[726] The Naughty Bucket Chronicles - Tokoz “Tech 300” Euro Cylinder Picked and Gutted

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  • Опубліковано 29 жов 2024

КОМЕНТАРІ • 293

  • @Kavukamari
    @Kavukamari 5 років тому +752

    Lock: "100% resistant to picking"
    LPL: "sounds like a false marketing suit to me"

    • @blackthrone6976
      @blackthrone6976 4 роки тому +7

      Picking Resistant isn't Picking Proof. Yeah, it's hard, but not impossible...

    • @Sip_Dhit
      @Sip_Dhit 4 роки тому +12

      If you resist damage 100% it means you're immune, but if you're restrained struggling 100% doesnt mean you're free, so 100% resistance could go either way

    • @TimLF
      @TimLF 4 роки тому +5

      They just round it up; LPL is 1/8,000,000,000 so accurate to 8 orders of magnitude

    • @Bikertrons
      @Bikertrons 3 роки тому +2

      well thank fuck he's a lawyer

    • @vast634
      @vast634 3 роки тому +1

      It might be opened by an expert in his lab, but that does not mean its not pick proof from an average picker at an actual door (with limited time and not knowing the lock and key).

  • @AalbertTorsius
    @AalbertTorsius 6 років тому +640

    "Bill, thanks for giving me a shot."
    How's the leg?

  • @kman1759
    @kman1759 6 років тому +734

    You know it's gonna be difficult when the key looks like a saw

    • @MrSonny6155
      @MrSonny6155 6 років тому +79

      It's actually a message to the picker to use a saw instead because you are gonna have an easier time.

    • @solidus3168
      @solidus3168 6 років тому +4

      BZZZZZZ a drill

    • @ericsarchive7718
      @ericsarchive7718 5 років тому +12

      All that does is turn a 30 second video into a 2 minute video.

    • @Kadeo-ms6qw
      @Kadeo-ms6qw 4 роки тому +2

      EricsArchive but it’s still easier than picking

    • @amandajensen3382
      @amandajensen3382 4 роки тому

      Nasty bitting, lol

  • @hightttech
    @hightttech 6 років тому +586

    ad says, "cannot be picked" ... LPL says, "Open mouth, insert foot, chew vigorously."

    • @bertrandhustle
      @bertrandhustle 6 років тому +47

      "This lock is advertised as unpickable, looks like I got it open in 26 seconds."

    • @thomasblake5174
      @thomasblake5174 5 років тому +6

      Nice

  • @youtube.commentator
    @youtube.commentator 6 років тому +515

    LPL - I saw you switch between picks, without knowing how the key was designed, would you have used the same strategy?

    • @lockpickinglawyer
      @lockpickinglawyer  6 років тому +739

      Yes. When I move between pins, I ride my pick on the pin I just picked. That makes it fairly obvious when I can’t reach a pin. That’s one of the reasons I always go front to back. 👍

    • @youtube.commentator
      @youtube.commentator 6 років тому +73

      LockPickingLawyer awesome, thanks!

    • @jrmbayne
      @jrmbayne 6 років тому +55

      Amazing tip. I've accidentally done that a few times while counting pins, will remember to do it purposefully in the future

    •  6 років тому +35

      This comment is pure gold ! So what made you realized you didn’t touched four was that when you came into contact with five it was way too far from three to be four ?

    • @buggsy5
      @buggsy5 5 років тому +14

      @ Correct.

  • @Papinak2
    @Papinak2 2 роки тому +12

    I have one minor and one major remark: the eurocylinder is usually mounted upside down. But it also needs a full rotation or two, to actually unlock. Half rotation is needed to just engage the lever, while you left it in 90° position

    • @DannyGraves1775
      @DannyGraves1775 Рік тому +1

      That's why the gods of lockpicking invented plugspinners 😉

  • @nicksenske662
    @nicksenske662 6 років тому +63

    If you would be able to get your hands on a matco toolbox, I would love to see you try to pick it. You have to push in against spring pressure to turn the key. If you couldn’t find one, I could try to get an extra and send it in

  • @brokencookieuwu
    @brokencookieuwu 6 років тому +10

    I'm really bad at counting pins, your videos always make it seem like you can actually see everything inside the lock, great video!

  • @Hrethgir
    @Hrethgir 4 роки тому +10

    Oh, THAT'S what wafers are in a lock! I just assumed it was a metal disc with notches the key goes thru. Good to see this one gutted.

  • @MrGSSM
    @MrGSSM 5 років тому +13

    I was working in Tokoz 11 years ago. They probably makes the best locks in the Czech Republic

  • @tomhejda6450
    @tomhejda6450 6 років тому +11

    Nice to see a Czech lock having been in the naughty bucket. I think I'll soon contact you, I've got some Tokoz to send your way. They are largish padlocks, and they are the things from them people know here. I believe the company entered the europrofile market only quite recently.

  • @dheller777
    @dheller777 6 років тому +227

    Great pick. Have you ever thought about letting Bill try to open some of your tougher locks that might have given you trouble?

    • @wiredwater7331
      @wiredwater7331 6 років тому +62

      I wanna see bill cry

    • @allothernamesbutthis
      @allothernamesbutthis 6 років тому +48

      He smashes them fire and might, never an unopened lock with lpl :D

    • @ButterBallTheOpossum
      @ButterBallTheOpossum 6 років тому +52

      I feel like LPL is on a whole different level of skill than Bill. He opened most of bills naughty bucket locks in under a minute. Anything LPL can't open Bill will never open.

    • @hannesmorgenroth7149
      @hannesmorgenroth7149 5 років тому +8

      I doubt LPL has one single lock he can't open.

    • @Bialy_1
      @Bialy_1 5 років тому +42

      @@ButterBallTheOpossum "I feel like LPL is on a whole different level of skill than Bill." feelings are irrational thats why u "feel" that. Bill chanel have completly different format, LPL is doing only short movies after he allready found solution to the "problem".

  • @Malta-fn9wf
    @Malta-fn9wf 6 років тому +63

    So glad i found this channel. I’m new here but i watched like 30 videos of yours today. Your channel is truly addictive. Keep it up 💪

  • @DaniCalifornia44
    @DaniCalifornia44 3 роки тому +11

    “Okay and we’re going to start by inverting gravity.”

  • @danielroglich3309
    @danielroglich3309 4 роки тому +3

    Awesome picking brother,thanks to Bosnian Bill for providing the locks for your naughty bucket chronicles videos!

  • @sitdox
    @sitdox 4 роки тому +3

    Been watching a lot off your videos
    My first comment
    The man that made art and spectacle of picking the locks
    My huge respect to that man
    He goes through the locks like squirrel through the nuts 😆
    Thank you for your great videos

  • @kasuha
    @kasuha 6 років тому +56

    European locks are mounted the other way, with pins being pushed down rather than up. I wonder if their anti-picking measures can't be designed for that and if you're not bypassing them by picking the lock upside down.

    • @Second_UNIT
      @Second_UNIT 4 роки тому +6

      Not necessarily. It might requiring a bit more finagling, but I’m sure that for lpl he’d have no problems since he’s shown capability with both top and bottom key way tension

  • @MorellioBenoir
    @MorellioBenoir 6 років тому +12

    It lasted barely over 2 minutes. Wow LPL, very nice.
    Extra thanks for gutting that one!

  • @GeoMan1217
    @GeoMan1217 6 років тому +34

    Loving the naughty bucket picks.

  • @rabidr3aper213
    @rabidr3aper213 2 роки тому +1

    This dudes forplay is 100% a chastity belt. Love these videos.

  • @Pheorize
    @Pheorize 6 років тому +4

    Haha, I like how you're saying that this was a tricky lock to pick, especially with this lock being a naughty bucket one, but you pick it in 2 minutes flat. Great job and video!

  • @Joe.Rogan.
    @Joe.Rogan. 6 років тому +10

    I've been really enjoying this series. Awesome content.

  • @brianhignett8954
    @brianhignett8954 6 років тому +4

    Hi Harry, Interesting lock, certainly a variation on wafers. I guess they could be Master Keyed using smaller wafers between top and bottom wafers ...? No lip on the front of the core could leave it vulnerable. Regards, Brian.

    • @lockpickinglawyer
      @lockpickinglawyer  6 років тому +4

      Yup, shimming from the front is definitely a problem with this design.

  • @DonzLockz
    @DonzLockz 6 років тому +58

    Pretty mental seeing a wafer lock in a naughty bucket but good job as those wafers are definately alien technology.😎✌🇦🇺

    • @two_tier_gary_rumain
      @two_tier_gary_rumain 6 років тому +6

      They're definitely not normal wafers.

    • @DonzLockz
      @DonzLockz 6 років тому +4

      Gary Rumain that's for sure Gary. I must say, I've never seen anything like them before.

  • @s1lver001
    @s1lver001 4 роки тому +5

    Let's get this out onto a tray. Nice!

    • @jooei2810
      @jooei2810 3 роки тому

      I know this meme! :D

  • @AlbertLebel
    @AlbertLebel 6 років тому +5

    Very good picking there LPL. And what a great lock. Thanks for sharing this one

  • @larrybe2900
    @larrybe2900 6 років тому +11

    Looks to be a challenge to assemble.

  • @8867348
    @8867348 6 років тому

    I think the key was using that deeper hook and not over setting #3 wafer. Good job. Lol, I'm talking like i know what I'm talking about. I just started this hobby a few months ago thanks to Mr Bills inspiration. I thought i was doing pretty good until i started using a vice to hold the locks and now it feels like i am starting all over again. Lol.

  • @RAkers-tu1ey
    @RAkers-tu1ey 6 років тому +2

    Wow. really interesting design I would likely never see otherwise.
    Thanks.

  • @kilroy1964
    @kilroy1964 6 років тому +6

    Absurd bidding? I actually thought that was a bump key at first!

  • @fastcharlie4054
    @fastcharlie4054 6 років тому

    Very cool wafer lock. I was not expecting that. The guts of an Illinois Duo are interesting but this is as well having wafer drivers.

  • @Pyrolock
    @Pyrolock 6 років тому

    Very interesting Mr. LPL -- Never seen anything like it. Thanks for showing it to us, + thanks for showing us your understanding of the lock and how to pick it.

  • @guyfromostrava
    @guyfromostrava 6 років тому +41

    Since this is a eurolock, I think you should pick those upside down, or for us europeans, the correct way a lock should be installed :-P

    • @chefgav1
      @chefgav1 6 років тому +1

      Seminko thrse are installed both ways depending on door in southern hemisphere

    • @Golegoth
      @Golegoth 6 років тому +3

      I agreed, I think it's kind of cheating as the upside down should make the overset way more difficult to deal with.

    • @buggsy5
      @buggsy5 5 років тому +10

      @@Golegoth I have picked locks in both orientations and have not noticed any difference in overset feel or clearing. The weights of the pins are so much less than the pressure applied by the springs that it doesn't matter.
      But that would certainly be an idea to try in a challenge lock. It would require some very fine tuning of spring pressures to make a difference.

  • @michaelmendillo4614
    @michaelmendillo4614 5 років тому +2

    We are going to need a bigger bucket Bill ! Lol,, 😁✌

  • @Deerslyr81
    @Deerslyr81 5 років тому +4

    I believe that’s the longest pick I’ve ever seen you have to do. Good job though. Waiting on my pick set to come in so I can start my journey!

  • @halfdeadedlifereturningwit3420
    @halfdeadedlifereturningwit3420 6 років тому +230

    New subscriber with quick question;
    Were you born with a set of picks in one hand & a tension bar in the other?
    You make picking locks seem like child's play.
    Lock manufacturers must really hate you...

    • @thecatthatgotaway
      @thecatthatgotaway 6 років тому +35

      id say its probably give and take, on one hand he shows how to pick a lock, on the other hand some companies have sent him locks to test before they release him to get input

    • @japascho
      @japascho 5 років тому +17

      It's a bit depressing to go back to picking after watching his videos as a beginner 😅 feels like my cheep training locks are much more difficult than his security ones

    • @buggsy5
      @buggsy5 5 років тому +28

      @@japascho One thing to keep in mind - he may spend several hours learning how to pick the lock before making a video of the process. All that time is not shown.
      Also, he has many years of practice. Picking locks sometimes requires a very fine touch/feel. It takes time to develop sensitivity to slight changes in position or pressure.

    • @leechowning2712
      @leechowning2712 5 років тому +16

      He has had a couple bets where he has to open the mailing pouch and open lock it 5 or less... The whole video was 3 minutes.

    • @ziiofswe
      @ziiofswe 4 роки тому +6

      @@leechowning2712 On the other hand I remember seeing a video with a rather tricky lock that he had to battle with for 4 hours...
      (The video itself was quite a bit shorter of course.)

  • @amberstails
    @amberstails 4 роки тому +5

    How long do locks have to resist Bill’s picking efforts to be put in the “naughty bucket”?

    • @Kalriostraz
      @Kalriostraz 4 роки тому +2

      Just watched the video on Bill's channel. The locks were in the range of a few months to a few years being in there, but every one stumped him for a dozen hours or more of picking attempts as I recall.

  • @khagaroth
    @khagaroth 5 років тому +2

    FYI you messed up while reading the TOKOZ catalog. The TECH cylinder is not the one they say is 100% pickproof (they have it listed as highly resistant). The lockpicking/bumping proof one is the PRO 300/400 cylinder which uses rotating discs locking mechanism.

  • @thumperlockpicking9269
    @thumperlockpicking9269 6 років тому +1

    Very cool lock,and you picked it like a champion

  • @DeetexSeraphine
    @DeetexSeraphine 4 роки тому

    eeeeeh, that keyway doesn't look too bad... unless it is extremely paracentric and I missed it.
    It never ceases to amaze me just how much tension you put on those locks, dayum...
    (DISASSEMBLY)
    It's a waver lock?! okay did not see that coming...

  • @ronniefaisstfan687
    @ronniefaisstfan687 4 роки тому +2

    startin to feel real bad for bill xD

  • @stevechurch3131
    @stevechurch3131 6 років тому +4

    So.... It's ALMOST 100% lockpicking proof. Lol. Well done and keep on picking

  • @MrBeeblebrox85
    @MrBeeblebrox85 6 років тому +7

    Great video! But when is LockPickingLawyer after dark coming out?

  • @THR33STEP
    @THR33STEP 6 років тому +1

    A wafer lock!! I didn’t expect that!!!

  • @gecko4ever
    @gecko4ever 4 роки тому +2

    Since the core slides out towards the back, doesn't this make the lock vulnerable to sliding a shim between the core and the cylinder from the front? @LockPickingLawyer Maybe something to try if you still have the lock.

    • @georgelangrick7384
      @georgelangrick7384 3 роки тому

      I was just thinking the same thing, it looks ripe for a shim picking. The tolerances do look quite tight though. I've never shim picked a wafer lock or even considered it, maybe it would be a tricky process but at least in theory it should work like a pin tumbler lock... I would love to know if this lock is susceptible to that form of attack.

  • @markleng67
    @markleng67 6 років тому

    I thought with that bitting that it was a challenge lock. Thanks for pointing out that MACS doesn't seem to apply to this style of lock.

  • @chunkymunkey9182
    @chunkymunkey9182 Рік тому

    You know its a challenge when there is an AD interrupting the lock picking process😁

  • @wreckelite
    @wreckelite 4 роки тому

    Seems like the student has surpasses the master, nailing these locks Bill had problems with.

  • @buggsy5
    @buggsy5 5 років тому

    Instead of using a magnet to get the wafers out of the core, use a pair of tweezers with fine points. That way you don't run the risk of magnetizing the wafers. Of course, the wafers could just as easily be brass, in which case magnetism is not a problem.

  • @crewmanderek3641
    @crewmanderek3641 2 роки тому

    💯 pick resistant. 😂 LPL has the last laugh again!

  • @HomestarCrawler
    @HomestarCrawler 3 роки тому

    I have a better version of this on a storage room in my building. I have the Tokoz 400 pro (a little more than 2x the price of this one) and it's a beast. People have tried to break in to it in the past, they tried to smash it, drill it, etc. No one's come close. About a year ago we installed cameras and a security system at the front door, and no more attempts have been made 😁 But I have to say that I'm pretty happy with this brand.

  • @taboripeter
    @taboripeter Рік тому

    What about a tokoz 400 pro? I've seen a pick on yt but I would like you to take a shot at it as your presentation is superb. The 400 has a special locking mechanism plus coupling so they claim, that you can lock it from the inside and not even open it with a key.

  • @3gsFreak
    @3gsFreak 5 років тому +1

    Congrats on 1M Subs!

  • @zbyszanna
    @zbyszanna 6 років тому

    Number four is like "can't touch this".

  • @MultiVde
    @MultiVde 6 років тому

    I've never seen anything like it, very neat lock!

  • @frank9240
    @frank9240 5 років тому

    the new snail spiral core will exceed all picking expectations, including sets, feedback, false gates, shimming, etc....

  • @rougnedodor2505
    @rougnedodor2505 Рік тому

    This man is a badass

  • @codyduff655
    @codyduff655 3 роки тому

    Hey, can you shim this lock. Slide a shim inbetween the cylinder and bible?. I didn't see and counter sinking or overlap to prevent a thin shim from being slid down on the shear line keeping the key and driver waffers from interacting. It may be too tight of a tolerance, but that may work.

  • @SunnySidhu_TinyTauTsss
    @SunnySidhu_TinyTauTsss 4 роки тому +1

    Meanwhile LPL and Bill making videos on yt about picking locks
    Me trying to pick a lock, Mother sees me doing something with a lock which is locking nothing. Flying shoe coming towards my face. 😂

  • @coladict
    @coladict 4 роки тому +1

    Does this wafer and ball-bearing alternative to regular pins make it more durable, like that large prison lock you showed us in 919?

  • @DrSid42
    @DrSid42 6 років тому +22

    Uh .. no indent on outside ? Can't it be simply shimmed ?

    • @tomhejda6450
      @tomhejda6450 6 років тому +7

      I believe the core housing is "closed" from the front; that's why you can't gut it through the front and that's also preventing shimming.

  • @lukd
    @lukd 4 роки тому

    Not sure why UA-cam recommended me this 1-year-old video today... but I have to say TOKOZ 300-series are not being marketed as 100% resistant (at least not in Czech Republic where they are being made). However they have the PRO 400-series which ARE being marketed as 100% resistant to lockpicking...

  • @Argosh
    @Argosh 5 років тому +2

    Is there a video where you explain all the terms you use?

  • @hssnov
    @hssnov 6 років тому

    Very nice explanation i like this one much. Can you give us a brief about your picking history and how did you start this skill.. thank you

  • @TS_Mind_Swept
    @TS_Mind_Swept Рік тому

    It would appear that flatter is not better, unfortunately; but hey, trying something new, I respect it

  • @martinnystrom7914
    @martinnystrom7914 4 роки тому +1

    I wonder, sins you take it apart ”in revers”, is it open for shimming?

  • @RAkers-tu1ey
    @RAkers-tu1ey 6 років тому +1

    do you think a relatively minor change in tolerances would greatly increase security?

  • @deerejohn7209
    @deerejohn7209 3 роки тому

    yay, longest LPL video not involving tape
    also not sure how I feel about a Lawyer that can pick locks

  • @crackrazor187
    @crackrazor187 5 років тому +1

    Nice pick job LPL. As always, I enjoy watching your videos. I was just wondering if these kinds of locks can be picked with an EPG?

  • @michalmarek2028
    @michalmarek2028 4 роки тому

    Hey @LockPickingLawyer have you also tried the flagship model of Tokoz? The Tokoz 400 PRO lock? Should be way better than this one and I could not find any mention about someone lockpicking it.

  • @bird718
    @bird718 6 років тому +3

    do you think that the wafer ball bearing design is better than security pins?

    • @lockpickinglawyer
      @lockpickinglawyer  6 років тому +4

      No

    • @buggsy5
      @buggsy5 5 років тому

      @@lockpickinglawyer I agree. I feel that the design is less secure. The difficulty on this lock was due to the extreme bitting.

  • @LanceRyley
    @LanceRyley 4 роки тому +3

    0:50 - "I will certainly take this apart to show you what's inside toward the end of the video." 01:40 - actually starts picking the unpickable lock. That's not arrogance, that is supreme confidence.

    • @JasonZakrajsek
      @JasonZakrajsek 3 роки тому +1

      Except he’s picked it before making the video, so it’s not just him saying “yeah I’ll take it apart” without knowing that he’ll actually get to that point. He already knows he can pick it.

  • @TheGeezzer
    @TheGeezzer 5 років тому

    Where experts fail...LPL steps in! 😮💨💯

  • @aettic
    @aettic Рік тому

    Wow, that bitting is extremely aggressive.

  • @TCGProductions03
    @TCGProductions03 6 років тому +38

    Pin 4: Cant touch this doo doo doo doo do do do do

  • @reedleatherware
    @reedleatherware 2 роки тому +2

    You pick all these European locks upsidedown. If it was in a door you would have to pick the other way. How come you dont practice both directions?

  • @JackdeDuCoeur
    @JackdeDuCoeur 6 років тому

    As always, nice work. (Wish I were so dexterous.)

  • @Reapsin
    @Reapsin 5 років тому

    Do the bearings make it more difficult to manipulate the wafers? Are they free rolling whilst assembled?

  • @dman1456
    @dman1456 4 роки тому

    The only thing that will ever be pick proof is a keyway that has been welded shut.

  • @davidstowe5652
    @davidstowe5652 4 роки тому

    Great job and good luck

  • @321981jdm
    @321981jdm 5 років тому

    Maybe a stupid question
    But since the cylinder exits the housing from front to back, instead of back through the front. Have you tried shimming the lock?

  • @boybilbo81
    @boybilbo81 6 років тому

    Interesting lock there. Thanks for showing it. 👍 🔐

  • @adamackels73
    @adamackels73 6 років тому +1

    Is this what we get when a Kwikset Smart key cylinder (missing it's sidebar) mates with a wafer lock?

  •  4 роки тому

    Hi, Tokoz is from my country :-) Czech republic. Have You tested Padlocks Gamma 70 CS and Golem 70 ? There are disk cillinders and some special security profile in Gamma

  • @niagra898
    @niagra898 6 років тому +5

    Does LPL have his own naughty bucket ?

    • @lockpickinglawyer
      @lockpickinglawyer  6 років тому +10

      Yes. It’s big and heavy!

    • @niagra898
      @niagra898 6 років тому

      LockPickingLawyer Whoa the man himself! Thanks foe responding LPL,have a great weekend 😀

    • @StefanPettersson
      @StefanPettersson 6 років тому +5

      LockPickingLawyer, ok. But do you have locks in it?

  • @bladactania
    @bladactania 4 роки тому

    Technically speaking, "100% protection against picking" doesn't mean 100% pick proof, it just means it's the maximum amount of protection against picking that is possible.

  • @robertwest3093
    @robertwest3093 Рік тому

    That kind of bitting will keep the amateurs out.

  • @donnierobertson3088
    @donnierobertson3088 3 роки тому

    Great job and video like always

  • @melomidi
    @melomidi 5 років тому +3

    "okay we hit 4 and dropped into a false set"
    you mean you hit pin 4 and fell down the stairs smashing a vase and killing a cat along the way into a false set
    every other click to me was so quiet I didn't hear it and then this false set comes out of nowhere and it's loud enough to unlock all of the doors in a postal code radius of your home

  • @toastycarpet9873
    @toastycarpet9873 6 років тому +1

    Awesome video

  • @shamimhasnath
    @shamimhasnath 4 роки тому

    This looked fairly easy for LPL. I’m curious why Bill couldn’t pick it!

  • @ariesmars29
    @ariesmars29 6 років тому +2

    I have to ask you something, do you read from a script because when speak on a video it's perfect every time and it's the same depending on the video.

  • @trevort4286
    @trevort4286 6 років тому +1

    How long have you been picking locks and wow I love that lock it's so different

  • @puirYorick
    @puirYorick 5 років тому +1

    What style of lock was that? I'm guessing it goes into a cabinet door or something.
    I can tell you defeated it obviously but I can't picture what it's meant to protect.

    • @jestestuman
      @jestestuman 4 роки тому +1

      Europrofile is standard type lock for doors in Europe - both out and inside.

  • @DirtyRobot
    @DirtyRobot 6 років тому

    Bill has another one for you LPL.

  • @Matteus733
    @Matteus733 5 років тому

    Can’t be picked LPL - hold my beer

  • @mitchvaniderstine7059
    @mitchvaniderstine7059 3 роки тому

    What are these locks actually used for? Sorry for the ignorant quesfion

  • @DaddyKratosOfTheShire
    @DaddyKratosOfTheShire 3 роки тому

    Let's get some tension here and done

  • @Darth_Chicken
    @Darth_Chicken 3 роки тому

    The lock is being picked upside down to how it is used in the door. Surly that makes some difference in picking it?!?

  • @ashlyy1341
    @ashlyy1341 2 роки тому

    does the US really insert its keys w/ the bitting pointing upwards ?