@@Palasid11 Something like Mario Odyssey may have more _complex_ code, but Deltarune's is way more of a mess, to a point of being just kinda poorly programmed in general, tbh. Game itself is fantastic, so it doesn't really matter, though, does it.
@@KrakaToad Yeah :V Can confirm, having quite a bit of experience in investigating Deltarune's code myself. Things that immediately come to mind are, like... - NPC text and entrance destinations being sometimes set based on their X/Y coordinates - Most of the NPC dialogue being in just one, 1200 entries long switch case - Spamton code in general
My theory is that Dark World "LV" doesn't stand for Level of Violence, but Light Value. The player, Kris, and party's Light Value grows as they seal the Dark Fountains and grow as people, the "light inside their souls" growing stronger.
@@drascia well I think LV standing for love in the light world is simply to show that thar world works on the same rules as undertale, unlike the dark world which, doesn’t. After all the light world has the same menus and dialogue boxes as undertale as well (including labeling the phone as “CELL” which is the worst design desision in the game not related to “so sorry”
The fact that LOVE still exists in the Light World makes me extremely paranoid about what's yet to come. It's not so much the fear that we COULD kill someone as it is wondering HOW in the hell Kris could LV up. In other terms, inb4 the Weird Route concludes with Kris forcing Noelle to pull Rudy's life support
@@ChiliChoccy welp, we don't know if leaving someone to die increases LV. (Like, burying them alive or something) AND we don't know if LV is specifically only for player or everyone can have it
@@ChiliChoccy Not necessarily. I forgot the exact quote, but Sans said something about it measuring your capacity and willingness to hurt people, and to distance yourself from the pain you've caused. Due to that, I think it'd be reasonable to assume that this just means they haven't intentionally killed someone, but they still could've accidentally killed someone.
Knowing that Toby is tracking all of our choices and giving us an open facing red herring for levels makes me think that we're gonna get a rugpull moment that's the inverse of Undertale
yeah, many people have refused to go on the weird route for the same reason they refused to go on a genocide, it feels bad to twist a gentle soul and permanently ruin your save file... except, this is the WEIRD route, not GENOCIDE 2 ELECTRIC BOOGALOO. It's about how much you can twist the preimposed path in a place where "choices don't matter". What if the weird route is actually necessary in a save file to get the best possible outcome in another save file?
The reason "false level" exists is likely because it's a display variable that's supposed to provide the illusion that closing fountains increases your level. As we can see, the actual level up code is tied to the chapter you are in. In that sense, it's actually a bug that the save point uses the wrong variable to display your LV, it should be using fakelv as well. What you didn't mention is that growing stronger by defeating enemies is essentially useless between chapters. Firstly, the HP of Kris, Susie and Ralsei is upper bounded in chapter 2 -- it cannot raise above 160 for Kris, for instance. Secondly, the level up when closing the fountain doesn't increase your max hp, it lower bounds it. If you've already increased your HP to 160 (on Kris) by the end of Chapter 2, then it will not actually raise at all when going to Chapter 3. Kris' HP will always be at 160 at the start of Chapter 3, no matter what happened. This means that fighting can only raise your HP in the *current* chapter, but it will have zero benefit for any subsequent chapters. Not so for Noelle however. Her HP is not upper-bounded, and can therefore raise infinitely if we fight enough enemies. It can actually go above 166 if you abort Snowgrave and then fight the mice in the cheese maze. To be honest, I would refrain from trying to read any meaning out of the specific structure of the code. It seems very clear that the ones working on the code are programming features in as they go, and the whole architecture was not really planned out, leading to such hacks as "fakelv" being required. Might explain why the game is taking a long time to develop.
the whole thing with copying everything from the older demo and adding a prefix of ch1(or smth like that) already proves that the whole thing hasn't been planned out that well, outside of the story.
Just a VERY small correction: fighting enemies to become stronger ISN’T entirely useless, since while there’s a fixed cap for HP that’s the same as closing the fountains, the other thing you get by becoming stronger are the stats increase. In the current live version (where the cheese maze glitch still exist) it’s possible to fight a total of 40 encounters, thus giving an increase of +4 stats (which is +2 more that what you get after sealing the fountain); in the steam beta version however, since the cheese maze glitch pas fixed, the total encounter is only 39, so just +3 stats increase, only +1 compared to sealing the fountain. Either way that means that there’s a reward for defeating enemies violently, even if it’s not much. Now, something i am VERY curious about…is if the game keep tracks of the number of encounters finished with violence BETWEEN chapters, for example: if by the end of chapter 2, 35 encounters were ended with violence, when you use that save file to continue to chapter 3, does the counter stays the same and you need to finish 5 more encounters to get a stats up increase, or it simply gets reset back to zero? Because if the former is the case, that would mean that the Player would be incentivised to defeat as many enemies as possible to gain many stats increases.
Well akshually... These are the (unconventional) game dev rules. It's good for various reasons _(S P E E D)_ to store all of your counters in a giant table and check everything with switch statements. Which is also kinda ironic. Although i know that by no means is this safe coding (hence the mansion warp glitch in ch.2), this is definitely the most optimized one: most of these features were already introduced in assembly. ASSEMBLY.
I believe that the Susie and Ralsei level up even if they aren't in your party because they don't level up, *WE* do. I believe that the soul seems to get stronger whenever we seal a fountain or defeat an enemy with violence. The reason why Kris, Susie and Ralsei get stronger is due to an almost symbiotic-parasitic relation between us and the them. When Noelle joins the party it says "Noelle has gotten stronger" because she herself has gotten stronger without any relation to the soul (that's why she doesn't level up when she isn't in the party).
But susie is the one who cant be contained, she can do things on her own, create her own battle rules (S-action), and yet noelle, who is under control easily, is the one that isnt connected to the soul? Shouldnt susie be the one that doesnt level up when shes away from the party?
Good point. Actually I wanted to add on that ideea. While Susie might be more rebelious, I don't believe she is 100% free. Either due to the profecy, prolonged exposure to our influence or some other more meta reason both Susie and Ralsei become more linked with the player. Before the Sweet Cap'n Cakes fight Ralsei and Susie act because Kris (and by extension us) tells them what to do. Whenever s-action and r-action are used kris has little to no involvement (see the dialogue that plays when Kris gets knocked out in that fight), implying that we are directly tellying them what to do in theese cases.
@@salt.io257 how does it come noelle has a closer bond to the player despite not receiving level ups, while susie is more rebellious and still receives level ups
1. I don't think that at we can do the snowgrave route because we have a stronget bond with Noelle. Later on in the route this "bond" does get stronger ("You whispered Noelle's name") but at the begining it seems that Noelle's lack of asertiveness combined with her hidden potential allow her to do those things. 2. As I said before I don't know exactly why susie is more tied with the player. The main reason I came up with this theory was because it felt like a very Toby Fox move to turn a mechanic such as exp share to party members that didn't take part in the fight and give it an in universe explanation.
Spares are the enemy no longer wanting to fight you, while pacifies are the enemies being forced out of combat against their will. Another important thing to note is that pacifies near-universally require the enemy be beaten to low HP first.
@@omegahaxors9-11 I feel like "near-universally" is exaggerating a lot? I feel like there were a significant number of Give a Boring Speech/Sing a Lullaby/etc-type ACTs, though I admit I never counted what proportion of enemies had that as an option
Whether it comes into play or not, the difference makes some sense, if you really think about it. You're not really befriending these people if you Pacify them. Yeah, you're still Sparing them and that matters, but you're not really creating an emotional connection with them like you do with normal Sparing. You're basically just knocking them out so they stop being an obstacle. Given that they attacked you first and you could have done the same instead, they still appreciate the mercy, but they don't really know you.
That last "leader' bit was probably not made as foreshadowing, but as a callback. Instead of that neutral-warm "Leader, commands the party with various ACTs", it turns into the more sinister and cold "Leader, commands".
This reminded me of the time i did the snowgrave route. What i did was spare every enemy before encountering Noelle. Then after i freeze everyone and when i got Susie and Ralsei again, i started to spare everyone again. It was interesting because my hp was lower when i face Neo Spamton than it should have been and Queen wasnt sad when i reach castle town, because i had some recrutes from chapter 2. It was like a weird middle point where the route is still pretty messed up but not as bad as it could have been.
I always found this interesting. I actually consider your method of doing the route *far* more nefarious, in it's own way. Even moreso if you did a peaceful Chapter One on the same file.
The problem with that is the flags are just counting the total number of times you do X thing-- For example, if you spend awhile grinding for money you could pacify a couple hundred enemies, which doesn't really mean much if you also beat people up as well.
And then he makes “Toby fox simulator” which starts as a puzzle game where you as the annoying dog have to move sprites and scripts to the right place to create undertale and deltarune” but you don’t actually need to complete the puzzles correctly, and if you assign the wrong sprites or scripts to characters they act oddly and if you do so in the right way, you can complete a secret ending which contains an incredibly long poem philosophicaly breaking down the nature of reality which is also the source (in the essolang poetic) for a program that modifies existing copies of undertale and deltarune in ways that are vaguely similar to what you did, and in fact also hides even more secret in the modified versions of the game revealing deeper information about the nature of gaster but in a way that is intentionally incoherent, even more so than the current information, and then if you count the number of ones in the ascii representation of each word in a specific altered dialog file that is intentionally buried between a bunch of unchanged files and also unused both in the original and altered versions of deltarune and seems to describe in this version the prosess of something trying to pull itself together despite incredible pain, you get the coordinates to a door in the middle of nowhere on the side of a mountain which when opened you find nothing, but, if somone stays there over night, at exactly midnight, if they are still awake they will find WD gaster manifesting in front of them in real life, where he would then probably thank the people there for how their continued attention helped him reform himself after being scattered across time and space. Befor probably maybee joining real world society and becoming one of the to rated researchers of all time.
I noticed that party becomes stronger with each fountain long ago, so I made a theory that Kris is creating and closing fountains to become strong enough to break free from players control, what do you think about it?
Every single Save Point so far mentions Power. While I disagree with the idea that Kris is doing everything to break free from the Player I think it's very clear they're obessed with the idea of gaining more Power. It is very possible Kris is trying to gain more Power in order to break free however the Power they're gaining currently is exclusive for the Dark Worlds, on the Light Worlds they're still as weak as ever. If we consider the possibility that the Roaring will come regardless, as it's prophesied by Gaster, one could see Kris trying to gain more Power in order to fight back the Titans. That would make more sense because if Kris was trying to break Free from The Player they'd try to gain Power in the Light World, not through violence but maybe through some other mean maybe they'd ask for help as they're capable of limited speech. But trying to gather Power in the Dark World specifically seems to imply they have a bigger plan regarding that and like I said I suspect it's because they know The Roaring is coming, as Gaster knows and has told us / Ralsei, so preparing for The Titans seems more appropriate as The Roaring will turn the entire Light World into one giant Dark World, making their Power relevant.
@@dylanzlol7293 it doesn't seem like they can do much without soul and they're none option for a player to kill or fight with town folks, so I think Kris is too limited right now to do anything besides opening portals, but they clearly have some plan, because they did slash Toriel's tiers for some reason
They come, do all this investigation and analysis of the code, does a lot of tests and tries to make sense of this tangled script but they remember to us, they're not a programmer. Dude, you're awesome, you're the only one I've seen that goes through all this trouble to make sense of this game's inner workings
I think that the reason fatalities in the dark world don't give exp is that the monsters there don't have any to give. That could be because they don't have souls, which could bring up some interesting points.
Are they even monsters? We just know that Humans and Monsters from the light world are Lightners, while the people in the dark world are Darkners, but it's never stated what those Darkners are, even ralsei in the legend, it says they need "a human, a monster, and a prince from the dark", ralsei isn't a monster too because it says they need *a* monster, singular, and it never says "a monster from the dark", and of course instead of Lightners it specifies their race so it doesnt get confused with 2 humans or 2 monsters
Darkners are basically like Flowey. Soulless beings given life through determination (either directly injected or indirectly through a fountain). The biggest difference is that darkners can feel compassion (maybe something to do with the fountain itself?)
I really find it interesting that Spare and Pacify are considered two different flags, and that they don't have like, a common flag that adds the total. I've tried a Only Pacify run through resolve and have found out that some enemies can't get tired (I believe swatchlings are one of these), and as such I think it will be interesting how pacify vs spare may affect or not different things in future chapters!
@@ArturFlintchannel Yep! that's what I mean by "through resolve", since it's the general term for hitting a enemy till they become pacifist. For some reason only them, some other enemies, and bosses dont get tired when their health is low.
Whether it comes into play or not, the difference makes some sense, if you really think about it. You're not really befriending these people if you Pacify them. Yeah, you're still Sparing them and that matters, but you're not really creating an emotional connection with them like you do with normal Sparing. You're basically just knocking them out so they stop being an obstacle. Given that they attacked you first and you could have done the same instead, they still appreciate the mercy, but they don't really *know* you.
It’s also possible this sort of stuff will be cleaned up when the game reaches full release. Like all the small stuff being tracked will be cut down if stuff is unused (unless it’s used for a sort of stats screen) but who knows at this point.
Thank you so much for always putting captions in your videos! I have sensory sensitivity because I'm autistic and sometimes I have a hard time processing sound because I may be overstimulated and english is also not my native language and I understand english better by reading when I'm having problems understanding sound, it means a lot to me when a youtuber puts accurate captions on their videos
Oh, I thought I was the only autistic person who likes subtitles due to sensitivity issues {only one who comments, at least....}{oh my gosh no amount of edits will allow me to clarify this}! The combination of subtitles and the clear tts voice thingy makes this one of the most assessable channels I have found in a long time for me. Not to mention the fact that there's almost always clarification on which scenes are real and which aren't, which helps with my inability to identify jokes. Yesh, Bread, I agree with this person here. You are incredible.
yeah, the captions are very helpful for me too. i dont mind the text-to-speech, but it can be hard to understand because it often doesnt pronounce words correctly.
toby could probably make one silly little mistake in the code and it could still make a lot of sense to the point of solving year-long questions and being the final puzzle piece to millions of theories
I've got a multi-faceted theory here: 1. The party gains 0 EXP when making an enemy flee because there's no execution involved. Something I did notice, though, is that "you gained 0 EXP" does _not_ appear after a frozen or fatal encounter. 2. I think it's important to distinguish the fact that LOVE stands for level of _violence_ - it measures one's capacity to hurt, not necessarily to kill. And Kris's LV may increase in the light world based on any number of things. 2.5. I think the light world LV has something to do with how much they have damaged "your" SOUL. Notice how they tear out the SOUL twice in chapter 2, arguably being more violent toward it than in chapter 1. 2.75. Violence may not be a bad thing in this instance; self defense is often violent in the same way that justice is a form of revenge. 3. In Undertale, EXP and LOVE are gained when killing a monster, destroying their soul in the process. Perhaps those are linked in a way? It may be possible that since darkners are based on inanimate objects, they don't actually have souls. But we as the player _do_ have one.
8:30 THIS IS WHAT I'VE BEEN TALKING ABOUT ALL THE TIME!!! THE "YOUR CHOICES DON'T MATTER" IS THE EQUIVALENT OF UNDERTALE'S "KILL OR BE KILLED", BUT NOBODY LISTENS!
The fact that Noelle only becomes stronger when in the party, while Kris Susie and Ralsei become stronger either if they aren't in the party or are in the party, might have something to do with the fact that Noelle isn't part of the legend, hence she isn't connected by destiny or something. She is temporarily able to "enter" the legend and alter it in drastic ways that other characters tied to the legend cannot, hence why the snowgrave route exists
Theory time. Lv in dark worlds represent normal level stats in videogames that goes up when you do notable things. Lv in light worlds however represent level of violence. Or how many people you’ve murdered. So when Noelle comes back to the party in the light world, don’t be surprised if her level is 4
you know, now that you mention it, Noelle most likely has LV 2 in lightworld since she was the one who spell snowgrave against berdly and most likely ended up dying.
Noelle's LV will probably stay a mystery, I don't think she'll be back in the party not only because of snowgrave but because of the freezering and thornring being overpowered (only iceshock deals 600~700 damage with the thorn ring) and even if she comes back we probably won't be able to look at her stats just like we can't look a susies' in the light world
I think it's implied that dying in the Dark World makes you "fall down" in the Light World, which is what happened to Berdly. But if a monster falls down and dies, you don't gain EXP for it since they died of natural causes. It's like pulling out someone's life support vs. smothering them with a pillow.
@@fabio5d Actually I think the fact that Snowring and Freezering are just overpowered actually increase the chance that we’ll get it back. As that would run with the theme of Genocide where each individual fight is easier but then at the end the bossfights are just bullshit hard. As we’ve already seen that in ch 2. And I think Trance will allow us to see Noelle’s stats in the lightworld.
@@Data-Expungeded While in a save where you continue a snowgrave route it makes sense to Noelle to defeat enemies in one hit since we'll probably have to get to 100% TP to cast snowgrave in everone if we continue to use Noelle to freeze enemies in a future chapter, the problem is you can get both rings in a normal route of the game as long as you Tell Noelle you're protecting her before the Berdly bossfight, spare him using glare or simply beat him without using the spell we get to keep those items in our inventory and Noelle just acts like if nothing had happened, if she comes back in the party in a save where you have the rings and haven't made "frozen chicken" She'll just be broken because she'll outperform both Susie and Ralsei in terms of damage and healing
2:35 What is a Halloween Pencil? Edit: I just figured out that it is the Light World version of the Spooky Sword WHICH IS SO COOL. Seriously, I hope we get more stuff like this in the future Edit 2: I have found more like this so the normal wooden blade is just “Pencil”, the trefoil, which is an unused item is “Lucky Pencil” and the bounce blade is “Eraser”. Nonetheless, this is all so interesting and I do wonder what more of the Light World equivalent to things are
Bread, the amount of effort you put into these videos is incredible. Your videos both are very entertaining, and make me think of theories and details about this game i've never even heard before. It's refreshing to hear theories about things other than Sans, Gaster, etc. And I love how this is bringing up ideas about the game that make Deltarune all the more intriguing!
Man I still can’t believe that all these years ago we didn’t figure out that the gumball machine in the spamtom sweepstakes Was the fake chapter 4 secret boss Skuntle Gumballer his small fight was amazing. Until we discovered that kris after removing his soul in chapter 3 actually hid the frozen snowgrave berdly inside the Ice-e Frostbear animatronic and making berdly live with remaining juice. Dude it was so cool seeing berdly perform the bite of 87 battery acid energy drinks as his final special attack.
@@Felipe_9999 don’t worry it was just a random deltarune joke about what will happen at the chapters, Sorry to have posted this on a random bread video that is *completely* unrelated
I wonder if our Dark World LV increases because sealing the fountain counts as defeating all Darkners? Also wonder if it's "false LV" as in, "false level of violence", and not "false level" overall, simply as a distinction between it and Undertale's/the Light World's level statistic.
@HBegaming YT tts is robotic, it's unfamiliar to most people, of course they're gonna get put off by it. The fact you can't even acknowledge this shows how narrow-minded you are.
@@JaruJaruJ Especially because the same thing happened in Undertale when you go to save for the first time, the save point states that your LV is 0. In addition, you can’t fully ‘erase’ your save file in Undertale without doing Genocide runs, but you can do it in Deltarune easily in the menu of the game.
i honestly think that toby is gonna scare us, like say we do some sort of evil thing near the end of the dark world in like chapter 6 or somethin, come out and see our LV is 2 in the lightworld. i would be freaked out honestly like oh my god imagine cutting to a black screen after a chapter and hearing up a slowed down version of the level up sound
I always thought that leveling up from fountains was from the bossfights you just fought because you have defeated a strong enemy, likely through violence, making you stronger. Also the several flags for random things might be because coding can be inconsistent, or may need to be flagged because of a requirement that needed to be bypassed later on in development without messing with the previous code of chapter 1.
God this whole LV situation has been made a lot more fascinating by Deltarune. Someone else in the comment section mentioned that character's LV increases being tied to dark fountain sealing may mean its starts for "light value" which makes sense to me. The other LV I think may stand for level but like a lot of Toby shenanigans its a word play because in games the word 'level' is traditionally applied not to strength but to a specific gameplay area a player enters (think Super Mario's levels). So yeah our savepoint's LV being different based on which chapter we've loaded makes perfect sense in that context.
Man I swear, you make crystal clear content where I just listen to and am like "do tell more". Honestly, you are the only link to UT/DR world for me at the moment. Focus of interest always sift but once a blue moon it is nice to listen to someone who feels like is studying Tobyology with 3 liter of coffee, 2 hours of sleep and thesis deadline in 1 hour.
Haven’t finished the video yet, but I find it interesting that the flag numbers have two ranges: 40-45, and 925-926. This makes me think that 40-45 were created for Chapter 1 (and mechanics that continue past it), and 925-926 for Chapter 2, since both of those involve Iceshock. I’d wager 45 was originally intended for something like “magic kills” that was removed from chapter 1, and 925 was meant for separate Chapter 2 tracking for the thornring counter. That might mean we’ll see 45 again in another chapter if it was a mechanic removed from Chapter 1. And if that flag is “magic kills”, I’m curious what character may be the one to kill, considering that Rude Buster doesn’t kill and Ralsei only seems to have healing and pacifying magic.
Something to keep in mind is that Toby did tell us that one of the upcoming chapters is in the light world, so LOVE may prove to be a factor in the future.
the discrepancy between savefile level and party menu level seems mostly like an oversight; both chapters thus far end with sealing a dark fountain, which increase your party's level, which means your party's level at the start of the chapter is the same as the chapter number. and it remains like that for 99% of the chapter, so in most circumstances, the game can just print your current chapter where it's suppose to print your level and there's nothing inaccurate about it. so, those two values were likely either always synced or were outright the same variable during development, but then toby decided to sneak in the little detail of your level going up right after sealing the fountain, modified the party menu code to reflect that ... and forgot to do the same for the savefile code, so it still just uses your current chapter for your level also it's p. funny how the light world stat menu is literally ripped straight from undertale. i'm much less convinced that light world level will just end up as an artifact of toby's elite coding skills, but i _do_ expect that xp table to either go eternally unused or be quietly cut out of the code when the stat menu starts doing Things in later chapters
I think that the descriptions change by how you act, with Kris called Tactician due to him making tactics to battle with ACT's, while he can also attack to Leader, because he doesn't just do commands now, he liderates everything and instead of planning tacticts just command Noelle to Ice Shock the enemies.
While you're kind of generalizing, I get what you're trying to say. Chapter One's Leader title that becomes the Tactician title is much different from Snowgrave's Leader title. The Chapter One title and Tactician title describes a clever leader that can use ACTS to tactically make a plan. The Snowgrave title feels more like a leader who cares less about making a good plan, and more about being obeyed regardless.
i know some people hate the long time between uploads, but i find it more satisfying to see an already satisfying video from my favourite undertale/deltarune youtuber after a long time for seeing a new upload.
I know this isn't perfectly on topic to THIS video, but I may have found another piece of the "ocean" motif that's been driving you crazy. In every patient room in the hospital, the wallpaper has a pattern of seahorses and stars (starfish?). ...I'm not sure what to make of this, but maybe it'll help you! :)
Hey Halfbreadchaos I was looking over the concept art for Undertale the other day when I saw an illustration for a removed feature of the ice cave in snowdin. On this piece of concept art you can see a depiction of the angel on the ice caves wall. Of which it eerily resembles Noelle with her distinctive robes and horn.
I don’t care what the topic is. HalfBreadChaos always makes a entertaining video to watch. You with your editors really have gotten better as time has gone on. And this topic was something that is very confusing and much different then how undertale was. The LV shows up in many places and like you showed. Is inconsistent. They must all represent different things and Toby is messing with us because he knows we look for LOVE
3:40 This is very interesting information! 5:17 That begs the question of why Toby designates that as the FALSE Level.... How will its falseness be relevant in the future? So, there's some missing brackets that make that makes it set flag 63 every time an enemy is frozen? Anyway, great analysis video! Thanks for uploading!
Besides the amazing research and good editing, it's really cool how you manage to give personality to your videos even when you have text to speech, which also shows that limitations are only an obstacle that can be overcome with time! Great video, bread!
I thought that love and level in the files specifically were for the different "runs" for how your HP increases (like breaking bonds for HP or closing dark worlds)
i hope they dont, makes looking trough the code a lot more mysterious, when you dont know what matters and whats just your brain playing tricks on you. it probably makes modding difficult though.
@@Rodrigo-kq3js No, they should be fixed ASAP to minimize any bugs and barriers to development going forward (and hopefully they have by now). I imagine the original source is just as chaotic
hi i just want to say that i have been trying and failing to get into deltarune theory videos for YEARS because none of them have ever really made sense to me and none of the people making them have captivated me enough to watch more than one but i just watched all of yours in a row and i love how much they’ve enhanced my interest in a game i already adored so THANK YOU FOR THESE 🩷‼️
Is LV the same thing for the recruited enemies. Because when you check the recruits menu you can see the enemies lv and clicking more info shows the stats of the enemy as Level, Attack, Defense, And Their element. Since it shows both Lv and level as the same number is it the same thing? Or is it different? Also how would they increase their level or Lv? Are they just made with the stats they have? Did they gain them from the fountain? Or did something/someone else Give them those stats?
I love these code dives. On top of just being really fun to listen to HalfBread look at it, they are also just such a constant stream of "Does this have implications or is the Code just Kind Of A Mess". Some things do feel intentional and we KNOW Toby uses the code as part of the art to some degree. But then the code in general just seems to be kind of clunky (how adding a room threw off that part of game so bad it actually caused soft locks and needed multiple updates to fix, chest contents being decided by ROOM for some reason meaning there can never be 2 chests in the same room or theyll need to change it, Save points using Chapter number instead of your actual level probably being a holdover from before implementing the actual Fountain Seal Level up, ...) to a point its both entirely possible and probably LIKELY for a lot of the things that look like tey might mean something to end up just being messy code weirdness with no relevance whatsoever, because for all intents and purposes the code is still code first and a story medium second.
It will be a fun thing when the entire game is out and the entire community goes on a bughunt. Or does the meme-patch concept I have been thinking about where we just change the internal stats to correspond to the entirely made up stats that they show us(Including the example where Spamton Neo supposedly has 8000 HP according to a dialogue Yu-gi-oh reference, but he actually just has 4809.)
Huh, how very interesting, I wonder if this will mean anything for the future or not, I also wonder if we’ll get to FIGHT in the Light World at some point and if so will they look like the FIGHTs in Undertale? Regardless this was a fun video, you did well, I wonder what you will cover next? Can’t wait.
I enjoy your videos a lot. It's very cool seeing all the possible connections between minor things be discussed within Toby's games. Thank you for the fun and engaging analysis's!
9:40 Considering in Chapter 1 when Susie battles Lancer, Kris' SOUL comes from the top right corner into the battle, this would make a lot of sense. This is where Kris was at the time of the gameplay. Toby even pointed this detail out and confirmed that this wasn't a bug in the Fangamer livestream. It seems like Kris' essence is shared throughout the party for some reason. (You're playing the 'Vs. Susie' track from Chapter 1 as the background music which is an interesting synchronicity.)
I mean, yeah. Damage you take is randomly divided between the party members and you only die if all three are knocked uncontious at once, Kris on their own does not matter.
I think LOVE is the stats that you get from enemies in chapter 2 and level probably is the lvl you get after you beat a chapter. E.g. after you beat king.
Theory: (I'm going to follow the line of thinking of Lv being gained when a dark fountain is closed) What if kris/us is with Lv 1 in chapter 1 it is because he has already closed a dark fountain or maybe there is already a person who has already closed it and the Lv connected with Kris's because of DT or because the dark world works differently. ..one minute. What if when we delete the save file and the Lv remains 0, is it because we didn't delete Kris's Save and in fact the person trapped in the darkness of the code? What if Kris may have already closed a dark fountain and that person was stuck in the code due to a glitch and thus Kris was left with Lv 1 and by deleting the previous save we would actually be deleting the previous code where we started the story?
I was playing around with the mod tool and made it so that you gain a “level” (all stats increased) every time you win a fight. I customized the level up script to simply add to everyone’s stats at once instead of doing various checks. I couldn’t put it back by reinstalling the game so I used this video to restore my version. Thanks.
Hey Halfbreadchaos just a small idea for video but did you ever think of tem being self aware? I mean tem armor as tem states decreases in price if you die so is he self aware of resets?
It sort of makes sense that our LV never increases in the Dark World as Kris / The Player never directly kills anyone in the Dark World, assuming Darkners don't count as they're just objects brought to life by a Dark Fountain. Technically speaking Noelle is the one to kill Berdly so our hands are still clean. Which I guess begs the question if Noelle gained an LV in the Dark World or even Light World after casting Snowgrave on Berdly.
The thing to take away from this video is that Deltarune's code is an unholy mess.
Honestly Deltarunes code is probably pretty clean. Imagine something huge like Mario Odyssey. Code is crazy
Toby codes using his stand 「spaghetti western」.
@@Palasid11 Something like Mario Odyssey may have more _complex_ code, but Deltarune's is way more of a mess, to a point of being just kinda poorly programmed in general, tbh.
Game itself is fantastic, so it doesn't really matter, though, does it.
@@KrakaToad Yeah :V
Can confirm, having quite a bit of experience in investigating Deltarune's code myself.
Things that immediately come to mind are, like...
- NPC text and entrance destinations being sometimes set based on their X/Y coordinates
- Most of the NPC dialogue being in just one, 1200 entries long switch case
- Spamton code in general
He's an untrained indie developer. It's likely to happen
My theory is that Dark World "LV" doesn't stand for Level of Violence, but Light Value. The player, Kris, and party's Light Value grows as they seal the Dark Fountains and grow as people, the "light inside their souls" growing stronger.
Nice
Ooooh I like this. Especially when so far, nothing has alluded to LV standing for LOVE.
That would make sense
@@drascia well I think LV standing for love in the light world is simply to show that thar world works on the same rules as undertale, unlike the dark world which, doesn’t. After all the light world has the same menus and dialogue boxes as undertale as well (including labeling the phone as “CELL” which is the worst design desision in the game not related to “so sorry”
Light Value sounds SICK
The fact that LOVE still exists in the Light World makes me extremely paranoid about what's yet to come. It's not so much the fear that we COULD kill someone as it is wondering HOW in the hell Kris could LV up.
In other terms, inb4 the Weird Route concludes with Kris forcing Noelle to pull Rudy's life support
Imagine if Kris somehow gained LOVE between chapters
TBH I had the opposite reaction, because if nothing else, this confirms that Kris hasn't killed anyone yet.
@@thewildgamer64 it's one of those moments when you just stare blankly, in realization
@@ChiliChoccy welp, we don't know if leaving someone to die increases LV. (Like, burying them alive or something)
AND we don't know if LV is specifically only for player or everyone can have it
@@ChiliChoccy Not necessarily. I forgot the exact quote, but Sans said something about it measuring your capacity and willingness to hurt people, and to distance yourself from the pain you've caused. Due to that, I think it'd be reasonable to assume that this just means they haven't intentionally killed someone, but they still could've accidentally killed someone.
Knowing that Toby is tracking all of our choices and giving us an open facing red herring for levels makes me think that we're gonna get a rugpull moment that's the inverse of Undertale
yeah, many people have refused to go on the weird route for the same reason they refused to go on a genocide, it feels bad to twist a gentle soul and permanently ruin your save file... except, this is the WEIRD route, not GENOCIDE 2 ELECTRIC BOOGALOO. It's about how much you can twist the preimposed path in a place where "choices don't matter".
What if the weird route is actually necessary in a save file to get the best possible outcome in another save file?
@@KyrieFortuneso ... save files affecting each other? Tbh that would be insane
@@KyrieFortunethat's sounds awesome
@@Aquabzs Seam knows whether or not you beat Jevil independent of the save file you pick.
@@Aquabzs it happened in undertale for souless pacifist
The reason "false level" exists is likely because it's a display variable that's supposed to provide the illusion that closing fountains increases your level. As we can see, the actual level up code is tied to the chapter you are in. In that sense, it's actually a bug that the save point uses the wrong variable to display your LV, it should be using fakelv as well.
What you didn't mention is that growing stronger by defeating enemies is essentially useless between chapters. Firstly, the HP of Kris, Susie and Ralsei is upper bounded in chapter 2 -- it cannot raise above 160 for Kris, for instance.
Secondly, the level up when closing the fountain doesn't increase your max hp, it lower bounds it. If you've already increased your HP to 160 (on Kris) by the end of Chapter 2, then it will not actually raise at all when going to Chapter 3. Kris' HP will always be at 160 at the start of Chapter 3, no matter what happened. This means that fighting can only raise your HP in the *current* chapter, but it will have zero benefit for any subsequent chapters.
Not so for Noelle however. Her HP is not upper-bounded, and can therefore raise infinitely if we fight enough enemies. It can actually go above 166 if you abort Snowgrave and then fight the mice in the cheese maze.
To be honest, I would refrain from trying to read any meaning out of the specific structure of the code. It seems very clear that the ones working on the code are programming features in as they go, and the whole architecture was not really planned out, leading to such hacks as "fakelv" being required. Might explain why the game is taking a long time to develop.
the whole thing with copying everything from the older demo and adding a prefix of ch1(or smth like that) already proves that the whole thing hasn't been planned out that well, outside of the story.
Just a VERY small correction: fighting enemies to become stronger ISN’T entirely useless, since while there’s a fixed cap for HP that’s the same as closing the fountains, the other thing you get by becoming stronger are the stats increase.
In the current live version (where the cheese maze glitch still exist) it’s possible to fight a total of 40 encounters, thus giving an increase of +4 stats (which is +2 more that what you get after sealing the fountain); in the steam beta version however, since the cheese maze glitch pas fixed, the total encounter is only 39, so just +3 stats increase, only +1 compared to sealing the fountain.
Either way that means that there’s a reward for defeating enemies violently, even if it’s not much.
Now, something i am VERY curious about…is if the game keep tracks of the number of encounters finished with violence BETWEEN chapters, for example: if by the end of chapter 2, 35 encounters were ended with violence, when you use that save file to continue to chapter 3, does the counter stays the same and you need to finish 5 more encounters to get a stats up increase, or it simply gets reset back to zero?
Because if the former is the case, that would mean that the Player would be incentivised to defeat as many enemies as possible to gain many stats increases.
Chapter 3??????
@@peachymunmagentayeah they’re gonna make more deltarune
@@alsartsavience3512I was worrying that not doing violence would make me too weak for a future boss, but it doesn't seem to be the case.
i like that deltarune's code is just as enigmatic as anything ever in this series
Leave it to Deltarune to even make the code itself Make you spin in confusion at the moment.
I mean with all due respect to Toby fox, he is not professionally trained in coding so it makes sense!
Well akshually... These are the (unconventional) game dev rules. It's good for various reasons _(S P E E D)_ to store all of your counters in a giant table and check everything with switch statements. Which is also kinda ironic. Although i know that by no means is this safe coding (hence the mansion warp glitch in ch.2), this is definitely the most optimized one: most of these features were already introduced in assembly. ASSEMBLY.
Love doesn't need to be in Deltarune, because I already love that game.
funny
bone
guy
?
you’re
I believe that the Susie and Ralsei level up even if they aren't in your party because they don't level up, *WE* do. I believe that the soul seems to get stronger whenever we seal a fountain or defeat an enemy with violence. The reason why Kris, Susie and Ralsei get stronger is due to an almost symbiotic-parasitic relation between us and the them. When Noelle joins the party it says "Noelle has gotten stronger" because she herself has gotten stronger without any relation to the soul (that's why she doesn't level up when she isn't in the party).
But susie is the one who cant be contained, she can do things on her own, create her own battle rules (S-action), and yet noelle, who is under control easily, is the one that isnt connected to the soul? Shouldnt susie be the one that doesnt level up when shes away from the party?
Good point. Actually I wanted to add on that ideea. While Susie might be more rebelious, I don't believe she is 100% free. Either due to the profecy, prolonged exposure to our influence or some other more meta reason both Susie and Ralsei become more linked with the player. Before the Sweet Cap'n Cakes fight Ralsei and Susie act because Kris (and by extension us) tells them what to do.
Whenever s-action and r-action are used kris has little to no involvement (see the dialogue that plays when Kris gets knocked out in that fight), implying that we are directly tellying them what to do in theese cases.
@@salt.io257 how does it come noelle has a closer bond to the player despite not receiving level ups, while susie is more rebellious and still receives level ups
1. I don't think that at we can do the snowgrave route because we have a stronget bond with Noelle. Later on in the route this "bond" does get stronger ("You whispered Noelle's name") but at the begining it seems that Noelle's lack of asertiveness combined with her hidden potential allow her to do those things.
2. As I said before I don't know exactly why susie is more tied with the player.
The main reason I came up with this theory was because it felt like a very Toby Fox move to turn a mechanic such as exp share to party members that didn't take part in the fight and give it an in universe explanation.
@@dylanzlol7293 i assume it has to do with the proficiency like the other person said.
Spares and pacifies being tracked separately has me wondering if the choice of whether to spare or pacify an enemy could matter in a future chapter.
Spares are the enemy no longer wanting to fight you, while pacifies are the enemies being forced out of combat against their will. Another important thing to note is that pacifies near-universally require the enemy be beaten to low HP first.
@@omegahaxors9-11 I feel like "near-universally" is exaggerating a lot? I feel like there were a significant number of Give a Boring Speech/Sing a Lullaby/etc-type ACTs, though I admit I never counted what proportion of enemies had that as an option
@@TotalWhackjob The point is that they don't necessarily lose animosity towards the player when they're pacified.
Whether it comes into play or not, the difference makes some sense, if you really think about it. You're not really befriending these people if you Pacify them. Yeah, you're still Sparing them and that matters, but you're not really creating an emotional connection with them like you do with normal Sparing. You're basically just knocking them out so they stop being an obstacle. Given that they attacked you first and you could have done the same instead, they still appreciate the mercy, but they don't really know you.
i was even wondering if pacifying recruited when first playing ch.2
That last "leader' bit was probably not made as foreshadowing, but as a callback. Instead of that neutral-warm "Leader, commands the party with various ACTs", it turns into the more sinister and cold "Leader, commands".
This reminded me of the time i did the snowgrave route. What i did was spare every enemy before encountering Noelle. Then after i freeze everyone and when i got Susie and Ralsei again, i started to spare everyone again. It was interesting because my hp was lower when i face Neo Spamton than it should have been and Queen wasnt sad when i reach castle town, because i had some recrutes from chapter 2. It was like a weird middle point where the route is still pretty messed up but not as bad as it could have been.
i did that too when i did the weird route, only froze with noelle
Yeah, I'm pretty sure speedrunners do this because some enemies, such as Tasque Manager, are faster to spare than to kill.
Maybe the weird route will have different variants depending on your choices?
I always found this interesting. I actually consider your method of doing the route *far* more nefarious, in it's own way. Even moreso if you did a peaceful Chapter One on the same file.
Discovering a new variant?
Honestly I would not be surprised that all the flags were just for some special dialogue if you say, put every enemy to sleep or something.
Probably for sparing instead of pacifying but there are enemies like mauswheel which can't get tired by fighting
The problem with that is the flags are just counting the total number of times you do X thing-- For example, if you spend awhile grinding for money you could pacify a couple hundred enemies, which doesn't really mean much if you also beat people up as well.
Okay so basically Undertale plays on what you expect of RPGs, and Deltarune plays on what you expect of Undertale.
And then he makes “Toby fox simulator” which starts as a puzzle game where you as the annoying dog have to move sprites and scripts to the right place to create undertale and deltarune” but you don’t actually need to complete the puzzles correctly, and if you assign the wrong sprites or scripts to characters they act oddly and if you do so in the right way, you can complete a secret ending which contains an incredibly long poem philosophicaly breaking down the nature of reality which is also the source (in the essolang poetic) for a program that modifies existing copies of undertale and deltarune in ways that are vaguely similar to what you did, and in fact also hides even more secret in the modified versions of the game revealing deeper information about the nature of gaster but in a way that is intentionally incoherent, even more so than the current information, and then if you count the number of ones in the ascii representation of each word in a specific altered dialog file that is intentionally buried between a bunch of unchanged files and also unused both in the original and altered versions of deltarune and seems to describe in this version the prosess of something trying to pull itself together despite incredible pain, you get the coordinates to a door in the middle of nowhere on the side of a mountain which when opened you find nothing, but, if somone stays there over night, at exactly midnight, if they are still awake they will find WD gaster manifesting in front of them in real life, where he would then probably thank the people there for how their continued attention helped him reform himself after being scattered across time and space. Befor probably maybee joining real world society and becoming one of the to rated researchers of all time.
@@algotkristoffersson15 And I thought I wrote long comments, but this... (it's a joke ^^')
@algotkristoffersson15 Can't wait for the full game to come out and find that you predicted everything
Isn’t it the other way around
@@algotkristoffersson15 You broke my brain, can't wait for the craziness to emplify next chapters
I noticed that party becomes stronger with each fountain long ago, so I made a theory that Kris is creating and closing fountains to become strong enough to break free from players control, what do you think about it?
Every single Save Point so far mentions Power. While I disagree with the idea that Kris is doing everything to break free from the Player I think it's very clear they're obessed with the idea of gaining more Power.
It is very possible Kris is trying to gain more Power in order to break free however the Power they're gaining currently is exclusive for the Dark Worlds, on the Light Worlds they're still as weak as ever.
If we consider the possibility that the Roaring will come regardless, as it's prophesied by Gaster, one could see Kris trying to gain more Power in order to fight back the Titans.
That would make more sense because if Kris was trying to break Free from The Player they'd try to gain Power in the Light World, not through violence but maybe through some other mean maybe they'd ask for help as they're capable of limited speech.
But trying to gather Power in the Dark World specifically seems to imply they have a bigger plan regarding that and like I said I suspect it's because they know The Roaring is coming, as Gaster knows and has told us / Ralsei, so preparing for The Titans seems more appropriate as The Roaring will turn the entire Light World into one giant Dark World, making their Power relevant.
@@synthwaverider if kris wanted power to become free, why not try getting stronger in the light world?
Cool theory, but they have an alibi for the Cyber World fountain, so there’s someone else who opened at least that one.
@@dylanzlol7293 it doesn't seem like they can do much without soul and they're none option for a player to kill or fight with town folks, so I think Kris is too limited right now to do anything besides opening portals, but they clearly have some plan, because they did slash Toriel's tiers for some reason
@@Mekap_Oble what, killing light world people in the dark world as a way of becoming free?
They come, do all this investigation and analysis of the code, does a lot of tests and tries to make sense of this tangled script but they remember to us, they're not a programmer.
Dude, you're awesome, you're the only one I've seen that goes through all this trouble to make sense of this game's inner workings
HalfBreadChaos uses they/them pronouns
@@janLilin Oh sorry, srly forgot about it, I'll change it
I think that the reason fatalities in the dark world don't give exp is that the monsters there don't have any to give. That could be because they don't have souls, which could bring up some interesting points.
That is an interesting train of thought. I wonder if that would have anything to do with how Kris can walk around and do things without their soul?
Are they even monsters? We just know that Humans and Monsters from the light world are Lightners, while the people in the dark world are Darkners, but it's never stated what those Darkners are, even ralsei in the legend, it says they need "a human, a monster, and a prince from the dark", ralsei isn't a monster too because it says they need *a* monster, singular, and it never says "a monster from the dark", and of course instead of Lightners it specifies their race so it doesnt get confused with 2 humans or 2 monsters
Darkners are basically like Flowey. Soulless beings given life through determination (either directly injected or indirectly through a fountain). The biggest difference is that darkners can feel compassion (maybe something to do with the fountain itself?)
This would make the black heart on Ralsei's cloak into a neat bit of foreshadowing.
I really find it interesting that Spare and Pacify are considered two different flags, and that they don't have like, a common flag that adds the total. I've tried a Only Pacify run through resolve and have found out that some enemies can't get tired (I believe swatchlings are one of these), and as such I think it will be interesting how pacify vs spare may affect or not different things in future chapters!
They cannot even if you lower their HP like it was in Undertale?
@@ArturFlintchannel Yep! that's what I mean by "through resolve", since it's the general term for hitting a enemy till they become pacifist. For some reason only them, some other enemies, and bosses dont get tired when their health is low.
@@creditsunknown7974 swatchlings not getting tired is because there butlers who work TIRELESSLY for queen.
Whether it comes into play or not, the difference makes some sense, if you really think about it. You're not really befriending these people if you Pacify them. Yeah, you're still Sparing them and that matters, but you're not really creating an emotional connection with them like you do with normal Sparing. You're basically just knocking them out so they stop being an obstacle. Given that they attacked you first and you could have done the same instead, they still appreciate the mercy, but they don't really *know* you.
Swatchings get tired if they're the only one left!
...still impossible for "true pacifist" though
It’s also possible this sort of stuff will be cleaned up when the game reaches full release. Like all the small stuff being tracked will be cut down if stuff is unused (unless it’s used for a sort of stats screen) but who knows at this point.
Thank you so much for always putting captions in your videos! I have sensory sensitivity because I'm autistic and sometimes I have a hard time processing sound because I may be overstimulated and english is also not my native language and I understand english better by reading when I'm having problems understanding sound, it means a lot to me when a youtuber puts accurate captions on their videos
Oh, I thought I was the only autistic person who likes subtitles due to sensitivity issues {only one who comments, at least....}{oh my gosh no amount of edits will allow me to clarify this}! The combination of subtitles and the clear tts voice thingy makes this one of the most assessable channels I have found in a long time for me. Not to mention the fact that there's almost always clarification on which scenes are real and which aren't, which helps with my inability to identify jokes. Yesh, Bread, I agree with this person here. You are incredible.
yeah, the captions are very helpful for me too. i dont mind the text-to-speech, but it can be hard to understand because it often doesnt pronounce words correctly.
toby could probably make one silly little mistake in the code and it could still make a lot of sense to the point of solving year-long questions and being the final puzzle piece to millions of theories
I've got a multi-faceted theory here:
1. The party gains 0 EXP when making an enemy flee because there's no execution involved. Something I did notice, though, is that "you gained 0 EXP" does _not_ appear after a frozen or fatal encounter.
2. I think it's important to distinguish the fact that LOVE stands for level of _violence_ - it measures one's capacity to hurt, not necessarily to kill. And Kris's LV may increase in the light world based on any number of things.
2.5. I think the light world LV has something to do with how much they have damaged "your" SOUL. Notice how they tear out the SOUL twice in chapter 2, arguably being more violent toward it than in chapter 1.
2.75. Violence may not be a bad thing in this instance; self defense is often violent in the same way that justice is a form of revenge.
3. In Undertale, EXP and LOVE are gained when killing a monster, destroying their soul in the process. Perhaps those are linked in a way?
It may be possible that since darkners are based on inanimate objects, they don't actually have souls. But we as the player _do_ have one.
Halfbreadchaos when fulltoastorder shows up
8:30 THIS IS WHAT I'VE BEEN TALKING ABOUT ALL THE TIME!!!
THE "YOUR CHOICES DON'T MATTER" IS THE EQUIVALENT OF UNDERTALE'S "KILL OR BE KILLED", BUT NOBODY LISTENS!
To quote Shayy when first doing the Snowgrave route, "Your choices don't matter HEADASS."
The fact that Noelle only becomes stronger when in the party, while Kris Susie and Ralsei become stronger either if they aren't in the party or are in the party, might have something to do with the fact that Noelle isn't part of the legend, hence she isn't connected by destiny or something.
She is temporarily able to "enter" the legend and alter it in drastic ways that other characters tied to the legend cannot, hence why the snowgrave route exists
1:10 Holy cow I didn't know you could bring an umbrella to the nice cream guy. That's so cool
Theory time.
Lv in dark worlds represent normal level stats in videogames that goes up when you do notable things. Lv in light worlds however represent level of violence. Or how many people you’ve murdered. So when Noelle comes back to the party in the light world, don’t be surprised if her level is 4
you know, now that you mention it, Noelle most likely has LV 2 in lightworld since she was the one who spell snowgrave against berdly and most likely ended up dying.
Noelle's LV will probably stay a mystery, I don't think she'll be back in the party not only because of snowgrave but because of the freezering and thornring being overpowered (only iceshock deals 600~700 damage with the thorn ring) and even if she comes back we probably won't be able to look at her stats just like we can't look a susies' in the light world
I think it's implied that dying in the Dark World makes you "fall down" in the Light World, which is what happened to Berdly. But if a monster falls down and dies, you don't gain EXP for it since they died of natural causes. It's like pulling out someone's life support vs. smothering them with a pillow.
@@fabio5d Actually I think the fact that Snowring and Freezering are just overpowered actually increase the chance that we’ll get it back. As that would run with the theme of Genocide where each individual fight is easier but then at the end the bossfights are just bullshit hard. As we’ve already seen that in ch 2. And I think Trance will allow us to see Noelle’s stats in the lightworld.
@@Data-Expungeded While in a save where you continue a snowgrave route it makes sense to Noelle to defeat enemies in one hit since we'll probably have to get to 100% TP to cast snowgrave in everone if we continue to use Noelle to freeze enemies in a future chapter, the problem is you can get both rings in a normal route of the game as long as you Tell Noelle you're protecting her before the Berdly bossfight, spare him using glare or simply beat him without using the spell we get to keep those items in our inventory and Noelle just acts like if nothing had happened, if she comes back in the party in a save where you have the rings and haven't made "frozen chicken" She'll just be broken because she'll outperform both Susie and Ralsei in terms of damage and healing
Kris is auctually level 3 mastery at moss finding.
2:35 What is a Halloween Pencil?
Edit: I just figured out that it is the Light World version of the Spooky Sword WHICH IS SO COOL. Seriously, I hope we get more stuff like this in the future
Edit 2: I have found more like this so the normal wooden blade is just “Pencil”, the trefoil, which is an unused item is “Lucky Pencil” and the bounce blade is “Eraser”. Nonetheless, this is all so interesting and I do wonder what more of the Light World equivalent to things are
Imagine if Kris tore out their soul, went off screen, and then when they came back their LV was at 2.
Then, there was no Rudy in the hospital.
Bread, the amount of effort you put into these videos is incredible.
Your videos both are very entertaining, and make me think of theories and details about this game i've never even heard before.
It's refreshing to hear theories about things other than Sans, Gaster, etc.
And I love how this is bringing up ideas about the game that make Deltarune all the more intriguing!
Man I still can’t believe that all these years ago we didn’t figure out that the gumball machine in the spamtom sweepstakes
Was the fake chapter 4 secret boss Skuntle Gumballer his small fight was amazing. Until we discovered that kris after removing his soul in chapter 3 actually hid the frozen snowgrave berdly inside the Ice-e Frostbear animatronic and making berdly live with remaining juice.
Dude it was so cool seeing berdly perform the bite of 87 battery acid energy drinks as his final special attack.
???
@@Felipe_9999 don’t worry it was just a random deltarune joke about what will happen at the chapters, Sorry to have posted this on a random bread video that is *completely* unrelated
@@Felipe_9999 In summary I was just doing a version of the skuntle bingoid joke
how I dress to
my wedding: 💁♂️
new half bread chaos video: 🤵
I wonder if our Dark World LV increases because sealing the fountain counts as defeating all Darkners?
Also wonder if it's "false LV" as in, "false level of violence", and not "false level" overall, simply as a distinction between it and Undertale's/the Light World's level statistic.
Poor Halfbread, they have to make sense of Tobi's script of our amusement.
Finally a community who accepts tts
more like “finally, a community that accepts tts.”
@@Data-Expungeded yep
Honestly, I used to just mute these videos and read the captions because I didn't like how the TTS sounded, but over time I warmed up to it.
It's weird how TTS is frowned upon in English Community on UA-cam when Japanese, Portuguese, Spanish, and Chinese videos commonly feature TTS
@HBegaming YT tts is robotic, it's unfamiliar to most people, of course they're gonna get put off by it. The fact you can't even acknowledge this shows how narrow-minded you are.
How does this channel don't have 3M subs??? This is extremely well made, the editing, the various sprites of HBC everything is made with care
Thank you for this HIGHLY informative video! Discovering that it's possible LOVE can be below 1 is HORRIBLY pleasing to hear! >:D
I think what that means is that because that save file (timeline) does not exist anymore your LOVE/LV would be 0.
@@jmupholstery4168 That's certainly one way to interpret it. ;)
@@JaruJaruJ Especially because the same thing happened in Undertale when you go to save for the first time, the save point states that your LV is 0. In addition, you can’t fully ‘erase’ your save file in Undertale without doing Genocide runs, but you can do it in Deltarune easily in the menu of the game.
i honestly think that toby is gonna scare us, like say we do some sort of evil thing near the end of the dark world in like chapter 6 or somethin, come out and see our LV is 2 in the lightworld.
i would be freaked out honestly
like oh my god imagine cutting to a black screen after a chapter and hearing up a slowed down version of the level up sound
Probably a coincidence, but the flag for fatal victories is 44, two 4s, once again referencing the funny death number
I can’t believe you called the Lancer Fan Club the Fun Gang
Noelle being tracked separately might mean that she's not one of the 3 heroes of the prophecy.
In canon, the 3 heroes are supposedly Kris, Susie, and Ralsei. so. yep
I always thought that leveling up from fountains was from the bossfights you just fought because you have defeated a strong enemy, likely through violence, making you stronger. Also the several flags for random things might be because coding can be inconsistent, or may need to be flagged because of a requirement that needed to be bypassed later on in development without messing with the previous code of chapter 1.
God this whole LV situation has been made a lot more fascinating by Deltarune. Someone else in the comment section mentioned that character's LV increases being tied to dark fountain sealing may mean its starts for "light value" which makes sense to me. The other LV I think may stand for level but like a lot of Toby shenanigans its a word play because in games the word 'level' is traditionally applied not to strength but to a specific gameplay area a player enters (think Super Mario's levels). So yeah our savepoint's LV being different based on which chapter we've loaded makes perfect sense in that context.
Man I swear, you make crystal clear content where I just listen to and am like "do tell more". Honestly, you are the only link to UT/DR world for me at the moment. Focus of interest always sift but once a blue moon it is nice to listen to someone who feels like is studying Tobyology with 3 liter of coffee, 2 hours of sleep and thesis deadline in 1 hour.
Thanks for making such [Cold… so cold] content!
Haven’t finished the video yet, but I find it interesting that the flag numbers have two ranges: 40-45, and 925-926. This makes me think that 40-45 were created for Chapter 1 (and mechanics that continue past it), and 925-926 for Chapter 2, since both of those involve Iceshock.
I’d wager 45 was originally intended for something like “magic kills” that was removed from chapter 1, and 925 was meant for separate Chapter 2 tracking for the thornring counter.
That might mean we’ll see 45 again in another chapter if it was a mechanic removed from Chapter 1. And if that flag is “magic kills”, I’m curious what character may be the one to kill, considering that Rude Buster doesn’t kill and Ralsei only seems to have healing and pacifying magic.
Something to keep in mind is that Toby did tell us that one of the upcoming chapters is in the light world, so LOVE may prove to be a factor in the future.
he did? when?
When did he say that?
Where is this message?
Stop quoting Toby without the source.
?
These videos always help me appreciate just how complex and thought out UT and DR are.
the discrepancy between savefile level and party menu level seems mostly like an oversight; both chapters thus far end with sealing a dark fountain, which increase your party's level, which means your party's level at the start of the chapter is the same as the chapter number. and it remains like that for 99% of the chapter, so in most circumstances, the game can just print your current chapter where it's suppose to print your level and there's nothing inaccurate about it. so, those two values were likely either always synced or were outright the same variable during development, but then toby decided to sneak in the little detail of your level going up right after sealing the fountain, modified the party menu code to reflect that ... and forgot to do the same for the savefile code, so it still just uses your current chapter for your level
also it's p. funny how the light world stat menu is literally ripped straight from undertale. i'm much less convinced that light world level will just end up as an artifact of toby's elite coding skills, but i _do_ expect that xp table to either go eternally unused or be quietly cut out of the code when the stat menu starts doing Things in later chapters
i love your videos so much!
I think that the descriptions change by how you act, with Kris called Tactician due to him making tactics to battle with ACT's, while he can also attack to Leader, because he doesn't just do commands now, he liderates everything and instead of planning tacticts just command Noelle to Ice Shock the enemies.
While you're kind of generalizing, I get what you're trying to say. Chapter One's Leader title that becomes the Tactician title is much different from Snowgrave's Leader title. The Chapter One title and Tactician title describes a clever leader that can use ACTS to tactically make a plan. The Snowgrave title feels more like a leader who cares less about making a good plan, and more about being obeyed regardless.
i know some people hate the long time between uploads, but i find it more satisfying to see an already satisfying video from my favourite undertale/deltarune youtuber after a long time for seeing a new upload.
I know this isn't perfectly on topic to THIS video, but I may have found another piece of the "ocean" motif that's been driving you crazy.
In every patient room in the hospital, the wallpaper has a pattern of seahorses and stars (starfish?).
...I'm not sure what to make of this, but maybe it'll help you! :)
your thumbnails still look like what I would expect as a live stream’s thumbnail
Hey Halfbreadchaos I was looking over the concept art for Undertale the other day when I saw an illustration for a removed feature of the ice cave in snowdin. On this piece of concept art you can see a depiction of the angel on the ice caves wall. Of which it eerily resembles Noelle with her distinctive robes and horn.
I don’t care what the topic is. HalfBreadChaos always makes a entertaining video to watch. You with your editors really have gotten better as time has gone on. And this topic was something that is very confusing and much different then how undertale was. The LV shows up in many places and like you showed. Is inconsistent. They must all represent different things and Toby is messing with us because he knows we look for LOVE
my theory is only get LOVE on the weird route, since its the only time you can get a higher Level Of Violence, but you can get LV in the light world.
Heck yes Halfbread's first video since I discovered them, subscribed, and binge watched the whole channel
3:40 This is very interesting information!
5:17 That begs the question of why Toby designates that as the FALSE Level.... How will its falseness be relevant in the future?
So, there's some missing brackets that make that makes it set flag 63 every time an enemy is frozen?
Anyway, great analysis video! Thanks for uploading!
I think it says “false level” because your Dark World level is false while your Light World LV is your actual LOVE.
Besides the amazing research and good editing, it's really cool how you manage to give personality to your videos even when you have text to speech, which also shows that limitations are only an obstacle that can be overcome with time!
Great video, bread!
I love your videos! I always get excited when I see them on the home page. I like to listen to them in my headphones while I do chores or something.
I thought that love and level in the files specifically were for the different "runs" for how your HP increases (like breaking bonds for HP or closing dark worlds)
LV in the SAVE menu could mean the level you're on, as in location or in this case chapter. Possibly more wordplay on the word "level".
I just want to say. halfbreadchaos, if you are ever feeling stressed out about running this channel, it's okay to take breaks and rejuvenate yourself!
The scariest thing is, what if Noelle was LV 2 by the end of the Snowgrave route...?
I mean she killed a lightner (Berdly) via Snowgrave so not closing the chance.
There’s a lot of weird little quirks in Deltarune’s programming that I honestly hope get fixed in the full release
i hope they dont, makes looking trough the code a lot more mysterious, when you dont know what matters and whats just your brain playing tricks on you. it probably makes modding difficult though.
@@Rodrigo-kq3js No, they should be fixed ASAP to minimize any bugs and barriers to development going forward (and hopefully they have by now). I imagine the original source is just as chaotic
@@Rodrigo-kq3js what the hell are you going on about
Another sweet video, well done, I've always wondered about Level. Looks like it's way more complex than I thought!
I definitely think that there will be stuff we'll be doing in the Light World in later chapters.
hi i just want to say that i have been trying and failing to get into deltarune theory videos for YEARS because none of them have ever really made sense to me and none of the people making them have captivated me enough to watch more than one but i just watched all of yours in a row and i love how much they’ve enhanced my interest in a game i already adored so THANK YOU FOR THESE 🩷‼️
Each Deltarune Chapter will have a Secret boss with one of the 7 human SOUL colors being used.
Remember this later.
This was an amazing video! I would never noticed all these details.
Thats a hell lot of effort to check what LV does in deltarune. This was interesting to watch, and thanks for your effort!
Is LV the same thing for the recruited enemies. Because when you check the recruits menu you can see the enemies lv and clicking more info shows the stats of the enemy as Level, Attack, Defense, And Their element. Since it shows both Lv and level as the same number is it the same thing? Or is it different? Also how would they increase their level or Lv? Are they just made with the stats they have? Did they gain them from the fountain? Or did something/someone else Give them those stats?
I love these code dives. On top of just being really fun to listen to HalfBread look at it, they are also just such a constant stream of "Does this have implications or is the Code just Kind Of A Mess". Some things do feel intentional and we KNOW Toby uses the code as part of the art to some degree. But then the code in general just seems to be kind of clunky (how adding a room threw off that part of game so bad it actually caused soft locks and needed multiple updates to fix, chest contents being decided by ROOM for some reason meaning there can never be 2 chests in the same room or theyll need to change it, Save points using Chapter number instead of your actual level probably being a holdover from before implementing the actual Fountain Seal Level up, ...) to a point its both entirely possible and probably LIKELY for a lot of the things that look like tey might mean something to end up just being messy code weirdness with no relevance whatsoever, because for all intents and purposes the code is still code first and a story medium second.
It will be a fun thing when the entire game is out and the entire community goes on a bughunt. Or does the meme-patch concept I have been thinking about where we just change the internal stats to correspond to the entirely made up stats that they show us(Including the example where Spamton Neo supposedly has 8000 HP according to a dialogue Yu-gi-oh reference, but he actually just has 4809.)
This game never stops surprising me, and this channel never stops entertaining.
Huh, how very interesting, I wonder if this will mean anything for the future or not,
I also wonder if we’ll get to FIGHT in the Light World at some point and if so will they look like the FIGHTs in Undertale?
Regardless this was a fun video, you did well,
I wonder what you will cover next? Can’t wait.
I enjoy your videos a lot. It's very cool seeing all the possible connections between minor things be discussed within Toby's games. Thank you for the fun and engaging analysis's!
Wow two new videos in succession it's truly wonderful that even after all this time we are still finding new things
9:40 Considering in Chapter 1 when Susie battles Lancer, Kris' SOUL comes from the top right corner into the battle, this would make a lot of sense. This is where Kris was at the time of the gameplay. Toby even pointed this detail out and confirmed that this wasn't a bug in the Fangamer livestream. It seems like Kris' essence is shared throughout the party for some reason. (You're playing the 'Vs. Susie' track from Chapter 1 as the background music which is an interesting synchronicity.)
I mean, yeah. Damage you take is randomly divided between the party members and you only die if all three are knocked uncontious at once, Kris on their own does not matter.
I think LOVE is the stats that you get from enemies in chapter 2 and level probably is the lvl you get after you beat a chapter. E.g. after you beat king.
Oh wait I think he already said that, oops
Great video. This is so minute, yet so complex! It's amazing
I figured LV wasn't LOVE in Deltarune since it increases between chapters but I sure wasn't expecting them to both be in the code.
Wow, this looked like a lot of work to figure out. Great job!
Theory:
(I'm going to follow the line of thinking of Lv being gained when a dark fountain is closed)
What if kris/us is with Lv 1 in chapter 1 it is because he has already closed a dark fountain or maybe there is already a person who has already closed it and the Lv connected with Kris's because of DT or because the dark world works differently. ..one minute.
What if when we delete the save file and the Lv remains 0, is it because we didn't delete Kris's Save and in fact the person trapped in the darkness of the code?
What if Kris may have already closed a dark fountain and that person was stuck in the code due to a glitch and thus Kris was left with Lv 1 and by deleting the previous save we would actually be deleting the previous code where we started the story?
I just came from watching "THE WOODY THEORY" (yes, also from Deltarune), so another one can't harm me
One of my favorite notifs to see on my phone is your uploads :D
All fun and games until kris takes out our soul and puts us in a cage, leaves, and comes back as lv 2
with a clear advice
like idk.. "kris equiped the knife"or something
Great video!
holy shit I managed to catch a HalfBreadChaos video the day it was uploaded…
I can die in peace
Honestly, props to you for not dissociating fully and all the code becoming static as you scroll through it to find information.
I was playing around with the mod tool and made it so that you gain a “level” (all stats increased) every time you win a fight. I customized the level up script to simply add to everyone’s stats at once instead of doing various checks. I couldn’t put it back by reinstalling the game so I used this video to restore my version. Thanks.
Theres something so comforting from watching Bread's videos at 1AM.
0:52 THE *_[[[[[JUDGEMENT HALL]]]]]_*
Hey Halfbreadchaos just a small idea for video but did you ever think of tem being self aware?
I mean tem armor as tem states decreases in price if you die so is he self aware of resets?
She*
Your videos are the absolute best, Halfbread.
You're so dedicated! It is appreciated I love watching your videos even If I have to wait (♥)
Wow muy interesante el video!! Sigue así!
I'm always so incredibly impressed by all the hard work you put into your videos
It sort of makes sense that our LV never increases in the Dark World as Kris / The Player never directly kills anyone in the Dark World, assuming Darkners don't count as they're just objects brought to life by a Dark Fountain.
Technically speaking Noelle is the one to kill Berdly so our hands are still clean.
Which I guess begs the question if Noelle gained an LV in the Dark World or even Light World after casting Snowgrave on Berdly.
Yeah but we don't even know if she killed Berdly yet! Maybe he was just knocked out and nothing more... Actually, does coma count as a kill?
Sitting down and watching Halfbread vids is now one of my favorite parts of the day