In our scrambles, cheating was a huge problem. We usually play two 4 person teams per hole. It is required now that your scorecard is to be filled out by the opposing team and returned to you after the round. It isn't foolproof but it pretty much got rid of some of the 50's scores that people were turning in. The last tournament we played, our team was paired with the defending champions of flight 1. When we asked for their card on the first hole they refused. We called the golf course manager over and it nearly came to a fight. After a while they relented, and we exchanged scorecards. Long story short, the previous year they won with a score of - 57 - with us keeping score - 71 - Good Times. Their is no way in hell they can, did or could shoot a 57.
We had four man scrambles in the Air Force. On our team, we had Jeff Couch, the Armed Services Champion (scratch), Dick Albrecht, a three, my best friend Dave Becker a seven, and me, the worst on the team with a ten handicap. We were four of the top six golfers on the Air Force Base. We ROUTINELY posted 57, and the next best was 70.
Golf is one sport that exposes the true character of the individual. No matter how small the prize, a large portion of the contestants just can’t help themselves.
I learned golf while living in the Philippines. An American expat living there gave lessons at a local country club in Mindanao. He told me that it was the only place he’d ever been where millionaires would cheat to win an electric fan.
This is the only philosophy to have of these. Every scramble I have been a part of if your group pars just one hole you are done. Way too much pressure and stress for me to worry about winning. So I just go to enjoy nice weather with friends and be happy our money is going to somewhere nice.
A friend of mine and I played in a charity event and were paired with one of the courses teaching pros and his friend. They were blatantly cheating (usually on where to play from when the friend hit one out of bounds or in a penalty area). Unbelievable.
I stopped playing scrambles 20 years ago because of the cheating. I was arguing with the people in “my foursome “ not to cheat. The only time I played in a scramble without cheating is when they paired 2 foursomes together and made them play as an eightSome. That way groups could watch each other. The winning score was a reasonable -14 with all scratch and single hcp golfers.
@@frankthetank1256 8 people in a scramble is not that slow.... your only using the best shot . Of course you could have both groups in on it particularly if money is involved
I played in a scramble once where a club member accompanied each 4 some and kept score. They also acted as officials for long drive, closest to the pin etc..
I played a scramble years ago where our team shot a 57 …no cheating. One older guy in our group was so enamored with that, he asked to see the scorecard. I told him sure, just don’t forget to turn it in. When they were announcing the winners later in the clubhouse, a 58 was first place. I was puzzled by that, and I asked a guy in our group where the old guy with the card was. “I think he went home”, was the answer. He just wanted the card for a souvenir. I thought that was funny. There really wasn’t much of a prize anyway.
good idea but how much time for all of this? The scramble itself lasts too long .... Hard to combine just a fun time fund raiser....verse a competition. Speed hole, pay it forward.... have a good time and put best prizes in a drawing.
@@elliott3991 it won't take as long as you think and whats a little more added time to an already long event? guarantee you the top two groups have at least a few competitive minded people playing and would want to see who is the real deal and who isn't.
I have played in probably 100 scrambles, and I think it's cute you think the second-place team did not cheat and the first place one did. What only the winners cheated?
The only part of this conversation to be completely honest was at the end where you stated that you hoped folks would come back with some integrity Golf to me is and always will be something I have where I control "MY" game. Who am I playing against? ME always me. There is no room for cheaters in my game. I understand your point and appreciate the tone and messages being delivered. It is a crying shame others do not play to that same value..
At our club one team always seems to win. They never turn in their scorecard until all the other teams have. They’ve been called out dozens of times. I only play in these scrambles to hang out with my friends, drink a little beer, laugh and have a fun time.
There are 3 ways to play scrambles and have a complete blast. One - Play the weekly scramble at your club and have the pro set the teams with A-B-C-D players. Use the "regular" scramble rules of a club length and in the leather. Those are tons of fun and will help your game if you are a C or D because you playing with better players that you normally wouldn't have a daily game with and it isn't real pressure. Two - Play for a charity and a couple of guys set their own teams and bet each other and ignore the scramble. This is also really fun but you have to know each other and trust each other and negotiate pops per side if one team is clearly better. You might not even turn in your card to the tourney because you were just donating and the real game was the side bet. Third - Play for charity that plays at a course that you otherwise wouldn't normally get a chance to play at and simply enjoy the course without the pressure of slow play because you don't know the course and if you miss, you just pick it up. The regulars at that course are likely going to win anyway because they know the greens. If y'all are wanting a fair scramble you have to play on a team with people you don't know set by the course or director based on HCs. The problem is guys building teams with 4 A players. You need to have to have a combined HC of 36 or something like that if you want it fair. You need a rule where you have to use at least one putt and use one drive from the D player and maybe 2 from the C player. I know a 40 just a stupid score, and 47 or even 48 is stupid too when the guys are weekend hacks without a GHIN handicap, but with 4 studs and knowledge of the course, add in a buy a drive to 140 and a perfect lie on the par5s and a couple of mulligans each, those scores aren't that unreasonable. Pay a couple of NCAA players to be on your team to blast the ball off the Tee and it will be a different game for your team by making the approaches a lot closer. Scrambles usually have easy pin placements. Going low becomes reasonable because scramble scores are all about putts and if you are getting 8 runs at the par 3s by using your mulligans on a near straight 12 or 15 footer. Using mulligans in the right place is part of the strategy. You don't use them of 40 foot putts or off the Tee unless none of your balls are playable. Back when I was a member/owner of a member owned club, we played a weekly game and the club pro set the teams and we usually played 11 holes and usually at least 3 or 4 teams would be under 11. If you don't make birdie on the Par 4's you were out. The par 3's were going to be par unless you get lucky and you can get a eagles on the par 5's usually 75% of the time. Putting was difference maker and we had all new teams every week so cheaters weren't going to be something that would go over because the next week you would be on the receiving end of it.
Me and my buddy played in a federal courthouse challenge once. We played like crap and we logged like a 70. The group in front of us logged like a 64-65 and EVERY single one of their players had baseball swings and played military golf all day left right left right left . They didn’t hit a single fairway. It was frustrating to say the least
Most charity scrambles i play in now have the best prizes in the raffle and ok prizes for the actual competition, like a box of ok ish balls etc. This is mainly because of this advanced accounting in the scoring...
You dont get gimmes in a scramble, the ball has to be holed, in the UK a scramble is a three man team, and each player must have a minimum of four drives, leaving the big hitter in the team to really go at the par fives.
@@rickeidam3287 No gimmes hear in the US. Except for the groups that cheat. Most scramble tournaments have a requirement like every player must use 2 of their drives.
My employer used to sponsor a scramble that benefited a local charity and it was open to 36 teams. I was once on a team that had the lowest posted score with three teams still to turn in their scorecard. Magically, two of those three teams finished with lower scores than ours. The winning team was actually witnessed checking all the scores on the board, disappearing for about 10 minutes and then turning in the winning card….
Many years ago I played in the annual Buick scramble which one year we made a miracle comeback to win our local club. Was an amazing experience despite not getting out of the second round which paired each group with a club pro as well as an official score keeper. Our club pro knew every player fairly well so it always seemed legitimate. One year we missed the registration and went to another club. We saw people on the course cheating. Moving balls out of the rough, taking gimmies, hitting from the wrong tee… the final scores were ridiculous. I could see why that national tournament didn’t last much longer after that. It was a shame as it always was a highlight of the year.
Used to play 3 or 4 scrambles a year at conventions or industry events. We had a 4 some that was made up of 2 scratch golfers and 2 bogey golfers. We were lucky that we had complimentary skills that was often successful in scrambles. We didn’t win every scramble but when we did we always had to deal with being accused of cheating. We didn’t cheat but some people are so competitive and narcissistic they can’t believe they didn’t win. We played for fun and charity, not bragging rights. Maybe that is why we did well.
I used to play loads of scrambles and our corporate team won a fair few with 12 to 15 under; however, we had 2 players under 5, a 14 and a 22. So you can see how we could shoot that if we played well. Your example of 4 players around 27, to shoot anywhere near that- next to impossible. So much for golf being an honorable sport😮
On a 2 man scramble I holed a 105 yard wedge shot. The other team didn't see it and asked my partner "what the hell are you doing" when he walked onto the green and picked my ball out of the hole.
Thank you for the pointing out the many ways some golfer cheat to win. The prizes for winning might be more realistic and that may help some to keep their scores more realistic. Closest to the pin or longest drive have worked for us. The foursome to finish with the second or third lowest score may help some.
I used to run a charitable scramble every year. Because of the suspected cheating, I stopped giving closest to the pin, longest putt, longest prize and lowest score prizes. Instead, everyone got a prize based on a random drawing with the best prizes going last. Everyone walked away happy.
I was a member of a group of about 40 golfers that splintered off the Men’s Club of a public course, many were single digit handicaps but also had some up to 15 handicaps. We had a few scramble tournaments a year, and had no problem with cheating, because nobody would risk it to get kicked out the group. But a much bigger chance in large Charity scrambles, I played in quite a few, but our group would never think of cheating. The cheaters I saw always turned their cards in late to see which score they needed to win. My team won the big year ending scramble once. The format was you had to take at least one tee shot from every player. Our first round we shot 19 under and were leading by 3, the next day everybody was hung over and we shot 12 under, but won by 1 because everybody was hungover also. Almost everybody had a group behind them except the last team, so the team behind could tell what you were shooting.
When I ran charity golf outings, we did teams of 3 so that we could go out as six somes and it lowered the scores, and kept people honest because there's another random team playing with them. That being said, I've played an outing with two scratch guys, a 6 and myself (13) and we were 18 under.
Just played in a scramble where we tied for first at -11. As it turned out their tie breaker system went by hardest hole comparison and so on down the line. We ended up winning but I love the idea of a playoff between top 2 or 3 teams because the team that tied us no way shot the same. And funny part is there was basically nothing on the line to win (about $30/person credit). Exactly what you guys are saying, and I think golf in general on the amateur level is suffering the same thing just playing rounds…be an interesting study about human ego etc.. Enjoyed the clip keep up the good work.
These need to move to 3 person teams with 2 groups playing together keeping the other’s score. Then implement things to speed up play, like automatic 2 putts, anything inside of 3ft is called good, etc. When I play in the state games scramble championship event, it’s 2 teams per hole keeping each other’s score.
I think a lot of people would be surprised at how much cheating goes on in golf tournaments period. I stopped playing in our local amateur tour because of it.
Agreed. I joined a league but recognized quickly that 18s were shooting -5 on 132 slopes. A 17 shot -5 in 20-30 mph winds. That was my last tournament. Cheating in golf grinds my gears.
@@np4qzags I watched a guy “looking for his ball” drop another out of his pocket and SWEAR it was his actual ball when confronted. Last tournament I played it. Too many on the course that don’t belong there.
I love the professional commentary. Great podcast. Scrambles are a lot of fun but most folks know that there are a lot of "discretionary shots" that occur. It shouldn't happen. Solution? Just drink and have fun :/
I've played in scrambles where you got a piece of string and you cut off a chunk to get the ball in the hole so there was a little strategy involved about when to use it before you ran out.
I stopped playing in scrambles years ago. Last one i was in they decided to post scores before everyone turned in their cards. Wouldn't you know the last team to turn in theirs won by one stroke lmao.
always one group of lads that do this for a year then join another club,golf bag couple wedges and bunch of pro vs after deciding which nearest to the pin they decide to pick.not a bad season
3-man teams with two teams on each hole, keeping score for each other's teams; NO gimmies; one-club-length improvement taken seriously, no improving type of lie (in a trap, stays in a trap); zero mulligans. Shot 55 with a team in exactly this kind of scramble 41 years ago (me and 2 friends who played division 1 and 2), and it's still the most fun I've ever had playing golf.
Cheating is rampant in scrambles. I’ve never been on a winning team in my life. But I just push it out of my mind. I don’t care about the prizes. I’m just out to have fun with my buddies. But I do have friends that refuse to play in scrambles anymore. I’ve been behind winning groups where I saw what they were actually scoring. It is really crazy.
I got into a few scrambles back in the day, always on a losing team (sometimes third or fourth....), but the last scramble I got into, as a newcomer to the course, I was "lucky" enough to get on the GOOD golfer's team, and off we went. Legitimately birdied some holes on the front, and at the turn when everyone compared where they stood, that's where the "good" golfer's team went rogue... on like hole 14, after missing the birdie putt, AND THEN THE PAR PUTT, they got together and agreed they could have made that if they had tried harder, and took the par. I "hurt my wrist" on the next shot and went home.... I wanted to say something, but as the newcomer, that would have been death at this small town (under 3000 population) golf course.... so I just left and never entered another scramble...
I’ve actually stopped playing with certain people in my golf group because of cheating. It just gets old when they’re shooting par on every single hole but yet they were in the woods or they hit it in the water, or they skulled their chip shot, etc.. Then they will gloat afterwards. “You golf four times a week and I beat you and I golf once a month.”
Sandbagging is the biggest issue. I have noticed for years that everybody scores 4-6 shots better the second day. Only exception is sometimes in the high handicap flights.
Cheating has been a huge problem for many years. There's not much organizers can do about it other than having official scorers with the teams. The other thing I thought about was to have prizes randomly drawn from all participants and must be present to win. One idea I had was to have the top 5 teams score-wise regardless of the actual number, have a skills competition in front of everyone. Fun, cheering on people, and will allow players to prove their ability.
I used to play in the "Oldsmobile Scramble" that claimed that the winners could win Cars, new sets of clubs....etc. They had a "Local, Regional" and a National Championship. Our local competition was held at a very difficult course, a little over 7,000 yards and the Course rating was around a 76.5. Myself, carrying a 9 at the time, my best friend played to 0.3 ( I know because even at 67 years old he still plays off scratch! ). Our other two players carried a 15 or so and the other one had a genuine 20! What the course didn't do was to hide the scores posted...so the wives of several players were keeping track of the posted scores, and they were telling their husbands out on the course what the scores were that were already posted. My group was pretty upset, because we watched a group coming in on the 18th hole... a 570 yard Par 5 ....and we watched them take 6 shots just to get on the green...and they 3 putted for a 9. I don't know how they scored them...but when we saw their score on that hole as a 3! We protested, along with 5 or six other groups protested. Even if their highest HC. Index was a 30...you're not getting 6 shots on that hole! In the Regional, held in Albuquerque, NM....All of the teams from our qualifier were DQed! I think that Tournament was never held again! The last scramble I played in was about 15 years ago....I was only signed for the individual Tournament, so they assigned me with a 3 some...but they didn't use my score. I ended up shooting a career round...and honest 5 under par 67! I had only broken par 2 other times, both were 1 under par 71's. In the scramble portion...there were some scores in the the mid 40's! Yeah...right! I tied for 2nd place and won the longest drive hole, at 372 yards....and they had some of the women measuring the balls! I won by 20+ yards! ( I am 6'6" and have always been pretty long off the tee!) At least I walked out with a couple of Callaway Gift Cards.
I saw an interview with the gentleman that was on that team that shot the 46 you were allowed to stack mulligan type shots on the same hole. Each person got 2 mulligans and a throw that does not count as a stroke. On a Par 4 which they carded a hole in one, drive was 60 yds short. They threw the ball which does not count as a stroke landed within 3 feet, they used another throw to put it in for a hole in one
I just played in a charity scramble last Saturday. It's organized by one of my daughters as a cancer benefit (our oldest daughter died of cancer 4 years ago). One of the "purchases" one can make is purchasing tissues (under treatment someone can have many nasal issues including bleeds). The tissues could be used for mulligans or for a 3 foot piece of string for use on the green. Our group made a commitment on the first hole that we would use all the tricks (there was also a wheel spin that gave us a hole in one). We did win (which was a cash prize and chatskis). All three of the groups donated their money back. I have never had so much fun. 5 of our 7 grandkids were there that day and they either played or were with us. That's a long-winded way of saying that I disagree with your assessment.
these are fund raisers on a golf course, not golf competitions . You have the right attitude and helped raise more money for a good cause. Congrats. If your mens or womens golf association has an ABCD player level draw for a competitive scramble then mulligans and string usually wont exist. These guys are just acting naive.
We ran a successful charity tournament for the make a wish foundation for 5 years - 1999 and 2003. To insure that we had an honest (or as honest as possible outcome) we asked for asked for 18 volunteers to monitor each hole. Typically, you will only have two groups playing a hole at the same time so it can be done. The Volunteers got to eat dinner for free and get some sun. Mosley, wives and GF's volunteered and we pretty much had the same groups playing all 5 years so volunteers were not a problem. No one complained and no one ever shot under a 58 (that I recall) and I believe it kept the cheaters out of the tourney. I suppose there are better ways to do it but that worked for us.
I have a vacation spot that is on a golf course. From our deck we can see the entire green of the 13th hole that is a par three 140 yards down hill. This past June we were three during a scramble. We sat on our deck and watched for several hours while smoking cigars and having drinks. I would say about one in every three groups had a golfer hit the green from the tee. Most of the shots we saw from the tee were short of the green. There were numerous shots that went into the trees that ran along both sides of the fairways. One golfer hit the flower garden in the back of our house. We only one saw legit birdie. There were some groups that never actually putted after their ball hit the green. They had very long putts for par and would just pick it up. I have no idea what scores they posted. The next morning my nephew searched the strip of woods that ran along the side of the fairway closest to our house. In no time he came back with 27 balls. There were a few old ones, but most were brand new. There were a lot Pro V1s, some Calloway Chrome Soft, a few Bridgestones and Vice, and a couple of range balls.
Golf scrambles are ridiculous. Played in 5 this year and realized i will never do it again. Never did better then 2nd flight and had good golfers with me and always some team with people who dont golf always ends up shooting 12 14 under while groups of good golfers are getting -6 and -8.
The one scramble I play in doesn't have any type of gimmick. We have a 2 minute rule on looking for a lost ball and once you are 2 over you pick up your ball. The closest thing that I saw to cheating were kids that are on their school's golf team playing from the ladies tee and I am just hoping that my drive makes it PAST the ladies tee. I go to the tournament with at least 40 balls because I play so bad. My team, this year, came in last. At one point he had hit a couple of good balls and were upset that might take us OUT of last place. LOL.
I use to play 4 man scramble at a former employer event. Its was only a 9 hole event. But each team had to use all 4 players tee off at least once. I also just played a scramble a month ago. We played a Bogey is your friend. If definitely speeds up the game until you get to a par 3 hole.
My group shot a 52 in a Halloween scramble Course was shortened to 5800 yds it was personal my greatest round of golf it felt amazing walking up and accepting the top spot
Yes, yes and yes! Too many stories to tell. One is we had a big money skin game two man scramble. When we were doing the skins that were worth 3000.00 each. One group had birdied the # 1 handicap hole. It is a 400 dog leg right that you need a 250- yard drive to even see the green, then it is over a pond to a small green with lots of break. The guys who said they birdied are both 20s who can't drive the ball 225 let alone have a perfect drive and perfect second shot and make the putt even if you gave them 100 tries. The kicker is they were playing by themselves as a group did not show. We had scratch golfers who bogeyed the hole. We had no way to prove they didn't and they kept the $$$$
I play in a few scrambles a year and it’s ALWAYS the least talented looking groups shooting insane scores. Also I’ve noticed most places don’t seperate regular and senior drives for longest drive holes which always drives me nuts. The guys I’ll play with always ask why I don’t want to cheat, I always say “because it wouldn’t be fun with the amount you have to cheat”. I’m just trying to play a round of golf, get some food and have fun.
Golf scramble cheating is solved by adding a 5th-objective participant to every scramble team. Assigned by the scramble organizing committee. The 5th individual may be a playing or non-playing (just scorekeeping) volunteer. When you add that 5th person to the scorekeeping, the scores come down. The other thing to consider is the alternate ways in which scrambles are fundraisers a lot of the time. Revenue is increased thru tools that lower the scores such as purchasing mulligans, or strings for greens to expand the hole, etc..at the end of the day, scrambles should just be a fun time.
A group of friends and I play in scrambles only because they can be cheaper that a normal round at that course. We just play a normal round of golf. When people are turning in scores of 56, there's no way we were ever going to wing. I played in one where my irons on par 3's was just on that day. I hit to 12", 2ft, 4ft, and 11"s. On the last par 3 I hit the 4ft shot. I also was the last group at that hole and picked up the marker. When the winner of the closest to the hole was announced all four holes went to the same guy. He was not the closest name on the marker I picked up. So even the organizers of events cheat. Fun fact. I haven't had a par 3 day (or even two holes) like that since.
It is not just low score cheating. I’ve seen people move the longest drive and closest to the hole markers with no relationship to where their ball ended up.
When I was a kid I played on a scramble team consisting of me, my uncle Jeff, my dad, and my fathers best friend from high school. They didn’t drink booze, and they were good golfers. We played in 8-somes to stop the cheat. It was some of the best times of my life. I made a hole in one, one time, in a scramble on that team. It was the 16th hole, the other 4 some had other friends, it was in front of the clubhouse, and it got us into a playoff that we eventually won. Maybe my greatest personal memory….. Today, scrambles are dead.
The last scramble I did, we were sent out in groups of 8. It was a 6 and a half hour round. I was exhausted at the end of it. It didn’t help it was a hot day on a golf course with little shade.
this is a couple of things i've always said needs to happen.. either have scrambles be 2 somes or 3 somes, and you go out in 4 somes or 6's and you keep score of the other team. another option is, you have the top 3 teams, play a 9 hole playoff vs the clubhouse Pro's team, or some of the local scratch players and if they can beat the scratch guys they win the prize... if any team doesn't want to this playoff format, they are disqualified and the next team has the option.
Played in a scramble in Norcal about 10-12 yrs ago. JBHunt was the host. Manteca Park. We know the Hunt guys and they are the hole ahead of us. My hcp was down to like 3-4 range. Carried my team and we ended up like 11-12 under. The 6th hole we catch the host team at tee on par 3. They are all absolutely f-ing hammered. They are all laughing that they just got their 1st birdie on last hole. So we finish. I’m taking my clubs to car before we meet to eat. One of the guys in Host group is sitting on the gate of his p/u and looks like he has a scorecard. I start fuming. Sure as $hit we go in and they announce scores…JBHunt team turns in -17 score. 11-12 didn’t win but the teams that seemed to turn in honest scores got cheated. Lost total respect for those folks that day. Every time I had to deal with them after that had a bad taste in my mouth.
I have played in a number of these scrambles for charity or in a group of retired guys. I really have come to hate how you can "buy" mulligans and other misc. stuff! That's not golf!! I would like to see a scramble done where each group must pay a modest amount for a "caddy" that goes along with your group and scores unbiased and truthfully and maybe helps out with rules where to drop or what have you. That would fix it and caddies would sign up to be one because they would get paid.
I play in a yearly scramble in Wisconsin. They have a putting raffle at the turn. You can buy 3 putts for $5. As many as you want. For each putt made your name gets put in a raffle jar. At the end, the winning name gets half the total money collected. To make things fair for everyone, 1st, 4th, 8th and 12th places are awarded prize money. All ties are rolled back to the hardest hole score. Can't tell you how many times we lost because we were 3rd or 7th or 10th place. Makes for a fun scramble. 😊
This is an old problem and nobody can fix it but the club. I can share from my own experience. Sandbaggers (good players with high handicaps) should be known to the pro. If you get out on a muni course then there is not much hope. If you play a tourney without a handicap you still have the issue of flights. I've seen ridiculous scores for the 1st/2nd flight better than the championship flight.
The small town I live in has a very nice municipal golf course. There are several fund raising tournaments throughout the season - volunteer fire department, high school sports etc. Fees are generally around $150 per player with a modest lunch provided and a raffle after the event. I decided not to participate when the winning gross scores were at or near 50 ( par 72) and net scores ( 25% handicap) were around 44 - 46. As you are commenting, no one in the group has the game for those scores. Sad .
I played in a scramble a month ago after some severe storms. Course was absolutely soaked. 30-40 mph winds and occasional rain. I played with 3 coworkers that can barely hit the ball. I play well. We shot 74. Winning team shot 57.
I’ve played in many and a lot of times the group in front of us is never in the fairway, never long, having to take drops from going in the drink, hitting out of green side bunkers all round long. Somehow…they manage to win by 6 strokes. It’s a miracle I tell you.
Played in these for decades. Charity ones where these goofy string, mulligans, games to go to front tees, shoot a cannon ball, etc. These get some crazy scores but it's not legit entirely. Plus, have played legit 4 person events with straight up scoring. It takes a long time but the most fair is teams play together. 8 people. Almost always these are on 9 hole courses. Best score we had of four players (player range +3-4 hcp to 3-4 hcp) shot -20. A couple drivable par 4s, reachable par 5s. Same 9 hole course twice. It was a playoff as both paired up teams (8) had that score, won on first playoff hole (Par 5) eagle over a birdie. Places can do an automatic 2 putt rule to move things along. Folds of Honor a couple weeks ago we did that as there were 136 players. Winning score was -14.
I've played in a couple of charity scrambles recently. In one, the winning team shot 48, 10 shots better than second place. The next one, the winner shot 51. 6 better than second place. We play honestly, so no chance of winning. But I did win $100 for closest to the pin in the second tournament. So that was fun.
My first 3 best ball scrambles 20 years ago were won by teams claiming 21, 20 and 18 under and there were no holes that you could buy a shot or pay to have ball on green for second shot on par 5. Straight up 18 holes of best ball only. My team was at par for one and 2 under for two, and together as a four man team we were better than most. The last best ball I did 3 years ago for a Church charity the winning score was even par and my group got second at 2 over par and there was a hole that you could buy a birdie, buy a putt for double eagle on a par five and buy a birdie put from 8 feet on a par 3. I remember thinking we were going to be last at 2 over even after I heard the organizers say we had a good score. They actually knew what they were talking about as they had put it on for the past 3 years. All 4 of those best balls were played on the same course which is considered quite difficult for the average golfer. We thought there was cheating going on 20 years ago so I am not at all surprised by this. Granted, myself and my group 3 years ago was not very strong, but we were still only a couple shots off of from two of those previous best balls.
Cheating was commonplace 30 years ago. Cheating in the scramble, closest to the hole and long drive contest. I've seen it all a whole lot. I have called people out about cheating. It never does any good.
This is crazy because I was just thinking about this. I was in a scramble and the top team got a 43. Standard course. Two cheats. 1. On two holes you got to tee off from the reds and 2. You got like 30 foot of string that you could measure out the string and cut it off, and then it was like it went in. So for a 5 foot put, they would have 25 foot of string left after using 5. I still think that is impossible though. If DeChambeau and Sergio can’t break 50 in best ball, how in the world can someone hit a 43, even with those cheats? Essentially every whole, your second shot would have to be 2-3 feet from the hole. On the flip side a couple counter points. Not all tourneys are rigged. Our church did a 27 player scramble and my group shot two under. I thought we would be crushed. There are a lot of solid golfers that played. We got third. First was only 5 under. So not everyone cheats. Second, you can’t totally base the score off handicap. These days I have around a 30 handicap (because I don’t cheat) and I am really inconsistent. However, I have done really well in scrambles because I am a really good putter, and sometimes I make an amazing iron shot (which really is what keeps me going). But I have never won a scramble. If I was in a scramble where I got to take all four shots myself, I bet I could post a really low score. It is weird though, I am very competitive in everything I do, and for scrambles I just go out to have fun, and it is always fun. Probably because I realize I have no shot at winning.
I played in a 9 hole charity tournament today. My team of fairly competent golfers shot 3 under for a 33. The winning team posted a 15 under 21 for 9 holes. The second place posted an 11 under 25. I call BS on all of it.
Long ago, a good friend of mine and golf pro, he and I played in a scratch doubles "better ball" tournament. At the time I was a +3.4 handicap and he was something around a +4.5 handicap. Yes, we were both sub-par players at the time. He and I both had a fantastic day that day, both playing one of the best rounds of the year, shooting a scratch 58 together. We were ecstatic over the round we had. Even for us that was an absolutely tremendous round. And then we found out that 2 other guys, 10 and 15 handicap players, also shot a scratch 58 round. The head pro of the course, also a friend of mine, allowed their score to stand but warned them, "never come back here to play a tournament again, you cheated". Obviously we could not prove they cheated, but come on, there is NO WAY a 10 and 15 handicap player scored a scratch 58 in this "better ball" tournament. That is impossible. It was unlikely enough that a +3 and +4 handicap team scored a scratch 58 (we did, and did NOT cheat). My head pro friend absolutely believed my buddy and I scored such a great game (he knows our playing well) but absolutely did not believe the other team. It was clear, they cheated. And our scratch score was 7 strokes better than the next best of the field. Oh, and FYI, my playing partner and I suggested a playoff to break the tie, funny thing, they wouldn't agree to it. Wonder why....
Last two weeks have played 4 man Texas scrambles at my club, last week off the yellows it was won with a score of 51 with a team Handicap Of 5, we thought we had played OK to come in with a net 60 (-12 to par) with a team ten handicap, with individual handicaps ranging from 15-20. This week off the whites winners had a 52, out of the field of 40 teams 20 had a score of 60 or lower. We shot 59 which was genuine and we did leave a few shots out in the course, such as not sinking birdie putts from 12 feet with 4 attempts. People grumble about manipulating handicaps, but if you have 4 golfers all 2 handicap playing home course you could expect them to hit birdies on most holes so a low 50’s is going to be the winning score. Our club sets no rules as to mixing the group with a range of handicaps etc. our two rounds were genuine no given putts etc and we could have with luck shot a low 50’s as well. If you think cheating going on maybe have to have a marker go with each group
I played in a scramble this past weekend and we had windy conditions than a torrential rainfall halfway through the round and the winning team shot 16 under.
I played a scramble in the spring and the winners were claiming a -16 and we were pretty sure they were doing at least a little cheating. It’s a game of honour and it can’t feel good to turn in a shady score. I think the key is to not give a big prize to the winners and just have KP for money with a spotter and maybe a long drive and longest putt holes. The -16 people made a couple hundred bucks each so I saw the incentive. Take away the ease and incentive of cheating and then people will just try to play well and have fun like they should. The exact middle score should win the biggest prize.
The club I belonged to had a team that ALWAYS came in 10-15 minutes after all the other scores were posted. And they always miraculously scored 1-2 strokes lower than the next low score. The prize money paled in comparison to the calcutta money. The pro knew, but didn't have the stones to stand up to them. I quit the club, but that didn't fix the problem.
i play a few scrable events a year where you play through with another random team and it seems to work well, round isnt much longer and the other team keeps an eye on your score.
The only scrambles I enjoy these days are amongst my leagues at the end of the yr. We randomly put 2 teams of 2 together, divide up the handicap, and play a course that isn't our league course, so it's honest guys, no one cheats, and it's a course we don't play every week
The missus and i were entered in a two person captains choice, and we had a terrible 1st day (91 IIRC), and the second day we shot an amazing 76, which bounced us out of our flight, fair enough...I did win a closest to the pin prize, and asked the team playing with us to verify my measurement, they declined, saying 'great shot'...but in other scrambles my regular partner and I won our flight twice, and one other closest to the pin prize...we never worried about winning, or even hitting a rare great shot, as we always knew inevitably someone else would pencil whip us...enjoy the pretty day with a friend, or missus...
This is how we play scrambles in Australia ... Whoever shot you select that person dose'nt hit this continues till the green then all 4 putt ... it certainly helps with cheating but I think handicaps are still are open to being manipulated in some cases
I was on a team that went 22 under. When we handed in the card...the organizers called bs. The group behind us come in and asked...that was amazing...how low did you go?!?! I was a 7 and long drives playing with 3 scratch guys.
What we’ve had to do in our area in WA state is put two foursomes together and make them swap score cards. That way the two teams keep each others scores. Cheating had gotten out of control during big money tournaments, so we had to do something.
The last scramble I played in the winning team won with a 46. It's been bad for decades in the flighted club championships too. One guy I knew told me that the reason he consistently won club championships and big $ matches was because he had a well-manicured handicap. The handicap system is kind of silly at this point
In foursomes, the initial shot on each of the 4 par 3s must be done by a different player in the foursome. So if A, B, & C are on the green, but D is in a bunker, you may want to use D's shot, because who knows what will happen on the remaining par 3s, and you'll probably get up and down from the bunker. If you use a player's drive, that player cannot hit the next shot; only the other 3 players on the team can hit the next shot. After that, all four players can play shots on that hole.
I really think ALL scrambles need a volunteer scorekeeper walking with each group. I competed in an event in Lexington, KY, par 72 course - one reachable par 4, 3/4 par 5s were easily reachable. Now gimmicks were given, you could buy a max of 8 mulligans per team, and you're given a 3' string (which I believe was not properly explained it's "proper" usage). My team made 3 eagles, 13 birdies for a score of 53. We eagled 2 of the par 5's and the reachable par 4. the winning team shot 46, with another team shooting 48, and 3 other teams beating our score of 53. And I'm just scratching my head thinking, there's no way...
We won a four man recently with a 57. We had a 20, 10, 1 (me) and scratch. No one believed that we didn't cheat. I probably won't play anymore scrambles just because of all the crap you catch for having a good day. It's not a good feeling standing there knowing everyone in the room thinks you're a cheater. Friends are always recruiting me for scrambles but I will probably politely decline from now on. So yeah, I guess cheaters have ruined scrambles.
My group played on a scramble recently, and followed a group that couldn’t hit it more than 100 yards. They were all hackers. We had to wait on every shot. Then when they called up the group that shot 18 under to win, this group walked up. We all about fell over!
How about the concept of Scrambles become Shambles? Best drive of the 4 players all players hit from that spot (every player has to use at least 2 of their drives). Then you play your own ball to finish the hole. The two best scores count for the final team score.
I have a corporate scramble coming up later this week. Last year’s winning score was a -19 by a group of 60+ guys. Now I’m not saying it can’t happen in a scramble… but the course/tee box we were playing was nearly 7000 yards with 73.4/136 rating. My group finished -8. I’m not saying we’re long hitters but I think I’m slightly above average with a 108mph swing speed. A couple guys in my group (friends of mine) are slightly faster at 110+. One guy is a single digit handicap, we had a 20 something handicap and me and the last guy are around a 12. I’m sorry but there’s no way the winning group birdied the longer par 4s. I’ll give them the 5s, but some of the par 4 holes were just under 500yards. One of them was a straightforward 480 to the pin but tree lined, narrow and protected by bunkers. 2nd hardest hole on the course. Absolutely no way they hit the gir. I didn’t get a clear view of them swinging but spotted them on a 210yard par 3 and some had driver in hand and the others weren’t holding irons. I’m thankful for the day off work and a round on the company’s dime but I’d rather match play in my own group if the tournament doesn’t mean anything.
the only way i can see of 'policeing ' a golf tourneyment is to have streaming cameras 3 or more to a hole, and recorders for each and a computer program to search and find ( follow ) each group throughout their round of play. that way when a group comes in with a low score its possible to see how they got it. ( or how they cheated ) jeffrey rayborn wausau, wisconsin - golf player- not regular best round = 9 holes 44 , usual round last year 55. one time was in a dolf scramble thru work - my group was formed om the day from people who worked in different areas of the company. 1 guy had never played before but was athletic. after 5 minutes on the range he could hit a ball in a forward direction! LOL my group won 3 individual things. the guy who never played before one a longest put for his totally lucky 20 foot put. on the par 5 hole was a longest drive- that one of our team won, and on the par 3 one guy got closest to the hole with a lucky shot that was 4 inches . the guy who never played before, a week later had to pay the golf course for ruining the clubs he used. and all of us we astounded! because we saw all his hits all day long and he never did anything to the clubs he used to cause them to be deformed! the following 6 years the company had any golf outings our 4 people protested and never went. and every year i heard about things that ruined golf for other groups. i understand your 'cheating' you talk about is against the players. but please dont forget about the disreputable things done to players in nearly every tourneyment also !
When I play scrambles I expect the cheating so I don’t even stress, I just go out to have fun and enjoy the ride to be honest. It’s fun watching and hearing all the talk at the end of the scramble bc people know exactly who cheated and who didn’t. It’s all fun at the end of the game. I have only won one scramble and it was due to the team I got paired with they were good players, so no credit to me 😂 it was definitely cool watching those guys just kill it on every hole
But sometimes you can buy string or buy mulligans for fun and more money. If there are huge prizes you would have to do eightsomes. Most scrambles I played the prizes were raffles at the end.
I’m a female golfer who hits the ball pretty long. I’ve had guys invite to be a part of their scramble because I get to hit from the forward tees. I would hit a shot into the fairway, then they would let it rip knowing they could play my shot ,which was always in the middle of the fairway, if their shots went into the woods.
We play one man scrambles against another person doing the same thing. Play 2 balls each, your best ball. No handicap, No giveaway shots. We play it on the sim, fast game score stays low with some skill.
The newest thing, at least for me, is where the institution running the event has everyone log into an account and track your scoring that way. This has led to cheaters waiting to see what the leading team is scoring and then track their scores. This is usually a 25+ handicap team beating a 5-10 handicap team. I've decided to just enjoy the game/opportunity to play with some friends and have no concept of actually winning. The sad part is most of the time I'm playing in "charity" events.
If you mix handicaps and scrambles, you might as well just give your money away. My rule is, if you play scrambles for money, you put 8 on a box, blind draw and keep each other's score. If a 2 man, 4 man to a box. Best way is to have a non-playing score keeper with each group. I am even seeing this trickle into Member Guest events.
Had to chime in! I just played in a fundraiser over the weekend. Out of my foursome, 3 of us around par regularly, 2 of us played mini tours back in the day and one shoots around 80 but pounds it. We played a pretty difficult public course with tough conditions, course got a lot of play and was rough, especially the greens plus a 15 to 25 mph wind. We shot 58, 14 under, 12 birdies and an eagle. All the pars was us missing 10 to 20 foot birdie putts, greens got us. The “winners” shot 18 under, you should’ve seen these guys! Even they were embarrassed! Somehow we came in 3rd!?
Most scrambles down here in Australia we have what we call a rodeo .... each player must use min of 4 tee shots. Focus is always getting that out of the way for the worst players ASAP.
IN RESPONSE TO YOUR QUESTION: YES! Buying Mulligans, using string for closer putts, hitting the green against the pro gets you an ace on the hole and the list goes on and on. Hell I even play one with corn hole, if you got the bags in the hole, you took a stroke off each hole. It hurt's the scramble and with prices getting so high, I pass on the invites!
In our scrambles, cheating was a huge problem. We usually play two 4 person teams per hole. It is required now that your scorecard is to be filled out by the opposing team and returned to you after the round. It isn't foolproof but it pretty much got rid of some of the 50's scores that people were turning in. The last tournament we played, our team was paired with the defending champions of flight 1. When we asked for their card on the first hole they refused. We called the golf course manager over and it nearly came to a fight. After a while they relented, and we exchanged scorecards. Long story short, the previous year they won with a score of - 57 - with us keeping score - 71 - Good Times. Their is no way in hell they can, did or could shoot a 57.
@@danhansen706 oh shit ! I love it. 👏👍🏼
We had four man scrambles in the Air Force. On our team, we had Jeff Couch, the Armed Services Champion (scratch), Dick Albrecht, a three, my best friend Dave Becker a seven, and me, the worst on the team with a ten handicap. We were four of the top six golfers on the Air Force Base. We ROUTINELY posted 57, and the next best was 70.
I hate that kind of shit.
@@dennissvitak5475were you proud of yourselves?
@@sodeepopkid6855 - Of course. It was a competition, that we won, fairly, year after year. Not sure what your problem was, loser.
Golf is one sport that exposes the true character of the individual. No matter how small the prize, a large portion of the contestants just can’t help themselves.
I learned golf while living in the Philippines. An American expat living there gave lessons at a local country club in Mindanao. He told me that it was the only place he’d ever been where millionaires would cheat to win an electric fan.
was it expensive to play golf there?
..it is all about human EGO .
I play charitable scrambles to enjoy a laid back round with friends. I assume there will be cheaters and never plan to come close to winning.
Same!!
This is the only philosophy to have of these. Every scramble I have been a part of if your group pars just one hole you are done. Way too much pressure and stress for me to worry about winning.
So I just go to enjoy nice weather with friends and be happy our money is going to somewhere nice.
Same thing here. The extent some guys are willing to go to just to win a meaningless scramble is mind blowing! 🤯
A friend of mine and I played in a charity event and were paired with one of the courses teaching pros and his friend. They were blatantly cheating (usually on where to play from when the friend hit one out of bounds or in a penalty area). Unbelievable.
Not me put me down for a 3 😂
I stopped playing scrambles 20 years ago because of the cheating. I was arguing with the people in “my foursome “ not to cheat. The only time I played in a scramble without cheating is when they paired 2 foursomes together and made them play as an eightSome. That way groups could watch each other. The winning score was a reasonable -14 with all scratch and single hcp golfers.
@@frankthetank1256 and it probably took seven hours
@@MIGolfLive Believe it or not it really didn’t!
Yes, in a real scramble you pair 2 guys from one team with 2 guys from another team and they keep each other's score
@@byrnesupholstery that would be a 2 man scramble. Four-man scramble’s is for a team of four and that’s what they’re talking about in this video.
@@frankthetank1256 8 people in a scramble is not that slow.... your only using the best shot . Of course you could have both groups in on it particularly if money is involved
I played in a scramble once where a club member accompanied each 4 some and kept score. They also acted as officials for long drive, closest to the pin etc..
This is the way
I played a scramble years ago where our team shot a 57 …no cheating. One older guy in our group was so enamored with that, he asked to see the scorecard. I told him sure, just don’t forget to turn it in. When they were announcing the winners later in the clubhouse, a 58 was first place. I was puzzled by that, and I asked a guy in our group where the old guy with the card was. “I think he went home”, was the answer. He just wanted the card for a souvenir. I thought that was funny. There really wasn’t much of a prize anyway.
Love the playoff idea at the end of the round vs the top two teams. A fraudulent team will get exposed real fast.
good idea but how much time for all of this? The scramble itself lasts too long .... Hard to combine just a fun time fund raiser....verse a competition. Speed hole, pay it forward.... have a good time and put best prizes in a drawing.
@@elliott3991 it won't take as long as you think and whats a little more added time to an already long event? guarantee you the top two groups have at least a few competitive minded people playing and would want to see who is the real deal and who isn't.
I have played in probably 100 scrambles, and I think it's cute you think the second-place team did not cheat and the first place one did. What only the winners cheated?
Plot twist: both teams are fraudulent.
we went birdie birdie eagle and got kicked off the course
I don’t play scrambles anymore and I never expected to come close to winning. I always wanted to see how low below par we could score.
The only part of this conversation to be completely honest was at the end where you stated that you hoped folks would come back with some integrity Golf to me is and always will be something I have where I control "MY" game. Who am I playing against? ME always me. There is no room for cheaters in my game. I understand your point and appreciate the tone and messages being delivered. It is a crying shame others do not play to that same value..
Absolutely, I’ve played golf for 31 years and it was like that back then. We just have fun
At our club one team always seems to win. They never turn in their scorecard until all the other teams have. They’ve been called out dozens of times. I only play in these scrambles to hang out with my friends, drink a little beer, laugh and have a fun time.
There are 3 ways to play scrambles and have a complete blast.
One - Play the weekly scramble at your club and have the pro set the teams with A-B-C-D players. Use the "regular" scramble rules of a club length and in the leather. Those are tons of fun and will help your game if you are a C or D because you playing with better players that you normally wouldn't have a daily game with and it isn't real pressure.
Two - Play for a charity and a couple of guys set their own teams and bet each other and ignore the scramble. This is also really fun but you have to know each other and trust each other and negotiate pops per side if one team is clearly better. You might not even turn in your card to the tourney because you were just donating and the real game was the side bet.
Third - Play for charity that plays at a course that you otherwise wouldn't normally get a chance to play at and simply enjoy the course without the pressure of slow play because you don't know the course and if you miss, you just pick it up. The regulars at that course are likely going to win anyway because they know the greens.
If y'all are wanting a fair scramble you have to play on a team with people you don't know set by the course or director based on HCs. The problem is guys building teams with 4 A players. You need to have to have a combined HC of 36 or something like that if you want it fair. You need a rule where you have to use at least one putt and use one drive from the D player and maybe 2 from the C player.
I know a 40 just a stupid score, and 47 or even 48 is stupid too when the guys are weekend hacks without a GHIN handicap, but with 4 studs and knowledge of the course, add in a buy a drive to 140 and a perfect lie on the par5s and a couple of mulligans each, those scores aren't that unreasonable. Pay a couple of NCAA players to be on your team to blast the ball off the Tee and it will be a different game for your team by making the approaches a lot closer. Scrambles usually have easy pin placements. Going low becomes reasonable because scramble scores are all about putts and if you are getting 8 runs at the par 3s by using your mulligans on a near straight 12 or 15 footer. Using mulligans in the right place is part of the strategy. You don't use them of 40 foot putts or off the Tee unless none of your balls are playable.
Back when I was a member/owner of a member owned club, we played a weekly game and the club pro set the teams and we usually played 11 holes and usually at least 3 or 4 teams would be under 11. If you don't make birdie on the Par 4's you were out. The par 3's were going to be par unless you get lucky and you can get a eagles on the par 5's usually 75% of the time. Putting was difference maker and we had all new teams every week so cheaters weren't going to be something that would go over because the next week you would be on the receiving end of it.
Me and my buddy played in a federal courthouse challenge once. We played like crap and we logged like a 70. The group in front of us logged like a 64-65 and EVERY single one of their players had baseball swings and played military golf all day left right left right left . They didn’t hit a single fairway. It was frustrating to say the least
Most charity scrambles i play in now have the best prizes in the raffle and ok prizes for the actual competition, like a box of ok ish balls etc. This is mainly because of this advanced accounting in the scoring...
...U'guys....?..their just mimicking their trumpity'doo'da hero..?..so'suprising..?..
@isaactaylor5531 sorry, most of us don't speak tard. Too bad you've got TDS. There's no cream for that.
In Ireland we have an interesting wrinkle for a scramble: whosever shot you are using MUST play 1st ( no placing). Makes a difference 😉
Some people don’t know how gimmes work. They don’t count the stroke
That’s true, I’ve seen it. Hard to believe.
You dont get gimmes in a scramble, the ball has to be holed, in the UK a scramble is a three man team, and each player must have a minimum of four drives, leaving the big hitter in the team to really go at the par fives.
@@rickeidam3287 No gimmes hear in the US. Except for the groups that cheat. Most scramble tournaments have a requirement like every player must use 2 of their drives.
My employer used to sponsor a scramble that benefited a local charity and it was open to 36 teams. I was once on a team that had the lowest posted score with three teams still to turn in their scorecard. Magically, two of those three teams finished with lower scores than ours. The winning team was actually witnessed checking all the scores on the board, disappearing for about 10 minutes and then turning in the winning card….
Many years ago I played in the annual Buick scramble which one year we made a miracle comeback to win our local club. Was an amazing experience despite not getting out of the second round which paired each group with a club pro as well as an official score keeper. Our club pro knew every player fairly well so it always seemed legitimate. One year we missed the registration and went to another club. We saw people on the course cheating. Moving balls out of the rough, taking gimmies, hitting from the wrong tee… the final scores were ridiculous. I could see why that national tournament didn’t last much longer after that. It was a shame as it always was a highlight of the year.
Used to play 3 or 4 scrambles a year at conventions or industry events. We had a 4 some that was made up of 2 scratch golfers and 2 bogey golfers. We were lucky that we had complimentary skills that was often successful in scrambles. We didn’t win every scramble but when we did we always had to deal with being accused of cheating. We didn’t cheat but some people are so competitive and narcissistic they can’t believe they didn’t win. We played for fun and charity, not bragging rights. Maybe that is why we did well.
You won when Trump did not play in the scramble because if he did you could not win! (He is the world's biggest cheat!)
I used to play loads of scrambles and our corporate team won a fair few with 12 to 15 under; however, we had 2 players under 5, a 14 and a 22. So you can see how we could shoot that if we played well.
Your example of 4 players around 27, to shoot anywhere near that- next to impossible.
So much for golf being an honorable sport😮
On a 2 man scramble I holed a 105 yard wedge shot. The other team didn't see it and asked my partner "what the hell are you doing" when he walked onto the green and picked my ball out of the hole.
Thank you for the pointing out the many ways some golfer cheat to win. The prizes for winning might be more realistic and that may help some to keep their scores more realistic. Closest to the pin or longest drive have worked for us. The foursome to finish with the second or third lowest score may help some.
I used to run a charitable scramble every year. Because of the suspected cheating, I stopped giving closest to the pin, longest putt, longest prize and lowest score prizes. Instead, everyone got a prize based on a random drawing with the best prizes going last. Everyone walked away happy.
I was a member of a group of about 40 golfers that splintered off the Men’s Club of a public course, many were single digit handicaps but also had some up to 15 handicaps. We had a few scramble tournaments a year, and had no problem with cheating, because nobody would risk it to get kicked out the group. But a much bigger chance in large Charity scrambles, I played in quite a few, but our group would never think of cheating. The cheaters I saw always turned their cards in late to see which score they needed to win. My team won the big year ending scramble once. The format was you had to take at least one tee shot from every player. Our first round we shot 19 under and were leading by 3, the next day everybody was hung over and we shot 12 under, but won by 1 because everybody was hungover also. Almost everybody had a group behind them except the last team, so the team behind could tell what you were shooting.
When I ran charity golf outings, we did teams of 3 so that we could go out as six somes and it lowered the scores, and kept people honest because there's another random team playing with them. That being said, I've played an outing with two scratch guys, a 6 and myself (13) and we were 18 under.
Just played in a scramble where we tied for first at -11. As it turned out their tie breaker system went by hardest hole comparison and so on down the line. We ended up winning but I love the idea of a playoff between top 2 or 3 teams because the team that tied us no way shot the same. And funny part is there was basically nothing on the line to win (about $30/person credit). Exactly what you guys are saying, and I think golf in general on the amateur level is suffering the same thing just playing rounds…be an interesting study about human ego etc.. Enjoyed the clip keep up the good work.
@@marks2193 thanks!
in my eperience it's 16/17 year olds trying to be noticed or it's either a policeman or banker
I always hated the hardest hole decides the playoff, we both have the same score, who cares how you got there.
These need to move to 3 person teams with 2 groups playing together keeping the other’s score. Then implement things to speed up play, like automatic 2 putts, anything inside of 3ft is called good, etc.
When I play in the state games scramble championship event, it’s 2 teams per hole keeping each other’s score.
I think a lot of people would be surprised at how much cheating goes on in golf tournaments period. I stopped playing in our local amateur tour because of it.
Agreed. I joined a league but recognized quickly that 18s were shooting -5 on 132 slopes. A 17 shot -5 in 20-30 mph winds. That was my last tournament. Cheating in golf grinds my gears.
@@np4qzags I watched a guy “looking for his ball” drop another out of his pocket and SWEAR it was his actual ball when confronted. Last tournament I played it. Too many on the course that don’t belong there.
I love the professional commentary. Great podcast. Scrambles are a lot of fun but most folks know that there are a lot of "discretionary shots" that occur. It shouldn't happen. Solution? Just drink and have fun :/
I've played in scrambles where you got a piece of string and you cut off a chunk to get the ball in the hole so there was a little strategy involved about when to use it before you ran out.
I stopped playing in scrambles years ago. Last one i was in they decided to post scores before everyone turned in their cards. Wouldn't you know the last team to turn in theirs won by one stroke lmao.
always one group of lads that do this for a year then join another club,golf bag couple wedges and bunch of pro vs after deciding which nearest to the pin they decide to pick.not a bad season
3-man teams with two teams on each hole, keeping score for each other's teams; NO gimmies; one-club-length improvement taken seriously, no improving type of lie (in a trap, stays in a trap); zero mulligans. Shot 55 with a team in exactly this kind of scramble 41 years ago (me and 2 friends who played division 1 and 2), and it's still the most fun I've ever had playing golf.
Cheating is rampant in scrambles. I’ve never been on a winning team in my life. But I just push it out of my mind. I don’t care about the prizes. I’m just out to have fun with my buddies. But I do have friends that refuse to play in scrambles anymore. I’ve been behind winning groups where I saw what they were actually scoring. It is really crazy.
I got into a few scrambles back in the day, always on a losing team (sometimes third or fourth....), but the last scramble I got into, as a newcomer to the course, I was "lucky" enough to get on the GOOD golfer's team, and off we went. Legitimately birdied some holes on the front, and at the turn when everyone compared where they stood, that's where the "good" golfer's team went rogue... on like hole 14, after missing the birdie putt, AND THEN THE PAR PUTT, they got together and agreed they could have made that if they had tried harder, and took the par. I "hurt my wrist" on the next shot and went home.... I wanted to say something, but as the newcomer, that would have been death at this small town (under 3000 population) golf course.... so I just left and never entered another scramble...
I’ve actually stopped playing with certain people in my golf group because of cheating.
It just gets old when they’re shooting par on every single hole but yet they were in the woods or they hit it in the water, or they skulled their chip shot, etc..
Then they will gloat afterwards. “You golf four times a week and I beat you and I golf once a month.”
Sandbagging is the biggest issue. I have noticed for years that everybody scores 4-6 shots better the second day. Only exception is sometimes in the high handicap flights.
Cheating has been a huge problem for many years. There's not much organizers can do about it other than having official scorers with the teams. The other thing I thought about was to have prizes randomly drawn from all participants and must be present to win.
One idea I had was to have the top 5 teams score-wise regardless of the actual number, have a skills competition in front of everyone. Fun, cheering on people, and will allow players to prove their ability.
I used to play in the "Oldsmobile Scramble" that claimed that the winners could win Cars, new sets of clubs....etc. They had a "Local, Regional" and a National Championship. Our local competition was held at a very difficult course, a little over 7,000 yards and the Course rating was around a 76.5. Myself, carrying a 9 at the time, my best friend played to 0.3 ( I know because even at 67 years old he still plays off scratch! ). Our other two players carried a 15 or so and the other one had a genuine 20! What the course didn't do was to hide the scores posted...so the wives of several players were keeping track of the posted scores, and they were telling their husbands out on the course what the scores were that were already posted.
My group was pretty upset, because we watched a group coming in on the 18th hole... a 570 yard Par 5 ....and we watched them take 6 shots just to get on the green...and they 3 putted for a 9. I don't know how they scored them...but when we saw their score on that hole as a 3! We protested, along with 5 or six other groups protested. Even if their highest HC. Index was a 30...you're not getting 6 shots on that hole!
In the Regional, held in Albuquerque, NM....All of the teams from our qualifier were DQed! I think that Tournament was never held again!
The last scramble I played in was about 15 years ago....I was only signed for the individual Tournament, so they assigned me with a 3 some...but they didn't use my score. I ended up shooting a career round...and honest 5 under par 67! I had only broken par 2 other times, both were 1 under par 71's. In the scramble portion...there were some scores in the the mid 40's! Yeah...right! I tied for 2nd place and won the longest drive hole, at 372 yards....and they had some of the women measuring the balls! I won by 20+ yards! ( I am 6'6" and have always been pretty long off the tee!) At least I walked out with a couple of Callaway Gift Cards.
I saw an interview with the gentleman that was on that team that shot the 46 you were allowed to stack mulligan type shots on the same hole. Each person got 2 mulligans and a throw that does not count as a stroke.
On a Par 4 which they carded a hole in one, drive was 60 yds short. They threw the ball which does not count as a stroke landed within 3 feet, they used another throw to put it in for a hole in one
I just played in a charity scramble last Saturday. It's organized by one of my daughters as a cancer benefit (our oldest daughter died of cancer 4 years ago). One of the "purchases" one can make is purchasing tissues (under treatment someone can have many nasal issues including bleeds). The tissues could be used for mulligans or for a 3 foot piece of string for use on the green. Our group made a commitment on the first hole that we would use all the tricks (there was also a wheel spin that gave us a hole in one). We did win (which was a cash prize and chatskis). All three of the groups donated their money back. I have never had so much fun. 5 of our 7 grandkids were there that day and they either played or were with us.
That's a long-winded way of saying that I disagree with your assessment.
these are fund raisers on a golf course, not golf competitions . You have the right attitude and helped raise more money for a good cause. Congrats. If your mens or womens golf association has an ABCD player level draw for a competitive scramble then mulligans and string usually wont exist. These guys are just acting naive.
We ran a successful charity tournament for the make a wish foundation for 5 years - 1999 and 2003. To insure that we had an honest (or as honest as possible outcome) we asked for asked for 18 volunteers to monitor each hole. Typically, you will only have two groups playing a hole at the same time so it can be done. The Volunteers got to eat dinner for free and get some sun. Mosley, wives and GF's volunteered and we pretty much had the same groups playing all 5 years so volunteers were not a problem. No one complained and no one ever shot under a 58 (that I recall) and I believe it kept the cheaters out of the tourney. I suppose there are better ways to do it but that worked for us.
I have a vacation spot that is on a golf course. From our deck we can see the entire green of the 13th hole that is a par three 140 yards down hill. This past June we were three during a scramble. We sat on our deck and watched for several hours while smoking cigars and having drinks. I would say about one in every three groups had a golfer hit the green from the tee. Most of the shots we saw from the tee were short of the green. There were numerous shots that went into the trees that ran along both sides of the fairways. One golfer hit the flower garden in the back of our house. We only one saw legit birdie. There were some groups that never actually putted after their ball hit the green. They had very long putts for par and would just pick it up. I have no idea what scores they posted. The next morning my nephew searched the strip of woods that ran along the side of the fairway closest to our house. In no time he came back with 27 balls. There were a few old ones, but most were brand new. There were a lot Pro V1s, some Calloway Chrome Soft, a few Bridgestones and Vice, and a couple of range balls.
Golf scrambles are ridiculous. Played in 5 this year and realized i will never do it again. Never did better then 2nd flight and had good golfers with me and always some team with people who dont golf always ends up shooting 12 14 under while groups of good golfers are getting -6 and -8.
If good golfers were shooting -6 and -8 they werent that good.
The one scramble I play in doesn't have any type of gimmick. We have a 2 minute rule on looking for a lost ball and once you are 2 over you pick up your ball. The closest thing that I saw to cheating were kids that are on their school's golf team playing from the ladies tee and I am just hoping that my drive makes it PAST the ladies tee. I go to the tournament with at least 40 balls because I play so bad. My team, this year, came in last. At one point he had hit a couple of good balls and were upset that might take us OUT of last place. LOL.
We’ve a 2 ball amateur team turn in a score of 61 in gale force wind rain pro-am when the pros were shooting 3 and 4 over.
I use to play 4 man scramble at a former employer event. Its was only a 9 hole event. But each team had to use all 4 players tee off at least once.
I also just played a scramble a month ago. We played a Bogey is your friend. If definitely speeds up the game until you get to a par 3 hole.
My group shot a 52 in a Halloween scramble Course was shortened to 5800 yds it was personal my greatest round of golf it felt amazing walking up and accepting the top spot
Yes, yes and yes! Too many stories to tell. One is we had a big money skin game two man scramble. When we were doing the skins that were worth 3000.00 each. One group had birdied the # 1 handicap hole. It is a 400 dog leg right that you need a 250- yard drive to even see the green, then it is over a pond to a small green with lots of break. The guys who said they birdied are both 20s who can't drive the ball 225 let alone have a perfect drive and perfect second shot and make the putt even if you gave them 100 tries. The kicker is they were playing by themselves as a group did not show. We had scratch golfers who bogeyed the hole. We had no way to prove they didn't and they kept the $$$$
Amazing...we may reach out to have you share the story on a follow up pod
I play in a few scrambles a year and it’s ALWAYS the least talented looking groups shooting insane scores. Also I’ve noticed most places don’t seperate regular and senior drives for longest drive holes which always drives me nuts. The guys I’ll play with always ask why I don’t want to cheat, I always say “because it wouldn’t be fun with the amount you have to cheat”. I’m just trying to play a round of golf, get some food and have fun.
So if the amount that you would have to cheat by was less, you would be OK with cheating?
Golf scramble cheating is solved by adding a 5th-objective participant to every scramble team. Assigned by the scramble organizing committee. The 5th individual may be a playing or non-playing (just scorekeeping) volunteer. When you add that 5th person to the scorekeeping, the scores come down. The other thing to consider is the alternate ways in which scrambles are fundraisers a lot of the time. Revenue is increased thru tools that lower the scores such as purchasing mulligans, or strings for greens to expand the hole, etc..at the end of the day, scrambles should just be a fun time.
A group of friends and I play in scrambles only because they can be cheaper that a normal round at that course. We just play a normal round of golf. When people are turning in scores of 56, there's no way we were ever going to wing. I played in one where my irons on par 3's was just on that day. I hit to 12", 2ft, 4ft, and 11"s. On the last par 3 I hit the 4ft shot. I also was the last group at that hole and picked up the marker. When the winner of the closest to the hole was announced all four holes went to the same guy. He was not the closest name on the marker I picked up. So even the organizers of events cheat. Fun fact. I haven't had a par 3 day (or even two holes) like that since.
It is not just low score cheating. I’ve seen people move the longest drive and closest to the hole markers with no relationship to where their ball ended up.
When I was a kid I played on a scramble team consisting of me, my uncle Jeff, my dad, and my fathers best friend from high school. They didn’t drink booze, and they were good golfers. We played in 8-somes to stop the cheat. It was some of the best times of my life.
I made a hole in one, one time, in a scramble on that team. It was the 16th hole, the other 4 some had other friends, it was in front of the clubhouse, and it got us into a playoff that we eventually won.
Maybe my greatest personal memory…..
Today, scrambles are dead.
The last scramble I did, we were sent out in groups of 8. It was a 6 and a half hour round. I was exhausted at the end of it. It didn’t help it was a hot day on a golf course with little shade.
this is a couple of things i've always said needs to happen.. either have scrambles be 2 somes or 3 somes, and you go out in 4 somes or 6's and you keep score of the other team. another option is, you have the top 3 teams, play a 9 hole playoff vs the clubhouse Pro's team, or some of the local scratch players and if they can beat the scratch guys they win the prize... if any team doesn't want to this playoff format, they are disqualified and the next team has the option.
Played in a scramble in Norcal about 10-12 yrs ago. JBHunt was the host. Manteca Park. We know the Hunt guys and they are the hole ahead of us. My hcp was down to like 3-4 range. Carried my team and we ended up like 11-12 under. The 6th hole we catch the host team at tee on par 3. They are all absolutely f-ing hammered. They are all
laughing that they just got their 1st birdie on last hole. So we finish. I’m taking my clubs to car before we meet to eat. One of the guys in Host group is sitting on the gate of his p/u and looks like he has a scorecard. I start fuming. Sure as $hit we go in and they announce scores…JBHunt team turns in -17 score. 11-12 didn’t win but the teams that seemed to turn in honest scores got cheated. Lost total respect for those folks that day. Every time I had to deal with them after that had a bad taste in my mouth.
I have played in a number of these scrambles for charity or in a group of retired guys. I really have come to hate how you can "buy" mulligans and other misc. stuff! That's not golf!! I would like to see a scramble done where each group must pay a modest amount for a "caddy" that goes along with your group and scores unbiased and truthfully and maybe helps out with rules where to drop or what have you. That would fix it and caddies would sign up to be one because they would get paid.
I play in a yearly scramble in Wisconsin. They have a putting raffle at the turn. You can buy 3 putts for $5. As many as you want. For each putt made your name gets put in a raffle jar. At the end, the winning name gets half the total money collected. To make things fair for everyone, 1st, 4th, 8th and 12th places are awarded prize money. All ties are rolled back to the hardest hole score. Can't tell you how many times we lost because we were 3rd or 7th or 10th place. Makes for a fun scramble. 😊
This is an old problem and nobody can fix it but the club. I can share from my own experience. Sandbaggers (good players with high handicaps) should be known to the pro. If you get out on a muni course then there is not much hope. If you play a tourney without a handicap you still have the issue of flights. I've seen ridiculous scores for the 1st/2nd flight better than the championship flight.
The small town I live in has a very nice municipal golf course. There are several fund raising tournaments throughout the season - volunteer fire department, high school sports etc. Fees are generally around $150 per player with a modest lunch provided and a raffle after the event. I decided not to participate when the winning gross scores were at or near 50 ( par 72) and net scores ( 25% handicap) were around 44 - 46. As you are commenting, no one in the group has the game for those scores. Sad .
I played in a scramble a month ago after some severe storms. Course was absolutely soaked. 30-40 mph winds and occasional rain. I played with 3 coworkers that can barely hit the ball. I play well. We shot 74. Winning team shot 57.
I’ve played in many and a lot of times the group in front of us is never in the fairway, never long, having to take drops from going in the drink, hitting out of green side bunkers all round long. Somehow…they manage to win by 6 strokes. It’s a miracle I tell you.
Played in a scramble in Dallas area. Guys with the cargo shorts carded -26. There were lots of gimmicky holes, but come on!
Played in these for decades. Charity ones where these goofy string, mulligans, games to go to front tees, shoot a cannon ball, etc. These get some crazy scores but it's not legit entirely. Plus, have played legit 4 person events with straight up scoring. It takes a long time but the most fair is teams play together. 8 people. Almost always these are on 9 hole courses. Best score we had of four players (player range +3-4 hcp to 3-4 hcp) shot -20. A couple drivable par 4s, reachable par 5s. Same 9 hole course twice. It was a playoff as both paired up teams (8) had that score, won on first playoff hole (Par 5) eagle over a birdie. Places can do an automatic 2 putt rule to move things along. Folds of Honor a couple weeks ago we did that as there were 136 players. Winning score was -14.
I've played in a couple of charity scrambles recently. In one, the winning team shot 48, 10 shots better than second place. The next one, the winner shot 51. 6 better than second place. We play honestly, so no chance of winning. But I did win $100 for closest to the pin in the second tournament. So that was fun.
My first 3 best ball scrambles 20 years ago were won by teams claiming 21, 20 and 18 under and there were no holes that you could buy a shot or pay to have ball on green for second shot on par 5. Straight up 18 holes of best ball only. My team was at par for one and 2 under for two, and together as a four man team we were better than most. The last best ball I did 3 years ago for a Church charity the winning score was even par and my group got second at 2 over par and there was a hole that you could buy a birdie, buy a putt for double eagle on a par five and buy a birdie put from 8 feet on a par 3. I remember thinking we were going to be last at 2 over even after I heard the organizers say we had a good score. They actually knew what they were talking about as they had put it on for the past 3 years. All 4 of those best balls were played on the same course which is considered quite difficult for the average golfer. We thought there was cheating going on 20 years ago so I am not at all surprised by this. Granted, myself and my group 3 years ago was not very strong, but we were still only a couple shots off of from two of those previous best balls.
Cheating was commonplace 30 years ago. Cheating in the scramble, closest to the hole and long drive contest. I've seen it all a whole lot. I have called people out about cheating. It never does any good.
This is crazy because I was just thinking about this. I was in a scramble and the top team got a 43. Standard course. Two cheats. 1. On two holes you got to tee off from the reds and 2. You got like 30 foot of string that you could measure out the string and cut it off, and then it was like it went in. So for a 5 foot put, they would have 25 foot of string left after using 5. I still think that is impossible though. If DeChambeau and Sergio can’t break 50 in best ball, how in the world can someone hit a 43, even with those cheats? Essentially every whole, your second shot would have to be 2-3 feet from the hole.
On the flip side a couple counter points. Not all tourneys are rigged. Our church did a 27 player scramble and my group shot two under. I thought we would be crushed. There are a lot of solid golfers that played. We got third. First was only 5 under. So not everyone cheats.
Second, you can’t totally base the score off handicap. These days I have around a 30 handicap (because I don’t cheat) and I am really inconsistent. However, I have done really well in scrambles because I am a really good putter, and sometimes I make an amazing iron shot (which really is what keeps me going). But I have never won a scramble. If I was in a scramble where I got to take all four shots myself, I bet I could post a really low score.
It is weird though, I am very competitive in everything I do, and for scrambles I just go out to have fun, and it is always fun. Probably because I realize I have no shot at winning.
I played in a 9 hole charity tournament today. My team of fairly competent golfers shot 3 under for a 33. The winning team posted a 15 under 21 for 9 holes. The second place posted an 11 under 25. I call BS on all of it.
Long ago, a good friend of mine and golf pro, he and I played in a scratch doubles "better ball" tournament. At the time I was a +3.4 handicap and he was something around a +4.5 handicap. Yes, we were both sub-par players at the time. He and I both had a fantastic day that day, both playing one of the best rounds of the year, shooting a scratch 58 together. We were ecstatic over the round we had. Even for us that was an absolutely tremendous round. And then we found out that 2 other guys, 10 and 15 handicap players, also shot a scratch 58 round. The head pro of the course, also a friend of mine, allowed their score to stand but warned them, "never come back here to play a tournament again, you cheated". Obviously we could not prove they cheated, but come on, there is NO WAY a 10 and 15 handicap player scored a scratch 58 in this "better ball" tournament. That is impossible. It was unlikely enough that a +3 and +4 handicap team scored a scratch 58 (we did, and did NOT cheat). My head pro friend absolutely believed my buddy and I scored such a great game (he knows our playing well) but absolutely did not believe the other team. It was clear, they cheated. And our scratch score was 7 strokes better than the next best of the field. Oh, and FYI, my playing partner and I suggested a playoff to break the tie, funny thing, they wouldn't agree to it. Wonder why....
Last two weeks have played 4 man Texas scrambles at my club, last week off the yellows it was won with a score of 51 with a team Handicap Of 5, we thought we had played OK to come in with a net 60 (-12 to par) with a team ten handicap, with individual handicaps ranging from 15-20.
This week off the whites winners had a 52, out of the field of 40 teams 20 had a score of 60 or lower. We shot 59 which was genuine and we did leave a few shots out in the course, such as not sinking birdie putts from 12 feet with 4 attempts.
People grumble about manipulating handicaps, but if you have 4 golfers all 2 handicap playing home course you could expect them to hit birdies on most holes so a low 50’s is going to be the winning score. Our club sets no rules as to mixing the group with a range of handicaps etc.
our two rounds were genuine no given putts etc and we could have with luck shot a low 50’s as well.
If you think cheating going on maybe have to have a marker go with each group
I played in a scramble this past weekend and we had windy conditions than a torrential rainfall halfway through the round and the winning team shot 16 under.
I played a scramble in the spring and the winners were claiming a -16 and we were pretty sure they were doing at least a little cheating. It’s a game of honour and it can’t feel good to turn in a shady score. I think the key is to not give a big prize to the winners and just have KP for money with a spotter and maybe a long drive and longest putt holes. The -16 people made a couple hundred bucks each so I saw the incentive. Take away the ease and incentive of cheating and then people will just try to play well and have fun like they should. The exact middle score should win the biggest prize.
The club I belonged to had a team that ALWAYS came in 10-15 minutes after all the other scores were posted. And they always miraculously scored 1-2 strokes lower than the next low score. The prize money paled in comparison to the calcutta money. The pro knew, but didn't have the stones to stand up to them. I quit the club, but that didn't fix the problem.
i play a few scrable events a year where you play through with another random team and it seems to work well, round isnt much longer and the other team keeps an eye on your score.
The only scrambles I enjoy these days are amongst my leagues at the end of the yr. We randomly put 2 teams of 2 together, divide up the handicap, and play a course that isn't our league course, so it's honest guys, no one cheats, and it's a course we don't play every week
The missus and i were entered in a two person captains choice, and we had a terrible 1st day (91 IIRC), and the second day we shot an amazing 76, which bounced us out of our flight, fair enough...I did win a closest to the pin prize, and asked the team playing with us to verify my measurement, they declined, saying 'great shot'...but in other scrambles my regular partner and I won our flight twice, and one other closest to the pin prize...we never worried about winning, or even hitting a rare great shot, as we always knew inevitably someone else would pencil whip us...enjoy the pretty day with a friend, or missus...
This is how we play scrambles in Australia ... Whoever shot you select that person dose'nt hit this continues till the green then all 4 putt ... it certainly helps with cheating but I think handicaps are still are open to being manipulated in some cases
I was on a team that went 22 under. When we handed in the card...the organizers called bs. The group behind us come in and asked...that was amazing...how low did you go?!?! I was a 7 and long drives playing with 3 scratch guys.
What we’ve had to do in our area in WA state is put two foursomes together and make them swap score cards. That way the two teams keep each others scores. Cheating had gotten out of control during big money tournaments, so we had to do something.
The last scramble I played in the winning team won with a 46. It's been bad for decades in the flighted club championships too. One guy I knew told me that the reason he consistently won club championships and big $ matches was because he had a well-manicured handicap. The handicap system is kind of silly at this point
In foursomes, the initial shot on each of the 4 par 3s must be done by a different player in the foursome. So if A, B, & C are on the green, but D is in a bunker, you may want to use D's shot, because who knows what will happen on the remaining par 3s, and you'll probably get up and down from the bunker.
If you use a player's drive, that player cannot hit the next shot; only the other 3 players on the team can hit the next shot. After that, all four players can play shots on that hole.
I really think ALL scrambles need a volunteer scorekeeper walking with each group. I competed in an event in Lexington, KY, par 72 course - one reachable par 4, 3/4 par 5s were easily reachable. Now gimmicks were given, you could buy a max of 8 mulligans per team, and you're given a 3' string (which I believe was not properly explained it's "proper" usage). My team made 3 eagles, 13 birdies for a score of 53. We eagled 2 of the par 5's and the reachable par 4. the winning team shot 46, with another team shooting 48, and 3 other teams beating our score of 53. And I'm just scratching my head thinking, there's no way...
We won a four man recently with a 57. We had a 20, 10, 1 (me) and scratch. No one believed that we didn't cheat. I probably won't play anymore scrambles just because of all the crap you catch for having a good day. It's not a good feeling standing there knowing everyone in the room thinks you're a cheater. Friends are always recruiting me for scrambles but I will probably politely decline from now on. So yeah, I guess cheaters have ruined scrambles.
My group played on a scramble recently, and followed a group that couldn’t hit it more than 100 yards. They were all hackers. We had to wait on every shot. Then when they called up the group that shot 18 under to win, this group walked up. We all about fell over!
How about the concept of Scrambles become Shambles? Best drive of the 4 players all players hit from that spot (every player has to use at least 2 of their drives). Then you play your own ball to finish the hole. The two best scores count for the final team score.
I quit playing scrambles, just a joke. Basically the same as men’s night. I just donate to the charity
I have a corporate scramble coming up later this week. Last year’s winning score was a -19 by a group of 60+ guys. Now I’m not saying it can’t happen in a scramble… but the course/tee box we were playing was nearly 7000 yards with 73.4/136 rating. My group finished -8. I’m not saying we’re long hitters but I think I’m slightly above average with a 108mph swing speed. A couple guys in my group (friends of mine) are slightly faster at 110+. One guy is a single digit handicap, we had a 20 something handicap and me and the last guy are around a 12. I’m sorry but there’s no way the winning group birdied the longer par 4s. I’ll give them the 5s, but some of the par 4 holes were just under 500yards. One of them was a straightforward 480 to the pin but tree lined, narrow and protected by bunkers. 2nd hardest hole on the course. Absolutely no way they hit the gir. I didn’t get a clear view of them swinging but spotted them on a 210yard par 3 and some had driver in hand and the others weren’t holding irons. I’m thankful for the day off work and a round on the company’s dime but I’d rather match play in my own group if the tournament doesn’t mean anything.
the only way i can see of 'policeing ' a golf tourneyment is to have streaming cameras 3 or more to a hole, and recorders for each and a computer program to search and find ( follow ) each group throughout their round of play. that way when a group comes in with a low score its possible to see how they got it.
( or how they cheated )
jeffrey rayborn wausau, wisconsin - golf player- not regular best round = 9 holes 44 , usual round last year 55. one time was in a dolf scramble thru work - my group was formed om the day from people who worked in different areas of the company. 1 guy had never played before but was athletic. after 5 minutes on the range he could hit a ball in a forward direction! LOL my group won 3 individual things. the guy who never played before one a longest put for his totally lucky 20 foot put. on the par 5 hole was a longest drive- that one of our team won, and on the par 3 one guy got closest to the hole with a lucky shot that was 4 inches . the guy who never played before, a week later had to pay the golf course for ruining the clubs he used. and all of us we astounded! because we saw all his hits all day long and he never did anything to the clubs he used to cause them to be deformed! the following 6 years the company had any golf outings our 4 people protested and never went. and every year i heard about things that ruined golf for other groups.
i understand your 'cheating' you talk about is against the players. but please dont forget about the disreputable things done to players in nearly every tourneyment also !
When I play scrambles I expect the cheating so I don’t even stress, I just go out to have fun and enjoy the ride to be honest. It’s fun watching and hearing all the talk at the end of the scramble bc people know exactly who cheated and who didn’t. It’s all fun at the end of the game.
I have only won one scramble and it was due to the team I got paired with they were good players, so no credit to me 😂 it was definitely cool watching those guys just kill it on every hole
But sometimes you can buy string or buy mulligans for fun and more money. If there are huge prizes you would have to do eightsomes. Most scrambles I played the prizes were raffles at the end.
I’m a female golfer who hits the ball pretty long. I’ve had guys invite to be a part of their scramble because I get to hit from the forward tees. I would hit a shot into the fairway, then they would let it rip knowing they could play my shot ,which was always in the middle of the fairway, if their shots went into the woods.
We play one man scrambles against another person doing the same thing. Play 2 balls each, your best ball. No handicap, No giveaway shots. We play it on the sim, fast game score stays low with some skill.
The newest thing, at least for me, is where the institution running the event has everyone log into an account and track your scoring that way. This has led to cheaters waiting to see what the leading team is scoring and then track their scores. This is usually a 25+ handicap team beating a 5-10 handicap team. I've decided to just enjoy the game/opportunity to play with some friends and have no concept of actually winning. The sad part is most of the time I'm playing in "charity" events.
If you mix handicaps and scrambles, you might as well just give your money away. My rule is, if you play scrambles for money, you put 8 on a box, blind draw and keep each other's score. If a 2 man, 4 man to a box. Best way is to have a non-playing score keeper with each group. I am even seeing this trickle into Member Guest events.
Had to chime in! I just played in a fundraiser over the weekend. Out of my foursome, 3 of us around par regularly, 2 of us played mini tours back in the day and one shoots around 80 but pounds it. We played a pretty difficult public course with tough conditions, course got a lot of play and was rough, especially the greens plus a 15 to 25 mph wind. We shot 58, 14 under, 12 birdies and an eagle. All the pars was us missing 10 to 20 foot birdie putts, greens got us.
The “winners” shot 18 under, you should’ve seen these guys! Even they were embarrassed! Somehow we came in 3rd!?
@@Dodgers84912 seems about right. Buying mulligans and string and gummies and…
This has been my experience in every charity/scramble or work event I've ever played in.
They made more putts than you
Oak harbor Ohio 6 man had someone sitting at every green 22 to 24 wins it. Very tough pins 5 paces on a few greens. Straight up cash no charitys.
Most scrambles down here in Australia we have what we call a rodeo .... each player must use min of 4 tee shots. Focus is always getting that out of the way for the worst players ASAP.
IN RESPONSE TO YOUR QUESTION: YES! Buying Mulligans, using string for closer putts, hitting the green against the pro gets you an ace on the hole and the list goes on and on. Hell I even play one with corn hole, if you got the bags in the hole, you took a stroke off each hole. It hurt's the scramble and with prices getting so high, I pass on the invites!