The two silliest things must be avoiding soy because of 'estrogens' while still consuming dairy, and avoiding soy while still eating beef which is fed a lot of soy.
@@panes840 Dairy still has some good qualities though. It's the most common way the US gets calcium in their diet. The other 'milk' beverages are fortified with calcium, including soymilk. Tofu is made from soymilk. Then what are we left with, Tums?
Thanks for sharing this information. I used to be very afraid of soy, but once you dive into the research there’s no reason to avoid soy. Nowadays I enjoy tofu, edamame, tempeh and soy milk on a daily basis. I’d wish everybody knew about the health benefits of soy.
I listened to this podcast this morning, fabulous!! I work in Equine Nutrition and I am faced with the misinformation often about Soy, we use Soy as a source of Protein and much more in horse feeds, Thank you, I can now just share this podcast. Please! Stop believing some animal study that was produced in the nineties! I eat soy every day and have so for years, and I am a post menopausal woman! Keep up the great work Simon.
Thanks for telling us you work in Soy industry. Yes, there are public concerns about industry involvement in science research. Thanks for your honesty! 🙏
I like to see a non-industry funded long term feeding study comparing GMO soy grown with typical herbicide application levels vs. organically grown soy.
Most of the soy grown for human consumption such as tofu, tempeh, edamame, soy milk, etc. is Organic. The soy that is not organic is fed to farmed animals. So the fear is misplaced: one should think eating animals is more harmful.
@@jellybeanvinkler4878 Who is not sure? You're not sure? Well, you better educate yourself. The data I provided is readily available in WWF reports and the UN Food and Agriculture Organization. See? I cite sources. Crazy concept ! "Pasture raised" not only is a fantasy, but it's highly immoral. It will take several planet earths to feed all the humans this way, plus they will be getting CVDs.
@@jellybeanvinkler4878 Who is not sure? You're not sure? Well, you better educate yourself. The data I provided is readily available in WWF reports and the UN Food and Agriculture Organization. See? I cite sources. Crazy concept !
@@jellybeanvinkler4878 "Pasture raised" not only is a fantasy, but it's highly immoral. We simply don't have the land, and people will be getting CVDs😉
I have eaten tofu, tempeh miso, edamame since the 1960's, at least 16-32 oz total per day. I WISH it would have conferred heftier breasts, but soy hver contributed hormones or symptoms of endocrine malfunction. I find the concerns about soy ironic , given the fact many foods in the US contain flavorings,stabilizers,dyes, that are banned in most other countries. Some US foods still contain iterations of trans fats. I apprecciated the speaker's sincerity and intent information, but he cast a long shadow on his credibility by calling the herbacide glyphosate safe, and declaring absence of health advantage in 1:34:19 non-GMO, organic soy products
Thank you for providing this detailed information on soy consumption! Many questions I had were answered and I found the whole conversation to be quite valuable since I am as an older vegan who is quite dependent on soy as my primary source of protein. My labs are always great so this discussion also helped to substantiate my choices of consuming a healthy diet especially on impacts that I may have been unaware of.
ill always be a carnivore..but love your content and dialogue and delivery of the facts and your transparency when you are giving your personal opinion..great champion of information.
Have you ever considered an episode about osteoporosis? I’d love that. After suffering from an ED for far too long I have low BMD at the age of 32. It would be great to cover this topic not just focused on menopause.
Would be great if the osteoporosis episode would cover vegan protein needs, supplementation of calcium, vitamin D, vitamin K2 and whether there are cardiovascular risks. Thank you for this channel. It's great.
Cantonese Chinese eat a lot of douchi, which is the salted fermented black beans made the same way as natto, but salted and dried. It is used in fish, shellfish, on tofu, stir fried w beef, chicken, steamed w pork ribs for dim sum etc. It is also more concentrated in MK-7 than natto. Soy milk is often consumed for breakfast too.
The point about the environmental impact is that the cow just eats a lot of soy to create that one kilo of meat. So even if it was soy out of the Amazon forest, it would still be better to eat the soy directly than to eat the cow that ate the soy.
Thank you so much, Simon, for hosting another great episode with such relevant, practical, evidence-based information. I stumbled upon your podcast and have really enjoyed it. It also has been extremely helpful as I was starting to wonder if I might need to turn to some animal based products (beyond some fish and eggs that I recently started to eat) to boost protein as I age. I have been plant based for decades and now that I am in my mid-60s, I am increasingly focused on getting sufficient protein to reduce any chances of sarcopenia and frailty (I am also doing strength training as well as other forms of exercise). I know you have had Don Layman on your podcast but I don't think you have interviewed Gabrielle Lyon yet (though I saw you challenged a few things she had said). If you are open to interview her, I would be most interested to hear this discussion on how to ensure you are getting enough quality protein on a plant-based (even plant-exclusive) diet as we age. I believe she has said the optimal is to get at least 100grams of quality protein per day for most people and even possibly higher with 1 gram per ideal body weight in pounds (it is much easier for me to understand the reference to pounds rather than kg so if you can translate that in future episodes I would greatly appreciate it). I am truly grateful to have found you and very grateful for all of your time and effort in digesting the science and communicating it in such an understandable way with practical guidance. 🙏
I’ve been consuming one cup of soy milk and 85 grams of tofu daily. Possibly a stupid quest, how many mg are in soy milk? Am I overdoing it? Cut back to 45 mg of tofu?
I’d like to know more about “short-fall” nutrients mentioned at end of podcast if eating Vegan...”iron and zinc “ were 2 mentioned. Any resources on this? Thank you!
Hello Friends, I'm curious to know which part of the conversation you found the most insightful and engaging. Also, if you have any other questions related to this subject, please post them below this comment. I'll make sure to include them in our next discussion.
I love what you do on this channel. Keep up the good work Simon. Well my question isn't really a question regarding this particular topic but a request. Since this channel exist for having science fact based conversations, Could you please do the same for the whole debate about MSG. I think everyone would be blessed by it. Thank you so much.
Question please: Today I was listening to Peter Attia and Rhonda Patrick. During the interview Peter Attia stated that vegetarians (me) could not get enough Leucine, Lysine or Methionine in their diets. Your take, please.
One problem with a lot of soy milks is they contain calcium carbonate which is the active ingredient in antacids. Last thing i want is to reduce my stomach acid. Only discovered this recently from watching Simnett Nutrition's video on it.
I can't speak to your concern one way or another but for those who are seeking pure soy milk with no added ingredients, if you have one in your area, Trader Joe's sells it.
Three brands come to mind: EdenSoy (unfortified verson); WestSoy; and, Trader Joe's (likely a private label of WestSoy). The plain, unsweetened versions of these brands just contain organic soybeans and water.
Well we don’t all have a farmer Joe’s , and I can’t find a single soy milk without vegetables oils in It! And who knows why they need all the other crap it’s like buying 3 percent almond milk.
I've been following the conversation carefully up until the claim about the safety of glyphosate. Now I question the speaker's impartiality. That doesn't diminish the quality and value of the podcast though. Great work - helps me explore, think, and learn!
Hey Simon! I've already watched this episode, and then came back after doing some research about thyreoid's diseases (hypothyreoid, Hashimoto's, etc.). I've seen the 2011 study that showed that a 20mg supplementation of isoflavones (250-300g tofu?) in people with subclinical hypothyreoidism could worsen the condition, but the only other study I've found from the same author later on that showed no effect in subclinical hypothyreoidism people was with Soy protein (isoflavone free), not soy food. Is there another?
Would you be able to do a video about optimizing testosterone and libido levels in men? I have been struggling with this off and on since I went vegan 6 years ago.
You just don’t get the testosterone if you go vegan. You can have the shots. Vegan diet damages your health in long term and don’t help the planet either. Now you ave feel the damage maybe it’s time to add at least fish. You are harming yourself in reality
Your meant to struggle with it. It has to be lower as that is why sanatorium came up with the vegan life style ! If you want more testosterone there are plenty of bald vegan gym junkies you could get tips on how they got their testosterone so out of wake they lost their hair.
Great episode, best conversation on soy that I have heard. I just wish it had went a little deeper when you had asked him about what happens to strength training athletes who eat more like 200-300mg of isoflavones and he responded that eating soy protein isolate solves that problem. However, many of us want to eat tofu instead of protein powder so it didn't quite answer the question. At another point in the video he did say that up to 8 servings in the studies has been fine, so for now I will stick with 8 total servings of tofu/soymilk per day. That is my take away from this.
aggression: Neal G Simon et al. 2004 semen quality : Jorge E Chavarro et al. 2008 dementia : E. Hogervorst 2008 et al. , Xin Xu et al. 2015 confused huh ?
I love that he is informed by evidence that confirms that glyphosate is safe and that GM varieties are more sustainable based on the evidence. To those who say they will never be convinced by evidence are taking a faith-based position not informed by good science.
Wow! Apparently I was eating way too much tofu. I had no idea that might be of concern. You know you're eating too much soy if you are consuming 2x or 3x that of your guest !! Great channel !!
how many servings were you eating? The guest recommends 4 servings but also mentions during the episode that there are no bad effects in the studies where people eat 8. He only recommends 4 so that people eat a varied diet not because 8 is unhealthy.
Really enjoyed listening to this very controversial topic Simon. I had breast cancer 5 years ago- estrogen + and follow intergrative oncologist Dr Thomas Lodi who highly recommends eating whole organic soy for helping prevent breast cancer reoccurrence🙏🏻
I am interested in VitK2 found in fermented soybeans. K2 is especially high in Natto. Will try to include Soy in my high protein diet. At almost 70yrs oldest OG under the barbell at local YMCA 🏋♂️😊
It would be nice to see anybody who is not affiliated with any products to speak of the safety of a product. I never hear an olive oil affiliate speak highly of soy & vice versa. Its so frustrating to me...I have a hard time believing the science.
I found Mark Messina's position on soy in general and isoflavones in particular to be persuasive. However, I felt his position on ultra processed soy foods to be conflicted. Apparently, soy milk that is made with just soy beans and water is not considered an ultra processed food while soy milk with gums, emulsifiers, flavors, sweeteners, and other additives is considered ultra processed. I know the rules in this forum request that we focus on the argument and not on the person. However, I have to point out that ultra process soy foods are big profit makers for the soy industry much more so than lightly processed soy foods. Mark Messina is essentially a representative of the soy industry, so I think this position on the highly profitable ultra processed soy foods needs to be considered in light of that. There's abundant evidence that ultra processed foods of all kinds have very negative health impact. I don't think there is any good reason to exclude soy products from this growing body of evidence. Although, I do agree that foods like breakfast cereals are probably far more problematic than things like the impossible burger. I think the most prudent way to eat a vegan diet is to stick to foods that are unprocessed or only lightly processed and give consideration to the traditional cultural uses of such foods. Additional comment: I just went back to the episode, and Mark Messina mentions that almost all of the clinical studies on soy have been done on soy protein isolate. He makes a valid point that it would be very difficult to get people to consume as much tofu on a daily basis to test the hypothesis. However, research of that sort tells me little or nothing about my own consumption which is exclusively of soy milk that is not ultra processed, tofu, and unpasteurized miso.
It's been around for thousands of years, they used to feed soy milk to infants in ancient China who didn't have access to breast milk. Of course it wasn't perfect but it allowed the baby to survive for the first months of their life before they could start eating regular food.
Simon, I really appreciate you presenting all these scientists discussing both benefits and limitations of their findings. Some listeners have brought up the issue of conflict of interest. Sure, there is a conflict of interest here too, just like Dr Layman and others have, and all explained extensively why. I think Dr Messina seems to display a degree of integrity that I do respect and, mostly, I trust you to select and present these individuals and so far I am truly impressed and grateful with regards of your selection. Dr Messina is not selling a supplement or claiming "miracle effects" from soy. Just reporting what has been studied so far. I do also find soy is underrated. It is fairly cheap, easy to find and prepare. At the end of the day, we will never have hard data about effects on breast cancer, thyroid function, fertility and so on. However, soy remains an excellent source of inexpensive protein.
I do really like the topic because I really like soy and Simon is an amazing interviewer. But I don't like the guest because I fell like he is selling me something, and I do have concerns about these beans because I have endometriosis and I can actually fell how affects me when I eat it. I would love to see an interview with someone neutral and even more if they talk about women's health and endometriosis.
Very frustrating hearing about the lack of funding for research, but then the frequent reference to junk science using animals. We wouldn't drive a car where the brakes work only 5% of the time nor would we buy a cell phone that drops 95% of the calls. So why waste precious research dollars on animal studies that have the same rate of failure when results are applied to humans? We need to fund compassionate, cost-effective and human-relevant research.
This really has to be the most disappointing podcast that Simon Hill ever made. Consulting an industry representative for his opinion makes absolutely no sense. Organic soy is not mentioned and the glyphosate issue is glossed over. It's like asking I meat industry expert whether red meat is healthy or not without even touching upon grass-fed meat! Come on Simon, You are way too intelligent and way too thorough to let this get by you.
I eliminated soy 20 years ago and immediately all of my chronic health issues ceased. My skin cleared up, hair grew back and stopped having viscous canker sores. Most importantly though, my entire digestive tract calmed down, a condition that had plagued most of my adult life. I’m convinced that I had genetic aversion to soy which first appeared as severe deep cystic acne as a teenager, and which persisted until I stopped eating soy at age 45. Perhaps certain strains of genetically modified soy were the problem. I’ll never know. The simple truth for me was that soybean oil and soy protein, including tofu were in so many of the foods I was eating all my life, including bread, mayo, salad dressing and many other prepared foods. The elimination of the chronic inflammation of my mucosa changed my life forever and was only discovered by my own experiments.
Dr Mark Messina is from Soy Nutrition Institute Global supported by United Soy Bean board which represents almost 600,000 US soybean farmers and other companies involved in soy products. I wouldn't rely on his claims!
The problem with soy in the west is that it’s promoted as a meat alternative and consumed (by some people) in ridiculous volumes. When I lived in Japan, I consumed a reasonable amount of soy (and still do), but soy in Asia is seen as just a bean, not some kind of meat alternative. I’m on a keto diet and consume fermented beans daily, often soy. It’s totally fine and has a lot of health benefits. Just don’t overdo it.
I think this is a totally valid question though, given how much slanted "science" has been put out by industry (Coke, etc.) But it's also important to understand how the science is done and how studies are designed, which is a point Simon has made before. If an industry provides an honest view of the science, it can be extremely helpful.
Of course there's a conflict of interest. I don't understand why my response had been deleted twice. I shared this link and it was deleted twice ua-cam.com/video/qSnNJ1Vq95A/v-deo.html
58:40 If you want the concentrated protein for body recomp/fitness purposes, but also want the best of both worlds (isoflavones that soy products have but more of the protein that you get from soy isolate), you can just get a soy isoflavone supplement and take it with your soy isolate protein shakes/supplement, or add it to food that you add soy isolate too. If I make a high protein bread with soy isolate I can add a few drops of soy isoflavones in to help “add back” and make it more like whole soy food to some degree and get the benefits of the increased soy protein and isoflavones. This especially helps with fitness minded ppl who don’t want to use too much sky milk or tofu for protein sources when they’re cutting calories because they come won’t more fat calories than soy protein isolate does.
Why go through that trouble? It'd be easier and cheaper to add in fine TVP or soy flour into the dough and be done with it. You'll get both the protein and isoflavanoids with relatively low carbs at the same time.
@@boxerfencerll you’re not really going through trouble to do it if you consume protein/soy shakes already. And soy isolate in a base or soy milk probably tastes better in most shakes than just the isolate itself added anyway. Many people like me already consume protein shakes so it wouldn’t be going out of the way to do it. We get and consume soy milk anyway. I already consume texturized soy protein but most people want variation in their diet with regards to food in general and soy food too. And they come in handy when you don’t have time to cook but still want the added isoflavnes. The comment was addressing soy isolate and those who already consume soy isolate. Most who consume it are consuming it in shake form for the convenience, so using TVP or sharing to just use TVP wouldn’t make sense, otherwise they’d be consuming that over isolate, in most cases.
@@TruthsSake it makes economical sense. TVP is much cheaper than isolate or isoflavones, and adding in one ingrediant rather than two is more convenient. Also, often not considered, soy TVP or TSP contains a lot of fiber, which is the sort of thing you want in bread, which saves on adding a separate third ingredient and assoceated aforementioned covenience.
@@boxerfencer Sure it’s more economic, but the point was about convenience. People will pay more for convenience if their time is valuable. I am one of them. Time is also money. Cooking with TVP is not more convenient because you still have to cook with it or prepare it. It’s only convenient if you batch cook food with it to travel with or whatever. But even then not everyone can travel that way. But when you you don’t acce time or have unexpected things come up especially, having a protein powder on hand which takes up little to no room and making a shake is hands down going to be more convenient to most people. Otherwise there wouldn’t be much of a market for protein shakes. Both have their place.
Are you afraid of Soy? Since you are sharing a personal experience my experience is that many of my most intense and noticeable hot flashes came when I was thinking about things that affected me emotionally. Perhaps it was all in your mind based on fear
Hey thanks for this and all that you are doing!
The two silliest things must be avoiding soy because of 'estrogens' while still consuming dairy, and avoiding soy while still eating beef which is fed a lot of soy.
This
@@panes840 Dairy still has some good qualities though. It's the most common way the US gets calcium in their diet. The other 'milk' beverages are fortified with calcium, including soymilk. Tofu is made from soymilk. Then what are we left with, Tums?
Or having a problem with soy farming when most of it is fed to livestock as far as I know...
Just eat carnivore and you don't have the soybean dilemma. Simple as that.
@@oliverstrika5201🤪
Thanks for sharing this information. I used to be very afraid of soy, but once you dive into the research there’s no reason to avoid soy. Nowadays I enjoy tofu, edamame, tempeh and soy milk on a daily basis. I’d wish everybody knew about the health benefits of soy.
I eat tofu once a day, pretty much every day. I just try to eat organic non-gmo stuff, since that's traditional.
@@adim00lahhow do you choke it down?! The stuff is grotesque. 🤢
I listened to this podcast this morning, fabulous!! I work in Equine Nutrition and I am faced with the misinformation often about Soy, we use Soy as a source of Protein and much more in horse feeds, Thank you, I can now just share this podcast. Please! Stop believing some animal study that was produced in the nineties! I eat soy every day and have so for years, and I am a post menopausal woman! Keep up the great work Simon.
Thanks for telling us you work in Soy industry. Yes, there are public concerns about industry involvement in science research. Thanks for your honesty! 🙏
"It's not a poison. It's not a miracle. It's a bean." :-)
I like to see a non-industry funded long term feeding study comparing GMO soy grown with typical herbicide application levels vs. organically grown soy.
Most of the soy grown for human consumption such as tofu, tempeh, edamame, soy milk, etc. is Organic. The soy that is not organic is fed to farmed animals. So the fear is misplaced: one should think eating animals is more harmful.
@@vasisimari92058not so sure about most soy consumed by Humans being non GMO!?
But, eating pasture raised, grass fed animals is the only way to go.
@@jellybeanvinkler4878 Who is not sure? You're not sure? Well, you better educate yourself.
The data I provided is readily available in WWF reports and the UN Food and Agriculture Organization. See? I cite sources. Crazy concept !
"Pasture raised" not only is a fantasy, but it's highly immoral. It will take several planet earths to feed all the humans this way, plus they will be getting CVDs.
@@jellybeanvinkler4878
Who is not sure? You're not sure? Well, you better educate yourself.
The data I provided is readily available in WWF reports and the UN Food and Agriculture Organization. See? I cite sources. Crazy concept !
@@jellybeanvinkler4878
"Pasture raised" not only is a fantasy, but it's highly immoral. We simply don't have the land, and people will be getting CVDs😉
Good interview.
I have eaten tofu, tempeh miso, edamame since the 1960's, at least 16-32 oz total per day. I WISH it would have conferred heftier breasts, but soy hver contributed hormones or symptoms of endocrine malfunction. I find the concerns about soy ironic , given the fact many foods in the US contain flavorings,stabilizers,dyes, that are banned in most other countries. Some US foods still contain iterations of trans fats. I apprecciated the speaker's sincerity and intent information, but he cast a long shadow on his credibility by calling the herbacide glyphosate safe, and declaring absence of health advantage in 1:34:19 non-GMO, organic soy products
Thank you for providing this detailed information on soy consumption! Many questions I had were answered and I found the whole conversation to be quite valuable since I am as an older vegan who is quite dependent on soy as my primary source of protein. My labs are always great so this discussion also helped to substantiate my choices of consuming a healthy diet especially on impacts that I may have been unaware of.
ill always be a carnivore..but love your content and dialogue and delivery of the facts and your transparency when you are giving your personal opinion..great champion of information.
Have you ever considered an episode about osteoporosis? I’d love that. After suffering from an ED for far too long I have low BMD at the age of 32. It would be great to cover this topic not just focused on menopause.
@@TheProofWithSimonHill And what is the result of your considerations? 😇😇
Would be great if the osteoporosis episode would cover vegan protein needs, supplementation of calcium, vitamin D, vitamin K2 and whether there are cardiovascular risks. Thank you for this channel. It's great.
Cantonese Chinese eat a lot of douchi, which is the salted fermented black beans made the same way as natto, but salted and dried. It is used in fish, shellfish, on tofu, stir fried w beef, chicken, steamed w pork ribs for dim sum etc. It is also more concentrated in MK-7 than natto. Soy milk is often consumed for breakfast too.
The point about the environmental impact is that the cow just eats a lot of soy to create that one kilo of meat. So even if it was soy out of the Amazon forest, it would still be better to eat the soy directly than to eat the cow that ate the soy.
Thank you so much, Simon, for hosting another great episode with such relevant, practical, evidence-based information. I stumbled upon your podcast and have really enjoyed it. It also has been extremely helpful as I was starting to wonder if I might need to turn to some animal based products (beyond some fish and eggs that I recently started to eat) to boost protein as I age. I have been plant based for decades and now that I am in my mid-60s, I am increasingly focused on getting sufficient protein to reduce any chances of sarcopenia and frailty (I am also doing strength training as well as other forms of exercise). I know you have had Don Layman on your podcast but I don't think you have interviewed Gabrielle Lyon yet (though I saw you challenged a few things she had said). If you are open to interview her, I would be most interested to hear this discussion on how to ensure you are getting enough quality protein on a plant-based (even plant-exclusive) diet as we age. I believe she has said the optimal is to get at least 100grams of quality protein per day for most people and even possibly higher with 1 gram per ideal body weight in pounds (it is much easier for me to understand the reference to pounds rather than kg so if you can translate that in future episodes I would greatly appreciate it). I am truly grateful to have found you and very grateful for all of your time and effort in digesting the science and communicating it in such an understandable way with practical guidance. 🙏
I’ve been consuming one cup of soy milk and 85 grams of tofu daily. Possibly a stupid quest, how many mg are in soy milk? Am I overdoing it? Cut back to 45 mg of tofu?
Really appreciate the reply! Thank you so much.
What was the reply?
@@kathy4180 85 grams tofu plus one cup of soy milk is absolutely fine.
@@wallyrbc Why can't we see the reply?
Good info. thank you.
Thanks for the excellent discussion. Now it only the anti-soy influencers would listen to this.
Anti-soy influencers don't want to hear the truth lol
Thanks! Very informative!
Really informative - thank you!
Glyphosate is safe? I really find this hard to believe!
the animal you eating also has glyphosate.
I’d like to know more about “short-fall” nutrients mentioned at end of podcast if eating Vegan...”iron and zinc “ were 2 mentioned. Any resources on this? Thank you!
absoleutely brilliant!! all the soy related myth answered at one stop. great
Hello Friends,
I'm curious to know which part of the conversation you found the most insightful and engaging. Also, if you have any other questions related to this subject, please post them below this comment. I'll make sure to include them in our next discussion.
I love what you do on this channel. Keep up the good work Simon. Well my question isn't really a question regarding this particular topic but a request. Since this channel exist for having science fact based conversations, Could you please do the same for the whole debate about MSG. I think everyone would be blessed by it. Thank you so much.
Question please: Today I was listening to Peter Attia and Rhonda Patrick. During the interview Peter Attia stated that vegetarians (me) could not get enough Leucine, Lysine or Methionine in their diets. Your take, please.
Thank you, Simon-- so much disinformation out there.@@TheProofWithSimonHill
They didn’t state it as a fact but something to keep in mind.
Rhonda is kinda a know it all.
One problem with a lot of soy milks is they contain calcium carbonate which is the active ingredient in antacids. Last thing i want is to reduce my stomach acid. Only discovered this recently from watching Simnett Nutrition's video on it.
I can't speak to your concern one way or another but for those who are seeking pure soy milk with no added ingredients, if you have one in your area, Trader Joe's sells it.
@@panes840 possibly but it's still concerning that they'd put antacid in soy milk, in quite high quantities sometimes too.
There are lots of soy milks available without the ingredient you mention.
@@tanyasydney2235 Really? At my local supermarket I can't find a single one without it.
Three brands come to mind: EdenSoy (unfortified verson); WestSoy; and, Trader Joe's (likely a private label of WestSoy). The plain, unsweetened versions of these brands just contain organic soybeans and water.
I like the soy milk from Trader Joes. Two ingredients: organic soy beans and water. Doesn't exactly sound "ultra processed".
Ditto!
Well we don’t all have a farmer Joe’s , and I can’t find a single soy milk without vegetables oils in It! And who knows why they need all the other crap it’s like buying 3 percent almond milk.
I've been following the conversation carefully up until the claim about the safety of glyphosate. Now I question the speaker's impartiality. That doesn't diminish the quality and value of the podcast though. Great work - helps me explore, think, and learn!
Hey Simon! I've already watched this episode, and then came back after doing some research about thyreoid's diseases (hypothyreoid, Hashimoto's, etc.). I've seen the 2011 study that showed that a 20mg supplementation of isoflavones (250-300g tofu?) in people with subclinical hypothyreoidism could worsen the condition, but the only other study I've found from the same author later on that showed no effect in subclinical hypothyreoidism people was with Soy protein (isoflavone free), not soy food. Is there another?
Would you be able to do a video about optimizing testosterone and libido levels in men? I have been struggling with this off and on since I went vegan 6 years ago.
@@TheProofWithSimonHill Yay!!
You just don’t get the testosterone if you go vegan. You can have the shots. Vegan diet damages your health in long term and don’t help the planet either. Now you ave feel the damage maybe it’s time to add at least fish. You are harming yourself in reality
Your meant to struggle with it. It has to be lower as that is why sanatorium came up with the vegan life style ! If you want more testosterone there are plenty of bald vegan gym junkies you could get tips on how they got their testosterone so out of wake they lost their hair.
Great episode, best conversation on soy that I have heard. I just wish it had went a little deeper when you had asked him about what happens to strength training athletes who eat more like 200-300mg of isoflavones and he responded that eating soy protein isolate solves that problem. However, many of us want to eat tofu instead of protein powder so it didn't quite answer the question. At another point in the video he did say that up to 8 servings in the studies has been fine, so for now I will stick with 8 total servings of tofu/soymilk per day. That is my take away from this.
aggression: Neal G Simon et al. 2004
semen quality : Jorge E Chavarro et al. 2008
dementia : E. Hogervorst 2008 et al. , Xin Xu et al. 2015
confused huh ?
I got SEVERE hot flashes every time I ate soy so it definitely has an estrogenic effect.
@@cammieklund That is extremely rare, I eat soy all that time and get regular blood work done. My estrogen is just fine.
Okinawans have some of the highest life expectancy in the world. And tofu was their main source of protein, nuff said.
I love that he is informed by evidence that confirms that glyphosate is safe and that GM varieties are more sustainable based on the evidence. To those who say they will never be convinced by evidence are taking a faith-based position not informed by good science.
Wow! Apparently I was eating way too much tofu. I had no idea that might be of concern. You know you're eating too much soy if you are consuming 2x or 3x that of your guest !! Great channel !!
how many servings were you eating? The guest recommends 4 servings but also mentions during the episode that there are no bad effects in the studies where people eat 8. He only recommends 4 so that people eat a varied diet not because 8 is unhealthy.
I usually eat one serving of tofu per day.
Really enjoyed listening to this very controversial topic Simon. I had breast cancer 5 years ago- estrogen + and follow intergrative oncologist Dr Thomas Lodi who highly recommends eating whole organic soy for helping prevent breast cancer reoccurrence🙏🏻
Wonderful, wonderful interview Simon! It answered so many common questions. Soy is King! 👍😊
I didn’t understand the response about soy’s affect on migraine. Was that a yes or a no? Where is that paper please? Thankyou!
Soooo good 👍
I am interested in VitK2 found in fermented soybeans. K2 is especially high in Natto. Will try to include Soy in my high protein diet. At almost 70yrs oldest OG under the barbell at local YMCA 🏋♂️😊
It would be nice to see anybody who is not affiliated with any products to speak of the safety of a product. I never hear an olive oil affiliate speak highly of soy & vice versa. Its so frustrating to me...I have a hard time believing the science.
Where’s the correlation between soy and olive oil? That’s no either or?
I eat organic soy daily but I refuse to consume soy bean oil because it is produced using chemicals.
I found Mark Messina's position on soy in general and isoflavones in particular to be persuasive. However, I felt his position on ultra processed soy foods to be conflicted. Apparently, soy milk that is made with just soy beans and water is not considered an ultra processed food while soy milk with gums, emulsifiers, flavors, sweeteners, and other additives is considered ultra processed. I know the rules in this forum request that we focus on the argument and not on the person. However, I have to point out that ultra process soy foods are big profit makers for the soy industry much more so than lightly processed soy foods. Mark Messina is essentially a representative of the soy industry, so I think this position on the highly profitable ultra processed soy foods needs to be considered in light of that. There's abundant evidence that ultra processed foods of all kinds have very negative health impact. I don't think there is any good reason to exclude soy products from this growing body of evidence. Although, I do agree that foods like breakfast cereals are probably far more problematic than things like the impossible burger. I think the most prudent way to eat a vegan diet is to stick to foods that are unprocessed or only lightly processed and give consideration to the traditional cultural uses of such foods.
Additional comment: I just went back to the episode, and Mark Messina mentions that almost all of the clinical studies on soy have been done on soy protein isolate. He makes a valid point that it would be very difficult to get people to consume as much tofu on a daily basis to test the hypothesis. However, research of that sort tells me little or nothing about my own consumption which is exclusively of soy milk that is not ultra processed, tofu, and unpasteurized miso.
Soy formula for babies has been around for a long time. I know someone who’s now in her mid fifties and was fed soy formula as a baby.
It's been around for thousands of years, they used to feed soy milk to infants in ancient China who didn't have access to breast milk. Of course it wasn't perfect but it allowed the baby to survive for the first months of their life before they could start eating regular food.
Simon, I really appreciate you presenting all these scientists discussing both benefits and limitations of their findings. Some listeners have brought up the issue of conflict of interest. Sure, there is a conflict of interest here too, just like Dr Layman and others have, and all explained extensively why. I think Dr Messina seems to display a degree of integrity that I do respect and, mostly, I trust you to select and present these individuals and so far I am truly impressed and grateful with regards of your selection. Dr Messina is not selling a supplement or claiming "miracle effects" from soy. Just reporting what has been studied so far. I do also find soy is underrated. It is fairly cheap, easy to find and prepare. At the end of the day, we will never have hard data about effects on breast cancer, thyroid function, fertility and so on. However, soy remains an excellent source of inexpensive protein.
So is soy beneficial or not? Should we be eating it
Did you listen to the full ep?
Thankyou, adding a serving of TVP to my beef stew to right now. 🙏🏻👹🏋🏻
I do really like the topic because I really like soy and Simon is an amazing interviewer. But I don't like the guest because I fell like he is selling me something, and I do have concerns about these beans because I have endometriosis and I can actually fell how affects me when I eat it.
I would love to see an interview with someone neutral and even more if they talk about women's health and endometriosis.
Very frustrating hearing about the lack of funding for research, but then the frequent reference to junk science using animals. We wouldn't drive a car where the brakes work only 5% of the time nor would we buy a cell phone that drops 95% of the calls. So why waste precious research dollars on animal studies that have the same rate of failure when results are applied to humans? We need to fund compassionate, cost-effective and human-relevant research.
This really has to be the most disappointing podcast that Simon Hill ever made. Consulting an industry representative for his opinion makes absolutely no sense. Organic soy is not mentioned and the glyphosate issue is glossed over. It's like asking I meat industry expert whether red meat is healthy or not without even touching upon grass-fed meat! Come on Simon, You are way too intelligent and way too thorough to let this get by you.
GMO is the way to go! 👍
I eliminated soy 20 years ago and immediately all of my chronic health issues ceased.
My skin cleared up, hair grew back and stopped having viscous canker sores.
Most importantly though, my entire digestive tract calmed down, a condition that had plagued most of my adult life.
I’m convinced that I had genetic aversion to soy which first appeared as severe deep cystic acne as a teenager, and which persisted until I stopped eating soy at age 45.
Perhaps certain strains of genetically modified soy were the problem. I’ll never know.
The simple truth for me was that soybean oil and soy protein, including tofu were in so many of the foods I was eating all my life, including bread, mayo, salad dressing and many other prepared foods.
The elimination of the chronic inflammation of my mucosa changed my life forever and was only discovered by my own experiments.
Dr Mark Messina is from Soy Nutrition Institute Global supported by United Soy Bean board which represents almost 600,000 US soybean farmers and other companies involved in soy products. I wouldn't rely on his claims!
@@TheProofWithSimonHillyou discussed that for 5 minutes. His response "my research papers also include authors without conflict of interest" 😅
@@hans471 which is a fair point for him to make if out of 10 authors ONLY 3 are associated with the soy industry, so not even half the authors
The problem with soy in the west is that it’s promoted as a meat alternative and consumed (by some people) in ridiculous volumes. When I lived in Japan, I consumed a reasonable amount of soy (and still do), but soy in Asia is seen as just a bean, not some kind of meat alternative. I’m on a keto diet and consume fermented beans daily, often soy. It’s totally fine and has a lot of health benefits. Just don’t overdo it.
@@panes840 I just ate a whole can of tomato paste. That was probably 10 cups...
Everyone believes something.
Mark Messina, PhD believes that glyphosate is safe.
Is there not a conflict of interest here? Given the good doctor’s organisation is funded by the soy industry.
Ignore my comment (I was only a few minutes in). You address this question quite comprehensively.
I think this is a totally valid question though, given how much slanted "science" has been put out by industry (Coke, etc.) But it's also important to understand how the science is done and how studies are designed, which is a point Simon has made before. If an industry provides an honest view of the science, it can be extremely helpful.
Of course there's a conflict of interest. I don't understand why my response had been deleted twice. I shared this link and it was deleted twice ua-cam.com/video/qSnNJ1Vq95A/v-deo.html
58:40 If you want the concentrated protein for body recomp/fitness purposes, but also want the best of both worlds (isoflavones that soy products have but more of the protein that you get from soy isolate), you can just get a soy isoflavone supplement and take it with your soy isolate protein shakes/supplement, or add it to food that you add soy isolate too. If I make a high protein bread with soy isolate I can add a few drops of soy isoflavones in to help “add back” and make it more like whole soy food to some degree and get the benefits of the increased soy protein and isoflavones. This especially helps with fitness minded ppl who don’t want to use too much sky milk or tofu for protein sources when they’re cutting calories because they come won’t more fat calories than soy protein isolate does.
Why go through that trouble? It'd be easier and cheaper to add in fine TVP or soy flour into the dough and be done with it. You'll get both the protein and isoflavanoids with relatively low carbs at the same time.
That’s smart.
@@boxerfencerll you’re not really going through trouble to do it if you consume protein/soy shakes already. And soy isolate in a base or soy milk probably tastes better in most shakes than just the isolate itself added anyway. Many people like me already consume protein shakes so it wouldn’t be going out of the way to do it. We get and consume soy milk anyway. I already consume texturized soy protein but most people want variation in their diet with regards to food in general and soy food too. And they come in handy when you don’t have time to cook but still want the added isoflavnes. The comment was addressing soy isolate and those who already consume soy isolate. Most who consume it are consuming it in shake form for the convenience, so using TVP or sharing to just use TVP wouldn’t make sense, otherwise they’d be consuming that over isolate, in most cases.
@@TruthsSake it makes economical sense. TVP is much cheaper than isolate or isoflavones, and adding in one ingrediant rather than two is more convenient.
Also, often not considered, soy TVP or TSP contains a lot of fiber, which is the sort of thing you want in bread, which saves on adding a separate third ingredient and assoceated aforementioned covenience.
@@boxerfencer
Sure it’s more economic, but the point was about convenience. People will pay more for convenience if their time is valuable. I am one of them. Time is also money.
Cooking with TVP is not more convenient because you still have to cook with it or prepare it. It’s only convenient if you batch cook food with it to travel with or whatever. But even then not everyone can travel that way. But when you you don’t acce time or have unexpected things come up especially, having a protein powder on hand which takes up little to no room and making a shake is hands down going to be more convenient to most people. Otherwise there wouldn’t be much of a market for protein shakes. Both have their place.
“Glyphosate is safe” (Mark Messina, PhD)
Right. Like I'm going to wait until the gods of science decide to do studies to determine if I should eat foods with added chemicals No!
I refuse to consume pee protein no matter what.
Debate Aman Duggal if soy is safe to consume.
Debate billions of Asians if soy is safe to consume
💜
Lol this guy gets a paycheck from the soybean industry... Very unbiased I am sure
Soyboy! 👹🙏🏻🏋🏻
I got SEVERE hot flashes every time I ate soy so it definitely has an estrogenic effect.
What is the point of you putting this comment all over this comment section?
Sounds like you have a bias against soy.
@@indigoandbrown I'm just sharing my experience.☺️
Are you afraid of Soy? Since you are sharing a personal experience my experience is that many of my most intense and noticeable hot flashes came when I was thinking about things that affected me emotionally. Perhaps it was all in your mind based on fear
@@jennymccracken8108 No, I'm not afraid of soy.😄
@@RC-rk2xs 🤣 No!! I loved soy, what are you taking about...