I agree there is a human element of selfishness involved in orthodox Christians clinging to hell rather than all saved eventually. The Christians I've grown up with, all good people, for some reason get really hostile if hell is debunked Scripturally.
@@rzella8022 Psychologically, it makes perfect sense to me. Disruption of one's view of ultimate meaning is always destablizing. Especially pernicious here is the lust for the teaching (universalism) to be false while justifying the reaction as demanded by a sound apprehension of divine love!
I grew up on the SBC, in its full Hellfire and Brimstone mode. IT has taken me decades to see the sheer immorality of Eternal Damnation without a hope of Rememption. Thank you for your work.
You don't believe in the teaching of eternal Hell because you are not converted to Christ. See my article on universalism, where I totally destroy this heresy.
@@TruthBeTold7 OK hardcore Southern Baptist grandma yelling at people in the seasonal aisle of the Albertsens in 1994 about why Easter egg hunts are pagan and you can't love Jesus if you do them.
As Christians, we shouldn’t. I like Lewis’ view that everyone will be in the presence of God after death, but for the ones who hate him, it will be agonizing. At the end of the day though, I know God is more merciful that we imagine and I cannot determine someone’s salvation.
What is Ironic to me as a Universalist is that I find similarities between myself and Calvinists. I believe in the Sovereignty of GOD, I believe that GOD is in full control, I believe that GOD is supremely powerful and all knowing. Difference is, I believe that GOD'S nature is redemptive and that He will save ALL humanity, Instead of a few selected. GOD is in full control, and one day, as 1st Timothy 2 says, "it will be testified in due time" 1st Corinthians 15:28 GOD will be ALL IN ALL❤
I presume you believe that faith is a gift from God. If that is true (which Scripture teaches: Rom 12:3, Eph 2:8, Eph 6:23, Phil 1:29, etc) why is your god dealing out vengeance against those He didn't give faith to ? THE CONCORDANT VERSION 2 Thessalonians 1:6-9 6 if so be that it is just of God to repay affliction to those afflicting you, 7 and to you who are being afflicted, ease, with us, at the unveiling of the Lord Jesus from heaven with His powerful messengers, 8 in flaming fire, dealing out VENGEANCE to those who are not acquainted with God and those who are not obeying the evangel of our Lord Jesus Christ
@@rudyferrell what about the 6 million Jews he had tortured and killed? Were they sent straight to HELL for eternity? You answer me that, and I'll answer your Hitler question.
@@rudyferrell Sure he goes to heaven, after he was purified and redeemed. You don't seem to get that the person who will enter heaven is no longer the destructive psycho he was, but a loving individual that repented and suffered the consequences of his evil deeds.
This actually makes me want to vomit. I can honestly say I’ve never wanted anyone, even the people that have personally devastated me emotionally through what can only be considered evil betrayal, to burn in Hell in eternal conscious torment! It’s such a deeply repulsive concept to my sensibilities!
Vebunkd you basically said if everyone is saved what is the point of the Cristian religion. It’s an argument often used. I find the argument shocking. I’m not a Christian because I’m going to be saved from hell. I’m a Christian because it’s the only way I want to live my life. Serving Christ here on Earth now.
Vebunkd hell is real. Check out the channel ‘The Total Victory of Christ’, if you would like to explore what I think is the closest to what the bible teaches. I have never subscribed to ECT, but did believe in annihilationism for a while. I then came to the conclusion of universalism on reading the bible more and opening my mind to what universalists had to say, it then became obvious to me (REALLY OBVIOUS). I think the reason you are even engaging in this conversation, is because deep down you have some deep questions about this doctrine. I’m sorry for my short answer, I’ve just woken up. I think the channel I mentioned in this comment, explains my position best. Take care and God bless you 💜. I might try and write more later, once I’ve woken up properly and finished my chores :) Edit: all the verses you quoted could equally point to universalism, once looking through that lens.
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If you study the entomology of the word hell, then you will soon discover that it was mistranslated from the word, sheol. Hades is the the actual word for grave. There is no point for God to punish people endlessly. He would never create something only to destroy or hurt it later on. Symbolism man, seriously. God wills the salvation of all mankind! That's what the word, Gospel means : GOOD NEWS!!!!
The doctrine of Hell has not ruined anybody, that is a deceit from the devil. On the contrary the doctrine of God's judgement has led many to turn to repentance. All the apostles of the bible spoke bodily about God's coming judgement
@@LukeAiwuyuse your either Deceived or just plain lying to yourself if you think people haven’t been completely broken by the thought of there loved ones burning in a never ending fire your sick if that’s what u hope for plain and simple
It's actually not that profound if you have a thesaurus handy. I'm not saying he's wrong (though I think he is); I'm just saying it's pretty normal for followers to follow the arrogant guy around, hanging on his every word. If you've been alive 5 minutes, you've seen this in every sort of community--secular or religious.
Everyone I know that defends the absurd notion that our Good Father will be torturing humans eternally are sure that are not among their number. How convenient.
I’ve always thought that about your average self-proclaimed Christian. When you really think about hell and your “non believing” friends, if you really believe in hell as a concept then why are you not spending every waking minute pleading with them and others you care about to become a part of the church
Exactly...thats one of the ultimate proofs to me people don't actually believe in ECT.Their neglect to speak to their friend for 10 min will result in their friend after 50 quadrillion years still being in hell....its insanity
@@ttownsupreme2183 sadly it’s becoming clear to me that most of them actually rejoice in the thought that there the special one that made the right choices and avoided never ending fiery torture they probably imagine themselves dancing and singing to suffering screams of there lost friends
I wouldn’t put it past some few who would preach genuinely to the best of their knowledge and ability about the gospel. If a man evangelizes because he loves Christ, than his love for Christ isn’t misleading. His theological grasp might be lopsided. But I’ve seen few, albeit very few, of those sorts of Christians myself who implore everyone around them to accept Christ-and what’s been a common attitude amongst those genuine evangelicals is that they don’t trouble themselves to judge others directly, but leave it to the will and mind of God the Father for that to be addressed. Rather than judging other’s souls eternally, they effectively preach accountability to God to both the believer and the nonbeliever instead. They’re wrong on theology, but right in principle. Their love for God overcomes their struggling with fear from having a lack of knowledge, which speaks of their having right character.
@@Hibernial exactly u speaking the truth if I ever heard it I think “Christian’s” that believe in hell and want people to go there aren’t Christian’s to begin with but true Christian’s that believe in hell and are constantly talking to there family and friends and others about what they believe they still always leave room to say but hey it’s up to god if he saves everyone I’m cool with that and that’s true Christianity acknowledging that at the end of the day it doesn’t too much matter what we think or feel or what the Bible says God is literally God and he can do whatever he decides he wants to do and we’re cool with that
There are parts of me that wish there is no hell, I really don't need anyone to suffer forever, I think. Obviously there are some really bad people, who need punishment, but I know God will be merciful, and correct in his judgment.
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There are some who while not wanting people to eternally experience torment, do get offended at the idea that those who didn't strive to live a virtuous, Christian life will be allowed to go to heaven. To them, a club must keep some out in order to be of any value.
@@AquaticDot None, unless He has mercy and regenerates us. As He transforms His children into the image of His Son...His wants (desires) become our wants (desires).
@Eremias Ranwolf You said: "Why would God abandon them forever when he might just open their eyes instead?" 22And if God, willing to shew the wrath and to make known His power, did endure, in much long suffering, vessels of wrath fitted for destruction, 23and that He might make known the riches of His glory on vessels of kindness, that He before prepared for glory, whom also He did call - us - 24not only out of Jews, but also out of nations
I do love DBH. He confesses his own guilt of being prideful, superior and arrogant by reference to the sporting clubs he supports - which is of course quite trivial - and as if he cares as much about football or baseball as about the ultimate truth of things. And he confesses to an aspect of his intellectual superiority - his coyness :) But he does not confess his overarching sense of triumph over most other philosophers and theologians including in particular Ed Feser. A while ago he offered a kind of apology to Feser for his involvement in the bitter dispute between them, but in the centre of this apology he spouted his ultimate superiority over Feser and other philistines - however good Feser's arguments might be, they will never be based on reading the original sources in their original languages. It's as if His Lordship DBH said: "I am sorry for putting you down Feser, but that is where you belong - compared to me"". He just can't help being so darn good :)))
I'm happy that he uses it to highlight the psychologically and, I believe, theologically sound view that "grace is more gracious the more abundantly it's given". It's an attitude of pride I find much more acceptable than the variant he calls out.
Grew up in Pentecostalism and have witnessed this winners/losers dichotomy. I think I have always been a Universalist and thought hell was a false teaching even as a child. I just had no mechanism to articulate my thoughts until Bible College and seminary. I understand salvation as a process rather than a state of being. We are constantly "becoming" Christian (i.e., Christlike) rather than being Christian. This view, I believe, debunks the doctrine of hell. No one is left out of this "becoming." I shared this when I was in the ordination process of the UMC and was told that it was heresy and not to share that. AS a UMC elder for a decade, I struggled with this being in the Universalist closet. When I came out due to this and my support for LGBT persons, I was asked to surrender my credentials.
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@@MegaNetty1 With respect, I don't buy his argument. Jesus' victory includes victory over sin and death. He would that no man should perish. Shall his will be thwarted by satan, or by man? The lake of fire is one of refinement, purification, judgement. _Let all creation rejoice before the Lord, for he comes, he comes to judge the earth._ (Psalm 96:13)
I agree with DBH that many who reject Universalism come from a primal desire to see a dynamic of winners vs losers.....but what about those who reject Universalism, like I do, that *wish it were true*, but do so out of feeling it's simply un-Biblical in that it negates God's granting of free will on his creation to willfully choose him?
Football, Have you read the second edition of Tom Talbott’s “inescapable love of God,” or the 2003 volume “Universal Salvation? the Current Debate” edited by Partridge and Parry, or the 2008 book “The Evangelical Universalist” by Robin Parry (under pseudonym Gregory MacDonald), or Reitan and Kronen’s 2011 book “God’s Final Victory: a comparative philosophical case for universalism?” Those are among the *best* cases for Christ-mediated universalism. The last book on that list is mostly philosophy and theological themes without much discussion of the prooftexts, but the others cover pretty much everything that needs to be covered (proof texts, philosophy, theology, and psychology).
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I love Hart's theological arguments and understandings. I do not appreciate his psychoanalysis of those who disagree with him. Hart is more judgment of souls than he wants you to believe. He seems to have a knack for mind reading and being snarky.
The comments above represent exactly the hubris that turn many people off of Hart. "Why do I have to be charitable to those beneath my level of intelligence?" is as reprehensible a view as those Hart criticizes.
@@godsarmy8746 Universal reconciliation through Christ’s work is not saying there in no hell at all. It’s a position stating that hell is finite and for an age, or even ages of time, but it is not infinite. The Church as Christ’s Bride for ages to come will be of the role to beckon all men onto Christ, after the long sentence for punishment is done. Ultimate restorationism/Christ centered universalism was the foremost and majority view in early christian fellowships up until the late Roman Empire assimilated christianity into the State. For political purposes of using religion and fear to control the masses, many church leaders who believed in ultimate restoration were disavowed by theocratic committees for political reasons, whether it was within some years if not even hundreds of years after the death of those christians. All that aside, I think maybe part of the haughtiness portrayed by Hart comes from his socio-political views through a lense of socialism. Academic intellectuals under the socialist banner are a common trend in university setting, though some few socialists do differ from the majority if they’re in fact just mutualists who prefer local communes rather than a monolithic central State’s rule. Nonetheless, having strong political positions that become mixed with spiritual beliefs is like a blend of things that really don’t mix. Spiritual views are personal and delve into meta-physical subject matter, and socio-political views are philosophical arguments based upon this life. And personally, I don’t think it right to conflate the redeeming love of Christ with egalitarian philosophical beliefs that all too often prop up governments with systems that become religions onto themselves; especially since it was the Roman State which assimilated Christianity into its system. The trouble with Christian Universalism’s arguments is the verbal baggage some messengers carry while presenting it.
@antoniososa1964You miss the point that those that disagree with Hart make; those who end up in hell do so because of *their* choices, not God's. Now I don't know whether they are right, or Hart is. I personally would prefer it if Hart's interpretation of this was the correct one, but my personal preference is irrelevant, and those that argue against Universalism don't have terrible arguments for their position unlike Hart's claims that they do.
It is Dr Hart's lack of 'intellectual academic manners' which I most admire. If someone thinks GOD (of infinite being and love) could TORTURE, for eternity, a creature He has made with finite capacities in so many ways, in order to respond to Him and be fullfilled in Him, then there has to be something grotesquely wrong with that 'believer', and that form of 'belief'.
I used to look at Christs parable of the 100 sheep and the good shepherd as talking about the sheep being the elect. Recently the spirit activated a synchronicity with the verse that said that Christs blood was shed for ALL MANKIND. It felt like a diamond was shot right through my forehead. All of mankind is under the jurisdiction of Christ. He breathed his breath into us in the beginning and HE WILL redeem all of his sheep who he claimed with his own blood. Why? Because He’s the good shepherd. Will he not be happy about the one sheep more than the 99?
DBH is an interesting theologian. I would like to share my thoughts, regards to the believing in non-eternal hell, but in a relation to existential behaviour of people who would accept this as a dogma. To me, eschatology needs to be a mistery. I think that we shouldn't define everything in dogmas. I understand DBH's argument about non-loving God, if there is an ethereal hell. I feel that also, in some sence, in the deepts of my heart. Алексеи Иличь Осипов (Osipov) said that there is a paradox if all loving God, knowing the destiny of human salvation, chooses to create the sole which will hypothetically go to hell (while knowing that, God chooses to create). But I would want to hear your opinions on this: How would the Christian world look like if we accept the teaching of origenism, where all beings would be saved in eternity? This is an existential question now. How would we behave in that conditions? What would be moral obligation for me to behave good, if I know that I would be, nevertheless, saved by a mercy God, all loving God? For me, the possibilities of the graciousness of God needs to stay a mistery for a human, while the time exists.
Saint Isaak Syrian said that hell (Gehenna) is the condition of impossibility, or better, a lack of possibility to bear the love of God. God is, therefore, everywhere. Even in hell, there is a love from God. I don't like the picture of hell that Roman Catholic church made through centuries, in order to scare people. The worst hell would be the state when we are not able to love. But the question that DBH asked about salvation is wery bright, indeed. If we are progressing in eternity (epectasis) in Second Jerusalim, maybe there is a progression in the state of hell. But the existential question stays: I can become Hitler, while believing in apocatastasis. I just think that eschatology should be a mistery. For God everything is possible.
@@todormia Even if hell is not eternal, which I don't belive, it is still painful and full of suffering. A purifying fire. A judgement of the conscience. That sounds really unpleassant, especially for someone like Hitler.
The Church is a therapy for the soul. Universal Salvation teaches that every soul will eventually return back to God, but only after a long period of what might be described as a self inflicted punishment. The punishment of this world being nihilism and depression, whilst the punishment of the next world being the purification of hell The goal of the Church is to allow one to escape the hell of this world and the next through the therapy of Christ
It is funny to me because I landed on the same conclusion. I see throughout the tradition an ambiguity concerning eternal hell. One thing, and I think every Christian can argee on this, is that there is a promise of salvation and the 'benefits' (I don't like to use words for these matters since they take away from the realitiy of it). But what happens to the people who don't get it, I don't think we can say anything about that form tradition. Of course there are some streams of thought who are very clear that hell is eternal, but you can find enough universalist throughout history aswell. So cleary there are stearms which will take you in that direction. Form a personal stance I like this ambiguity and I would say maybe it is even more powerfull than any cetrainty regarding punishment after death. The fact that I can only be sure of that there is the promise of salvation. Makes me wanna go that route because I now know what awaits me, it will me good whatever it is. But I don't want to end up anywhere where goodness is not certainly there.
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1 Timothy 2:4-6 Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth. For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus; Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.
@@memedrop742 you’d have to rip dozens of other scriptures out of the Bible to make this one true. Clearly, this is referring to all the men who believe on Christ.
@@memedrop742 I am honestly trying to understand how you rationalize universalism and how you harmonize it with other scriptures that clearly show that a rejection of Christ leads to hell.... I mean, I can see how it would feel good to believe this, I just cannot rationalize this with what scripture presents. Scripture cannot contradict itself. It’s very easy to take a proof text and make it mean what you want it to as it stands alone. Have you ever considered this?
John Calvin is an awful person to quote. He might be surprised that the God he so ferociously defended doesn't exist. A Torturer of Souls is not the God of Love.
As someone who is honestly trying to understand and wrap their head around the concept of universalism, what do you say to the argument that God created man with free will and to consign everyone to eventual heaven-even if it is against their own choice because they hate God, essentially turns them into puppets? Doesn’t God want us to love and want to be with Him freely-not because we are forced to? I can’t imagine anyone hating God to that degree , but I assume they are out there.
Free will is not some random thing, there are always reasons why you love or hate something. For true freedom, we have to will with perfect clarity and as finite beings, we can’t forever hate God who is absolutely and infinitely good. For one to truly and perfectly understand the magnitude of the evils they have committed, they can’t have any imperfections in their reasoning. For even the worst person, utter hate can only change into utter shame with total understanding (for someone like Hitler or Chengis Khan, at a minimum they would need to go through the memories and emotions of everyone they caused pain and death when they lived and beyond and the shame will be worse than any bodily punishment)
If you are standing at the edge of a cliff and choose not to jump off, do you somehow not have free will? The universalist view is that once we sinners are humbled through hell and are exposed to God's nature after death, the obvious choice is to accept His gift of salvation through Jesus Christ. I don't think we can somehow keep rejecting Him for eternity, and it would be cruel for a truly infinitely loving God to put a time limit, especially when most people have a horrible idea of what the theistic God is (calling him a sky fairy for example) and hate that interpretation.
Both the Arminian and Calvinists are right respectively in their points of emphasis, yet wrong in interpreting man’s will and God’s will as somehow existing in a dilemma. The dilemma of endlessly competing wills that’s perceived and preserved by many theologians within doctrinal schools only exists because of the pagan/Roman doctrine of hell lasting forever being passed down in Christendom through the generations as status-quo, rather than hell being finite and temporary as a sentence. So that dilemma being a reoccurring source of confusion for many Christians who are left puzzled by the nature of how man can form a genuine relationship with God if not for fear of endless torment is really an illusion that doesn’t exist. That isn’t to say hell as a form of punishment doesn’t exist; it’s to say that hell rebukes through man having free exercise of his will to reject God’s offering of Himself, and to endure separation and lack of enjoyment for however long he prefers to endure for a time in his own limited being. Even a man’s rejection of God is limited, and while God will not approach a man who blasphemes Him by saying no repeatedly, in enduring separation from God even that man will eventually come to repent upon realizing that God as Love is infinitely loving.
We all have the free choice to eat our own excrements, yet (allmost) none of us do. I doubt anyone would actualy reject God when confronted with his infinite love and the experience of purgatory.
Im not hostile at all to the idea. I want this so much to be true. I just dont see how it can be defended biblically or patriotically. I really do pray that its true. It may be a foolish prayer but I cant help it.
For sure salvation is to realize one can do nothing to deserve anything. There is no reward behind it, other that that mentality IS what is required to really appreciate everything. To not realize this is to build ones own hell where ultimately one lives by the maxim of merit, rewards, and punishments, which we all do, because who really, really, really thinks he does not deserve anything? I believe the Word becomes what we are to us, so that it can invite us into something else. If we are literal-minded, reward/punishment minded, etc. the Word will become that to us, in order to crack the door open from that point of view into stepping outside it a little. Isn't it obvious this is what Jesus is doing? He speaks as a pharisee to the pharisees. He speaks as a loving father to those who despair. Some respond, some not. Whether somehow all will respond in the end is not really possible to know. But I think it is more important to get away from the hell being a punishment for breaking rules, and rather just as what one would experience if one takes the idea of justice being rewards and punishments to it's conclusion. I don't know if it is actually possible to do so, but I think that is what Jesus is getting at. He is inviting us into taking those ideas seriously, so that we can see how that cannot possibly be how reality exists.
People are just hostile because eternal torment is ingrained in the minds of many people. How many of them realize that the original Bible is in Greek? I am no language expert by any stretch of the imagination but the translation from Greek to Latin had errors in it. There are some vids on UA-cam where they explain these mistranslations. They tell you what the true meaning of the original Greek words are. BTW, if all you really know is English and similar languages that use the 26 letter alphabet you may find Greek and a lot of languages just about impossible to understand. There are plenty of languages I am unable to read because of that. I wonder if in those countries I would be considered dyslexic because of not being able to read any of their language.
By necessity? A creator can't just forgive people and bring them back home? That's a thousand libraries of theology right there, but still it just seems like he could. The prodigal son acted very poorly but was welcomed home.
first of all, the word "eternal" in the Bible comes from the Greek word "aion", which should be translated as "age period". But, the Bible is clear that there will come a day when EVERYONE believes in Him and accepts Jesus' sacrifice. Philippians 2:10-11 'that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of those in heaven, and of those on earth, and of those under the earth, 11 and that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.' "If you confess with your mouth that 'Jesus is Lord'......you will be saved". So any person who confesses and accepts Jesus will be saved, and every person will eventually confess and accept Jesus, so the only conclusion is that everyone will one day be saved.
@@headlessguy98 what do you make of all the other scriptures that clearly teach otherwise? Namely, that those who do not believe end up in hell? Everyone will one day confess, but it will be too late for many
Honestly I don’t want one single person to go to hell, and it says in the Bible God wants everyone to be saved, here are a couple of verses that may back this up. Let’s pray and discern love you guys, God is good and can do all things but it is His creation, His choice ♥️ 1 Timothy 4:10 New International Version That is why we labor and strive, because we have put our hope in the living God, who is the Savior of all people, and especially of those who believe. 1 John 2:2 NIV He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world. Love you! And God bless! Enjoy your Christmas :)
@@koppite9600 Genesis 12:3 --- All peoples on earth will be blessed through Abraham. Genesis 22:18 --- All nations on earth will be blessed through Abraham’s offspring. Numbers 27:16 --- Moses refers to the “source of the breath of all flesh”. Psalms 22:27 --- All the ends of the earth and all the families of the nations will acknowledge God. Psalms 65:2 --- All men will come to God. Psalms 86:9 --- All nations will worship and glorify God. Psalms 103:8-9 --- God is compassionate, will not always accuse and will not be angry forever. Psalm 136 --- God's love endures forever. Psalms 145:9-10 --- The Lord has compassion on all His creation and all He has made will praise Him. Psalms 145:13 --- The Lord loves all His creation. Psalms 145:14 --- The Lord upholds all who fall. 1 Sam. 2:6: - “The Lord kills and makes alive; he brings down to the grave (Sheol--Hadees) and brings up." Isaiah 25:6-8 --- God will prepare a feast for all people, He will destroy the shroud that enfolds all peoples, the sheet that covers up all nations. He will eliminate death, wipe away the tears from all faces and remove the disgrace of his people from all the earth. Isaiah 45:22-23 --- God has sworn an oath that every knee will bow before Him and every tongue will swear by Him. Isaiah 49:6 --- God’s salvation will be brought to the ends of the earth. Isaiah 54:8 --- Although God will hide His face in a surge of anger, He will also have compassion with everlasting kindness. Isaiah 57:16-18 --- God’s anger is not permanent. Although He punishes man, He will heal, guide and restore comfort to him. Jeremiah 31:33-34 --- All men will know God, from the greatest to the least. Lamentations 3:31-33 --- The Lord does not cast off forever. Although He brings grief, He will also be compassionate. Ezekiel 18:21 --- God does not any pleasure in the death of the wicked. Rather, He is pleased when they repent. Jonah 2:6 --- "Forever" is used in reference to a period of only three days. Jonah 4:2 --- God graciously and compassionately relents from promised judgement. Micah 7:18 --- God does not stay angry forever. Matthew 18:13 --- Like the man who owes a hundred sheep and is not willing to lose even one, God is not willing that any one be lost. Luke 2:10 --- The birth of Jesus is good news for all the people. Luke 3: 5, 6 --- John the Baptist quotes Isaiah’s words that all mankind will see God’s salvation. John 1:29 --- Jesus is the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world. John 3:35 --- God sent Jesus to save the world. John 4:42 --- God has committed all things to Christ. John 5:25 --- Even the dead will hear the sound of Christ and all who hear will live. John 6:37 --- Everything that God has given to Christ will come to him. John 10:14-16 - “I am the good shepherd. I know My sheep and My sheep know Me, 15 just as the Father knows Me and I know the Father. And I lay down My life for the sheep. 16 I have other sheep that are not of this fold. I must bring them in as well, and they will listen to My voice. Then there will be one flock and one shepherd.” John 12:32 --- When Jesus is lifted up from the earth, he will draw all men to himself. John 12:47 --- Jesus came to save the world. John 17:2 --- God granted Christ authority over all people so that Christ may give eternal life to all that God has given him. Acts 3:20-21 --- Jesus must remain in heaven until the time comes for God to restore everything. Acts 17:28 --- All human beings are children of God. Romans 3:3-4 --- The unbelief of some will not nullify God’s faithfulness. Romans 5:18 --- The act of obedience of one man (Jesus) will bring life for all men. Romans 8:19-21 --- Creation itself will be liberated and brought into the glorious freedom of the children of God. Romans 8:38-39 --- Nothing can separate us from the love of God that is in Christ. Romans 11:32 --- God made all people imprisoned by disobedience so that he may have mercy on them all. 1 Corinthians 5:5 -- 5To deliver such a man to the Accuser for destruction of the flesh, so that the spirit might be saved on the day of the Lord. 1 Corinthians 15:22-28 --- All will be made alive in Christ, but each in his own turn and ultimately Christ will subdue all his enemies, eliminate death and God will be all in all. 2 Corinthians 5:15 --- Christ died for all. 2 Corinthians 5:19 --- Through Christ, God was reconciling the world to Himself. Ephesians 1:11 --- God will bring all things under heaven and on earth under Christ. Ephesians 4:6 - One Lord, one God, one Father of all. Ephesians 4:10 --- Christ ascended higher then all the heavens to fill the whole universe. Philippians. 2:9-11 --- Every tongue will confess that Jesus is Lord (In 1 Corinthians 12:3, Paul writes that no one can say “Jesus is Lord” except by the Holy Spirit) Colossians 1: 19-20 --- God was pleased to reconcile to Himself, all things on earth and in heaven through the blood of Christ. 1 Timothy 2:4-6 --- God wants all men to be saved and to know the truth. Can God’s desire be thwarted? 1 Timothy 4:10 --- God is the Savior of all men, especially (not exclusively) those who believe. Titus 2:11-12 --- God’s grace, which brings salvation has appeared to all men. Hebrews 2:9 --- Jesus tasted death for everyone. 1 John 2:2 --- Christ is the atoning sacrifice of the sins of the whole world. 1 John 3:8 --- Christ appeared to destroy the devil’s works. (The doctrine of eternal damnation denies the victory of Christ!) 1 John 4:8, 16 --- God is Love. (not loving towards some, but not others, Love is the very essence of Who He is.) 1 John 4:14 --- Christ is the Savior of the World. Revelations 5:13 --- Every creature in heaven, on earth, under the earth, and on the sea will sing praises to him who sits on the throne and to the Lamb (Christ). Revelations 21:4-5 --- God will dwell with men and he will wipe every tear from their eyes, death, mourning, crying, pain and the old order of things will pass and everything will be made new.
I disagree with David B Hart about this. There will of course be some people who want there to be a Hell so that they can be "winners in the game of life" but I suspect that those people are few and far between. When I believed in Hell I did so reluctantly and with no small degree of discomfort. I thought then that it was the clear and unequivocal teaching of Christ, so who was I to disagree? Now I realise that Christ did not teach "Hell" at all and that the word "aionios", which we usually translate as "eternal", means "for an indeterminate length of time".
I believe there are more hopeless or hope-seeking people within circles of christendom, than there are pious and spiteful attitudes. If Hart is criticizing strictly the traditions of denominations rooted in hellfire doctrine, then I don’t see him being incorrect or wrong about his impassioned response. But I do believe it’s wrong to target most of common people in that way. Christ Jesus rebuked the Pharisees harshly and cast out the money lenders in the temple with similar disdain towards their attitude, but he was in the company of believers and nonbelievers who (like many Christians or Christian raised people today) have a lacking grasp due to only knowing theology that’s based upon traditions of men.
Hart have you considered the possibility that peope are so against universalism because it directly contradicts the words of Christ, our Saints, our Councils and all of Orthodoxy Christianity?
Does this teaching mean that Christians should accept gay marriage as ok with God since he loves everyone the same? Or does it means that as God’s image bearers we still need the framework of male and female roles to guide us through this maze while God is freeing us from the effects of sin and death? I am asking because the church I attend never addresses what followers of Christ can do to live and serve people who are struggling with their identities.
Much of dysphoria expressed through tendencies of lack of self-control I would believe is rooted in the old life of human nature in Adam. Put into more modern terms, an ego that forms in a person to cope with past or unaddressed trauma can cause that person to be at war with their mind, and their body. Depending on the severity of the dysphoria, some people really can struggle with different types of personality disorders. For others their emphasis of identity is just living through their own physical body, disassociating and ignoring the health of their mind from their body to a degree of lesser severity. Some are more socially functional than others. But chasing after broken relationships is not an uncommon occurrence nowadays for many people; homosexual relationships don’t find their odds better relative to heterosexual ones. If chasing after relationships that do not last doesn’t afford a person peace despite their working and effort in being invested in something temporary, that just points to their need for Christ’s Spirit to mend their spirit.
Primal desire of winners vs losers? How would he know that? Has he personally interviewed all these people? His claim is the psychogenetic fallacy and appeal to motive fallacy.
Does one try to live in such a way that pleases God out of fear of going to "hell"? I say one is inspired to live in such a way that glorifies God out of a gratefulness and love toward Him that makes one want to honor what Be did for us all.
DBH is smarter than I am...to a great degree. But his supreme intelligence does not thereby render to him any authority whatsoever, in the same way Luther's genius and Calvin's genius did not thereby render authority to them, as convincing as they were to so many. If we are misled by modern English translations, those of us who cannot go back to read the original Greek cannot be culpable for our misunderstandings. Personally, my only desire is to believe what the Church teaches. She has authority to bind my conscience, rightly formed. I don't have authority to bind myself, nor does DBH have authority to bind me based on his own condescending sense of what justice is. While I constantly search out the whys and wherefores, I have no skin in the game apart from my loyalty to the Catholic Church, because she was established by Jesus Christ.
I am a Christian. I believe that hell is real. Now I'm not entirely sure if it's eternal or not but one thing I know for sure is that I don't want anybody to end up in it. I don't want people to be apart from the Father. I don't need to be a winner with billions of losers outside the gates. This video is incredibly insulting to all the Christians who simply believe that the blood of Christ saves if only you believe.
I don't think he is focusing on people like you, in fact he specifically says that most people really don't believe. You do but are unsure of how it functions. I think he meant the people who enthusiastically say they "know" etc., and think it's a great thing. It seems natural to have some cognitive dissonance, some struggle with this concept. But some people flat out seem to be think it's fine. Would those same people want serial killers eaten alive by rats? Would they want people they don't like tortured? You say you don't know if it's eternal or not, but wouldn't that make a big difference to God's character? If God had mercy and did eventually save everyone, it would seem like slander to say he didn't, no? In other words, a Universalist can say "you are slandering my God" by saying he has no mercy. And the other side can say, "are you saying my God is just just?". Not trying to upset anyone, just curious. I wish there was a more clear answer. So much evidence to support different views. The Bible is not supposed to be confusing but there is confusion, is there not?
@@joecheffo5942 The one big thing I don't understand in the Bible is hell. There are other things like individual words that weren't translated well but you can easily figure that stuff out with videos. The doctrine of hell is tough.
@@avivastudios2311 Hell I understand was translated in KJV from three Hebrew words, gehenna, sheol, and another one, and also Hades from Greek religion/myth. They all have different meanings but were all translated Hell. That seems a bit sketchy. Thats the Protestant Bible. I guess Catholics did the same thing? Took Hades from Greeks? I think as the bible got spread to Greek speaking gentiles, the concept of hell got stronger. I think its more in John than earlier gospels. Its kind of unfair for churches and pastors not to be up front about all this.
@@avivastudios2311 Some translations do it better, whether they have more integrity or less bias, I don't know. But Hell appears 61 time in KJV anbout half that in a nothing trasvlation, and onl a few times in some others. More modern translations seen to get it better, maybe ones with better philologists. Peace.
Is grace cheapened when we turn the universal atonement and invitation to all people into a final act? I do not disagee with DBH but with the mis appropriation of the invitation to the eschatological banquet where all nations are invited to the mountain of God, into something else. This man is very erudite but isnt he a bit lazy in his hopscotch A = Z? I would love to think we all will be saved, and I do not love Augustine anymore than he does, but wishful thinking is not part of my training.
The day the word Hell was put into the Bible, and the geographic actual place in Jerusalem called GEHENNA. Was a utterly day of horror not from God, but a perverted doctrine, intensional or not.
Genesis 12:3 --- All peoples on earth will be blessed through Abraham. Genesis 22:18 --- All nations on earth will be blessed through Abraham’s offspring. Numbers 27:16 --- Moses refers to the “source of the breath of all flesh”. Psalms 22:27 --- All the ends of the earth and all the families of the nations will acknowledge God. Psalms 65:2 --- All men will come to God. Psalms 86:9 --- All nations will worship and glorify God. Psalms 103:8-9 --- God is compassionate, will not always accuse and will not be angry forever. Psalm 136 --- God's love endures forever. Psalms 145:9-10 --- The Lord has compassion on all His creation and all He has made will praise Him. Psalms 145:13 --- The Lord loves all His creation. Psalms 145:14 --- The Lord upholds all who fall. 1 Sam. 2:6: - “The Lord kills and makes alive; he brings down to the grave (Sheol--Hadees) and brings up." Isaiah 25:6-8 --- God will prepare a feast for all people, He will destroy the shroud that enfolds all peoples, the sheet that covers up all nations. He will eliminate death, wipe away the tears from all faces and remove the disgrace of his people from all the earth. Isaiah 45:22-23 --- God has sworn an oath that every knee will bow before Him and every tongue will swear by Him. Isaiah 49:6 --- God’s salvation will be brought to the ends of the earth. Isaiah 54:8 --- Although God will hide His face in a surge of anger, He will also have compassion with everlasting kindness. Isaiah 57:16-18 --- God’s anger is not permanent. Although He punishes man, He will heal, guide and restore comfort to him. Jeremiah 31:33-34 --- All men will know God, from the greatest to the least. Lamentations 3:31-33 --- The Lord does not cast off forever. Although He brings grief, He will also be compassionate. Ezekiel 18:21 --- God does not any pleasure in the death of the wicked. Rather, He is pleased when they repent. Jonah 2:6 --- "Forever" is used in reference to a period of only three days. Jonah 4:2 --- God graciously and compassionately relents from promised judgement. Micah 7:18 --- God does not stay angry forever. Matthew 18:13 --- Like the man who owes a hundred sheep and is not willing to lose even one, God is not willing that any one be lost. Luke 2:10 --- The birth of Jesus is good news for all the people. Luke 3: 5, 6 --- John the Baptist quotes Isaiah’s words that all mankind will see God’s salvation. John 1:29 --- Jesus is the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world. John 3:35 --- God sent Jesus to save the world. John 4:42 --- God has committed all things to Christ. John 5:25 --- Even the dead will hear the sound of Christ and all who hear will live. John 6:37 --- Everything that God has given to Christ will come to him. John 10:14-16 - “I am the good shepherd. I know My sheep and My sheep know Me, 15 just as the Father knows Me and I know the Father. And I lay down My life for the sheep. 16 I have other sheep that are not of this fold. I must bring them in as well, and they will listen to My voice. Then there will be one flock and one shepherd.” John 12:32 --- When Jesus is lifted up from the earth, he will draw all men to himself. John 12:47 --- Jesus came to save the world. John 17:2 --- God granted Christ authority over all people so that Christ may give eternal life to all that God has given him. Acts 3:20-21 --- Jesus must remain in heaven until the time comes for God to restore everything. Acts 17:28 --- All human beings are children of God. Romans 3:3-4 --- The unbelief of some will not nullify God’s faithfulness. Romans 5:18 --- The act of obedience of one man (Jesus) will bring life for all men. Romans 8:19-21 --- Creation itself will be liberated and brought into the glorious freedom of the children of God. Romans 8:38-39 --- Nothing can separate us from the love of God that is in Christ. Romans 11:32 --- God made all people imprisoned by disobedience so that he may have mercy on them all. 1 Corinthians 5:5 -- 5To deliver such a man to the Accuser for destruction of the flesh, so that the spirit might be saved on the day of the Lord. 1 Corinthians 15:22-28 --- All will be made alive in Christ, but each in his own turn and ultimately Christ will subdue all his enemies, eliminate death and God will be all in all. 2 Corinthians 5:15 --- Christ died for all. 2 Corinthians 5:19 --- Through Christ, God was reconciling the world to Himself. Ephesians 1:11 --- God will bring all things under heaven and on earth under Christ. Ephesians 4:6 - One Lord, one God, one Father of all. Ephesians 4:10 --- Christ ascended higher then all the heavens to fill the whole universe. Philippians. 2:9-11 --- Every tongue will confess that Jesus is Lord (In 1 Corinthians 12:3, Paul writes that no one can say “Jesus is Lord” except by the Holy Spirit) Colossians 1: 19-20 --- God was pleased to reconcile to Himself, all things on earth and in heaven through the blood of Christ. 1 Timothy 2:4-6 --- God wants all men to be saved and to know the truth. Can God’s desire be thwarted? 1 Timothy 4:10 --- God is the Savior of all men, especially (not exclusively) those who believe. Titus 2:11-12 --- God’s grace, which brings salvation has appeared to all men. Hebrews 2:9 --- Jesus tasted death for everyone. 1 John 2:2 --- Christ is the atoning sacrifice of the sins of the whole world. 1 John 3:8 --- Christ appeared to destroy the devil’s works. (The doctrine of eternal damnation denies the victory of Christ!) 1 John 4:8, 16 --- God is Love. (not loving towards some, but not others, Love is the very essence of Who He is.) 1 John 4:14 --- Christ is the Savior of the World. Revelations 5:13 --- Every creature in heaven, on earth, under the earth, and on the sea will sing praises to him who sits on the throne and to the Lamb (Christ). Revelations 21:4-5 --- God will dwell with men and he will wipe every tear from their eyes, death, mourning, crying, pain and the old order of things will pass and everything will be made new.
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@@MegaNetty1 Hi Jeannette thanks for the link. While Mr Wiese has a clear and concise approach, unfortunately he falls into an all-too-common misunderstanding of universal restoration, claiming that we say all ppl go to heaven no matter what they believe. UR embraces that the son is the only way to the Father. We simply say that ALL will come to believe, whether in this life or in the next, when Jesus lets the souls out of death and hell. The destruction of the old sinful man, the purging of the dross, needs to occur in the firey lake of God's pure love so that the new man in Christ, the overcomer, can enter heaven through the ever-open pearly gates, bringing all the glory of the nations and the kings of the earth to the throne. When God's righteous acts are revealed and the enemies of sin, death, Babylon and the false trinity are cast down, all mankind will be in awe. You know, God swore an oath by Himself before Cyrus that every knee would bow and every tongue confess. (Isa 45:23, Rom 14:11, Phil 2:10). Why do ppl want to short-change the Koreshic Oath, this divine covenant promise? Salvation is a gift of God, the most worthy are the least deserving. If God can save the likes of Mr Wiese, you and me, then He can surely save anyone. And He will be all in all.
If someone has a curable disease and they resist the cure, they have a problem with both the cure and the disease. To accept the cure means there will not be a problem with the disease. The unbeliever still has a problem with sin that can only be cured through Christ. Just because the cure exists and is available does not mean the disease is gone. They must receive the cure to remove the sin. In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:” - Colossians 1:14 The forgiveness of sins is made possible by the blood of the Lord Jesus Christ. By his grace God offers forgiveness of all sins to any man in Christ. This does not mean everyone is already forgiven, for not all men are in Christ. Not all men have faith. The benefits of the gospel of Christ, including benefits of the blood, are only given to those that first trust the gospel (Eph 1:13). Everyone in Christ will be judged according to Christ’s work on their behalf. Everyone in hell will be judged according to their works. People are in hell because of their sins. There is forgiveness of sins offered through faith in the blood of Christ, but they rejected that and are left to deal with the consequences. Salvation has been secured and assured for those that believe, but without faith it is impossible to please him (Heb 11:6). Unbelievers need forgiveness before they die. Forgiveness is only found in Christ. Any man can be in Christ by faith in the gospel. If someone is without faith and outside of Christ, there is no forgiveness. God has done everything necessary for souls to be saved including providing the means for forgiveness. This gospel of grace (God’s riches at Christ’s expense) is preached unto all nations for the obedience of faith (Rom 1:5). It is there. It is offered to you freely, but you must believe it to receive it!
I don't see universalism compatible with the concept of free will and genuine love of the Father, if eventually God will redeem us even if we reject him all the way to our graves. I see universalism as just another longing for the eternal, the complete, the good, the beautiful, and transcendent things that cannot be attained in this world. It's a form of idealism wishing to usher a beautiful ending in an otherwise serious reality that exists because it's the only way true love and the essence of God can exist in this universe. (Through Jesus Christ's life & sacrifice). It's natural to be inclined to be attracted toward these ideas, because our soul longs to be satisfied with the ideal, the great ideal, the God-man Christ himself, through which in his words says "Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. 14 But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it. Matthew 7:13-14" Remember, goodness always comes after truth, I say seek the truth, and let God sort things out afterwards.
Me neither. I don’t believe in free will. Jesus draws (literally drags) all men to himself. He is the savior of all, especially those who believe ! Those are Bible verses.
Narrow is the way into the Kingdom, because not many people in this life will realize who Christ is, or they will not live Him out, or not many will live lives meaningfully with a purpose to serve and encourage others who are broken in spirit. Many people live self-destructive lives, or purposeless lives to no avail which lead only to torment. Christ centered universalism *is* the eternal message of the Gospel, because hell rather than being forever becomes a place of burning to rebuke the unrepentant in spirit who eventually will see Christ as infinitely loving. The Bridal Church to that end is to have the testimony to convince the lost man to enter into the Kingdom of God. What happened in the parable of the prodigal son? He returned to his Father after his appetite changed, because his hunger to be accepted back into his Father’s presence came to him after he was entirely exhausted, and after he had lived out all other experiences in his life which were profitless. And, for a time, he also endured the consequences of his own actions. His staving off feeling famished, as much as the inheritance he received and squandered, were both finite. Upon his return and upcoming celebration, the Father corrected the older son who had worked his days in the fields. The older son toiled the fields in hopes to please the Father who had a broken heart. In truth, the Father loved both his sons in the same nature. The older son was in error to believe that his toiling to love his Father to compensate for what his younger brother wasted, and to make up for what the Father lost in a son, was what he ought to do. He saw his younger brother as a hopeless cause. The Father said no. I love him, as I love you.
By modern Christian standards, how can degenerate and sinful man make himself right with God? He can't; he needs the Holy Spirit's intercession. This in itself is already a violation of man's free will. Because left to his own devices? Man would choose the worst of all possible outcomes.
Here's my view. There is no hell on earth like the hell a mother goes through if and when one of her children goes through hell! When God's only son suffered on the cross He went to heaven forever. When a billion human sons (and daughters) have died they webt to hell forever. Why? Because they disappointed God. God's way of planning stuff sucks big time if you ask me. But Im going to hell forever just for saying the plan sucks. First we are given a deep hunger for love and attention. Then we're given strong hormones and the urge to merge. Then it leads to pregnancy. Great! Now as God's plan goes we get to raise a child that's going to worry about going to hell forever. Thy will be done? Sad, sad, sicko plan!
Brimstone is used to refine materials through intense heat. Even hellfire apologists can’t escape terms laid out within scripture. The martyrs reward is not dependent on the suffering of others. You can misunderstand and turn away from Christ who ought to be the first love of the believer. If your expectation is to see another man judged, then how does that fit the story of the prodigal son? What about the parables of the religious who act in God’s name yet are rebuked by God? In the end God does not abandon them. He corrects them, for a time.
Those martyrs were sinful and fallen human beings - no better than you or me. They didn't get saved because they died for their faith. Either salvation comes entirely from God, OR you can earn your salvation by living or dying a certain way. Take your pick.
The sin argument is an interesting one. Christian apologists claim that Adam and Eve were created perfect but they had freewill - hence why they sinned. The problem with this claim is that if they were created perfect then they should have always made perfect decisions. Imperfection does not give birth to perfection. That goes against the rules of logic. PERFECTION BEGATS PERFECTION. IMPERFECTION BEGATS IMPERFECTION. Logic always wins. Therefore, the Christian apologists claim is completely wrong from a logical standpoint - of course, that is if we are using the same logical parameters to assess this topic in the same way we would assess everything else in life. Of course, the Eden story is entirely mythological - but Christian apologists interpret the story literally - thats the problem. You see foks, All the geographical locations in the bible are actually real - so are the various people groups mentioned in the bible. But all the stories are entire mythological and consist of allegory and metaphor. In fact, all the worlds organised religions are actually the same in this manner. Ancient Humans were simply trying to understand the world around them and their greater purpose - so they wrote what they SURMISED was Gods nature and mixed in their own folklore tales with it. They then put these ALLEGORICAL hybrid tales into books and the resulting end products are what you would call the so called "holy books" from the various people groups around the world. There is nothing surprising about this. Thats just human beings behaving like human beings. Throughout the thousands of years people groups from around the world have done this. The trick is to make the various resulting religions work for YOU. Rather than YOU working for these religions. Hell was not taught as a lake of fire in the Old Testament. The greek idea of hell in the New Testament is very easy to explain. Let us first examine the Jews. The orthodox Jews claim that both Christianity and Islam are actually BASTARDISATIONS of orthodox Judaism. The orthodox Jews do not believe in hell as a place of eternal torture by fire. That would explain why greek ideas of hell have been put in Jesus's mouth by the greek writers of the New Testament. Especially, considering that in order for any person to learn greek 2000 years ago the only greek writings actually available to actually PRACTICE learning the greek language were greek mythological epics which documented precisely greek ideas of hell. For example, Hades and Tartarus are terms for hell copied straight from the greek mythological epics which contained these concepts and ideas. People simply learnt these Greek epics as a way of practicing reading and writing greek as the main greek writings were all mythological works. The New Testament writers then copied these greek ideas of hell into the greek New Testament they were writing. The New Testament is a fusion of Judaism and Greek mythology. Hellinistic Judaism is well documented by Orthodox Jews themselves. It was eventually suppressed - but It re-emerged as New Testament Christianity in 325ad. The difference is that this time it was backed by the state of Rome in what became known as Roman Catholicism. ALL, the various protestant denominations copied these doctrines as they branched off from Roman Catholicism. They left out other doctrines and took the main doctrines into their new Protestant version of Christianity.
Jesus teachings overrides everything in scripture, and evey book written by mankind. Jesus is God! 1Ti 3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory. Jesus teachings is all about some people being saved, and about some people being lost. Some people will refuse to take the offer of salvation. When Jesus speaks please believe him! Rev 3:19 As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent. Rev 3:20 Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me. Rev 3:21 To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne. Mat 10:32 Whosoever therefore shall confess me before men, him will I confess also before my Father which is in heaven. Mat 10:33 But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven. Mat 7:13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:Mat 7:14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it. Mat 7:15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves. Mat 7:16 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles? Mat 7:17 Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit. Mat 7:18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit. Mat 7:19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire. Mat 7:20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them. Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Mat 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? Mat 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity. Mat 7:24 Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:Mat 7:25 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock. Mat 7:26 And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand:Mat 7:27 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it. Mat 13:36 Then Jesus sent the multitude away, and went into the house: and his disciples came unto him, saying, DECLARE UNTO US THE PARABLE OF THE TARES OF THE FIELD. Mat 13:37 He answered and said unto them, He that soweth the good seed is the Son of man;Mat 13:38 The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one; Mat 13:39 The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels. Mat 13:40 As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world. Mat 13:41 The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity; Mat 13:42 And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth. Mat 13:43 Then shall the righteous shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Who hath ears to hear, let him hear. Mat 13:47 Again, the kingdom of heaven is like unto a net, that was cast into the sea, and gathered of every kind: Mat 13:48 Which, when it was full, they drew to shore, and sat down, and gathered the good into vessels, but cast the bad away. Mat 13:49 So shall it be at the end of the world: the angels shall come forth, and sever the wicked from among the just, Mat 13:50 And shall cast them into the furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth. Jhn 4:23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him. Jhn 4:24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth. 2Co 4:3 But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost: 2Co 4:4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.
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@Scott Klaudt The fire sent by God will be so real! Sinners must take HEED please! The great battle of ARMAGEDDON! Joe 2:10 The earth shall quake before them; the heavens shall tremble: the sun and the moon shall be dark, and the stars shall withdraw their shining:Joe 2:11 And the LORD shall utter his voice before his army: for his camp is very great: for he is strong that executeth his word: for the day of the LORD is great and very terrible; and who can abide it? Joe 2:12 Therefore also now, saith the LORD, turn ye even to me with all your heart, and with fasting, and with weeping, and with mourning:Joe 2:13 And rend your heart, and not your garments, and turn unto the LORD your God: for he is gracious and merciful, slow to anger, and of great kindness, and repenteth him of the evil. 2Pe 3:10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up. 2Pe 3:11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,2Pe 3:12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat? 2Pe 3:13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.2Pe 3:14 Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in peace, without spot, and blameless. Rev 16:1 And I heard a great voice out of the temple saying to the seven angels, Go your ways, and pour out the vials of the wrath of God upon the earth. Rev 16:2 And the first went, and poured out his vial upon the earth; and there fell a noisome and grievous sore upon the men which had the mark of the beast, and upon them which worshipped his image. Rev 16:3 And the second angel poured out his vial upon the sea; and it became as the blood of a dead man: and every living soul died in the sea. Rev 16:4 And the third angel poured out his vial upon the rivers and fountains of waters; and they became blood. Rev 16:5 And I heard the angel of the waters say, Thou art righteous, O Lord, which art, and wast, and shalt be, because thou hast judged thus. Rev 16:6 For they have shed the blood of saints and prophets, and thou hast given them blood to drink; for they are worthy. Rev 16:7 And I heard another out of the altar say, Even so, Lord God Almighty, true and righteous are thy judgments. Rev 16:8 And the fourth angel poured out his vial upon the sun; and power was given unto him to scorch men with fire. Rev 16:9 And men were scorched with great heat, and blasphemed the name of God, which hath power over these plagues: and they repented not to give him glory. Rev 16:10 And the fifth angel poured out his vial upon the seat of the beast; and his kingdom was full of darkness; and they gnawed their tongues for pain,Rev 16:11 And blasphemed the God of heaven because of their pains and their sores, and repented not of their deeds. Rev 16:12 And the sixth angel poured out his vial upon the great river Euphrates; and the water thereof was dried up, that the way of the kings of the east might be prepared. Rev 16:13 And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs come out of the mouth of the dragon, and out of the mouth of the beast, and out of the mouth of the false prophet. Rev 16:14 For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty. Rev 16:15 Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame. Rev 16:16 And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue ARMAGEDDON. Rev 16:17 And the seventh angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, It is done. Rev 16:18 And there were voices, and thunders, and lightnings; and there was a great earthquake, such as was not since men were upon the earth, so mighty an earthquake, and so great. Rev 16:19 And the great city was divided into three parts, and the cities of the nations fell: and great Babylon came in remembrance before God, to give unto her the cup of the wine of the fierceness of his wrath. Rev 16:20 And every island fled away, and the mountains were not found. Rev 16:21 And there fell upon men a great hail out of heaven, every stone about the weight of a talent: and men blasphemed God because of the plague of the hail; for the plague thereof was exceeding great. Rev 19:11 And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war. Rev 19:12 His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself. Rev 19:13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God. Rev 19:14 And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean. Rev 19:15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God. Rev 19:16 And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS. Rev 19:17 And I saw an angel standing in the sun; and he cried with a loud voice, saying to all the fowls that fly in the midst of heaven, Come and gather yourselves together unto the supper of the great God;Rev 19:18 That ye may eat the flesh of kings, and the flesh of captains, and the flesh of mighty men, and the flesh of horses, and of them that sit on them, and the flesh of all men, both free and bond, both small and great. Rev 19:19 And I saw the beast, and the kings of the earth, and their armies, gathered together to make war against him that sat on the horse, and against his army. Rev 19:20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone. Rev 19:21 And the remnant were slain with the sword of him that sat upon the horse, which sword proceeded out of his mouth: and all the fowls were filled with their flesh.
That's funny you decided to put this one in last: 2Co 4:3 But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost: 2Co 4:4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them. Whether you are aware of it or not, this passage is plainly telling us that God abounds in grace the most to those that sin (That's everyone!). That Jesus will go after and save all the lost sheep and will not return until he finds them. God wills the salvation of all mankind. He WILLS it!!! Do you think Jesus only came for some, a small handful of people?!! All knees will bow and all tongues will freely choose Jesus as Lord dude!!! Your passages are figurative in nature. They are hyperboles, expressions of symbolism and the word fire especially. God is a refiner, a consuming and spiritual fire. The Greek for fire is PUR. Should I tell you what PUR translates to? I'll let you figure that out on your own!! God bless
@@je4754 1Co 1:18 For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God. 2Co 4:3 But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost:2Co 4:4 In whom the god of this world ( SATAN )hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them. 2Th 2:10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 2Th 2:11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:2Th 2:12 That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness. Tit 1:15 Unto the pure all things are pure: but unto them that are defiled and unbelieving is nothing pure; but even their mind and conscience is defiled.Tit 1:16 They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate. 1Pe 4:17 For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God?1Pe 4:18 And if the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear?1Pe 4:19 Wherefore let them that suffer according to the will of God commit the keeping of their souls to him in well doing, as unto a faithful Creator. Act 3:19 Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord;Act 3:20 And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you:Act 3:21 Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began. Act 3:22 For Moses truly said unto the fathers, A prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you of your brethren, like unto me; him shall ye hear in all things whatsoever he shall say unto you. Act 3:23 And it shall come to pass, that every soul, which will not hear that prophet, shall be destroyed from among the people. Act 3:24 Yea, and all the prophets from Samuel and those that follow after, as many as have spoken, have likewise foretold of these days. Act 3:25 Ye are the children of the prophets, and of the covenant which God made with our fathers, saying unto Abraham, And in thy seed shall all the kindreds of the earth be blessed. Act 3:26 Unto you first God, having raised up his Son Jesus, sent him to bless you, in turning away every one of you from his iniquities. 2Pe 3:3 Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,2Pe 3:4 And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation. 2Pe 3:5 For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:2Pe 3:6 Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished:2Pe 3:7 But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men. 2Pe 3:8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day. 2Pe 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance. 2Pe 3:10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up. 2Pe 3:11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,2Pe 3:12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?2Pe 3:13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.2Pe 3:14.Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in peace, without spot, and blameless.
Genesis 12:3 --- All peoples on earth will be blessed through Abraham. Genesis 22:18 --- All nations on earth will be blessed through Abraham’s offspring. Numbers 27:16 --- Moses refers to the “source of the breath of all flesh”. Psalms 22:27 --- All the ends of the earth and all the families of the nations will acknowledge God. Psalms 65:2 --- All men will come to God. Psalms 86:9 --- All nations will worship and glorify God. Psalms 103:8-9 --- God is compassionate, will not always accuse and will not be angry forever. Psalm 136 --- God's love endures forever. Psalms 145:9-10 --- The Lord has compassion on all His creation and all He has made will praise Him. Psalms 145:13 --- The Lord loves all His creation. Psalms 145:14 --- The Lord upholds all who fall. 1 Sam. 2:6: - “The Lord kills and makes alive; he brings down to the grave (Sheol--Hadees) and brings up." Isaiah 25:6-8 --- God will prepare a feast for all people, He will destroy the shroud that enfolds all peoples, the sheet that covers up all nations. He will eliminate death, wipe away the tears from all faces and remove the disgrace of his people from all the earth. Isaiah 45:22-23 --- God has sworn an oath that every knee will bow before Him and every tongue will swear by Him. Isaiah 49:6 --- God’s salvation will be brought to the ends of the earth. Isaiah 54:8 --- Although God will hide His face in a surge of anger, He will also have compassion with everlasting kindness. Isaiah 57:16-18 --- God’s anger is not permanent. Although He punishes man, He will heal, guide and restore comfort to him. Jeremiah 31:33-34 --- All men will know God, from the greatest to the least. Lamentations 3:31-33 --- The Lord does not cast off forever. Although He brings grief, He will also be compassionate. Ezekiel 18:21 --- God does not any pleasure in the death of the wicked. Rather, He is pleased when they repent. Jonah 2:6 --- "Forever" is used in reference to a period of only three days. Jonah 4:2 --- God graciously and compassionately relents from promised judgement. Micah 7:18 --- God does not stay angry forever. Matthew 18:13 --- Like the man who owes a hundred sheep and is not willing to lose even one, God is not willing that any one be lost. Luke 2:10 --- The birth of Jesus is good news for all the people. Luke 3: 5, 6 --- John the Baptist quotes Isaiah’s words that all mankind will see God’s salvation. John 1:29 --- Jesus is the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world. John 3:35 --- God sent Jesus to save the world. John 4:42 --- God has committed all things to Christ. John 5:25 --- Even the dead will hear the sound of Christ and all who hear will live. John 6:37 --- Everything that God has given to Christ will come to him. John 10:14-16 - “I am the good shepherd. I know My sheep and My sheep know Me, 15 just as the Father knows Me and I know the Father. And I lay down My life for the sheep. 16 I have other sheep that are not of this fold. I must bring them in as well, and they will listen to My voice. Then there will be one flock and one shepherd.” John 12:32 --- When Jesus is lifted up from the earth, he will draw all men to himself. John 12:47 --- Jesus came to save the world. John 17:2 --- God granted Christ authority over all people so that Christ may give eternal life to all that God has given him. Acts 3:20-21 --- Jesus must remain in heaven until the time comes for God to restore everything. Acts 17:28 --- All human beings are children of God. Romans 3:3-4 --- The unbelief of some will not nullify God’s faithfulness. Romans 5:18 --- The act of obedience of one man (Jesus) will bring life for all men. Romans 8:19-21 --- Creation itself will be liberated and brought into the glorious freedom of the children of God. Romans 8:38-39 --- Nothing can separate us from the love of God that is in Christ. Romans 11:32 --- God made all people imprisoned by disobedience so that he may have mercy on them all. 1 Corinthians 5:5 -- 5To deliver such a man to the Accuser for destruction of the flesh, so that the spirit might be saved on the day of the Lord. 1 Corinthians 15:22-28 --- All will be made alive in Christ, but each in his own turn and ultimately Christ will subdue all his enemies, eliminate death and God will be all in all. 2 Corinthians 5:15 --- Christ died for all. 2 Corinthians 5:19 --- Through Christ, God was reconciling the world to Himself. Ephesians 1:11 --- God will bring all things under heaven and on earth under Christ. Ephesians 4:6 - One Lord, one God, one Father of all. Ephesians 4:10 --- Christ ascended higher then all the heavens to fill the whole universe. Philippians. 2:9-11 --- Every tongue will confess that Jesus is Lord (In 1 Corinthians 12:3, Paul writes that no one can say “Jesus is Lord” except by the Holy Spirit) Colossians 1: 19-20 --- God was pleased to reconcile to Himself, all things on earth and in heaven through the blood of Christ. 1 Timothy 2:4-6 --- God wants all men to be saved and to know the truth. Can God’s desire be thwarted? 1 Timothy 4:10 --- God is the Savior of all men, especially (not exclusively) those who believe. Titus 2:11-12 --- God’s grace, which brings salvation has appeared to all men. Hebrews 2:9 --- Jesus tasted death for everyone. 1 John 2:2 --- Christ is the atoning sacrifice of the sins of the whole world. 1 John 3:8 --- Christ appeared to destroy the devil’s works. (The doctrine of eternal damnation denies the victory of Christ!) 1 John 4:8, 16 --- God is Love. (not loving towards some, but not others, Love is the very essence of Who He is.) 1 John 4:14 --- Christ is the Savior of the World. Revelations 5:13 --- Every creature in heaven, on earth, under the earth, and on the sea will sing praises to him who sits on the throne and to the Lamb (Christ). Revelations 21:4-5 --- God will dwell with men and he will wipe every tear from their eyes, death, mourning, crying, pain and the old order of things will pass and everything will be made new.
This is kind of gross. He relays the polarization in a magnified way as if to relish in it himself by so coloring his opponents... it's merely a temporal tribalism, with eternal implications if he's ascendant, yet wrong. He's not wholly wrong. But, again, I see the same emotional NEED for it to be true that they all have this NEED. Just listen to his tone of voice when he says it.
I’m NOT hostile to UV…you’re just lost blind naked…I once was lost and now I’m found..and my heart goes out to my brothers still in the dark Now UV…your religious nuttiness…like mormons or catholics or evolutionists..is an odd creation of man with Satans HELP. Praying for you…NO follower of Christ takes pleasure in ANYONE going to hell. Here’s what God said…not that you care…”As surely as I Live declares the Sovereign Lord…I Take NO pleasure in the death of the wicked but RATHER they turn from their wicked ways and LIVE” It’s a shame you’re not a better student…you might have come across this in your own study…praying for you
The idea of a hell that lasts forever is a pagan belief, and a Roman belief. Roman principality and rule entered into Christian tradition upon the Roman State’s inclusion of Christianity into its system. From which point, rather than preaching an eternal gospel, many were declared heretics-some for the very reason of holding to a belief in ultimate restoration through Christ-even at the point of the sword. Christ’s simple message became warped due to political interests. Why would Christ need the principality of a fallen kingdom of this age to defend his namesake, or to testify in His place? Late ancient Rome as well as the Roman Catholic political system following it was and is quick to declare heresy, and the former was quick to kill rather than to merely cast out. The spirit of that tradition lives on in many denominations that take after the spirit of ancient Roman Catholicism, like children from their mother.
i would not wish hell on my worst enemy
I wouldn't either brother. God bless you!
I pray for murderers and rapists and monsters like Stalin to be saved by God.
Same 🙏
Neither I
same...bless you brother
"I'm not special if everyone is special." A psychologically astute observation that I suspect is at the basis of all hostility to universalism.
I agree there is a human element of selfishness involved in orthodox Christians clinging to hell rather than all saved eventually. The Christians I've grown up with, all good people, for some reason get really hostile if hell is debunked Scripturally.
@@rzella8022 Psychologically, it makes perfect sense to me. Disruption of one's view of ultimate meaning is always destablizing. Especially pernicious here is the lust for the teaching (universalism) to be false while justifying the reaction as demanded by a sound apprehension of divine love!
I grew up on the SBC, in its full Hellfire and Brimstone mode. IT has taken me decades to see the sheer immorality of Eternal Damnation without a hope of Rememption. Thank you for your work.
You don't believe in the teaching of eternal Hell because you are not converted to Christ. See my article on universalism, where I totally destroy this heresy.
@@TruthBeTold7 OK hardcore Southern Baptist grandma yelling at people in the seasonal aisle of the Albertsens in 1994 about why Easter egg hunts are pagan and you can't love Jesus if you do them.
@@TheJoeschmoe777 That sounds oddly specific, want to talk about it?
@@UrbanDefenseSystemsLook up "Ishtar Ruins Easter" by LutheranSatire lol
'grace is more gracious the more abundantly it is given.' excellent!
Yep people get excited thinking 99% of the universe is going to burn in hell forever and ever amen
As Christians, we shouldn’t.
I like Lewis’ view that everyone will be in the presence of God after death, but for the ones who hate him, it will be agonizing.
At the end of the day though, I know God is more merciful that we imagine and I cannot determine someone’s salvation.
What is Ironic to me as a Universalist is that I find similarities between myself and Calvinists. I believe in the Sovereignty of GOD, I believe that GOD is in full control, I believe that GOD is supremely powerful and all knowing. Difference is, I believe that GOD'S nature is redemptive and that He will save ALL humanity, Instead of a few selected. GOD is in full control, and one day, as 1st Timothy 2 says, "it will be testified in due time" 1st Corinthians 15:28 GOD will be ALL IN ALL❤
I presume you believe that faith is a gift from God. If that is true (which Scripture teaches: Rom 12:3, Eph 2:8, Eph 6:23, Phil 1:29, etc) why is your god dealing out vengeance against those He didn't give faith to ?
THE CONCORDANT VERSION
2 Thessalonians 1:6-9
6 if so be that it is just of God to repay affliction to those afflicting you,
7 and to you who are being afflicted, ease, with us, at the unveiling of the Lord Jesus from heaven with His powerful messengers,
8 in flaming fire, dealing out VENGEANCE to those who are not acquainted with God and those who are not obeying the evangel of our Lord Jesus Christ
So Hitler is going to heaven?
@@rudyferrell what about the 6 million Jews he had tortured and killed? Were they sent straight to HELL for eternity? You answer me that, and I'll answer your Hitler question.
@@georgiapeach6289 that's what I thought
@@rudyferrell Sure he goes to heaven, after he was purified and redeemed. You don't seem to get that the person who will enter heaven is no longer the destructive psycho he was, but a loving individual that repented and suffered the consequences of his evil deeds.
The prodigals sons brother will be like most of the Christian world who will say “ but they haven’t earned it”
Oohhh yes they won’t want the party. They will want the pity party.
This actually makes me want to vomit. I can honestly say I’ve never wanted anyone, even the people that have personally devastated me emotionally through what can only be considered evil betrayal, to burn in Hell in eternal conscious torment! It’s such a deeply repulsive concept to my sensibilities!
Vebunkd if you have to genuinely ask what the point of being a Christian is other than being saved from Hell, I feel very sad for you.
Vebunkd you basically said if everyone is saved what is the point of the Cristian religion. It’s an argument often used. I find the argument shocking. I’m not a Christian because I’m going to be saved from hell. I’m a Christian because it’s the only way I want to live my life. Serving Christ here on Earth now.
Vebunkd hell is real. Check out the channel ‘The Total Victory of Christ’, if you would like to explore what I think is the closest to what the bible teaches. I have never subscribed to ECT, but did believe in annihilationism for a while. I then came to the conclusion of universalism on reading the bible more and opening my mind to what universalists had to say, it then became obvious to me (REALLY OBVIOUS). I think the reason you are even engaging in this conversation, is because deep down you have some deep questions about this doctrine. I’m sorry for my short answer, I’ve just woken up. I think the channel I mentioned in this comment, explains my position best. Take care and God bless you 💜. I might try and write more later, once I’ve woken up properly and finished my chores :)
Edit: all the verses you quoted could equally point to universalism, once looking through that lens.
HI, L C! HAVE YOU SEEN THIS 4 MINUTE VIDEO YET? PLEASE WATCH IT REAL QUICK AND LET ME KNOW WHAT YOU THINK. THANKS! ua-cam.com/video/hDd5d0Rdyao/v-deo.html
If you study the entomology of the word hell, then you will soon discover that it was mistranslated from the word, sheol. Hades is the the actual word for grave.
There is no point for God to punish people endlessly. He would never create something only to destroy or hurt it later on. Symbolism man, seriously. God wills the salvation of all mankind! That's what the word, Gospel means : GOOD NEWS!!!!
So many adults ruined in child hood by the doctrine of Hell.
The doctrine of Hell has not ruined anybody, that is a deceit from the devil. On the contrary the doctrine of God's judgement has led many to turn to repentance. All the apostles of the bible spoke bodily about God's coming judgement
@@LukeAiwuyuse your either Deceived or just plain lying to yourself if you think people haven’t been completely broken by the thought of there loved ones burning in a never ending fire your sick if that’s what u hope for plain and simple
@@jdoe7674 God Bless you friend
@@LukeAiwuyuse And none of them thought the verdict would be Eternal Torture. They were annihilationists or universalists.
Nobody would even be talkin about hell if they would get rid of toxic translations, you won't find the word hell in the true Hebrew or Greek.
1 John 2:2 - And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world
Titus 2:11 "For the grace of God has appeared, giving salvation to all human beings".
Do you mean DBH, or God ?? (or do they pretty much mean the same thing:)
@@christopherconey732 You're asking this question to a Bible verse. You tell me
So Hitler is going to heaven? 🤔
@@rudyferrell mercy is a Jesus concept, hell is a human concept. So eventually, yes
@@JoeySehn oh, Well Jesus talked about hell too. You can twist his words around to make them say what you want them to, but he talked about hell son.
The most people who think that there is a hell are not happy about it.
you mean Eternal Hell, right? because Universalists do believe in hell. its just not everlasting...
DBH 's mouth locuta, causa finita. He is, undoubtely, the single most insightful Orthodox theologian of our time.
He's teaching a doctrine of demons and it sounds like you bought it. Read your Bible
@@rudyferrell Dude read YOUR bible 😂 Christ literally wins!
@@Jordan-hz1wr Yes He wins and sinners lose, unlike your marcionite heretic hart we don't reject the old testament or believe in evolution
@@shiningdiamond5046 The messaging of Christian Universalism struggles due to the baggage of some of its messengers.
It's actually not that profound if you have a thesaurus handy. I'm not saying he's wrong (though I think he is); I'm just saying it's pretty normal for followers to follow the arrogant guy around, hanging on his every word. If you've been alive 5 minutes, you've seen this in every sort of community--secular or religious.
Everyone I know that defends the absurd notion that our Good Father will be torturing humans eternally are sure that are not among their number. How convenient.
I’ve always thought that about your average self-proclaimed Christian. When you really think about hell and your “non believing” friends, if you really believe in hell as a concept then why are you not spending every waking minute pleading with them and others you care about to become a part of the church
Exactly...thats one of the ultimate proofs to me people don't actually believe in ECT.Their neglect to speak to their friend for 10 min will result in their friend after 50 quadrillion years still being in hell....its insanity
@@ttownsupreme2183 sadly it’s becoming clear to me that most of them actually rejoice in the thought that there the special one that made the right choices and avoided never ending fiery torture they probably imagine themselves dancing and singing to suffering screams of there lost friends
I wouldn’t put it past some few who would preach genuinely to the best of their knowledge and ability about the gospel. If a man evangelizes because he loves Christ, than his love for Christ isn’t misleading. His theological grasp might be lopsided. But I’ve seen few, albeit very few, of those sorts of Christians myself who implore everyone around them to accept Christ-and what’s been a common attitude amongst those genuine evangelicals is that they don’t trouble themselves to judge others directly, but leave it to the will and mind of God the Father for that to be addressed. Rather than judging other’s souls eternally, they effectively preach accountability to God to both the believer and the nonbeliever instead. They’re wrong on theology, but right in principle. Their love for God overcomes their struggling with fear from having a lack of knowledge, which speaks of their having right character.
@@Hibernial exactly u speaking the truth if I ever heard it I think “Christian’s” that believe in hell and want people to go there aren’t Christian’s to begin with but true Christian’s that believe in hell and are constantly talking to there family and friends and others about what they believe they still always leave room to say but hey it’s up to god if he saves everyone I’m cool with that and that’s true Christianity acknowledging that at the end of the day it doesn’t too much matter what we think or feel or what the Bible says God is literally God and he can do whatever he decides he wants to do and we’re cool with that
There are parts of me that wish there is no hell, I really don't need anyone to suffer forever, I think. Obviously there are some really bad people, who need punishment, but I know God will be merciful, and correct in his judgment.
Great stuff! Thank you.
HI, David! HAVE YOU SEEN THIS 4 MINUTE VIDEO YET? PLEASE WATCH IT REAL QUICK AND LET ME KNOW WHAT YOU THINK. THANKS! ua-cam.com/video/hDd5d0Rdyao/v-deo.html
There are some who while not wanting people to eternally experience torment, do get offended at the idea that those who didn't strive to live a virtuous, Christian life will be allowed to go to heaven. To them, a club must keep some out in order to be of any value.
Hell is the absence of God. What makes you think the unregenerate man loves God and wants to be with Him in heaven?
@@paulmichael5021 What business does God have with our wants?
@@AquaticDot None, unless He has mercy and regenerates us. As He transforms His children into the image of His Son...His wants (desires) become our wants (desires).
@Eremias Ranwolf
You said:
"Why would God abandon them forever when he might just open their eyes instead?"
22And if God, willing to shew the wrath and to make known His power, did endure, in much long suffering, vessels of wrath fitted for destruction, 23and that He might make known the riches of His glory on vessels of kindness, that He before prepared for glory, whom also He did call - us - 24not only out of Jews, but also out of nations
What don't you understand about vessels of wrath fitted for destruction?
I do love DBH.
He confesses his own guilt of being prideful, superior and arrogant by reference to the sporting clubs he supports - which is of course quite trivial - and as if he cares as much about football or baseball as about the ultimate truth of things.
And he confesses to an aspect of his intellectual superiority - his coyness :)
But he does not confess his overarching sense of triumph over most other philosophers and theologians including in particular Ed Feser. A while ago he offered a kind of apology to Feser for his involvement in the bitter dispute between them, but in the centre of this apology he spouted his ultimate superiority over Feser and other philistines - however good Feser's arguments might be, they will never be based on reading the original sources in their original languages. It's as if His Lordship DBH said: "I am sorry for putting you down Feser, but that is where you belong - compared to me"". He just can't help being so darn good :)))
Academics tend to have an ego, which doesn’t help in the matter of relaying anything that’s true.
He said he is not coy which means shy. This has nothing to do with intellectual superiority as you claim
I'm happy that he uses it to highlight the psychologically and, I believe, theologically sound view that "grace is more gracious the more abundantly it's given". It's an attitude of pride I find much more acceptable than the variant he calls out.
Grew up in Pentecostalism and have witnessed this winners/losers dichotomy. I think I have always been a Universalist and thought hell was a false teaching even as a child. I just had no mechanism to articulate my thoughts until Bible College and seminary. I understand salvation as a process rather than a state of being. We are constantly "becoming" Christian (i.e., Christlike) rather than being Christian. This view, I believe, debunks the doctrine of hell. No one is left out of this "becoming." I shared this when I was in the ordination process of the UMC and was told that it was heresy and not to share that. AS a UMC elder for a decade, I struggled with this being in the Universalist closet. When I came out due to this and my support for LGBT persons, I was asked to surrender my credentials.
Technically you are saying the word of hid lies
Great clip. Thanks.
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@@MegaNetty1 With respect, I don't buy his argument. Jesus' victory includes victory over sin and death. He would that no man should perish. Shall his will be thwarted by satan, or by man? The lake of fire is one of refinement, purification, judgement. _Let all creation rejoice before the Lord, for he comes,
he comes to judge the earth._ (Psalm 96:13)
They rather worship a God who is going to torture his own creation in hell forever. I do not understand how they can believe such horror.
I don't want to be around evil people. I don't care if it's eternal torture or annihilation, just get them out of heaven.
@@christianthinker2536 they aren’t going to be evil In heaven they will be purified in the lake of fire
@@christianthinker2536 If you "don't care if it's eternal torture" then I'm sorry to break it to you, but... you're the evil one.
I agree with DBH that many who reject Universalism come from a primal desire to see a dynamic of winners vs losers.....but what about those who reject Universalism, like I do, that *wish it were true*, but do so out of feeling it's simply un-Biblical in that it negates God's granting of free will on his creation to willfully choose him?
Sinners cannot choose God anymore than we can choose our earthly parents. Also free will is an illusion.
Football, Have you read the second edition of Tom Talbott’s “inescapable love of God,” or the 2003 volume “Universal Salvation? the Current Debate” edited by Partridge and Parry, or the 2008 book “The Evangelical Universalist” by Robin Parry (under pseudonym Gregory MacDonald), or Reitan and Kronen’s 2011 book “God’s Final Victory: a comparative philosophical case for universalism?” Those are among the *best* cases for Christ-mediated universalism. The last book on that list is mostly philosophy and theological themes without much discussion of the prooftexts, but the others cover pretty much everything that needs to be covered (proof texts, philosophy, theology, and psychology).
@@therealgospelofchrist6823 - So....Calvinism?
@@footballpharaoh5469 Uhhh no... what made you make that assumption?
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So good. Love this theologian. “all shall be saved” - Excellent read! ❤🎉
Can David do a talk with Rob Bell, Carlton Pearson,Richard Rohr,Brad Jersak, Paul Young, Brian Zahnd?
All navel-gazing half-brainless men.
That’s a potpourri of heretics if I ever saw one.
I love Hart's theological arguments and understandings. I do not appreciate his psychoanalysis of those who disagree with him. Hart is more judgment of souls than he wants you to believe. He seems to have a knack for mind reading and being snarky.
The comments above represent exactly the hubris that turn many people off of Hart. "Why do I have to be charitable to those beneath my level of intelligence?" is as reprehensible a view as those Hart criticizes.
To deny hell is to deny the new testament. End of story. No philosphizing needed, this man is a heretic.
@@godsarmy8746 Triggered some 😤
@@godsarmy8746 Universal reconciliation through Christ’s work is not saying there in no hell at all. It’s a position stating that hell is finite and for an age, or even ages of time, but it is not infinite. The Church as Christ’s Bride for ages to come will be of the role to beckon all men onto Christ, after the long sentence for punishment is done. Ultimate restorationism/Christ centered universalism was the foremost and majority view in early christian fellowships up until the late Roman Empire assimilated christianity into the State. For political purposes of using religion and fear to control the masses, many church leaders who believed in ultimate restoration were disavowed by theocratic committees for political reasons, whether it was within some years if not even hundreds of years after the death of those christians.
All that aside, I think maybe part of the haughtiness portrayed by Hart comes from his socio-political views through a lense of socialism. Academic intellectuals under the socialist banner are a common trend in university setting, though some few socialists do differ from the majority if they’re in fact just mutualists who prefer local communes rather than a monolithic central State’s rule. Nonetheless, having strong political positions that become mixed with spiritual beliefs is like a blend of things that really don’t mix. Spiritual views are personal and delve into meta-physical subject matter, and socio-political views are philosophical arguments based upon this life. And personally, I don’t think it right to conflate the redeeming love of Christ with egalitarian philosophical beliefs that all too often prop up governments with systems that become religions onto themselves; especially since it was the Roman State which assimilated Christianity into its system.
The trouble with Christian Universalism’s arguments is the verbal baggage some messengers carry while presenting it.
@antoniososa1964You miss the point that those that disagree with Hart make; those who end up in hell do so because of *their* choices, not God's.
Now I don't know whether they are right, or Hart is. I personally would prefer it if Hart's interpretation of this was the correct one, but my personal preference is irrelevant, and those that argue against Universalism don't have terrible arguments for their position unlike Hart's claims that they do.
It is Dr Hart's lack of 'intellectual academic manners' which I most admire. If someone thinks GOD (of infinite being and love) could TORTURE, for eternity, a creature He has made with finite capacities in so many ways, in order to respond to Him and be fullfilled in Him, then there has to be something grotesquely wrong with that 'believer', and that form of 'belief'.
I used to look at Christs parable of the 100 sheep and the good shepherd as talking about the sheep being the elect. Recently the spirit activated a synchronicity with the verse that said that Christs blood was shed for ALL MANKIND. It felt like a diamond was shot right through my forehead. All of mankind is under the jurisdiction of Christ. He breathed his breath into us in the beginning and HE WILL redeem all of his sheep who he claimed with his own blood. Why? Because He’s the good shepherd. Will he not be happy about the one sheep more than the 99?
DBH is an interesting theologian. I would like to share my thoughts, regards to the believing in non-eternal hell, but in a relation to existential behaviour of people who would accept this as a dogma.
To me, eschatology needs to be a mistery. I think that we shouldn't define everything in dogmas. I understand DBH's argument about non-loving God, if there is an ethereal hell. I feel that also, in some sence, in the deepts of my heart. Алексеи Иличь Осипов (Osipov) said that there is a paradox if all loving God, knowing the destiny of human salvation, chooses to create the sole which will hypothetically go to hell (while knowing that, God chooses to create).
But I would want to hear your opinions on this:
How would the Christian world look like if we accept the teaching of origenism, where all beings would be saved in eternity? This is an existential question now. How would we behave in that conditions? What would be moral obligation for me to behave good, if I know that I would be, nevertheless, saved by a mercy God, all loving God?
For me, the possibilities of the graciousness of God needs to stay a mistery for a human, while the time exists.
Saint Isaak Syrian said that hell (Gehenna) is the condition of impossibility, or better, a lack of possibility to bear the love of God. God is, therefore, everywhere. Even in hell, there is a love from God. I don't like the picture of hell that Roman Catholic church made through centuries, in order to scare people. The worst hell would be the state when we are not able to love. But the question that DBH asked about salvation is wery bright, indeed. If we are progressing in eternity (epectasis) in Second Jerusalim, maybe there is a progression in the state of hell.
But the existential question stays: I can become Hitler, while believing in apocatastasis.
I just think that eschatology should be a mistery. For God everything is possible.
@@todormia Even if hell is not eternal, which I don't belive, it is still painful and full of suffering. A purifying fire. A judgement of the conscience. That sounds really unpleassant, especially for someone like Hitler.
The Church is a therapy for the soul. Universal Salvation teaches that every soul will eventually return back to God, but only after a long period of what might be described as a self inflicted punishment. The punishment of this world being nihilism and depression, whilst the punishment of the next world being the purification of hell
The goal of the Church is to allow one to escape the hell of this world and the next through the therapy of Christ
@@emZee1994 Well said! I completely agree.
It is funny to me because I landed on the same conclusion. I see throughout the tradition an ambiguity concerning eternal hell. One thing, and I think every Christian can argee on this, is that there is a promise of salvation and the 'benefits' (I don't like to use words for these matters since they take away from the realitiy of it). But what happens to the people who don't get it, I don't think we can say anything about that form tradition. Of course there are some streams of thought who are very clear that hell is eternal, but you can find enough universalist throughout history aswell. So cleary there are stearms which will take you in that direction.
Form a personal stance I like this ambiguity and I would say maybe it is even more powerfull than any cetrainty regarding punishment after death. The fact that I can only be sure of that there is the promise of salvation. Makes me wanna go that route because I now know what awaits me, it will me good whatever it is. But I don't want to end up anywhere where goodness is not certainly there.
I see the same thing !! A lot of demonations are real bad about it !
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1 Timothy 2:4-6 Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth. For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus; Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.
A text without a context is a pretext for a proof text. Go back and read your Bible...
@@awakeandfearless4143 what is the context that could lead these scriptures to be interpreted differently?
@@memedrop742 you’d have to rip dozens of other scriptures out of the Bible to make this one true. Clearly, this is referring to all the men who believe on Christ.
@@awakeandfearless4143 no you don’t and it’s clearly not, thats not what it says you’re just adding stuff on
@@memedrop742 I am honestly trying to understand how you rationalize universalism and how you harmonize it with other scriptures that clearly show that a rejection of Christ leads to hell.... I mean, I can see how it would feel good to believe this, I just cannot rationalize this with what scripture presents. Scripture cannot contradict itself. It’s very easy to take a proof text and make it mean what you want it to as it stands alone. Have you ever considered this?
"A dog barks when his master is attacked. I would be a coward if I saw that God's truth is attacked and yet would remain silent." - John Calvin
John Calvin is an awful person to quote. He might be surprised that the God he so ferociously defended doesn't exist. A Torturer of Souls is not the God of Love.
Which truth? The truth of God presented by Calvin is a sick facsimile of the Gospel that is completely incompatible with the love of God.
As someone who is honestly trying to understand and wrap their head around the concept of universalism, what do you say to the argument that God created man with free will and to consign everyone to eventual heaven-even if it is against their own choice because they hate God, essentially turns them into puppets? Doesn’t God want us to love and want to be with Him freely-not because we are forced to? I can’t imagine anyone hating God to that degree , but I assume they are out there.
Free will is not some random thing, there are always reasons why you love or hate something. For true freedom, we have to will with perfect clarity and as finite beings, we can’t forever hate God who is absolutely and infinitely good. For one to truly and perfectly understand the magnitude of the evils they have committed, they can’t have any imperfections in their reasoning. For even the worst person, utter hate can only change into utter shame with total understanding (for someone like Hitler or Chengis Khan, at a minimum they would need to go through the memories and emotions of everyone they caused pain and death when they lived and beyond and the shame will be worse than any bodily punishment)
If you are standing at the edge of a cliff and choose not to jump off, do you somehow not have free will? The universalist view is that once we sinners are humbled through hell and are exposed to God's nature after death, the obvious choice is to accept His gift of salvation through Jesus Christ. I don't think we can somehow keep rejecting Him for eternity, and it would be cruel for a truly infinitely loving God to put a time limit, especially when most people have a horrible idea of what the theistic God is (calling him a sky fairy for example) and hate that interpretation.
Both the Arminian and Calvinists are right respectively in their points of emphasis, yet wrong in interpreting man’s will and God’s will as somehow existing in a dilemma. The dilemma of endlessly competing wills that’s perceived and preserved by many theologians within doctrinal schools only exists because of the pagan/Roman doctrine of hell lasting forever being passed down in Christendom through the generations as status-quo, rather than hell being finite and temporary as a sentence. So that dilemma being a reoccurring source of confusion for many Christians who are left puzzled by the nature of how man can form a genuine relationship with God if not for fear of endless torment is really an illusion that doesn’t exist.
That isn’t to say hell as a form of punishment doesn’t exist; it’s to say that hell rebukes through man having free exercise of his will to reject God’s offering of Himself, and to endure separation and lack of enjoyment for however long he prefers to endure for a time in his own limited being. Even a man’s rejection of God is limited, and while God will not approach a man who blasphemes Him by saying no repeatedly, in enduring separation from God even that man will eventually come to repent upon realizing that God as Love is infinitely loving.
Do you believe that babies who die go to hell? I bet you don't. But if all who die in infancy go to heaven, where is free will?
We all have the free choice to eat our own excrements, yet (allmost) none of us do. I doubt anyone would actualy reject God when confronted with his infinite love and the experience of purgatory.
Im not hostile at all to the idea. I want this so much to be true. I just dont see how it can be defended biblically or patriotically. I really do pray that its true. It may be a foolish prayer but I cant help it.
For sure salvation is to realize one can do nothing to deserve anything. There is no reward behind it, other that that mentality IS what is required to really appreciate everything. To not realize this is to build ones own hell where ultimately one lives by the maxim of merit, rewards, and punishments, which we all do, because who really, really, really thinks he does not deserve anything? I believe the Word becomes what we are to us, so that it can invite us into something else. If we are literal-minded, reward/punishment minded, etc. the Word will become that to us, in order to crack the door open from that point of view into stepping outside it a little. Isn't it obvious this is what Jesus is doing? He speaks as a pharisee to the pharisees. He speaks as a loving father to those who despair. Some respond, some not. Whether somehow all will respond in the end is not really possible to know. But I think it is more important to get away from the hell being a punishment for breaking rules, and rather just as what one would experience if one takes the idea of justice being rewards and punishments to it's conclusion. I don't know if it is actually possible to do so, but I think that is what Jesus is getting at. He is inviting us into taking those ideas seriously, so that we can see how that cannot possibly be how reality exists.
People are just hostile because eternal torment is ingrained in the minds of many people. How many of them realize that the original Bible is in Greek? I am no language expert by any stretch of the imagination but the translation from Greek to Latin had errors in it. There are some vids on UA-cam where they explain these mistranslations. They tell you what the true meaning of the original Greek words are. BTW, if all you really know is English and similar languages that use the 26 letter alphabet you may find Greek and a lot of languages just about impossible to understand. There are plenty of languages I am unable to read because of that. I wonder if in those countries I would be considered dyslexic because of not being able to read any of their language.
Hell exists by necessity. The question: is Hell a prison, a guillotine or a hospital?
By necessity? A creator can't just forgive people and bring them back home? That's a thousand libraries of theology right there, but still it just seems like he could. The prodigal son acted very poorly but was welcomed home.
Honest question: if universalism is true, what is your interpretation of John 3:16? Do you not see a condition for eternal life-namely, to believe?
first of all, the word "eternal" in the Bible comes from the Greek word "aion", which should be translated as "age period".
But, the Bible is clear that there will come a day when EVERYONE believes in Him and accepts Jesus' sacrifice.
Philippians 2:10-11 'that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of those in heaven, and of those on earth, and of those under the earth, 11 and that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.'
"If you confess with your mouth that 'Jesus is Lord'......you will be saved".
So any person who confesses and accepts Jesus will be saved, and every person will eventually confess and accept Jesus, so the only conclusion is that everyone will one day be saved.
@@headlessguy98 I am aware of that scripture but how are you reading that that particular confession equates to justification?
@@awakeandfearless4143 Because the way you get saved is by confessing.
@@headlessguy98 what do you make of all the other scriptures that clearly teach otherwise? Namely, that those who do not believe end up in hell? Everyone will one day confess, but it will be too late for many
@@anahata3478 yeah but it will be too late at that point for many.
Honestly I don’t want one single person to go to hell, and it says in the Bible God wants everyone to be saved, here are a couple of verses that may back this up. Let’s pray and discern love you guys, God is good and can do all things but it is His creation, His choice ♥️
1 Timothy 4:10
New International Version
That is why we labor and strive, because we have put our hope in the living God, who is the Savior of all people, and especially of those who believe.
1 John 2:2
NIV
He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world.
Love you! And God bless! Enjoy your Christmas :)
These are messages of hope and not for universalism.
The Father will pick from among us and give to the Son and others will perish.
@@koppite9600 check revelation 20:13
@@pdxtravis that is the resurrection of the body in the day of judgement..
I see nothing out of place
@@koppite9600 Genesis 12:3 --- All peoples on earth will be blessed through Abraham.
Genesis 22:18 --- All nations on earth will be blessed through Abraham’s offspring.
Numbers 27:16 --- Moses refers to the “source of the breath of all flesh”.
Psalms 22:27 --- All the ends of the earth and all the families of the nations will acknowledge God.
Psalms 65:2 --- All men will come to God.
Psalms 86:9 --- All nations will worship and glorify God.
Psalms 103:8-9 --- God is compassionate, will not always accuse and will not be angry forever.
Psalm 136 --- God's love endures forever.
Psalms 145:9-10 --- The Lord has compassion on all His creation and all He has made will praise Him.
Psalms 145:13 --- The Lord loves all His creation.
Psalms 145:14 --- The Lord upholds all who fall.
1 Sam. 2:6: - “The Lord kills and makes alive; he brings down to the grave (Sheol--Hadees) and brings up."
Isaiah 25:6-8 --- God will prepare a feast for all people, He will destroy the shroud that enfolds all peoples, the sheet that covers up all nations. He will eliminate death, wipe away the tears from all faces and remove the disgrace of his people from all the earth.
Isaiah 45:22-23 --- God has sworn an oath that every knee will bow before Him and every tongue will swear by Him.
Isaiah 49:6 --- God’s salvation will be brought to the ends of the earth.
Isaiah 54:8 --- Although God will hide His face in a surge of anger, He will also have compassion with everlasting kindness.
Isaiah 57:16-18 --- God’s anger is not permanent. Although He punishes man, He will heal, guide and restore comfort to him.
Jeremiah 31:33-34 --- All men will know God, from the greatest to the least.
Lamentations 3:31-33 --- The Lord does not cast off forever. Although He brings grief, He will also be compassionate.
Ezekiel 18:21 --- God does not any pleasure in the death of the wicked. Rather, He is pleased when they repent.
Jonah 2:6 --- "Forever" is used in reference to a period of only three days.
Jonah 4:2 --- God graciously and compassionately relents from promised judgement.
Micah 7:18 --- God does not stay angry forever.
Matthew 18:13 --- Like the man who owes a hundred sheep and is not willing to lose even one, God is not willing that any one be lost.
Luke 2:10 --- The birth of Jesus is good news for all the people.
Luke 3: 5, 6 --- John the Baptist quotes Isaiah’s words that all mankind will see God’s salvation.
John 1:29 --- Jesus is the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world.
John 3:35 --- God sent Jesus to save the world.
John 4:42 --- God has committed all things to Christ.
John 5:25 --- Even the dead will hear the sound of Christ and all who hear will live.
John 6:37 --- Everything that God has given to Christ will come to him.
John 10:14-16 - “I am the good shepherd. I know My sheep and My sheep know Me, 15 just as the Father knows Me and I know the Father. And I lay down My life for the sheep. 16 I have other sheep that are not of this fold. I must bring them in as well, and they will listen to My voice. Then there will be one flock and one shepherd.”
John 12:32 --- When Jesus is lifted up from the earth, he will draw all men to himself.
John 12:47 --- Jesus came to save the world.
John 17:2 --- God granted Christ authority over all people so that Christ may give eternal life to all that God has given him.
Acts 3:20-21 --- Jesus must remain in heaven until the time comes for God to restore everything.
Acts 17:28 --- All human beings are children of God.
Romans 3:3-4 --- The unbelief of some will not nullify God’s faithfulness.
Romans 5:18 --- The act of obedience of one man (Jesus) will bring life for all men.
Romans 8:19-21 --- Creation itself will be liberated and brought into the glorious freedom of the children of God.
Romans 8:38-39 --- Nothing can separate us from the love of God that is in Christ.
Romans 11:32 --- God made all people imprisoned by disobedience so that he may have mercy on them all.
1 Corinthians 5:5 -- 5To deliver such a man to the Accuser for destruction of the flesh, so that the spirit might be saved on the day of the Lord.
1 Corinthians 15:22-28 --- All will be made alive in Christ, but each in his own turn and ultimately Christ will subdue all his enemies, eliminate death and God will be all in all.
2 Corinthians 5:15 --- Christ died for all.
2 Corinthians 5:19 --- Through Christ, God was reconciling the world to Himself.
Ephesians 1:11 --- God will bring all things under heaven and on earth under Christ.
Ephesians 4:6 - One Lord, one God, one Father of all.
Ephesians 4:10 --- Christ ascended higher then all the heavens to fill the whole universe.
Philippians. 2:9-11 --- Every tongue will confess that Jesus is Lord (In 1 Corinthians 12:3, Paul writes that no one can say “Jesus is Lord” except by the Holy Spirit)
Colossians 1: 19-20 --- God was pleased to reconcile to Himself, all things on earth and in heaven through the blood of Christ.
1 Timothy 2:4-6 --- God wants all men to be saved and to know the truth. Can God’s desire be thwarted?
1 Timothy 4:10 --- God is the Savior of all men, especially (not exclusively) those who believe.
Titus 2:11-12 --- God’s grace, which brings salvation has appeared to all men.
Hebrews 2:9 --- Jesus tasted death for everyone.
1 John 2:2 --- Christ is the atoning sacrifice of the sins of the whole world.
1 John 3:8 --- Christ appeared to destroy the devil’s works. (The doctrine of eternal damnation denies the victory of Christ!)
1 John 4:8, 16 --- God is Love. (not loving towards some, but not others, Love is the very essence of Who He is.)
1 John 4:14 --- Christ is the Savior of the World.
Revelations 5:13 --- Every creature in heaven, on earth, under the earth, and on the sea will sing praises to him who sits on the throne and to the Lamb (Christ).
Revelations 21:4-5 --- God will dwell with men and he will wipe every tear from their eyes, death, mourning, crying, pain and the old order of things will pass and everything will be made new.
@@markdaniels1730 Excellent, profound, and well-researched comment! :)
I disagree with David B Hart about this. There will of course be some people who want there to be a Hell so that they can be "winners in the game of life" but I suspect that those people are few and far between. When I believed in Hell I did so reluctantly and with no small degree of discomfort. I thought then that it was the clear and unequivocal teaching of Christ, so who was I to disagree? Now I realise that Christ did not teach "Hell" at all and that the word "aionios", which we usually translate as "eternal", means "for an indeterminate length of time".
I believe there are more hopeless or hope-seeking people within circles of christendom, than there are pious and spiteful attitudes. If Hart is criticizing strictly the traditions of denominations rooted in hellfire doctrine, then I don’t see him being incorrect or wrong about his impassioned response. But I do believe it’s wrong to target most of common people in that way. Christ Jesus rebuked the Pharisees harshly and cast out the money lenders in the temple with similar disdain towards their attitude, but he was in the company of believers and nonbelievers who (like many Christians or Christian raised people today) have a lacking grasp due to only knowing theology that’s based upon traditions of men.
David Bentley Hart -- the philosopher who looks like Orson Welles and talks like Jim Morrison.
@Life Is Finite--Death Is Inevitable But you do. ;)
Hart have you considered the possibility that peope are so against universalism because it directly contradicts the words of Christ, our Saints, our Councils and all of Orthodoxy Christianity?
Simply put G-d will do the right and best thing for every soul.
you know who else was 'hostile' to universalism? The 5th ecumencial council. Despite what univeralists might say, it WAS condemned
Does this teaching mean that Christians should accept gay marriage as ok with God since he loves everyone the same? Or does it means that as God’s image bearers we still need the framework of male and female roles to guide us through this maze while God is freeing us from the effects of sin and death? I am asking because the church I attend never addresses what followers of Christ can do to live and serve people who are struggling with their identities.
Much of dysphoria expressed through tendencies of lack of self-control I would believe is rooted in the old life of human nature in Adam.
Put into more modern terms, an ego that forms in a person to cope with past or unaddressed trauma can cause that person to be at war with their mind, and their body. Depending on the severity of the dysphoria, some people really can struggle with different types of personality disorders. For others their emphasis of identity is just living through their own physical body, disassociating and ignoring the health of their mind from their body to a degree of lesser severity.
Some are more socially functional than others. But chasing after broken relationships is not an uncommon occurrence nowadays for many people; homosexual relationships don’t find their odds better relative to heterosexual ones. If chasing after relationships that do not last doesn’t afford a person peace despite their working and effort in being invested in something temporary, that just points to their need for Christ’s Spirit to mend their spirit.
No. Sin has consequences that we all face and Christian Universalism does not dismiss this fact.
Has everything you do or have done been ok with God?
Primal desire of winners vs losers? How would he know that? Has he personally interviewed all these people? His claim is the psychogenetic fallacy and appeal to motive fallacy.
It's a lovely thought that everyone goes to heaven but it's problematic bc then everyone would just do whatever they want. ..
That is so simplistic and also happens to be false. Is that what it would do for you?
Does one try to live in such a way that pleases God out of fear of going to "hell"? I say one is inspired to live in such a way that glorifies God out of a gratefulness and love toward Him that makes one want to honor what Be did for us all.
Paul believed that everyone goes to heaven , did he teach 'everyone do what you want?
DBH is smarter than I am...to a great degree. But his supreme intelligence does not thereby render to him any authority whatsoever, in the same way Luther's genius and Calvin's genius did not thereby render authority to them, as convincing as they were to so many. If we are misled by modern English translations, those of us who cannot go back to read the original Greek cannot be culpable for our misunderstandings. Personally, my only desire is to believe what the Church teaches. She has authority to bind my conscience, rightly formed. I don't have authority to bind myself, nor does DBH have authority to bind me based on his own condescending sense of what justice is. While I constantly search out the whys and wherefores, I have no skin in the game apart from my loyalty to the Catholic Church, because she was established by Jesus Christ.
I am a Christian. I believe that hell is real. Now I'm not entirely sure if it's eternal or not but one thing I know for sure is that I don't want anybody to end up in it. I don't want people to be apart from the Father. I don't need to be a winner with billions of losers outside the gates. This video is incredibly insulting to all the Christians who simply believe that the blood of Christ saves if only you believe.
I don't think he is focusing on people like you, in fact he specifically says that most people really don't believe. You do but are unsure of how it functions. I think he meant the people who enthusiastically say they "know" etc., and think it's a great thing.
It seems natural to have some cognitive dissonance, some struggle with this concept. But some people flat out seem to be think it's fine. Would those same people want serial killers eaten alive by rats? Would they want people they don't like tortured?
You say you don't know if it's eternal or not, but wouldn't that make a big difference to God's character? If God had mercy and did eventually save everyone, it would seem like slander to say he didn't, no? In other words, a Universalist can say "you are slandering my God" by saying he has no mercy. And the other side can say, "are you saying my God is just just?".
Not trying to upset anyone, just curious. I wish there was a more clear answer. So much evidence to support different views. The Bible is not supposed to be confusing but there is confusion, is there not?
@@joecheffo5942 The one big thing I don't understand in the Bible is hell. There are other things like individual words that weren't translated well but you can easily figure that stuff out with videos. The doctrine of hell is tough.
@@avivastudios2311 Hell I understand was translated in KJV from three Hebrew words, gehenna, sheol, and another one, and also Hades from Greek religion/myth.
They all have different meanings but were all translated Hell. That seems a bit sketchy. Thats the Protestant Bible. I guess Catholics did the same thing? Took Hades from Greeks? I think as the bible got spread to Greek speaking gentiles, the concept of hell got stronger. I think its more in John than earlier gospels.
Its kind of unfair for churches and pastors not to be up front about all this.
@@joecheffo5942 Didn't Jesus say "I hold the keys to death and Hades"? The word Hades was not always translated to hell in that case.
@@avivastudios2311 Some translations do it better, whether they have more integrity or less bias, I don't know. But Hell appears 61 time in KJV anbout half that in a nothing trasvlation, and onl a few times in some others. More modern translations seen to get it better, maybe ones with better philologists.
Peace.
No one believes in Hell. If Hell exists, no one cares, ESPECIALLY those who defend it. Hell for them is for Others.
Is grace cheapened when we turn the universal atonement and invitation to all people into a final act? I do not disagee with DBH but with the mis appropriation of the invitation to the eschatological banquet where all nations are invited to the mountain of God, into something else. This man is very erudite but isnt he a bit lazy in his hopscotch A = Z? I would love to think we all will be saved, and I do not love Augustine anymore than he does, but wishful thinking is not part of my training.
God's bigger than our conceptions of him. I'm sure that he'll surprise all of us, in the end 😉
The day the word Hell was put into the Bible, and the geographic actual place in Jerusalem called GEHENNA. Was a utterly day of horror not from God, but a perverted doctrine, intensional or not.
John 3 16 and Jesus speaks of punishment for the one who stashed his talents instead of multiplying them.
@@koppite9600 we believe in punishment too just not a permanent spot in eternal fire we believe in a just punishment according to the persons works
Unintentional है!! But many people don't know the origin of the word Sheol, Hades, and Gehenna.
I know
How can anyone be a universalist when Scripture and the church clearly teach that the torments of hell are eternal?
Genesis 12:3 --- All peoples on earth will be blessed through Abraham.
Genesis 22:18 --- All nations on earth will be blessed through Abraham’s offspring.
Numbers 27:16 --- Moses refers to the “source of the breath of all flesh”.
Psalms 22:27 --- All the ends of the earth and all the families of the nations will acknowledge God.
Psalms 65:2 --- All men will come to God.
Psalms 86:9 --- All nations will worship and glorify God.
Psalms 103:8-9 --- God is compassionate, will not always accuse and will not be angry forever.
Psalm 136 --- God's love endures forever.
Psalms 145:9-10 --- The Lord has compassion on all His creation and all He has made will praise Him.
Psalms 145:13 --- The Lord loves all His creation.
Psalms 145:14 --- The Lord upholds all who fall.
1 Sam. 2:6: - “The Lord kills and makes alive; he brings down to the grave (Sheol--Hadees) and brings up."
Isaiah 25:6-8 --- God will prepare a feast for all people, He will destroy the shroud that enfolds all peoples, the sheet that covers up all nations. He will eliminate death, wipe away the tears from all faces and remove the disgrace of his people from all the earth.
Isaiah 45:22-23 --- God has sworn an oath that every knee will bow before Him and every tongue will swear by Him.
Isaiah 49:6 --- God’s salvation will be brought to the ends of the earth.
Isaiah 54:8 --- Although God will hide His face in a surge of anger, He will also have compassion with everlasting kindness.
Isaiah 57:16-18 --- God’s anger is not permanent. Although He punishes man, He will heal, guide and restore comfort to him.
Jeremiah 31:33-34 --- All men will know God, from the greatest to the least.
Lamentations 3:31-33 --- The Lord does not cast off forever. Although He brings grief, He will also be compassionate.
Ezekiel 18:21 --- God does not any pleasure in the death of the wicked. Rather, He is pleased when they repent.
Jonah 2:6 --- "Forever" is used in reference to a period of only three days.
Jonah 4:2 --- God graciously and compassionately relents from promised judgement.
Micah 7:18 --- God does not stay angry forever.
Matthew 18:13 --- Like the man who owes a hundred sheep and is not willing to lose even one, God is not willing that any one be lost.
Luke 2:10 --- The birth of Jesus is good news for all the people.
Luke 3: 5, 6 --- John the Baptist quotes Isaiah’s words that all mankind will see God’s salvation.
John 1:29 --- Jesus is the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world.
John 3:35 --- God sent Jesus to save the world.
John 4:42 --- God has committed all things to Christ.
John 5:25 --- Even the dead will hear the sound of Christ and all who hear will live.
John 6:37 --- Everything that God has given to Christ will come to him.
John 10:14-16 - “I am the good shepherd. I know My sheep and My sheep know Me, 15 just as the Father knows Me and I know the Father. And I lay down My life for the sheep. 16 I have other sheep that are not of this fold. I must bring them in as well, and they will listen to My voice. Then there will be one flock and one shepherd.”
John 12:32 --- When Jesus is lifted up from the earth, he will draw all men to himself.
John 12:47 --- Jesus came to save the world.
John 17:2 --- God granted Christ authority over all people so that Christ may give eternal life to all that God has given him.
Acts 3:20-21 --- Jesus must remain in heaven until the time comes for God to restore everything.
Acts 17:28 --- All human beings are children of God.
Romans 3:3-4 --- The unbelief of some will not nullify God’s faithfulness.
Romans 5:18 --- The act of obedience of one man (Jesus) will bring life for all men.
Romans 8:19-21 --- Creation itself will be liberated and brought into the glorious freedom of the children of God.
Romans 8:38-39 --- Nothing can separate us from the love of God that is in Christ.
Romans 11:32 --- God made all people imprisoned by disobedience so that he may have mercy on them all.
1 Corinthians 5:5 -- 5To deliver such a man to the Accuser for destruction of the flesh, so that the spirit might be saved on the day of the Lord.
1 Corinthians 15:22-28 --- All will be made alive in Christ, but each in his own turn and ultimately Christ will subdue all his enemies, eliminate death and God will be all in all.
2 Corinthians 5:15 --- Christ died for all.
2 Corinthians 5:19 --- Through Christ, God was reconciling the world to Himself.
Ephesians 1:11 --- God will bring all things under heaven and on earth under Christ.
Ephesians 4:6 - One Lord, one God, one Father of all.
Ephesians 4:10 --- Christ ascended higher then all the heavens to fill the whole universe.
Philippians. 2:9-11 --- Every tongue will confess that Jesus is Lord (In 1 Corinthians 12:3, Paul writes that no one can say “Jesus is Lord” except by the Holy Spirit)
Colossians 1: 19-20 --- God was pleased to reconcile to Himself, all things on earth and in heaven through the blood of Christ.
1 Timothy 2:4-6 --- God wants all men to be saved and to know the truth. Can God’s desire be thwarted?
1 Timothy 4:10 --- God is the Savior of all men, especially (not exclusively) those who believe.
Titus 2:11-12 --- God’s grace, which brings salvation has appeared to all men.
Hebrews 2:9 --- Jesus tasted death for everyone.
1 John 2:2 --- Christ is the atoning sacrifice of the sins of the whole world.
1 John 3:8 --- Christ appeared to destroy the devil’s works. (The doctrine of eternal damnation denies the victory of Christ!)
1 John 4:8, 16 --- God is Love. (not loving towards some, but not others, Love is the very essence of Who He is.)
1 John 4:14 --- Christ is the Savior of the World.
Revelations 5:13 --- Every creature in heaven, on earth, under the earth, and on the sea will sing praises to him who sits on the throne and to the Lamb (Christ).
Revelations 21:4-5 --- God will dwell with men and he will wipe every tear from their eyes, death, mourning, crying, pain and the old order of things will pass and everything will be made new.
That's not necessarily a bad thing. What if those torments actually purify your spirit?
You're jesting right?
I think Jesus roots damnationist hypocrisy in this kind of churlish pride as well. Suffering is the divine remedy for the rich man. Lord have mercy.
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@@MegaNetty1 Hi Jeannette thanks for the link. While Mr Wiese has a clear and concise approach, unfortunately he falls into an all-too-common misunderstanding of universal restoration, claiming that we say all ppl go to heaven no matter what they believe. UR embraces that the son is the only way to the Father. We simply say that ALL will come to believe, whether in this life or in the next, when Jesus lets the souls out of death and hell. The destruction of the old sinful man, the purging of the dross, needs to occur in the firey lake of God's pure love so that the new man in Christ, the overcomer, can enter heaven through the ever-open pearly gates, bringing all the glory of the nations and the kings of the earth to the throne. When God's righteous acts are revealed and the enemies of sin, death, Babylon and the false trinity are cast down, all mankind will be in awe.
You know, God swore an oath by Himself before Cyrus that every knee would bow and every tongue confess. (Isa 45:23, Rom 14:11, Phil 2:10). Why do ppl want to short-change the Koreshic Oath, this divine covenant promise?
Salvation is a gift of God, the most worthy are the least deserving. If God can save the likes of Mr Wiese, you and me, then He can surely save anyone. And He will be all in all.
Speculation.
If someone has a curable disease and they resist the cure, they have a problem with both the cure and the disease. To accept the cure means there will not be a problem with the disease.
The unbeliever still has a problem with sin that can only be cured through Christ. Just because the cure exists and is available does not mean the disease is gone. They must receive the cure to remove the sin.
In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:” - Colossians 1:14
The forgiveness of sins is made possible by the blood of the Lord Jesus Christ. By his grace God offers forgiveness of all sins to any man in Christ.
This does not mean everyone is already forgiven, for not all men are in Christ. Not all men have faith.
The benefits of the gospel of Christ, including benefits of the blood, are only given to those that first trust the gospel (Eph 1:13).
Everyone in Christ will be judged according to Christ’s work on their behalf. Everyone in hell will be judged according to their works.
People are in hell because of their sins. There is forgiveness of sins offered through faith in the blood of Christ, but they rejected that and are left to deal with the consequences.
Salvation has been secured and assured for those that believe, but without faith it is impossible to please him (Heb 11:6).
Unbelievers need forgiveness before they die. Forgiveness is only found in Christ. Any man can be in Christ by faith in the gospel.
If someone is without faith and outside of Christ, there is no forgiveness.
God has done everything necessary for souls to be saved including providing the means for forgiveness. This gospel of grace (God’s riches at Christ’s expense) is preached unto all nations for the obedience of faith (Rom 1:5).
It is there. It is offered to you freely, but you must believe it to receive it!
Bottom line. Unbelievers hate the truth. You can see the hate you can see the real unbelievers
Are you suggesting Christian Universalists are unbelievers?
if he believes in universalism, fine, but give biblical verses to justify it.
He does all along the way!
Do you need paper & ink to tell you that God is Love?
I got videos that justify it
Get up off your butt, and go get it yourself.
Sean, go read his book dude.
I don't see universalism compatible with the concept of free will and genuine love of the Father, if eventually God will redeem us even if we reject him all the way to our graves. I see universalism as just another longing for the eternal, the complete, the good, the beautiful, and transcendent things that cannot be attained in this world. It's a form of idealism wishing to usher a beautiful ending in an otherwise serious reality that exists because it's the only way true love and the essence of God can exist in this universe. (Through Jesus Christ's life & sacrifice).
It's natural to be inclined to be attracted toward these ideas, because our soul longs to be satisfied with the ideal, the great ideal, the God-man Christ himself, through which in his words says "Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. 14 But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it. Matthew 7:13-14" Remember, goodness always comes after truth, I say seek the truth, and let God sort things out afterwards.
Me neither. I don’t believe in free will. Jesus draws (literally drags) all men to himself. He is the savior of all, especially those who believe ! Those are Bible verses.
Narrow is the way into the Kingdom, because not many people in this life will realize who Christ is, or they will not live Him out, or not many will live lives meaningfully with a purpose to serve and encourage others who are broken in spirit. Many people live self-destructive lives, or purposeless lives to no avail which lead only to torment. Christ centered universalism *is* the eternal message of the Gospel, because hell rather than being forever becomes a place of burning to rebuke the unrepentant in spirit who eventually will see Christ as infinitely loving. The Bridal Church to that end is to have the testimony to convince the lost man to enter into the Kingdom of God.
What happened in the parable of the prodigal son? He returned to his Father after his appetite changed, because his hunger to be accepted back into his Father’s presence came to him after he was entirely exhausted, and after he had lived out all other experiences in his life which were profitless. And, for a time, he also endured the consequences of his own actions. His staving off feeling famished, as much as the inheritance he received and squandered, were both finite. Upon his return and upcoming celebration, the Father corrected the older son who had worked his days in the fields. The older son toiled the fields in hopes to please the Father who had a broken heart. In truth, the Father loved both his sons in the same nature. The older son was in error to believe that his toiling to love his Father to compensate for what his younger brother wasted, and to make up for what the Father lost in a son, was what he ought to do. He saw his younger brother as a hopeless cause. The Father said no. I love him, as I love you.
By modern Christian standards, how can degenerate and sinful man make himself right with God? He can't; he needs the Holy Spirit's intercession.
This in itself is already a violation of man's free will. Because left to his own devices? Man would choose the worst of all possible outcomes.
Capitalism penchant to make money the ultimate goal,spawns the need to be envied .
Here's my view. There is no hell on earth like the hell a mother goes through if and when one of her children goes through hell! When God's only son suffered on the cross He went to heaven forever. When a billion human sons (and daughters) have died they webt to hell forever. Why? Because they disappointed God. God's way of planning stuff sucks big time if you ask me. But Im going to hell forever just for saying the plan sucks.
First we are given a deep hunger for love and attention. Then we're given strong hormones and the urge to merge. Then it leads to pregnancy. Great! Now as God's plan goes we get to raise a child that's going to worry about going to hell forever.
Thy will be done? Sad, sad, sicko plan!
Yes Bible believing Christian’s are hostile to heresy. 🤷♂️🤷♂️🤷♂️🤷♂️
When a satan can convince people there is no hell against the clear teaching of scripture, he ensures that persons eternal existence there
To say there is no eternal hell is to say that the martyrs died in vain, that our faith is in vain. Disgusting.
Not even close
Not true
Brimstone is used to refine materials through intense heat. Even hellfire apologists can’t escape terms laid out within scripture.
The martyrs reward is not dependent on the suffering of others. You can misunderstand and turn away from Christ who ought to be the first love of the believer. If your expectation is to see another man judged, then how does that fit the story of the prodigal son? What about the parables of the religious who act in God’s name yet are rebuked by God? In the end God does not abandon them. He corrects them, for a time.
In vain how? Aren't they in Heaven now? Possible the best way to die. Suffer a painful death and be happy forever after that.
Those martyrs were sinful and fallen human beings - no better than you or me. They didn't get saved because they died for their faith.
Either salvation comes entirely from God, OR you can earn your salvation by living or dying a certain way. Take your pick.
The sin argument is an interesting one.
Christian apologists claim that Adam and Eve were created perfect but they had freewill - hence why they sinned.
The problem with this claim is that if they were created perfect then they should have always made perfect decisions.
Imperfection does not give birth to perfection.
That goes against the rules of logic.
PERFECTION BEGATS PERFECTION.
IMPERFECTION BEGATS IMPERFECTION.
Logic always wins.
Therefore, the Christian apologists claim is completely wrong from a logical standpoint - of course, that is if we are using the same logical parameters to assess this topic in the same way we would assess everything else in life.
Of course, the Eden story is entirely mythological - but Christian apologists interpret the story literally - thats the problem.
You see foks,
All the geographical locations in the bible are actually real - so are the various people groups mentioned in the bible.
But all the stories are entire mythological and consist of allegory and metaphor.
In fact, all the worlds organised religions are actually the same in this manner.
Ancient Humans were simply trying to understand the world around them and their greater purpose - so they wrote what they SURMISED was Gods nature and mixed in their own folklore tales with it.
They then put these ALLEGORICAL hybrid tales into books and the resulting end products are what you would call the so called "holy books" from the various people groups around the world.
There is nothing surprising about this.
Thats just human beings behaving like human beings.
Throughout the thousands of years people groups from around the world have done this.
The trick is to make the various resulting religions work for YOU.
Rather than YOU working for these religions.
Hell was not taught as a lake of fire in the Old Testament.
The greek idea of hell in the New Testament is very easy to explain.
Let us first examine the Jews.
The orthodox Jews claim that both Christianity and Islam are actually BASTARDISATIONS of orthodox Judaism.
The orthodox Jews do not believe in hell as a place of eternal torture by fire.
That would explain why greek ideas of hell have been put in Jesus's mouth by the greek writers of the New Testament.
Especially, considering that in order for any person to learn greek 2000 years ago the only greek writings actually available to actually PRACTICE learning the greek language were greek mythological epics which documented precisely greek ideas of hell.
For example, Hades and Tartarus are terms for hell copied straight from the greek mythological epics which contained these concepts and ideas.
People simply learnt these Greek epics as a way of practicing reading and writing greek as the main greek writings were all mythological works.
The New Testament writers then copied these greek ideas of hell into the greek
New Testament they were writing.
The New Testament is a fusion of Judaism and Greek mythology.
Hellinistic Judaism is well documented by Orthodox Jews themselves.
It was eventually suppressed -
but It re-emerged as New Testament Christianity in 325ad.
The difference is that this time it was backed by the state of Rome in what became known as Roman Catholicism.
ALL, the various protestant denominations copied these doctrines as they branched off from Roman Catholicism.
They left out other doctrines and took the main doctrines into their new Protestant version of Christianity.
ok cool I will be hostile back lmao
Jesus teachings overrides everything in scripture, and evey book written by mankind. Jesus is God! 1Ti 3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.
Jesus teachings is all about some people being saved, and about some people being lost. Some people will refuse to take the offer of salvation. When Jesus speaks please believe him! Rev 3:19 As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.
Rev 3:20 Behold, I stand at the door, and knock: if any man hear my voice, and open the door, I will come in to him, and will sup with him, and he with me.
Rev 3:21 To him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.
Mat 10:32 Whosoever therefore shall confess me before men, him will I confess also before my Father which is in heaven.
Mat 10:33 But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven.
Mat 7:13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:Mat 7:14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.
Mat 7:15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.
Mat 7:16 Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?
Mat 7:17 Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.
Mat 7:18 A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.
Mat 7:19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.
Mat 7:20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.
Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Mat 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
Mat 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
Mat 7:24 Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:Mat 7:25 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock.
Mat 7:26 And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand:Mat 7:27 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it.
Mat 13:36 Then Jesus sent the multitude away, and went into the house: and his disciples came unto him, saying, DECLARE UNTO US THE PARABLE OF THE TARES OF THE FIELD.
Mat 13:37 He answered and said unto them, He that soweth the good seed is the Son of man;Mat 13:38 The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one; Mat 13:39 The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels.
Mat 13:40 As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world.
Mat 13:41 The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity; Mat 13:42 And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.
Mat 13:43 Then shall the righteous shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Who hath ears to hear, let him hear.
Mat 13:47 Again, the kingdom of heaven is like unto a net, that was cast into the sea, and gathered of every kind: Mat 13:48 Which, when it was full, they drew to shore, and sat down, and gathered the good into vessels, but cast the bad away. Mat 13:49 So shall it be at the end of the world: the angels shall come forth, and sever the wicked from among the just, Mat 13:50 And shall cast them into the furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.
Jhn 4:23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.
Jhn 4:24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.
2Co 4:3 But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost: 2Co 4:4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.
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@Scott Klaudt The fire sent by God will be so real! Sinners must take HEED please! The great battle of ARMAGEDDON!
Joe 2:10 The earth shall quake before them; the heavens shall tremble: the sun and the moon shall be dark, and the stars shall withdraw their shining:Joe 2:11 And the LORD shall utter his voice before his army: for his camp is very great: for he is strong that executeth his word: for the day of the LORD is great and very terrible; and who can abide it?
Joe 2:12 Therefore also now, saith the LORD, turn ye even to me with all your heart, and with fasting, and with weeping, and with mourning:Joe 2:13 And rend your heart, and not your garments, and turn unto the LORD your God: for he is gracious and merciful, slow to anger, and of great kindness, and repenteth him of the evil.
2Pe 3:10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
2Pe 3:11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,2Pe 3:12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
2Pe 3:13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.2Pe 3:14 Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in peace, without spot, and blameless.
Rev 16:1 And I heard a great voice out of the temple saying to the seven angels, Go your ways, and pour out the vials of the wrath of God upon the earth.
Rev 16:2 And the first went, and poured out his vial upon the earth; and there fell a noisome and grievous sore upon the men which had the mark of the beast, and upon them which worshipped his image.
Rev 16:3 And the second angel poured out his vial upon the sea; and it became as the blood of a dead man: and every living soul died in the sea.
Rev 16:4 And the third angel poured out his vial upon the rivers and fountains of waters; and they became blood.
Rev 16:5 And I heard the angel of the waters say, Thou art righteous, O Lord, which art, and wast, and shalt be, because thou hast judged thus.
Rev 16:6 For they have shed the blood of saints and prophets, and thou hast given them blood to drink; for they are worthy.
Rev 16:7 And I heard another out of the altar say, Even so, Lord God Almighty, true and righteous are thy judgments.
Rev 16:8 And the fourth angel poured out his vial upon the sun; and power was given unto him to scorch men with fire.
Rev 16:9 And men were scorched with great heat, and blasphemed the name of God, which hath power over these plagues: and they repented not to give him glory.
Rev 16:10 And the fifth angel poured out his vial upon the seat of the beast; and his kingdom was full of darkness; and they gnawed their tongues for pain,Rev 16:11 And blasphemed the God of heaven because of their pains and their sores, and repented not of their deeds.
Rev 16:12 And the sixth angel poured out his vial upon the great river Euphrates; and the water thereof was dried up, that the way of the kings of the east might be prepared.
Rev 16:13 And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs come out of the mouth of the dragon, and out of the mouth of the beast, and out of the mouth of the false prophet.
Rev 16:14 For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty.
Rev 16:15 Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame.
Rev 16:16 And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue ARMAGEDDON.
Rev 16:17 And the seventh angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, It is done.
Rev 16:18 And there were voices, and thunders, and lightnings; and there was a great earthquake, such as was not since men were upon the earth, so mighty an earthquake, and so great.
Rev 16:19 And the great city was divided into three parts, and the cities of the nations fell: and great Babylon came in remembrance before God, to give unto her the cup of the wine of the fierceness of his wrath.
Rev 16:20 And every island fled away, and the mountains were not found.
Rev 16:21 And there fell upon men a great hail out of heaven, every stone about the weight of a talent: and men blasphemed God because of the plague of the hail; for the plague thereof was exceeding great.
Rev 19:11 And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.
Rev 19:12 His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself.
Rev 19:13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.
Rev 19:14 And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.
Rev 19:15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.
Rev 19:16 And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.
Rev 19:17 And I saw an angel standing in the sun; and he cried with a loud voice, saying to all the fowls that fly in the midst of heaven, Come and gather yourselves together unto the supper of the great God;Rev 19:18 That ye may eat the flesh of kings, and the flesh of captains, and the flesh of mighty men, and the flesh of horses, and of them that sit on them, and the flesh of all men, both free and bond, both small and great.
Rev 19:19 And I saw the beast, and the kings of the earth, and their armies, gathered together to make war against him that sat on the horse, and against his army.
Rev 19:20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.
Rev 19:21 And the remnant were slain with the sword of him that sat upon the horse, which sword proceeded out of his mouth: and all the fowls were filled with their flesh.
That's funny you decided to put this one in last:
2Co 4:3 But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost: 2Co 4:4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.
Whether you are aware of it or not, this passage is plainly telling us that God abounds in grace the most to those that sin (That's everyone!). That Jesus will go after and save all the lost sheep and will not return until he finds them. God wills the salvation of all mankind. He WILLS it!!! Do you think Jesus only came for some, a small handful of people?!! All knees will bow and all tongues will freely choose Jesus as Lord dude!!! Your passages are figurative in nature. They are hyperboles, expressions of symbolism and the word fire especially. God is a refiner, a consuming and spiritual fire. The Greek for fire is PUR. Should I tell you what PUR translates to? I'll let you figure that out on your own!! God bless
@@je4754 1Co 1:18 For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.
2Co 4:3 But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost:2Co 4:4 In whom the god of this world ( SATAN )hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.
2Th 2:10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.
2Th 2:11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:2Th 2:12 That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
Tit 1:15 Unto the pure all things are pure: but unto them that are defiled and unbelieving is nothing pure; but even their mind and conscience is defiled.Tit 1:16 They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate.
1Pe 4:17 For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God?1Pe 4:18 And if the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear?1Pe 4:19 Wherefore let them that suffer according to the will of God commit the keeping of their souls to him in well doing, as unto a faithful Creator.
Act 3:19 Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord;Act 3:20 And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you:Act 3:21 Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began.
Act 3:22 For Moses truly said unto the fathers, A prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you of your brethren, like unto me; him shall ye hear in all things whatsoever he shall say unto you.
Act 3:23 And it shall come to pass, that every soul, which will not hear that prophet, shall be destroyed from among the people.
Act 3:24 Yea, and all the prophets from Samuel and those that follow after, as many as have spoken, have likewise foretold of these days.
Act 3:25 Ye are the children of the prophets, and of the covenant which God made with our fathers, saying unto Abraham, And in thy seed shall all the kindreds of the earth be blessed.
Act 3:26 Unto you first God, having raised up his Son Jesus, sent him to bless you, in turning away every one of you from his iniquities.
2Pe 3:3 Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,2Pe 3:4 And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.
2Pe 3:5 For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:2Pe 3:6 Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished:2Pe 3:7 But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.
2Pe 3:8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.
2Pe 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
2Pe 3:10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
2Pe 3:11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,2Pe 3:12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?2Pe 3:13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.2Pe 3:14.Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in peace, without spot, and blameless.
Genesis 12:3 --- All peoples on earth will be blessed through Abraham.
Genesis 22:18 --- All nations on earth will be blessed through Abraham’s offspring.
Numbers 27:16 --- Moses refers to the “source of the breath of all flesh”.
Psalms 22:27 --- All the ends of the earth and all the families of the nations will acknowledge God.
Psalms 65:2 --- All men will come to God.
Psalms 86:9 --- All nations will worship and glorify God.
Psalms 103:8-9 --- God is compassionate, will not always accuse and will not be angry forever.
Psalm 136 --- God's love endures forever.
Psalms 145:9-10 --- The Lord has compassion on all His creation and all He has made will praise Him.
Psalms 145:13 --- The Lord loves all His creation.
Psalms 145:14 --- The Lord upholds all who fall.
1 Sam. 2:6: - “The Lord kills and makes alive; he brings down to the grave (Sheol--Hadees) and brings up."
Isaiah 25:6-8 --- God will prepare a feast for all people, He will destroy the shroud that enfolds all peoples, the sheet that covers up all nations. He will eliminate death, wipe away the tears from all faces and remove the disgrace of his people from all the earth.
Isaiah 45:22-23 --- God has sworn an oath that every knee will bow before Him and every tongue will swear by Him.
Isaiah 49:6 --- God’s salvation will be brought to the ends of the earth.
Isaiah 54:8 --- Although God will hide His face in a surge of anger, He will also have compassion with everlasting kindness.
Isaiah 57:16-18 --- God’s anger is not permanent. Although He punishes man, He will heal, guide and restore comfort to him.
Jeremiah 31:33-34 --- All men will know God, from the greatest to the least.
Lamentations 3:31-33 --- The Lord does not cast off forever. Although He brings grief, He will also be compassionate.
Ezekiel 18:21 --- God does not any pleasure in the death of the wicked. Rather, He is pleased when they repent.
Jonah 2:6 --- "Forever" is used in reference to a period of only three days.
Jonah 4:2 --- God graciously and compassionately relents from promised judgement.
Micah 7:18 --- God does not stay angry forever.
Matthew 18:13 --- Like the man who owes a hundred sheep and is not willing to lose even one, God is not willing that any one be lost.
Luke 2:10 --- The birth of Jesus is good news for all the people.
Luke 3: 5, 6 --- John the Baptist quotes Isaiah’s words that all mankind will see God’s salvation.
John 1:29 --- Jesus is the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world.
John 3:35 --- God sent Jesus to save the world.
John 4:42 --- God has committed all things to Christ.
John 5:25 --- Even the dead will hear the sound of Christ and all who hear will live.
John 6:37 --- Everything that God has given to Christ will come to him.
John 10:14-16 - “I am the good shepherd. I know My sheep and My sheep know Me, 15 just as the Father knows Me and I know the Father. And I lay down My life for the sheep. 16 I have other sheep that are not of this fold. I must bring them in as well, and they will listen to My voice. Then there will be one flock and one shepherd.”
John 12:32 --- When Jesus is lifted up from the earth, he will draw all men to himself.
John 12:47 --- Jesus came to save the world.
John 17:2 --- God granted Christ authority over all people so that Christ may give eternal life to all that God has given him.
Acts 3:20-21 --- Jesus must remain in heaven until the time comes for God to restore everything.
Acts 17:28 --- All human beings are children of God.
Romans 3:3-4 --- The unbelief of some will not nullify God’s faithfulness.
Romans 5:18 --- The act of obedience of one man (Jesus) will bring life for all men.
Romans 8:19-21 --- Creation itself will be liberated and brought into the glorious freedom of the children of God.
Romans 8:38-39 --- Nothing can separate us from the love of God that is in Christ.
Romans 11:32 --- God made all people imprisoned by disobedience so that he may have mercy on them all.
1 Corinthians 5:5 -- 5To deliver such a man to the Accuser for destruction of the flesh, so that the spirit might be saved on the day of the Lord.
1 Corinthians 15:22-28 --- All will be made alive in Christ, but each in his own turn and ultimately Christ will subdue all his enemies, eliminate death and God will be all in all.
2 Corinthians 5:15 --- Christ died for all.
2 Corinthians 5:19 --- Through Christ, God was reconciling the world to Himself.
Ephesians 1:11 --- God will bring all things under heaven and on earth under Christ.
Ephesians 4:6 - One Lord, one God, one Father of all.
Ephesians 4:10 --- Christ ascended higher then all the heavens to fill the whole universe.
Philippians. 2:9-11 --- Every tongue will confess that Jesus is Lord (In 1 Corinthians 12:3, Paul writes that no one can say “Jesus is Lord” except by the Holy Spirit)
Colossians 1: 19-20 --- God was pleased to reconcile to Himself, all things on earth and in heaven through the blood of Christ.
1 Timothy 2:4-6 --- God wants all men to be saved and to know the truth. Can God’s desire be thwarted?
1 Timothy 4:10 --- God is the Savior of all men, especially (not exclusively) those who believe.
Titus 2:11-12 --- God’s grace, which brings salvation has appeared to all men.
Hebrews 2:9 --- Jesus tasted death for everyone.
1 John 2:2 --- Christ is the atoning sacrifice of the sins of the whole world.
1 John 3:8 --- Christ appeared to destroy the devil’s works. (The doctrine of eternal damnation denies the victory of Christ!)
1 John 4:8, 16 --- God is Love. (not loving towards some, but not others, Love is the very essence of Who He is.)
1 John 4:14 --- Christ is the Savior of the World.
Revelations 5:13 --- Every creature in heaven, on earth, under the earth, and on the sea will sing praises to him who sits on the throne and to the Lamb (Christ).
Revelations 21:4-5 --- God will dwell with men and he will wipe every tear from their eyes, death, mourning, crying, pain and the old order of things will pass and everything will be made new.
This is kind of gross. He relays the polarization in a magnified way as if to relish in it himself by so coloring his opponents... it's merely a temporal tribalism, with eternal implications if he's ascendant, yet wrong.
He's not wholly wrong. But, again, I see the same emotional NEED for it to be true that they all have this NEED. Just listen to his tone of voice when he says it.
He is so pretentious.......
I’m NOT hostile to UV…you’re just lost blind naked…I once was lost and now I’m found..and my heart goes out to my brothers still in the dark
Now UV…your religious nuttiness…like mormons or catholics or evolutionists..is an odd creation of man with Satans HELP.
Praying for you…NO follower of Christ takes pleasure in ANYONE going to hell. Here’s what God said…not that you care…”As surely as I Live declares the Sovereign Lord…I Take NO pleasure in the death of the wicked but RATHER they turn from their wicked ways and LIVE”
It’s a shame you’re not a better student…you might have come across this in your own study…praying for you
A heretic is a heretic no matter how many big words he uses.
Heresy means choice. The literal meaning of that Greek word. Human organizations don’t get to choose for you, you have your own mind.
The idea of a hell that lasts forever is a pagan belief, and a Roman belief. Roman principality and rule entered into Christian tradition upon the Roman State’s inclusion of Christianity into its system. From which point, rather than preaching an eternal gospel, many were declared heretics-some for the very reason of holding to a belief in ultimate restoration through Christ-even at the point of the sword. Christ’s simple message became warped due to political interests.
Why would Christ need the principality of a fallen kingdom of this age to defend his namesake, or to testify in His place? Late ancient Rome as well as the Roman Catholic political system following it was and is quick to declare heresy, and the former was quick to kill rather than to merely cast out. The spirit of that tradition lives on in many denominations that take after the spirit of ancient Roman Catholicism, like children from their mother.
Bentley and those who follow his heresy are false teachers damned to eternal hell unless they repent of their unbiblical teaching.