Always cool to see new cats and hear others perspectives, especially with some experience to back it up. Thanks for the video and all the best with your decision and purchase too.
Thanks, Open 46 boats are now becoming available in charter and we plan to do so. Two key considerations for us continue to be the location of the twin helm stations and the galley forward location. Most of the boats going in charter are the Fly versions but there are a few with the "hard top" stern helm locations. I will continue to post videos of our evaluations and sails here on my channel.
We have a couple of key considerations that really limit what boats made our short list. We only want to purchase from a large manufacture that has a good history and strong dealer or factory rep network. Finding a good dealer or working with a direct experienced factory rep is one of the most critical issues. Second, finding a boat with a good compromise between comfort and performance is one of our top considerations. I evaluate the performance - is this a boat I would be excited to sail, and my wife evaluates the comfort - is this a boat that she can make into a home. And of course price defines the ultimate limit of what we can evaluate. Currently our short list is the Open 46 and Fountain Pajot 44 (possibly the new 47 depending on price). Also the new Lagoon 42 might make the list, we are planning to sail on one soon.
We attended the LGM show as well. Nice overall layout on this boat. Fit and finish was well above what I was expecting for a Bavaria, by far the best of the major production boats. I am in agreement with you that this was my favorite of the production boats at the show. One thing of note, they actually have four showers not two as stated in the video. The two guest heads can be used as a wet head (you can see the drains on floor of each head and the faucet head has a retractable flexible extension hose so that it can be used as a hand held shower head or fixed shower when placed in the bracket on the wall). It took a minute to figure out why they didn't just provide each head with a shower stall but given the size of the shared shower stall it makes a lot sense, one big shower trumps two small showers, plus if you just have to have shower when the shared stall is in use, you can use the one in the head. A few things that I had concerns with were the lack of a dedicated nav station in the main cabin. Fixable if you opt for the cabinets and relocated freezer instead of the lounge near the companion way. in doing so you also get a helm station where the fridge freezer is currently located. And the outboard helms (it's funny, I prefer dual helms on a monohaul and single helms on a cat). It’s still workable if you double up on everything including dual engine controls and provide one of the helms with decent enclosure. All this of course will increase the cost of purchase and the maintenance. Overall this boat made my short list primarily because of how well built it is, and the overall sailing performance for a boat designed more as a floating home than an all-out speed machine. As compromises go, is a hard boat not to like.
Hi Will, thanks for the feedback. I completely agree with your comments. Classic way of looking at catamarans is to draw a triangle with equal sides. Label the corners "Performance", "Economy", and then "Comfort". Every catamaran is going to map somewhere in that triangle. For me the Open 46 falls in the right spot, the right compromise between these three metrics.
+Richard Betz I didn't feel that at all and frankly no different from 90% of the monohulls. The great thing about these helm positions was the access from the cockpit (no steps), the ability to interact with people in the cabin and cockpit, visibility, ease of access for docking, and so on. Plus, they were extremely comfortable to sit and control the boat.
Hi YellowSock - still shopping. We chartered a Nautitech O46 in April for a week and we removed it from consideration. There are bunch of reasons why that I can share over email. So this caused us to renew our search. We will be attending the US Boat Show in Annapolis here in a few weeks to look at a few new models that we have yet to see. Currently we are seriously considering the ITA 14.99. Hull No. 1 of the ITA is in production in Italy and we will be sailing on the boat early next year to make our final decision and get a boat on order. We are still deciding what the second best option would be, likely the new FP 47 depending on how we like it when we see it and sail on it. Also considering a Leopard 45 and then on the used market there are few choices depending of course what is actually available when we make a final decision on the ITA. My email is gryan004@yahoo.com if you want more details on our decision not to purchase a Nautitech.
Cool video, just got done spending a week on the open 40(See thumbnail pic). Beautiful boat but the parts I did not like were the open helm stations. You are very exposed to the elements. Of course many may love this about the boat. I did not like the visability. The slope and angle of the lounge area overhead (not the best design). When raining you will get soaked if trying to sit outside. The water runs off and splashes right behind your back. Probably just fixed with the addition of some snap/zip on covers. Lastly when tying off to a mooring ball you line will get snaged in a pinch point between the hull and crossmember on the bow. You can see the space in the video. Otherwise I was really impressed with the open 40 in the protected waters of the BVI. Had a blast sailing it.
+John Gebo Hi John, some good points here and worth while to check out. Pros and Cons on all helm positions. There is a factory option for small awnings and windshields at the helm stations but I think you could do something more interesting after market. Overall, based on my own experience and sailing style, I would take the cons on the duel stern stations over other options. Also, the Open 46 will be available with a fly bridge helm position as well.
+iliohale productions. Thanks for the video, II liked it very much. I'm also looking for a performance cruising cat. I really like the Outremer 45, 51 for the speed you can achieve not these boats, but to also get this boat comfortable, like adding an A/C and other stuff, the price becomes ridiculous. Would you please give me your perspective on how much speed will this boat can do in 15-20 knots of wind on a closed or open reach. Also what about giving up the dagger boards, is that a big sacrifice. I'm planning to go to Grand matte April 2017, any advice on getting there, and should I contact anyone to book sea trials prior to getting there.
Hi Karim, Let's take this conversation direct, I can definitely provide you with some good information. Drop me an email at gryan004@yahoo.com and I will give you my initial thoughts. Thanks
We have not seen an Antares yet live, just videos. Owner feedback on the Antares is very good. My current sense, right or wrong, very well built & equipped, over priced for what you get, older design with poor performance, don't like the galley down, don't like the rigging set up. For us it is not on our short list.
Just did 6 days on an Open 40 off Phuket. Visibility from the helm is a real issue - it's frankly appalling. Saying that access is good without steps from the cockpit is really struggling to find a positive thing to say about it. Visibility is so poor it is actually dangerous to navigate in marinas or with traffic around. The rest of the boat is fine but the low helm position is a real issue that means I for one would never charter this boat again.
+Kamasiri Koh Kood Can't speak to the visibility of the 40 but on the 46 I was very comfortable with it. Prior to seeing and sailing on the boat I was very suspicious that I would like these helm positions. Underway I found a very small area that was blocked. Looking straight forward this was like between 5 to 10 degrees to port or starboard depending on which station you were at. Simply falling off or heading up a few degrees for a few seconds allowed me to see everywhere. This was even better than my last monohull where I was blocked by the headsails and had to consistently fall off or head up like 15 degrees to see around it. Further, on the raised bulkhead locations, the headsails can provide a significant visibility issue. On the Open 46 the headsails do not block you because your line of site is pretty much at deck level. Again, there are pros and cons to every location. Outremer would argue that the combination of the tiller stations and the bulkhead stations are the best option. For me with the type of sailing I plan to do, I am very comfortable with the stern stations on the Open 46 with more pros than cons.
+iliohale Productions glad it's OK for you. It was the worst helm position I'd experienced fixed only by having a spotter at the bow or an annoyingly regular need to run up the steps to see what was going on ahead and to the port quarter. Using the alternative port helm wasn't practical because it didn't have full controls.
6.3 knots of boat speed in 6.5 of True wind is impressive however, remember that the boat is totally empty of gear, provisions, extra equipment one would have in cruising mode, plus all tanks are probably near empty. Still impressive.....
Actually, the boat was being tested for CE certification the following day and the tanks where required to be half full. Also there was at least 12 people on the boat and the owner had already moved aboard for an extended cruise. So I would say it was pretty weighted down.
Disagree, please watch that section of the video where I discuss the pros and cons of the stern helm locations. My experience was that visibility was not an issue.
The open helm stations don't appeal to me much. Adding a bimini or canopy would take away from the design plus the added windage problems. My favorite cats would be the St Francis 50 Mk 2, and the new Balance 526, which have much better helm stations and sight lines and keeps you out of the weather. But that's just my opinion.
Hi Jason, Stay tuned, we are scheduled for a 7 charter on an Open 46 so I will let you know how I feel about the twin stern helm positions after that. I will also be taking much video and will post it as well.
Actually a lot of couples have sailed the Atlantic 47 to their homeport, from Chili, where it was built. An Atlantic 41 was singlehanded around the world recently. The sight lines to the stern from the inner helm station is excellent. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.
Locharald Johansson You will have a lot of great choices within your budget. You will need to really focus on your own requirements. Compromise between price - performance - comfort.
Warting from you preiss mast and plan motor diesel oder electrique panneaux solaires électriques this good for watter chauffe for douche and bad and lavabo wasch méthode logistique
OK, scratch the Bavaria off my list. The whole video looked like one big ad for IKEA. Also I for one would never have a helm station that low and aft of the main views of the boat.
Messieurs de chez NAUTITECH, Bruno Voisard et autres décideurs, permettez moi de vous adresser, en toute amitié, un conseil que, j'en suis persuadé, n'est pas isolé. Beaucoup d'autres sympathisants de la marque pensent comme moi : REVOYEZ ou ABANDONNEZ carrément le concept "OPEN" (Cockpit inutilement surdimensionné, au détriment du carré). Les critiques favorables à son endroit sont très très rares. Vos architectes nous avaient habitué à beaucoup mieux jusque là. Conseil d'un fan frustré.
This modèle nautithec from my better y search this boad from Monaco bisness ok y warting from you live speack from motor and electrique and preiss from my y warting from you communication tank you
Always cool to see new cats and hear others perspectives, especially with some experience to back it up. Thanks for the video and all the best with your decision and purchase too.
Thanks, Open 46 boats are now becoming available in charter and we plan to do so. Two key considerations for us continue to be the location of the twin helm stations and the galley forward location. Most of the boats going in charter are the Fly versions but there are a few with the "hard top" stern helm locations. I will continue to post videos of our evaluations and sails here on my channel.
Sounds cool, hope you get a great charter!
Are there any other cool cats you are looking at also? There are so many out there.
We have a couple of key considerations that really limit what boats made our short list. We only want to purchase from a large manufacture that has a good history and strong dealer or factory rep network. Finding a good dealer or working with a direct experienced factory rep is one of the most critical issues. Second, finding a boat with a good compromise between comfort and performance is one of our top considerations. I evaluate the performance - is this a boat I would be excited to sail, and my wife evaluates the comfort - is this a boat that she can make into a home. And of course price defines the ultimate limit of what we can evaluate. Currently our short list is the Open 46 and Fountain Pajot 44 (possibly the new 47 depending on price). Also the new Lagoon 42 might make the list, we are planning to sail on one soon.
We attended the LGM show as well. Nice overall layout on this boat. Fit and finish was well above what I was expecting for a Bavaria, by far the best of the major production boats. I am in agreement with you that this was my favorite of the production boats at the show. One thing of note, they actually have four showers not two as stated in the video. The two guest heads can be used as a wet head (you can see the drains on floor of each head and the faucet head has a retractable flexible extension hose so that it can be used as a hand held shower head or fixed shower when placed in the bracket on the wall). It took a minute to figure out why they didn't just provide each head with a shower stall but given the size of the shared shower stall it makes a lot sense, one big shower trumps two small showers, plus if you just have to have shower when the shared stall is in use, you can use the one in the head.
A few things that I had concerns with were the lack of a dedicated nav station in the main cabin. Fixable if you opt for the cabinets and relocated freezer instead of the lounge near the companion way. in doing so you also get a helm station where the fridge freezer is currently located. And the outboard helms (it's funny, I prefer dual helms on a monohaul and single helms on a cat). It’s still workable if you double up on everything including dual engine controls and provide one of the helms with decent enclosure. All this of course will increase the cost of purchase and the maintenance.
Overall this boat made my short list primarily because of how well built it is, and the overall sailing performance for a boat designed more as a floating home than an all-out speed machine. As compromises go, is a hard boat not to like.
Hi Will, thanks for the feedback. I completely agree with your comments. Classic way of looking at catamarans is to draw a triangle with equal sides. Label the corners "Performance", "Economy", and then "Comfort". Every catamaran is going to map somewhere in that triangle. For me the Open 46 falls in the right spot, the right compromise between these three metrics.
The light air performance says alot about the boat. Very impressive seeing 6.3Kts in 6.5Kts of wind.
Helm station at the stern seems like it might be a bit scary in a larger following sea...? Love the rest though.
+Richard Betz
I didn't feel that at all and frankly no different from 90% of the monohulls. The great thing about these helm positions was the access from the cockpit (no steps), the ability to interact with people in the cabin and cockpit, visibility, ease of access for docking, and so on. Plus, they were extremely comfortable to sit and control the boat.
Thank you for this nice video. I would love to know for which boat you went in the end and why.
Hi YellowSock - still shopping. We chartered a Nautitech O46 in April for a week and we removed it from consideration. There are bunch of reasons why that I can share over email. So this caused us to renew our search. We will be attending the US Boat Show in Annapolis here in a few weeks to look at a few new models that we have yet to see. Currently we are seriously considering the ITA 14.99. Hull No. 1 of the ITA is in production in Italy and we will be sailing on the boat early next year to make our final decision and get a boat on order. We are still deciding what the second best option would be, likely the new FP 47 depending on how we like it when we see it and sail on it. Also considering a Leopard 45 and then on the used market there are few choices depending of course what is actually available when we make a final decision on the ITA. My email is gryan004@yahoo.com if you want more details on our decision not to purchase a Nautitech.
Cool video, just got done spending a week on the open 40(See thumbnail pic). Beautiful boat but the parts I did not like were the open helm stations. You are very exposed to the elements. Of course many may love this about the boat. I did not like the visability. The slope and angle of the lounge area overhead (not the best design). When raining you will get soaked if trying to sit outside. The water runs off and splashes right behind your back. Probably just fixed with the addition of some snap/zip on covers. Lastly when tying off to a mooring ball you line will get snaged in a pinch point between the hull and crossmember on the bow. You can see the space in the video. Otherwise I was really impressed with the open 40 in the protected waters of the BVI. Had a blast sailing it.
+John Gebo
Hi John, some good points here and worth while to check out. Pros and Cons on all helm positions. There is a factory option for small awnings and windshields at the helm stations but I think you could do something more interesting after market. Overall, based on my own experience and sailing style, I would take the cons on the duel stern stations over other options. Also, the Open 46 will be available with a fly bridge helm position as well.
+iliohale productions. Thanks for the video, II liked it very much. I'm also looking for a performance cruising cat. I really like the Outremer 45, 51 for the speed you can achieve not these boats, but to also get this boat comfortable, like adding an A/C and other stuff, the price becomes ridiculous. Would you please give me your perspective on how much speed will this boat can do in 15-20 knots of wind on a closed or open reach. Also what about giving up the dagger boards, is that a big sacrifice.
I'm planning to go to Grand matte April 2017, any advice on getting there, and should I contact anyone to book sea trials prior to getting there.
Hi Karim,
Let's take this conversation direct, I can definitely provide you with some good information. Drop me an email at gryan004@yahoo.com and I will give you my initial thoughts. Thanks
Nice video. Who is the lady at 4:23 ?
Don't know, another potential buyer out on the test sail.
Have you compared this to a Antares 44i ?
We have not seen an Antares yet live, just videos. Owner feedback on the Antares is very good. My current sense, right or wrong, very well built & equipped, over priced for what you get, older design with poor performance, don't like the galley down, don't like the rigging set up. For us it is not on our short list.
This super catamaran navigation from my y navigation from Bahamas 1 avril
Just did 6 days on an Open 40 off Phuket. Visibility from the helm is a real issue - it's frankly appalling. Saying that access is good without steps from the cockpit is really struggling to find a positive thing to say about it. Visibility is so poor it is actually dangerous to navigate in marinas or with traffic around. The rest of the boat is fine but the low helm position is a real issue that means I for one would never charter this boat again.
+Kamasiri Koh Kood
Can't speak to the visibility of the 40 but on the 46 I was very comfortable with it. Prior to seeing and sailing on the boat I was very suspicious that I would like these helm positions. Underway I found a very small area that was blocked. Looking straight forward this was like between 5 to 10 degrees to port or starboard depending on which station you were at. Simply falling off or heading up a few degrees for a few seconds allowed me to see everywhere. This was even better than my last monohull where I was blocked by the headsails and had to consistently fall off or head up like 15 degrees to see around it. Further, on the raised bulkhead locations, the headsails can provide a significant visibility issue. On the Open 46 the headsails do not block you because your line of site is pretty much at deck level. Again, there are pros and cons to every location. Outremer would argue that the combination of the tiller stations and the bulkhead stations are the best option. For me with the type of sailing I plan to do, I am very comfortable with the stern stations on the Open 46 with more pros than cons.
+iliohale Productions glad it's OK for you. It was the worst helm position I'd experienced fixed only by having a spotter at the bow or an annoyingly regular need to run up the steps to see what was going on ahead and to the port quarter. Using the alternative port helm wasn't practical because it didn't have full controls.
6.3 knots of boat speed in 6.5 of True wind is impressive however, remember that the boat is totally empty of gear, provisions, extra equipment one would have in cruising mode, plus all tanks are probably near empty. Still impressive.....
Actually, the boat was being tested for CE certification the following day and the tanks where required to be half full. Also there was at least 12 people on the boat and the owner had already moved aboard for an extended cruise. So I would say it was pretty weighted down.
Good to hear. Well, that is really impressive then.....
For my opinion this Bavaria is very small for a 46 cat. The 47 Saona is much bigger in and outside.
Yes, however, every boat is a compromise and not every boat will map to everyone's requirements.
Perfect boat if they copy the helms from the Seawind 1600.
Visibility is quite while from the helm? To me that is the worst location to put the helm.
Disagree, please watch that section of the video where I discuss the pros and cons of the stern helm locations. My experience was that visibility was not an issue.
The open helm stations don't appeal to me much. Adding a bimini or canopy would take away from the design plus the added windage problems. My favorite cats would be the St Francis 50 Mk 2, and the new Balance 526, which have much better helm stations and sight lines and keeps you out of the weather. But that's just my opinion.
Hi Jason,
Stay tuned, we are scheduled for a 7 charter on an Open 46 so I will let you know how I feel about the twin stern helm positions after that. I will also be taking much video and will post it as well.
iliohale Productions 一一
Want great helm sight lines etc.. and security -- get an Atlantic 47.
Actually a lot of couples have sailed the Atlantic 47 to their homeport, from Chili, where it was built. An Atlantic 41 was singlehanded around the world recently. The sight lines to the stern from the inner helm station is excellent. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.
looking for a really great cat that will be my home, budget $1,000,000
Locharald Johansson
You will have a lot of great choices within your budget. You will need to really focus on your own requirements. Compromise between price - performance - comfort.
how much is it ??
Base price is in the $400K USD range delivered in France. Likely with options it is closer to $550K USD delivered in France.
Warting from you preiss mast and plan motor diesel oder electrique panneaux solaires électriques this good for watter chauffe for douche and bad and lavabo wasch méthode logistique
OK, scratch the Bavaria off my list. The whole video looked like one big ad for IKEA. Also I for one would never have a helm station that low and aft of the main views of the boat.
Hi Bill, you should watch my review of the boat during our 1 week charter in Croatia.
Messieurs de chez NAUTITECH, Bruno Voisard et autres décideurs, permettez moi de vous adresser, en toute amitié, un conseil que, j'en suis persuadé, n'est pas isolé. Beaucoup d'autres sympathisants de la marque pensent comme moi :
REVOYEZ ou ABANDONNEZ carrément le concept "OPEN" (Cockpit inutilement surdimensionné, au détriment du carré). Les critiques favorables à son endroit sont très très rares. Vos architectes nous avaient habitué à beaucoup mieux jusque là. Conseil d'un fan frustré.
Nice boat, thanks for the reviw. Also most monotonous voiceover ever?
Ummm, thanks I think!
This modèle nautithec from my better y search this boad from Monaco bisness ok y warting from you live speack from motor and electrique and preiss from my y warting from you communication tank you
La grande motte, c'est banlieue-sur-mer !!! Du béton, BEAUCOUP de béton, et des cons, BEAUCOUP de cons !!!
gabon40 it's pretty ugly, I agree!