Piecemeal armor might also have application for called targets (specifically trying to hit an area) and natural target biasing (a halfling with a short sword fighting a hill giant is very unlikely to strike at even the torso). One might also rule that finesse weapons automatically exploit under-armored areas as if they were a larger fraction of the total area. This might not add too much bookkeeping while giving weapon choices more significance. One might also rule that certain degrees and/or types of fighting skill could reduce/remove penalties for location-biased attacks. E.g., a 2nd level fighter might have half the benefit of finesse weapons (i.e., better than other classes) and a 'targeting' feat might allow even better exploitation than finesse weapons as well as a chance to hit a more specific target such as a magic item or the hand that holds it. There could also be skill-effects for defending with less complete armor, allowing a skilled warrior to get by with less expensive armor or gain more of an advantage from partial magical armor. If pieces of armor provided (magical?) resistance or immunity to weapon damage types for the covered areas, being able to target more vulnerable areas at a penalty could result in more effective attacks. E.g., an adamant breastplate might give immunity to slashing and piercing and resistance to bludgeoning in the covered area, but the rest of the armor would be less protective. Managing complexity while providing a feeling of specialness for some weapons/tactics/skills might be challenging. Applying such to every encounter would probably be too cumbersome, but it might be possible to develop a system that balanced slower combat unfun (increased by more diverse checks) and special-use fun for perhaps as much as one encounter per session. Since half-cover provides +2 AC bonus, a +1 to hit for finesse weapons against a partially armored opponent might be reasonable with a higher bonus for special skill; this would only handle general hit/miss not where the hit happened (so armor pieces with special resistances would not be handled). (I suspect it would take substantial playtesting to find something that would support targeting and differences in effect and still be fun for those who are not hard-core simulationists.)
Pathfinder 1e had optional piecemeal rules with interesting consequences. An armor set that consisted of studded leather legs, scale mail arms, and a plate chest piece had an AC bonus equal to full plate, two-thirds the weight, and cost a tenth of the price. It was still considered heavy armor, but that's a minor limitation for being superior to every other heavy armor in the official game.
The only piecemeal armor I've used is from Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay where you can mix and match which armor you can wear as well as layer it. So it would go leather with chainmail ontop and then plate ontop of that. It stacks points that stop damage from hitting that part of the body
I like the one in Combat & Tactics over the one in Dark Sun. It's more complicated, but has more armor types on it and allows you to be really specific. I also do the calculations where two half arms or legs equal one whole one, so for example if a hauberk covers to a character's knee that would be two half legs of chain, and add together to make one leg for purposes of calculating armor class for that suit. I also don't mind doing math.
@@oldgrognardsays Right on. Thanks. I played Dark Sun almost exclusively in the mid-late 90's and we used all the S&P stuff but I can't remember specifics anymore. Anyways, just asking because I'm getting back into 2e recently. Dark Sun, of course.
@@oldgrognardsays Doing messy math isn't so bad if it's something you can just calculate once, write on your sheet, and then not worry about again until you find some more armor. Besides, we all have calculators.
@@oldgrognardsays Easy Spouse or girlfriend has 90% plot armour. Best buddy 50% plot armour Nice person 40% plot armour Annoying younger brother 10% plot armour unless trump card MOM SAID SO then it 110% plot armour.
Thanks for watching!
Some related AD&D 2nd Edition videos
THAC0....................................................................................... ua-cam.com/video/AWCk2xHOAjc/v-deo.html
Shields....................................................................................... ua-cam.com/video/IEYLDqvrpOk/v-deo.html
Armor......................................................................................... ua-cam.com/video/VBCwjC-WPEI/v-deo.html
Weapon Expertise and Specialization (Combat & Tactics).... ua-cam.com/video/QHtpaY_br6M/v-deo.html
Weapon Mastery (Combat & Tactics)...................................... ua-cam.com/video/ZFZrFxbaAaY/v-deo.html
Piecemeal armor might also have application for called targets (specifically trying to hit an area) and natural target biasing (a halfling with a short sword fighting a hill giant is very unlikely to strike at even the torso).
One might also rule that finesse weapons automatically exploit under-armored areas as if they were a larger fraction of the total area. This might not add too much bookkeeping while giving weapon choices more significance. One might also rule that certain degrees and/or types of fighting skill could reduce/remove penalties for location-biased attacks. E.g., a 2nd level fighter might have half the benefit of finesse weapons (i.e., better than other classes) and a 'targeting' feat might allow even better exploitation than finesse weapons as well as a chance to hit a more specific target such as a magic item or the hand that holds it. There could also be skill-effects for defending with less complete armor, allowing a skilled warrior to get by with less expensive armor or gain more of an advantage from partial magical armor.
If pieces of armor provided (magical?) resistance or immunity to weapon damage types for the covered areas, being able to target more vulnerable areas at a penalty could result in more effective attacks. E.g., an adamant breastplate might give immunity to slashing and piercing and resistance to bludgeoning in the covered area, but the rest of the armor would be less protective.
Managing complexity while providing a feeling of specialness for some weapons/tactics/skills might be challenging. Applying such to every encounter would probably be too cumbersome, but it might be possible to develop a system that balanced slower combat unfun (increased by more diverse checks) and special-use fun for perhaps as much as one encounter per session. Since half-cover provides +2 AC bonus, a +1 to hit for finesse weapons against a partially armored opponent might be reasonable with a higher bonus for special skill; this would only handle general hit/miss not where the hit happened (so armor pieces with special resistances would not be handled). (I suspect it would take substantial playtesting to find something that would support targeting and differences in effect and still be fun for those who are not hard-core simulationists.)
Pathfinder 1e had optional piecemeal rules with interesting consequences. An armor set that consisted of studded leather legs, scale mail arms, and a plate chest piece had an AC bonus equal to full plate, two-thirds the weight, and cost a tenth of the price. It was still considered heavy armor, but that's a minor limitation for being superior to every other heavy armor in the official game.
Min max abuse is always a danger with any system that lets players build stuff.
"... chainmail pants and nothing else ..."
Someone Who Wears Chainmail: "Um ... ouch. Yes, ouch. Lots and lots of ouch."
I probably should have worded that differently
@@oldgrognardsays Well, it isn't happening to me, so it's hilarious!
Right on
Thx for the guidance. Neu to the Old Skool stuff but I luv it! So many alt mechaniks to learn abewt
Right on
The outros for your videos involving wierd creatures is my favorite thing. Especially the vague and unspecified eldritch horror.
Thanks. Half of the fun of making these videos is making the outros.
The only piecemeal armor I've used is from Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay where you can mix and match which armor you can wear as well as layer it. So it would go leather with chainmail ontop and then plate ontop of that. It stacks points that stop damage from hitting that part of the body
Do you think the piecemeal armor table in S&P is better than the one in the Dark Sun rules book?
I like the one in Combat & Tactics over the one in Dark Sun. It's more complicated, but has more armor types on it and allows you to be really specific. I also do the calculations where two half arms or legs equal one whole one, so for example if a hauberk covers to a character's knee that would be two half legs of chain, and add together to make one leg for purposes of calculating armor class for that suit. I also don't mind doing math.
@@oldgrognardsays Right on. Thanks. I played Dark Sun almost exclusively in the mid-late 90's and we used all the S&P stuff but I can't remember specifics anymore. Anyways, just asking because I'm getting back into 2e recently. Dark Sun, of course.
@@oldgrognardsays Doing messy math isn't so bad if it's something you can just calculate once, write on your sheet, and then not worry about again until you find some more armor. Besides, we all have calculators.
1:05 Wait, plot armour? Is that actually in the book?
Fortunately, no. I have no idea how to calculate how piecemeal plot armor would work.
@@oldgrognardsays Easy Spouse or girlfriend has 90% plot armour.
Best buddy 50% plot armour
Nice person 40% plot armour
Annoying younger brother 10% plot armour unless trump card MOM SAID SO then it 110% plot armour.
@@RottenRogerDM Sounds like an idea for an April Fools Day video
@@oldgrognardsays I use to love the April edition of the Dragon mag.
Hey my oscar mayer baloneny armour is AC 16 tell me I lie!
But does it allow you to pilot the Wienermobile?
@@oldgrognardsays Yes but you may do five to ten in the federal pen if the owner objects. :)