The Left Wing: Ireland's errors, bench questions and the Antoine Frisch dilemma
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- Опубліковано 11 бер 2024
- Ireland's shock defeat to England at Twickenham is up for discussion on the latest episode of The Left Wing.
Cian Tracey joins Luke Fitzgerald and Will Slattery to break down where things went wrong for Andy Farrell's men.
A passive defence, poor kicking strategy and a questionable use of the bench all contributed to the Ireland defeat.
Italy's surprise win over Scotland, Antoine Frisch's France call up and the Moment of the Week are all up for discussion too.
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I was shocked that they waited so long to bring the bench on. Why didn't any journalist ask as them why they waited so ,long?
me too!
Baird would've been on 10 minutes earlier were it not for O'Mahony's incompetence. Murray and O'Mahony need to be dropped.
I am irish and i did expect this match to be a tough one. England have a huge player pool and great talent, and i felt that up to now they were not using them well. England ran South Africa very close in the world cup and thrashed a good NZ side in the prior world cup semi. England came at us from the first minute and deserved to win, they played at great speed and never let us settle. We need to learn from this defeat, how to manage a team that has huge energy and comes at you at speed. I have no doubt that Scotland will have noted this and will try the same strategy. We made masses of errors but that probably was down to England pressure. This match is done and we need to focus on Scotland and learn the lessons.
im irish and predicted an england win.... dont know how anyone didnt see this coming
Humble pie lads. Lots and lots of humble pie needed.
Still a good chance they will win the six nations with a huge point gap. Just shows how far ahead they were of the chasing pack. I think you can cut them a break. England just had a world-beating performance. Good for them. But can they sustain this? That remains to be seen.
Luke Fitz is eating all of it by the looks of it.
@@realitysosubtle2746 😂😂😂😂😂
😂😂
Scottish Irish Fan. Disrespectful and arrogance last week. Hope these podcasts learnt
I don't think they were disrespectful. They were basing it on recent form and England have been very average in recent times. They were all over the place in their last match.
@@Keenonhang They misjudged England who, compared to other NH teams, have a nasty habit of turning up for the big games.
This is the most vicious dissection of Ireland's failings that I've watched. Harsh but fair. Ireland (& Leinster from where most of the players are drawn) have a real problem in crunch games. They just can't get to the emotional & physical pitch required, & let the other team bully them. Lots of unforced errors under pressure. Unfortunately, it's a character/mentality failure that cannot be fixed.
This was no surprise to the majority of Irish fans or the Irish team, it just shows how out of touch the pundits are. There is very much a history of England getting it up for Ireland and knocking Ireland back to reality, most pundits ignored this elephant in the room. Irish pundits have been a real embarrassment to everyone in the country.
England have no chance against France?? Some people just won't learn. I'm not saying we will definitely win but we certainly have a very good chance and to say otherwise seems ill informed!
exactly.. England at home and with revenge in mind for the last French visit. France not the same team too.. Eng to win.
England not at home.
@@seamusryan2320ah! my bad.
France will be very tough for England . The French are a wounded beast with a point to prove and England may have given too much in beating Ireland. France by 10
Two Bench errors... one was not bringing the change early after the try, the other was not having Ringrose on the bench.. to make sure we are not scrambling with the backs... there is no reason to have a strategy of having Park move to wing and bring on Murray to scrum half.. this should never happen again.. never... only bring on Murray when the game is won, otherwise leave that strategy to the dust bin... come on Ireland.. get a grip..
The time has come for some people to be honest with themselves and perhaps now stand aside….. Porter, O’Mahony, Murray, Henderson and maybe one or two others.
On another note altogether, Luke is looking well fed these days 😂
Agree alternatives needed for POM, Murray, Henderson. But Porter? Really.
Porter lol, you haven’t a clue
@@conor9848 : Yes, Porter. He hasn’t been right since the NZ game in the WC. Low in confidence, giving away far too many penalties, not the threatening attacking force that he once was, slower around the field. A twelve month sabbatical from the international game would do him no harm.
@@Driver2616 he’s miles better than any other loosehead in the country, we won’t have a quality backup until Milne, Boyle and McCarthy step up
Luke has turned into an excellent pundit. He is fair and points out things other pundits miss. He is also not afraid to ruffle a few feathers and criticise the Irish team when it is appropriate. Whilst some of the Irish pundits were a bit ridiculous Luke was much more reserved in his prediction. Like the majority of Irish fans he thought it would be a tight match that we would probably win.
Listening after the last game, the question is whether our attack has been found out or we are simply not as potent when missing Keenan, Hansen and Ringrose. Our pack has not been as dominant as it was last year and v SA in the World Cup.
That's the third time Doris has been outplayed by his opposite no 8 in a big game in the past year (Alldritt, Savea, now Earl). Food for thought
They are all top class 8s , no shame in that
When did Alldritt outplay Doris in the last year? With La Rochelle r France?
@@aaronreid116 Champions Cup final
@purplecrown505 ah yes!..can't be top in every game I suppose 🤷♂️
@@aaronreid116 Becoming a pattern though
Your man just said he doesn't think Scotland will more or less not stand a chance against ireland Err thats what you all said about England still doing it would though yous learnt your leeson after the weekend
First question for France is will they keep 15 players on the field - for the first time this season at home!
Best analysis yet.
Ireland played outstanding against France but we’ve been a bit a hit and miss in the other matches. We obviously underperformed against England and they were very good and really hungry for a big performance and a win. But even though we barely attacked we still very nearly won. Hopefully we can put in a huge performance at the weekend.
How can you be "outstanding" when playing 15 against 14 for more than half the game?
@@robw7676 After the heartbreaking loss against NZ in the World Cup we returned with a great performance and a record breaking win against France in France. A lacklustre performance wouldn't have got us that. In what match have we performed better than that? If against France wasn't a very good performance which one was?
@Keenonhang Conceding 2 tries whilst playing against 14 men with 15 was not "outstanding". That is a wobbly defence. Teams at the top of their game don't let in tries easily. The 17 points Ireland conceded is more than South Africa shipped against England or New Zealand or that either opponent let them score in the RWC semi and final, but France got 14 points out of Ireland with a man down.
Ireland ran away with it in the final quarter, which is nearly always what happens with a first half sending off. France pinned them back to a 7 point lead twice before the hour. Ireland had a man advantage for 50 minutes in total with all cards considered, so I think the final score reflects "job done" rather than an outstanding showing.
If Ireland want to be regarded and judged alongside teams who can get to RWC finals, then none of their performances have been particularly "outstanding" since the pool game against South Africa when their defence was firing, although the Boks would have won with better kicking to be fair.
England said they believed they could beat them, the Irish pundits mocked and said they were trying to convince themselves - but it turned out that England did believe it, with good reason. They spotted the cracks that have been evident for a while, such as the lineout not always working, but Ireland being heavily dependent on it as a platform to score tries.
To be fair nobody saw that england performance before the game, at last borthwick sees sense and lets the in form premiership players play to their strengths, although god knows why he persists with daly and ford, finn smith is criminally underused as well. Ireland are going to have to rethink a little about how they play against big physical defenses.
The excuses begin. Sometimes you are beaten by a team that was better on the day. England stopped Ireland from imposong their game. The question shouldn't be 'Why did Ireland lose?', it should be 'How did England win?'
So if Ireland are behind the game, do they have the bench to come from behind and win?
Wanna thank jamie heaslip and matt williams for their superb pre match assessment and predictions.....should go down in rugby folklore as the worst irish rugby pundits ever....perhaps williams should feck off back to oz asap....what a waste of space they both are
Don't forget how smug Trimble and Joe Molloy were in their preview, Irish pundits should take note for the future
Heaslip is ridiculous, it's like he believes he's still playing in the team when he comments on Leinster or Ireland. He hasn't made the jump from team mate to "somewhat" detached pundit. Great player doesn't mean great commentator.
I thought some of the Englush pundits were worse.
...but he was proven right?
The buzz word now is that we are in the 'entertainment business' do these pundits not generate viewers to each channel? We are not in the hard-core sports world anymore, they are looking at building revenue, growing the sport and generating talking points. If everyone is quiet and respectful, the short attention span public will get bored and move on.
Sorry lads love your honesty but no mitigating factors here, We played away games last year and we won a grand slam so maybe the opposition teams were treated with a bit more respect last year by the Ireland coaching group. And the coaches had seen 20 minutes of England which was a hint of what might come when England played against Scotland... so no excuses and no mitigating factors. You always treat your opponents with Respect. They can always produce a surprise tactically and win and that goes for this Scotland team on Saturday BTW. the golden rule is Never underestimate your opponents.
Agree with kicking, to me it looked like we needed to adjust that strategy. England were making gains from our kicks all game. When we are so good at building pressure through ball in hand multi phase play why did we not change tactics and play to our strengths not to theirs.
Interesting timing for and English coach of an Irish team to have an off day 😂
Stop talking over each other guys, its ok in mid conversation but bad TV.
Aki and Mccloskey won't be at next RWC. Get Frisch capped for Ire
If NATO and US don’t get a grip there won’t be any World Cup or anything else for that matter!!!
He's not good enough
@@DM-rp9ikAh he is good enough in fairness
Aki and McCloskey are both 12s. Frisch is a 13 and we don’t have many of them either. In fact it is hard to see who is the backup like for like replacement for Ringrose. Henshaw is a hybrid 12/13 and also possibly not around in 2027.
@@patrickmccutcheon9361 Hehshaw is also injury prone
Amazingly it was only a 1 pt win with last kick.
Saturday, is a day of a lack of leadership. Tightening things and bringing structure when we got the lead in the second half would be the answer. England had a superb emotional performance and most of what they did deserved to be ahead to that point but we had then weathered storm . Pom really has to go. There is a need to get a pack leader. Ryan missed both games. I would give him the confidence of captaincy. Let beirne and baird and battle with Mccarthy for 2nd row and also the 6 slot...starting currently with beirne at 6
Does Cian Tracey want to bring Keith Earls out of retirement and start him on the wing as well, maybe start Healy ahead of Porter? Boring bloke wanting to get rid of the young players out of the 23. Can properly see the Munster fan in him the enjoyment he got out of calling Mccarthy anonymous
RR: 29, Henshaw: 30, Aki: 33, ChuChu Stu: 31.... And Andeh is not developing centres? Is he actually taking the piss?
We have to learn how to win when sides throw the big emotional one off game at us. This game reminded me of Ireland vs New Zealand in 2013. New Zealand hung in and won.
WHY did Farrell not cap Frisch?...
Murray and PoM are over the hill. They've been great servants.
By the way lads, the England boys won the U20s championship last night, smashed the much vaunted French
I don't get pom. I like.him too and I know he wears heart on sleeve and excellent jumper but listen to analysis of Murray lowe etc versus pom
Results were fixed...italy beating Scotland and Ireland v England....zero logic
Leadership on field suspect. Crowley needs to impose himself from 10 a bit more.
Ireland were expected to beat the All Blacks in the RWC? Lol not to any non Irish rugby fan.
You don't seem to understand how betting and being favorites works.
@@andrewmartinfarrell8167Rugby people never expected that. It was always a 50:50 game, and the All Blacks team that Ireland beat in NZ was very different in terms of playing personnel to the one that they faced in the RWC, not to mention the changes in the coaching setup.
The betting agencies in Australia and NZ had that game as dead even too.
@AK-wc9rl lol as excepted you don't understand what's going on. You think hockey fans bet on rugby? This is a bad conversation if you don't understand the concept of laying down money. "Rugby people" would have had France to beat Italy. Theydidn't. Does that make real rugby people clueless?
@@andrewmartinfarrell8167 Pundits are swayed by emotion ffs, and even so the odds were very close. Towards the end of the betting week in NZ and Australia, the ABs were favoured at the betting agencies as most of the bets were placed on them by over emotional punters.
Experts on the other hand, from outside of Ireland at least, were far from convinced that Ireland were the favourites. It was a game that most couldn't pick, and even a few Irish fans that I engaged with were nervous about this game.
@@AK-wc9rl When you say all "rugby people", you mean southern-hemisphere people, right?
'We are the better team, which Ireland are clearly' lol.
Henderson was brutal ..
That's your take? Blame a guy on for what, 20 mins?
@@Fredders88 He consistently underperforms in big games. Anonymous against the All Blacks
Ireland was asleep, heads must roll
O'Mahony and Murray
I said beforehand, Ireland had something to lose, England were like cornered rats, dismissed by their own media, pundits and supporters, they had nothing to lose and went for it, pressure makes a difference.
True. It’s the difference between motivated to win, and desperate not to lose. Many of this England squad needed to make an impression to stay relevant. None of the Irish squad really feared for their places.
@@seamusryan2320 At the same time, Ireland made tactical errors midgame, think they adjusted OK with JGP on the wing, but after 50 mins we should have used our replacements, we completely lost impact in one at a time, Baird didn't get on till 70th min. So combined failure in player performance and coaching decisions.
no check check on Furlong clean out...and foot in touch...?
Bernard jackman has stated on the rugby pod that he has seen multiple angles of the genge clear out and has witnessed no evidence of any head contact. The same pictures would have been available to the tmo and he didn't see anything untowards. And Ireland got the ball back after the foot in touch!
Lol they have mouth guards that sense impact now don't they? Didn't see him go off for an HIA clutching at straws, you got done on the day simple.
We were beaten fair and square by a better team on the day. Please don't whinge.
@simonjeffs75 that running start and no wrap clear out was banned after 2009 it wasn't a head contact issue
Home team gets away with things sometimes. Slade played the ball off his feet when he threw an offload but that's just how it goes sometimes
england seems to be the one team that has the psychological edge on ireland. lets not forget that in 6N 2023 it was 10-9 at 50 mins. in 6N 2022 it was 15-15 at 60 mins. and on both occasions england were at a low ebb in the tournament and lost a man to a red card.
The psychology of this fixture has changed 25 years ago, that used to be Ireland, throwing the kitchen sink at England and scraping to get a 1 point win at home. Now it's England
@@DM-rp9ikOver the last 25 years it is 17 wins to England and 15 to Ireland with many close games.
The psychology of this fixture is that it is a big game, and the odds on the 2025 fixture now are about 50/50 regardless of form at the moment.
It is always a winnable game for both teams, but rarely an easy one. There are few big standout score lines in those 25 years either way - only Ireland's 43-13 win at Croke Park in 2007 and the 57-15 hammering they got at Twickenham in 2019 really stand out.
@robw7676 In the Six nations, it's 14 wins for Ireland and 11 for England. For the last 4 years, it has changed. England now needs the mother and father of all performance to beat Ireland at home by a point. In 2001, that was Ireland.
Warm-up games are weak sauce with rotation or poor prep.
@DM-rp9ik
No change I can feel.
Ireland won 4 on the trot 2004-2007. England were defending a Grand Slam in 2004 having just won the world cup, and went to the 2007 RWC final. 2004-2007 Ireland beat a more successful England team in 4 consecutive 6N games, this Ireland team's win streak ended on 3 games if you don't want to count warm-ups, so Ireland were arguably BETTER against England 20 years ago than they are now.
All that has really changed is that a lot of Irish people now have a much more highly inflated opinion of this Ireland team than they did of that Ireland team because they are psychologically stronger when it comes to playing the leading Southern Hemisphere sides now they play them more often. Their performance VS England hasn't changed for the better since 2004-2007.
The Welsh have 1 more Grand Slam and 2 more RWC semis under their belt in the last 20 years than Ireland do when it actually comes down to it - so a Welsh team playing well is arguably more of a threat than Ireland when it matters. Wales have dipped and started to rebuild, but that will happen to Ireland eventually too - maybe the dip is starting now, who knows? Scotland are so wildly inconsistent that we probably can't read too much into the result this weekend either way, but the South Africa tour will show whether last weekend was more about England starting to click or Ireland starting to dip.
Last weekend England left 10 points on the tee and were ahead on the stats for scrums, lineouts, breaks, metres, collisions, tackle %, territory and possession - so the 1 point scoreline flatters Ireland whatever psychobabble you apply to cope with the reality of not getting the back to back slam many pundits were telling us was in the bag, on top of missing out in the 7th Irish attempt at getting past a RWC QF.
No use pretending that it isn't frustrating or that you aren't quietly worried Ireland are about to go right off the boil - England supporters have been there and know all about those feelings.
@robw7676 It has changed England now see Ireland as a scalp to save their season even if Ireland are still going to win the championship. 25 years ago it was the reverse
Claims of us having the best coaching tickets in the world are laughable when the lineout and scrum have both been failing for near on a year. POC and Fogarty clearly passed it and need addressing sooner rather than later.
On JGP staying at 9... move murry to 10, Jack to FB, and Keenan to the wing.
Cian is a decent pundit but this "we irish" stuff is brutal. Cut it out. Not everyone thinks the same way
😂
Luke Fitzgerald 😂😂😂😂
He’s a bottler when it comes to using the bench let’s be honest. Been a great coach for us but that is one area he has let us down.
Farrell gets a 5 for waiting to bring on the bench sooner
Hey ireland team and fans it was easy to swallow all the press adoration and falsehoods of irelands rugby standing. Englishmen have left a very unpalatable pungent taste in your big gobs,suck it up,the false belief has vanished and Scotland taste blood and like England easy pickings.The vultures are circling over Dublin saturday next!
Big mistake at world cup was leaving sexton on for sentimental reasons, he should have been subbed earlier
France are awful lads. England to win that.
Gonna be some tough selections for the Lions for sure.
St Paddy was English, sort of adds an extra twist
Lads, slow down the predictions ffs 😂