Building An IEM System 2.0
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- Опубліковано 20 сер 2024
- You tag along as Rest, Repose builds a better In Ear Monitoring System with some updates! Big shoutout to Sennheiser, Circle Three Cases and Hosa cables for helping us make this new rig possible!
Routing Diagram: goo.gl/VmNDjD
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Chris' Channel: / redcl0ud22
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I'm not sure if you're aware, but the Sennheiser Antenna Combiners actually send power to the other G4 units via the BNC connectors. No need to plug in all of those wall wart power supplies.
i was just about to say the same thing
Timothy Busby I came here just to say that hahaha
Came here to comment that lol. Glad you mentioned it! Some of the other receivers can also do PoE should you choose to network them.
Was Just now typing this same thing and thought.. "I should see if someone has already informed them" lol
I was about to say that 😂
I installed the G4 units right after they came out and learned that after I set it up too
We've built an almost identical rig a little over a year ago and let me tell you - it's been a game changer. We're completely autonomous on stage, don't need our own monitor engineer, because all of us can adjust our mix with our smartphones and it gives us massive piece of mind to not worry about sound on stage. The X32 has been incredible, after switching from a soundcraft UI and no matter if we're playing a huge stage for 7k plus people or the tiniest bar - we always hear the same sound. Additionally we switched to cab simulators to avoid issues with mic'd cabinets and to maintain clean signals from all stringed instruments. Drums are mic'd with clamps to ensure speedy changeovers and it's working like clockwork. If anyone is unsure if a rack like this is necessary - if you plan on playing consistently, this thing will be your best friend in no time. - Soyan
100% agree! From my own experience on the road as a musician to years as an audio/lighting provider, going in ears is truly a game changer.
That’s awesome!
I’m wondering… how do you deal with your drum mics?
The X32 only has 16 inputs in XLR, how many of these are for the drums and for the other instrumentalists?
Not sure if anyone's pointed this out already, but if you're only using 5 IEM units you don't need two combiners. You can just run 4 of them into one combiner and have the last one standalone.
We do this with my band (Alestorm) and it works completely fine - we actually use two A1031-U omnidirectional paddle antennas, one of which is connected to a combiner (4 units) and the other directly to the 5th unit. These are then mounted high up on mic stands for good reception. I'd then suggest use your new free half-U space for an ethernet bridge and connect all the IEM units to it so you can run the Sennheiser WSM software and scan everything at once!
This, though i would recommend using directional paddles for IEMs such as the A2003.
@@matthewgillespie1581 Actually we tried that for the first year or so. In our situation, because we have guitar and drum techs, the in-ear and instrument wireless packs are mostly off stage during the 30 minute linecheck before our show... With directional paddles this meant that we band members were usually in the antenna dead spots and therefore often getting signal bombing in the ears, and the instrument wirelesses were bombing too (which makes awful noises).
Of course none of that made any difference during the show when we were on stage and in signal range, but it really doesn't instil confidence before the show to be getting dropouts, and made us question whether our frequencies were good and leading to a few panicked moments right before the show.
The directional paddles are, I'm sure, much better for larger stages and provide a stronger signal... but honestly we play massive festivals and some pretty big club stages and the omni paddles have worked perfectly every time. I can't remember having any signal dropouts at all in the last 12 months since we switched to them.
@@ElliotVernon Yeah. In bigger budget bands that tour full mons packages and RF techs, its very common to have a local paddle dedicated to the techs / mons engineer. But I can understand where you are coming from. You are correct it will not effect much. Just make sure you are using the correct short 50 ohmns cables! :)
Having directional paddles is alot more important for Radio mics than IEMs, especially in congested RF areas ! I am in the UK and the bandwidth is getting very small indeed. I know good knowledgeable engineers that are making a job out of it by being just RF Techs.
On another note, I am sure you are aware of multipin panel setups, but this does push the budget up quite a bit, but it is very tidy and fast especially for festivals. Perhaps that could be the 3.0 version :)
As a Network Engineer, and former System Admin, professionally; I can fully respect the need to thinking out a rack layout, and the need to careful cable management. Nice work! Though the cabling, could be neater :)!
No one can beat network engineers at cable management :)
As a sysadmin, you should be saying put the heavy crap at the bottom. That's probably why it was tipping over. Always place heavy items at the bottom.
mpressive IEM system: 32 channel mid-range digital mixer with 16 transformer iso splits. 5 high end Sennheiser G4 IEM channels and a end Sennheiser G4 vocal mic. All for less than $10k street price. Add stage mics and all the venue needs to provide are "racks and stacks" speakers. Add $2k for 2 additional vocal mics for a 3 singer band. A lot cheaper than 4x4 pickup truck or a big speed boat.
20 years ago this amount of functionality would require at least half a dozen heavy cases and hours to setup and tear down.
Great video!
Robert Harker still well beyond the reach of the average working band though...
@@officialWWM This is a much more sensible investment for a gigging band than i.e. buying equipment for each individual band member. Just skip the new guitar/bass/cymbal set and this becomes affordable for almost every band, assuming everyone has a job of course (for teenagers without financial backup from the parents this is in most cases not affordable).
InviKid it depends on how a band is structured. If every individual member has to buy their own setup, I can guarantee there will be one who can't afford it (regardless of age). If the band has a fund for expenses, it's gonna take a massive hit to set this up!
This was fun, let’s build another one
Chris - quick question for ya. So you have 16 channels wired up to go to the X32 but only giving FOH 8 from what I see in the video. Is that the "16 tracks (if we want them)" reference? Do you usually not put the drums in the IEM mix or just not all of them?
Hey just so you know and a few other people commented this too, but I didn’t see a reply for any of you guys...but the combiner send power over the BNC cables so you don’t need the wall-warts for the individual Sennheiser receivers. Might save some space and reduce cable clutter! Awesome build!
Bro, how do you configure the PSM in order to eliminate the antenna it has? I have both a Shure wireless and a PSM300 and I am looking to setup my rack, but this got me thinking how
This is now the main reason I want to get a band up and running to touring level! Just to build this! Thank you fluff!
In addition. You can network all the G4's using the RJ45 on the back of each. This is great because with Sennhieser's Wireless System Manager (runs on MAC or PC) you can run frequency scan on one pack, sync to WSM and auto assign frequencies to all the units simultaneously; as well as change all the settings from your computer as opposed to using the little nobs on the front of each unit. I also use 5 sennhieser IEM's (G3\G4\Antenna combiner) in my rig, Sennhieser WSM makes for very quick setup at every venue. I also name the units for band members so it is very easy to know who "owns" which pack by simply turning it on and looking at the name on the screen. Great setup!
How exactly you network all G4s and connect then to a PC?
@@eriksdrummer100 Like any network. You will need a switch ($30 on amazon), connect all the units to the switch then the switch to your laptop via network cable or wireless AP.
I love how rest repose imploded soon after this video came out
1. You only needed one wall wart for the IEM base units (both the Sennheiser and Shure combiners can provide power to all the base units).
2. You could have stayed with the original power conditioner (see #1).
3. You only needed a couple G4 base units as each one supports (2) separate mixes (I think Sennheiser calls it Focus Mode. Shure offers it as well and calls it mixmode)
4. You could have purchased a smaller case and saved on a lot of weight (see #1 and #4).
I've watched both of your IEM system videos now.
It is so unfortunate that musicians have to spend so much, and do so much, just to not get f'ed over by the people running sound at venues.
All the f'in time!
YES! Finally! I've been waiting for this video ever since you mentioned it in that FAQ a while back. Thanks man!
Always fun playing tetris with rack gear, from experience I have learned the to make wiring/cabling easier to access, the deeper units should be on the bottom of the rack and shallower ones on top. This is a guideline as its not always possible to accomplish. Now to test it out to make sure it works and there are no ground loops, more fun !!!
Great follow up! I'd imagine the X32 is the heaviest unit. If you stuck it on the bottom in the smaller case it would have made it less prone to tipping and in the new case it would not be in the way of the top mounted light in back of the unit. You also may want to consider LED strips for rear lighting. :)
just seeing the life we used to have from a dystopian future, makes me feel some sort of nostalgia. Like why the fuck am I looking at this video. Liveshows are so rare now.
I have never seen an in ear system put together before. I have always wondered what that would look like. Thank you!
Your bandmates are super fortunate to have someone with your knowledge. This was a cool video!
Ohh maaann !
I would like to be your roadie, how is everything beautiful and organized !
I’m almost 33 and I still can’t help but giggle every time I hear the word “duty”
I built almost the same, but: 4u rack, behringer splitters, xr18 mixer, and only the vocal is wireless, all the other guys are with cable headphone amps. So great! :)
Fluff!!! Please do a video about the struggles of getting decent guitar tone with an IEM system. There is allot of frustration out there for guitarists and IEM's I would like to hear what challenges and successes and advice you have. Thx😎
the beauty of the X32 rack is you can run the whole show from it if you had to. Just keep a bunch of TRS to XLR male for the Aux outs to use them for FOH output to the PA. I would set up the scenes to have the Main left right to the aux outs just in case but that's just me. The rig looks great!
Yes, *IF* the FOH engineer has a tablet/touch screen already set-up and tested. I had a band show up and randomly asking me not 2 hours before a show if I had a tablet - please don't do that. I had to run dual-system instead. Just please, for the love of God, let us know...!!!
I should start recording all my rack builds. 🤔
These IEMs are great, man. We have em for rent. Just works with no issues. BUT dont foget the EXTERNAL ANTENNAS. Its a must for a touring band performing in different areas and venues.
Are you guys touring with your own mics? Play local shows with your own mics? Would love to put something similar together but I'm in weekend warrior type bands and could see local venues struggling to cope with gear (mics) that they are unfamiliar with. Love the idea of just handing them the end of a snake and letting the plug and play minimizing the amount of time a stage hand spends on stage.
They tour with their own equipment, that includes microphones
2:45 Chris has beautiful eyes.
That vocal unit in a different color makes me anxious.
me too i was like can you spray paint it black?
That's to identify the mic unit from the IEM unit.
Chris reminds me soo much of the bassist in Coldplay!!
Chris is such a humble nice guy!
If I may, if you end up having any issues whatsoever with antennae I couldn't recommend the RF Venue Diversity Fin enough. It's fantastic.
As someone who builds racks almost daily, good job!
yo what dimensions should i get for the rack
Very cool. I wish a company would make an all in one unit that does all of this in a small package. I'm sure one day it will happen.
Looks Clean, nice job boys!
Great video.
Here’s an idea instead of having all those wall wart transformers on the power conditioner. Which come loose when moving around anyway.
Why not just get 1 DC power supply which has enough current capacity to power all the Sennheisser kit. You can power that from the conditioner and that would give you all your DC power for the wireless gear.
Running some led tape around the back edges would help in super dark venues
Is Josh having fun on tour?
Jaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaawwwwwssssshhhhhhhhhh
Yes, I'm
Thank you from Overt Enemy in Texas! Really appreciate your expertise and all these videos \m/
The combiner will power the G4 via the bnc cable, so you just need 2 combiners for the 6 G4‘s. That makes two plugs in total 👍🏼
Now we’re talking fluff love the idea of this video
upon reviewing this again..Man!!! That's insane!!! Sgotta' be so awesome live!!
Hi man, The Sennheiser IEM antena combiner work as a power supply for the IEM
How do you deal with child labour laws there in US' west coast? Because how old is Chris, 13, 14?
God damnit lol
Sorry Chris, I'm not used to see people actually look young. I look like a middle aged man since I was fifteen
Hi Fluff, I love your video and I love your IEM system. But still it's pretty bulky. Maybe Behringer (or other brands) should make a dedicated IEM mixer with a build in splitter and a way to connect analog to any FOH you encounter. This would eliminate a lot of cables, make things lighter and more compact, and cheaper of course.
The same goes for the wireless IEM units. I think it's time to make combined rack units for bands instead of 5 separate units. It would lower costs and make IEM more accessible. Maybe it's easier for you to inspire some engineers to build us some stuff like this ;-)
Maybe not everything in one unit, but for example: another unit like a S16/S32 stageboxes, but with 1 AES-50 output, and other analog outputs after split.
That would keep cable management at minimum (1 cable to mixer) and still have everything in small package ;)
As far as I was able to find, there is only 1 unit that can do this, and it's very expensive top-tier Midas blue box.
The problem is that yes, the price per unit would be lower in such a multiple-in-one system, but the upfront payment a band would have to put down would be pretty high and you are constraint by the tech build in there. This way you could start with buying the mixer (there are many options out there that are way cheaper and capable enough for an IEM rig) and slowly build up the ecosystem around it, maybe start with wired IEMs, then your first wireless unit, and slowly grow your rig with your band and capabilities. This IS more expensive when summed up, yes, but it is more accessible, scalable and can be individualized more easily.
dude that is a sick in ear setup. damn
you don't need the individual power supplies for each of the IEM transmitters. the combiner will power them through the BNC cables
As a sound engineer, I seeing comments about "people running sound at venues mess it up" its not the case of the sound engineer. The thing is time. Lets be real, a band typically plays for 30mins right? Set up in between sets maybe around 15mins. So we have 15mins to disconnect all our mics, plug it into the IEM unit, use your snake to plug it back into the mixer which won't reach (Stage racks are opposite sides of the stage for people on the left and the right to keep less cables on the middle of the stage) while 2 bands are trying to move their gear off and on stage and lets be real again, bands tend to do at lest 10mins of talking and picture taking which cuts the setup 5mins
Instead of a drum trash mic, why didn’t you just get a single send of the drum submix back from the desk and run it in? It’s what we do and it works great, and we have a very similar setup, and if your sound guy is good then you get a really killer drum sound.
Also, I thought the combiners also allowed you to feed power to all the units as well so you don’t need a tonne of wall warts clogging up your stuff.
Either way, nice new gear!
Kalen Austin That kinda defeats the purpose of the whole self-contained in-ear system idea. Also that takes a little bit longer to do.
@@thedrumengineer No, it's actually much much quicker, ESPECIALLY if you're not the headliner and can't leave your stuff on stage. Also how does it defeat the purpose? When we go on stage, literally the only volume we have to adjust is the drums, but Vocals 1,2, Guitars 1,2, Bass, Click, Backing tracks are all right there. Every stage will already have a bunch of sends on stage to the various monitors, all you need to do is grab one of them and have the sound engineer use it for the drum only send. Done this many times with absolutely no issues, and takes seconds.
Kalen Austin It defeats the purpose cause it’s not self contained. When it’s 100% self contained we don’t have to adjust anything. It’s plug and play. And they don’t have to run any lines to us.
What would be much quicker? Running a trash mic vs getting a single drum send? Or running all our own lines for drums vs getting a drum send? Cause I would agree that running our own mics and lines takes longer than FOH or monitors giving us a single drum send.
Getting a submix of the drums from the FOH engineer is a bad idea. Not all analog consoles can do that easily and also sometimes the house system snake could be maxed out on stage returns.
There's also the possibility of the engineer mixing them in a way you might not like, which could ruin the performance. It's much easier to plug all channels from the stage into the splitter so you have total control of all channels going to the in-ears. Also crowd mics will make the IEM experience even better!!
If I may offer one bit of professional advice, instead of rigging up your snake cables to the equipment directly, set up patch panels that you can plug into. It will save you from having to reach inside the case to plug anything in, as it's right at the face of the rack, and it will also spare you the burden of having to ensure your snake cables are securely fastened to avoid any unnecessary stresses on the connectors whilst in transit.
It will also allow you to make the internal wiring significantly neater and make the kit more serviceable if necessary.
The ART S8's have the mic inputs right on the front. Then one output goes to the rear of the x32 and another goes to an xlr to xlr snake. There's no reaching into the back of the rack for anything.
@@mgsg50 That addresses the mic splits but you'd still need a patch panel for the Sennheiser gear.
@@larzblast The only thing he has to plug in with this setup is the mics, which are plugged in right at the front of the S8's. The IEM units are wired directly to the x32, as are one pair of the S8 outputs. I don't think I'm understanding what you're saying.
@@mgsg50 You're right. I totally neglected the whole reason for the onboard mixer was to feed the Sennheiser gear.
Ignore me.
@@larzblast oh if those had to be patched every show I would totally use a patch panel. I had a setup like that at one time.
We only use Sennheiser, and yeah I love the brackets too!
Beautiful job fellas!
Although it's late Audiofusion has a way of doing wireless stereo iems through the iphone for $100 per person. Some may knock it at first but it wasn't that bad when I tried it out
0:23 When you said that why did I immediately hear in my head, "Josh, are you having fun, Josh?! Josh!!! JOOOOSSSSHHHHH!!!!" 😂 🤦♂️
4:15 It's not a counter, it's a cooker. You can make food with it :P
Enjoyed watching this. Congrats on a new rack!
those sennheiser systems are awesome! the anenna splitter should provide power too - might makes things a bit easier!
I need that rack. The light 😍
Will you do a video about how to set up all the frequencies in your sennheiser g4s so that they work together?
i know this is like a year or so too late. but, heavy stuff at the bottom! that's how racks fall over.
I give this rig 4.5 beards out of 5
Wow, super awesome!
You might also want to use WSM for RF coordination in bigger scale venues. Ever considered a switcher? That way you can use your laptop to control your x32 editor and WSM at the same time through an ethernet port
This guy has a great personality he should be an actor
Thanks, Ryan for this very educating video.
great IEM setup!
I built this same system. Only difference I ran a foh patch bay so the cables plug into the front just so I can see everything in case of issue
I couldn't tell exactly how you were using the IEM combiners BUT assuming you are using 1 combiner for 4 IEM units and 1 combiner for the 5th unit, you can actually use a passive combiner (eg. RF Venue 2x1) and combine the antenna feeds for both units into a single feed so you only have to put up 1 IEM antenna. You may be smarter than me and already be doing that but I found it out the hard way :)
Interesting video. The explanation at the end helped me to understand!
Such a great set up!
you have really great equipment
This should be a nice improvement! I wondered why you settled for a "trash" mic for drums before... Gotta hear those drums if you're gonna be tight! I use a Sennheiser IEM system and love it, although have been curious about the Galaxy Audio systems for their affordability.
“Fluff out” outro, “Fluff In” intro lol
HAVE YOU THOUGHT ABOUT USING A BEHRINGER STAGEBOX AS A splitter? We did that and left it next to the drummer, also gave him a p16. Anyway, your system is just as good. If you end up with another x32 at FOH, you wont even need the splitters.
4:15 ummm sweaty that's a stove
One thing to consider, put whatever makes the most heat up top
Y'all should add a router to the X32 so you can use your phones and ipads to make adjustments.
When you tour make a video on how it's set up in the venue that would he cool
btw you don't need the second power conditioner, the first one has enough power. Just use splitter cables..
if you are only going to use 2 screws on a rack mounted equipment "NEVER PUT THEM IN DIAGONALLY" or it can cause twisting of the mount. Instead, put them at the bottom because that's where the support is needed most. Try it for yourself
Could i get the wiring diagram again. It seems to have been deleted. Thank you, Fluff!
Man, you show make a video that shows how it works live, how do you guys make the thing work.. I have so many question, specially on the splitter side.. great video!
You can also run the output of one combiner into one of the four inputs of the second combiner. Voila! Only one antenna.
Hey! Hello from Moscow, Russia =)
This rack layout is pretty nice, but i have a few questions:
1. Why don't you use power delivery via coaxial cable from antenna combiner? As i can see - this combiner just like thouse we use with G4 IEM Rack, so you can use coaxial antenna cables as a power cables and you don't need to feed IEM base stations with their own power supplies.
2. FURMAN as i know always have lamps in front panel, so they are ment to be mounted on the top of the rack, so u can use this lamps in low light situations.
3. BTW, it could be little bit more cost-effective if u will change 1 IEM system to wired monitor system like P1 from Behringer, in this case u can sell unnecessary IEM and Combiner and get your mony back with no loss of the efficiency of this monitor rack ( may be just a bit, but it gonna keep your money).
4. You also could place wireless router like classic and very reliable Apple AirPort Express for X32 and Network Switch, so you'll get the option to control all of your Sennheiser devices and your X32 mixer via the only one Wi-Fi network. It's pretty handy, trust me.
i'll be very happy if anything from this list cuold be usefull for you, thanks for your job!
Why not just use a Behringer x-air 18?
That needs an external display to work like an iPad
Josh Robison good question.
Hi Fluff.
Have you made any videos with this rack in action? Just how you set it up when you do live gigs. It would be a interesting video. it's a awesome setup. CHEERS!
Maybe I'm wrong... But won't you get interferences by placing the vocal unit next to the IEM?
I was like what are they doing getting an extra furman and trying to plug in all those power supplies? the combiners do that for you and power all the units on at once.
Exactly! And besides which, if there wasn't a combiner in the system, using a power strip plugged into a single IEC outlet from one of the power conditioners would've been more than sufficient given how little those Sennheisers draw. Love my Sennheiser IEM rig.
Am I correct in understanding that each IEM-transmitter is only mounted "on the front" but not "on the back" inside the rack? Doesn't it sag at the back then?
the question is, why are there so many power supply units for sennheiser if the antenna unit transmits power to them?
Hello friend, how are you. excellent video and the rack looks super collected. I like. I wanted to know how the x32 rack worked for you. I have an x32 compact with its digital snake and I would like to buy the x32 rack for more comfort.
Buying all those in-ear transmitters to use them mono is definitely a waste of money. Use them stereo or buy only half as much. If you use a wired setup for the drummer, that's another 1000 bucks saved.
Hey! Thanks for this! Two questions:
1) We have a similar set up to your old one - we run into a lot of venues not knowing what we are talking about... do you have something that you send to venues/ how do you normally communicate to them about your in-war set up.
2) do you use the same mics all the time, or do you use house mics at the venue
The solution is not to say anything. Most every venue has an XLR stage snake. All you need do is tell the FOH that you’re sending him lines into the snake
Give me some good ole floor wedges and I’m good .. but good video
Why is not pizza in all those blue boxes? :D feels like the 3 of you getting together needs moer 'za
Why split the signals with the ART S8s? Can't you just use the the mixer main outs to go to the PA directly?
Question:
Say you set up your stage always as it is,
1) Don't you sound check and fine tune your in-ear levels?
2) Do you still need to do sound check for the stage or can you give the master output of the X32 to the venue and they just EQ it?
3) If you can give the main Buses from X32 like Drums, Guitars, Bass, and Vocals to the Venue, does it enough for the venue or do you still need to give all the channels from slitter as you do in the video?
Thanks!
As FOH mixer, if you handed me nothing but a few bus signals and expected me to mix your band properly, I'd be pretty unhappy. In fact I'd probably tell you "No". Guarantee it'll sound like ass. That's reflected directly back on me.
If you're going to spend the money on in ears, spend enough to get quality. You WON'T regret it. And if you're going to buy quality in ear systems, spend a bit more and get a quality splitter. Buy once: cry once.
Agreed, so in short:
-No, they do that during the rehearsals they have.
-The band still has to soundcheck for the FOH engineers to do the house/venue mix.
-The band HAS to send all of their channels individually to the FOH equipment, to make them sound decent, no matter the venue, and that implies that the band's IEM rack should have a good splitter to send a "copy" of their channel strips.
No joke. I'm rebuilding an RF Rack for work and I would love to know what that little light is you used for the back of the rack? That would make working in the rack in total darkness much easier.
That satisfying moment when you fire everything up :) That mic receiver being grey is triggering my OCD :/
Heavy setup!
Sick rig.. I'd LOVE to be able to work on something like this.. Kudo's to Hosa.. my brand for years and years....kinda wish I was actually a live performer so I could actually use something like this...};-}
Hey Fluff, I'm building this right now. I have the attenna combiner. My understanding is it powers the transmitters. why are you using the adapters? Thanks for the help.
Trying to see the faces of the splitters to get an idea of what you have going through each channel but the shots ar far to blurry, any chance you could post a pic or list of each channel please. Cheers