How the PROS add DEPTH to their Recordings (and you can too)
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- Опубліковано 3 вер 2023
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Share this with a friend in need of some depth!
I always hate saying this but.. yep.."Back in the day" everything we recorded had multiple sources or mics on it. Guitar cabinets, acoustic guitars, pianos, etc would always have 2 or 3 mics. I do think as people moved into their bedrooms to record over the last 20 or so years, inputs became scarce and these pro techniques began to disappear as it all became DIY. I'm glad to see the return of consoles, knobs, and button pushing and all the quality that brings. Very happy to see folks digging into the art, sciences and craft of sound engineering. As always. I enjoyed this video very much. Thanks for sharing and keep 'em coming. Also.. wanted to share this great example of doing these techniques on drums.. ua-cam.com/video/jqVnl0kyPCI/v-deo.html
Thanks for the demo. I play a lot of acoustic guitar and you sold me on using stereo! Thanks.
Peace from SF
warm audio is killing it. dope video
The result is great !!! Thank you
Wow, this one was very helpful. Thanks! Will try this out... Cheers!
Love this! Super useful information and demonstration. Gonna have to get a room mic for my guitar setup.
Love these studio vids!
It really completes the picture for the guitar sound compared to just the close mic on the amp.
Great video! This video has a ton of excellent and useful information. Thanks!
Thank you so much for this video. This is super helpful and such a simple fix to get a depth of sound that I have been trying to get out of one mic. When I heard the guitars that’s when the “Aha” moment happened! Gonna make this a standard in my studio. Thank again!
Hi Andrew. Sounds great! I have some ideas about adding depth from watching the same Bruce Swedien video just recently! So great of you to make an awesome video on it. I think the way Bruce adds depth to keys is really cool. Adding depth to single vocal and choir is really cool too. It's all cool! More videos on these techniques would be greatly appreciated. It's a really good creative energy.
stereo pair on acoustic sounds night and day, as well as the electric. what that mic 10 ft out picks up from the room just adds that extra cloud underneath that the close mic sits so nicely on top of. really can tell the difference. nice vid!
Awesome! 🔥
Wiiiide man! Man it sounds great on the guitars! How do you pan the mics for the electric guitars?
Awesome tip! I was getting a bit frustrated with things sounding kinda “flat” (probably from my own mistakes tbh), will have to give this a try. Thanks!
Makes a big difference in the mix!
That was excellent! Thank you!
Glad it was helpful!
❤ love using Stereo mic’s,with roommics,great vids as usual
The WA-14s are so good. I bought a pair last year and they’re my go-to overheads now. I finally get the cymbal brightness and attack I’ve been looking for without getting strident. Glad to see they’re offering matched pairs now, but the unmatched pair I have are close enough for jazz.
I really like to use my Sphere L22 to capture as much as possible in stereo, its awesome! Thanks for the video
Amazing video!
WA-44 there hiding in plain sight, LOL. Warm is doing a bang up job with these products!
Great video, my friend!
Hi.
I Wonder if I had to remove the rooms tracks so that it's in phase with rest of the mics or leave the decay between the mics...?
Sorry about my english! I'm french...😬
AWESOME!
Thanks!
@Andrewmasters How do you like the SM7 on the hi hats?
In your gtr amp example, is there a minimum distance for the room mic in order to avoid potentially significant phase issues -ie would this work in a small recording space where it can only go back say 2-3 metres?
Sounds awesome! I do like the sound of the stereo.
Hey nice channel!
Thank you! lol @@AndrewMasters
Your drum kit sounds amazing. I own a Warm audio WA 14. Use it on sax with a WA 12 mic pre. Love it!!
Thanks!
That d18 sounds soooo good
Hi….I love the idea of a room mic plus close mic for guitar cab. How does one adjust for phase cancellations ? Any tips.?
Come on Andrew! Where'm I supposed to get the heaps of cash for all this gear?! haha! 🤣 🤣 🤣 You're right though, stereo all the way... Dang ☘💪🏽👀👍🏽☘
A shootout between the Warm pair vs your AKG c414 pair would be great!
Awesome! I stumbled upon your channel a couple of weeks ago and have really been enjoying it. I am a bit of a "Warm Audio Geek", I love their stuff and have quite a bit of it in my home studio. I really like the depth that was captured using these techniques. Looks like I have some "testing" to do. Are you hard panning them in the mix?
The overheads yes but the acoustic and electric vary
hey man that was great! but may I know how did you compensate or avoid with phas cancellation when tracing in stereo ?
Hmm maybe I’ll do a video on this
Nice video!
👍
A couple of things have to be said, though:
-there are definitely instances in which mono/single mic-ing is beneficial, and depth can most certainly be achieved with it, too (panning, reverb, distance from source, etc)
-today's music and productions have changed a lot since the tape era of/from which the great B.Swedien speaks, so in an often crowded and even overcrowded typical production of today, stereo mic-ing everything might not be a good idea
-that stereo mic technique with 2 fig-8/bidirectional mics you use for your room mics is called BLUMLEIN - credit where it's due, it was invented by the genius of Alan Blumlein, practically the father of stereo, and also the inventor of the M/S mic technique.
BTW for your room mics, try placing them lower, to avoid so much brightness & cymbals in them and capture more of the kick drum and under-toms sound, and, if you have someone play the drums and someone else move them just inches closer or further from that wall while you listen on headphones in another room, you'll find a position in which the boundary effect makes the low end content kinda multiply, giving your drum room a nice phatt boost right were you'll certainly like it.
😉
Cheers & Peace,
AF
I must have been unclear in the video, but I certainly was not trying to make the point - only use stereo miking on everything always. My point here is I've gotten into a habit of doing some things one way. Bruce mentioning take some time and get a stereo placement on some sources to add depth, inspired me, and maybe it'd inspire you too.
Of course Bruce knew that mono miking sources, distance and panning achieve depth as well lol. 30 seconds after he talks about stereo he mentions the same thing about mono, and how some things should absolutely be done in mono.
Room mics down low is a fantastic move. I learned that one about 10 years ago from Doug Mckean. Another great way is baffling the kit and putting the room mics on the floor in omni on the opposite side of the baffle the drums are on, and hitting them with some compression.
@@AndrewMasters personally I stereo track drums, then add mono drum samples which match the drum tracking or vibe of the recording to get a better umph than a classic "mono kick drum mic". I've found that being inside of the box for certain instances has been useful.
and using that "mono kick drum mic" as a sample, instead going towards a synthesized kick drum sample for instance.
@f-unfairstudiotime, makes no sense doing all that work, idk where you are going with that. There are plugins that give you M/S effect with only two buttons. lol.
@@nickstojakovic112 No, wasn't talking about M/S processing of a stereo track, or of simulating M/S stereo - I meant the actual M/S miking technique.
That's inevitably done with 2 microphones (one in cardioid and one in fig-8 multed to 2 channels of which one with inverted polarity then blended in for width), not plugins. And that is what Alan Blumlein invented.
As for "all that work"... ehhh, some of us love doing this work!
🤭😉
You may have mentioned this and I missed it, but what are you feeding the mics into (pre-amp, mixer, interface, etc)? What are the settings on the pre-amp?
I used my Trident Preamps overheads, AEA RPQ2 Preamps on room mics, and WA273 Preamps on acoustic.
Townsend (Now UA) Sphere modeling mic is amazing for this in my opinion.
Andrew blinder of a video brilliant.
It's a great tip, but not necessarily a rule. For example, I wouldn't discount double-tracking (two separate takes in mono) as a technique for achieving width, because in a dense mix, it can sound better than stereo miking, especially on guitar. :D But a stereo setup is beautiful for solos.
True! I've always doubled everything and just stuck with it out of habbit. This just really solved my doubled electric guitars sitting in a mix recently - thought i'd share!
Great content. Pushing to experiment in the studio is a good thing! 👍🏼
Totally agree
It depends on how busy or full the mix is. Mono mic placement is also often overlooked. "Distance equals depth." Jimmy Page/Eddie Kramer
Don't be afraid to get those mics off the grill cloth. :)
Also a great technique!
really full fil sound
Killer video Wow bruce was a real genius
Mics sound great! Love all the stereo placements!
Thanks!
@@AndrewMasters Warm audio has had the WA14 out for a bit, outside of packaging them as a stereo pair is there anything new about these mics?
I watched his videos like 3 weeks ago and is was like hmmm I should start doing this it seems like no one is….. then Andrew makes this! Lol he also talks about Omni ;)
I wish there would be a SWEETWATER Music store in my country......or a Vintage King, or both....what a dream it must be to be able to ACTUALLY LISTEN to all these amazing products plus a staff that actually knows their stuff!
My name is Teddy and I have already been subscribed :D
It’s actually surprising how much difference this has made! Great video and thank you a lot for his cool tip!👏🏻
Man thought he was slick playing “The Hype” by twenty one pilots 👀
What was the Michael Jackson documentary called? I'd love to hear Bruce sweiden go into detail one of my favorite engineers of all time
Also wondering this
I love this. I'm copying that electric guitar trick for now on, so thanks! Also, was that The Hype that I hear?👀
Yes it was!
@@AndrewMasters I knew it when I heard it! And, hey, do you remember what your whole chain was for the electric track?
what kinda difference would it make on vocals or spoken word?
On a single vocal, you'll still want to rock a mono mic setup. On a choir or group of vocalists, stereo makes a huge difference.
thank you! @@AndrewMasters
Did you hard left and right ? Great episode 😎🤙
Gol darn it, Andrew! Now I gotta get off my lazy butt & stick an 87 in my tiny room to go w the m160 I put in fronta my AC15! Thanks a LOT (sarcastically 😆) Seriously, though-thank you for this awesome video!
It really makes things sound like I'm in the room. Great video! Thank you so very much!
I don't agree that you should always record stereo. I think you should use mono or stereo depending on the arrangdment of the song and always do a conscious decision of why you're doing it. Many times mono acoustic sounds better in a busy track than stereo.
haha yes, I don't think anyone's making the point that in every scenario you must use stereo. The point here as stated in the video repeatedly, is if you're like me, and you have a habit of only using a mono mic on something and you feel like it's lacking some depth or width - try some stereo techniques.
I've been looking at the WA14 for awhile. It might finally be time to get the pair!
common sense, excellent.
The Mics Sound great. Loved the guitar SP!!! I just added something different to the mix. I need to spend more time messing with placement. My Lazybone need to get with it... lol Be Safe
DUDE
That gets hard to do with busy compositions like this piece: ua-cam.com/video/4RS5RsSPssw/v-deo.html
Your mic placement for the stereo set on guitar isn’t right. Mics are too close and pointing in the same direction causing phasing issues.
It's a near coincident spaced pair. Phase is perfectly aligned.
focals to barefoot, wtf speakers do i get
Both great companies, the speaker model you pick really should depend on your room size and placement to you
@@AndrewMasters i have a big room
At the end of the day the consumer is listening to music on crappy ear buds from a crappy streaming service. Yes, stereo pairs sound better but the consumer doesn't care. This is also why ATMOS will ultimately fail to become the standard. The only people that really care about all of this are the equipment manufacturers that want to sell us more stuff.
People use phones, so quality and production don't matter. Got it.
@@AndrewMasters My point Andrew is that the consumer can't tell what microphone, preamp, compressor, EQ, or anything else that was used. All they care about is listening to a great song that elicits emotion. Don't believe me? If high quality recordings were really that important how is it that songs recorded 50 -60 years ago are still popular. They were recorded on crap equipment, but still they live on. Yes, we need quality production today but not at an extreme level. Our job as musicians is to elicit emotion with our songs. We can do that with average equipment. We do not need to mortgage our soul to buy SSL pre's, 1176s, or LA2As, or for that matter any of the other outrageously expensive equipment that is out there. What we need to do is to write great songs. That my friend is what the consumer wants.
So prove me wrong. Record a song using all of your high dollar gear. Then record the same song using a couple of under $200 mics directly into a Focusrite interface. Mix this version only using plugins that came with your DAW. Now, go out on the street and play one version of the song to 20 people using a bluetooth speaker connected to your phone. Ask them what they thought of the song. Video their responses. Now do this again with the other version of the song. 20 different people. Again record their responses.
I will bet that the responses will be similar.
This is a video on recording techniques, on a studio channel that makes content on recording and production. It’s not for the consumer, or the songwriter, it’s for the audio engineer, the student, the people who are interested in learning and developing their skills who record the people who write the songs. Most people who are engineers and producers are aware the song is the most important part, yet we want our skills to be able to elevate the songs as much as possible at every level. Artists also want the production and engineering team to be the best, so their song has all the advantages. If you disagree then that’s fine. You’re welcome to keep coming back to the video and commenting :)
@@AndrewMasters I understand what you are saying. BTW, I enjoy your channel and the information that you give out. All that I am saying is that to me we are doing a dis-service to the kid sitting in his bedroom trying to record his song and giving up because he can't afford the equipment that the pro studios have. You see Andrew, I was that kid many, many years ago. Recording musicians on a four track cassette. I couldn't afford pro gear and the people that I recorded couldn't afford to pay for that pro quality studio anyway. So, I gave up. In my head I put myself down because I didn't have the right equipment or the right room. Years later I found out that those recordings had quite a following. You see, the end listener didn't care that those tapes were not "Pro Quality" all that they cared about was the music.
So keep doing what you're doing. I especially enjoy the studio tours. Just keep in mind that many people can't afford the high dollar equipment that you have. They are sitting in their bedroom trying to produce music with a demo copy of a DAW and some used instruments. Give those people some tips and tricks to.
Thanks. If not being able to afford high end gear when you were a kid made you give up, then you weren't that into it or there was something else going on. That's unfortunate you gave up for that reason. I know when I was a teenager I would do literally whatever I could to make it happen. I was literally obsessed and didn't care about anything else. I gave up all my friends and family and moved to the other side of the country with no support system for a chance to intern somewhere. It paid off, I got a job starting by cleaning toilets and stocking studio supplies then a year later worked my way up to a staff engineer and worked with clients like John Legend, Dawes, Jim James, Ghost, Weezer, Muse, Richie Sambora, Justin Timberlake, Jason Mraz. I got to learn from producers and engineers who had literally been doing it for 5-6 decades. Now I want to share some of what I learned.
This content is for those people. A large amount of people who watch my videos are working professionals in studios. Some are semi-professionals who have other high paying careers and want to learn more about technique and gear so they have a better idea what they should get. Some are obsessed teenagers who just want to know how to make their recordings sound the way they want. At the end of the day - as the person who come up with the ideas, spends the money on the videos, and does all of the work, I make the video the way I think gives the most value and makes the best video. Never in a video have I said you can't get a great recording with out the gear I'm using. I use the gear that I like, and want to share it because I like it.