No interest in this one based on early reviews. The game mechanics appear to be broken, with way too much narrative based game play. It sounds like the rule system is unfinished and that this is not a true RPG. Additionally, I'm not interested in it based on being hit over the head with a woke hammer throughout the book.
We let me be "brutally honest" too. As someone who struggles with a severe mental illness i have zero problem with "gamifying insanity". My illness is a disability. I would much rather not have it. It doesn't make me less "valid", but It is in no way part of my identity. People are allowed to role play whatever they want, including people with disabilities, and if role playing games want to simulate that with game mechanics, it is entirely fine. I feel much more at peace not interiorizing my disability and recognizing it for what is: an obstacle. Why would i be offended at people who what to role play that struggle? Its completely fine.
I can't really take it seriously when there's a "we don't roleplay madness because trauma and mental illness aren't gameplay" section while accounting for physical disabilities as gameplay... kinda yikes design decision for me
Reading into it, Candela Obscura feels a lot like a $40 piece of CR merch for people less concerned with tabletop roleplaying and more concerned about feeling like they're VOs making an actual play. Some elements of the story and setting are pretty interesting, but I think the actual system is barebones to a fault. Yes, I understand it's meant to be oriented toward shorters sessions, but systems like Mork Borg's apocalyptic seals accomplish this without sacrificing basic mechanics or being too overly-complicated. Coming across a couple of pages talking about what should and shouldn't be done in horror and roleplaying was kind of just an eye-roll on top of the disappointment.
It's a rule book telling you what you're not allowed to do like an obnoxious SJW step mother, and leaving out any form of actual combat rules that would make it a game. It's not really even a game, it's just an abstract set of condescending morals.
My main issue is that the game doesnt actually have any horror mechanics. Theres nothing it does thst Vaesen can't do better as a narrative driven horror game.
To be fair, they've always stated that the intention for Candela and the Illuminated Worlds system was that it be used for short story arcs. It wasn't ever designed to be used to run long campaigns. That's what their upcoming Daggerheart system is for.
Yep, we don't think there is anything wrong with it, just wanted to let people know about it in case they had plans on sweeping, month longs faireland campaigns!
@TheCharacterSheet that's a game I've played since it's release. I do like narrative games. Vtm v5 genesys and l5r are all systems that can achieve some really good narrative games too
But would you be able to use the Daggerheart system for a long-term Candela campaign? I don't like being limited to short story arcs, and am not particularly fond of PbtA-type systems. The setting looks awesome. I may run it in something else.
Candela Obscura: A game less about the thrill of playing it and more selling you the feeling that you and your group of friends are famous celebrities making an actual play
Yea, this along with the World of Darkness products out now make it seem like modern horror rpgs, don't even like themselves. Horror can't be without discomfort, and gods forbid someone be uncomfortable.
My biggest issue with this game is that it feels like it was 100% built around woke ideology and its a vehicle to push that ideology. It doesn't feel like a game meant for everyone. Think of it like this. Bible school type games tend to be oriented around Christian or Catholic and other types of religious ideas. Those kinds of games run the players through biblical and moral challenges and rewards. Candela Obscura comes off more as a Woke cultist version of a bible school game. And the players are introduced to tons of Woke terms and ideology disguised as a role playing game. Everything is "Inclusive" and a "collaboration". And it tries to be as unoffensive to everyone that it ends up being pretty offensive. I always knew the cast of CR was heavily into Twitter and the Woke stuff. But thing's were kinda held in check during campaign 2. Campaign 3 however they just came out and said F it were woke AF. Candela Obscura is just a direct reflection of this. If anyone has been truly paying attention to the world lately. Woke crap is bombing hard. And has been bombing hard for more than a couple years. This game just reeks of it. CR will still be fine. They have their dedicated fan base toxic though they are. But if they keep making stuff like this. I can't see a successful road map for them. And that's a shame considering how actually talented Mat Mercer is. I feel like in a different cultural situation he would be a lot bigger name.
As a committed progressive but one old enough to see the dangers of the woke-or-die mindset, I agree. It's one thing for the system to say something along the lines of "The Fairelands is an idyllic setting in which racism, sexism, etc. doesn't exist" (5e takes this position), but it's quite another to tell people they shouldn't play the game if their table wants the world to feature those things (because maybe we like to fight against racism in our make-believe time?). It's not like other systems have built-in discrimination rules or that the world of Blades (which, sidenote, they should have full-throatedly declared CO is a mod of, rather than "inspired by") is rife with it. I've been looking for a stripped-down version of Blades with a little less grit (we have tweens at our table), so I'm going to check out illuminated worlds at least.
This is not a brutally honest review … as every unbiased review calls this what it is “terrible” It doesn’t matter what the marketing says, which you have gleefully repeated, it’s simply a pretty book very poorly written. It’s isn’t about “humanity in horror” is a time of advice about how not to scare the “precious” players in a horror game. If you need trigger rules you can’t play horror - it is absolutely the main genre that needs immersion to work. But the biggest issue with CO is it’s obtuse and difficult to read. Character creation is a train wreck, banding the perfectly styled Playbooks (one of the great contribution in blades) for 1980s styled multi page rules. This should have been a critical review, not a critical role apology 1/10
From everything I’ve seen reviewing the system, it really seems like they’re too scared to dive into the meat of what cosmic horror’s about and it leads to a somewhat bare bones system for both the player and GM. Such a shame since the whole scar mechanic is actually pretty interesting to me, as well as the idea that your previous characters can become light keepers after acquiring so many scars.
You've framed your comments about this being a system for shorter campaigns as a criticism (whether that was the intention I'm not sure, but it reads that way) which is a little redundant, considering they have always said that this was meant for short arcs, and have showcased it that way with the liveplay episodes. Calling it "simplistic" because of this feels a little unfair. Also, the whole point of the game is that it's narrative driven, so the character classes having narrative differences rather than strongly mechanical ones would be what I would expect from a system like this? A weird take honestly, comparing apples to oranges and then being disappointed they aren't pears.
We don't want to conflate those 2 things, so if we did that's our bad. It being aimed at shorter campaigns isn't a negative, just a potential sticking point for some players who may not have seen the full press for the game. As for the rules, we do think they may be every so slightly too streamlined for some players, but as mentioned this is a narrative heavy rpg, so a lighter rule set just leans into that strength, it's just another thing that may not be to everyone's tastse. The fact that those were our only potential sticking points should show you how good the game is!
didn't they literally announce it as intended for shorter campaigns? And that Daggerheart was the more in depth system for long games and character growth? I see no problem with this being for shorter campaigns.
We have no problem with it being for shorter campaigns. But A) that was more about illuminated worlds in general and not Candela in particular as Spenser mentioned in our interview he preferred a 10-12ish session campaign length and B) it was just being reiterated because not everyone who watches this channel is up to speed on an announcement made not directly about this system 5 months ago in a state of the press video
@@TheCharacterSheet the video sounded like a discovery, rather than a reminder, evidenced by the number of people who have echoed this sentiment. Well, given Candela uses Illuminated Worlds, it still fits. Even 12 sessions is a short campaign by CR standards, and the circle progression would stretch for about that, so I think that’s all fine.
I just wrapped around my head on Blades in the Dark recently, and honestly? It did not took long for me to realize that Candela looks nothing like Blades in the Dark. Internet was just being a dick again.
@@yiklongtay6029 I could share what they have in common. Its only the philosophy of the dice roll - which the fundamentals comes from PbtA games. 6: full success, 4-5 mixed success, 1-3 failure. And the fact that you can resist consequences from your own rolls. But they are handed completly differently. Everything is handed completly differently.
To me, Candela Obscura feels like the 'murder mystery party' of TTRPGs. The way that they have demonstrated how the game works by dressing up nicely and having a few short sessions with essentially 'one shot' type characters gives me the vibe of this being the 'birthday' or event game, and not so much something i woukd add to a regular schedule of gaming sessions. Friends getting together, dressing up and having a good time embodying the characters sounds like a lot of fun, as someone who enjoys getting suited up for MM parties.
@anthonytoohey1164 me loving the cast talking through all their concepts and the trauma built into their backstories is probably the same reason I have like 30+ characters on the Backburner that I might never play xD
Hi, not sure where the image at 1:41 came from but the tarot cards in it are the work of Amrit Brar who illustrated the Marigold Tarot deck, just wanted to comment because I couldn't find where that image came from and wanted to make sure it was properly credited here, at least :)
Side note. The game CAN be long form as a series of smaller stories. Why could it not? Players would just move from case to case. They don't have to be connected but they are in that they all deal with shenanigans between olde and near faire. I find this review to be nonsense.
I find your criticisms of the short form focus of the game strange, as It isnt in anyway designed for longterm play, which was very clear in their marketing. The criticism that its too light to be used as long form, doesnt work when its not designed to meet that niche at all. It is a game specifically made for short form play. If you prefer longform thats one thing, but it seems a tad bit unfair to criticize something for not functioning in a space it wasnt made for especially when you and much of the audience watchin this content is aware of Daggerheart . There hasn't been any mixed messaging with it either. I agree with most of what you said outside of that, in terms of the beauty of the lore and I actually enjoy how easy it is to jump in and learn the system.
So, in our interviews with Spenser and Rowan, which are up on the channel, they mentioned that it was also built towards longer campaigns as well, and it wasn't so much a concern as it was an observation that after fully digesting the rules, while we love it for shorter campaigns, it may simply lack the variety for a longer campaign, which may not be apparent based on the marketing of the game so far, that's all!
I think what was meant when they said that it could be used for longer forms of play was that the rpg's baseline mechanics and themes gave room for very effective extensions of the lore and story beats, which would naturally allow for more than 3 or 4 sessions, If a GM wanted to homebrew further. Especially with the connective tissue of the varying factions both within and outside of Newfaire and the ever rotating stats of the players when they take a scar. Because of its heavy roleplay, lore and character focus, it allows for a cinematic style of play that can capture both the fast-paced and slow burn elements without excessive restriction. One of the major factors as well comes from how very easily players can die, since they aren't superpowered action heroes like in dnd. This also heavily affects how a long form game in this type of setting would work. So personally i think the idea of lacking complexity for this style of game is negated by the way the game is designed to be played. @@TheCharacterSheet
@@futurexsoul828 If something has to be homebrewed to allow for more than 3 or 4 sessions, that means it's really bad for long form play, which is good to point out if the writers said in interviews that it was built towards longer campaigns. Even in your unnecessarily long comment above you start talking about how wonderful it would be in long form play, right after your comment saying that it was never intended for long form play and shouldn't be criticized for failing to handle it well.
the writers specifically said it was meant for short term play. thats why I have an issue with that aspect of the criticism. There is even an official video and many separate interviews online and even with this very team, that has them saying that candela is meant for short term play. and so it was designed to be episodic and not run beyond more than 3 sessions. If something is designed for short term play, it doesnt make sense to try and criticize its design for not working with long form when the product was not at all built to facilitate that. it is not a weakness to have a very specific focus and they were clear about that in their marketing. If a player enjoys the it enough to try and homebrew something to allow for long term play, that is their choice, but it doesnt have anything to do with the designers. People can play how they want to, and have their own views, but criticism within reason , inclusive of context for a products purpose and its market is far more productive .@@Uccisore28
I GM'ed a one shot Wendigo hunt for 3 friends. We had fun enough but it wasn't the most incredible game. Granted that was before the core rulebook came out. Definitely want to play again at some point.
For me, I actually did not love Blades in the Dark because of the disconnect between the narrative heists and the weirdly crunchy advancement system. Why are we fiddling with pluses and minuses on reputation with other gangs, and then using a completely narrative arc for the heist? So, I feel like candela is actually answering that concern. Go narrative, recognize that narratives don't fit well with long term crunchy play, and move on.
2 years into a DnD campaign and I am totally open to a game built for shorter campaign arcs. I picked up the core rulebook on launch day and I'm intrigued to play Candela Obscura with my regular rpg party. My main hope is that it encourages more people to try Powered By the Apocalypse style games. That being said, I think the criticism that the character options are not mechanically super different is a fair one.
If you like shorter campaign arcs, Candela Obscura is definitely a must try. And as we said, even if you do want something longerform, a good GM can do that in the Candela System as well
I just finished watching the 1st episode, and it really made me want to play. I’ve never played a TTRPG, mostly because it seemed really complicated and I was a bit intimidated. However, this game seemed like a good way to enter TTRPGs. Plus I like that it’s a relatively short story. It felt like I could try out different characters, and learn how to really develop my narrative abilities.
I picked up a copy of EZD6, because it is rules light and has lots of good reviews. I am using it to put together a short fantasy game for my three grandkids, ages 8, 9, and 10. They have their characters made and are excited about playing. I will get Candela Obscura for adult family and friends.
I have tried for months to research and run a game since I got the book. I personally have a very hard time with describing areas in this game because of the limited descriptors given in the book. While there are a lot of them, they are compact and not as thorough as they could be. Using the phrases 'art deco' and the like don't really click with me or my players. I feel like it's lacking in content and is really only good for short games with players that don't mind talking instead of rolling.
So your complaints are: 1) it's a BotD rip off - John Harper approves of it AND the co-Designer was a designer on BotD 2) it can't handle long campaigns. - that was an intentional design goal, they have talked about this multiple times. What a weird review...did you research the game?
Lol they only even mentioned BITD after their initial materials failed to mention it at all, and a bunch of people called them out on it. The perennial worry with CR is it smothering everything else in the space. DND already does this, so them cribbing another system (with the creators blessing or otherwise) pushes fears and resentment toward this "New" system just sucking up the rest of the space in the hobby and contributing more to choking out original designers and developers. I saw a discussion in discord with the creator of The Wildsea and he flat out said they would have made 5x as much money if Wildsea had just been a 5e supplement, but that would have been a tremendous loss if that had happened for the hobby in terms of narrative and mechanical design. Sure you don't have any obligation to care about that. But a lot of us do, and we are seeing it justified more and more.
1) just because John Harper nods approvingly and everything is legal doesn't reduce the fact that both games exist and one has pretty much everything the other has and more, or that CO still lacks any FitD dress 2) otoh the marketing and review were both pretty consistent, but otoh i think it's valid to say "this game is episodic, but the episodes might be too similar, leading to not getting a long season"
A question I have, will there be interesting ways you will be able to combine mechanical aspects of future Illuminated Worlds games with each other to expand what's possible? (Like, if they make a Noir game and a Fantasy game, could you combine them to create "Columbo with Elves and Orcs"? For example)
As someone who enjoys more mechanically minded system and play in thkse types ofynygroui thus feels like a system to come nick to in a year or two and see how it's inproved
If you are a big fan of chunky, crunchy rulesets, Candela Obscura may never be your cup of tea. It's way more narrative focused. But the good news is Pathfinder 2 remastered may have the heft you are looking for!
You did mention how will it be able to be adapted to other genres...I myself is not a fan of the horror genre. So, after the first chapter...I skipped the rest of the showings. I do believe they said in the beginning it was for a short campaign as a one off or such. To me it comes down to the game system and how it fits with other styles.
@@TheCharacterSheet I think the train scene at the beginning of chapter 2 was there to show us it could indeed do other settings. That first scene was more like something out of Indiana Jones rather than horror. If you want an example of the rules in a non-horror setting I'd recommend watching the first 30-40 mins of the first episode of chapter 2.
I'm hoping to run a sort of monster of the week type game with this. No real overarching narrative but maybe a serialized game where the characters don't really grow any stronger but do change over time and face a different threat every couple of sessions.
PCs will get mechanically stronger, unless you ditch XP/illumination via house rule. Each level-up (a Circle can get 5) lets you increase actions or your drive, in addition to picking up cool new abilities.
@@Greymorn True but it's not the same power creep as say DnD where you go from exterminating rats in a basement to punching god in the face. I'd like it to be more like early Supernatural where they may get a nice boon now and then but the monsters they face in the early days are just as deadly in the later ones. Keep in mind I'm talking about early Supernatural and not the later seasons where they're literally punching god in the face.
Can you please make an emergency video reviewing the rules for the TMNT game? I know that the main rules will be the same as the original game but I have found no one that is as honest and clear with their reviews as you. We got about 2 weeks left of the Kickstarter campaign and I don't want to buy something I'm not going to use.
The ingame setting looks familiar to Arcanum. Except this is apparently a horror. Sounds interesting. I'm too lazy to play table top on a frequent manner. So I'll keep an eye out for a crpg from Candela Obscura. I mean, the setting sounds pretty cool, and it being a horror, damn I need to try it
So they go out of their way to emphasize the system is made for short campaign arcs, from the pre-release announcements to the structure of their actual play episodes, and one of your main criticisms is that it only seems good for short campaign arcs? Really sharp, fellas 🙄🙄🙄
We are reviewing this for people that may not have seen the 1 video 5 months ago about a system with a different name that is where that statment is based on :D
Plus we have an actual interview on this very channel where the game designer mentions he thinks the sweet spot is around a 12 session campaign, so clearly even the game designers aren't fully on board with that old marketing pitch!
@@TheCharacterSheet I guess if you said “this system is designed for short arcs/campaigns” rather than “the problem with this system is it only works for short campaigns.” I just find it disingenuous I guess. Cheers.
Very nice book. It won't replace call of cthulhu for my group (we usually want a little more crunch than candela offers), but it's a nice option for an rpg to rotate to when you need a break from your main rpg.
Honestly, that could actually work. The setting itself is the greatest creation in that entire work. The ruleset is clean and elegant, but possibly a bit too simple for some people's tastes, but the world building is S-tier
I'm the substitute DM for the two groups I play in regularly, and I would have killed to have Candela Obscura when one of my DMs took a break to prepare for his second kid's arrival earlier this year. I love the system for the shorter format it's designed for; and I plan to use it as a stopgap/change-up between the longer DND campaigns my friends put on for me.
Your video addresses the shorter campaigns and thinner character development as if it's a surprise and a shortfall. But that's been the intention and message from Critical Role since it's announcement about illuminated worlds, and it mentions that throughout the book. I don't think the video fairly presents that side in your criticisms.
People considering buying this game should know if the system falls apart for longer games. Just because the writers get out in front of it and announce 'this isn't for longer games!!" doesn't make that an unfair criticism.
@@Uccisore28 yeah, but my criticism is about the way he addressed it, and like it was a surprise and he was just figuring this out. Even when the creators have made several posts about it being geared toward shorter story arc games. Pretty sure this channel even made content before that acknowledged that the game is meant for shorter games, but now he's saying "apparently" "it seems like" and language that says that the game isn't exactly as it was advertised.
Stras Acimovic literally helped write Blades in the Dark, and went on to write Scum & Villainy (Blades in space) and Band of Blades (Blades in Warhammer I guess). He has said many times how much he loves the game system, so it shouldn't be a surprise that Illuminated Worlds is like Blades. Why does no one bring this up? Seriously, Darrington Press should have lead with that so Blades fans could immediately rally behind another Stras game, instead of making it seem like Spenser wrote the whole thing.
I think you guys need to learn my about this TTRPG hobby you claim to know... Remember when you did that whole thing about how CO was going to be the Call of Cthulhu toppler? Are your examples of Horror TTRPG's were CoC and Revenloft? No mention of Kult Divinty Lost, End of the World, Dread, Candles, Watchtower, etc... no, no, Just Call of Cthulhu. I cant tell if your maliciously curating your audiance to a select group of TTPGs, or if your just sheeple with no experience in this hobby, latching onto the fad...
CR: Promotes game as a short campaign ruleset. Does 3 session live-plays to show what they mean. Character Sheet: Hm. I wonder why this feels light on long term advancement. It must be bad. You had me with the other points but this one was just plain stupid
Depends what you mean by a "short campaign". I have already finished a 12 session campaign which could have gone another 1-3 sessions if not for the impending holidays, so we wrapped it up. If anything, the advancement system might be tuned too far in the other direction: the max length of a campaign is 20 "assignments" which in practical terms means 30-40 sessions. Narrative arcs in a storytelling game like Candella typically wrap up sooner than that. Candella is also great for one-shots and convention play.
I love that it's designed for short form play. My players have busy schedules and it's hard to get together to play anything. One lives in another state. Short form games are better for us and this is perfect.
The whole negative- this won’t last for year long campaigns The game- this is meant for 3-5 session shot campaigns Seems like you are deliberately ignoring what the game is made for to shit all over it for something it’s not doing. Like you may as well have said “ this game doesn’t do cyberpunk 3/10”.
So, does Candela Obscura's Core Rulebook get a slot on your bookshelf? Let us know in the comments!
No interest in this one based on early reviews. The game mechanics appear to be broken, with way too much narrative based game play. It sounds like the rule system is unfinished and that this is not a true RPG. Additionally, I'm not interested in it based on being hit over the head with a woke hammer throughout the book.
We let me be "brutally honest" too. As someone who struggles with a severe mental illness i have zero problem with "gamifying insanity". My illness is a disability. I would much rather not have it. It doesn't make me less "valid", but It is in no way part of my identity. People are allowed to role play whatever they want, including people with disabilities, and if role playing games want to simulate that with game mechanics, it is entirely fine. I feel much more at peace not interiorizing my disability and recognizing it for what is: an obstacle. Why would i be offended at people who what to role play that struggle? Its completely fine.
Totally agree.
Well done 👏 great saying!
I can't really take it seriously when there's a "we don't roleplay madness because trauma and mental illness aren't gameplay" section while accounting for physical disabilities as gameplay... kinda yikes design decision for me
Reading into it, Candela Obscura feels a lot like a $40 piece of CR merch for people less concerned with tabletop roleplaying and more concerned about feeling like they're VOs making an actual play. Some elements of the story and setting are pretty interesting, but I think the actual system is barebones to a fault. Yes, I understand it's meant to be oriented toward shorters sessions, but systems like Mork Borg's apocalyptic seals accomplish this without sacrificing basic mechanics or being too overly-complicated. Coming across a couple of pages talking about what should and shouldn't be done in horror and roleplaying was kind of just an eye-roll on top of the disappointment.
You crit role fans are crazy
I see no reason to buy or play Candela Obscura when I have Vaesen.
It’s not like they’re the same thing? If you want to play that, then play that.
It's a rule book telling you what you're not allowed to do like an obnoxious SJW step mother, and leaving out any form of actual combat rules that would make it a game. It's not really even a game, it's just an abstract set of condescending morals.
My main issue is that the game doesnt actually have any horror mechanics. Theres nothing it does thst Vaesen can't do better as a narrative driven horror game.
To be fair, they've always stated that the intention for Candela and the Illuminated Worlds system was that it be used for short story arcs. It wasn't ever designed to be used to run long campaigns. That's what their upcoming Daggerheart system is for.
Yep, we don't think there is anything wrong with it, just wanted to let people know about it in case they had plans on sweeping, month longs faireland campaigns!
@TheCharacterSheet that's a game I've played since it's release.
I do like narrative games. Vtm v5 genesys and l5r are all systems that can achieve some really good narrative games too
@@TheCharacterSheetthat is definitely not how you approach it in the video. It's portrayed as a negative and in your words, lacking.
@@spooderous
Exactly!
This review doesn't, at any point, say it was designed that way.
It's presented as a flaw/shortcoming.
But would you be able to use the Daggerheart system for a long-term Candela campaign? I don't like being limited to short story arcs, and am not particularly fond of PbtA-type systems. The setting looks awesome. I may run it in something else.
"Let's tell the Story of How Cool we all Looked when We Saved the World (with unnecessary extra steps)" - The Game.
Candela Obscura: A game less about the thrill of playing it and more selling you the feeling that you and your group of friends are famous celebrities making an actual play
Yea, this along with the World of Darkness products out now make it seem like modern horror rpgs, don't even like themselves. Horror can't be without discomfort, and gods forbid someone be uncomfortable.
My biggest issue with this game is that it feels like it was 100% built around woke ideology and its a vehicle to push that ideology. It doesn't feel like a game meant for everyone. Think of it like this. Bible school type games tend to be oriented around Christian or Catholic and other types of religious ideas. Those kinds of games run the players through biblical and moral challenges and rewards. Candela Obscura comes off more as a Woke cultist version of a bible school game. And the players are introduced to tons of Woke terms and ideology disguised as a role playing game. Everything is "Inclusive" and a "collaboration". And it tries to be as unoffensive to everyone that it ends up being pretty offensive. I always knew the cast of CR was heavily into Twitter and the Woke stuff. But thing's were kinda held in check during campaign 2. Campaign 3 however they just came out and said F it were woke AF. Candela Obscura is just a direct reflection of this. If anyone has been truly paying attention to the world lately. Woke crap is bombing hard. And has been bombing hard for more than a couple years. This game just reeks of it. CR will still be fine. They have their dedicated fan base toxic though they are. But if they keep making stuff like this. I can't see a successful road map for them. And that's a shame considering how actually talented Mat Mercer is. I feel like in a different cultural situation he would be a lot bigger name.
As a committed progressive but one old enough to see the dangers of the woke-or-die mindset, I agree. It's one thing for the system to say something along the lines of "The Fairelands is an idyllic setting in which racism, sexism, etc. doesn't exist" (5e takes this position), but it's quite another to tell people they shouldn't play the game if their table wants the world to feature those things (because maybe we like to fight against racism in our make-believe time?). It's not like other systems have built-in discrimination rules or that the world of Blades (which, sidenote, they should have full-throatedly declared CO is a mod of, rather than "inspired by") is rife with it. I've been looking for a stripped-down version of Blades with a little less grit (we have tweens at our table), so I'm going to check out illuminated worlds at least.
This is not a brutally honest review … as every unbiased review calls this what it is “terrible”
It doesn’t matter what the marketing says, which you have gleefully repeated, it’s simply a pretty book very poorly written.
It’s isn’t about “humanity in horror” is a time of advice about how not to scare the “precious” players in a horror game. If you need trigger rules you can’t play horror - it is absolutely the main genre that needs immersion to work.
But the biggest issue with CO is it’s obtuse and difficult to read. Character creation is a train wreck, banding the perfectly styled Playbooks (one of the great contribution in blades) for 1980s styled multi page rules.
This should have been a critical review, not a critical role apology
1/10
From everything I’ve seen reviewing the system, it really seems like they’re too scared to dive into the meat of what cosmic horror’s about and it leads to a somewhat bare bones system for both the player and GM. Such a shame since the whole scar mechanic is actually pretty interesting to me, as well as the idea that your previous characters can become light keepers after acquiring so many scars.
It's basically what happens when the overly-sensitive far left crowd tries to write about something like cosmic horror.
You've framed your comments about this being a system for shorter campaigns as a criticism (whether that was the intention I'm not sure, but it reads that way) which is a little redundant, considering they have always said that this was meant for short arcs, and have showcased it that way with the liveplay episodes.
Calling it "simplistic" because of this feels a little unfair.
Also, the whole point of the game is that it's narrative driven, so the character classes having narrative differences rather than strongly mechanical ones would be what I would expect from a system like this?
A weird take honestly, comparing apples to oranges and then being disappointed they aren't pears.
We don't want to conflate those 2 things, so if we did that's our bad. It being aimed at shorter campaigns isn't a negative, just a potential sticking point for some players who may not have seen the full press for the game. As for the rules, we do think they may be every so slightly too streamlined for some players, but as mentioned this is a narrative heavy rpg, so a lighter rule set just leans into that strength, it's just another thing that may not be to everyone's tastse. The fact that those were our only potential sticking points should show you how good the game is!
@@TheCharacterSheet That's fair, misinterpretation on my part then :)
The CoC is safe.
CoC is a horric, terrifying game compared to Candela.
@@galinor7 I did end up buying the pdf for CO. And read it. It was pretty fucking horrifying, in it's own way :-)
didn't they literally announce it as intended for shorter campaigns? And that Daggerheart was the more in depth system for long games and character growth?
I see no problem with this being for shorter campaigns.
yes..apparently some people haven't grasped that concept
We have no problem with it being for shorter campaigns. But A) that was more about illuminated worlds in general and not Candela in particular as Spenser mentioned in our interview he preferred a 10-12ish session campaign length and B) it was just being reiterated because not everyone who watches this channel is up to speed on an announcement made not directly about this system 5 months ago in a state of the press video
@@TheCharacterSheet the video sounded like a discovery, rather than a reminder, evidenced by the number of people who have echoed this sentiment. Well, given Candela uses Illuminated Worlds, it still fits. Even 12 sessions is a short campaign by CR standards, and the circle progression would stretch for about that, so I think that’s all fine.
I just wrapped around my head on Blades in the Dark recently, and honestly? It did not took long for me to realize that Candela looks nothing like Blades in the Dark. Internet was just being a dick again.
Im too lazy. Could you share hpw they are dif?
@@yiklongtay6029 I could share what they have in common. Its only the philosophy of the dice roll - which the fundamentals comes from PbtA games. 6: full success, 4-5 mixed success, 1-3 failure. And the fact that you can resist consequences from your own rolls. But they are handed completly differently. Everything is handed completly differently.
I was told is more similar to Vaesen, and not Blades in the dark@@brunobotelho4502
To me, Candela Obscura feels like the 'murder mystery party' of TTRPGs.
The way that they have demonstrated how the game works by dressing up nicely and having a few short sessions with essentially 'one shot' type characters gives me the vibe of this being the 'birthday' or event game, and not so much something i woukd add to a regular schedule of gaming sessions.
Friends getting together, dressing up and having a good time embodying the characters sounds like a lot of fun, as someone who enjoys getting suited up for MM parties.
I also really enjoyed the character creation behind the scenes video with Spencer. I thought that was a great model for how session 0's should go
@@EunoiaRPG Their session 0 was almost more illuminating than the episodes themselves, much as I loved them,
@anthonytoohey1164 me loving the cast talking through all their concepts and the trauma built into their backstories is probably the same reason I have like 30+ characters on the Backburner that I might never play xD
Hi, not sure where the image at 1:41 came from but the tarot cards in it are the work of Amrit Brar who illustrated the Marigold Tarot deck, just wanted to comment because I couldn't find where that image came from and wanted to make sure it was properly credited here, at least :)
Love the system. I think I still prefer the call of Cthulhu system.
Side note. The game CAN be long form as a series of smaller stories. Why could it not? Players would just move from case to case. They don't have to be connected but they are in that they all deal with shenanigans between olde and near faire. I find this review to be nonsense.
Any one figure out what happens when you get 4 or more scars?
I find your criticisms of the short form focus of the game strange, as It isnt in anyway designed for longterm play, which was very clear in their marketing. The criticism that its too light to be used as long form, doesnt work when its not designed to meet that niche at all. It is a game specifically made for short form play. If you prefer longform thats one thing, but it seems a tad bit unfair to criticize something for not functioning in a space it wasnt made for especially when you and much of the audience watchin this content is aware of Daggerheart . There hasn't been any mixed messaging with it either. I agree with most of what you said outside of that, in terms of the beauty of the lore and I actually enjoy how easy it is to jump in and learn the system.
So, in our interviews with Spenser and Rowan, which are up on the channel, they mentioned that it was also built towards longer campaigns as well, and it wasn't so much a concern as it was an observation that after fully digesting the rules, while we love it for shorter campaigns, it may simply lack the variety for a longer campaign, which may not be apparent based on the marketing of the game so far, that's all!
I think what was meant when they said that it could be used for longer forms of play was that the rpg's baseline mechanics and themes gave room for very effective extensions of the lore and story beats, which would naturally allow for more than 3 or 4 sessions, If a GM wanted to homebrew further. Especially with the connective tissue of the varying factions both within and outside of Newfaire and the ever rotating stats of the players when they take a scar. Because of its heavy roleplay, lore and character focus, it allows for a cinematic style of play that can capture both the fast-paced and slow burn elements without excessive restriction. One of the major factors as well comes from how very easily players can die, since they aren't superpowered action heroes like in dnd. This also heavily affects how a long form game in this type of setting would work. So personally i think the idea of lacking complexity for this style of game is negated by the way the game is designed to be played. @@TheCharacterSheet
@@futurexsoul828 If something has to be homebrewed to allow for more than 3 or 4 sessions, that means it's really bad for long form play, which is good to point out if the writers said in interviews that it was built towards longer campaigns. Even in your unnecessarily long comment above you start talking about how wonderful it would be in long form play, right after your comment saying that it was never intended for long form play and shouldn't be criticized for failing to handle it well.
the writers specifically said it was meant for short term play. thats why I have an issue with that aspect of the criticism. There is even an official video and many separate interviews online and even with this very team, that has them saying that candela is meant for short term play. and so it was designed to be episodic and not run beyond more than 3 sessions. If something is designed for short term play, it doesnt make sense to try and criticize its design for not working with long form when the product was not at all built to facilitate that. it is not a weakness to have a very specific focus and they were clear about that in their marketing. If a player enjoys the it enough to try and homebrew something to allow for long term play, that is their choice, but it doesnt have anything to do with the designers. People can play how they want to, and have their own views, but criticism within reason , inclusive of context for a products purpose and its market is far more productive .@@Uccisore28
I GM'ed a one shot Wendigo hunt for 3 friends. We had fun enough but it wasn't the most incredible game. Granted that was before the core rulebook came out.
Definitely want to play again at some point.
For me, I actually did not love Blades in the Dark because of the disconnect between the narrative heists and the weirdly crunchy advancement system. Why are we fiddling with pluses and minuses on reputation with other gangs, and then using a completely narrative arc for the heist? So, I feel like candela is actually answering that concern. Go narrative, recognize that narratives don't fit well with long term crunchy play, and move on.
2 years into a DnD campaign and I am totally open to a game built for shorter campaign arcs. I picked up the core rulebook on launch day and I'm intrigued to play Candela Obscura with my regular rpg party. My main hope is that it encourages more people to try Powered By the Apocalypse style games. That being said, I think the criticism that the character options are not mechanically super different is a fair one.
If you like shorter campaign arcs, Candela Obscura is definitely a must try. And as we said, even if you do want something longerform, a good GM can do that in the Candela System as well
I am enjoying CR's actual plays. I have watched the 1st two chapters.
I would like to try running this with a table of new players.
I just finished watching the 1st episode, and it really made me want to play. I’ve never played a TTRPG, mostly because it seemed really complicated and I was a bit intimidated. However, this game seemed like a good way to enter TTRPGs. Plus I like that it’s a relatively short story. It felt like I could try out different characters, and learn how to really develop my narrative abilities.
I picked up a copy of EZD6, because it is rules light and has lots of good reviews. I am using it to put together a short fantasy game for my three grandkids, ages 8, 9, and 10. They have their characters made and are excited about playing.
I will get Candela Obscura for adult family and friends.
I have tried for months to research and run a game since I got the book. I personally have a very hard time with describing areas in this game because of the limited descriptors given in the book. While there are a lot of them, they are compact and not as thorough as they could be. Using the phrases 'art deco' and the like don't really click with me or my players. I feel like it's lacking in content and is really only good for short games with players that don't mind talking instead of rolling.
Combat isn't very dangerous, everything is woke, it is quite difficult not to have success when attempting a task. A bit light and sugary for me.
From what ive heard. Everything this game does, Call of Cthulhu does better.
Any system that isn't in the game you can add your own stuff into it, its not a problem! You're game world is You're world!
I say good on them they have done a fantastic job to get it from idea to publication. Its not easy you no making an RPG so well done to then!
They took a theme (Call of Cthulhu) and a game system (Blades in the dark) and made a 🐕💩 taco out of it
So your complaints are:
1) it's a BotD rip off
- John Harper approves of it AND the co-Designer was a designer on BotD
2) it can't handle long campaigns.
- that was an intentional design goal, they have talked about this multiple times.
What a weird review...did you research the game?
Lol they only even mentioned BITD after their initial materials failed to mention it at all, and a bunch of people called them out on it.
The perennial worry with CR is it smothering everything else in the space. DND already does this, so them cribbing another system (with the creators blessing or otherwise) pushes fears and resentment toward this "New" system just sucking up the rest of the space in the hobby and contributing more to choking out original designers and developers.
I saw a discussion in discord with the creator of The Wildsea and he flat out said they would have made 5x as much money if Wildsea had just been a 5e supplement, but that would have been a tremendous loss if that had happened for the hobby in terms of narrative and mechanical design.
Sure you don't have any obligation to care about that. But a lot of us do, and we are seeing it justified more and more.
1) just because John Harper nods approvingly and everything is legal doesn't reduce the fact that both games exist and one has pretty much everything the other has and more, or that CO still lacks any FitD dress
2) otoh the marketing and review were both pretty consistent, but otoh i think it's valid to say "this game is episodic, but the episodes might be too similar, leading to not getting a long season"
A question I have, will there be interesting ways you will be able to combine mechanical aspects of future Illuminated Worlds games with each other to expand what's possible?
(Like, if they make a Noir game and a Fantasy game, could you combine them to create "Columbo with Elves and Orcs"? For example)
I mean, you can do that with all rpgs, but at that point maybe you should find a game that does what you want or make your own.
As someone who enjoys more mechanically minded system and play in thkse types ofynygroui thus feels like a system to come nick to in a year or two and see how it's inproved
If you are a big fan of chunky, crunchy rulesets, Candela Obscura may never be your cup of tea. It's way more narrative focused. But the good news is Pathfinder 2 remastered may have the heft you are looking for!
I think you missed described it but nailed it at the same time
You did mention how will it be able to be adapted to other genres...I myself is not a fan of the horror genre. So, after the first chapter...I skipped the rest of the showings. I do believe they said in the beginning it was for a short campaign as a one off or such. To me it comes down to the game system and how it fits with other styles.
Yeah, we are excited to see how illuminated worlds gets adapted to sci-fi, fantasy, or even a more modern RPG setting
@@TheCharacterSheet I think the train scene at the beginning of chapter 2 was there to show us it could indeed do other settings. That first scene was more like something out of Indiana Jones rather than horror. If you want an example of the rules in a non-horror setting I'd recommend watching the first 30-40 mins of the first episode of chapter 2.
I'm hoping to run a sort of monster of the week type game with this. No real overarching narrative but maybe a serialized game where the characters don't really grow any stronger but do change over time and face a different threat every couple of sessions.
PCs will get mechanically stronger, unless you ditch XP/illumination via house rule. Each level-up (a Circle can get 5) lets you increase actions or your drive, in addition to picking up cool new abilities.
@@Greymorn True but it's not the same power creep as say DnD where you go from exterminating rats in a basement to punching god in the face. I'd like it to be more like early Supernatural where they may get a nice boon now and then but the monsters they face in the early days are just as deadly in the later ones. Keep in mind I'm talking about early Supernatural and not the later seasons where they're literally punching god in the face.
Dread is and will be the winner of horror
Honestly, my copy of TEETH just arrived and it's *so* much better imho.
Oooo, I had seen that but not read it yet, will have to check it out!
I am completely ambivalent
Can you please make an emergency video reviewing the rules for the TMNT game? I know that the main rules will be the same as the original game but I have found no one that is as honest and clear with their reviews as you. We got about 2 weeks left of the Kickstarter campaign and I don't want to buy something I'm not going to use.
Is the game more geared towards content creators rather than players?
The ingame setting looks familiar to Arcanum. Except this is apparently a horror. Sounds interesting. I'm too lazy to play table top on a frequent manner. So I'll keep an eye out for a crpg from Candela Obscura. I mean, the setting sounds pretty cool, and it being a horror, damn I need to try it
So they go out of their way to emphasize the system is made for short campaign arcs, from the pre-release announcements to the structure of their actual play episodes, and one of your main criticisms is that it only seems good for short campaign arcs? Really sharp, fellas 🙄🙄🙄
We are reviewing this for people that may not have seen the 1 video 5 months ago about a system with a different name that is where that statment is based on :D
Plus we have an actual interview on this very channel where the game designer mentions he thinks the sweet spot is around a 12 session campaign, so clearly even the game designers aren't fully on board with that old marketing pitch!
@@TheCharacterSheet I mean, okay, but 12 sessions is still a very short campaign 🤷♂️
@@TheCharacterSheet I guess if you said “this system is designed for short arcs/campaigns” rather than “the problem with this system is it only works for short campaigns.” I just find it disingenuous I guess. Cheers.
i am people are going to be tweaking and bending the mechanics of the game.
Io be honest watching it a few time no thanks. It is boring and bland. The world seems GREAT no doubting that.
Very nice book. It won't replace call of cthulhu for my group (we usually want a little more crunch than candela offers), but it's a nice option for an rpg to rotate to when you need a break from your main rpg.
Love the show, love the setting, but I'm tepid on the rules. If I end up purchasing the book, I'd sub in a different ruleset.
Honestly, that could actually work. The setting itself is the greatest creation in that entire work. The ruleset is clean and elegant, but possibly a bit too simple for some people's tastes, but the world building is S-tier
😂😂😂
I'm the substitute DM for the two groups I play in regularly, and I would have killed to have Candela Obscura when one of my DMs took a break to prepare for his second kid's arrival earlier this year. I love the system for the shorter format it's designed for; and I plan to use it as a stopgap/change-up between the longer DND campaigns my friends put on for me.
Your video addresses the shorter campaigns and thinner character development as if it's a surprise and a shortfall. But that's been the intention and message from Critical Role since it's announcement about illuminated worlds, and it mentions that throughout the book. I don't think the video fairly presents that side in your criticisms.
People considering buying this game should know if the system falls apart for longer games. Just because the writers get out in front of it and announce 'this isn't for longer games!!" doesn't make that an unfair criticism.
@@Uccisore28 yeah, but my criticism is about the way he addressed it, and like it was a surprise and he was just figuring this out. Even when the creators have made several posts about it being geared toward shorter story arc games. Pretty sure this channel even made content before that acknowledged that the game is meant for shorter games, but now he's saying "apparently" "it seems like" and language that says that the game isn't exactly as it was advertised.
Stras Acimovic literally helped write Blades in the Dark, and went on to write Scum & Villainy (Blades in space) and Band of Blades (Blades in Warhammer I guess). He has said many times how much he loves the game system, so it shouldn't be a surprise that Illuminated Worlds is like Blades. Why does no one bring this up? Seriously, Darrington Press should have lead with that so Blades fans could immediately rally behind another Stras game, instead of making it seem like Spenser wrote the whole thing.
All the safety callouts treats the players and GM like children afraid of their own shadows.
I think you guys need to learn my about this TTRPG hobby you claim to know...
Remember when you did that whole thing about how CO was going to be the Call of Cthulhu toppler? Are your examples of Horror TTRPG's were CoC and Revenloft? No mention of Kult Divinty Lost, End of the World, Dread, Candles, Watchtower, etc... no, no, Just Call of Cthulhu.
I cant tell if your maliciously curating your audiance to a select group of TTPGs, or if your just sheeple with no experience in this hobby, latching onto the fad...
CR: Promotes game as a short campaign ruleset. Does 3 session live-plays to show what they mean.
Character Sheet: Hm. I wonder why this feels light on long term advancement. It must be bad.
You had me with the other points but this one was just plain stupid
Depends what you mean by a "short campaign". I have already finished a 12 session campaign which could have gone another 1-3 sessions if not for the impending holidays, so we wrapped it up. If anything, the advancement system might be tuned too far in the other direction: the max length of a campaign is 20 "assignments" which in practical terms means 30-40 sessions. Narrative arcs in a storytelling game like Candella typically wrap up sooner than that.
Candella is also great for one-shots and convention play.
I love that it's designed for short form play. My players have busy schedules and it's hard to get together to play anything. One lives in another state. Short form games are better for us and this is perfect.
The whole negative- this won’t last for year long campaigns
The game- this is meant for 3-5 session shot campaigns
Seems like you are deliberately ignoring what the game is made for to shit all over it for something it’s not doing.
Like you may as well have said “ this game doesn’t do cyberpunk 3/10”.
Isn’t there already a My Little Pony game for players who don’t want to “feel uncomfortable” in a HORROR setting?
If InCels and the InCel adjacent hate it they must be doing something right
Friend, that's just hateful and dumb. So dumb.