My DM once made the mistake of letting us know a white dragon was scheduled to show up in a village in three days. We spent all our time and gold laying down Symbols and Glyphs of Warding under a cart full of meat to be offered to it. We never rolled initiative and that village ended up covered top to bottom in dragon guts and pork.
I find that the attack option of plane shift is actually very nice, if situational. By level 13, there are plenty of enemies you can fight that can’t be killed conventionally, or come back angrier each time. Sometimes they’ll have allies that will resurrect them, sometimes they’ll have Contingency cast on themselves in the event that they run low on health, sometimes they might have death effects that cause AOE damage and killing them would also kill your whole party. Whatever the reason, by high level death isn’t always the solution. For those cases, Plane Shift can sometimes be an answer.
@@archmagemc3561 Carceri is my preferred choice. Using the Prison Plane rule in the DMG, the only way out through a spell is the Wish spell, so even creatures like Rakshasas with innate plane shift can’t escape. That being said, good luck finding a tuning fork for Carceri.
@@mikebieser4175 You build one. It's not a magic item, so even with the asinine rules for item creation, you can manufacture one, if you have the Arcana skill.
@@richardwhaler8717 BUILD, not buy. Your character has the arcana skill, knows how to "attune" material to a plane. Just like the one with the proficiency in smith tools knows how to forge a sword.
25:51 Whirlwind doesn't deal damage to targets it's already restrained. The damage is only for when a creature or the whirlwind enters the other's space. Does this change your rating?
Symbol is amazing for ambushes. Put a Symbol down, hide, and wait until your enemy walks into the trap and triggers a concentration-free, absolutely brutal mass debuff such as Stun or Insanity for a minute. Granted, casting Symbol ahead of time requires a good amount of planning, but if an enemy manages to triggered it, its effect can be even more dramatic than a level 9 spell. Gold is also not really an issue at these levels. A Druid is not a Wizard - they don't have pricey spells to transcribe into a spell book. The only equipment a Druid really needs to buy is 45gp Studded Leather. So blowing all your gold (probably countable in the thousands at this level) on spell like Heroes' Feast and Symbol is all very reasonable. Frankly, I would consider it Orange - circumstantial, but frankly amazing when it can be applied.
Regenerate with Life Domain Cleric dip is nice. That's +9 HP per round, so 10hp per round. i'd still rather cast aura of vitality, though. Unless I need concentration for something else. Or bonus actions. eg, a 1 level dip into life cleric with spore druid, regenerate is better, since it doesn't take up your bonus action or concentration. So, circumstantial, really.
Yeah, this spell works a lot better on a life domain Cleric. An interesting side effect of this spell is that once you cast it on a front liner, they probably won't die or lose turns from taking damage in a fight for the 1 hour duration. Not the best spell but it could work fine with this dip and in the right situation
@@edgaraquino3528 totally. For me, I run a spore druid, so having my concentration freed up for something else, and my bonus action devoted to commanding skeletons and zombies makes using regeneration perfect. I don't have to spend half my spell slots on healing, and can contribute a lot to combat.
Step 1- Wizard fabricates bleachers Step 2- Druid with Life cleric dip cast regenerate on the Wizard in same round. Step 3- Druid on Round 2 or other caster cast Polymorph on Wizard to make giant Ape. Step 4- Watch the Ape have a Massacre. If your DM will let you magic stone the thrown rock attacks for more fun. (Don't expect it though)
I still think this spell is worth even for pure druid without multiclass. The best time to cast this spell is after the first encounter in dungeon. You heal your front-liner to full with this spell and he will be healed for the rest of that 1 hour. If he is knocked down to 0 HPs, he gets back every turn, if you wait a bit between fights (rooms), he gets to full HPs again. So this spell can mean 3-4 full heals, several times waking up unconscious character during combat and all that with no action cost! It seems like a worth 7th level spell slot!
Interestingly, a big draw of Regenerate is that it's a 7th level spell. If an NPC is missing an arm, an eye, or another body part, they won't have an easy time getting it back - meaning that you can ask for a pretty big favour in return for making their peg leg obsolete. Very, very situational, but fun when it comes up.
I mean, as a Druid, you have access to your whole spell list. If the situation comes, you can probably afford to take a long rest, prepare the spell and cast it.
This is a good point. I am probably just trying to justify the 1 time I took this as my Bard's 7th level spell, but also I think there are situations where the extreme, concentration free healing over 1 hour could be super useful- say your party is the vanguard of a force storming an enemy castle, where the PCs need to engage in several time-sensitive battles in rapid succession, with only 3-5 minutes of running between engagements. The auto 1 hp revive at the start of the turn is also very action economy efficient if set up before a battle, although bouncing back up at 1 hp also greatly increases the odds of an opponent deciding to target the regenerating character with a full multi attack routine and just killing them outright.
@@geckothegreene There are for sure really niche situations where it is the best available option for healing. And, I mean, if most characters had this spell's functionality available as a 13th level feature, I'm thinking it wouldn't be a bad one. But optimal play aside, with this spell you can get a lot of goodwill out of a pirate king with an eye patch, a hook for a hand, and a peg leg. Yarrrgh.
5:30 Against a single target yes but Firestorm has a massive area of effect. If you're fighting many enemies or participate in say a battle. it's way stronger than those other spells you mentioned.
9:40 Illusions in dnd are of many kind. Some may just alter the mind of a target, or create an illusion that people can go through, but there are solid illusions too, like Mirage Arcane, Shadowblade, Illusionary Dragon and there migh be a couple more
I believe by RAW with Whirlwind, a creature trapped in it only takes the damage initially, because at that point, they're no longer entering it; they move with the Whirlwind from then on.
I used to think that the damage of symbol was bad. Then I realized it happened every round for 10 minutes. Each instance of damage occurs if a creature enters the area, or ends its turn in the area. It certainly made the mummy lord boss more interesting for my players. >:)
The only effect that lasts 10 minutes is sleep which ends if the target takes damage, so 1000d10 is not going to happen. Even the 100d10 assume that the target fails 11 saves in a row
@@MightyMagnetmonster that is only mostly correct. The only effect that lasts 10min from a single saving throw lasts for 10 mintutes, but evem that effect is a little more powerful than you are giving credit. The spell comes in multiple parts, the description on how to cast and trigger the spell, the general effect of the spell which reads as follows in paragraph 5. "... Once Triggered, the glyph glows, filling a 60ft radius sphere for 10 minutes, afterwhich the spell ends. Each creature in the sphere when the glyph activates is targeted by its effect, as is a creature that enters the sphere for the first time on a turn or ends its turn there." That last segment is especially important. Because yeah if you are hit by the initial burst of damage, you can escape any subsequent damage by simply leaving the area... i mean, unless something is stopping your movement, like Stone to Mud, or Plant Growth as simple druid options. After that segment it goes into the seperate effects, all of which are effected by the previous section we just covered. And none of the options stipulate that you are immune or ignored from being effected on subsequent rounds so long as you are in the area of effect. Thus the sleep you mention is technically sleep for 10min if they failed the initial save plus a number of rounds depending on when they failed thier second save. Because i highly doubt a character can make 999 successful saves in a row. It only takes one fail to fall asleep afterall, however I would be surprised if a character started to sleep walk out of the area. But I suppose not entirely out of the question. (Edited for grammer and typos)
@@MightyMagnetmonster The effect lasts 10 minutes, it's clearly written in the spell description - If you go in and out multiple rounds, you end up taking the damage.
I think Chris summarized it well, the spell list is small. The best spells here are not necessarily druid exclusive, and with certain interpretations I think mirage arcane and plane shift are up there.
I’ve used Fire Storm VERY effectively in combat, I would say it’s at least orange if not purple. It’s especially impressive/effective when you get to cast it against a group of smaller creatures such as an enemies summoned creatures with their own conjure animals. Much better than dispelling each one or wasting an action per creature when you can use an action to wipe most of them all out at once.
I agree. I think Tree was too way hard on this spell especially in his comparison with Cone of Cold. Yes, the damage should be higher but the comparison wasn't fair since he didn't bring up the negatives of Cone of Cold in comparison to Fire Storm which lacks those negatives. I am referring to (1) CoC is obviously a cone and cones suck compared to circles/squares (since on a grid a circle just becomes a square) but circles suck compared to fire storms 10 squares. Fire Storm has amazing flexibility as an aoe. How many other aoe spells have this flexibility/ability to manipulate the aoe? (2) It's a Dex save while Cone of Cold is a Con save. You can counter that its fire and more likely to be resisted and that's a reasonable critique as is the low comparative damage. But that hardly should qualify this as a red. I'd have put it at purple.
Yes, but at 7th level it needs to be 8d10 min to be worthwhile; or have rider. I think it is red because while situational, Druids have better options for those situations.
@@studynot757 But if blasting is what you're into, there are other ways to exclude your allies from AoE that don't involve you sacrificing 4 spell slots over a fireball for only slightly higher damage. It's too big of a penalty to justify with just the ability to shape the spell when straight damage is already something that shouldn't be your priority as a caster. If you're going to be doing straight damage, it needs to be high, and this just isn't.
@@ihave2cows If full blasting is all I’m concerned about then I’m not playing a Druid. We’re here discussing the merits of Druid spells at their respective levels. I’m saying that Treantmonk gave some short shrift to Fire Storm because of its flexibility. Yes overall Fireball is more volume of fire and somewhat close in damage, but 9 out of 10 times you’re fireballing you’re not using all 33,510 ft3 of fire, you’re using… like 4 or 5 square of it. Fire Storm lets you more effectively target disjointed groups of enemies and shape it around friends, etc. I’m not saying it’s Blue or Green even but purple at least.
Mirage arcane can be so powerful depending on how your DM rules it. It's a spell you should always talk about with your DM before using it, because it will immediately raise a bunch of questions and slow down gameplay if you haven't already figured out how you're playing it.
@@samuelbroad11 Well depending on how your DM rules it you can make terrain incredibly hostile. Also, it's crazy good if you're a divination wizard, as you have the ability to change the illusion after casting it. With Mirage Arcane, that's kind of over powered.
@@tomgymer7719 chur bro, don't you mean illusion wizard. malleable illusions? I like the idea of turning an entire area into the labyrinth from The Labyrinth.
So if an NPC casts this in a jungle or heavily forested area, would PCs just continually bump into trees, rocks, and essentially not be able to navigate through the woodland (if it looked like a meadow or rolling hills)? Without magical aid, this would seemingly make it nearly impossible or painstaking and probably deadly to move through that illusionary terrain. It doesn't conceal anyone, and it doesn't reveal anyone either, right? So in the example above, critters would "materialize" from thin air if they popped out from behind a tree or from a bush that had been made to look grassy plains? It does say range is "sight", or what you can see, so if you tried to use this in a dense forest, it might only affect your immediate vicinity and nothing beyond the clump of trees and shrubs surrounding you... Super confusing spell.
Other thing about Regenerate is that the target regains HP at the start of its turn, so it automatically gets up if knocked down every round. So you heal a near-dead ally to full in downtime, and they just get back up every time they’re knocked down. A lot of beasties simply can’t kill them (need at least 3 attacks to have a chance). Doesn’t make it GOOD, but it’s certainly relevant,
Exactly! The best time to cast this spell is after the first encounter in dungeon. You heal your front-liner to full with this spell and he will be healed for the rest of that 1 hour. If he is knocked down to 0 HPs, he gets back every turn, if you wait a bit between fights (rooms), he gets to full HPs again. So this spell can mean 3-4 full heals, several times waking up unconscious character and all that with no action cost! It seems like a worth 7th level spell slot!
Agreed, Regenerate is seriously underestimated. It makes you virtually unkillable for the duration of a non-concentration spell. Barring enough damage to kill you instantly, or 4 attacks in a round (1 to drop you and 3 to burn through death saves), you get back up at the start of the next round and continue fighting.
@@rickfairfax9631 One correction: attacking incapacitated target from 5 ft has advantage and it is auto- crit, so it means minus 2 death saves with each hit. But it still means 3 attacks are needed, which is still plenty. If you consider average dmg of enemy 25 and 2 attacks “wasted” each turn on character with regeneration, with 20 rounds of combat during this one hour, we are talking about 1000 HPs of healing from 1 spell + healing out of combat, so easily 1500 HPs from 1 spell! This is not red at all in my opinion!
Loving the series so far! Can you make a Stars druid build please? I want to play one that defaults to the archer starry form, from level 2-9. Obviously, full versatility at level 10+ being able to change your constellation. Thanks!
I think a stars druid wants to look at concentration spells that dont require further actions, with the BA always being used and free castings of guiding bolt
while I agree that melee attack and then save is a very big red flag for a spell, Charisma saves are surprisingly poor on a lot of enemies. ALso I must diasgree with the red * rating on Regenerate. Yes this spell is poor for healing, but it can be a great story/utility cast on an NPC, where severd limps are far more likely than on an NPC. and since a Druid can swap their spells, they can prepapre the spell when they encounter someone who needs regeneration on their adventures, of they have the time to stay there and heal them. This would normaly be overly circumstential, but I dont think 2overly cicumstentila" is red on a prep caster, comapred to a "known" caster.
Hi treantmonk! Have u ever considered making a build based off different table expectations. For example a table where a player can expect 1 combat encounter maybe 2 per adventuring day with short rest after every encounter. At least in my experiences some tables I've been at are like this and in those sernarios I'm interested on what kind of tactics or builds would thrive there
Firestorm can be useful for terrorist or guerilla activity. I'm getting dark here. Regenerate could be used for a horrifying revenge; cut off all of a creature's limbs, then put the arms where the legs were and the legs where the arms were. As a piece de resistance, face them backwards. Also, the Sword of Sharpness can lop off a limb, if you roll a 20 and then another 20. So yeah, pretty rare.
Symbol feels very campaign dependent. I could see it being useful if you know a large dangerous monster plans on attacking a village, then you could set it up beforehand.
I think if you've got someone with a silver enough tongue or a decent-sized distraction Symbol can be used as a pretty elaborate trap for a big enemy if you're trying to lure it out, though I do see it not being very frequent. Maybe a party of players that like coming up with ridiculous elaborate traps could make use of it :/
Missed the points that if you plane shift an enemy, you might be able to send them to a plane where the natives will attack on sight: sending a fiend or undead to mount celestia, for example. Not universal, but situationally very cool. If using offensively you will want to make sure your attack roll has advantage, at the very least, which shouldn't be too hard to set up with allies and pets in play.
If you make a habit of this, the inhabitants of the destination plane may come looking for whoever it is that keeps annoying them with enemies in their home.
@@bleddynwolf8463 it doesn't sound ridiculous to me from a world building scenario. Alternatively sending powerful enemies repeatedly to a sacred place could lead to dire circumstances.
@@elliotbryant3459 well, using a different example then OP, sending almost anything other than Demons to the Abyss, and send them to the beastlands to be hunted by any number of great beast you know, have the cleric/paladin ask their god if they can send enemies to be chopped up in their realm. don't disagree that sending pit fiends to mount celestia unannounced is a bad idea, but you have other options.
I also want to point out that RAW it seems like a regenerate spell doesn't truly fix non-severing 'lingering injuries'. For example, a punctured eyeball. Rime seems to imply that the spell was *intended* to be able to do this, so RaI, but i'd say its interesting nonetheless as a very obvious oversight.
Regeneration it's actually quite good for it's main purpose, regenerate body parts. Odd you said it never comes in play, probably not for everyday preparation but for story reasons i find it relativily common. It's in the same category as Resurrection, prepare when needed.
I know will almost never come into play, but at level 20 we don’t need material components that lack cost, so plain shift might get more utility, if the DM previously required you to find a fork for each plain.
Imagine regeneration at a disposal of torturer... And yeah, RAW reverse gravity affects flying creatures. Because there's written "if creature can't grab anchor it fall up" and there's nothing about flying creatures avoid this effect - they raw will fall upwards even with hover xd
OK, obviously some controversy on the rating for Regenerate, and I haven’t personally played a Druid at this level. But I always assumed this was primarily a self-buff for a Moon Druid: both increases durability of your Wildshape in combat, but more importantly ensures you are healing up between combats, at least for an hour.
Ugh I think I agree with you Chris in almost all the rankings, but I just can't wrap my head around you giving regen a red ranking. I means it not a great spell but, it has a lot of value! If you and your team need to hurry up and rush trough a castle or dungeon or are cornered and expect a lot of fighting regen is a great spell. You can give your fighter for example discount 'immortality' for 1 hour, no more saving trowns and save the action economy rising him up, and a lot of fighting in short time? he will always be full hp. In the right situation a player member would be (no meta) almost unkillable for one whole hour, only afraid of insta-kill things or the DM now always targeting him when he is down (which some dms do others not). The pcs now can face or fight in a way they probably couldn't afford before, regen opens them this option. I really think it deserved at least the 'situational' orange, to me its purple.
I mean... if i was the DM i would certainly target him (with an intelligent opponent) when he is down if i had some way of knowing that he just gets back up again... 3 examples of the top of my head; saw the previous fight, had a mook flee and tell me, it happened already in combat
Sure, Reverse Gravity shouldn't affect flying creatures as much..but it can be devastating to non flying creatures..non-flying creatures that make their saves are restrained and those that don't are suspended in the air either oscillating 100 ft. up or have taken damage and are prone and can't do anything while you finish off the ones that can't move on the ground...I agree that there's a time and a place for it, but that applies to a lot of other spells with better ratings. It's an encounter ending spell ...or screws it up pretty bad if it doesn't end it..
Mirage Arcane to turn the terrain into lava flows with lakes and rivers of molten lava flowing and erupting? Could certainly cause a lot of death to at least lower level creatures, and an inconvenience even to higher level things.
I disagree about fire storm, maybe the sculptability is too neiche for purple, but id put it in purple or orange. Druids wont have high initiative so your allies often engage ahead of you, there can be dynamic with innocents/civilians, and aoe spells, especially for druids, are best for mobs not the "appropriate" cr Edit: it also helps to counteract mobs knowing to spread out to avoid aoe damage
I don't think Chris is adequately considering the impact of regenerating up from 0 to 1 hit points AUTOMATICALLY and without concentration. The spell makes the target basically un-killable unless they fail three death saves before their next turn. The druid could be going tow to toe with a Balor who would have virtually no way of killing the druid for a full hour. They just don't have enough attacks to use up all of the druid's death saves before its the druid's turn again. I'm not saying that this makes a blue spell but that should easily bump it to a purple or even green spell.
The balor has a damaging aura at the start of it's turn so it can kill you. Also any attack within 5ft. of you while you are downed is considered a critical hit (2 failed death saves)
If you change the regeneration amount the spell instantly becomes a whole lot better. Regeneration 10 would make the spell actually pack enough oomph to make it a superior spell to Heal and worth the higher-level spell slot. As it currently stands its more of a plot spell or a spell to make the druid some big money.
Regeneration earns a Orange. Considering utility, the sphere of annihilation and even Fey claiming a finger for a favor, I can’t support Regeneration as anything less then a Orange spell. And there are to many ways the a creature can loose parts as part of the story based “how do you want to do this” culture. And a revivify is not going to restore that wing. Short of resurrection, there is no way to get limbs back. Do you prepare it on GPs ? Nope as with most spells of this type you take it when you need it, but if you know you need it you get it. (This counts as engagement too)
I don't know if it's just this video, or this is just the video where I noticed it, but in the intro, the Blue title card is misspelled as "Blue: Fatasic Spell". Yeah, I'm that guy. :(
One thing I’m wondering is for fire storm if a creature is big enough to be in more than one of the cubes would they only take the damage once or would they take the damage for each cube they are in? If it’s the later then you could deal quite a bit of damage at once to pretty big targets.
If you read the spell carefully, you'll notice it mentions "the area of the storm consists of up to ten 10-foot cubes" and "each creature in the area". Either you are in the area or you are not, so just one instance of damage.
nothing says god mode like casting reverse gravity on a few purple worms and making them as helpless as floating cows. hey, Treant! can you boogey while hung up in the sky to scooch out of the area of effect?
Aaaaah. Plane Shift. Also called "Enjoy your stay in Carceri". What's the catch? You can't escape Carceri without getting stronger (smarter, shrewder, or whatever happened to you) of who sent you there. Even if you can planeshift.
Ranking Fire Storm Red??? I don't think you realized the sheer volume it covers! That spell is "I burn the entire town in 6 seconds." That spell is "Every one of the BBEG's forty-five minions takes 20 fire damage." Surely worth at least Orange ranking.
How would you feel about mirage arcane creating vehicles or something that can harm players? Can I create a weapon and use it on an NPC? What about a stationary weapon, similar to a cannon or ballista? Can it fire illusory ammo? Can it fire real ammo I already own?
I am not a DM™, but if I were, I would say this spell can add/remove generally fixed terrain features and buildings, including large rocks that something smaller than Huge couldn't move. So, no vehicles, no weapons. Some exaples of creative ways around *that* would be springy tree branches, swinging gates, and quicksand. I can see some DMs saying the spell can only create a static image-but then anybody could just notice the trees don't sway in the breeze and water doesn't flow. There's a league or two of room for interpretation with Mirage Arcane.
Some food for thought comparison: take a look at the higher level upcasting of Air Bridge. The caster can make the bridge exist only for those creatures the caster chooses. Perhaps some insight could be drawn from this regarding Mirage Arcane.
Reverse gravity is powerful. The creatures can't move for one minute. You can cast this then just use range weapons to pick them off. Flying creatures can't fly in it either. Is says if they reach the top they just slowly oscillate until the spell ends.
Flying creatures would still be able to fly, gravity has been reversed not reversed & amplified. They would fall initially obviously but would just need to reverse their orientation on their next turn. The oscillation is if they hit the edge of the effect without striking anything. There would be nowhere further to fall and no stable surfaces for a walking creature to move along, whereas a flying creature doesn't require the same support for their movement.
@@elliotbryant3459 if you want to apply logic to magic then yes that would be true but the way the spell is written it would work the same regardless of a fly speed.
@@MageLeaderInc nothing says they loose access to movement. If you hit a wall you can walk upside down and walk out of the area and then fall back to the normal ground early. Also you are assuming the people up there also have no ranged weapons (not a bad assumption for monsters and some PCs but yeah... they may actually ENJOY being 100 feet away from you)
@@LeumGaming I didn't make any of those assumptions I just didn't list every possible outcome. Yes if they hit something then they can move but the way I interpret it is if a creature makes it all the way to the top then they are stuck there for the duration. As for the loosing access to movement it literally says "If an object or creature reaches the top of the area without striking anything, it remains there, oscillating slightly, for the duration." That tells me until the spell ends they are stuck there oscillating slightly, they can still take actions but the only movement is the natural oscillating motion.
@@MageLeaderInc Can you name another spell that reduces/removes movement and doesn't explicitly say it (or a condition that has also explicitly says it -ie restrained ). Perhaps there is precedent, but I feel like they are usually VERY clear about this (hence why fly should work)
I have to disagree again on your interpretation (I'd even call it a house rule, since it contradicts so many ways the spell is clearly stated to work) about Mirage Arcane not affecting things without senses. Does your cart (or clothes) get caught on the rocks in the gully that's been made into a wide road? If someone dies or is knocked out, do they suddenly fall through the illusory hill? What happens if they wake up from unconsciousness while inside something? What about the cart you're pulling up the hill, or across the lake-turned-field? So much of the spell is invalidated, and SO much more is contradictory if you consider that physical forces from the spell only get applied to conscious creatures. The designers have been clear that the spell is supposed to be extremely powerful and, afaik, have only confirmed strengths of the spell, not drawbacks. I also disagree that concealing creatures means not blocking line of sight with objects---how could you ever know the lines of sight of every creature in the area? I would say that phrase is intended to prevent it being used as near-permanent mass greater invisibility, especially because that'd presumably come with intangibility. All that said, as a DM I might house-rule this to be 9th level, or simply ban it, since it invalidates too many types of challenges. I believe the spell as written and intended is demigod-level reality-control, and at least shouldn't be wish-castable. Also worth mentioning that an illusionist with it can totally change the environment as an action, repeatedly, whenever they like. That's just bonkers.
Yeah, I'd say the bit about concealing creatures means you can't make the creatures just disappear as a *direct* effect of the spell, but that the creatures can conceal *themselves* in features of the illusory terrain the spell creates. That could have been phrased more clearly. It sure seems like you could use this to make a boulder blocking a narrow passage disappear, or create a bridge or ramp to just walk over a hazard. Also, this spell is clearly begging to require concentration, but doesn't, because reasons. ;-)
I don't understand the scaling on damaging spells. HP scales up by one die size every level, but spells don't scale up nearly that much. If a 1st level aoe spell is doing somewhere in the range of 1d10 damage, then an equivalent 7th level spell should do 13d10 since you'll be level 13 by the time you can use it. Why didn't they just have spell damage on all of your spells scale based on caster level the way 3.5e did? There was nothing wrong with that system, and damage dealing spells were hardly the reason why casters were so powerful in that edition.
Maybe because spellcasting is so versatile and powerful, even without great damage, that making it good at damage too would negate the reason to play anything else. Sometimes, you don't get to be the very best at every single things, all at once.
@@ChristnThms That's more an issue with some of the PHB martial options and especially levels 11+ than with the game itself. For the most commonly played level range, levels 2-9, martials and casters are relatively balanced and have pros and cons compared to each other. Notably, that's the level range where blasting actually is effective. It's higher levels where damaging spells fall off to a major degree. Those are also the levels where some of the spells become, frankly, absurd. I would rather they nerf overpowered spells and buff high level features for under-performing classes rather than to have them quietly make an entire playstyle irrelevant.
@@stranger6822 what would make you think I'm not calm? Did I stutter? Did my hands shake while typing? Or did you just jump to a completely irrational conclusion, because you don't have anything else?
There are magic items and monsters with the ability to chop off your head. If you can somehow survive the attack (perhaps because you have two heads) then you can use regenerate to stick the head back on your neck. So technically, it does have use even in the absence of lingering injuries.
@@latyper7450 as far as items go there's also the sword of sharpness [granted it still requires rolling two 20's]. Also the clone spell requires a cubic inch of flesh from the creature.
Plane shift can't be used as a straight up teleport. The first line says you have to go to a different plane. So you would have to cast it twice to use it as a teleport.
I agree to a point. But seriously, how often do you get sent up against many lower CR targets? Most DMs (imo) find it easier to give you one single harder enemy than to give you many lower enemies. But yes - i think it is situational (i mentioned it to someone else here, but if you know you have a large cinematic battle coming up where your party is going to take out the enemy leader and the mooks will fight the standard soldiers... great spell because now you get 100s of extra bow shots at the BBEG and some of those will be 20s)
My DM once made the mistake of letting us know a white dragon was scheduled to show up in a village in three days. We spent all our time and gold laying down Symbols and Glyphs of Warding under a cart full of meat to be offered to it. We never rolled initiative and that village ended up covered top to bottom in dragon guts and pork.
Lol, but did the dragon's hoard just replace the material components?
The greatest level 7 spell is, of course, conjure animals! :D
Of course
Ya this series isn't really convincing that the druid spell list is that great negating summoning
@@theeye8276 yes, kinda. It’s situational but the full spell list is yours and has a bunch of consistent options that never feel bad if you cast.
@@ryansalmon6507 ya prepared spell casting us way more user friendly. Known casting is a stress sandwich
9/10 really lonely druids agree!
I find that the attack option of plane shift is actually very nice, if situational. By level 13, there are plenty of enemies you can fight that can’t be killed conventionally, or come back angrier each time. Sometimes they’ll have allies that will resurrect them, sometimes they’ll have Contingency cast on themselves in the event that they run low on health, sometimes they might have death effects that cause AOE damage and killing them would also kill your whole party.
Whatever the reason, by high level death isn’t always the solution. For those cases, Plane Shift can sometimes be an answer.
Plane shift to the elemental plane of fire. There is fire there that can burn even the fire immune.
@@archmagemc3561 Carceri is my preferred choice. Using the Prison Plane rule in the DMG, the only way out through a spell is the Wish spell, so even creatures like Rakshasas with innate plane shift can’t escape.
That being said, good luck finding a tuning fork for Carceri.
@@mikebieser4175 You build one.
It's not a magic item, so even with the asinine rules for item creation, you can manufacture one, if you have the Arcana skill.
@@WexMajor82 Heavy DM buy in needed there. You can't just buy materials attuned to distant planes in most campaign settings.
@@richardwhaler8717 BUILD, not buy.
Your character has the arcana skill, knows how to "attune" material to a plane.
Just like the one with the proficiency in smith tools knows how to forge a sword.
25:51 Whirlwind doesn't deal damage to targets it's already restrained. The damage is only for when a creature or the whirlwind enters the other's space.
Does this change your rating?
Symbol is amazing for ambushes. Put a Symbol down, hide, and wait until your enemy walks into the trap and triggers a concentration-free, absolutely brutal mass debuff such as Stun or Insanity for a minute.
Granted, casting Symbol ahead of time requires a good amount of planning, but if an enemy manages to triggered it, its effect can be even more dramatic than a level 9 spell.
Gold is also not really an issue at these levels. A Druid is not a Wizard - they don't have pricey spells to transcribe into a spell book. The only equipment a Druid really needs to buy is 45gp Studded Leather. So blowing all your gold (probably countable in the thousands at this level) on spell like Heroes' Feast and Symbol is all very reasonable.
Frankly, I would consider it Orange - circumstantial, but frankly amazing when it can be applied.
Oh yeah this baby packs a punch alright, just be cautious about that non party friendly 60ft radius and have a ball. \o/
Regenerate with Life Domain Cleric dip is nice. That's +9 HP per round, so 10hp per round.
i'd still rather cast aura of vitality, though. Unless I need concentration for something else. Or bonus actions. eg, a 1 level dip into life cleric with spore druid, regenerate is better, since it doesn't take up your bonus action or concentration. So, circumstantial, really.
Yeah, this spell works a lot better on a life domain Cleric. An interesting side effect of this spell is that once you cast it on a front liner, they probably won't die or lose turns from taking damage in a fight for the 1 hour duration. Not the best spell but it could work fine with this dip and in the right situation
@@edgaraquino3528 totally. For me, I run a spore druid, so having my concentration freed up for something else, and my bonus action devoted to commanding skeletons and zombies makes using regeneration perfect. I don't have to spend half my spell slots on healing, and can contribute a lot to combat.
I love this idea.
Step 1- Wizard fabricates bleachers
Step 2- Druid with Life cleric dip cast regenerate on the Wizard in same round.
Step 3- Druid on Round 2 or other caster cast Polymorph on Wizard to make giant Ape.
Step 4- Watch the Ape have a Massacre.
If your DM will let you magic stone the thrown rock attacks for more fun. (Don't expect it though)
I still think this spell is worth even for pure druid without multiclass.
The best time to cast this spell is after the first encounter in dungeon.
You heal your front-liner to full with this spell and he will be healed for the rest of that 1 hour.
If he is knocked down to 0 HPs, he gets back every turn, if you wait a bit between fights (rooms), he gets to full HPs again.
So this spell can mean 3-4 full heals, several times waking up unconscious character during combat and all that with no action cost! It seems like a worth 7th level spell slot!
Interestingly, a big draw of Regenerate is that it's a 7th level spell. If an NPC is missing an arm, an eye, or another body part, they won't have an easy time getting it back - meaning that you can ask for a pretty big favour in return for making their peg leg obsolete. Very, very situational, but fun when it comes up.
I mean, as a Druid, you have access to your whole spell list. If the situation comes, you can probably afford to take a long rest, prepare the spell and cast it.
@@Nightmare-bn4sr Absolutely, the only danger is to forget that you have it just because it's almost never useful, or at least remotely optimal.
This is a good point. I am probably just trying to justify the 1 time I took this as my Bard's 7th level spell, but also I think there are situations where the extreme, concentration free healing over 1 hour could be super useful- say your party is the vanguard of a force storming an enemy castle, where the PCs need to engage in several time-sensitive battles in rapid succession, with only 3-5 minutes of running between engagements. The auto 1 hp revive at the start of the turn is also very action economy efficient if set up before a battle, although bouncing back up at 1 hp also greatly increases the odds of an opponent deciding to target the regenerating character with a full multi attack routine and just killing them outright.
@@geckothegreene There are for sure really niche situations where it is the best available option for healing. And, I mean, if most characters had this spell's functionality available as a 13th level feature, I'm thinking it wouldn't be a bad one.
But optimal play aside, with this spell you can get a lot of goodwill out of a pirate king with an eye patch, a hook for a hand, and a peg leg. Yarrrgh.
Frankly, making the spell 6th would have the same effect.
I LOVE YOU TREANTMONK :)
5:30 Against a single target yes but Firestorm has a massive area of effect. If you're fighting many enemies or participate in say a battle. it's way stronger than those other spells you mentioned.
Cone of Cold is also pretty large though, and two whole spell levels lower. Plus cold is more reliable than fire
@@PsyrenXY Cone of cold needs to originate from you. And massed numner of enemies usually do not have resistances.
9:40 Illusions in dnd are of many kind. Some may just alter the mind of a target, or create an illusion that people can go through, but there are solid illusions too, like Mirage Arcane, Shadowblade, Illusionary Dragon and there migh be a couple more
I believe by RAW with Whirlwind, a creature trapped in it only takes the damage initially, because at that point, they're no longer entering it; they move with the Whirlwind from then on.
I used to think that the damage of symbol was bad. Then I realized it happened every round for 10 minutes. Each instance of damage occurs if a creature enters the area, or ends its turn in the area. It certainly made the mummy lord boss more interesting for my players. >:)
Yeah, I don't know how many necrotic immune enemies Chris is fighting, because 1000D10 damage is a lot, even if you resist it.
The only effect that lasts 10 minutes is sleep which ends if the target takes damage, so 1000d10 is not going to happen.
Even the 100d10 assume that the target fails 11 saves in a row
@@MightyMagnetmonster that is only mostly correct. The only effect that lasts 10min from a single saving throw lasts for 10 mintutes, but evem that effect is a little more powerful than you are giving credit.
The spell comes in multiple parts, the description on how to cast and trigger the spell, the general effect of the spell which reads as follows in paragraph 5.
"... Once Triggered, the glyph glows, filling a 60ft radius sphere for 10 minutes, afterwhich the spell ends. Each creature in the sphere when the glyph activates is targeted by its effect, as is a creature that enters the sphere for the first time on a turn or ends its turn there."
That last segment is especially important. Because yeah if you are hit by the initial burst of damage, you can escape any subsequent damage by simply leaving the area... i mean, unless something is stopping your movement, like Stone to Mud, or Plant Growth as simple druid options.
After that segment it goes into the seperate effects, all of which are effected by the previous section we just covered. And none of the options stipulate that you are immune or ignored from being effected on subsequent rounds so long as you are in the area of effect. Thus the sleep you mention is technically sleep for 10min if they failed the initial save plus a number of rounds depending on when they failed thier second save. Because i highly doubt a character can make 999 successful saves in a row. It only takes one fail to fall asleep afterall, however I would be surprised if a character started to sleep walk out of the area. But I suppose not entirely out of the question.
(Edited for grammer and typos)
@@MightyMagnetmonster The effect lasts 10 minutes, it's clearly written in the spell description - If you go in and out multiple rounds, you end up taking the damage.
I think Chris summarized it well, the spell list is small. The best spells here are not necessarily druid exclusive, and with certain interpretations I think mirage arcane and plane shift are up there.
I’ve used Fire Storm VERY effectively in combat, I would say it’s at least orange if not purple.
It’s especially impressive/effective when you get to cast it against a group of smaller creatures such as an enemies summoned creatures with their own conjure animals. Much better than dispelling each one or wasting an action per creature when you can use an action to wipe most of them all out at once.
I agree. I think Tree was too way hard on this spell especially in his comparison with Cone of Cold. Yes, the damage should be higher but the comparison wasn't fair since he didn't bring up the negatives of Cone of Cold in comparison to Fire Storm which lacks those negatives. I am referring to (1) CoC is obviously a cone and cones suck compared to circles/squares (since on a grid a circle just becomes a square) but circles suck compared to fire storms 10 squares. Fire Storm has amazing flexibility as an aoe. How many other aoe spells have this flexibility/ability to manipulate the aoe? (2) It's a Dex save while Cone of Cold is a Con save. You can counter that its fire and more likely to be resisted and that's a reasonable critique as is the low comparative damage. But that hardly should qualify this as a red. I'd have put it at purple.
Yes, but at 7th level it needs to be 8d10 min to be worthwhile; or have rider. I think it is red because while situational, Druids have better options for those situations.
@@brettmajeske3525 I have to disagree. Even 7d10 and able to shape make it one of my go to options at those levels.
@@studynot757 But if blasting is what you're into, there are other ways to exclude your allies from AoE that don't involve you sacrificing 4 spell slots over a fireball for only slightly higher damage. It's too big of a penalty to justify with just the ability to shape the spell when straight damage is already something that shouldn't be your priority as a caster. If you're going to be doing straight damage, it needs to be high, and this just isn't.
@@ihave2cows If full blasting is all I’m concerned about then I’m not playing a Druid.
We’re here discussing the merits of Druid spells at their respective levels. I’m saying that Treantmonk gave some short shrift to Fire Storm because of its flexibility. Yes overall Fireball is more volume of fire and somewhat close in damage, but 9 out of 10 times you’re fireballing you’re not using all 33,510 ft3 of fire, you’re using… like 4 or 5 square of it. Fire Storm lets you more effectively target disjointed groups of enemies and shape it around friends, etc.
I’m not saying it’s Blue or Green even but purple at least.
Mirage arcane can be so powerful depending on how your DM rules it. It's a spell you should always talk about with your DM before using it, because it will immediately raise a bunch of questions and slow down gameplay if you haven't already figured out how you're playing it.
any good ideas to use it?
@@samuelbroad11 Well depending on how your DM rules it you can make terrain incredibly hostile. Also, it's crazy good if you're a divination wizard, as you have the ability to change the illusion after casting it. With Mirage Arcane, that's kind of over powered.
@@tomgymer7719 chur bro, don't you mean illusion wizard. malleable illusions? I like the idea of turning an entire area into the labyrinth from The Labyrinth.
@@samuelbroad11 Illusion, yes of course, sorry.
So if an NPC casts this in a jungle or heavily forested area, would PCs just continually bump into trees, rocks, and essentially not be able to navigate through the woodland (if it looked like a meadow or rolling hills)? Without magical aid, this would seemingly make it nearly impossible or painstaking and probably deadly to move through that illusionary terrain.
It doesn't conceal anyone, and it doesn't reveal anyone either, right? So in the example above, critters would "materialize" from thin air if they popped out from behind a tree or from a bush that had been made to look grassy plains?
It does say range is "sight", or what you can see, so if you tried to use this in a dense forest, it might only affect your immediate vicinity and nothing beyond the clump of trees and shrubs surrounding you...
Super confusing spell.
Other thing about Regenerate is that the target regains HP at the start of its turn, so it automatically gets up if knocked down every round. So you heal a near-dead ally to full in downtime, and they just get back up every time they’re knocked down. A lot of beasties simply can’t kill them (need at least 3 attacks to have a chance).
Doesn’t make it GOOD, but it’s certainly relevant,
Exactly!
The best time to cast this spell is after the first encounter in dungeon.
You heal your front-liner to full with this spell and he will be healed for the rest of that 1 hour.
If he is knocked down to 0 HPs, he gets back every turn, if you wait a bit between fights (rooms), he gets to full HPs again.
So this spell can mean 3-4 full heals, several times waking up unconscious character and all that with no action cost! It seems like a worth 7th level spell slot!
Agreed, Regenerate is seriously underestimated. It makes you virtually unkillable for the duration of a non-concentration spell. Barring enough damage to kill you instantly, or 4 attacks in a round (1 to drop you and 3 to burn through death saves), you get back up at the start of the next round and continue fighting.
@@rickfairfax9631 One correction: attacking incapacitated target from 5 ft has advantage and it is auto- crit, so it means minus 2 death saves with each hit. But it still means 3 attacks are needed, which is still plenty.
If you consider average dmg of enemy 25 and 2 attacks “wasted” each turn on character with regeneration, with 20 rounds of combat during this one hour, we are talking about 1000 HPs of healing from 1 spell + healing out of combat, so easily 1500 HPs from 1 spell! This is not red at all in my opinion!
Loving the series so far! Can you make a Stars druid build please? I want to play one that defaults to the archer starry form, from level 2-9. Obviously, full versatility at level 10+ being able to change your constellation. Thanks!
I think a stars druid wants to look at concentration spells that dont require further actions, with the BA always being used and free castings of guiding bolt
while I agree that melee attack and then save is a very big red flag for a spell, Charisma saves are surprisingly poor on a lot of enemies.
ALso I must diasgree with the red * rating on Regenerate.
Yes this spell is poor for healing, but it can be a great story/utility cast on an NPC, where severd limps are far more likely than on an NPC. and since a Druid can swap their spells, they can prepapre the spell when they encounter someone who needs regeneration on their adventures, of they have the time to stay there and heal them.
This would normaly be overly circumstential, but I dont think 2overly cicumstentila" is red on a prep caster, comapred to a "known" caster.
Hi treantmonk! Have u ever considered making a build based off different table expectations. For example a table where a player can expect 1 combat encounter maybe 2 per adventuring day with short rest after every encounter. At least in my experiences some tables I've been at are like this and in those sernarios I'm interested on what kind of tactics or builds would thrive there
Firestorm can be useful for terrorist or guerilla activity.
I'm getting dark here. Regenerate could be used for a horrifying revenge; cut off all of a creature's limbs, then put the arms where the legs were and the legs where the arms were. As a piece de resistance, face them backwards.
Also, the Sword of Sharpness can lop off a limb, if you roll a 20 and then another 20. So yeah, pretty rare.
But what if a bugbear comes and rips your arm off? Things get complicated with only one arm.
Symbol feels very campaign dependent. I could see it being useful if you know a large dangerous monster plans on attacking a village, then you could set it up beforehand.
I think if you've got someone with a silver enough tongue or a decent-sized distraction Symbol can be used as a pretty elaborate trap for a big enemy if you're trying to lure it out, though I do see it not being very frequent. Maybe a party of players that like coming up with ridiculous elaborate traps could make use of it :/
If you have a party member with banish or find someone who can cast it, you can get back to your native plane without a tuning fork
Missed the points that if you plane shift an enemy, you might be able to send them to a plane where the natives will attack on sight: sending a fiend or undead to mount celestia, for example. Not universal, but situationally very cool.
If using offensively you will want to make sure your attack roll has advantage, at the very least, which shouldn't be too hard to set up with allies and pets in play.
If you make a habit of this, the inhabitants of the destination plane may come looking for whoever it is that keeps annoying them with enemies in their home.
@@topomusicale5580 thats a bit much , its only useing the spell for its express purpose
@@bleddynwolf8463 it doesn't sound ridiculous to me from a world building scenario. Alternatively sending powerful enemies repeatedly to a sacred place could lead to dire circumstances.
@@elliotbryant3459 well, using a different example then OP, sending almost anything other than Demons to the Abyss, and send them to the beastlands to be hunted by any number of great beast you know, have the cleric/paladin ask their god if they can send enemies to be chopped up in their realm. don't disagree that sending pit fiends to mount celestia unannounced is a bad idea, but you have other options.
I also want to point out that RAW it seems like a regenerate spell doesn't truly fix non-severing 'lingering injuries'. For example, a punctured eyeball. Rime seems to imply that the spell was *intended* to be able to do this, so RaI, but i'd say its interesting nonetheless as a very obvious oversight.
Regeneration it's actually quite good for it's main purpose, regenerate body parts. Odd you said it never comes in play, probably not for everyday preparation but for story reasons i find it relativily common. It's in the same category as Resurrection, prepare when needed.
I take Mirage Arcane like a holodeck in Star Trek
BLUE💙💙
😢
GREEN💚💚
Plane Shift
PRPLE💜💜
Mirage Arcane
Reverse Gravity
Whirlwind
ORANGE🧡🧡
😐
RED💔💔
Fire Storm
Regenerate
Symbol
~
I know will almost never come into play, but at level 20 we don’t need material components that lack cost, so plain shift might get more utility, if the DM previously required you to find a fork for each plain.
The fork costs 250g though
Imagine regeneration at a disposal of torturer...
And yeah, RAW reverse gravity affects flying creatures. Because there's written "if creature can't grab anchor it fall up" and there's nothing about flying creatures avoid this effect - they raw will fall upwards even with hover xd
Are we sure that creatures inside a whirlwind take damage on subsequent turns?
OK, obviously some controversy on the rating for Regenerate, and I haven’t personally played a Druid at this level. But I always assumed this was primarily a self-buff for a Moon Druid: both increases durability of your Wildshape in combat, but more importantly ensures you are healing up between combats, at least for an hour.
Ugh I think I agree with you Chris in almost all the rankings, but I just can't wrap my head around you giving regen a red ranking. I means it not a great spell but, it has a lot of value! If you and your team need to hurry up and rush trough a castle or dungeon or are cornered and expect a lot of fighting regen is a great spell. You can give your fighter for example discount 'immortality' for 1 hour, no more saving trowns and save the action economy rising him up, and a lot of fighting in short time? he will always be full hp.
In the right situation a player member would be (no meta) almost unkillable for one whole hour, only afraid of insta-kill things or the DM now always targeting him when he is down (which some dms do others not).
The pcs now can face or fight in a way they probably couldn't afford before, regen opens them this option. I really think it deserved at least the 'situational' orange, to me its purple.
I mean... if i was the DM i would certainly target him (with an intelligent opponent) when he is down if i had some way of knowing that he just gets back up again... 3 examples of the top of my head; saw the previous fight, had a mook flee and tell me, it happened already in combat
Would you recommend any up cast spells on lower levels as pseudo blue for 7th? (It sounds like it may be a similar question for 8th)
Planeshift really should be limited on where you can appear on a plane.
Sure, Reverse Gravity shouldn't affect flying creatures as much..but it can be devastating to non flying creatures..non-flying creatures that make their saves are restrained and those that don't are suspended in the air either oscillating 100 ft. up or have taken damage and are prone and can't do anything while you finish off the ones that can't move on the ground...I agree that there's a time and a place for it, but that applies to a lot of other spells with better ratings. It's an encounter ending spell ...or screws it up pretty bad if it doesn't end it..
Couldn’t you use this regenation to farm magic item creation if you use that varent?
Mirage Arcane to turn the terrain into lava flows with lakes and rivers of molten lava flowing and erupting? Could certainly cause a lot of death to at least lower level creatures, and an inconvenience even to higher level things.
I disagree about fire storm, maybe the sculptability is too neiche for purple, but id put it in purple or orange. Druids wont have high initiative so your allies often engage ahead of you, there can be dynamic with innocents/civilians, and aoe spells, especially for druids, are best for mobs not the "appropriate" cr
Edit: it also helps to counteract mobs knowing to spread out to avoid aoe damage
I don't think Chris is adequately considering the impact of regenerating up from 0 to 1 hit points AUTOMATICALLY and without concentration. The spell makes the target basically un-killable unless they fail three death saves before their next turn. The druid could be going tow to toe with a Balor who would have virtually no way of killing the druid for a full hour. They just don't have enough attacks to use up all of the druid's death saves before its the druid's turn again. I'm not saying that this makes a blue spell but that should easily bump it to a purple or even green spell.
The balor has a damaging aura at the start of it's turn so it can kill you.
Also any attack within 5ft. of you while you are downed is considered a critical hit (2 failed death saves)
Yeah, its a huge boost to durability in a big time fight given that it’s non-concentration
If you change the regeneration amount the spell instantly becomes a whole lot better. Regeneration 10 would make the spell actually pack enough oomph to make it a superior spell to Heal and worth the higher-level spell slot. As it currently stands its more of a plot spell or a spell to make the druid some big money.
All the people saying this is a huge durability boost obviously don't have dms that target downed PC's. Two hits while you are down and you are done.
@@justinstreet1254 I’m a DM who targets downed players. This is a big boost to durability
I really want to see you rate tsunami. I only had a chance to cast it once, but it was a lvl 15 pvp game with 12 people and it was hella fun)
Vive a druid a year andò between all his spells he can make a fortress, and hide it ad a hill
Regeneration earns a Orange. Considering utility, the sphere of annihilation and even Fey claiming a finger for a favor, I can’t support Regeneration as anything less then a Orange spell. And there are to many ways the a creature can loose parts as part of the story based “how do you want to do this” culture. And a revivify is not going to restore that wing. Short of resurrection, there is no way to get limbs back. Do you prepare it on GPs ? Nope as with most spells of this type you take it when you need it, but if you know you need it you get it.
(This counts as engagement too)
I don't know if it's just this video, or this is just the video where I noticed it, but in the intro, the Blue title card is misspelled as "Blue: Fatasic Spell". Yeah, I'm that guy. :(
One thing I’m wondering is for fire storm if a creature is big enough to be in more than one of the cubes would they only take the damage once or would they take the damage for each cube they are in? If it’s the later then you could deal quite a bit of damage at once to pretty big targets.
If you read the spell carefully, you'll notice it mentions "the area of the storm consists of up to ten 10-foot cubes" and "each creature in the area". Either you are in the area or you are not, so just one instance of damage.
@@Kipex got it, I had been driving when he went over that spell and wondered that when I finished the video later.
Wouldn't placing 4 cubes adjacent to each other on a large or bigger creature cause it to make 4 DCs for a potential 28d10 damage?
No. It would not
nothing says god mode like casting reverse gravity on a few purple worms and making them as helpless as floating cows.
hey, Treant! can you boogey while hung up in the sky to scooch out of the area of effect?
Aaaaah.
Plane Shift.
Also called "Enjoy your stay in Carceri".
What's the catch? You can't escape Carceri without getting stronger (smarter, shrewder, or whatever happened to you) of who sent you there.
Even if you can planeshift.
Ranking Fire Storm Red??? I don't think you realized the sheer volume it covers! That spell is "I burn the entire town in 6 seconds." That spell is "Every one of the BBEG's forty-five minions takes 20 fire damage." Surely worth at least Orange ranking.
Forty fire damage, save for half, with no secondary effect, is a PATHETIC use of a 7th level slot, no matter how many targets it hits.
How would you feel about mirage arcane creating vehicles or something that can harm players? Can I create a weapon and use it on an NPC? What about a stationary weapon, similar to a cannon or ballista? Can it fire illusory ammo? Can it fire real ammo I already own?
I am not a DM™, but if I were, I would say this spell can add/remove generally fixed terrain features and buildings, including large rocks that something smaller than Huge couldn't move. So, no vehicles, no weapons. Some exaples of creative ways around *that* would be springy tree branches, swinging gates, and quicksand. I can see some DMs saying the spell can only create a static image-but then anybody could just notice the trees don't sway in the breeze and water doesn't flow. There's a league or two of room for interpretation with Mirage Arcane.
I would cast fire storm just for flavor. It's cool xd
Regeneration + Disciple of Life works?
Do Clerics next!
The SA rulings on mirage arcane implie that objects created by the spell are physically real.
Yep make this spell bit of a city killer just fill the city with lava water acid ect
Some food for thought comparison: take a look at the higher level upcasting of Air Bridge. The caster can make the bridge exist only for those creatures the caster chooses. Perhaps some insight could be drawn from this regarding Mirage Arcane.
Reverse gravity is powerful. The creatures can't move for one minute. You can cast this then just use range weapons to pick them off. Flying creatures can't fly in it either. Is says if they reach the top they just slowly oscillate until the spell ends.
Flying creatures would still be able to fly, gravity has been reversed not reversed & amplified. They would fall initially obviously but would just need to reverse their orientation on their next turn. The oscillation is if they hit the edge of the effect without striking anything. There would be nowhere further to fall and no stable surfaces for a walking creature to move along, whereas a flying creature doesn't require the same support for their movement.
@@elliotbryant3459 if you want to apply logic to magic then yes that would be true but the way the spell is written it would work the same regardless of a fly speed.
@@MageLeaderInc nothing says they loose access to movement. If you hit a wall you can walk upside down and walk out of the area and then fall back to the normal ground early. Also you are assuming the people up there also have no ranged weapons (not a bad assumption for monsters and some PCs but yeah... they may actually ENJOY being 100 feet away from you)
@@LeumGaming I didn't make any of those assumptions I just didn't list every possible outcome. Yes if they hit something then they can move but the way I interpret it is if a creature makes it all the way to the top then they are stuck there for the duration. As for the loosing access to movement it literally says "If an object or creature reaches the top of the area without striking anything, it remains there, oscillating slightly, for the duration." That tells me until the spell ends they are stuck there oscillating slightly, they can still take actions but the only movement is the natural oscillating motion.
@@MageLeaderInc Can you name another spell that reduces/removes movement and doesn't explicitly say it (or a condition that has also explicitly says it -ie restrained ).
Perhaps there is precedent, but I feel like they are usually VERY clear about this (hence why fly should work)
I have to disagree again on your interpretation (I'd even call it a house rule, since it contradicts so many ways the spell is clearly stated to work) about Mirage Arcane not affecting things without senses. Does your cart (or clothes) get caught on the rocks in the gully that's been made into a wide road? If someone dies or is knocked out, do they suddenly fall through the illusory hill? What happens if they wake up from unconsciousness while inside something? What about the cart you're pulling up the hill, or across the lake-turned-field? So much of the spell is invalidated, and SO much more is contradictory if you consider that physical forces from the spell only get applied to conscious creatures. The designers have been clear that the spell is supposed to be extremely powerful and, afaik, have only confirmed strengths of the spell, not drawbacks.
I also disagree that concealing creatures means not blocking line of sight with objects---how could you ever know the lines of sight of every creature in the area? I would say that phrase is intended to prevent it being used as near-permanent mass greater invisibility, especially because that'd presumably come with intangibility.
All that said, as a DM I might house-rule this to be 9th level, or simply ban it, since it invalidates too many types of challenges. I believe the spell as written and intended is demigod-level reality-control, and at least shouldn't be wish-castable. Also worth mentioning that an illusionist with it can totally change the environment as an action, repeatedly, whenever they like. That's just bonkers.
Yeah, I'd say the bit about concealing creatures means you can't make the creatures just disappear as a *direct* effect of the spell, but that the creatures can conceal *themselves* in features of the illusory terrain the spell creates. That could have been phrased more clearly.
It sure seems like you could use this to make a boulder blocking a narrow passage disappear, or create a bridge or ramp to just walk over a hazard.
Also, this spell is clearly begging to require concentration, but doesn't, because reasons. ;-)
I don't understand the scaling on damaging spells. HP scales up by one die size every level, but spells don't scale up nearly that much. If a 1st level aoe spell is doing somewhere in the range of 1d10 damage, then an equivalent 7th level spell should do 13d10 since you'll be level 13 by the time you can use it.
Why didn't they just have spell damage on all of your spells scale based on caster level the way 3.5e did? There was nothing wrong with that system, and damage dealing spells were hardly the reason why casters were so powerful in that edition.
Maybe because spellcasting is so versatile and powerful, even without great damage, that making it good at damage too would negate the reason to play anything else.
Sometimes, you don't get to be the very best at every single things, all at once.
@@ChristnThms That's more an issue with some of the PHB martial options and especially levels 11+ than with the game itself. For the most commonly played level range, levels 2-9, martials and casters are relatively balanced and have pros and cons compared to each other.
Notably, that's the level range where blasting actually is effective. It's higher levels where damaging spells fall off to a major degree. Those are also the levels where some of the spells become, frankly, absurd. I would rather they nerf overpowered spells and buff high level features for under-performing classes rather than to have them quietly make an entire playstyle irrelevant.
@@stranger6822 So your solution to "fix" the game is to break what works and buff what doesn't need buffing...
Ok. Let me know how that works for you.
@@ChristnThms yikes. You need to calm down.
@@stranger6822 what would make you think I'm not calm? Did I stutter? Did my hands shake while typing? Or did you just jump to a completely irrational conclusion, because you don't have anything else?
There are magic items and monsters with the ability to chop off your head. If you can somehow survive the attack (perhaps because you have two heads) then you can use regenerate to stick the head back on your neck. So technically, it does have use even in the absence of lingering injuries.
Are there any monsters or items I'm forgetting about besides the Vorpal Sword?
@@latyper7450 as far as items go there's also the sword of sharpness [granted it still requires rolling two 20's]. Also the clone spell requires a cubic inch of flesh from the creature.
@@latyper7450 A Molydeus basically wields a vorpal sword
Plane shift can't be used as a straight up teleport. The first line says you have to go to a different plane. So you would have to cast it twice to use it as a teleport.
Which is exactly what he explained with his example :)
@@Kipex oh I missed that
Whirlwind blows.
Why do you continue to compare AoE spells (like fire storm) to single, high-CR targets? It's disingenuous and unconvincing.
I agree to a point. But seriously, how often do you get sent up against many lower CR targets? Most DMs (imo) find it easier to give you one single harder enemy than to give you many lower enemies.
But yes - i think it is situational (i mentioned it to someone else here, but if you know you have a large cinematic battle coming up where your party is going to take out the enemy leader and the mooks will fight the standard soldiers... great spell because now you get 100s of extra bow shots at the BBEG and some of those will be 20s)