As an owner of off course golf shop. After any fitting that requires new shafts, I ask my customer if they would like their old shafts back or if I can keep them to donate to junior golfers who cannot afford such shafts. Great way to help young golfers improve their equipment.
As a person who doesn’t trust many people, I’d also ask for the discount up front, knowing that you’d donate the shaft free and clear. You can claim the difference to charity on your taxes, but I’d never know. Thank you for your good deed, but this world is evil…not saying you are.
Happened to me years ago. Got so sick and tired of being bent over that I started building my own clubs. Went out and purchased all the equipment to build clubs and have never looked back. I also help my friends out with their club issues fir free. I do it not to make money but because I love Golf!
I do all kinds of club work for family and friends. Obviously I build to the best quality cause im not rushing a job. They tend to pay green fees for me when playing together.
Most people don't realize that it is not very difficult once you understand the concepts the Mobile Clubmaker and a couple of others teach. It does require a minimum investment on basic equipment though.
Great video. I recently got fitted @Club Champion for TaylorMade p770 irons and the bill sheet including the irons shafts grips puring Etc was $2,400 I said thank you, I have to think about it. Paid my $150 fitting fee, went online and look for a shaft with a similar profile and weight in an oem offering and was able to get my irons 4-PW for $1,300 new. +cost of the grips($70). That's $1,000 saved. Keep up the good work with this good info.
I actually tell people to do this all the time. Get fitted by someone who can tell you what shaft/clubhead might work best for you and go find the set online without their markup lol. Good on you for that!
I did the same thing @ Club Champion.... Had a full bag fit & really enjoyed it. Took the build sheet and bought everything online and had it assembled locally and saved $2500 from their quote
This is why they charge money for a fitting. That said, I got fitted at club champion right after things reopened for covid. Total sales job. Has me warm up with my driver keeps all shots including bad. The with the one he picks cuts all and shots (i.e. Only keeps good ones) and barely made a difference. 3 out of the 4 clubs he should have told me the difference was so random would recommend coming back and he might have sold me the one club that worked.
had a similar situation but with a different turn out originally the build sheet was 2800 for irons told them that was a no go. came in for second half an my fitter had found a company I believe it was tgw that offered my recommended shafts heads an grips as on "oem" option dude saved me 1500 dollars which lead to me buying them as well as my wedges an new putter from the money he saved me. even after the three additional clubs an still came out 600 cheaper than the original price for just irons.
I was a fitter myself for 10 years. Here is the best thing to do. If ur getting fit inside, Bring your own club and bring your own golfball that you play with. That way you can compare apples to apples. Also, 80% of the people I fit really would have benefited more from spending 500$ on lessons instead of a new driver. Keep that in mind. Why buy a 500$ driver to fix ur slice, when u can just get lessons and then hit everything straight?
Most club pros dont care and are not good teachers. Lets not forget the ridiculous cost per hr for a guy thats just rushing you through to get back in the clubhouse a sit down on it
The worst part, and Club Champion was notorious for this, is the spiff shaft. I had a student I was teaching win a gift cert. there and was all excited because he'd never been "professionally fitted". This dude has him hit 10 drivers and then gives him this shaft and he hits it and the numbers were marginally better and he exclaims, "We found it!" He wouldn't let him hit another shaft because that was "the one!" I couldn't believe it! He won the G.C, so it wasn't like he could go get a refund. It was later found out they were getting paid under the table by Aldila and Harrison. He had a Harrison shaft in his driver. Thanks for this informative video!
Dear EFG/MC, you NAILED this video!! I received a gift certificate to Club Champion. I thought I had done my homework before the fitting and then got taken to the cleaners... I purchased a partial set of irons for 110% of what I would have paid for a full set of the same clubs directly from the manufacturer. I got lost in Trackman data and didn't understand little things like a 12-degree difference between my clubs and the clubs they put in my hands. This video is MUST WATCH viewing before anyone goes to their first fitting. The PGA, R&A, and USGA should each post a link on their websites!
I’ve had all sorts of fittings in my life, from local pros to the OEM to the boutiques like Cool Clubs and Club Champion. My opinion is that the best fitters are 1) local pro or person at your local golf course that you trust, or if you’re lucky enough to be close by, 2) the OEM. I got fit at Callaway once and it was a great experience. The person didn’t push any upgrade shafts, which there was no incentive, because you don’t buy direct from them anyway. Club Champion was an experience and I wish this video came out 3 years ago. I bought an exotic shaft for my driver, which, to be fair, I really like and the guy didn’t try to convince me I also needed a new driver. I got a new hybrid, but still don’t understand why they matched the shaft to the iron shafts they recommended instead of the stock which is in my other hybrid, which the fitter said I hit great. The dumbest thing I went with was an exotic shaft for a 3W. Why did I not think to myself, why do I need an aftermarket shaft for a club I may hit twice in a round? But the irons were the worst. I hadn’t intended on getting irons, but gosh I was hitting them so well. With the specialty shafts and the puring, I don’t want to think about how much I spent. Oh yeah, the puring. I’ve bought it 2 different times. Don’t buy it. It’s a waste of money.
I am a professional fitter myself one of my biggest questions I ask is if they want to go full custom or OEM. Always explain the differences between the two but biggest thing is being able to find the right set of clubs within the budget and play better golf. Word of mouth is huge and clubs aren’t cheap. Never screw over the client
Worse practice I have seen is say you want a new driver you take yours with you they say hit it for base numbers then they fit you into a new driver and you are getting say 40 yards more, but what you don't know is when hitting your driver they have whatever software they are using set to low altitude, cold weather wind against wet fairways or a combination of those, then when you get fit for your new expensive driver they change it to high altitude hot weather dry fairways wind with. So yes you see massive gains unfortunately you will not see them when your lovely new driver makes its debut on the course. A friend of mine quit his job because he was told to do this.
Good information. I am now a 4 handicap golfer, who used to work for a golf club manufacturer. Your information is right on the mark. I don’t know of too many golfers who would gain any noticeable advantage by transitioning to an exotic brand component vs. a quality standard brand. Unless you are tour quality. Spend your time on getting the correct specs on your putter first, wedges, then driver.
The voice of experience. A 4 handicapper can probably find the center of the face more often than not. This is the key element of a proper fitting. Scratch or better is where a small alteration can make a consistent 1 or 2 stroke difference. There are many factors that get a player into "tour territory", and they often have nothing to do with the equipment. My son is in the process of learning this, and it's a pleasure to witness.
Like many others here I went to a fitting @CC. For my iron build I was quoted $2300. Oddly enough it was with one of the stock shaft choices, but I was still quoted for the shafts separately. I ordered direct from the manufacturer for $800. A friend went through the same experience. Thanks for shedding light on this and hopefully more watch this video before being taken advantage of.
@@TheAverageAngler Maybe. I was thinking 30% but I may be underestimating how much people are willing to spend on golf. And the fact that these prices keep going up must mean people are paying, so your 50% might be right on the money.
At least they let you hit stock shafts. My Club Champion refused to let me hit stock shafts as they're no good. Funny how Dynamic Gold is a stock shaft and is by far and away the most used shaft on Tour, where they can use what ever they want and they choose terrible $25 stock shafts. Club Champion is a joke. The worst thing ever for TXG, but Ian's getting paid big bucks... it's just sad TXG is gone.
As a fitter from a large retailer in Canada, I have only fit I think 1 customer in the last year into an upcharge shaft. I always try to fit to no upcharge. I've had lots of customers ask about "exotic" shafts but more often than not they dont need it. I did fit myself into an upcharge shaft but I did my research and knew that it would work well. I loved the video thank you very much.
Nice one! Thank you for the heads-up! I'm going through the mind melt that is getting fitted by all of the manufacturers who have visited my club with their vans, and now I'm in a head scramble with it all! Between my pros not even knowing how to set up a demo 7i, to the fitters getting my fit wrong, or suggesting a club I hate, or just asking me to place an order there and then when I'm clearly not impressed, and all of the searching online through all of the dozens of other options, I'm really needing an honest fitter who will just listen to me and only have my interests in mind. As we say here in bonny Scotland: I'm not buttoned up the back! To find real honesty in this mainly corporate world that we all now live in I think is rare, sadly! The search continues! Anyone in Scotland that can offer a trustworthy fitter tip, please go ahead!
I’m a scratch golfer but haven’t bought new equipment in years until 2022. Tried a bunch, tried shafts, and ended up fitting in to a stock shaft. Didn’t know it at the time. It was Uinta Golf so not a Club Champion type fitter. But still nice to see that I performed just as well in a stock vs premium shaft. Nice to have no upcharge too lol😂. Great video!
I work in club repair and fittings. I always try and be upfront and honest with customers from the start. People are shocked when I save them money because I stop them from making an impulsive choice or correct equipment they are using.
just went for a fitting at club champion and the fitter was doing exactly what you are saying. for a company who claims that they don't care about your purchase of equipment, their fitter seems to still care about the sale ( maybe they still earn commission?) just really disappointed. thanks for shining a light on this AJ
I got pureing done many years ago on a shaft I fitted myself from Golf Works. Just so happened to be a shaft I have used ever since, purely because it was a fit for my swing! Took me years to verify by testing everything else, it was not the pureing, it was the shaft! I have to agree!
Good points. We need to stop over thinking this fitting stuff. In most cases we can find a stock offering at no up charge that will work very well. Or at least at a smaller up charge. There are often several shafts at different flexes to choose from. If you don’t get paid to play golf, be careful about the shaft rabbit hole.
Good video, thank you. Unfortunately, where I live in New Zealand, proper club fitters are very limited and scarse. They will be nothing like you may get in the US. There are no fitters for specific brands, eg. Titleist fitter or Ping fitter. We ate too small and too far away. 😮
This is amazing information, these things have happened to me three times, Twice by CC and once by True-specs. This is why you really can not trust club fitting.
This is an amazing video and spot on. I think I've had a fitter bring out a bunch of exotic shafts that I probably didn't need. I'm now suspicious they did a lot of the other same things you talked about. There were some positive things I got out of my past fittings but the negatives I've experienced make think I'll never pay for a custom fitting again.
I can't tell you how much I wish I had seen this video before going to Club Champion for a driver fitting. It has been an extremely disappointing and frustrating experience. My wife surprised me with a CC gift certificate for a full bag fitting. I was using a 12 year old Taylor Made driver, so I elected to start out with just a driver fitting;. Went through the whole fitting routine.swaping out a variety of heads and shafts finally coming down to a Taylor Made head and a Titleist head each with the same Mitsubishi C6 shaft. Although I liked the feel of the Taylor Made a little better, the fitter convinced me that the Titleist was the better fit. then I saw the build sheet (the embodiment of your first dubious practice). I pointed this our to the fitter who said that he doesn't know anything about the corporate pricing practices, but this was just how it worked out. He also gave me all the reasons that buying the individual components on my own was, in his opinion, a bad Idea. So I just went ahead with the purchase, using the remaining balance of the gift certificate toward the purchase. When the driver arrived` after seven weeks, I took it out to the range and then the fun really began . To make a long story short, it just didn't work. Not only was it not as long as my 12 yer old gamer, I couldn't keep even reasonably in play. After several range sessions and a couple of attempts to play with it, I went back to CC. The fitter made some "adjustments " to the club and Magically, back on their launch monster It seemed to outperform my old club as well as the Taylor Made that was the other finalist.. OK so I went back out to the real world and guess what - still no go. Worst club in my bag. I can't keep it in play and even my 4 wood goes further in the real world. This really had me baffled until i brea Derek Shrrock's comment. Now I am really suspicious . All I can say at this point is buyer beware.
The only fitting I ever had was from Club Champion and it was the absolute worst fitting possible. He refused to even let me hit "stock" shafts. Gave me this big spiel about stock shafts having 2 bends and premium shafts have 3 bends. He only had me test 1 shaft flex (soft butt), which through hours and hundreds of balls later I've determined is the absolute worst bend profile for my swing. I would take one swing with a bunch of iron heads and he'd change them out on me. I never hit more than 1 ball per combination/adjustment. The driver fitting went nowhere, I was hitting slices 200 yards and I told him it felt way wrong and I hit my 3W way farther. He asked me how far and I said 270 and he said there's no way you hit your 3W 270. I said I do it all the time on the course. And he scoffed. I asked to try like HZRDUS or other stock shafts and he said No. Only the OBAN fits my swing...which obviously didn't by the shot data. We moved to putter, he looked at my PLD Anser, then asked me if I had hit mallets and why didn't I buy a mallet, they're more forgiving. I told him I don't hit mallets good, but my blade is always pretty good and I make a lot of putts but never make any with a mallet. He scoffed again, and said "We'll see what SAM says."... whatever that meant. So he told me to hit a bunch of balls to warm up. I hit 3 straight in hole, then he yanked my putter out of my hand and said okay, hit 8 more and it will track the data. I hit 6 putts all went in, the 7th I tugged my arms and pulled it left, the 8th went in the hole... the Computer pulled up the result and it said my swing fit a blade... he said my putter is the wrong face balance and I need 60 degree, he then walked around the room looking for a putter that has that angle and could not find a single one... he then gave up on me and started doing other stuff. I still had wedge and wood/hybrid fitting included in my fit as it was a full bag. I went and pulled my 3W out of my bag and started hitting balls messing around as he wasn't helping me. And guess what... I hit it 270 yards. So I told him look and he said there's no way that's your 3W that's the driver we fit. I said no, I didn't hit a single ball that far with the driver and I just hit 3 balls with my 3W... the last 3 balls on the data and they all went straight and 260+... He scoffed again and said Well I didn't see it so I don't believe that was your 3W...
Went to a driver fitting and got a decent deal and purchased the driver. Went back to the same place for an iron fitting, the cost was $500 more than retail because of their installation upcharges - Just as you said. I paid the $50 fitting fee and left. Purchased the same clubs direct from a retail store.
I also used CC for my iron fittings, and wanted to correct my last comment to read 6 new Fujikaru Sakura iron hybrid/iron shafts for ($513) when they sold online for $35 per shaft ($210). The only other shaft used in my fitting comparison was Accra I-Series.
People need to be more aware of what can happen in these more high end fittings. I have seen too many occasions where people are led into certain shafts that aren’t available from the club companies thereby forcing them to buy from the fitter if they want that shaft. And as you mentioned fitter MSRP seems to be very different from retail MSRP.
This video was so helpful and informative. I am thinking about new clubs and your recommendation suggesting that you only stick with OEM shafts or OEM provided upgrades makes so much sense. Since there is no perfect shaft there should be a couple of shafts that will work for you.
Did the $100 dollar full bag fitting promo at club champion, walked away getting fit for a Speeder NX 60 S and they wanted close to $600 dollars for that shaft alone on top of the full price TSi3. Got fitted for a ‘club builders’ project x vrtx shaft in a ping g425 max 3 wood… and oban ct-115 x (minus) flex shafts in my same iron heads. I considered doing the iron build but after regripping it’d cost around $1000 bucks… probably not worth it as a 14 handicap. The fitting was a fantastic experience as a lesson and the guy was knowledgeable, he didn’t push wedges or a putter. At the end of the day just walked away and wish I got to try more readily available shaft options. Felt bad the guy spent 4 hours with me, basically gave me a lesson and I didn’t buy anything though! Thanks for this video.
I couldn't agree more, we are in that small percentage you referenced when I can get the OEM heads only. The fitting is detailed, the amount charged dependent on the cost component and an assembly fee only. good video
With regard to pure-ing shafts. There does seem to be some sensible science there, at least with steel shafts. I did pure a set years ago and though I was amazed at the obvious shaft dynamics which I could see during the process, my game was not at a level where it was a noticeable improvement, mostly due to an onset of health issues. ( spinal cancer)..Now, in my 70's, feeling better and getting back into this wonderful game...
THAT'S Club Champion to a tee on his 1st description.....been there 1st hand to see it on a build sheet....I didn't tell them I'm a retired PGA member.....so sad that they are not up front.....
Club Champion build sheet wanted me to spend 4000 on a set of irons (upcharge padderson kinetix for all irons) and 1000 for a driver (triple diamond sub zero callaway head with some Ventus tour issue whatever). Nope. Even the iron heads they recommended were awful. But it was a fun little trackman session for me to self diagnose my missed shots! 🤣
Spot-on video. My first ever fitting felt like I paid a manufacturer's fitter an opportunity to up-sell me their latest and greatest. I went in as a beginner wanting to purchase the manufacturer's lesser expensive line with the idea that customization is better than stock. Right off the top, he gives me their mid-line irons to try and doesn't recommend the lower-line irons. Then he recommends the premium shafts over the stock shafts. After working up the spec. sheet, for about $200 more, he can get me a special fitter's deal for their premium line. The premium line doesnt include the premium shafts so that also extra. The launch monitor was just there as a tool for him to point to some obscure number saying the recommendations are working. He's obviously incentivized to sell and trained by the manufacturer. The whole experience is such a page out of "car dealership for dummies" You go into a Mercedes Benz dealership wanting to by an A class. They let you test drive a C class, then with all the options and add-ons, it is close to an E base model. With the same options, you're paying triple what you originally wanted to spend. Now I know what they mean when they say "Kaboom baby!!". I believe getting a right fit will help, so I went to a local independent fitter. Basically he's saying my swing is inconsistent, but at minimum, x,y,z adjustments should be made.
Only been fitted 4 times and never had a bad experience or up sale, my last fitting October in Columbus ohio for Mizuno JPX 923 Hot Metals and was a great experience.
I had an excellent experience at Cool Clubs in Scottsdale. They are not cheap, but didn’t change my 3 wood at all, and just put a new shaft in my old driver, saying the new model heads were no better for me. They also basically refused to sell me a 4 iron, saying I couldn’t hit it well enough. Puring was built into their price. BTW, I used to build fishing rods, and it was standard practice to locate the spine and align it straight up or down. That is similar to puring as I understand the goal.
Glad you had a good experience there. That said, aligning a golf shaft is not the same as aligning a fishing rod because the fishing rod only flexes in one plane while a golf shaft flexes in multiple.
New golfer, went from regular to stiff shaft in my driver (which was 3 months old). My local range/par 3 course upgraded for me and reduced the price by £60 in exchange for keeping my original regular shaft. I’ll use them againas I know they won’t screw me over.
Some fitters are just looking to slam dunk you. I went to get fit for the top part of my bag, the guy was way too obsessed with Trackman numbers and not strike or feel. I personally come from a school of thought where shafts are all about feel and when it bends the right way, the golfer will sequence correctly and distance and dispesion will be a result of it. Then and only then you adjust lies and length.
Went for a True Spec driver fit a month ago (Feb ‘23) and they fit me into a UST shaft that was released in 2016. Needless to say, the shaft wasn’t even available through UST themselves any longer. Fortunately was able to find it used and in good condition from eBay, and saved $220 in the process.
So glad I found this video. Thanks. Am doing research into fitting. Was looking at club champ and was attracted by there brand neutral status (meaning I could try some wilson clubs too) but given the comments thread they are off my list now😱👍
Reminds me of one of the largest national clubfitting chains that's for sure. Good video! I will also add a red flag would be if the fitter won't allow for a short follow-up fitting to double-check the fit.
True. At least some of the fitting companies, have guarantees if you're not happy. Though I am not sure how you would ever be happy paying double what these things should cost??
The funny thing is how do you think they obtain the heads? They buy stock clubs from the manufacturer. They pull the heads put your shaft and grip you were fitted into and sell the pulls. That’s what Club Champion does.
@@shanejones8884 Or they could order your clubs with upgraded stock option shafts and non OEM branded grips uninstalled, pull the shafts, and then sell those.
This exact thing is what has kept me from getting fit. I'm super frugal and hate feeling ripped off. I don't care how much further I could hit it with a fitting with the latest year driver model when a 1 year old $200 driver I can buy off of Callaway preowned with adjustable hosel and my launch monitor allows me to experiment and figure much of it out for myself. As good as a pro fit? No way, but being "forced" to pay for not only the latest model year driver, but shafts and grips also would depress the hell out of me if I had pay $1000 for a driver. Thanks so much AJ.
Excellent video. I’ve been fitted quite a few times in my golfing career and I’ve found the following trends. When I went to big box stores, despite the fitting results, they always seemed to want to sell me the stock offering in order to move inventory. I will say that some of the big box stores have gotten better but your experience may vary lol When I was fitted in a custom shop my experience was better because they had no stock offerings or any inventory to move although that always resulted in a much more expensive club(s).
Couldn't you eliminate the risk of the disappearing shafts and heads by simply having the clubs built to your specs by the manufacturer? My last set of irons came directly from Mizuno after my fitter sent my specs and they arrived with my requested shafts and grips.
I was fitted for t300 irons this past fall at club champion also a g425 max driver and a 3wood total build sheet price was over 3400$ I ordered the exact same irons from titileist build to my exact specs same shafts n grips lie angle for 1100 shipped. And got the 3wood the same threw fairway jockey for 300$ no upcharge for shaft or grip never got the driver
Man you are absolutely correct. True specs fitted me with a shaft that I can’t even find anywhere. The Mitsubishi OT i75. The only way I can get another one is only from them… wow. I wish I watched this video be for I got fitted. Next time I am definitely ordering everything and have you install for me
Sorry you had to go through all that. Most people have no idea how shady some of these fitting companies can be. This is one of the biggest reasons I am opening my own fitting studio. There are knowledgable fittings, there are honest fitters, but almost none are both!
i was fitted after using clubs I've had for 15 years because I wanted "better" to lower my handicap. I went from the R7 CGB Max to the 2023 Stealth. No improvement, no more forgiving and no more distance whatsoever. I'm really kicking myself in the butt with how much I spent. I've had lessons and was always told to "play more golf" and that was it. I started playing in 2007 and was using my stepdads clubs from the early 90s and late 80s and was beating people who were fitted with the latest and greatest. Yeah, clubs cary but if you don't have game, you won't score good. I'm a 14 handicap and I really enjoy playing. I even play with folks with those $400 sets and they score really good for the most part.
Ive been fitting for 10 plus years for all major OEMs ...the one variable you cant acocunt for in any fitter is what fitter you get. Makes all the differenc in the world. Everyone has launch monitors and fitting shafts and heads...its how its applied
Club Champion seems to do a lot of this. The issue is that I quite like their fitting process and have had good results with the products that they've recommended. For me, it's ultimately a bit of a trade off. I typically tend to order iron sets from them at the upcharge because they do an excellent job of swing weighting the set properly. Is the swing weight worth the 25% uncharge? Probably not but it is less of a headache than pulling and tip weighting shafts from a manufacturer. For woods and putters, I always piece the clubs together myself. I was able to save about 50% doing this recently. With modern woods, it'd pretty simple to buy shafts, tips, and weight kits on eBay and get the specs you are looking for without too much fuss.
Club Champion really screwed me as well, I went telling the fitter I was just coming back into golf after a few years and didn't have the knowledge I do now about equipment or especially your first point about not receiving the original shafts/grips that came with irons. Fitter didn't fit my swing he fit 4 or 5 decent swings. After agreeing to purchase, mainly because I thought he genuinely made me think I was paying retail for everything, went online that night and saw the almost 3x retail price of my shafts that he had me put in all 8 of my irons and 2 of my wedges. Ended up wasting over 1200 on "puring" and shafts that according to the fitter, "will last you 7-8 years". Should've cancelled order after 1 business day. Another shady fine print policy they have. Will never buy clubs from any fitting chain like this again.
The thing I've noticed is club makers chasing distance, because this has become such a numbers game. Launch angle, swing speed, distance carry... A 7-iron now hits as far as a 5-iron did 15 years ago. What's wrong with that? It means you need a bag full of gap wedges to fill in for all the scenarios under 170 yrds. So that advertised set price is misleading because you are paying for clubs you don't need (4 and 5 iron) and does not include the wedges or fairway woods you probably do need.
Master fitter for a major company, I have never “pushed” upcharged shafts, if they are interested I will let them try it and see how they feel and talk about the tech the shaft offers but I never recommend it unless you have unlimited funds or are playing competitive golf.
My nephew has recently gone into Club Fitting he is a PGA pro Qualified in uk..having worked at a Private GC 5 yrs. He is now into his 3rd Mth… he can’t believe how many golfers are coming for there Fitting…from beginner to high end paying for a Full bag Fit..Wedge Fit…Driver Fit…& churning it out in 2 hrs fully Built…
Just had a Club Champion driver fitting yesterday and...yeah not sure I will be doing that again. The fitter more or less ignored/downplayed any of my input/requests/questions, didn't seem all that knowledgeable about how to read the Trackman, and was dead set on pushing Titleist products. Overhead the fitter in the bay next to us and he was pushing Titleist super hard as well. TSI2 was one of my leaders coming into the fitting--so it wasn't the end of the world--but when I mentioned I wanted to hit the G425 he was visibly annoyed. The whole thing was incredibly dubious. There are a few independent fitters I will be trying out next time before returning to a CC, that's for sure.
A great video to help people not get shafted. I bought a head second hand on eBay. I then went to get shaft fitting. I was charged £150 for a shaft that I could have bought on eBay for £90. And I’ve ended up with a shaft that is just too long.
Everyone should take heed of this video. I wanted a professional driver fitting, not one from a big box store. I thought club champion was the answer. I wasn't even offered the OEM shaft. Not knowing any better I paid over $900.00 for a Callaway Epic Flash driver. A friend of mine went there for an iron fitting. His bill was over $3000.00. Buyer beware at Club Champion!!
AJ.. been a custom builder for over 20yrs. Know how Club Champion evolved. I fit a major Japanese mfgr.. have access to 2 OEM heads only purchases. Have an idea what the unit volume is that CC etc are doing. They are buying stock uncut shafted irons grips in the box. Their shaft and grip add on is because they do not stock all the shafts they fit with. Thru pull heads, add the fitted shaft, and grips, thus their shaft upgrade. Have seen so many mis fit iron sets. From PXG as well. I fit from a Club ProShop and range. The assembly process is critical. One large OEM assembles in Mexico. Many misses. Thanks for raising the issue. It’s all about $$$.
I just went in for a driver fitting(like my head so just shaft only). The fitting cost $75. I tried probably 7-8 shafts and had told the fitter my budget, which he stuck within. Was fitted for a ventus blue tr(which I really agreed with). The shaft was msrp, and the only thing I was paying extra for was them to trim a tiny bit off and put it together(I think it was $25). Overall, only spent $25 more than I would have if I bought it myself, and the fitting fee itself was fair. I’ve heard insane stories about club champion
Very good video!! ...I tend to hit the players original club at the end again to make sure what I have come to in the fitting is definitely better I recommend so many people not to buy because either they didn't gain anything or they need to work on their swing to get more out of a purchase later (I also give them the coaching tools/ideas to help make this progress happen)
A.J., great follow-up video to your fitting video from last week. You hit a few of the issues I was thinking of. Especially the point of "the best shaft chosen from the sample provided".
Sometimes, fitters have brands like Accra (only available through fitters). The results speak for themselves. Sometimes the big $ shaft is the clear winner, Sometimes there's no winner and a stock offering is completely suitable. Don't feel pressed to buy from the fitter. The fitting fee is payment enough
Interesting comment, as I got my son fitted for his driver 2 years ago at CC, and they recommended Accra, which I went with. Now think it was not the right decision as it is 2 years later and he is not hitting it as good. But that could also be due to his body growing and getting stronger, fitted at 16, now he is 18.
@@danvandermeulen9337 2 years is an enormous difference at that age. 40-42 is nothing of note. He'll likely be fit every year until 24ish if he's playing regularly and growing (height and muscle).
Fitting sounds so intimidating. It’s like a Chinese menu with the myriad of choices. I’ve never quite understood whether there are significant differences from one manufacturer of shafts versus another. They may differ in weight but will performance be significant? I’m looking at it from the high to mid handicappers perspective. Great content. You really opened my eyes to the whole fitting world. I’m still playing 30 year old clubs and I don’t see a need to change yet. I feel like I’d pay $2k for clubs and I’ll still be a 15 handicap.
the main thing a fitter should do for most players is get them in clubs that suit them, this may be the opposite of exotic. let people buy themselves online and they want the tour spec stuff, which wont work best for the average slower swing speed. The main thing most men go for is stiff shafts because they are a REAL MAN!! my tip to you is find out your average iron and driver swing speed and then looks at what fits that,
Having component accounts is much common than you think. The people that have them though are boutique builders. Shops that only fit have a hard time getting them but if you own a build shop it’s very easy to do
You are not completely correct on issue #1 Disappearing Shafts and Grips... this from a major fitter company I'll call "CC"..... >"this is a misconception -- you aren't being charged for stock shafts/grips. We have a component account with our OEMs, which means all the heads, shafts and grips come separately. We weight sort and do all that fun stuff before the components ever make it into the shop. We aren't taking in built clubs, disassembling them and then tossing away the stock stuff - we're putting the separate pieces together. >Where this gets weird is with the OEM's pricing -- they tell their retailers what they can charge for their clubs, based on clubheads. It's called MAP (minimum advertised pricing), and we have to adhere to it. So if Mizuno says that iron costs $175, that's the cost we have to charge for the clubhead, since we cannot go below that minimum. There's no "component" cost for clubheads since we cannot sell just the head to an end customer as a standalone piece. OEMs pay pennies on the dollar for stock shafts and even grips in some cases, because they are ordering mass-produced items in massive quantities. That $175 price tag is based on the clubhead materials and technology (and probably some room in there for Mizuno to make a fair profit), not necessarily the fully assembled club, even though that's how it's presented online."
I got fitted for irons. They were ok but I never felt the clubs improved my game. Late in the season, I took my clubs to a local club maker for re-gripping and ask the vendor to check the loft and lie angle. Well, on the scoring irons, the lofts were 2 degrees flatter than my specs and the mid irons varied from too flat to too upright. I asked another fitter to check the clubs and got the same results...the clubs were not made to spec. Of course, both the vendor and the so-called quality manufacturer did not respond to my what went wrong inquiries. So, now, I'm using an old iron set I found in the family garage and my brand name, highly praised irons are for sale.
dang, where were you when i bought clubs 5 months ago. got fitted and they sold me the +1.5in shaft off the wall. Now I realize they are 1 inch too long and they f'd me... lol. getting them shortened asap.
Got fitted for TSR driver…first fitting ever for me…..surprising the driver I was fitted for was the only driver in stock at retailer….lol…turned out the club, shaft where all not the best for me…seems like they fitted me into the one driver they had in stock
Really enjoyed your video. I strongly believe in fitting, but there has to be a balance with getting what you pay for. Got my 16yr old son fitted for irons, and went to Roger Dunn since it was only paying the fitting fee plus the cost of the clubs from the OEM, whereas a premium fitter would charge $100 per shaft and then the price doubles, so that was a good experience. I am regretting a bit now that I took him to CC for his driver and went with an Accra shaft for his current Callaway head, and another guy posted below that those are only available through fitters, so I got suckered into that (wish I had this video then :)!). Besides that, he is now 18 and I don't think that shaft fits him as well now that he is taller and stronger. So a question on that...I agree that the OEMs now all offer a pretty good selection of stock and upgrade shafts, but what is your recommendation on picking the OEM? Seems like driver heads now don't have as much differentiation as they used to. Thanks!
I did a video about picking out shafts based on specs. Most important is weight, then bend profile and flex. Everything else is pretty insignificant in how it influences the shot. You can really pick any brand and they will have a shaft line that works for you. The idea that people need all these boutique random shafts that no-one knows is just wrong. I say stick to the big names you see on the tours both mens and womens. Majority of them are using Fujikura, Mitsubishi, Graphite Design, and Project X and most of those shafts are offered by the OEMs as stock or upgrade options.
@@EFGMC Thanks for the fast response. Just realized I wasn't clear in my reference to OEMs....I was wondering if you have any thoughts on narrowing the club OEM...TM, Ping, etc, for drivers, since those are all very similar now in terms of size, COR, etc. Agree with you on the shaft comments.
@@danvandermeulen9337 Like you said, spec wise they are all very close. Really comes down to what you like looking at. Callaway and Taylormade are the biggest sellers but I see the most positive feedback from Ping and Titleist drivers.
I work at a big box store and had a customer try to order his custom driver based on a fitting from that nationally advertised golf fitting company. The shaft they recommended was not even offered as an upgrade from Cobra. The way I look at it he could of bought two Oem Drivers gor what they wanted to charge him for one Driver. This was for an older high handicap golfer. To me a fitter should serve the role as consultant. The consultant should be helping you instead of just trying to over charge you. The fitting fee and retail price for the driver should be enough for compensation.
Really good points but you also have to consider "dubious" things done by the OEM. One of biggest is the OEM ventus. And that most OEMs {besides mizuno] only have a very limited amount of shafts and even more limited in covid times with ping OEM wait times taking multiple months. Theres also a lack on information for customers on what is available for fitting at different fitters (club champion not having really any stock OEM driver-hybrid shafts) and The opposite with GG/dicks only having a few exotic shafts and those being limited to specific OEMs. Even though you can order the exotics through golf galaxy, you only really have 2-6 total to try per OEM, and thats if you play stiff or X
I got fitted at Club Champion yesterday, total bill $5,090 for the whole set. I saw every single one of the practices described in the video applied to my fitting session...They quoted me the head of the Driver the same price I would pay for driver+shaft+grip...plus a $390 shaft.... same for the irons, with the shaft quoted 50% more than I can find online... I paid $400 for the fitting, and I still don't know what shaft I should buy without breaking the bank... so sad...
@@krusher74 true, however I am quite happy with the performance of the stuff I tried. I think that Buying 2nd hand and shopping around I can shave $3,000+ dollars…and doesn’t have to happen all at once…it can be my 2022 project as I improve my golf…
Hi, Don't forget the other dodgy procedure. Fitters that are Brand specific might easily modify your shot data to promote the club they are trying to sell you. Bring your own golf balls that you normally game, and get them to turn of the BALL NORMALISATION. This is a calculation that a launch monitor can make for varying types of golf ball and weather conditions when testing outdoors. It has a % slider on the set up. One of them is ball speed normalisation. He can slide this to 90% during your driver and 100% during his. Making your current driver fall short of his new driver. Getting them to turn this off doesn't stop them from being dodgy, but it does show them that you might know what you are talking about and might catch them out if they try it. Get the fitter to explain to you why the new club is better than your old one. "Better technology" & "it just works for you" are not an explanation. "Your club face strike patterns are the same in both clubs, but the newer one is more forgiving to off centre strikes because of a better distribution of mass in the club head" is a better explanation which he can prove by showing you the strike patterns on the launch data.
@@EFGMC I think the biggest handicap that most amateur golfers have is a lack of knowledge and over estimation of how complicated that data is. I take my hat off to you in doing the hard work to try and educate the masses and simplify the magic that is the game we love. Get lessons, Get educated, Get fitted and get out there and have some fun.
I thought i was getting quite well versed on this fitting thing, but finding out the fitting companies dont get bare heads from the Oems to start builds with was a shock.
Great video. I'd add when you warm up in a fitting and they keep your bad shots then just keep your best ones with their fitted product. Not apples to apples
I hate you…I needed you to send me this video before I went the Club Champion for the bend and send…you literally detailed almost my entire experience, right down to the LA Golf Tour AXS Red 85R ($175 per shaft) they stuck in my irons that suck. Unless you are ready to take control of the entire experience, don’t go to CC to get fitted…I suffered through my Titleist T200s with these LA Golf 85g shafts for 5 months and thought maybe I just completely lost my golf touch after having my hip replaced a year ago…But, on a whim, I stopped at my local Golf Galaxy, had them put together a T200 with different shafts and found my swing instantly once I put the Project X LZ 6.0 shaft in them…they are 120g!!!! Nowhere near the 85g in the LA Golf shaft…and they are much cheaper…I went back a few more times to make sure and then ordered three shafts, had them installed and did a side by side comparo with my current clubs and it’s not even close! On the upside, my driver fitting was great and I love my driver…But, I will be assembling my own clubs for a while until a absorb that unreal price I paid for my initial iron fitting…not worth it unless you are trending towards becoming a pro…go to a local mom and pop shop fitter…
Sorry you had that experience. Happens far too often. Only other thing I would say is don't assume that a better golfer will somehow get more out of that type of fitting than an average one. Same rules apply, and the same tricks used. A fitter can just as easily "fit" a great golfer into what the fitter wants, as they can with an average golfer.
Love how you’re calling all of these things out. Hate how true spec golf has their own graphite design shafts. Doesn’t matter how good the shaft is it’s a massive conflict of interest
Nice someone to say about this. I'm pretty sure you are spot on. I went to someone good and paid up for the analysis only. Then they happily reworked my dynacraft forged irons and acer woods no problem, not trying to subsidise the fitting by selling more than I need. Would be good to know what other good components suppliers there are out there, not many at all it seems.
0:14 ding ding ding, exactly, it's like going to a car dealer most of the time. Pay attention to what they are trying to get you to purchase, get a spec sheet and then study it before committing $$$. I build my own clubs now.
Club Champion is notorious for charging for each component of the club. Quoted my friend nearly 2500 for clubs he could get direct from Ping for $1200.
I just found this channel and really like what you've been doing. I've been building clubs for many years (I have the same John Kaufman frequency clamp that's on your workbench!) as a hobby and for friends, etc. but I've never had a good way to fit myself other than sort of guesswork based on current clubs and ball flight. I was thinking about going to a fitting place. This video and its predecessor where excellent in terms of giving insight into those processes. I had no idea they were basically doing shaft pulls on off-the-rack clubs to get their heads. Anyway, I have no interest in these guys making me a club, I just want to understand my swing characteristics and see if a different loft or maybe different shaft weight would improve things. After seeing your videos, I'm now thinking it might make more sense to just get a lesson with a pro with a good launch monitor and see how my current driver does(I have two shafts I could interchange for a small weight difference test). I'd get some fitting information along with some instruction for probably a similar charge as a driver fitting (with the potential sales job!). My second choice would be to go to the fitting place with very specific requests but I'm concerned that their incentives are elsewhere.
Welcome. I think if you go to any of these fitting companies and know what you want to look at, they can be helpful. You just need to steer the process to ensure that you aren't steered wrong. And of course do your buying somewhere else!
As an owner of off course golf shop. After any fitting that requires new shafts, I ask my customer if they would like their old shafts back or if I can keep them to donate to junior golfers who cannot afford such shafts. Great way to help young golfers improve their equipment.
if i was your customer I would be ok with this as long as you take the value of said shaft off the price of my newly built club.
Good idea.
As a person who doesn’t trust many people, I’d also ask for the discount up front, knowing that you’d donate the shaft free and clear. You can claim the difference to charity on your taxes, but I’d never know. Thank you for your good deed, but this world is evil…not saying you are.
@@DVCasey0311then that wouldn’t be a donation would it?
@@DVCasey0311 there’s no trade in value for just shafts. Some high end shafts, maybe…. Not usually.
Happened to me years ago. Got so sick and tired of being bent over that I started building my own clubs. Went out and purchased all the equipment to build clubs and have never looked back. I also help my friends out with their club issues fir free.
I do it not to make money but because I love
Golf!
I do all kinds of club work for family and friends. Obviously I build to the best quality cause im not rushing a job. They tend to pay green fees for me when playing together.
Can we be friends.
Most people don't realize that it is not very difficult once you understand the concepts the Mobile Clubmaker and a couple of others teach. It does require a minimum investment on basic equipment though.
@@bobpegram8042 Agreed, and I also agree with petergolfer9102
There is no better feeling than to do things for yourself.
Great video. I recently got fitted @Club Champion for TaylorMade p770 irons and the bill sheet including the irons shafts grips puring Etc was $2,400 I said thank you, I have to think about it. Paid my $150 fitting fee, went online and look for a shaft with a similar profile and weight in an oem offering and was able to get my irons 4-PW for $1,300 new. +cost of the grips($70). That's $1,000 saved. Keep up the good work with this good info.
I actually tell people to do this all the time. Get fitted by someone who can tell you what shaft/clubhead might work best for you and go find the set online without their markup lol. Good on you for that!
I did the same thing @ Club Champion.... Had a full bag fit & really enjoyed it. Took the build sheet and bought everything online and had it assembled locally and saved $2500 from their quote
This is why they charge money for a fitting. That said, I got fitted at club champion right after things reopened for covid. Total sales job. Has me warm up with my driver keeps all shots including bad. The with the one he picks cuts all and shots (i.e. Only keeps good ones) and barely made a difference. 3 out of the 4 clubs he should have told me the difference was so random would recommend coming back and he might have sold me the one club that worked.
had a similar situation but with a different turn out originally the build sheet was 2800 for irons told them that was a no go. came in for second half an my fitter had found a company I believe it was tgw that offered my recommended shafts heads an grips as on "oem" option dude saved me 1500 dollars which lead to me buying them as well as my wedges an new putter from the money he saved me. even after the three additional clubs an still came out 600 cheaper than the original price for just irons.
Good job. A little leg work and you can save a ton of money.
I was a fitter myself for 10 years. Here is the best thing to do. If ur getting fit inside, Bring your own club and bring your own golfball that you play with. That way you can compare apples to apples. Also, 80% of the people I fit really would have benefited more from spending 500$ on lessons instead of a new driver. Keep that in mind. Why buy a 500$ driver to fix ur slice, when u can just get lessons and then hit everything straight?
Sometimes lessons don't help though. I've been to a lot of coaches who made my swing worse.
A £500 driver is always the answer 🤣🤣🤣
Most club pros dont care and are not good teachers. Lets not forget the ridiculous cost per hr for a guy thats just rushing you through to get back in the clubhouse a sit down on it
The worst part, and Club Champion was notorious for this, is the spiff shaft. I had a student I was teaching win a gift cert. there and was all excited because he'd never been "professionally fitted". This dude has him hit 10 drivers and then gives him this shaft and he hits it and the numbers were marginally better and he exclaims, "We found it!" He wouldn't let him hit another shaft because that was "the one!" I couldn't believe it! He won the G.C, so it wasn't like he could go get a refund. It was later found out they were getting paid under the table by Aldila and Harrison. He had a Harrison shaft in his driver. Thanks for this informative video!
Dear EFG/MC, you NAILED this video!! I received a gift certificate to Club Champion. I thought I had done my homework before the fitting and then got taken to the cleaners... I purchased a partial set of irons for 110% of what I would have paid for a full set of the same clubs directly from the manufacturer. I got lost in Trackman data and didn't understand little things like a 12-degree difference between my clubs and the clubs they put in my hands. This video is MUST WATCH viewing before anyone goes to their first fitting. The PGA, R&A, and USGA should each post a link on their websites!
I’ve had all sorts of fittings in my life, from local pros to the OEM to the boutiques like Cool Clubs and Club Champion. My opinion is that the best fitters are 1) local pro or person at your local golf course that you trust, or if you’re lucky enough to be close by, 2) the OEM. I got fit at Callaway once and it was a great experience. The person didn’t push any upgrade shafts, which there was no incentive, because you don’t buy direct from them anyway. Club Champion was an experience and I wish this video came out 3 years ago. I bought an exotic shaft for my driver, which, to be fair, I really like and the guy didn’t try to convince me I also needed a new driver. I got a new hybrid, but still don’t understand why they matched the shaft to the iron shafts they recommended instead of the stock which is in my other hybrid, which the fitter said I hit great. The dumbest thing I went with was an exotic shaft for a 3W. Why did I not think to myself, why do I need an aftermarket shaft for a club I may hit twice in a round? But the irons were the worst. I hadn’t intended on getting irons, but gosh I was hitting them so well. With the specialty shafts and the puring, I don’t want to think about how much I spent. Oh yeah, the puring. I’ve bought it 2 different times. Don’t buy it. It’s a waste of money.
As a builder and fitter this is a wonderful explanation of some of the malpractices that go on in the industry
I agree
I am a professional fitter myself one of my biggest questions I ask is if they want to go full custom or OEM. Always explain the differences between the two but biggest thing is being able to find the right set of clubs within the budget and play better golf. Word of mouth is huge and clubs aren’t cheap. Never screw over the client
Worse practice I have seen is say you want a new driver you take yours with you they say hit it for base numbers then they fit you into a new driver and you are getting say 40 yards more, but what you don't know is when hitting your driver they have whatever software they are using set to low altitude, cold weather wind against wet fairways or a combination of those, then when you get fit for your new expensive driver they change it to high altitude hot weather dry fairways wind with. So yes you see massive gains unfortunately you will not see them when your lovely new driver makes its debut on the course. A friend of mine quit his job because he was told to do this.
That is by far the most blatant practice. That business should be called out.
@@EFGMC He did call it out with head office of the company he worked for but was ignored unfortunately
@@derekshorrock594 All about the bottom line. ☹️
Good information. I am now a 4 handicap golfer, who used to work for a golf club manufacturer. Your information is right on the mark. I don’t know of too many golfers who would gain any noticeable advantage by transitioning to an exotic brand component vs. a quality standard brand. Unless you are tour quality. Spend your time on getting the correct specs on your putter first, wedges, then driver.
The voice of experience. A 4 handicapper can probably find the center of the
face more often than not. This is the key element of a proper fitting. Scratch
or better is where a small alteration can make a consistent 1 or 2 stroke
difference. There are many factors that get a player into "tour territory", and
they often have nothing to do with the equipment. My son is in the process
of learning this, and it's a pleasure to witness.
Like many others here I went to a fitting @CC. For my iron build I was quoted $2300. Oddly enough it was with one of the stock shaft choices, but I was still quoted for the shafts separately. I ordered direct from the manufacturer for $800. A friend went through the same experience. Thanks for shedding light on this and hopefully more watch this video before being taken advantage of.
I always wonder what the conversion rate is from these companies? How many people end up buying from them?
@@EFGMC I have no hard data but I’m thinking it must be in the 50% range.
@@TheAverageAngler Maybe. I was thinking 30% but I may be underestimating how much people are willing to spend on golf. And the fact that these prices keep going up must mean people are paying, so your 50% might be right on the money.
At least they let you hit stock shafts. My Club Champion refused to let me hit stock shafts as they're no good. Funny how Dynamic Gold is a stock shaft and is by far and away the most used shaft on Tour, where they can use what ever they want and they choose terrible $25 stock shafts. Club Champion is a joke. The worst thing ever for TXG, but Ian's getting paid big bucks... it's just sad TXG is gone.
As a fitter from a large retailer in Canada, I have only fit I think 1 customer in the last year into an upcharge shaft. I always try to fit to no upcharge. I've had lots of customers ask about "exotic" shafts but more often than not they dont need it. I did fit myself into an upcharge shaft but I did my research and knew that it would work well. I loved the video thank you very much.
Good for you. Plenty of good stock options to fit most golfers. Thank you for doing it the right way.
Nice one! Thank you for the heads-up! I'm going through the mind melt that is getting fitted by all of the manufacturers who have visited my club with their vans, and now I'm in a head scramble with it all! Between my pros not even knowing how to set up a demo 7i, to the fitters getting my fit wrong, or suggesting a club I hate, or just asking me to place an order there and then when I'm clearly not impressed, and all of the searching online through all of the dozens of other options, I'm really needing an honest fitter who will just listen to me and only have my interests in mind. As we say here in bonny Scotland: I'm not buttoned up the back! To find real honesty in this mainly corporate world that we all now live in I think is rare, sadly! The search continues! Anyone in Scotland that can offer a trustworthy fitter tip, please go ahead!
I wonder if I can comment this is the best real life golf content under every single one of your videos.
I appreciate it!
I’m a scratch golfer but haven’t bought new equipment in years until 2022. Tried a bunch, tried shafts, and ended up fitting in to a stock shaft. Didn’t know it at the time. It was Uinta Golf so not a Club Champion type fitter. But still nice to see that I performed just as well in a stock vs premium shaft. Nice to have no upcharge too lol😂.
Great video!
I work in club repair and fittings. I always try and be upfront and honest with customers from the start. People are shocked when I save them money because I stop them from making an impulsive choice or correct equipment they are using.
just went for a fitting at club champion and the fitter was doing exactly what you are saying. for a company who claims that they don't care about your purchase of equipment, their fitter seems to still care about the sale ( maybe they still earn commission?) just really disappointed. thanks for shining a light on this AJ
Pretty sure they are compensated in some way.
I got pureing done many years ago on a shaft I fitted myself from Golf Works. Just so happened to be a shaft I have used ever since, purely because it was a fit for my swing! Took me years to verify by testing everything else, it was not the pureing, it was the shaft! I have to agree!
Good points. We need to stop over thinking this fitting stuff. In most cases we can find a stock offering at no up charge that will work very well. Or at least at a smaller up charge. There are often several shafts at different flexes to choose from. If you don’t get paid to play golf, be careful about the shaft rabbit hole.
Good video, thank you. Unfortunately, where I live in New Zealand, proper club fitters are very limited and scarse. They will be nothing like you may get in the US. There are no fitters for specific brands, eg. Titleist fitter or Ping fitter. We ate too small and too far away. 😮
This is amazing information, these things have happened to me three times, Twice by CC and once by True-specs. This is why you really can not trust club fitting.
This video needs to be seen by more people. Thank you for posting this!
This is an amazing video and spot on. I think I've had a fitter bring out a bunch of exotic shafts that I probably didn't need. I'm now suspicious they did a lot of the other same things you talked about. There were some positive things I got out of my past fittings but the negatives I've experienced make think I'll never pay for a custom fitting again.
Happens way more often then most realize.
I can't tell you how much I wish I had seen this video before going to Club Champion for a driver fitting. It has been an extremely disappointing and frustrating experience. My wife surprised me with a CC gift certificate for a full bag fitting. I was using a 12 year old Taylor Made driver, so I elected to start out with just a driver fitting;. Went through the whole fitting routine.swaping out a variety of heads and shafts finally coming down to a Taylor Made head and a Titleist head each with the same Mitsubishi C6 shaft. Although I liked the feel of the Taylor Made a little better, the fitter convinced me that the Titleist was the better fit. then I saw the build sheet (the embodiment of your first dubious practice). I pointed this our to the fitter who said that he doesn't know anything about the corporate pricing practices, but this was just how it worked out. He also gave me all the reasons that buying the individual components on my own was, in his opinion, a bad Idea. So I just went ahead with the purchase, using the remaining balance of the gift certificate toward the purchase.
When the driver arrived` after seven weeks, I took it out to the range and then the fun really began . To make a long story short, it just didn't work. Not only was it not as long as my 12 yer old gamer, I couldn't keep even reasonably in play. After several range sessions and a couple of attempts to play with it, I went back to CC. The fitter made some "adjustments " to the club and Magically, back on their launch monster It seemed to outperform my old club as well as the Taylor Made that was the other finalist.. OK so I went back out to the real world and guess what - still no go. Worst club in my bag. I can't keep it in play and even my 4 wood goes further in the real world. This really had me baffled until i brea Derek Shrrock's comment. Now I am really suspicious . All I can say at this point is buyer beware.
The only fitting I ever had was from Club Champion and it was the absolute worst fitting possible. He refused to even let me hit "stock" shafts. Gave me this big spiel about stock shafts having 2 bends and premium shafts have 3 bends. He only had me test 1 shaft flex (soft butt), which through hours and hundreds of balls later I've determined is the absolute worst bend profile for my swing. I would take one swing with a bunch of iron heads and he'd change them out on me. I never hit more than 1 ball per combination/adjustment. The driver fitting went nowhere, I was hitting slices 200 yards and I told him it felt way wrong and I hit my 3W way farther. He asked me how far and I said 270 and he said there's no way you hit your 3W 270. I said I do it all the time on the course. And he scoffed. I asked to try like HZRDUS or other stock shafts and he said No. Only the OBAN fits my swing...which obviously didn't by the shot data. We moved to putter, he looked at my PLD Anser, then asked me if I had hit mallets and why didn't I buy a mallet, they're more forgiving. I told him I don't hit mallets good, but my blade is always pretty good and I make a lot of putts but never make any with a mallet. He scoffed again, and said "We'll see what SAM says."... whatever that meant. So he told me to hit a bunch of balls to warm up. I hit 3 straight in hole, then he yanked my putter out of my hand and said okay, hit 8 more and it will track the data. I hit 6 putts all went in, the 7th I tugged my arms and pulled it left, the 8th went in the hole... the Computer pulled up the result and it said my swing fit a blade... he said my putter is the wrong face balance and I need 60 degree, he then walked around the room looking for a putter that has that angle and could not find a single one... he then gave up on me and started doing other stuff. I still had wedge and wood/hybrid fitting included in my fit as it was a full bag. I went and pulled my 3W out of my bag and started hitting balls messing around as he wasn't helping me. And guess what... I hit it 270 yards. So I told him look and he said there's no way that's your 3W that's the driver we fit. I said no, I didn't hit a single ball that far with the driver and I just hit 3 balls with my 3W... the last 3 balls on the data and they all went straight and 260+... He scoffed again and said Well I didn't see it so I don't believe that was your 3W...
Wow, that's both really terrible and not at all surprising.
Went to a driver fitting and got a decent deal and purchased the driver. Went back to the same place for an iron fitting, the cost was $500 more than retail because of their installation upcharges - Just as you said. I paid the $50 fitting fee and left. Purchased the same clubs direct from a retail store.
I also used CC for my iron fittings, and wanted to correct my last comment to read 6 new Fujikaru Sakura iron hybrid/iron shafts for ($513) when they sold online for $35 per shaft ($210). The only other shaft used in my fitting comparison was Accra I-Series.
People need to be more aware of what can happen in these more high end fittings. I have seen too many occasions where people are led into certain shafts that aren’t available from the club companies thereby forcing them to buy from the fitter if they want that shaft. And as you mentioned fitter MSRP seems to be very different from retail MSRP.
Great video. We should all let these fitters know that we will not pay more than the list price of stock clubs. In other words, give them a budget.
This video was so helpful and informative. I am thinking about new clubs and your recommendation suggesting that you only stick with OEM shafts or OEM provided upgrades makes so much sense. Since there is no perfect shaft there should be a couple of shafts that will work for you.
Did the $100 dollar full bag fitting promo at club champion, walked away getting fit for a Speeder NX 60 S and they wanted close to $600 dollars for that shaft alone on top of the full price TSi3. Got fitted for a ‘club builders’ project x vrtx shaft in a ping g425 max 3 wood… and oban ct-115 x (minus) flex shafts in my same iron heads. I considered doing the iron build but after regripping it’d cost around $1000 bucks… probably not worth it as a 14 handicap.
The fitting was a fantastic experience as a lesson and the guy was knowledgeable, he didn’t push wedges or a putter. At the end of the day just walked away and wish I got to try more readily available shaft options. Felt bad the guy spent 4 hours with me, basically gave me a lesson and I didn’t buy anything though! Thanks for this video.
A lot of suspicious shaft choices there. I would not feel bad for certain fitting companies.
I couldn't agree more, we are in that small percentage you referenced when I can get the OEM heads only. The fitting is detailed, the amount charged dependent on the cost component and an assembly fee only. good video
Thank you sir. I am always in awe of the quality of your work!
With regard to pure-ing shafts. There does seem to be some sensible science there,
at least with steel shafts. I did pure a set years ago and though I was amazed at the
obvious shaft dynamics which I could see during the process, my game was not at
a level where it was a noticeable improvement, mostly due to an onset of health
issues. ( spinal cancer)..Now, in my 70's, feeling better and getting back into this
wonderful game...
This is an amazing video, ive had to find this stuff out first hand through fittings but this is the best info I've seen
THAT'S Club Champion to a tee on his 1st description.....been there 1st hand to see it on a build sheet....I didn't tell them I'm a retired PGA member.....so sad that they are not up front.....
Club Champion build sheet wanted me to spend 4000 on a set of irons (upcharge padderson kinetix for all irons) and 1000 for a driver (triple diamond sub zero callaway head with some Ventus tour issue whatever). Nope. Even the iron heads they recommended were awful. But it was a fun little trackman session for me to self diagnose my missed shots! 🤣
That is impressive. Might be the highest price quote I've seen from them. 👎
Spot-on video. My first ever fitting felt like I paid a manufacturer's fitter an opportunity to up-sell me their latest and greatest. I went in as a beginner wanting to purchase the manufacturer's lesser expensive line with the idea that customization is better than stock. Right off the top, he gives me their mid-line irons to try and doesn't recommend the lower-line irons. Then he recommends the premium shafts over the stock shafts. After working up the spec. sheet, for about $200 more, he can get me a special fitter's deal for their premium line. The premium line doesnt include the premium shafts so that also extra. The launch monitor was just there as a tool for him to point to some obscure number saying the recommendations are working. He's obviously incentivized to sell and trained by the manufacturer.
The whole experience is such a page out of "car dealership for dummies" You go into a Mercedes Benz dealership wanting to by an A class. They let you test drive a C class, then with all the options and add-ons, it is close to an E base model. With the same options, you're paying triple what you originally wanted to spend. Now I know what they mean when they say "Kaboom baby!!".
I believe getting a right fit will help, so I went to a local independent fitter. Basically he's saying my swing is inconsistent, but at minimum, x,y,z adjustments should be made.
You hit the nail on the head.
Only been fitted 4 times and never had a bad experience or up sale, my last fitting October in Columbus ohio for Mizuno JPX 923 Hot Metals and was a great experience.
Great insight.. moral of the story, buyer beware!
I had an excellent experience at Cool Clubs in Scottsdale. They are not cheap, but didn’t change my 3 wood at all, and just put a new shaft in my old driver, saying the new model heads were no better for me. They also basically refused to sell me a 4 iron, saying I couldn’t hit it well enough. Puring was built into their price.
BTW, I used to build fishing rods, and it was standard practice to locate the spine and align it straight up or down. That is similar to puring as I understand the goal.
Glad you had a good experience there. That said, aligning a golf shaft is not the same as aligning a fishing rod because the fishing rod only flexes in one plane while a golf shaft flexes in multiple.
New golfer, went from regular to stiff shaft in my driver (which was 3 months old). My local range/par 3 course upgraded for me and reduced the price by £60 in exchange for keeping my original regular shaft. I’ll use them againas I know they won’t screw me over.
I got fit at my golf club by a Callaway Master Fitter for free. Great experience and I got to use my discount on my new apexes.
Always like to hear good fitting stories. Gives me hope.
Some fitters are just looking to slam dunk you. I went to get fit for the top part of my bag, the guy was way too obsessed with Trackman numbers and not strike or feel. I personally come from a school of thought where shafts are all about feel and when it bends the right way, the golfer will sequence correctly and distance and dispesion will be a result of it. Then and only then you adjust lies and length.
Went for a True Spec driver fit a month ago (Feb ‘23) and they fit me into a UST shaft that was released in 2016. Needless to say, the shaft wasn’t even available through UST themselves any longer.
Fortunately was able to find it used and in good condition from eBay, and saved $220 in the process.
So glad I found this video. Thanks. Am doing research into fitting. Was looking at club champ and was attracted by there brand neutral status (meaning I could try some wilson clubs too) but given the comments thread they are off my list now😱👍
Reminds me of one of the largest national clubfitting chains that's for sure. Good video! I will also add a red flag would be if the fitter won't allow for a short follow-up fitting to double-check the fit.
True. At least some of the fitting companies, have guarantees if you're not happy. Though I am not sure how you would ever be happy paying double what these things should cost??
@@EFGMC haha exactly, I guess another red flag is if they say they can't order your clubs through the oem as well!
The funny thing is how do you think they obtain the heads? They buy stock clubs from the manufacturer. They pull the heads put your shaft and grip you were fitted into and sell the pulls. That’s what Club Champion does.
@@shanejones8884 Or they could order your clubs with upgraded stock option shafts and non OEM branded grips uninstalled, pull the shafts, and then sell those.
This exact thing is what has kept me from getting fit. I'm super frugal and hate feeling ripped off. I don't care how much further I could hit it with a fitting with the latest year driver model when a 1 year old $200 driver I can buy off of Callaway preowned with adjustable hosel and my launch monitor allows me to experiment and figure much of it out for myself. As good as a pro fit? No way, but being "forced" to pay for not only the latest model year driver, but shafts and grips also would depress the hell out of me if I had pay $1000 for a driver. Thanks so much AJ.
Excellent video. I’ve been fitted quite a few times in my golfing career and I’ve found the following trends. When I went to big box stores, despite the fitting results, they always seemed to want to sell me the stock offering in order to move inventory.
I will say that some of the big box stores have gotten better but your experience may vary lol
When I was fitted in a custom shop my experience was better because they had no stock offerings or any inventory to move although that always resulted in a much more expensive club(s).
Couldn't you eliminate the risk of the disappearing shafts and heads by simply having the clubs built to your specs by the manufacturer? My last set of irons came directly from Mizuno after my fitter sent my specs and they arrived with my requested shafts and grips.
I was fitted for t300 irons this past fall at club champion also a g425 max driver and a 3wood total build sheet price was over 3400$ I ordered the exact same irons from titileist build to my exact specs same shafts n grips lie angle for 1100 shipped. And got the 3wood the same threw fairway jockey for 300$ no upcharge for shaft or grip never got the driver
Man you are absolutely correct. True specs fitted me with a shaft that I can’t even find anywhere. The Mitsubishi OT i75. The only way I can get another one is only from them… wow. I wish I watched this video be for I got fitted.
Next time I am definitely ordering everything and have you install for me
Sorry you had to go through all that. Most people have no idea how shady some of these fitting companies can be. This is one of the biggest reasons I am opening my own fitting studio.
There are knowledgable fittings, there are honest fitters, but almost none are both!
i was fitted after using clubs I've had for 15 years because I wanted "better" to lower my handicap. I went from the R7 CGB Max to the 2023 Stealth. No improvement, no more forgiving and no more distance whatsoever. I'm really kicking myself in the butt with how much I spent. I've had lessons and was always told to "play more golf" and that was it. I started playing in 2007 and was using my stepdads clubs from the early 90s and late 80s and was beating people who were fitted with the latest and greatest. Yeah, clubs cary but if you don't have game, you won't score good. I'm a 14 handicap and I really enjoy playing. I even play with folks with those $400 sets and they score really good for the most part.
This post resonates. Prefer fitters that don’t hard sell.
Ive been fitting for 10 plus years for all major OEMs ...the one variable you cant acocunt for in any fitter is what fitter you get. Makes all the differenc in the world. Everyone has launch monitors and fitting shafts and heads...its how its applied
TY for an honest presentation 👏👏👏
Club Champion seems to do a lot of this. The issue is that I quite like their fitting process and have had good results with the products that they've recommended. For me, it's ultimately a bit of a trade off. I typically tend to order iron sets from them at the upcharge because they do an excellent job of swing weighting the set properly. Is the swing weight worth the 25% uncharge? Probably not but it is less of a headache than pulling and tip weighting shafts from a manufacturer. For woods and putters, I always piece the clubs together myself. I was able to save about 50% doing this recently. With modern woods, it'd pretty simple to buy shafts, tips, and weight kits on eBay and get the specs you are looking for without too much fuss.
Your video was my experience at Club Champion Orlando
Club Champion really screwed me as well, I went telling the fitter I was just coming back into golf after a few years and didn't have the knowledge I do now about equipment or especially your first point about not receiving the original shafts/grips that came with irons. Fitter didn't fit my swing he fit 4 or 5 decent swings. After agreeing to purchase, mainly because I thought he genuinely made me think I was paying retail for everything, went online that night and saw the almost 3x retail price of my shafts that he had me put in all 8 of my irons and 2 of my wedges. Ended up wasting over 1200 on "puring" and shafts that according to the fitter, "will last you 7-8 years". Should've cancelled order after 1 business day. Another shady fine print policy they have. Will never buy clubs from any fitting chain like this again.
Sorry to hear that. Unfortunately you are one of too many that get misled and lulled into a false sense of trust during these fittings.
The thing I've noticed is club makers chasing distance, because this has become such a numbers game. Launch angle, swing speed, distance carry... A 7-iron now hits as far as a 5-iron did 15 years ago. What's wrong with that? It means you need a bag full of gap wedges to fill in for all the scenarios under 170 yrds. So that advertised set price is misleading because you are paying for clubs you don't need (4 and 5 iron) and does not include the wedges or fairway woods you probably do need.
Master fitter for a major company, I have never “pushed” upcharged shafts, if they are interested I will let them try it and see how they feel and talk about the tech the shaft offers but I never recommend it unless you have unlimited funds or are playing competitive golf.
My nephew has recently gone into Club Fitting he is a PGA pro Qualified in uk..having worked at a Private GC 5 yrs. He is now into his 3rd Mth… he can’t believe how many golfers are coming for there Fitting…from beginner to high end paying for a Full bag Fit..Wedge Fit…Driver Fit…& churning it out in 2 hrs fully Built…
The industry has been pushing the "get fit" narrative for a while now and it seems to have taken off.
Just had a Club Champion driver fitting yesterday and...yeah not sure I will be doing that again. The fitter more or less ignored/downplayed any of my input/requests/questions, didn't seem all that knowledgeable about how to read the Trackman, and was dead set on pushing Titleist products. Overhead the fitter in the bay next to us and he was pushing Titleist super hard as well. TSI2 was one of my leaders coming into the fitting--so it wasn't the end of the world--but when I mentioned I wanted to hit the G425 he was visibly annoyed. The whole thing was incredibly dubious. There are a few independent fitters I will be trying out next time before returning to a CC, that's for sure.
Disappointing. Especially that he was dismissing your desires and questions during the process.
Another great video AJ, thank you so much!
A great video to help people not get shafted. I bought a head second hand on eBay. I then went to get shaft fitting. I was charged £150 for a shaft that I could have bought on eBay for £90. And I’ve ended up with a shaft that is just too long.
Everyone should take heed of this video. I wanted a professional driver fitting, not one from a big box store. I thought club champion was the answer. I wasn't even offered the OEM shaft. Not knowing any better I paid over $900.00 for a Callaway Epic Flash driver. A friend of mine went there for an iron fitting. His bill was over $3000.00. Buyer beware at Club Champion!!
AJ.. been a custom builder for over 20yrs. Know how Club Champion evolved. I fit a major Japanese mfgr.. have access to 2 OEM heads only purchases. Have an idea what the unit volume is that CC etc are doing. They are buying stock uncut shafted irons grips in the box. Their shaft and grip add on is because they do not stock all the shafts they fit with. Thru pull heads, add the fitted shaft, and grips, thus their shaft upgrade. Have seen so many mis fit iron sets. From PXG as well.
I fit from a Club ProShop and range. The assembly process is critical. One large OEM assembles in Mexico. Many misses. Thanks for raising the issue. It’s all about $$$.
Thank you this is very correct
I just went in for a driver fitting(like my head so just shaft only).
The fitting cost $75. I tried probably 7-8 shafts and had told the fitter my budget, which he stuck within. Was fitted for a ventus blue tr(which I really agreed with). The shaft was msrp, and the only thing I was paying extra for was them to trim a tiny bit off and put it together(I think it was $25). Overall, only spent $25 more than I would have if I bought it myself, and the fitting fee itself was fair. I’ve heard insane stories about club champion
Always like to hear these stories to balance out the bad ones.
Very good video!! ...I tend to hit the players original club at the end again to make sure what I have come to in the fitting is definitely better
I recommend so many people not to buy because either they didn't gain anything or they need to work on their swing to get more out of a purchase later (I also give them the coaching tools/ideas to help make this progress happen)
Now what about the growing problem of: good fitting, but a bad build? I think that the build is just as important as the fitting.
My vote is go to the fitting, figure out your specs, then source and build yourself.
very informative, thanks for posting!
A.J., great follow-up video to your fitting video from last week. You hit a few of the issues I was thinking of. Especially the point of "the best shaft chosen from the sample provided".
Thanks Gary!
Sometimes, fitters have brands like Accra (only available through fitters). The results speak for themselves. Sometimes the big $ shaft is the clear winner, Sometimes there's no winner and a stock offering is completely suitable. Don't feel pressed to buy from the fitter. The fitting fee is payment enough
Interesting comment, as I got my son fitted for his driver 2 years ago at CC, and they recommended Accra, which I went with. Now think it was not the right decision as it is 2 years later and he is not hitting it as good. But that could also be due to his body growing and getting stronger, fitted at 16, now he is 18.
@@danvandermeulen9337 2 years is an enormous difference at that age. 40-42 is nothing of note. He'll likely be fit every year until 24ish if he's playing regularly and growing (height and muscle).
These are club champion build sheets. I definitely got scammed. Lesson learned. Thanks
Great advice thanks.
I like the club spine to be checked...to elimatethe mental doubt...
Have a video idea in the works where I test out this idea.
Fitting sounds so intimidating. It’s like a Chinese menu with the myriad of choices. I’ve never quite understood whether there are significant differences from one manufacturer of shafts versus another. They may differ in weight but will performance be significant? I’m looking at it from the high to mid handicappers perspective. Great content. You really opened my eyes to the whole fitting world. I’m still playing 30 year old clubs and I don’t see a need to change yet. I feel like I’d pay $2k for clubs and I’ll still be a 15 handicap.
the main thing a fitter should do for most players is get them in clubs that suit them, this may be the opposite of exotic. let people buy themselves online and they want the tour spec stuff, which wont work best for the average slower swing speed. The main thing most men go for is stiff shafts because they are a REAL MAN!! my tip to you is find out your average iron and driver swing speed and then looks at what fits that,
That’s great, thanks, my kid has a fitting at GolfTec coming up, and that’s great insite
Having component accounts is much common than you think. The people that have them though are boutique builders. Shops that only fit have a hard time getting them but if you own a build shop it’s very easy to do
My local builder (20yrs) can't get just(new) iron heads from big OEM ,they all come with shafts on.
Yes woods he can get just heads.
You are not completely correct on issue #1 Disappearing Shafts and Grips... this from a major fitter company I'll call "CC".....
>"this is a misconception -- you aren't being charged for stock shafts/grips. We have a component account with our OEMs, which means all the heads, shafts and grips come separately. We weight sort and do all that fun stuff before the components ever make it into the shop. We aren't taking in built clubs, disassembling them and then tossing away the stock stuff - we're putting the separate pieces together.
>Where this gets weird is with the OEM's pricing -- they tell their retailers what they can charge for their clubs, based on clubheads. It's called MAP (minimum advertised pricing), and we have to adhere to it. So if Mizuno says that iron costs $175, that's the cost we have to charge for the clubhead, since we cannot go below that minimum. There's no "component" cost for clubheads since we cannot sell just the head to an end customer as a standalone piece. OEMs pay pennies on the dollar for stock shafts and even grips in some cases, because they are ordering mass-produced items in massive quantities. That $175 price tag is based on the clubhead materials and technology (and probably some room in there for Mizuno to make a fair profit), not necessarily the fully assembled club, even though that's how it's presented online."
Great info. Will definitely remember this when I do my next fitting this year.
Thanks again for this video. It helps a lot. ;)
I got fitted for irons. They were ok but I never felt the clubs improved my game. Late in the season, I took my clubs to a local club maker for re-gripping and ask the vendor to check the loft and lie angle. Well, on the scoring irons, the lofts were 2 degrees flatter than my specs and the mid irons varied from too flat to too upright. I asked another fitter to check the clubs and got the same results...the clubs were not made to spec. Of course, both the vendor and the so-called quality manufacturer did not respond to my what went wrong inquiries. So, now, I'm using an old iron set I found in the family garage and my brand name, highly praised irons are for sale.
And, now I'm tempted to build my own clubs
dang, where were you when i bought clubs 5 months ago. got fitted and they sold me the +1.5in shaft off the wall. Now I realize they are 1 inch too long and they f'd me... lol. getting them shortened asap.
Got fitted for TSR driver…first fitting ever for me…..surprising the driver I was fitted for was the only driver in stock at retailer….lol…turned out the club, shaft where all not the best for me…seems like they fitted me into the one driver they had in stock
Great advice.
Your knowledge, delivery and insightful content has earned a new subscriber.
Thanks for the support! Really appreciate it.
Really enjoyed your video. I strongly believe in fitting, but there has to be a balance with getting what you pay for. Got my 16yr old son fitted for irons, and went to Roger Dunn since it was only paying the fitting fee plus the cost of the clubs from the OEM, whereas a premium fitter would charge $100 per shaft and then the price doubles, so that was a good experience. I am regretting a bit now that I took him to CC for his driver and went with an Accra shaft for his current Callaway head, and another guy posted below that those are only available through fitters, so I got suckered into that (wish I had this video then :)!). Besides that, he is now 18 and I don't think that shaft fits him as well now that he is taller and stronger. So a question on that...I agree that the OEMs now all offer a pretty good selection of stock and upgrade shafts, but what is your recommendation on picking the OEM? Seems like driver heads now don't have as much differentiation as they used to. Thanks!
I did a video about picking out shafts based on specs. Most important is weight, then bend profile and flex. Everything else is pretty insignificant in how it influences the shot. You can really pick any brand and they will have a shaft line that works for you. The idea that people need all these boutique random shafts that no-one knows is just wrong. I say stick to the big names you see on the tours both mens and womens. Majority of them are using Fujikura, Mitsubishi, Graphite Design, and Project X and most of those shafts are offered by the OEMs as stock or upgrade options.
@@EFGMC Thanks for the fast response. Just realized I wasn't clear in my reference to OEMs....I was wondering if you have any thoughts on narrowing the club OEM...TM, Ping, etc, for drivers, since those are all very similar now in terms of size, COR, etc. Agree with you on the shaft comments.
@@danvandermeulen9337 Like you said, spec wise they are all very close. Really comes down to what you like looking at. Callaway and Taylormade are the biggest sellers but I see the most positive feedback from Ping and Titleist drivers.
I work at a big box store and had a customer try to order his custom driver based on a fitting from that nationally advertised golf fitting company. The shaft they recommended was not even offered as an upgrade from Cobra. The way I look at it he could of bought two Oem Drivers gor what they wanted to charge him for one Driver. This was for an older high handicap golfer. To me a fitter should serve the role as consultant. The consultant should be helping you instead of just trying to over charge you. The fitting fee and retail price for the driver should be enough for compensation.
Really good points but you also have to consider "dubious" things done by the OEM. One of biggest is the OEM ventus. And that most OEMs {besides mizuno] only have a very limited amount of shafts and even more limited in covid times with ping OEM wait times taking multiple months. Theres also a lack on information for customers on what is available for fitting at different fitters (club champion not having really any stock OEM driver-hybrid shafts) and The opposite with GG/dicks only having a few exotic shafts and those being limited to specific OEMs. Even though you can order the exotics through golf galaxy, you only really have 2-6 total to try per OEM, and thats if you play stiff or X
yeah, they have a "Deal" going with every shaft company they offer as a shaft option. and the OEM shaft is just a well-worded con.
I got fitted at Club Champion yesterday, total bill $5,090 for the whole set. I saw every single one of the practices described in the video applied to my fitting session...They quoted me the head of the Driver the same price I would pay for driver+shaft+grip...plus a $390 shaft.... same for the irons, with the shaft quoted 50% more than I can find online... I paid $400 for the fitting, and I still don't know what shaft I should buy without breaking the bank... so sad...
That's sad to hear, for $400 you could fly to a recommended independent fitter if there isn't one in driving distance.
@@krusher74 true, however I am quite happy with the performance of the stuff I tried. I think that Buying 2nd hand and shopping around I can shave $3,000+ dollars…and doesn’t have to happen all at once…it can be my 2022 project as I improve my golf…
Great information!!
Hi, Don't forget the other dodgy procedure. Fitters that are Brand specific might easily modify your shot data to promote the club they are trying to sell you. Bring your own golf balls that you normally game, and get them to turn of the BALL NORMALISATION. This is a calculation that a launch monitor can make for varying types of golf ball and weather conditions when testing outdoors. It has a % slider on the set up. One of them is ball speed normalisation. He can slide this to 90% during your driver and 100% during his. Making your current driver fall short of his new driver. Getting them to turn this off doesn't stop them from being dodgy, but it does show them that you might know what you are talking about and might catch them out if they try it.
Get the fitter to explain to you why the new club is better than your old one. "Better technology" & "it just works for you" are not an explanation. "Your club face strike patterns are the same in both clubs, but the newer one is more forgiving to off centre strikes because of a better distribution of mass in the club head" is a better explanation which he can prove by showing you the strike patterns on the launch data.
All great advise. The more you can show you know what is going on, the better.
@@EFGMC I think the biggest handicap that most amateur golfers have is a lack of knowledge and over estimation of how complicated that data is. I take my hat off to you in doing the hard work to try and educate the masses and simplify the magic that is the game we love.
Get lessons, Get educated, Get fitted and get out there and have some fun.
@@brianellis5146 End of the day, golf is probably 15% equipment, 85% the person holding that equipment.
I thought i was getting quite well versed on this fitting thing, but finding out the fitting companies dont get bare heads from the Oems to start builds with was a shock.
Thanks for the video on fitting practices. Good stuff here!
Thanks Charles!
Great video. I'd add when you warm up in a fitting and they keep your bad shots then just keep your best ones with their fitted product. Not apples to apples
Yes, I would for sure double back to hit my gamer clubs against the new "fitted" ones at the end and see what happens.
I hate you…I needed you to send me this video before I went the Club Champion for the bend and send…you literally detailed almost my entire experience, right down to the LA Golf Tour AXS Red 85R ($175 per shaft) they stuck in my irons that suck. Unless you are ready to take control of the entire experience, don’t go to CC to get fitted…I suffered through my Titleist T200s with these LA Golf 85g shafts for 5 months and thought maybe I just completely lost my golf touch after having my hip replaced a year ago…But, on a whim, I stopped at my local Golf Galaxy, had them put together a T200 with different shafts and found my swing instantly once I put the Project X LZ 6.0 shaft in them…they are 120g!!!! Nowhere near the 85g in the LA Golf shaft…and they are much cheaper…I went back a few more times to make sure and then ordered three shafts, had them installed and did a side by side comparo with my current clubs and it’s not even close! On the upside, my driver fitting was great and I love my driver…But, I will be assembling my own clubs for a while until a absorb that unreal price I paid for my initial iron fitting…not worth it unless you are trending towards becoming a pro…go to a local mom and pop shop fitter…
Sorry you had that experience. Happens far too often. Only other thing I would say is don't assume that a better golfer will somehow get more out of that type of fitting than an average one. Same rules apply, and the same tricks used. A fitter can just as easily "fit" a great golfer into what the fitter wants, as they can with an average golfer.
Love how you’re calling all of these things out. Hate how true spec golf has their own graphite design shafts. Doesn’t matter how good the shaft is it’s a massive conflict of interest
And they usually, at least from what has been recounted to me, don't disclose that it is a propriety shaft.
@@EFGMC - If you every have one fail, good luck getting a replacement except from them.
Nice someone to say about this. I'm pretty sure you are spot on. I went to someone good and paid up for the analysis only. Then they happily reworked my dynacraft forged irons and acer woods no problem, not trying to subsidise the fitting by selling more than I need. Would be good to know what other good components suppliers there are out there, not many at all it seems.
The Maltby stuff I have put together is good quality.
0:14 ding ding ding, exactly, it's like going to a car dealer most of the time. Pay attention to what they are trying to get you to purchase, get a spec sheet and then study it before committing $$$. I build my own clubs now.
Club Champion is notorious for charging for each component of the club. Quoted my friend nearly 2500 for clubs he could get direct from Ping for $1200.
I just found this channel and really like what you've been doing. I've been building clubs for many years (I have the same John Kaufman frequency clamp that's on your workbench!) as a hobby and for friends, etc. but I've never had a good way to fit myself other than sort of guesswork based on current clubs and ball flight. I was thinking about going to a fitting place. This video and its predecessor where excellent in terms of giving insight into those processes. I had no idea they were basically doing shaft pulls on off-the-rack clubs to get their heads. Anyway, I have no interest in these guys making me a club, I just want to understand my swing characteristics and see if a different loft or maybe different shaft weight would improve things. After seeing your videos, I'm now thinking it might make more sense to just get a lesson with a pro with a good launch monitor and see how my current driver does(I have two shafts I could interchange for a small weight difference test). I'd get some fitting information along with some instruction for probably a similar charge as a driver fitting (with the potential sales job!). My second choice would be to go to the fitting place with very specific requests but I'm concerned that their incentives are elsewhere.
Welcome. I think if you go to any of these fitting companies and know what you want to look at, they can be helpful. You just need to steer the process to ensure that you aren't steered wrong. And of course do your buying somewhere else!
Thank you for this.