Please don't leave us. I just started getting into you. You've been really helpful in dealing with my frustrations over a lack of conversation between artist and audience in modern art, and I really appreciate that. PBS Game/Show is gone, PBS Idea Channel is leaving. I don't expect you to be here forever, I just really don't want you to go in the near future.
I guess Im asking the wrong place but does someone know a method to get back into an Instagram account? I was stupid lost the password. I would love any tips you can give me!
For sure! This was a great response. I think as long as a person does no harm (i.e. peeing on an artwork), museums have a good opportunity to engage with their audiences when something like this happens. Museums are (mostly) full of well meaning people who desperately want people to interact with the work they pour tons of time and thought and energy into.
What I really like about the glasses prank is that it is essentially people who listened to one of your first videos on this channel "That's easy, I could do that" "Well do it" And it was really a great example of this
That would be an interesting development: After the piece was criticized for abandoning the object's original purpose, what if that purpose was restored to it?
My mom and I had a half hour discussion this morning about the multitude of meanings you can extrapolate from Fountain, so I think it’s doing what art is supposed to do: make you think and question the world.
While this wasn't the intention the first thing I ended up thinking about is how a lot of art museums are really bad at being accessible to disabled people. I thought of someone who got so fed up with the terrible accessibility that they just put their glasses down and left.
the glasses prank also takes on a more traditional art form as soon they post it on instagram and in fact from the start since that was planned from the outset
Eric Taxxon That's not a good sign but an omen that art is being made equal to trash. Just like the urinal by Duchamp: "Art is to be pissed upon." A fine statent to show your contempt for the medium.
Except the people doing the pissing were artists too, so clearly they weren't just saying that art is trash or they would be saying that about themselves too
I made a critique of modern philosophy to a group of philosophy majors. This provoked an uproar of "You can't say that!" One of the senior girls said "He is DOING philosophy."
Lots of these ideas make good connections to the "I could have done that" video. Context and intent are seen as defining aspects of art as opposed to solely the visual of the product on display.
Yes, indeed. Lots of overlap with that video, and in some ways an answer to a lot of the virulent hate it receives daily. But I'm so glad for that video, because it provides such a valuable window for me into what each commenter thinks art should be. And while I agree that context and intent are now seen as a defining aspect of art, there is still plenty of art for which the primary thing is still the product on display. I think that's why art can be so challenging, because each new work you see often requires a completely different approach. Sometimes it's about the brushstrokes, the skill, the subject depicted. But sometimes it's about a whole different set of concerns.
There's been a lot of change in the philosophy and definition of art. While I can see why some of these "I could have done that" pieces could be rationalized as art, I'd like to point out that we've divorced context and intention from form. Art is not simply visual, but it's not pure thought either. It can't be. Our attempts to make it so have resulted in nothing but alienation from the common viewer, the exact opposite of art's purpose (or have we changed that too?). I once read that if a good reader cannot understand what's being said, it is the writer's fault for not communicating well enough. The same applies to art. It's funny. Art students get punished for unarticulated ideas, but galleries are stuffed full with them. Again, I don't mean to hate on modern art, but this is a philosophical dilemma, not just a categorical one.
I agree with you; I like some connection between context and form. Sarah, or at least the AA account, talks about sometimes it being the technical skill and sometimes about individual meaning. I don't think it's an either/or, but instead more of a spectrum. It gets into ideas of existentialism and postmodernism as a whole and how much input the viewer/reader/listener/audience has in determining the meaning. Sometimes very little and the art is very concrete in meaning, and sometimes it's teddy bears around a blanket. Personally, I don't mind when there is wiggle room for the audience to self-assign meaning, but when that is 100% the meaning of the art, I actually find it harder to engage with it.
"The art is what happens in the space that between you and "object." I have been thinking about this since this video posted a couple weeks ago. It is about the art itself it is about the relationship between the person and the object. If we think about the term relationship in reference to a person and another person, how is that cultivated: time, experience, and education... I can't stop thinking about this.
Is a urinal made art lessened by being pissed on? No, because we have to consider the question at all. The moment it wasn't "Hey, quit pissing on that art," and instead was "Should we stop these guys from pissing on this art?" Was the moment they had a reason to do it.
You raise some interesting points. I remember many years ago, entering one of my medium sized watercolour paintings, into the London Royal Academy of Arts, Summer Exhibition. It took quite some time to produce and I was quite proud it, especially as many people said how good it was. Alas, it was not selected for exhibit. However, when viewing the exhibition, I saw one exhibit, a small, white lace shawl hanging on a single nail in the wall. I thought, that’s it! How much effort did that take. Years later I realise there is much more to it, I learned a lesson there.
“The art isn’t in the glasses. The art is what happens in the space between you and the glasses-just as it exists between you and a Renaissance painting.” - Thank you for this. As someone who’s spent a lot of time screwing his face up at Duchamp’s “failed DYI project” and Malevich’s “white squares on white backgrounds,” that statement is a kick in the perception-a call to take a second thought.
The problem with Fountains reputation is that it was almost completely unknown until the replicas were made in 1964. Books on Dada and Surrealism before then show Duchamp works such as Bicycle Wheel and Bride Stripped Bare.....but do not even mention Fountain.
I struggle with this one. I think when art is created to push boundaries, we tend to praise it (eventually). This creates problems when that art is devoid of any other remarkable qualities. I believe Duchamp’s “Fountain” is guilty of this, and has convinced young, naive, yet aspiring artists to think that they can do what ever they want in art just as long as it is edgy and pushing boundaries; thus perpetuating the problem.
but when you say its devoid of any other remarkable qualities its more of your own opinion, thats what makes it hard to argue. I think art is too objective to even deny or reject certain works
But it also forces us to reconsider the unremarkable in new ways, analyzing the aesthetic properties of things that we might otherwise take for granted, or enabling us to critique the institutional barriers of what constitutes "art" and what doesn't.
What is one saying when one says, "I could have done this." Is it why am I not famous and in an art gallery? Or I could cash in and make millions of dollars with little effort. Maybe it is questioning the effort applied to producing an art piece. Or the skill level required. In other words I think we want to be transformed but in a way we can also be in awe of the work required to get our attention. Does what appear to be shortcuts belittle the result?
The reason we are impressed by things is because it took a bunch of skill or thought, or some other scarce quality or resource. The reason why people are impressed by artworks such as a urinal or a blank canvas is whatever they themselves make themselves think or feel by looking at it. If you look at something, with the mindset that it’s profound and ingenious, then u will also think that way about it, and especially when everyone around you does too. And another, i think more common reason, people react to these artworks like that, is because of how famous the artist is. So the same reason why you might want Elvis’s guitar despite is just being like any other guitar materially.
Prank art. They may have pranked themselves. The guy who made the photo may not have been "fooled". He probably knew what was going on and decided to record it. Just like the photographer who photographed the photographer photographing the glasses. I would have preferred an old, worn out boot.
Two people (One of them being my friend) went to an art-gallery. My friends companion, a little bit sad and bored perhaps, leaned against a wall and got lost in her own thoughts. Since she stood so still people started gathering around her, thinking she was part of the exhibition! My friend even got a photo of the spectacle!
When I saw the title, I thought to myself, she could really talk about the guy with the glasses on the gallery floor, and there it is, amazing video, really insightful, thank you! :D
Just as art can make us examine, think about, and question society and the world around us, I love it when artists make us examine, think about, and question art itself.
This video also made me think about a conversation I had with a friend. I had this beautiful Asparagus fern who had grown so beautifully with branches reaching and twisting into themselves. I called it art of nature, while she argued that it probably can't be art since no human hand was involved in how the plant grew with an intention of creating art. I feel like the plant was art since I viewed it as an art piece. It was not art for her- and that's ok.
The discourse makes it art - if it gets us engaged. Like or Dislike is too simple a response - all art "moves" us in some way - the best example is music, but it applies to all forms.
I want to see more of the performance artists ( commonly called cleaners) in galleries. It is they who keep the space between us and the art works clear for interaction. Their services are underated!
After struggling myself with modern art I find a bit daft and trying to figure out what I want to create these videos have been extremely enlightening, thank you.
I think it's very generous to say the "victims" of the prank are looking for meaning. Alternatively they could just as well be behaving like they are meant to behave in an art gallery; not thinking or looking for anything at all other than perhaps belonging or approval. My guess is it's this second type of behaviour the kids were pranking. And speaking of pranking: Piero Manzoni?
I think the glasses prank is more artistic than the urinal piece because it actually proves that people will accept anything as fine art just because it's showcased as such. So the glasses themselves is not the art, but the predictable actions of people is. It's a comedy.
Sarah enthusiasm to understand, explain and accept is exceptional. Still, no matter how I love and understand what she is trying and saying, majority of objects here are simply not art.
Thanks for this Sarah. For me, the underlying message here is about taking responsibility for our experiences and our reality. We are all having our on relationship with art and we are all apart of creating the "institution" that is the art world. It's far more empowering to embrace that by contributing instead of complaining.
Arguably, we often consider pairs of glasses as art (in and of themselves ignoring the context of them being placed in a gallery as a joke). Glasses after all are pieces of fashion; they have a design ascetic which is part functional design and part going for a "look." Usually we think of glasses as fashion (a type of art) when we wear them and they are part of our visual appeal, on our bodies, but when we take them off, unless we are thinking of how someone might like to buy them to wear, we sometimes forget the art going into a pair of glasses and see them as just a thing, a functional piece...Unless we turn to admiring the art of the functional design (e.g. appreciating the skill involved in thin lenses on a pair of glasses)
Can I say that my absolute favorite thing about this story is that the SFMOMA has a Duchamp Fountain. Also thank you for doing an ep touching on Duchamp!
I think you made great points and explained this discussion very eloquently. However, I have mix feelings about this subject: "pranks" that become art when a person admires a certain object or some visual casualty that people confuse with/interpret as a piece of art. This is really hard to explain, but I'll try: 1) I believe that any piece of art has to be observed/"perceived" by someone (by a person who has emotions or a conscience) in order to "come to life" or "exist as art"; 2) People can and often will "experience" and/or interpret a piece of art differently. The same painture or song/etc could make me or someone else evoque different emotions, remember different memories, have a more or less intense reaction, find a different meaning/s; 3) Considering the previous points, it could be argued that a prank or any random object should be considered art if an audience perceives it as art; 4) My problem is that although Art is almost impossible to define, at least it seems to me that Art is the result of an act of creation, this is why I believe the intention of the author/artist is relevant; 5) In my conception, Art can use any medium to transmit a message that materializes itself through an "act of creation". A dancer, a musician, a singer, an actor, a painter, a chef... These artist create something using their music, ingredients, words, materials, their bodies, etc with the intention of transmitting "something" to "someone", it could be anything (a feeling, a story, an idea, a statement, a criticism, an opinion, a gift, etc). The artist externalizes something internal; 6) Once the art is out there in the world, it becomes "an end in itself", that's why the audience's interpretation may differ drastically from the artist's interpretation and we can defend our interpretation with arguments or criticise the art piece. But I think if I put an object in a museum as a prank, with the intention to fool people, but without changing anything about the object itself nor its surroundings, without having a message in mind: If there is no "act of creation", then it's not art. In the case of the urinal, it was sort of an act of rebellion, the artist wanted to protest because they were censoring his art... In a way, the urinal was questioning "What is art? Do these elite institutions have the right to decide what is or isn't art? No they don't".... So, I think the artist had a message, and created controversy, it could be considered more of an act of protest.
I think the relationship between artist and institution is always going to be... interesting. Most artists are beholden to institutions for both employment and legitimacy as artists, so they're simultaneously trying to get on their good side and limited by them.
i used to have the, i could do that mentality, but this channel has really come to help me appreciate not just art but so many different kinds of art. thank you for that gift .
Cold dark universe haha!! Great video, reminds me of all the tumblr posts and threads on 'pranks' in art galleries. Thanks so much for making such a great channel. I saw duchamp's readymades a few weeks ago in one of my first ever big time museum art visits and my brother couldn't understand why I was flipping out over a shovel haha. And I'm like, blame the art assignment! I personally love the fountain and appreciated all the art I saw/see because of you guys. Thanks for that :)
In 2017 we created three print-on-demant mugs and wrote R.MUTT 2017 on them. We called them Ready-to-be-made, but the point of contemporary art is promotion and marketing, not artwork itself...
Marcel Duchamp has been my favorite artist for years. I'm a big fan of cubism and Dadaism, love so many of his pieces and the "jokes" he played. Really great video, thanks
My college art professor did something like this. He was showing in a college gallery and he *hated* all of the student art and found it all pretentious. So he took an ashtray from the front desk, and placed in on the floor with the name 'Buttheads'.
Yay! I've been anticipating this video since it's "preview" at VidCon, and it's gotten even better, wonderful video. I'm really struck by Andrea Fraser's meditation on the idea of an "institution" as somehow being separate from us, and on how we often disavow our role in shaping it (or other institutions and relationships in our life). How you tie that together in the end is brilliantly put -- I am very much going to use that phrase "The art isn't in the glasses, the art is what happens in the space between you and the glasses." Beautiful. There's definitively art in that space between your words and me. It reminds me that art exists in the interaction, and the more I keep myself open for that dialogue (whether I immediately think "I like it" or "That's crud!"), the more possibility there exists for art. Also... with that non-recommended invitation for performance art, a nice old-school call-back to the days of "Don't break the law?" :D Appropriate that UA-cam has the "Please break the law?" video as one of the suggested ones in the sidebar... ;)
Oh hell yes about this prank! I also pranked the SFMoMa (see a pattern?) by taking a picture of dust bunnies on the stairs. People started taking pictures of me taking pictures from weird places on the floor and stairs showing that, clearly, they too were bored by SFMoMa's choices.
"Fine Art is the deliberate, creative, reflective, human expression of an idea, with the purpose of saying something important and redemptive to other humans about their humanity -- and which may be analyzed and evaluated for the validity and importance of its truth claims and intent." -Charles Clevenger One of the big points made in this video is that art is art when the viewer perceives it to be art. The artist's intent, however, is so often ignored. Is it art when the artist intends to convey his or her own humanity and create a metaphorical meaning behind the work?
I wonder whether we could apply the concepts of Barthes' _Death of the Author_ to art other than literature? Metaphorical meaning may or may not be seen by those other than the artist; if not, why can't we analyse what we _can_ see?
I love the Art Assignment. It helps me feel connected to my field now that I've graduated from college. I'll go back for more soon, but I like how this helps me stay attune to art and the questions surrounding its existence and creation in the meantime.
Art is strictly an expression of an artist who has expressed their idea, while the one observing the art is a voyeur. Without an artist, the one viewing something as artistic becomes the artist who can either choose to share that thing they view as artistic through some medium or leave it alone for their own enjoyment, never to be shared. One can even view another's art and re-present it in a new way to express how they themselves view it or to evoke a new response. In this way, art is communication, not between the piece and the voyeur, but between the artist and the voyeur. Anyone who views the piece in a way unintended by the artist becomes the artist, and is no longer receiving a communication from the artist, but is expressing a message they wish to see expressed in the piece.
I did this at the MoMA in 2008. Documented. I did it in their old minimalist room with my shoes and I was siting in the next room with my socks on watching the viewer that caught on do a double take. The guards let me keep the work up all day.
tbh there is something of an art to pulling off a good and successful prank. Like one that's incredibly clever and not just being an ass to someone, one that makes the person for a moment feel like they're part of some surreal world.
The point of the glasses was that they were quick and less 'considered' than (presumably) the pieces around them, a sudden inspiration and yet still garnered interest and serious consideration. Had it been more staged and considered then the point would have been diluted. That's what makes the joke and ultimately makes them far more memorable than the official art in the gallery. No-one would even remember the teddies and blanket piece without it being referenced to the glasses. The museum's quip that here was the new Duchamp was more apt than they perhaps realised although little can match the novelty of Duchamp's joke a century ago.
I think this kind of discussion brings in greater questions of where the intersection of artistic depth and humor lies. I analyze memes from an artistic perspective all the time, they have a symbolic language to them and a regularity and clear intent that often surprises people who may not approach jokes from the perspective of breaking them down into meaningful information. "bottom text" is a punchline highlighting the lack of an apparent punchline, hyperpixelating or deepfrying an image conveys intent to view the subject matter as absurd and unreal in a similar manner to choice of colour in other visual art, perspective can be manipulated to make meta humor of a meme specifically interacting with the viewer through the use of illusion of depth where it's unexpected or dynamic motion.
I'd love to find an episode about Richard Prince and your take on it. Most of us are only scratching the surface by accusing him of stealing others work when in reality he's changing art history's direction dramatically. At least that is my opinion and I'd love to hear yours.
You just gave me an Idea on how I might have a chance on how to appreciate art. You make it sound to me that art can be extended beyond the piece of art, towards the space between it and me, and furthermore into my mind, my subconcious universe and everything who I am, what I've learned and combine it with everything that is. Damn! Now I have to go and visit this bulky museum and see the art of Beuys again. And I really don't like the art of Beuys. It feels so depressing to me.
Haha. Yes, it was rather pleasant delivering this in a quiet room, but oh so much less of a challenge. It was tough to trim it down. So much more to say! Thanks for coming to the presentation, and for watching another version of it.
Art is whatever you think it is. Its when an object or piece is injected with human life, emotion and time. With that being said, I like some types of art mich better than others, that including some modern art
7 років тому
I think this wasn't a prank but a mischievoust act...
"The backstory is important" is the Antithesis of Art. This approach toward dealing with the contests of those critical to these artists couldn't be more pedantic if it were a "art bogo sale" button on a curator's lapel! You dont argue with trolls who scoff, " I could do that. " You merely encourage them to GO AND DO IT (elsewhere) or NOT, but refrain from undermining things they do not understand on the premises of another person whom is staking their livelihood upon making the exhibition possible for those who DO appreciate it. See how that works? Double Standards and Antithesis Solved.
The first Fountain is a work of art because it had a point and a purpose behind it. All of the copies that were sold benefited of the wallet of the artist cause every museum wanted to be the cool kid in on the joke. This is my issue with Duchamp's Fountain in museums. While I admit I am not a big fan of his work there are pieces I appreciate. I love Nude Descending a Staircase. Étant donnés: 1° la chute d'eau, 2° le gaz d'éclairage . . . (Given: 1. The Waterfall, 2. The Illuminating Gas . . . ) is smart and smart-ass at the same time.The Bride Stripped Bare by Her Bachelors, Even (The Large Glass) is an interesting piece. That said I like the photo of the original Fountain because it captures the moment of creative thinking but even then they knew that the object was unimportant as the idea. That is why the Original Fountain was thrown out. The idea was gone, now it was a memory. I did think it was funny when PMA painted R.Mutt 1917 on toilets and urinals in the museum though.
I was surprised you didn't touch on the suggestion that Duchamp was not the artist who created Fountain, but originally submitted it on behalf of a female friend (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fountain_(Duchamp)#Origin)
Very thought provoking! I had never thought of myself as part of an institution. As a member of the IMA I will definitely look at things with a fresh eye now.
I find "fine art" revolting in that it rejects or excludes certain genres and styles. Here it speaks about "ennobling" objects, to bring new perspective and meaning - but fine art fails to find those things in ALL works of art. There is never any explanation for that and I think it's worth commenting on.
This video is known as "Turning into the skid". The ridiculousness of what conceptual artists (People who are bad at math) insist upon as something profound was spotlighted by the glasses. Instead of admitting that most abstract expressionism is the product of, otherwise, unemployable self-absorbed hacks, The Art Assignment is attempting an obviously palpable "I meant to do that". Artists like Picasso, Cezanne, Braque, and Dali were trained , practiced, and gifted artists who had already proved their classical bonafides and were looking for something more. (I have often compared Pablo Picasso to Eddy Van Halen in that both are virtuosos ((Vituosi?)) that were introverted in their creation as opposed to extroverted like a musician who enjoys entertaining a crowd with the same songs every night.) Duchamp too could paint things that look like the things they look like. See "Portrait of the Artist's Father". And his cubist stuff took real talent. But the readymades (Even if he was making a statement) paved the way for the pseudo intellectual tripe that we are bombarded with by decidedly non-artists and pretentious art consumers. No! The glasses were not a deep, meaningful, editorial on the nature of art. They shined a light on the hollow attempts of people desperate to be special (In this case, the art crowd - Also a great read by Sophy Burnham - but it could be foodies, wine enthusiasts, the caviar wrist lickers, or sports talk radio hosts). I've always wondered what would happen if art pieces were simply displayed with no reference to the artist. Would anybody have paid whatever the outrageous sum was for "Onement VI" if it didn't have the cachet of Barnett Newman? And don't get me started on Warhol's screen prints. If a piece genuinely touches someone, that's great. They've been moved or entertained or in some way affected. But nobody was moved by the glasses. And if the people standing around them were by themselves, they wouldn't have given them a second look...or they would have turned them in to lost and found.
I think the glasses prank could be considered art in the sense that it challenges people to question and think differently about the world. It is an invitation to question the point of modern art, and what can or will be considered art. It makes us notice that an unmodified everyday object placed on the floor is considered art only because it is in a museum, and asks us if that is/should be enough to make it art. And, as a prank, it was intended to entertain, which is a purpose a lot of art serves.
the guys pulling the prank, didn't care if it would entertain others or not, they did it to entertain themself, and prove theyere prejudice, and they were correct.
Fountain is 100 years old now.
Happy Birthday! 🚽
and its amazing that we still talk about it! :O
Lol
Now 103
And art has degraded even more. Remarkably...
Please don't leave us.
I just started getting into you. You've been really helpful in dealing with my frustrations over a lack of conversation between artist and audience in modern art, and I really appreciate that.
PBS Game/Show is gone, PBS Idea Channel is leaving. I don't expect you to be here forever, I just really don't want you to go in the near future.
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i feel your pain, random internet commenter. i'm also very upset about idea channel even if i know i can't expect people to make things forever
I guess Im asking the wrong place but does someone know a method to get back into an Instagram account?
I was stupid lost the password. I would love any tips you can give me!
Same here. I learned so many new insights on modern art that really helped me understand the purpose behind them.
the SFMOMA social media people are good sports for not simply condemning this and actually (maybe involuntarily) further the conversation!!
For sure! This was a great response. I think as long as a person does no harm (i.e. peeing on an artwork), museums have a good opportunity to engage with their audiences when something like this happens. Museums are (mostly) full of well meaning people who desperately want people to interact with the work they pour tons of time and thought and energy into.
They wouldn't be a progressive art gallery otherwise. People would mock them for their un-artfulness.
@ And thank god for that am I right? It had really overstayed it's welcome.
What I really like about the glasses prank is that it is essentially people who listened to one of your first videos on this channel "That's easy, I could do that" "Well do it"
And it was really a great example of this
Museums and art galleries should have all the urinals in their men's rooms that be replicas of Duchamp's Fountain, signed "R. Mutt."
All the Fountains are replicas. The original is lost.
Gavin Reid you miss the point? It’s conceptual art - there is no real original.
Michael Donovan i agree
That would be an interesting development: After the piece was criticized for abandoning the object's original purpose, what if that purpose was restored to it?
@@danatronics9039 There was a performance artist who did just that, I can't remember who they were though
My mom and I had a half hour discussion this morning about the multitude of meanings you can extrapolate from Fountain, so I think it’s doing what art is supposed to do: make you think and question the world.
Glasses seem like a very apt ready made art object to have in a place where you go to look at things
While this wasn't the intention the first thing I ended up thinking about is how a lot of art museums are really bad at being accessible to disabled people. I thought of someone who got so fed up with the terrible accessibility that they just put their glasses down and left.
Dose that Idea warrant a above and beyond Value to the object. ?
@@ericswain4177 No one was charging anything for those glasses so that's kind of irrelevant to the question
I mean, unless you are like me. If I put my glasses on the floor the joy would be great until I crashed into a wall or glass.
Art is philosophy made material
Step Back History
In the case of modern non-art, it's trash philosophy.
Gold words make for good poetry, or at the very least an aphorism
Maybe. But the truth resists simplicity.
You're about 60 years late to be talking about modern art
Art is metaphysics made material.
the glasses prank also takes on a more traditional art form as soon they post it on instagram and in fact from the start since that was planned from the outset
agreed
Though are youtube comments art?
literature
You pinned the tail on the donkey here, these pranksters are unknowingly making artistic statements with their jokes.
Eric Taxxon
That's not a good sign but an omen that art is being made equal to trash. Just like the urinal by Duchamp:
"Art is to be pissed upon."
A fine statent to show your contempt for the medium.
Except the people doing the pissing were artists too, so clearly they weren't just saying that art is trash or they would be saying that about themselves too
OMG Eric!!! It's you! The Art State is my go to study album. Nice to see you around and keep up the music it's great
I made a critique of modern philosophy to a group of philosophy majors. This provoked an uproar of "You can't say that!" One of the senior girls said "He is DOING philosophy."
Lots of these ideas make good connections to the "I could have done that" video. Context and intent are seen as defining aspects of art as opposed to solely the visual of the product on display.
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Trey Willetto +
Yes, indeed. Lots of overlap with that video, and in some ways an answer to a lot of the virulent hate it receives daily. But I'm so glad for that video, because it provides such a valuable window for me into what each commenter thinks art should be.
And while I agree that context and intent are now seen as a defining aspect of art, there is still plenty of art for which the primary thing is still the product on display. I think that's why art can be so challenging, because each new work you see often requires a completely different approach. Sometimes it's about the brushstrokes, the skill, the subject depicted. But sometimes it's about a whole different set of concerns.
There's been a lot of change in the philosophy and definition of art. While I can see why some of these "I could have done that" pieces could be rationalized as art, I'd like to point out that we've divorced context and intention from form. Art is not simply visual, but it's not pure thought either. It can't be. Our attempts to make it so have resulted in nothing but alienation from the common viewer, the exact opposite of art's purpose (or have we changed that too?). I once read that if a good reader cannot understand what's being said, it is the writer's fault for not communicating well enough. The same applies to art. It's funny. Art students get punished for unarticulated ideas, but galleries are stuffed full with them. Again, I don't mean to hate on modern art, but this is a philosophical dilemma, not just a categorical one.
I agree with you; I like some connection between context and form.
Sarah, or at least the AA account, talks about sometimes it being the technical skill and sometimes about individual meaning. I don't think it's an either/or, but instead more of a spectrum. It gets into ideas of existentialism and postmodernism as a whole and how much input the viewer/reader/listener/audience has in determining the meaning. Sometimes very little and the art is very concrete in meaning, and sometimes it's teddy bears around a blanket.
Personally, I don't mind when there is wiggle room for the audience to self-assign meaning, but when that is 100% the meaning of the art, I actually find it harder to engage with it.
"The art is what happens in the space that between you and "object." I have been thinking about this since this video posted a couple weeks ago. It is about the art itself it is about the relationship between the person and the object. If we think about the term relationship in reference to a person and another person, how is that cultivated: time, experience, and education... I can't stop thinking about this.
I appreciate that quote as well... it really reframes the whole art experience.
Is a urinal made art lessened by being pissed on? No, because we have to consider the question at all. The moment it wasn't "Hey, quit pissing on that art," and instead was "Should we stop these guys from pissing on this art?" Was the moment they had a reason to do it.
You raise some interesting points. I remember many years ago, entering one of my medium sized watercolour paintings, into the London Royal Academy of Arts, Summer Exhibition. It took quite some time to produce and I was quite proud it, especially as many people said how good it was. Alas, it was not selected for exhibit. However, when viewing the exhibition, I saw one exhibit, a small, white lace shawl hanging on a single nail in the wall. I thought, that’s it! How much effort did that take. Years later I realise there is much more to it, I learned a lesson there.
What is there more to it?
“The art isn’t in the glasses. The art is what happens in the space between you and the glasses-just as it exists between you and a Renaissance painting.” - Thank you for this. As someone who’s spent a lot of time screwing his face up at Duchamp’s “failed DYI project” and Malevich’s “white squares on white backgrounds,” that statement is a kick in the perception-a call to take a second thought.
The problem with Fountains reputation is that it was almost completely unknown until the replicas were made in 1964. Books on Dada and Surrealism before then show Duchamp works such as Bicycle Wheel and Bride Stripped Bare.....but do not even mention Fountain.
I struggle with this one. I think when art is created to push boundaries, we tend to praise it (eventually). This creates problems when that art is devoid of any other remarkable qualities. I believe Duchamp’s “Fountain” is guilty of this, and has convinced young, naive, yet aspiring artists to think that they can do what ever they want in art just as long as it is edgy and pushing boundaries; thus perpetuating the problem.
but when you say its devoid of any other remarkable qualities its more of your own opinion, thats what makes it hard to argue. I think art is too objective to even deny or reject certain works
But it also forces us to reconsider the unremarkable in new ways, analyzing the aesthetic properties of things that we might otherwise take for granted, or enabling us to critique the institutional barriers of what constitutes "art" and what doesn't.
Yeah, looks more like a prank than art
What is one saying when one says, "I could have done this." Is it why am I not famous and in an art gallery? Or I could cash in and make millions of dollars with little effort. Maybe it is questioning the effort applied to producing an art piece. Or the skill level required. In other words I think we want to be transformed but in a way we can also be in awe of the work required to get our attention. Does what appear to be shortcuts belittle the result?
The reason we are impressed by things is because it took a bunch of skill or thought, or some other scarce quality or resource. The reason why people are impressed by artworks such as a urinal or a blank canvas is whatever they themselves make themselves think or feel by looking at it. If you look at something, with the mindset that it’s profound and ingenious, then u will also think that way about it, and especially when everyone around you does too. And another, i think more common reason, people react to these artworks like that, is because of how famous the artist is. So the same reason why you might want Elvis’s guitar despite is just being like any other guitar materially.
Art or prank? Can't it be both?
Yes! Titles (esp UA-cams ones) are only designed to get you here ;)
TaddsDelight
It's trash. To show how gullible people are.
Prank art. They may have pranked themselves. The guy who made the photo may not have been "fooled". He probably knew what was going on and decided to record it. Just like the photographer who photographed the photographer photographing the glasses. I would have preferred an old, worn out boot.
I like a good artistic prank. Shows up the pretentious nature of some of the art world.
🌲🌝☘️
Two people (One of them being my friend) went to an art-gallery. My friends companion, a little bit sad and bored perhaps, leaned against a wall and got lost in her own thoughts. Since she stood so still people started gathering around her, thinking she was part of the exhibition! My friend even got a photo of the spectacle!
When I saw the title, I thought to myself, she could really talk about the guy with the glasses on the gallery floor, and there it is, amazing video, really insightful, thank you! :D
“Art is what you make it. And I’m not making enough!”
Patti Hoskins
Just as art can make us examine, think about, and question society and the world around us, I love it when artists make us examine, think about, and question art itself.
This video also made me think about a conversation I had with a friend. I had this beautiful Asparagus fern who had grown so beautifully with branches reaching and twisting into themselves. I called it art of nature, while she argued that it probably can't be art since no human hand was involved in how the plant grew with an intention of creating art. I feel like the plant was art since I viewed it as an art piece. It was not art for her- and that's ok.
The discourse makes it art - if it gets us engaged. Like or Dislike is too simple a response - all art "moves" us in some way - the best example is music, but it applies to all forms.
I want to see more of the performance artists ( commonly called cleaners) in galleries. It is they who keep the space between us and the art works clear for interaction. Their services are underated!
After struggling myself with modern art I find a bit daft and trying to figure out what I want to create these videos have been extremely enlightening, thank you.
I think it's very generous to say the "victims" of the prank are looking for meaning.
Alternatively they could just as well be behaving like they are meant to behave in an art gallery; not thinking or looking for anything at all other than perhaps belonging or approval. My guess is it's this second type of behaviour the kids were pranking.
And speaking of pranking: Piero Manzoni?
I often take pictures of art that I absolutely hate as well as love. Inspiration comes in many forms.
I think the glasses prank is more artistic than the urinal piece because it actually proves that people will accept anything as fine art just because it's showcased as such. So the glasses themselves is not the art, but the predictable actions of people is. It's a comedy.
Once the museum itself becomes a required part of the artwork I think it ceases to be art.
Sarah enthusiasm to understand, explain and accept is exceptional. Still, no matter how I love and understand what she is trying and saying, majority of objects here are simply not art.
"And while I cannot say I like or approve of this peeing performance" gotta say I do both!
I just feel sorry for the poor bugger who has to clean it up
you missed the point of the glasses prank! they were not to imitate Duchamp but to question his question.
can you explain further what you mean?
yes but by questioning the did contribute to the same idea Duchamp presented - as is analyzed in the rest of the video
I dont think they missed that point at all
Eventually someone’s going to put a stained inside out underwear on a wall and call it art. By stained I mean a shit mark by the pooper hole.
If everything can be considered an art then what's the value of art.
Thanks for this Sarah. For me, the underlying message here is about taking responsibility for our experiences and our reality. We are all having our on relationship with art and we are all apart of creating the "institution" that is the art world. It's far more empowering to embrace that by contributing instead of complaining.
Arguably, we often consider pairs of glasses as art (in and of themselves ignoring the context of them being placed in a gallery as a joke). Glasses after all are pieces of fashion; they have a design ascetic which is part functional design and part going for a "look." Usually we think of glasses as fashion (a type of art) when we wear them and they are part of our visual appeal, on our bodies, but when we take them off, unless we are thinking of how someone might like to buy them to wear, we sometimes forget the art going into a pair of glasses and see them as just a thing, a functional piece...Unless we turn to admiring the art of the functional design (e.g. appreciating the skill involved in thin lenses on a pair of glasses)
" You eventually become what you are making fun of " - Beastie Boys
Beasties forever!
Can I say that my absolute favorite thing about this story is that the SFMOMA has a Duchamp Fountain. Also thank you for doing an ep touching on Duchamp!
I'm not crazy, institution
You're the one who's crazy, institution
You're driving me crazy, institution
All I wanted was a god damn pepsi
I think you made great points and explained this discussion very eloquently. However, I have mix feelings about this subject: "pranks" that become art when a person admires a certain object or some visual casualty that people confuse with/interpret as a piece of art.
This is really hard to explain, but I'll try: 1) I believe that any piece of art has to be observed/"perceived" by someone (by a person who has emotions or a conscience) in order to "come to life" or "exist as art";
2) People can and often will "experience" and/or interpret a piece of art differently. The same painture or song/etc could make me or someone else evoque different emotions, remember different memories, have a more or less intense reaction, find a different meaning/s;
3) Considering the previous points, it could be argued that a prank or any random object should be considered art if an audience perceives it as art;
4) My problem is that although Art is almost impossible to define, at least it seems to me that Art is the result of an act of creation, this is why I believe the intention of the author/artist is relevant;
5) In my conception, Art can use any medium to transmit a message that materializes itself through an "act of creation". A dancer, a musician, a singer, an actor, a painter, a chef... These artist create something using their music, ingredients, words, materials, their bodies, etc with the intention of transmitting "something" to "someone", it could be anything (a feeling, a story, an idea, a statement, a criticism, an opinion, a gift, etc). The artist externalizes something internal;
6) Once the art is out there in the world, it becomes "an end in itself", that's why the audience's interpretation may differ drastically from the artist's interpretation and we can defend our interpretation with arguments or criticise the art piece.
But I think if I put an object in a museum as a prank, with the intention to fool people, but without changing anything about the object itself nor its surroundings, without having a message in mind: If there is no "act of creation", then it's not art.
In the case of the urinal, it was sort of an act of rebellion, the artist wanted to protest because they were censoring his art... In a way, the urinal was questioning "What is art? Do these elite institutions have the right to decide what is or isn't art? No they don't".... So, I think the artist had a message, and created controversy, it could be considered more of an act of protest.
I think the relationship between artist and institution is always going to be... interesting. Most artists are beholden to institutions for both employment and legitimacy as artists, so they're simultaneously trying to get on their good side and limited by them.
Someone should sneak a toilet into a modern art museum and invite people to use it, calling it interactive art.
i used to have the, i could do that mentality, but this channel has really come to help me appreciate not just art but so many different kinds of art. thank you for that gift .
Cold dark universe haha!! Great video, reminds me of all the tumblr posts and threads on 'pranks' in art galleries. Thanks so much for making such a great channel. I saw duchamp's readymades a few weeks ago in one of my first ever big time museum art visits and my brother couldn't understand why I was flipping out over a shovel haha. And I'm like, blame the art assignment! I personally love the fountain and appreciated all the art I saw/see because of you guys. Thanks for that :)
I'll accept blame any day for someone flipping out in a museum. Thank you for being part of this community!
Art is a device of communication between the minds. People speaking different languages may interpret another man's poetry as gibberish.
Oh my god... this needs to be played before everyone as they enter any museum!
Look at the Picasso Manifesto, it picks up where DuChamp left off. It intends to ask what is art today
I have an idea for an art piece. Take a months supply of trash and put it in an art gallery surrounding a mannequin.
In 2017 we created three print-on-demant mugs and wrote R.MUTT 2017 on them. We called them Ready-to-be-made, but the point of contemporary art is promotion and marketing, not artwork itself...
cool
Marcel Duchamp has been my favorite artist for years. I'm a big fan of cubism and Dadaism, love so many of his pieces and the "jokes" he played. Really great video, thanks
My college art professor did something like this. He was showing in a college gallery and he *hated* all of the student art and found it all pretentious. So he took an ashtray from the front desk, and placed in on the floor with the name 'Buttheads'.
my girlfriends grandfather has one of the copy’s in his house in his personal art gallery and i was amazed at it
It widens my perspective how should I look towards an art. Love it! 👏
Yay! I've been anticipating this video since it's "preview" at VidCon, and it's gotten even better, wonderful video. I'm really struck by Andrea Fraser's meditation on the idea of an "institution" as somehow being separate from us, and on how we often disavow our role in shaping it (or other institutions and relationships in our life). How you tie that together in the end is brilliantly put -- I am very much going to use that phrase "The art isn't in the glasses, the art is what happens in the space between you and the glasses." Beautiful. There's definitively art in that space between your words and me. It reminds me that art exists in the interaction, and the more I keep myself open for that dialogue (whether I immediately think "I like it" or "That's crud!"), the more possibility there exists for art.
Also... with that non-recommended invitation for performance art, a nice old-school call-back to the days of "Don't break the law?" :D Appropriate that UA-cam has the "Please break the law?" video as one of the suggested ones in the sidebar... ;)
+
I almost have no other means of learning about art right now so Sarah, please keep those videos coming and thank you for the good work you do.
barometers of what...the acceptamce of stupidity?
like the emperor's new clothes?
Ok, you changed my mind on this, a little. Thanks!
Oh hell yes about this prank! I also pranked the SFMoMa (see a pattern?) by taking a picture of dust bunnies on the stairs. People started taking pictures of me taking pictures from weird places on the floor and stairs showing that, clearly, they too were bored by SFMoMa's choices.
"The art is what happens in the space between you and the glasses".
"Fine Art is the deliberate, creative, reflective, human expression of an idea, with the purpose of saying something important and redemptive to other humans about their humanity -- and which may be analyzed and evaluated for the validity and importance of its truth claims and intent." -Charles Clevenger
One of the big points made in this video is that art is art when the viewer perceives it to be art. The artist's intent, however, is so often ignored. Is it art when the artist intends to convey his or her own humanity and create a metaphorical meaning behind the work?
I wonder whether we could apply the concepts of Barthes' _Death of the Author_ to art other than literature? Metaphorical meaning may or may not be seen by those other than the artist; if not, why can't we analyse what we _can_ see?
Just loved the concept that art is between you and the piece!
I love the Art Assignment. It helps me feel connected to my field now that I've graduated from college. I'll go back for more soon, but I like how this helps me stay attune to art and the questions surrounding its existence and creation in the meantime.
Kudos to SFMOMA for clapping back at Kevin Nguyen with class 👏🏻
Art is strictly an expression of an artist who has expressed their idea, while the one observing the art is a voyeur. Without an artist, the one viewing something as artistic becomes the artist who can either choose to share that thing they view as artistic through some medium or leave it alone for their own enjoyment, never to be shared. One can even view another's art and re-present it in a new way to express how they themselves view it or to evoke a new response. In this way, art is communication, not between the piece and the voyeur, but between the artist and the voyeur. Anyone who views the piece in a way unintended by the artist becomes the artist, and is no longer receiving a communication from the artist, but is expressing a message they wish to see expressed in the piece.
I did this at the MoMA in 2008. Documented. I did it in their old minimalist room with my shoes and I was siting in the next room with my socks on watching the viewer that caught on do a double take. The guards let me keep the work up all day.
cool now you're an artist
Big flaw right out of the gate (almost), 'painting' is not 'art' because of the materials used. Are books 'literature' because we can stack them?
tbh there is something of an art to pulling off a good and successful prank. Like one that's incredibly clever and not just being an ass to someone, one that makes the person for a moment feel like they're part of some surreal world.
Love. Had to watch it twice to let it all sink in.
The point of the glasses was that they were quick and less 'considered' than (presumably) the pieces around them, a sudden inspiration and yet still garnered interest and serious consideration. Had it been more staged and considered then the point would have been diluted. That's what makes the joke and ultimately makes them far more memorable than the official art in the gallery. No-one would even remember the teddies and blanket piece without it being referenced to the glasses. The museum's quip that here was the new Duchamp was more apt than they perhaps realised although little can match the novelty of Duchamp's joke a century ago.
I think this kind of discussion brings in greater questions of where the intersection of artistic depth and humor lies. I analyze memes from an artistic perspective all the time, they have a symbolic language to them and a regularity and clear intent that often surprises people who may not approach jokes from the perspective of breaking them down into meaningful information. "bottom text" is a punchline highlighting the lack of an apparent punchline, hyperpixelating or deepfrying an image conveys intent to view the subject matter as absurd and unreal in a similar manner to choice of colour in other visual art, perspective can be manipulated to make meta humor of a meme specifically interacting with the viewer through the use of illusion of depth where it's unexpected or dynamic motion.
What a wonderfully specific yet concise exploration of this concept. This high school art teacher thanks you, a thousand times!
art is a mindful meditation. it is innocuous to all life.
Contemporary artists are not artists but bad philosophers. Saved you 9 min.
But was it really Duchamp who invented Fountain ? He did not say it was his idea, but never denied it.
"think about what your trained to expect" can someone chisel that in stone, or should i?
It's a joke that people being take way too serious for way too long.
Oh my god ! This series is amazing ....Thank you!!!!
I'm glad this exists. Thank you ❤️
I'd love to find an episode about Richard Prince and your take on it. Most of us are only scratching the surface by accusing him of stealing others work when in reality he's changing art history's direction dramatically. At least that is my opinion and I'd love to hear yours.
This is a place to start: ua-cam.com/video/6dIQW4DRrp8/v-deo.html
This episode is so freakin’ good.
You just gave me an Idea on how I might have a chance on how to appreciate art.
You make it sound to me that art can be extended beyond the piece of art, towards the space between it and me, and furthermore into my mind, my subconcious universe and everything who I am, what I've learned and combine it with everything that is.
Damn! Now I have to go and visit this bulky museum and see the art of Beuys again. And I really don't like the art of Beuys. It feels so depressing to me.
I saw you give this presentation at Vidcon! It's nice to watch it without an incredibly loud comedy show playing over it. :D
Haha. Yes, it was rather pleasant delivering this in a quiet room, but oh so much less of a challenge. It was tough to trim it down. So much more to say! Thanks for coming to the presentation, and for watching another version of it.
I'm always disappointed in myself when I can find anything to like in a piece of art.
Art is whatever you think it is. Its when an object or piece is injected with human life, emotion and time. With that being said, I like some types of art mich better than others, that including some modern art
I think this wasn't a prank but a mischievoust act...
"The backstory is important" is the Antithesis of Art. This approach toward dealing with the contests of those critical to these artists couldn't be more pedantic if it were a "art bogo sale" button on a curator's lapel! You dont argue with trolls who scoff, " I could do that. " You merely encourage them to GO AND DO IT (elsewhere) or NOT, but refrain from undermining things they do not understand on the premises of another person whom is staking their livelihood upon making the exhibition possible for those who DO appreciate it. See how that works? Double Standards and Antithesis Solved.
Can we please acknowledge that the fountain is probably not made by Duchamps but by the baroness Elsa Von Freytag-Loringhoven?
I've watched a couple post from here but this one made me subscribe
The art of pranking
The first Fountain is a work of art because it had a point and a purpose behind it. All of the copies that were sold benefited of the wallet of the artist cause every museum wanted to be the cool kid in on the joke. This is my issue with Duchamp's Fountain in museums. While I admit I am not a big fan of his work there are pieces I appreciate. I love Nude Descending a Staircase. Étant donnés: 1° la chute d'eau, 2° le gaz d'éclairage . . . (Given: 1. The Waterfall, 2. The Illuminating Gas . . . ) is smart and smart-ass at the same time.The Bride Stripped Bare by Her Bachelors, Even (The Large Glass) is an interesting piece. That said I like the photo of the original Fountain because it captures the moment of creative thinking but even then they knew that the object was unimportant as the idea. That is why the Original Fountain was thrown out. The idea was gone, now it was a memory.
I did think it was funny when PMA painted R.Mutt 1917 on toilets and urinals in the museum though.
Dadaism seems to say... Turn everything into controversy then walk away from it.
I was surprised you didn't touch on the suggestion that Duchamp was not the artist who created Fountain, but originally submitted it on behalf of a female friend (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fountain_(Duchamp)#Origin)
Very thought provoking! I had never thought of myself as part of an institution. As a member of the IMA I will definitely look at things with a fresh eye now.
This video changed my life
change it back fore it's too late.
I find "fine art" revolting in that it rejects or excludes certain genres and styles. Here it speaks about "ennobling" objects, to bring new perspective and meaning - but fine art fails to find those things in ALL works of art. There is never any explanation for that and I think it's worth commenting on.
Baroness Elsa von Freytag- Loringhoven?
www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/art/features/was-marcel-duchamps-fountain-actually-created-by-a-long-forgotten-pioneering-feminist-10491953.html
Yes, she's been left unattributed yet again.
This video is known as "Turning into the skid". The ridiculousness of what conceptual artists (People who are bad at math) insist upon as something profound was spotlighted by the glasses. Instead of admitting that most abstract expressionism is the product of, otherwise, unemployable self-absorbed hacks, The Art Assignment is attempting an obviously palpable "I meant to do that".
Artists like Picasso, Cezanne, Braque, and Dali were trained , practiced, and gifted artists who had already proved their classical bonafides and were looking for something more. (I have often compared Pablo Picasso to Eddy Van Halen in that both are virtuosos ((Vituosi?)) that were introverted in their creation as opposed to extroverted like a musician who enjoys entertaining a crowd with the same songs every night.)
Duchamp too could paint things that look like the things they look like. See "Portrait of the Artist's Father". And his cubist stuff took real talent. But the readymades (Even if he was making a statement) paved the way for the pseudo intellectual tripe that we are bombarded with by decidedly non-artists and pretentious art consumers.
No! The glasses were not a deep, meaningful, editorial on the nature of art. They shined a light on the hollow attempts of people desperate to be special (In this case, the art crowd - Also a great read by Sophy Burnham - but it could be foodies, wine enthusiasts, the caviar wrist lickers, or sports talk radio hosts).
I've always wondered what would happen if art pieces were simply displayed with no reference to the artist. Would anybody have paid whatever the outrageous sum was for "Onement VI" if it didn't have the cachet of Barnett Newman? And don't get me started on Warhol's screen prints.
If a piece genuinely touches someone, that's great. They've been moved or entertained or in some way affected. But nobody was moved by the glasses. And if the people standing around them were by themselves, they wouldn't have given them a second look...or they would have turned them in to lost and found.
I'd love to see more "The Case For" videos. Highlight more different artists, styles, & mediums. (I'd personally love to see a Basquiat one)
I think the glasses prank could be considered art in the sense that it challenges people to question and think differently about the world. It is an invitation to question the point of modern art, and what can or will be considered art. It makes us notice that an unmodified everyday object placed on the floor is considered art only because it is in a museum, and asks us if that is/should be enough to make it art.
And, as a prank, it was intended to entertain, which is a purpose a lot of art serves.
the guys pulling the prank, didn't care if it would entertain others or not, they did it to entertain themself, and prove theyere prejudice, and they were correct.
I LOVE this series SO MUCH!