 amps, you have a chance of starting it with your generator (assuming you turn everything else off when doing this). Hope it works out for you!
@@copelandrobinson that is the sense app. It clamps on to the main power incoming and uses machine learning algorithms to guess the power usage of different devices based off of their profile. For example, it might see a power spike of 475 watts when a fridge comes on, it remembers that and when it sees that spike, they attribute it to the fridge. It is cool when it works, but I will warn that sometimes it doesn't guess right.
I have a window unit I can quickly deploy into a bedroom window that I power from my similarly-propane converted Wen GN400i generator. I think it's reasonable fuelwise to run lighter loads if possible during an outage, and my little gen runs it well, along with my fridge, deep freezer, and a couple lights. Since it's 120v only, installing a generator inlet plug really isn't an option, so I just use extension cords. I want to install a natural gas quick connect next for it as I don't have but a few days worth of propane, but can always go back to gasoline so it's making it a bit hard to justify the cost. Anyhow, this little genny kept the natural gas furnace working well during the big Texas chill quite well. I'm debating on a 2nd unit for redundancy.
That's awesome. I'm glad you have an emergency setup that works for you! It was pretty important for me to run my central heating unit (which is hard-wired into my house) because I never wanted to be in the same situation as the 2021 winter storm which is why I went with hardwired. If you have the space and money, 2nd unit is always a good idea. I would consider a closed frame model - they're both smaller, lighter, and more quiet to run. The downsides is that it is more expensive. Check this one out - amzn.to/3X7gQAU.
@@jonathanDIYs Luckily my gas central heat/air air handler actually plugs into a dedicated 120v outlet, so it was easy to connect up with an extension cord. Had it been 240v or hard-wired, I'd of had a rougher time for sure.
If you get one. Look at the clear plastic cover carefully. I have two of their Flex units. Both have a defect in the cover in the same place that looks like it would compromise the seal and allow moisture in. Not sure how I will proceed.
@@maxwellcrazycat9204 sorry to hear you got one with defects. I'd recommend reaching out to micro-air, from everything I've heard, they really stand behind their products and give good support. I'm pretty sure they would replace it for you or resolve this with you somehow. I get it might be more trouble than it's worth, hope you figure out what to do.
@@fattysgarage1754 I just measured it and I came up with 2/3 inch diameter. I remember having a hard time finding something exact because it was a little bigger than 3/8" and smaller than 3/4", but if you're going to just pass it through a connector the 3/4 inch or bigger should do. Good luck!
Never mount the capacitor upside down because the electrons will spill out! Actually so that the water tight fitting will not hold water and potentially leak.
I had one of these installed on my Goodman 3 1/2 ton heat pump and man what a difference it made! My Bluetooth reading shows 28 starting amps, down from around 85-95 amps prior to installation. Can run my ac on my Champion 7500 watt generator. Not sure about the heating yet but in Texas cold winters are rare so no biggie. Also, I am amazed at how many times my compressor has started since the micro air was installed. (5300 times) This will definitely extend the life of my compressor so I'm very happy I made the small investment. Was wondering if I should put one on my refrigerator???? Thoughts? Steve from Rowlett, Texas
hey Steve! I wouldn't recommend putting one of the refrigerator. The surge amps for refrigerators are pretty low (~1000 watts for your typical refrigerator). If you're able to keep under the 7500 watt load of your champion, you should be good to go. Refrigerators fortunately use a lot less power than HVAC units.
I always get a kick out of people suggesting their compressor lasted longer because of the micro. I’ve never used one and never had a compressor go out. It’s incredibly durable. Power outages are its enemy that’s why I have a surge directly on it and also a whole house surge.
@@Imwright720 Agreed however with the easy start you could go with a smaller generator that saves money right their . When I install a A/C unit I always roll in a surge protector into the price without telling the customer. Then when they see it and I explain it to them their jaws drop. And I install them right at the unit not the disconnect.
@@wd8557 I ordered one because my generator does groan a bit when my 4 ton starts. We get hurricanes and it’s run the house during 13 and 14 day power outages. I haven’t needed it since 2006. My main concern is would the micro damage the compressor. I figure if they engineered the compressor to start with high amps then lowering that might actually damage it. They offer a warranty but it’s worded in such a way as they would never actually payout.
Thanks for sharing Jonathan. I have some questions: 1. Once the AC kicked in, the running wattage for the AC remains on about 3k to 4k watts?, if so, then I need a generator that supports at least 5,000kw running, not less, correct? 2. How long is the cable from the generator to the inlet box 3. I have a 4 ton AC also, and your Easy start is 48x, but now Easy start says I need a X72 for a 48,000 BTU, but yours run with the X48, with no problems. Should I go with the X72? Thanks
1. Yes - you need a decently sized generator to run a whole house HVAC unit. For a 4 ton unit like mine, I'm BARELY able to get it started with my 8750W peak/7000W run generator. I wouldn't go any lower. For a 2 ton unit, you might be able to get away with a 5000watt unit. The issue is mostly on starting. After it starts, the HVAC unit takes a quarter or even a fifth of the peak power. 2. I bought a really long cable - 80ft because I wanted to keep my generator in the backyard during an emergency while all my power panels are near the front of the house. 3. X72 makes no sense to me. X72 is for a 6ton unit. The X48 would seem to be appropriate in my opinion. If you're interested in saving money, I have learned since there are other soft start manufacturers out there. I haven't tried, but the ICM Controls 870-32A looks like a good alternative. If I were to do it again, I would try one of these other solutions. Easystart is a bit overpriced IMO. Hope this helps!
@@jonathanDIYs thanks. I finally installed the X48 easy start with no problems, it reduced the kick amp from 73 to 23 on the first learn, then it settled at 25 amps. Sweet!
@@jonathanDIYs Thanks for your posts. Just FYI Mircoair changed their recommendations recently and they now only rate the X48 model up to 3.5 tons. For 4 tons and above, the X72 is what is recommended. I can only assume they did this for a good reason and I sent an email to support to confirm. As far as Micro-air being "overpriced" keep in mind this is a US company with US support who developed this technology, I am guessing they will perform better than the knock off foreign products. FWIW I pt my money where my mouth is and my X72 for my Trane 4 ton XR16 is on its way now. Thanks for the videos. You can also shop around a little and get a better deal online than buying direct from Microair.
@@jonathanDIYso bought the x48 for a customer of mine who had a 4 ton heat pump. I called tech support and they insisted I needed the x72 even though one one site I read the 48 was big enough for a 4 ton. Then in another section of the micro air page they said a 4 ton needed a 72. My customer insisted going back to the 72 and returned the 48. 72 did dj the trick though
@@brandonstephens1447 I have heard a bit of confusion in this area. I am not 100% certain, but I think micro-air changed their ratings and recommendations at some point in the past but did not update all their documentation. I do have a 4 ton unit and I do have the ASY-368-X72. I think oversizing would not be an issue, while undersizing definitely will be an issue. My guess would be that 4 ton units are right at the limit and some units would work on the 48 but it would be safer to just recommend the 72 so that everything can work. Glad the install worked for your client!
Hello there.. questions 1. Are you using a 30 AMP connection for the Generator or a 50 AMP, 2. Since you installed the easy start did you noticed if your electricity bill went down since its consuming less electricity to start. 3. What brand of AC unit condenser do you have? 4. Under full load, refrigerators, microwave can you use those at the same time as the AC unit when you are using generator ?
hi Juanti, 1. I'm using a 30 amp connector (NEMA L14-30). 2. I installed the easy start pretty much in the winter so I can't really comment on energy usage yet. I'll update you when it starts getting really hot this year. 3. Air Condition Unit - Trane XR16 series 4TTR6048J1000AA from 5/2020 4. The refrigerator works fine, I didn't actually try it out with the microwave. Next time I'm on generator with the AC on, i'll give that a shot. One thing to note is that there are 2 legs of power (the black 120V and the red 120V). The microwave works on only 1 leg so you might actually cause one of the legs to go over the 30 amp limit and trip the breaker if the load is not well-distributed between the 2 legs.
@The right is wrong I concur in my energy bill observations. It has not gone down at all this summer and is in fact more than last. Have to factor that we've been in a 90-105 degree heat wave for the past few weeks though.
Did it trip breakers before you had it installed? Did you say all your breakers?? Sounds like you have a wire connected to the wrong thing or a short somewhere. I'd double check the wiring. Tripping all the breakers is quite the feat - if things are wired correctly, you should only be tripping the breaker for the AC condenser which should be a double pole 40 or 50 amp breaker. Does the breakers trip instantly or does it take a few seconds or minutes?
@@jonathanDIYs the AC breaker doesn't trip but all the other running in parallel from the same circuit. I don't know if it's something related to the frequency or voltage stabilization. I read something like this on Internet. Worst part is that I bought the biggest LNG portable generator (10kw peak/ 8 kw running) but it seems insufficient. My AC in rush current is now around 35A but with just 6/7 amps from other loads in the house I'm scratching the 42max amp. I will install a monitoring device and see how everything behaves during this operation. I'm just afraid this peak load information doesn't mention that the voltage will be very bad. Btw, all videos on internet about AC Starts and Generators, it seems the generator are running on gasoline with delivers more power than propane and/or LNG.
hey, sorry for the late reply - was away on vacation. What type of generator are you using? If it is a standard generator, yes, the voltage and the frequency can fluctuate during peak load (both voltage and frequency dropping). I bought an inverter generator that has less of those issues. Yes, it seems generally true that gasoline has the highest power output. When I look at ratings, it seems like it is gasoline > propane > Natural Gas. Hope you sort it out. Maybe try turning everything off when starting up the HVAC and then turn power back on gradually to everything?
Thr reason you don’t want to mount it upside down is because you want to virtually eliminate the possibility of water intrusion into the strain relief where the wires are exiting the device.
That and the capacitor is a Castro oil filled canister so you don’t want the oil to be saturating the top where the terminals are at as this could leak out over time.
Bet you money the inrush after the easystart is under 30 amps, if you have the bluetooth model you can connect and check it in your stats. Pro tip the AC has to be running and your gps on to connect to the easystart, I also have a video how to do it. Back to the under 30amps part, easystart has to do this because its made for RV's and campers to power AC units off of 30amp service panels or generators that have 30amp service... like ours. You should have no problem with your setup running on natural gas, its wild my 3.5 ton AC pushes 5k watts and the generator can keep up and run everything else in the house pretty much like normal while on NG. Curious if sense helped you wire up to work on portable power or did you have to figure it out yourself like I did?
Good idea! I haven't connected to the easystart on bluetooth yet - I've been just measuring everything using the sense or that external clamp meter (which didn't work to get inrush properly). That's very interesting that your 3.5 ton AC takes up more power than mine - once my 4 ton AC is all on, it only takes 3.5k regularly. I'm guessing it is because my AC is just around 2 years old as I just bought the house recently. About the sense wire, I got that idea after watching Benjamin Sahlstrom's video - ua-cam.com/video/Y26CBqpS2M0/v-deo.html. Make sure you have the direction of the wires the same way or it will give weird readings. Aka, both wires have to be going "downward" through the clamps - you can't have one going upwards and 1 downwards. I think you mentioned you have your sense all working already so you might be all set there already. Thanks for watching!
@Jonathan Chan I wish I would have thought about wiring it like that before I got the extra flex sensors, duh! They were only 20$ so no biggie. Thats essentially how I have it wired, but when I'm on generator power the app says its on generator, u can see that in my video. Still going to make video using the flex cables and also ref ur method. While ba j I called sense and they told me it wasn't possible. Just needed some creativity! Thanks brother! Also if u connect to the app it shows u ALL the stats.
It's supposed to be weather rated. 🤷♂️ They have all the main disconnects near the front of houses in my area to make it convenient for fire or emergency services to shut off power in an emergency. It's gone through the freeze and through hail, it seems like a pretty sturdy metal box. Not sure what could destroy it before you have to start worrying about your windows and other things around the house as well.
Yes sir - it works great, no issues! I just tested it with running my generator on NG - you can check it out here: ua-cam.com/video/Fgqlg9NThBM/v-deo.html thanks for commenting!
@@christian14329 they changed their specs over the years... At the time, this was the one rated for 4 ton AC. Check with microair if you're unsure for your own setup. This works for me and I'm not going to fix what isn't broken. 😁
Yeah, I really wanted to, but I messed up on the wiring and I didn't want to show the wrong thing as it would probably be confusing. I had the brown go to the contactor and the white go to the condenser. Turned it on and the condenser wouldn't power up. I was somewhat scared I fried something, but fortunately reversing the wires - white go to contactor and brown to the condenser and everything started up happily. Hope you don't make my mistake if you're doing this, best wishes!
Sense app - amzn.to/4566YK6 Frankly, I'm not sure if it is worth it anymore now that it is twice the amount I paid for it. Not sure if there are better options at this point.
Yeah, I have no problems with my soft start. It cycles dozens of times a day and I haven't had any issues with it. Still great when I need to run from generator power as well (though I haven't had a long term outage since winter 2021).
Hi TomMeyers974 - the tube isn't plastic - I believe it is copper. I think it is the high side where the refridgerant is going into the house as a liquid. The larger tube inside the dryer vent thing is the low side where the refridgerant is going through the condenser as a gas. The gas is forced into a liquid by compression which increases the temperature (Charles's Law - en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles%27s_law). The hot refridgerant is cooled through the blower and the fins in the condenser. Then the cooled, compressed liquid is piped through the hose you are asking about into the evaperator which drops the pressure decreasing the temperature and is used to cool the house. The black cylinder I believe is a filter.
Hello.. i have the 368-x48 blue as well running on a trane xr16 2.5ton with LRA 67.8.. the easy start works great running just below 25 starting amps..When connecting a generac 7kw with 8750 starting wats, it will not start the compressor... any ideas why? You have a larger AC unit 4ton running with the exact same set up as me.. Edited: my AC unit has a TXV valve.. does yours?
Hi Thimitri1, what's the symptoms? Does the breaker trip? Does it stall out the generator? How are you measuring 25 starting amps - just by the easy start bluetooth interface or are you independently checking with a peak hold voltmeter? I have always been a little suspicious to the accuracy of the easy start bluetooth readings. I always like to confirm using another voltmeter.
@jonathanDIYs ... no problems with the generator stalling or breaker tripping.. The condenser fan starts spinning and then the compressor starts but then stalls.. the easy start has green lights but then the system shuts down when the compressor kicks on... I believe my AC systems TXV value keeps the high pressure which makes it difficult for the generator to start but your video seems to contradict that, if your system has a TXV valve. Thanks for your reply..
@@thimitri1 I think it might be time to contact Micro-Air support - www.micro-air.com/contact_microair.htm You might need a larger capacitor to get this thing working, at least that is what they say on reddit - www.reddit.com/r/Generator/comments/14tnsll/ac_soft_start_and_generator_size/. Hope you can get this working!
@@jonathanDIYs I just checked I have a 2.5 ton for my town home is that’s still ok to buy or which do you recommend and where can I buy it thx for your reply and fyi great work on yours
@@lejend69 The Easystart 364 (ASY-364-X36-BLUE) would be more appropriate for you. You want to choose the easy start to the appropriate size of your AC. 2.5 ton unit is 30k BTU. You can get it from: wateryachtsolutions.com/easystart-364-soft-starter-for-ac-units-up-to-36k-115v-230v-asy-364-x36-ul/smartstart What are you looking to achieve? Are you trying to run the AC off of a generator?
Unfortunately You did not use a strain relief on that new cord into the knockout, this can lead to problems later. On your 240V feed, you use Romex inside the sealtite, this is a no no in wet locations. Otherwise thanks for the information.
Hi Bruce, thanks for commenting. Oh wow, I just watched my video and see exactly what you're talking about. I can't believe the HVAC installers left it like that and that neither my home inspector nor myself didn't catch that this whole time. Thanks for pointing this out for me.
The current wattage from my home is being read from my Sense whole house energy monitoring system (sense.com/). I wired it up in such a fashion so that I can monitor both the generator power input and the main power input by running both the main lines and the generator wires through the amp meter clamps in the main panel.
CAUTION!!!!!!!! 😯 This diy person did NOT properly discharge the capacitor, all he did was check for voltage and there will be none with the power disconnected. There are proper ways to discharge a capacitor, look them up if you are concerned. Also, that is an improper use of the red plastic item. Use a proper wire protection device.
Thank you so much for sharing this. Will this work in a dc to ac solar inverters? Most manufacturers of such inverters doesnt recommend that u hook up inductive load on them, especially if their peak loads are too high (even if it doesnt exceed the inverter capacity, still not recommended). I have a window type AC 1hp if not mistaken. Im planning to hool up a soft starter after the thermostat switch.
Hi Sunny, thanks for commenting. This should work for dc to ac solar inverters however, I don't think they make a soft start for window type AC units. Do you know if those units are for sale? I'd love to do some research on it. Thanks!
Hello Jonathan. We have the exact same a/c unit (4TTR6048J1000AA). I noticed that the Micro Air web site does not include Trane for its brand specific installation instructions. Could you please tell me where you got your instructions from? It is very hot right now, so I would like to have the least possible down time while installing this. Thank you
Hi there, I was able to follow the general installation instructions (www.micro-air.com/support-documents/residential/current/EasyStart_HomeResidential_Installation_Guide.pdf). I would open up your compressor unit and verify that your setup is simple - a run capacitor with a HERM/FAN/Common connection and a contactor with one side servicing the fan and the other the compressor. If so, you can use the generalized instructions. If you want the lease amount of downtime, open it up first and verify everything before you even start. I think I opened it a few times before I started to make sure I bought all the right connectors and crimps. If you're really concerned about downtime, I would recommend doing this when it isn't so hot. I did it in December with plenty of time to fix any mistakes before the hot season.
Micro-air put out a new video recently that does a better job explaining all of it than me. You can also view that - ua-cam.com/video/bp4U-husy1o/v-deo.html.
Unless I "lose" my generator altogether. ;-) Joking aside, I did have a concern about security with running my generator in the front of the house. I wanted to be able to keep an eye on it while inside and make it pretty inconvenient and noticeable if someone was going to try to take it. But you're absolutely right, the shorter the wire, the less the resistance. For long runs like that, you need thicker and thicker wire.
Security is a big concern for any portable generator in a power outage. I installed a cement anchor hook on a 100lbs 2x2 concrete pavor. Our generator is positioned over it. I have a really thick chain and lock, that I put though the bottom frame on the generator and lock it under the middle of the generator. If they want our generator that bad, they will have to cut the bottom frame, on both ends, to take it. At that point, it would be useless and hard to move.
@@jimsjacob Heard from a friend, his neighbor had a generator stolen during outage for Hurricane Katrina. He said his lights went out and he could still hear the generator running. Thought it broke down, went outside and there's a lawnmower running where his generator was.
Hi Curtis, thanks! The app I'm using to monitor my watts is the Sense energy meter. You could pick one up from your local home depot or online at sense.com.
I'm thinking of going with a Duromax 9000 watt, 7600 continuous watt inverter generator for my York 4 ton AC. What are your thoughts...do you think it will run my unit with 30 outlet? If so, I am good with that, I can cool my house, turn the AC off then run my other appliances. Let me know what you think. Thanks
If you get a soft start - it very well might work. If it does work, you will actually be able to run all your other appliances at the same time as your AC. The key is just to turn on the AC first and then after the surge startup power is drawn, turn on the other devices. The surge startup power only lasts a few seconds. It is the surge that makes systems have to be oversized. The surge can be up to 5-10x higher than normal running power consumption. The Duramax 9000 is a great unit - I'd be surprised if it doesn't work once you add a soft start. Let us know after you do it! Would love to hear more success stories!
@@jonathanDIYs thanks a bunch. I will definitely let you know. I'm adding the soft start and an auto start kit for my wife's convenience if available for the Duromax as well as a Generlink. Thanks again for the feedback.
Unfortunately, our power company doesn't allow generlink on their meters. My duromax was delivered today. 30 amp inlet box, soft start and whole home surge protector will be installed this weekend. I'll definitely let you know the outcome.
Was your home bult by Lennar? I think we have the same house lol. I even have the narrow side yard with the overly intrusive ac unit blocking the front gate
Highland homes here! Small lots are annoying... If it ever works out for me, I'd love to get a place with 3-10 acres and have a workshop and all that. :) Until then, I'm stuck with a very narrow side fence and the neighbors house 10 or so feet away.
I got the 368 installed on a 3.5o ton ac and the app shows the peak amp is at 40 amp and from the lock rotor am of 59 so it only reduced by about 36 percent. Can I still run this with my Genmax 9000 as well?
Hi Mariojalata5259 - that is really close to the limits. Doing quick calculations, the Genmax 9000 produces peak 9000 watts. 9000Watts/240V = 37.5 amps. If it is truly 40 peak amps, it will be too much power draw for the GenMax 9000. How many times did you run the air conditioner with the 368? If you run it 5 times, the peak amps might drop more. There is a "learning" period where the 368 adjusts to the load and optimizes the system. If you can get it under 37 amps, that would be ideal.
@jonathanDIYs thank you so much for your response. To date I am on my 3rd run with the Genmax and the 40 amps so far is holding. Oddly enough, the Genmax seems to be fine as well.
@@jonathanDIYs It only needed 4 connectors. For the price we pay for it should've come with the connectors. There's other, lower cost soft-starts out there that come fully loaded with cable ties and connectors. I just discovered one last night that's made in the USA.
Jonathan, I've looked thru your videos to find out which generator interlock kit you have installed in your breaker box. No luck so far...Can you share which one this is and where to buy it? Thank you in advance!
Hi sorry I've been off of youtube lately. You have to get the generator interlock kit specific to your loadcenter. Best thing to do is open up your electric panel and look for make and model numbers. I found my electric panel was a Eaton CH style load panel. I looked it up in Eaton's brochure and found CHPMIKCSR to be the compatible one for my load center. If you have an Eaton, you can probably find yours in here too: www.eaton.com/content/dam/eaton/products/low-voltage-power-distribution-controls-systems/load-centers/custom-flex-center-solutions/eaton-flex-interlock-kits-pub53673-en-us.pdf If you have another brand, you'll have to look up the interlock kits for those things. Often times the original manufacturer does not make an interlock kit and you will have to go with a 3rd party.
Your meter won't see the fan if you're using the Compressor common wire so that wasn't the problem. You probably just forgot to press the max (inrush) button first.
I was using the main power wire IIRC. The max inrush button on my meter takes a max reading and then if there is new peaks, it does not further update. I edited out the 3 or 4 attempts I made at trying to measure it. Thanks for commenting!
For under $40 a hard start kit dropped my 4 ton lennox from 99a to 58a at startup and it runs at just under 14a. not sure this fancy box is worth it. the amount of time your AC is at peak during startup is a fraction of a second.
Unfortunately that wouldn't work for my generator which is only a 8750 peak watt generator. At 58a, we'd be looking at almost 14000 peak watts. I either needed to size up my generator (which meant sizing up my inlet which was a NEMA 30 amp to the 50 amp, go with 8 gauge wires, size up the breaker) or go with this. I'm glad it works for you though! If you can get by with a hard start kit, definitely the more affordable option. Thanks for commenting!
Having the Soft Start is much better in so many ways and worth the money. I installed a Hard Start on our Lennox 3-ton AC system. The LRA before the install was 57.1 amps. After installing the Hard Start, the LRA was 37.1 amps. I was able to run our AC on our Predator 9000/7250 gasoline generator with no problem. Once I installed a Tri-fuel kit and using NG, the AC wouldn't start. (Not enough startup wattage) Once I installed this same Soft Starter, the LRA was 20.8 amps and now we can run our ac on NG easily along with the rest of the house.
What square footage is your home? I have a 1500sqft home with a 4-ton AC and my WEN 8750 Watt Inverter Generator with a MicroAir cannot start it. I'm getting about 35 amp, and when measured at the panel I get max of 41amp (blower fan and Compressor outside). Thinking about downgrading to a 3-ton or 3.5 ton. Every calculation I used online said 4-ton overkill.
I would tend to agree that a 4-ton AC is overkill. My house is 2800sq ft and the 4 ton seems to cool it sufficiently well. I don't know if it is because I have a new house though with good insulation. How old is your unit? If it is taking up 41 amps to run regularly, it would definitely seem like your AC won't run on generator. It isn't an inrush problem at that point but just a regular load problem. 41*240V = 9840 watts which is way over the regular running power of your 8750 generator which I believe is 7000 watts. You'll need to get the whole house under 29 amps if you want to power off the generator. I am fortunate that my AC takes about 14-15 amps after the inrush which allows me to run off AC. Wish you the best in getting everything working together!
My 1400 sqft house was built in 2005. I have an XR14 which is 2.5 tons and it heats and cools my house easily. Your 4 ton system is actually doing you more harm than good because there's a good chance your system isn't being able to go through proper cycling times to provide the best efficiency. The humidity levels in a home typically dictate the efficiency of an HVAC system. Consistently high humidity levels mean one of two things. Either A) your system is too big and it's cooling the house too fast. This is a problem because the system isn't running long enough to remove the necessary humidity that it should be removing. Or B) High humidity levels are from a system that is undersized and is not able to keep up with cooling and heating demands. This isn't the case with you. The lower the humidity levels the better in terms of HVAC efficiency. My house typical hovers between 38 and 50% humidity levels. This is just about perfect.
I got a 75ft long cable and it wasn't long enough, so I added another 10ft extension to it. I bought it off of amazon.com for $161.21 and $31.34 respectively. I watch the prices and try to get the cheapest one. Here are the exact 2 I have: www.amazon.com/gp/product/B085HHWV16/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1 www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08HJ6NHSX/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1 Hope this helps and that you're able to get your setup working! Thanks for commenting!
That's the sense app. It is a kit that comes with current and voltage monitor that sits inside electric panel. I think it goes for 250 or so at home Depot. I'll make a video of it someday, seems a lot of people ask about it.
That's how the builders (or the HVAC contractor the builders hired) did it. My inspector didn't catch that either. Honestly, I'm not surprised - I've found more and more issues with the house the longer I have lived here and the more I have learned about how things are supposed to be done right. For this, what's the right way for this to be done?
@@jonathanDIYs The suction line (the big line) should be fully insulated with armaflex all the way to the air handler/furnace (looking at your video it doesn't appear to have any. The liquid line (small line) can be ran straight without insulation. They typically just run straight into the house with a standard fitting where they enter the wall, typically sealed with some type of weather proofing.. im guessing that the dryer vent may have been some way to either hide a giant hole, or make the HOA happy (probably not an HOA thing) . But I would be skeptical if the dryer vent actually runs THROUGH the wall, that would make it nearly impossible to properly seal or make air tight. Plus its flexible so any type of movement will eventually break down the weatherproof seal. The softstart on the other hand is a great choice to add to your system. Seems like you do more research than the builders. Also you are typically better off installing the filter dryer on the interior of the home vs. the exterior, but that's a minimal debate.
Thanks for sharing that bit of knowledge! One more thing for me to be mad about at the builders for not doing right. ;-) Next time I'm out there, I'll go check if they have armaflex on that line inside that dryer duct. I wonder if they did that as a way to protect the insulation. Texas sun does beat down pretty hard in my area!
The micro-air white wire connects where the compressor R (run) wire was connected. Then, you connect the micro-air brown wire to the compressor R (run) wire. You connect the micro-air black wire to the contactor on the other side of the contactor. To find the right compressor R (run) wire, you look at the schematic on the inside of the cover. It will tell you what color it is. Mine was yellow.
Can you tell me what’s the difference between this device and a start assist and a hard start kit and also a soft start up kit? Why is the fan turning so slow at 12:22 ?🤔 Thanks from New Orleans 🎭
The fan is not really turning slow - that's an illusion because of the camera. As for hard and soft start - hard start is cheaper and basically just an extra capacitor. It works by storing more juice so that when the compressor kicks in, more of the surge is being buffered by the extra capacitor than if there was nothing. If the hard start can cut your in rush down enough to run on your generator, it can be significantly cheaper. The microair soft start on the other hand has a computer logic board and a bit more sophisticated startup sequence. The soft start starts the compressor fan first to eliminate the inrush of that motor than starts the compressor. It has some learning logic to determine the best combination to reduce inrush as much as possible. Soft start is definitely more expensive and if you can get away with hard start, I'd recommend it for the price. I needed to do a soft start because my generator is relatively small. I'm somewhat amazed I can run a 4 ton AC off of something smaller than 10000 watts. Hope that helps! Thanks for commenting!
@@jonathanDIYs Does the circuit board have any surge protection? The last thing you need is a fried board as a result of lightning or power company surges during/after outages.
Without a soft start, you definitely need a 15kw unit. With a soft start, my 7k unit is able to power it just fine! AC units actually only need a lot of power during startup. If you're able to smooth out the startup power draw, you can run it with a smaller generator. The key values to look at are the LRA (locked rotar amps) and the RLA (rated load amps). The LRA is the amount of power it draws at startup and the RLA is the regular running load. A soft start reduces the LRA to be closer to the RLA.
@@syedfaz26 yes, after the initial startup (lights dim slightly), I was able to have all my regular lights and devices on. I think it would fail if I tried to run the dryer at the same time, but it does a good job of running everything else (fridge, computers, lights, etc) at the same time.
@@jonathanDIYs That is great. To summarize my setup in case anyone is interested. I am going with 50 amp breaker, 45 ft four, 6 gauge wires in conduit from main panel to 50 amp inlet(Reliance PBN50). 4 ton Trane XL18i with x368 easy start from micro air and 9500 Predator Inverter Genrator. I will share some results after finish installing the inlet.
@@syedfaz26 I’ve heard awesome things about that generator. One guy on UA-cam made a parallel cable and can basically max the full 50 amps. With that much power, you practically can run everything without issue. Good luck with your install and stay safe - dealing with potentially deadly voltage!
Hi @rdcd111, thanks for your comment. The fan is actually spinning fine, it is just a camera glitch in capturing fast moving subjects where the camera makes it look like it is going much slower than it actually is going. You notice the same thing when they film propeller airplanes like in this video: ua-cam.com/video/jKXDVVvGlXE/v-deo.html
Here in NC , we are starting to get bad storms. Powergrid pretty good and rates are not that bad . 2400sqft house with temp set at 68 is about 200.00 a month
So far this year, been able to do 150 or so for a 2800 sq ft. set to 74 or 75. In the past, was able to do $100, but this summer has been extremely hot - 100+ degrees for almost 2 months straight now. I didn't find the soft start save any money, but it is hard to compare since this summer was a lot hotter than the previous summers.
The Soft Starter won't save you any money on your electric bill. The AC still uses the same volts when running. The Soft Starter lowers the inrush voltage at startup only.
Draining capacitor with multimeter could actually burn the multimeter and some cases even make it blow right in your hands, that’s the most dangerous thing your could do
I respectfully beg to differ. A capacitor stores microfarads (energy) and discharges it at a set voltage. If you look at the rating, it is usually 370 or 440 volts. Multimeters are designed to safely measure a certain amount of voltage, mine 600V. As long as you have it on the right setting (AC Voltage) and the voltage remains under the amount rated, it will be fine. The way multimeters work is they act as a very very high resistor. This is why when you test your voltage at an outlet, you don't blow a breaker. It measures the voltage and allows energy to flow very slowly. "Most digital multimeters sold today for testing industrial, electrical, and electronic systems have high impedance input circuits greater than 1 megohm. In simple terms this means that when the DMM is placed across a circuit for a measurement, it will have little impact on circuit performance." www.fluke.com/en-us/learn/blog/digital-multimeters/dual-impedance-digital-multimeters
Thanks for your reply. I have Frigidaire - FS4BE-060KA - 5 Ton 14 SEER High Efficiency AC Compressor and been looking on UA-cam to see if someone may have the same or close to the same wiring to help me with the installation but haven't seen any. Do you think your wiring would be the same as mine?
@@VMH. have you opened up the compressor unit yet? Turn off the power at the disconnect switch box and unscrew the cover to access the capacitor and the contactor. If you only have a fan and compressor wires, then you have the same setup. If you can't tell, take pictures and put them online somewhere and I'll be happy to take a look and let you know what I think.
After reading many reviews and watching a lot of videos, I chose this option for my first backup power station. ua-cam.com/users/postUgkxHypYDKHAN93Lp2RQpfvU_ksc70wJ00pt I was between this and a larger option that could power a wider range of items, but the price/size/capacity blend seemed right for this unit. Hasn't gotten a ton of use yet, but the build quality is solid and it charges fine via the Rockpals solar panel I purchased to pair with it. One thing to note is that the screen is optimized for a top down viewing angle, which makes sense, but this means it washes out at other angles - especially low angles. Not a huge deal, but perhaps a better option for the display could be used to provide wider viewing angles.
That is completely the wrong bushing for the knockout. You need to use a strain relief for the cable that has a nut to secure it to the knockout hole. The way it is now that bushing is going to fall out real soon and then the cable will rub against the sheet metal with vibration and cut into the insulation shorting out the circuit possibly burning out your expensive soft start kit and likely starting a fire. Thats real bad!
The hole is too small and is not able to hold a standard size bushing. On retrospect, I would have drilled the hole bigger and use a standard bushing with a strain relief. As it stands now, the wire is jammed in there with the plastic bushing and isn’t going anywhere. It took me 15 minutes to squeeze the wire and bushing through the hole. Thanks for the advice and thanks for commenting! The other thing I would have done better is crimp the condenser wire instead of screwing it directly to the contactor. If I ever go back to opening or working on the unit, I’ll address those issues.
Hi Paul, thanks for commenting! According to Southwire's voltage drop calculator (www.southwire.com/calculator-vdrop), I only lose about 2.23% volts with the 10 gauge and ~85ft of cable I am using which is an acceptable amount. 30 amps over a 10 gauge wire can be run up to 114 ft. If it were a thinner wire, I would have problems utilizing the full 7000 watts the generator can generate, but as it stands, the wire is sufficient for the generator.
Here are my tips as a result of surviving MANY hurricanes. After a hurricane expect power to be out on average 7days. This requires a LOT of gasoline or propane if you run your generator more or less continuously under significant load. That’s a lot of fuel to buy and store (good luck waiting in line for hours to buy gasoline after a storm if you can find any). A generator with a natural gas option and a hook up to your gas meter is the way to go. My experience with the aftermarket retrofit trifuel carburetors is not good. The problem is the ones with the regulator built into the carb overheat and cause the regulator to malfunction under continuous use. The carb gets VERY hot. You will have a challenge trying to power up a larger HVAC using a generator fueled with natural gas even with a soft start because of the wattage reduction. I use small to medium size window units. I also do keep propane and gasoline just in case my natural gas system malfunctions. Nothing worse than being without power in New Orleans after a hurricane. If you want minimal aggravation and have the resources, then get a Generac whole house backup generator permanently installed (but keep in mind they require maintenance and don’t last forever).
Thanks for your tips! I'm looking to do a natural gas conversion on this generator when it gets cooler. I will note that when we lost power in TX last year, natural gas was also in short supply. We didn't even have enough to run our hot water heater or the natural gas furnace. I think having multiple ways of powering the generator is best. I am very curious to see if I will have enough power to power my AC on natural gas/propane. I'll let everyone know when I try it!
@@jonathanDIYs It’s also a good idea to have another generator as a backup in case your primary generator has mechanical problems as a result of continuous use. You also need to change the oil after so many hours of operation so have a supply available. In the military they say one is none and two is one. You might consider purchasing a trifuel generator and use the one you have as a backup. Costco has a Firman that goes on sale for $200 off around twice a year (you just missed the July sale).
Great advice. Installing a Tri-fuel kit is much better, then an already made Tri-fuel generator. The reason why, is because on a Tri-fuel ready generator, the air fuel mixture is set. (No adjustments) When you install a Tri-fuel kit, Motor Snorkel, you can adjust the regulator based on your load. (Once set, you won't have to set it again) Meaning, you can adjust the air fuel mixture. This will minimize power lose some, when running on alternate fuels.
That's the sense app (sense.com/). You can purchase a kit from Home Depot or Lowes. It attaches to your electric panel and measures current and voltage.
There really isn't any way that the AC will start without the soft start with the generator size I have. The LRA (locked rotor amp) aka startup load on the AC is 80-100 Amps depending on your model. 80 amps * 220 volts is 17600 watts. You would need a larger generator that could do 17600 starting watts. My generator can only do 8750W starting watts and 7000W continuous. That's why I need the soft start!
That’s the sense app. You install a energy meter in your main power panel to measure the amps and voltage coming into the house. It then provides the wattage reading for everything- it’s pretty neat!
For the price of the Easy Start; which is no longer selling the smaller ones, I would like to have more data. Like... How much electricity is it going to save me? If it doesn't then how many years is it going to add to my A/C unit? Don't have answer to these questions? Then just so I can use a smaller generator is not a good investment criteria. Easy Start priced themselves out of the market buy just selling the commercial units only. End of story. Or better yet get a split cooling unit that has a heat pump instead!
Hi Teddy, thanks for commenting! As far as I have observed, the easy start does not save ANY electricity. Theoretically, the A/C unit should last longer, but I think it probably is only extending the life of the capacitor or what not. The only reason why I got it is to run a smaller generator... For me, a requirement was to run an inverter generator - I have sensitive electronics that would not work on regular generators. The math added up as follows: Generator: $900 vs $2500 or $5000 generator for 11000 or 16000 watt generator Upsizing wires: 10 gauge vs 8 gauge - $300 vs $600 I was looking at spending more than $2000-3000 more dollars if I was to just upsize my generator. Getting a easy start at $300 seemed like the better investment when considering these options. If you don't have inverter generator as a requirement or don't mind getting a bigger generator that takes up more fuel/hour, just getting a bigger generator might be the right thing for you. In my scenario, it was the most cost-efficient option.
Hard to say… this year has been a lot hotter than last year. We are seeing 100+ degree weather in Texas for a week and a half straight. The bill has gone up because of that. I wouldn’t necessarily add this to save electricity - it was all to make sure I can run AC during an emergency power outage if it happened in the summer.
You need a lesson in how to handle electricity. You trust that toy gadget to determine the lines are dead ? - pretty foolish. You should have used the multimeter. Also the soft kit is a piece of junk and is liable to ruin your compressor.
You're running a 4 ton on a 7kw (running power) generator?! That's impressive!
Yes sir, thanks for commenting 😊
Until the start windings in your compressor motor blows.
Hi Jonathan. I have the exact same setup (gen and motor snorkel) but my ac is a 5 ton (year 2024). Do you think it would be able to start it?
Great detailed video. Being able to run your Central AC system off a portable generator, is much better than buying and installing window units.
I just installed this same Soft Start on our Lennox 3-ton AC system. We have a Predator 9000/7250 watts generator that I installed a Tri-fuel Kit (Motor Snorkel). The Motor Snorkel is the best Tri-fuel kit you can buy and install. It works very well, with minimal power lose when using NG. That's because you can adjust the air/fuel mixture with the regulator. Unlike already Tri-fuel generator that have fixed jets in the carburetor.
The LRA w/o any hard/soft start was 57.1 amps. Our generator, on gasoline, couldn't start our AC. I installed a Hard Start, which bought the LRA down to 37.1 amps. Now our generator could start our AC on gasoline, but not NG. I removed the Hard Start and installed the Soft Start. The LRA came down to 20.8 amps. Now our generator can start/run our AC system and whole house on NG.
We do have to turn the AC off, when running high wattage items, like the Microwave, gas dryer, sum pump and coffee maker to name a few. These items will bog the generator down and bring down the hertz well below 60 hertz. On NG, 6000 watts was about the max I was able to safely run on our generator.
Thanks for sharing! I'm always curious to see the difference between a hard start and a soft start and it great that you have numbers.
If you get an inverter generator, the frequency will always be the same. I got one because I have a lot of electronics and I didn't want to damage them when I'm on generator power. The THD of regular generators can be pretty bad for electronics.
Glad your setup is working out! It's almost cool enough for me to install the motor snorkel. Probably will be getting to that project pretty soon.
The inverter generator is the way to go for that perfect 60 htz. After over 80 hrs. of use with our Predator 9000/7250 watts Tri-fuel generator, we haven't had any issues with our electronics. At this time, I would only buy an inverter generator, when our current one fails.
Quick question I have the same generator predator 9000 what would you recommend for installing soft start or hard start for ac unit and thanks On advanced
I would recommend the Micro-Air Easy Start Kit (Soft Start). Checkout my video review on it. ua-cam.com/video/IB5sbnNypgI/v-deo.html
Soft start is best if you want the lowest inrush current. Only negative is the soft start is so much more expensive!
This is the exact emergency setup i am working on in my 2800 sq ft 1 year old home here in New Caney TX. This Geny is great as we have had to use it in our new construction neighborhood a few times do to prolonged power outages with an installed Interlock Switch at our panel. The questions I had for my setup running my ac condenser with the exact same geny, you have answered and i am now considering purchasing the soft start. I have only run this geny on gas, but have purchased the nat gas snorkel conversion kit. I am looking forward to your nat gas conversion video. Thanks!
Just be aware that you lose wattage when running on ng/ propane....BUT you should still be fine...good luck!
I bought my soft start at a place called Hayes near north belt and 59. Run my 4 ton unit and the rest of the house with an 8750 inverter generator.
Can I run a 5 ton AC unit with a 5,000w generator with the Easy Start?
@@davidh3861 the ASY-368-X72-BLUE is rated for up to a 6 ton AC compressor. I just ordered one for my 5 ton unit. Unfortunately, It won't be an apples to apples comparison, because I have a 10,000-wat generator.
I have the same setup (Champion 100520, Trane XR16 4TTR6048J, EasyStart and NG conversion). I haven't tested my system on NG yet because once I installed the EasyStart, the bluetooth app read about 21A live current & 37A for last peak start, which exceeds the capability of the 100520 on NG (roughly 5740W running/7175W starting).
I grabbed a new amp meter with inrush metering and it reads much more reasonable 18A running and ~23.5A inrush to the condenser, which is much more expected when you check the LRA/RLA listed by Trane for this model (18.5/124). Waiting for a response back from Microair regarding this now.
That's awesome that you have the same setup! I've been really wanting to test it out with NG, but haven't done the conversion yet. If you already have NG setup, I think it would be fine to just test it out. You won't know unless you try. All that happens if you go beyond the power of the generator will be that it stalls and all the power goes out. I did this a few times before installing the soft start when I was trying to run the AC by itself. Looking forward to hear your findings whatever you do. Thanks for sharing!
Yes, it was surprising to see someone else with the same setup.
I have the motor snorkel installed and tested locally but I don't have 30a service pulled over where my gas disconnect is (roughly 90' away unfortunately). I will pull cable once I have some free time and a death wish to spend more time in my attic.
@@effingv Ah, yeah... NG and electricity being in different areas is annoying. I bought a 80' or so long extension cord - it was pretty expensive, especially with how much copper is these days, but I figure it was an investment and gave me a lot of flexibility to have the generator wherever I need.
Just to follow up on this, I got the AC working on NG. I also see the same numbers (37A peak start), but it somehow still works. I'm guessing the EasyStart reading is not completely accurate? I can't imagine the generator being able to generate 8880W peak power... and this somewhat seems to be confirmed by you measuring with an independent inrush meter. If you're interested to see the latest video, it's over here: ua-cam.com/video/Fgqlg9NThBM/v-deo.html Thanks for sharing your experience!
Open the unit and flip the capacitor. Now it’s facing right for the wire. Assuming it’s possible, probably not. Thanks for the video, going this route also.
Thanks for sharing. I learned a lot.
I'm really looking forward to your next adventure -- converting to NG.
I've seen a lot of videos of folks who did the gas/NG conversion but none of them showed their generator running under load. I'd hate to buy a kit only to discover that NG doesn't have the energy density required to run (at least) my AC.
Probably won’t end up doing this until the fall. 100 degree weather in Texas makes me dread being in the garage for any longer than I have to (call me spoiled)! Thanks for commenting and your support!
Connect to the MicroAir with the app to check amps
I was planning on Purchasing one to put on my AC unit($354) because my 7000 running watt generator want start the AC , But first i removed the Panel on my AC to see if there was room to install the unit behind the cover area I noticed on the back of the cover was a Factory wiring diagram for the AC Unit and noticed it showed a Run Capacitor & a Start Capacitor & Potential Relay on the wiring diagram but the start capacitor & Potential Relay was not installed on my AC unit so i called the AC MFG company to get some more info They said only there Top Tier ($$$) units come from the Factory with Start Capacitor & Relay But i could add to my unit the kit is $350 ($350 for cap & relay ) i said No Thanks , So i did some research on the Part number & I Found a MARS Capacitor (USA Made) with same spec as Factory Start Capacitor online for $9.08 & the Same spec Potential relay for $40.00 ordered both and installed to as the factory wiring diagram shows and Now My Generator Has No Problem Staring the AC unit !! Saved ME over $300 !!
Glad that worked out for you Dan Ray! Yes, I believe what you installed can be bought commercially as a "hard start kit". I opted for the soft start kit, but I believe several people has had success with doing exactly what you described. I think the only significant difference is that the soft start starts the fan a few seconds before the compressor to mitigate more surge, but in terms of having a capacitor for evening out the starting surge requirements, they do the same thing. What you're paying for with the soft start is an electronics control board that can "learn" the power profile of your AC unit. If you can get it to work strictly like you did, great for you! Glad you can save some money and do it on the cheap!
Have converted your generator to natural gas and if so ,does it run the whole house or most of the house...I'm working on the same setup have a duromax 8500 running watts thats with use of natural gas
@@lanceandres62Mine is a multi-fuel generator but you get more power out of gas vs. natural gas. I can run pretty much everything but I have not tested the electric heat on the AHU, electric heat pulls high amps. I only installed a hard start kit and has worked fine so far.
@@lanceandres62you planning on 30amp or 50amp inlet? 30amp inlets have 7500 watts max. 50amp inlets have 12500 watts max I believe. Check your inlet manual to verify your specific unit. Just something I noticed that not many peeps talks about until their generators overheat.
Just got the connection to the house done and I thought my Champion 10,000 start/ 8,000 running watt generator would be able to run alone on it but kept kicking my fuse off. I wonder if this would make it work with my 4 ton AC in Texas heat.
Yeah, a soft start kit might really be able to help you. Look on your AC Condenser and look for LRA and RLA ratings. If you can get the LRA under 41.5 amps, you have a chance of starting it with your generator (assuming you turn everything else off when doing this). Hope it works out for you!
Now I see why micro air is a little more in price that app is handy! Great video!
How about a list with all your appliances fridges, lights, tv?
@@copelandrobinson that is the sense app. It clamps on to the main power incoming and uses machine learning algorithms to guess the power usage of different devices based off of their profile. For example, it might see a power spike of 475 watts when a fridge comes on, it remembers that and when it sees that spike, they attribute it to the fridge. It is cool when it works, but I will warn that sometimes it doesn't guess right.
remember to check out the other side of the metal place so that the newly drilled hole does NOT go into any tubing, wires, etc.
I have a window unit I can quickly deploy into a bedroom window that I power from my similarly-propane converted Wen GN400i generator. I think it's reasonable fuelwise to run lighter loads if possible during an outage, and my little gen runs it well, along with my fridge, deep freezer, and a couple lights. Since it's 120v only, installing a generator inlet plug really isn't an option, so I just use extension cords. I want to install a natural gas quick connect next for it as I don't have but a few days worth of propane, but can always go back to gasoline so it's making it a bit hard to justify the cost. Anyhow, this little genny kept the natural gas furnace working well during the big Texas chill quite well. I'm debating on a 2nd unit for redundancy.
That's awesome. I'm glad you have an emergency setup that works for you! It was pretty important for me to run my central heating unit (which is hard-wired into my house) because I never wanted to be in the same situation as the 2021 winter storm which is why I went with hardwired. If you have the space and money, 2nd unit is always a good idea. I would consider a closed frame model - they're both smaller, lighter, and more quiet to run. The downsides is that it is more expensive. Check this one out - amzn.to/3X7gQAU.
@@jonathanDIYs Luckily my gas central heat/air air handler actually plugs into a dedicated 120v outlet, so it was easy to connect up with an extension cord. Had it been 240v or hard-wired, I'd of had a rougher time for sure.
On your meter, make sure you have it set to MAX.
If you get one. Look at the clear plastic cover carefully. I have two of their Flex units. Both have a defect in the cover in the same place that looks like it would compromise the seal and allow moisture in. Not sure how I will proceed.
@@maxwellcrazycat9204 sorry to hear you got one with defects. I'd recommend reaching out to micro-air, from everything I've heard, they really stand behind their products and give good support. I'm pretty sure they would replace it for you or resolve this with you somehow. I get it might be more trouble than it's worth, hope you figure out what to do.
Just ordered mine! Thanks
Awesome - hope your install goes well!
@@jonathanDIYs Thanks, Can you tell me the power cord whip diameter so I can get the liquid tite connector for the install? Thanks again!
@@fattysgarage1754 I just measured it and I came up with 2/3 inch diameter. I remember having a hard time finding something exact because it was a little bigger than 3/8" and smaller than 3/4", but if you're going to just pass it through a connector the 3/4 inch or bigger should do. Good luck!
Yah, go with 3/4 connector. I used a 1/2 connector, and it works, but the cable is a really snug fit.
Never mount the capacitor upside down because the electrons will spill out! Actually so that the water tight fitting will not hold water and potentially leak.
I had one of these installed on my Goodman 3 1/2 ton heat pump and man what a difference it made! My Bluetooth reading shows 28 starting amps, down from around 85-95 amps prior to installation. Can run my ac on my Champion 7500 watt generator. Not sure about the heating yet but in Texas cold winters are rare so no biggie. Also, I am amazed at how many times my compressor has started since the micro air was installed. (5300 times) This will definitely extend the life of my compressor so I'm very happy I made the small investment. Was wondering if I should put one on my refrigerator???? Thoughts? Steve from Rowlett, Texas
hey Steve! I wouldn't recommend putting one of the refrigerator. The surge amps for refrigerators are pretty low (~1000 watts for your typical refrigerator). If you're able to keep under the 7500 watt load of your champion, you should be good to go. Refrigerators fortunately use a lot less power than HVAC units.
How long do you think it will run on a full tank with and without the ac
I always get a kick out of people suggesting their compressor lasted longer because of the micro. I’ve never used one and never had a compressor go out. It’s incredibly durable. Power outages are its enemy that’s why I have a surge directly on it and also a whole house surge.
@@Imwright720 Agreed however with the easy start you could go with a smaller generator that saves money right their . When I install a A/C unit I always roll in a surge protector into the price without telling the customer. Then when they see it and I explain it to them their jaws drop. And I install them right at the unit not the disconnect.
@@wd8557 I ordered one because my generator does groan a bit when my 4 ton starts. We get hurricanes and it’s run the house during 13 and 14 day power outages. I haven’t needed it since 2006. My main concern is would the micro damage the compressor. I figure if they engineered the compressor to start with high amps then lowering that might actually damage it. They offer a warranty but it’s worded in such a way as they would never actually payout.
Thanks for sharing Jonathan. I have some questions:
1. Once the AC kicked in, the running wattage for the AC remains on about 3k to 4k watts?, if so, then I need a generator that supports at least 5,000kw running, not less, correct?
2. How long is the cable from the generator to the inlet box
3. I have a 4 ton AC also, and your Easy start is 48x, but now Easy start says I need a X72 for a 48,000 BTU, but yours run with the X48, with no problems. Should I go with the X72?
Thanks
1. Yes - you need a decently sized generator to run a whole house HVAC unit. For a 4 ton unit like mine, I'm BARELY able to get it started with my 8750W peak/7000W run generator. I wouldn't go any lower. For a 2 ton unit, you might be able to get away with a 5000watt unit. The issue is mostly on starting. After it starts, the HVAC unit takes a quarter or even a fifth of the peak power.
2. I bought a really long cable - 80ft because I wanted to keep my generator in the backyard during an emergency while all my power panels are near the front of the house.
3. X72 makes no sense to me. X72 is for a 6ton unit. The X48 would seem to be appropriate in my opinion. If you're interested in saving money, I have learned since there are other soft start manufacturers out there. I haven't tried, but the ICM Controls 870-32A looks like a good alternative. If I were to do it again, I would try one of these other solutions. Easystart is a bit overpriced IMO.
Hope this helps!
@@jonathanDIYs thanks. I finally installed the X48 easy start with no problems, it reduced the kick amp from 73 to 23 on the first learn, then it settled at 25 amps. Sweet!
@@jonathanDIYs Thanks for your posts. Just FYI Mircoair changed their recommendations recently and they now only rate the X48 model up to 3.5 tons. For 4 tons and above, the X72 is what is recommended. I can only assume they did this for a good reason and I sent an email to support to confirm. As far as Micro-air being "overpriced" keep in mind this is a US company with US support who developed this technology, I am guessing they will perform better than the knock off foreign products. FWIW I pt my money where my mouth is and my X72 for my Trane 4 ton XR16 is on its way now. Thanks for the videos. You can also shop around a little and get a better deal online than buying direct from Microair.
@@jonathanDIYso bought the x48 for a customer of mine who had a 4 ton heat pump. I called tech support and they insisted I needed the x72 even though one one site I read the 48 was big enough for a 4 ton. Then in another section of the micro air page they said a 4 ton needed a 72. My customer insisted going back to the 72 and returned the 48. 72 did dj the trick though
@@brandonstephens1447 I have heard a bit of confusion in this area. I am not 100% certain, but I think micro-air changed their ratings and recommendations at some point in the past but did not update all their documentation. I do have a 4 ton unit and I do have the ASY-368-X72. I think oversizing would not be an issue, while undersizing definitely will be an issue. My guess would be that 4 ton units are right at the limit and some units would work on the 48 but it would be safer to just recommend the 72 so that everything can work. Glad the install worked for your client!
Love my soft start. It works
Hello there.. questions 1. Are you using a 30 AMP connection for the Generator or a 50 AMP, 2. Since you installed the easy start did you noticed if your electricity bill went down since its consuming less electricity to start. 3. What brand of AC unit condenser do you have? 4. Under full load, refrigerators, microwave can you use those at the same time as the AC unit when you are using generator ?
hi Juanti,
1. I'm using a 30 amp connector (NEMA L14-30).
2. I installed the easy start pretty much in the winter so I can't really comment on energy usage yet. I'll update you when it starts getting really hot this year.
3. Air Condition Unit - Trane XR16 series 4TTR6048J1000AA from 5/2020
4. The refrigerator works fine, I didn't actually try it out with the microwave. Next time I'm on generator with the AC on, i'll give that a shot. One thing to note is that there are 2 legs of power (the black 120V and the red 120V). The microwave works on only 1 leg so you might actually cause one of the legs to go over the 30 amp limit and trip the breaker if the load is not well-distributed between the 2 legs.
@The right is wrong I concur in my energy bill observations. It has not gone down at all this summer and is in fact more than last. Have to factor that we've been in a 90-105 degree heat wave for the past few weeks though.
Can you explain why your fence is built like that
Just installed mine. AC started ok but it trips all my breakers in my panel ... what is wrong here? Any suggestion?
Did it trip breakers before you had it installed? Did you say all your breakers?? Sounds like you have a wire connected to the wrong thing or a short somewhere. I'd double check the wiring. Tripping all the breakers is quite the feat - if things are wired correctly, you should only be tripping the breaker for the AC condenser which should be a double pole 40 or 50 amp breaker.
Does the breakers trip instantly or does it take a few seconds or minutes?
@@jonathanDIYs the AC breaker doesn't trip but all the other running in parallel from the same circuit. I don't know if it's something related to the frequency or voltage stabilization. I read something like this on Internet. Worst part is that I bought the biggest LNG portable generator (10kw peak/ 8 kw running) but it seems insufficient. My AC in rush current is now around 35A but with just 6/7 amps from other loads in the house I'm scratching the 42max amp. I will install a monitoring device and see how everything behaves during this operation. I'm just afraid this peak load information doesn't mention that the voltage will be very bad. Btw, all videos on internet about AC Starts and Generators, it seems the generator are running on gasoline with delivers more power than propane and/or LNG.
hey, sorry for the late reply - was away on vacation. What type of generator are you using? If it is a standard generator, yes, the voltage and the frequency can fluctuate during peak load (both voltage and frequency dropping). I bought an inverter generator that has less of those issues. Yes, it seems generally true that gasoline has the highest power output. When I look at ratings, it seems like it is gasoline > propane > Natural Gas. Hope you sort it out. Maybe try turning everything off when starting up the HVAC and then turn power back on gradually to everything?
Very nice setup
Thr reason you don’t want to mount it upside down is because you want to virtually eliminate the possibility of water intrusion into the strain relief where the wires are exiting the device.
That and the capacitor is a Castro oil filled canister so you don’t want the oil to be saturating the top where the terminals are at as this could leak out over time.
Learned something new - thanks!
I"m reading the comments to say this. I see it's already been said. I wish I could search the comments on UA-cam.
Bet you money the inrush after the easystart is under 30 amps, if you have the bluetooth model you can connect and check it in your stats. Pro tip the AC has to be running and your gps on to connect to the easystart, I also have a video how to do it. Back to the under 30amps part, easystart has to do this because its made for RV's and campers to power AC units off of 30amp service panels or generators that have 30amp service... like ours. You should have no problem with your setup running on natural gas, its wild my 3.5 ton AC pushes 5k watts and the generator can keep up and run everything else in the house pretty much like normal while on NG. Curious if sense helped you wire up to work on portable power or did you have to figure it out yourself like I did?
Good idea! I haven't connected to the easystart on bluetooth yet - I've been just measuring everything using the sense or that external clamp meter (which didn't work to get inrush properly). That's very interesting that your 3.5 ton AC takes up more power than mine - once my 4 ton AC is all on, it only takes 3.5k regularly. I'm guessing it is because my AC is just around 2 years old as I just bought the house recently.
About the sense wire, I got that idea after watching Benjamin Sahlstrom's video - ua-cam.com/video/Y26CBqpS2M0/v-deo.html. Make sure you have the direction of the wires the same way or it will give weird readings. Aka, both wires have to be going "downward" through the clamps - you can't have one going upwards and 1 downwards. I think you mentioned you have your sense all working already so you might be all set there already. Thanks for watching!
@Jonathan Chan I wish I would have thought about wiring it like that before I got the extra flex sensors, duh! They were only 20$ so no biggie. Thats essentially how I have it wired, but when I'm on generator power the app says its on generator, u can see that in my video. Still going to make video using the flex cables and also ref ur method. While ba j I called sense and they told me it wasn't possible. Just needed some creativity! Thanks brother!
Also if u connect to the app it shows u ALL the stats.
Your main breaker box is located in your front yard exposed to the elements? One hurricane or harsh weather event and your electrical box is toast.
It's supposed to be weather rated. 🤷♂️ They have all the main disconnects near the front of houses in my area to make it convenient for fire or emergency services to shut off power in an emergency. It's gone through the freeze and through hail, it seems like a pretty sturdy metal box. Not sure what could destroy it before you have to start worrying about your windows and other things around the house as well.
It's over a year later. Still working ok?
Yes sir - it works great, no issues! I just tested it with running my generator on NG - you can check it out here: ua-cam.com/video/Fgqlg9NThBM/v-deo.html thanks for commenting!
Thank you for your videos! They are great
What’s your average run time per tank, with and without the a/c running?
Irrelevant unless you have the exact same generator and conditions
Isn’t that rated for 6 ton Unit? Might wanna switch to the flex version?!
@@christian14329 they changed their specs over the years... At the time, this was the one rated for 4 ton AC. Check with microair if you're unsure for your own setup. This works for me and I'm not going to fix what isn't broken. 😁
Sure would be nice to watch you wire the unit to how it’s done. Thanks for replying back.
Yeah, I really wanted to, but I messed up on the wiring and I didn't want to show the wrong thing as it would probably be confusing. I had the brown go to the contactor and the white go to the condenser. Turned it on and the condenser wouldn't power up. I was somewhat scared I fried something, but fortunately reversing the wires - white go to contactor and brown to the condenser and everything started up happily. Hope you don't make my mistake if you're doing this, best wishes!
@@jonathanDIYs I thought the instructions indicated that you completely eliminate the original condenser from the system?
What are you using to monitor watts on your phone?
Sense app - amzn.to/4566YK6 Frankly, I'm not sure if it is worth it anymore now that it is twice the amount I paid for it. Not sure if there are better options at this point.
Thank you so much for this awesome demonstration! You helped me tremendously!!!
And two years later is it still working?
Yeah, I have no problems with my soft start. It cycles dozens of times a day and I haven't had any issues with it. Still great when I need to run from generator power as well (though I haven't had a long term outage since winter 2021).
@@jonathanDIYs fantastic. I will purchase one. Was a little concerned from all the amazon reviews. Some great and some not too good
@@shawnstangeland3011 hope you have a good experience with it!
At 6mins 30sec shows a plastic tube with a black cylinder attached. Comes out of the wall and goes to bottom of the condenser. What is that?
Thanks.
Hi TomMeyers974 - the tube isn't plastic - I believe it is copper. I think it is the high side where the refridgerant is going into the house as a liquid. The larger tube inside the dryer vent thing is the low side where the refridgerant is going through the condenser as a gas. The gas is forced into a liquid by compression which increases the temperature (Charles's Law - en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles%27s_law). The hot refridgerant is cooled through the blower and the fins in the condenser. Then the cooled, compressed liquid is piped through the hose you are asking about into the evaperator which drops the pressure decreasing the temperature and is used to cool the house. The black cylinder I believe is a filter.
TNX.@@jonathanDIYs
Hello.. i have the 368-x48 blue as well running on a trane xr16 2.5ton with LRA 67.8.. the easy start works great running just below 25 starting amps..When connecting a generac 7kw with 8750 starting wats, it will not start the compressor... any ideas why?
You have a larger AC unit 4ton running with the exact same set up as me..
Edited: my AC unit has a TXV valve.. does yours?
Hi Thimitri1, what's the symptoms? Does the breaker trip? Does it stall out the generator? How are you measuring 25 starting amps - just by the easy start bluetooth interface or are you independently checking with a peak hold voltmeter?
I have always been a little suspicious to the accuracy of the easy start bluetooth readings. I always like to confirm using another voltmeter.
@jonathanDIYs ... no problems with the generator stalling or breaker tripping.. The condenser fan starts spinning and then the compressor starts but then stalls.. the easy start has green lights but then the system shuts down when the compressor kicks on... I believe my AC systems TXV value keeps the high pressure which makes it difficult for the generator to start but your video seems to contradict that, if your system has a TXV valve.
Thanks for your reply..
@@thimitri1 I think it might be time to contact Micro-Air support - www.micro-air.com/contact_microair.htm You might need a larger capacitor to get this thing working, at least that is what they say on reddit - www.reddit.com/r/Generator/comments/14tnsll/ac_soft_start_and_generator_size/. Hope you can get this working!
Which model did you use and you did a great job
Easystart 368 X48 which is rated for an 4 ton HVAC unit model. Thanks for commenting!
@@jonathanDIYs I just checked I have a 2.5 ton for my town home is that’s still ok to buy or which do you recommend and where can I buy it thx for your reply and fyi great work on yours
@@lejend69 The Easystart 364 (ASY-364-X36-BLUE) would be more appropriate for you. You want to choose the easy start to the appropriate size of your AC. 2.5 ton unit is 30k BTU. You can get it from:
wateryachtsolutions.com/easystart-364-soft-starter-for-ac-units-up-to-36k-115v-230v-asy-364-x36-ul/smartstart
What are you looking to achieve? Are you trying to run the AC off of a generator?
@@jonathanDIYs I’m trying to make it easier for a solar set up
@@lejend69 awesome - hope it works out! Let us know how it goes!
Unfortunately You did not use a strain relief on that new cord into the knockout, this can lead to problems later. On your 240V feed, you use Romex inside the sealtite, this is a no no in wet locations. Otherwise thanks for the information.
Hi Bruce, thanks for commenting.
Oh wow, I just watched my video and see exactly what you're talking about. I can't believe the HVAC installers left it like that and that neither my home inspector nor myself didn't catch that this whole time. Thanks for pointing this out for me.
Curious to what you are doing to see your current wattage usage on your phone. What's it reading from, the generator or the outlet?
The current wattage from my home is being read from my Sense whole house energy monitoring system (sense.com/). I wired it up in such a fashion so that I can monitor both the generator power input and the main power input by running both the main lines and the generator wires through the amp meter clamps in the main panel.
CAUTION!!!!!!!! 😯
This diy person did NOT properly discharge the capacitor, all he did was check for voltage and there will be none with the power disconnected.
There are proper ways to discharge a capacitor, look them up if you are concerned.
Also, that is an improper use of the red plastic item.
Use a proper wire protection device.
Could you please explain the proper way to discharge the capacitor. Thanks
@@mindsandmotiontherapy6968 To discharge the capacitor use a well insulated screwdriver and touch all contacts with each other on the capacitor. ⚡️
Thank you so much for sharing this. Will this work in a dc to ac solar inverters? Most manufacturers of such inverters doesnt recommend that u hook up inductive load on them, especially if their peak loads are too high (even if it doesnt exceed the inverter capacity, still not recommended). I have a window type AC 1hp if not mistaken. Im planning to hool up a soft starter after the thermostat switch.
Hi Sunny, thanks for commenting. This should work for dc to ac solar inverters however, I don't think they make a soft start for window type AC units. Do you know if those units are for sale? I'd love to do some research on it. Thanks!
Hello Jonathan. We have the exact same a/c unit (4TTR6048J1000AA). I noticed that the Micro Air web site does not include Trane for its brand specific installation instructions. Could you please tell me where you got your instructions from? It is very hot right now, so I would like to have the least possible down time while installing this. Thank you
Hi there, I was able to follow the general installation instructions (www.micro-air.com/support-documents/residential/current/EasyStart_HomeResidential_Installation_Guide.pdf). I would open up your compressor unit and verify that your setup is simple - a run capacitor with a HERM/FAN/Common connection and a contactor with one side servicing the fan and the other the compressor. If so, you can use the generalized instructions. If you want the lease amount of downtime, open it up first and verify everything before you even start. I think I opened it a few times before I started to make sure I bought all the right connectors and crimps. If you're really concerned about downtime, I would recommend doing this when it isn't so hot. I did it in December with plenty of time to fix any mistakes before the hot season.
@@jonathanDIYs Hello Jonathan, Thank you for the reply.
Micro-air put out a new video recently that does a better job explaining all of it than me. You can also view that - ua-cam.com/video/bp4U-husy1o/v-deo.html.
The shorter you can make the cord from the generator the less loss you will have.
Unless I "lose" my generator altogether. ;-) Joking aside, I did have a concern about security with running my generator in the front of the house. I wanted to be able to keep an eye on it while inside and make it pretty inconvenient and noticeable if someone was going to try to take it. But you're absolutely right, the shorter the wire, the less the resistance. For long runs like that, you need thicker and thicker wire.
Security is a big concern for any portable generator in a power outage. I installed a cement anchor hook on a 100lbs 2x2 concrete pavor. Our generator is positioned over it. I have a really thick chain and lock, that I put though the bottom frame on the generator and lock it under the middle of the generator.
If they want our generator that bad, they will have to cut the bottom frame, on both ends, to take it. At that point, it would be useless and hard to move.
That thing is so loud, anyone looking to steal a generator will know you’ve got on running.
@@jimsjacob
Heard from a friend, his neighbor had a generator stolen during outage for Hurricane Katrina.
He said his lights went out and he could still hear the generator running. Thought it broke down, went outside and there's a lawnmower running where his generator was.
@@deanb949 😂🤣. Ingenious!
Enjoyed the video… What app. We’re you using to determine the watts your generator was using
Hi Curtis, thanks! The app I'm using to monitor my watts is the Sense energy meter. You could pick one up from your local home depot or online at sense.com.
I'm thinking of going with a Duromax 9000 watt, 7600 continuous watt inverter generator for my York 4 ton AC. What are your thoughts...do you think it will run my unit with 30 outlet? If so, I am good with that, I can cool my house, turn the AC off then run my other appliances. Let me know what you think. Thanks
If you get a soft start - it very well might work. If it does work, you will actually be able to run all your other appliances at the same time as your AC. The key is just to turn on the AC first and then after the surge startup power is drawn, turn on the other devices. The surge startup power only lasts a few seconds. It is the surge that makes systems have to be oversized. The surge can be up to 5-10x higher than normal running power consumption. The Duramax 9000 is a great unit - I'd be surprised if it doesn't work once you add a soft start. Let us know after you do it! Would love to hear more success stories!
@@jonathanDIYs thanks a bunch. I will definitely let you know. I'm adding the soft start and an auto start kit for my wife's convenience if available for the Duromax as well as a Generlink. Thanks again for the feedback.
@@jonathanDIYs It is brief, but it occurs frequently.
Unfortunately, our power company doesn't allow generlink on their meters.
My duromax was delivered today. 30 amp inlet box, soft start and whole home surge protector will be installed this weekend. I'll definitely let you know the outcome.
Was your home bult by Lennar? I think we have the same house lol. I even have the narrow side yard with the overly intrusive ac unit blocking the front gate
Highland homes here! Small lots are annoying... If it ever works out for me, I'd love to get a place with 3-10 acres and have a workshop and all that. :) Until then, I'm stuck with a very narrow side fence and the neighbors house 10 or so feet away.
@@jonathanDIYs hahaha i feel your pain. Your videos have really helped me! Thank you.
I got the 368 installed on a 3.5o ton ac and the app shows the peak amp is at 40 amp and from the lock rotor am of 59 so it only reduced by about 36 percent. Can I still run this with my Genmax 9000 as well?
Hi Mariojalata5259 - that is really close to the limits. Doing quick calculations, the Genmax 9000 produces peak 9000 watts. 9000Watts/240V = 37.5 amps. If it is truly 40 peak amps, it will be too much power draw for the GenMax 9000. How many times did you run the air conditioner with the 368? If you run it 5 times, the peak amps might drop more. There is a "learning" period where the 368 adjusts to the load and optimizes the system. If you can get it under 37 amps, that would be ideal.
@jonathanDIYs thank you so much for your response. To date I am on my 3rd run with the Genmax and the 40 amps so far is holding. Oddly enough, the Genmax seems to be fine as well.
@@mariojalata5259 that's great! I think the easystart peak amp reading isn't too accurate.
I do not know why it did not come with any crimp-on connectors.
Some resellers sell connector kits, but I found it more economical just to buy a whole set of connectors myself.
@@jonathanDIYs It only needed 4 connectors. For the price we pay for it should've come with the connectors. There's other, lower cost soft-starts out there that come fully loaded with cable ties and connectors. I just discovered one last night that's made in the USA.
@@troy3456789 really? Please share. This was the only one on the market that I knew about when I originally purchased this.
@@jonathanDIYs Same for me too. Mine cost almost $400, but installed it already. Lemme look it up
@@jonathanDIYs ICM870 soft starter. I do not think it has Bluetooth. It's like $170 ua-cam.com/video/b2vpP5QBSlE/v-deo.html
nice work Jonathan!
Jonathan, I've looked thru your videos to find out which generator interlock kit you have installed in your breaker box. No luck so far...Can you share which one this is and where to buy it? Thank you in advance!
Hi sorry I've been off of youtube lately. You have to get the generator interlock kit specific to your loadcenter. Best thing to do is open up your electric panel and look for make and model numbers. I found my electric panel was a Eaton CH style load panel. I looked it up in Eaton's brochure and found CHPMIKCSR to be the compatible one for my load center.
If you have an Eaton, you can probably find yours in here too:
www.eaton.com/content/dam/eaton/products/low-voltage-power-distribution-controls-systems/load-centers/custom-flex-center-solutions/eaton-flex-interlock-kits-pub53673-en-us.pdf
If you have another brand, you'll have to look up the interlock kits for those things. Often times the original manufacturer does not make an interlock kit and you will have to go with a 3rd party.
@@jonathanDIYs thank you! Just got the nat gas pipe components ... Will get this while project done by August.
@@christopherfrantz7050 do your research and stay safe! Good luck on your project!
Your meter won't see the fan if you're using the Compressor common wire so that wasn't the problem. You probably just forgot to press the max (inrush) button first.
I was using the main power wire IIRC. The max inrush button on my meter takes a max reading and then if there is new peaks, it does not further update. I edited out the 3 or 4 attempts I made at trying to measure it. Thanks for commenting!
Is your generator a 50amp or 30amp?
@@marcoolazaran9193 30amps
For under $40 a hard start kit dropped my 4 ton lennox from 99a to 58a at startup and it runs at just under 14a. not sure this fancy box is worth it. the amount of time your AC is at peak during startup is a fraction of a second.
Unfortunately that wouldn't work for my generator which is only a 8750 peak watt generator. At 58a, we'd be looking at almost 14000 peak watts. I either needed to size up my generator (which meant sizing up my inlet which was a NEMA 30 amp to the 50 amp, go with 8 gauge wires, size up the breaker) or go with this. I'm glad it works for you though! If you can get by with a hard start kit, definitely the more affordable option. Thanks for commenting!
Having the Soft Start is much better in so many ways and worth the money. I installed a Hard Start on our Lennox 3-ton AC system. The LRA before the install was 57.1 amps. After installing the Hard Start, the LRA was 37.1 amps. I was able to run our AC on our Predator 9000/7250 gasoline generator with no problem.
Once I installed a Tri-fuel kit and using NG, the AC wouldn't start. (Not enough startup wattage) Once I installed this same Soft Starter, the LRA was 20.8 amps and now we can run our ac on NG easily along with the rest of the house.
What square footage is your home? I have a 1500sqft home with a 4-ton AC and my WEN 8750 Watt Inverter Generator with a MicroAir cannot start it. I'm getting about 35 amp, and when measured at the panel I get max of 41amp (blower fan and Compressor outside). Thinking about downgrading to a 3-ton or 3.5 ton. Every calculation I used online said 4-ton overkill.
I would tend to agree that a 4-ton AC is overkill. My house is 2800sq ft and the 4 ton seems to cool it sufficiently well. I don't know if it is because I have a new house though with good insulation. How old is your unit?
If it is taking up 41 amps to run regularly, it would definitely seem like your AC won't run on generator. It isn't an inrush problem at that point but just a regular load problem. 41*240V = 9840 watts which is way over the regular running power of your 8750 generator which I believe is 7000 watts. You'll need to get the whole house under 29 amps if you want to power off the generator. I am fortunate that my AC takes about 14-15 amps after the inrush which allows me to run off AC. Wish you the best in getting everything working together!
My 1400 sqft house was built in 2005. I have an XR14 which is 2.5 tons and it heats and cools my house easily. Your 4 ton system is actually doing you more harm than good because there's a good chance your system isn't being able to go through proper cycling times to provide the best efficiency. The humidity levels in a home typically dictate the efficiency of an HVAC system. Consistently high humidity levels mean one of two things. Either A) your system is too big and it's cooling the house too fast. This is a problem because the system isn't running long enough to remove the necessary humidity that it should be removing. Or B) High humidity levels are from a system that is undersized and is not able to keep up with cooling and heating demands. This isn't the case with you. The lower the humidity levels the better in terms of HVAC efficiency. My house typical hovers between 38 and 50% humidity levels. This is just about perfect.
@@Ozzie4Para So, in other words.. you're really not sure.
Hello Johnathan, how long is the 50 amp "really long cable" and where did you get it from? Do you remember what you paid for it?
Thanks
I got a 75ft long cable and it wasn't long enough, so I added another 10ft extension to it. I bought it off of amazon.com for $161.21 and $31.34 respectively. I watch the prices and try to get the cheapest one. Here are the exact 2 I have:
www.amazon.com/gp/product/B085HHWV16/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1
www.amazon.com/gp/product/B08HJ6NHSX/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1
Hope this helps and that you're able to get your setup working! Thanks for commenting!
Great Video. What app do you use to monitor real time energy consumption?
That's the sense app. It is a kit that comes with current and voltage monitor that sits inside electric panel. I think it goes for 250 or so at home Depot. I'll make a video of it someday, seems a lot of people ask about it.
who ran your condenser line set thru a dryer vent 😅
That's how the builders (or the HVAC contractor the builders hired) did it. My inspector didn't catch that either. Honestly, I'm not surprised - I've found more and more issues with the house the longer I have lived here and the more I have learned about how things are supposed to be done right. For this, what's the right way for this to be done?
@@jonathanDIYs The suction line (the big line) should be fully insulated with armaflex all the way to the air handler/furnace (looking at your video it doesn't appear to have any. The liquid line (small line) can be ran straight without insulation. They typically just run straight into the house with a standard fitting where they enter the wall, typically sealed with some type of weather proofing.. im guessing that the dryer vent may have been some way to either hide a giant hole, or make the HOA happy (probably not an HOA thing)
. But I would be skeptical if the dryer vent actually runs THROUGH the wall, that would make it nearly impossible to properly seal or make air tight. Plus its flexible so any type of movement will eventually break down the weatherproof seal. The softstart on the other hand is a great choice to add to your system. Seems like you do more research than the builders. Also you are typically better off installing the filter dryer on the interior of the home vs. the exterior, but that's a minimal debate.
Thanks for sharing that bit of knowledge! One more thing for me to be mad about at the builders for not doing right. ;-) Next time I'm out there, I'll go check if they have armaflex on that line inside that dryer duct. I wonder if they did that as a way to protect the insulation. Texas sun does beat down pretty hard in my area!
For the softstart to work best and reduce the compressor in-rush it would better it should be connected on the compressor side of the contacter.
The micro-air white wire connects where the compressor R (run) wire was connected. Then, you connect the micro-air brown wire to the compressor R (run) wire. You connect the micro-air black wire to the contactor on the other side of the contactor.
To find the right compressor R (run) wire, you look at the schematic on the inside of the cover. It will tell you what color it is. Mine was yellow.
Cool - what app are you using to measure amps on phone pls?
That's the sense app - sense.com/ You can pick it up at Lowe's or Home Depot or just get it online.
Can you tell me what’s the difference between this device and a start assist and a hard start kit and also a soft start up kit? Why is the fan turning so slow at 12:22 ?🤔 Thanks from New Orleans 🎭
The fan is not really turning slow - that's an illusion because of the camera. As for hard and soft start - hard start is cheaper and basically just an extra capacitor. It works by storing more juice so that when the compressor kicks in, more of the surge is being buffered by the extra capacitor than if there was nothing. If the hard start can cut your in rush down enough to run on your generator, it can be significantly cheaper. The microair soft start on the other hand has a computer logic board and a bit more sophisticated startup sequence. The soft start starts the compressor fan first to eliminate the inrush of that motor than starts the compressor. It has some learning logic to determine the best combination to reduce inrush as much as possible. Soft start is definitely more expensive and if you can get away with hard start, I'd recommend it for the price. I needed to do a soft start because my generator is relatively small. I'm somewhat amazed I can run a 4 ton AC off of something smaller than 10000 watts. Hope that helps! Thanks for commenting!
@@jonathanDIYs Does the circuit board have any surge protection? The last thing you need is a fried board as a result of lightning or power company surges during/after outages.
@@socrates2706 No surge protection on the soft start system itself. I did install a whole house SPD2 device that offers some protection of the unit.
I thought a 4 ton unit needed around 15 KW generator?
Without a soft start, you definitely need a 15kw unit. With a soft start, my 7k unit is able to power it just fine! AC units actually only need a lot of power during startup. If you're able to smooth out the startup power draw, you can run it with a smaller generator. The key values to look at are the LRA (locked rotar amps) and the RLA (rated load amps). The LRA is the amount of power it draws at startup and the RLA is the regular running load. A soft start reduces the LRA to be closer to the RLA.
Hi, what is LRA on your ac unit? I have also installed the easy start on my 4-ton ac Trane xl18i and my peak is 32.5 after 5 learn.
After training, my easystart is reporting that my LRA is 36.4A and my RLA is 13.7A. Looks like the Trane xl18i is a bit more efficient!
@@jonathanDIYs Thanks Jonathan. Were you able to do continous run test with central ac and other devices?
@@syedfaz26 yes, after the initial startup (lights dim slightly), I was able to have all my regular lights and devices on. I think it would fail if I tried to run the dryer at the same time, but it does a good job of running everything else (fridge, computers, lights, etc) at the same time.
@@jonathanDIYs That is great. To summarize my setup in case anyone is interested. I am going with 50 amp breaker, 45 ft four, 6 gauge wires in conduit from main panel to 50 amp inlet(Reliance PBN50). 4 ton Trane XL18i with x368 easy start from micro air and 9500 Predator Inverter Genrator. I will share some results after finish installing the inlet.
@@syedfaz26 I’ve heard awesome things about that generator. One guy on UA-cam made a parallel cable and can basically max the full 50 amps. With that much power, you practically can run everything without issue. Good luck with your install and stay safe - dealing with potentially deadly voltage!
Thanks
Nice job But your a/c fan wasn't spinning properly while on generator. Better check what's causing that. Could destroy your nice a/c unit.
Hi @rdcd111, thanks for your comment. The fan is actually spinning fine, it is just a camera glitch in capturing fast moving subjects where the camera makes it look like it is going much slower than it actually is going. You notice the same thing when they film propeller airplanes like in this video: ua-cam.com/video/jKXDVVvGlXE/v-deo.html
wow...on an 8750/7000 watt generator!!!
Here in NC , we are starting to get bad storms. Powergrid pretty good and rates are not that bad . 2400sqft house with temp set at 68 is about 200.00 a month
So far this year, been able to do 150 or so for a 2800 sq ft. set to 74 or 75. In the past, was able to do $100, but this summer has been extremely hot - 100+ degrees for almost 2 months straight now. I didn't find the soft start save any money, but it is hard to compare since this summer was a lot hotter than the previous summers.
The Soft Starter won't save you any money on your electric bill. The AC still uses the same volts when running. The Soft Starter lowers the inrush voltage at startup only.
Draining capacitor with multimeter could actually burn the multimeter and some cases even make it blow right in your hands, that’s the most dangerous thing your could do
I respectfully beg to differ. A capacitor stores microfarads (energy) and discharges it at a set voltage. If you look at the rating, it is usually 370 or 440 volts. Multimeters are designed to safely measure a certain amount of voltage, mine 600V. As long as you have it on the right setting (AC Voltage) and the voltage remains under the amount rated, it will be fine. The way multimeters work is they act as a very very high resistor. This is why when you test your voltage at an outlet, you don't blow a breaker. It measures the voltage and allows energy to flow very slowly.
"Most digital multimeters sold today for testing industrial, electrical, and electronic systems have high impedance input circuits greater than 1 megohm. In simple terms this means that when the DMM is placed across a circuit for a measurement, it will have little impact on circuit performance."
www.fluke.com/en-us/learn/blog/digital-multimeters/dual-impedance-digital-multimeters
Hi, what compressor model is yours? Thanks
Trane XR16 series 4TTR6048J1000AA from 5/2020
Thanks for your reply. I have Frigidaire - FS4BE-060KA - 5 Ton 14 SEER High Efficiency AC Compressor and been looking on UA-cam to see if someone may have the same or close to the same wiring to help me with the installation but haven't seen any. Do you think your wiring would be the same as mine?
@@VMH. have you opened up the compressor unit yet? Turn off the power at the disconnect switch box and unscrew the cover to access the capacitor and the contactor. If you only have a fan and compressor wires, then you have the same setup.
If you can't tell, take pictures and put them online somewhere and I'll be happy to take a look and let you know what I think.
After reading many reviews and watching a lot of videos, I chose this option for my first backup power station. ua-cam.com/users/postUgkxHypYDKHAN93Lp2RQpfvU_ksc70wJ00pt I was between this and a larger option that could power a wider range of items, but the price/size/capacity blend seemed right for this unit. Hasn't gotten a ton of use yet, but the build quality is solid and it charges fine via the Rockpals solar panel I purchased to pair with it. One thing to note is that the screen is optimized for a top down viewing angle, which makes sense, but this means it washes out at other angles - especially low angles. Not a huge deal, but perhaps a better option for the display could be used to provide wider viewing angles.
That is completely the wrong bushing for the knockout. You need to use a strain relief for the cable that has a nut to secure it to the knockout hole. The way it is now that bushing is going to fall out real soon and then the cable will rub against the sheet metal with vibration and cut into the insulation shorting out the circuit possibly burning out your expensive soft start kit and likely starting a fire. Thats real bad!
The hole is too small and is not able to hold a standard size bushing. On retrospect, I would have drilled the hole bigger and use a standard bushing with a strain relief. As it stands now, the wire is jammed in there with the plastic bushing and isn’t going anywhere. It took me 15 minutes to squeeze the wire and bushing through the hole. Thanks for the advice and thanks for commenting!
The other thing I would have done better is crimp the condenser wire instead of screwing it directly to the contactor. If I ever go back to opening or working on the unit, I’ll address those issues.
Well you lost some generator output with that long cable.
Hi Paul, thanks for commenting! According to Southwire's voltage drop calculator (www.southwire.com/calculator-vdrop), I only lose about 2.23% volts with the 10 gauge and ~85ft of cable I am using which is an acceptable amount. 30 amps over a 10 gauge wire can be run up to 114 ft.
If it were a thinner wire, I would have problems utilizing the full 7000 watts the generator can generate, but as it stands, the wire is sufficient for the generator.
Here are my tips as a result of surviving MANY hurricanes. After a hurricane expect power to be out on average 7days. This requires a LOT of gasoline or propane if you run your generator more or less continuously under significant load. That’s a lot of fuel to buy and store (good luck waiting in line for hours to buy gasoline after a storm if you can find any). A generator with a natural gas option and a hook up to your gas meter is the way to go. My experience with the aftermarket retrofit trifuel carburetors is not good. The problem is the ones with the regulator built into the carb overheat and cause the regulator to malfunction under continuous use. The carb gets VERY hot. You will have a challenge trying to power up a larger HVAC using a generator fueled with natural gas even with a soft start because of the wattage reduction. I use small to medium size window units. I also do keep propane and gasoline just in case my natural gas system malfunctions. Nothing worse than being without power in New Orleans after a hurricane. If you want minimal aggravation and have the resources, then get a Generac whole house backup generator permanently installed (but keep in mind they require maintenance and don’t last forever).
Thanks for your tips! I'm looking to do a natural gas conversion on this generator when it gets cooler. I will note that when we lost power in TX last year, natural gas was also in short supply. We didn't even have enough to run our hot water heater or the natural gas furnace. I think having multiple ways of powering the generator is best. I am very curious to see if I will have enough power to power my AC on natural gas/propane. I'll let everyone know when I try it!
@@jonathanDIYs It’s also a good idea to have another generator as a backup in case your primary generator has mechanical problems as a result of continuous use. You also need to change the oil after so many hours of operation so have a supply available. In the military they say one is none and two is one. You might consider purchasing a trifuel generator and use the one you have as a backup. Costco has a Firman that goes on sale for $200 off around twice a year (you just missed the July sale).
Great advice. Installing a Tri-fuel kit is much better, then an already made Tri-fuel generator. The reason why, is because on a Tri-fuel ready generator, the air fuel mixture is set. (No adjustments) When you install a Tri-fuel kit, Motor Snorkel, you can adjust the regulator based on your load. (Once set, you won't have to set it again) Meaning, you can adjust the air fuel mixture. This will minimize power lose some, when running on alternate fuels.
what is that app on your phone u are using for the current measuring???
That's the sense app (sense.com/). You can purchase a kit from Home Depot or Lowes. It attaches to your electric panel and measures current and voltage.
You should have been able to start the AC without the soft start.
There really isn't any way that the AC will start without the soft start with the generator size I have. The LRA (locked rotor amp) aka startup load on the AC is 80-100 Amps depending on your model. 80 amps * 220 volts is 17600 watts. You would need a larger generator that could do 17600 starting watts. My generator can only do 8750W starting watts and 7000W continuous. That's why I need the soft start!
Whap app you using on the computer and phone
That’s the sense app. You install a energy meter in your main power panel to measure the amps and voltage coming into the house. It then provides the wattage reading for everything- it’s pretty neat!
For the price of the Easy Start; which is no longer selling the smaller ones, I would like to have more data. Like... How much electricity is it going to save me? If it doesn't then how many years is it going to add to my A/C unit? Don't have answer to these questions? Then just so I can use a smaller generator is not a good investment criteria. Easy Start priced themselves out of the market buy just selling the commercial units only. End of story. Or better yet get a split cooling unit that has a heat pump instead!
Hi Teddy, thanks for commenting!
As far as I have observed, the easy start does not save ANY electricity. Theoretically, the A/C unit should last longer, but I think it probably is only extending the life of the capacitor or what not.
The only reason why I got it is to run a smaller generator... For me, a requirement was to run an inverter generator - I have sensitive electronics that would not work on regular generators. The math added up as follows:
Generator: $900 vs $2500 or $5000 generator for 11000 or 16000 watt generator
Upsizing wires: 10 gauge vs 8 gauge - $300 vs $600
I was looking at spending more than $2000-3000 more dollars if I was to just upsize my generator. Getting a easy start at $300 seemed like the better investment when considering these options.
If you don't have inverter generator as a requirement or don't mind getting a bigger generator that takes up more fuel/hour, just getting a bigger generator might be the right thing for you. In my scenario, it was the most cost-efficient option.
do a natural gas conversation
Did you notice $ saving also?
Hard to say… this year has been a lot hotter than last year. We are seeing 100+ degree weather in Texas for a week and a half straight. The bill has gone up because of that. I wouldn’t necessarily add this to save electricity - it was all to make sure I can run AC during an emergency power outage if it happened in the summer.
Are you kidding me, you literally skip the most interesting part, connecting the wires. :(
Do not drill into the coils!
Definitely! Good advice
doing electrical work while not being able to convert watts to amps is concerning. good demo otherwise
You'd be surprised how nerves can make you forget everything in front of a camera... at least it happens for me. W = A × V
Neighbors are gonna really that generator running…
You need a lesson in how to handle electricity. You trust that toy gadget to determine the lines are dead ? - pretty foolish. You should have used the multimeter. Also the soft kit is a piece of junk and is liable to ruin your compressor.
Good way to cause a condenser coil leak 😂