Yeah, one of the more huge differences between my imagination and the anime interpretation. I personally didn't imagine Frieren being easy going and mellow while reading the manga, but the anime went to this more cozy, slow, tranquil atmosphere with the SOL scenes.
@@climax-sannI also believe for voices your slightly more in favor of manga, because your interpretation of the voices are subjective, I do understand the mild disappointment when a character doesn't sound like how you think they would though
I strongly - strongly disagree with your thoughts of injecting more chapters per episode. I've seen way too many anime rush to a particular endpoint, thus adapting too many chapters per episode. Frieren may have been a little slow, but in my opinion it was perfectly suited for the tone it had. I really like it when anime go to the lengths to faithfully include as much content as possible, so I would much rather have what we got, where the staff are given the time needed to beautifully adapt each panel. There is no need to accelerate the pace of the anime at all, and doing so would only come with negatives.
Yeah maybe just add an extra episode or 2 maybe 3 depending on the chapter distribution in the second season to get all the current 128 chapters but I think the whole point of the anime is to not rush through things and enjoy the slow pacing
I disagree with trying to squeeze more in to each episode. I feel the pacing and letting things breath in this series was perfect. It's a journey after all. I remember watching LOTR Return of the King in the theater and felt it was rushed. Watching the Extended versions if felt much better. Feel your missing the point on that. What I like about the anime over the manga is those montage shots that are so tiny in the manga that it was hard for me to read what it was vs letting the anime use the full frame. We did know that Flamme was from at least a thousand years ago because Frieren said so in episode 4 with "Even after 1000 years, I'm still dancing in the palm of my master" and that was a "daaayyymm" moment for me and it just reinforced Frieren's age along with the "one one hundredth of my life", that she's stated before. I think Serie's voice was not what I was inmagining.
I think a lot of people do prefer the relaxed pacing of Freieren considering the anime's popularity. It was just my own preference kinda thing. And yeah, you're right, I missed the 1000 years part. All I remember was simply something like "after all these years". Thanks for mentioning. Serie's voice somehow just instantly felt suitable in my head.
@@climax-sann Oddly, you're not the first person to even make a video about adaptation and pointing to the same "flaw" of how "Flamme's age is never stated" or something similar. It's possible that some people missed it the first time (I watched 30+ reactions to Frieren Anime - at least 15% of reactors did have issues placing when Flamme lived or how old Frieren was) and like it often happens, even if they later watch it again, they don't listen as carefully, because they "remember" what was said. But not really. Of course I don't know if this was what happened to you. There might be multitude of reasons of why you missed it and I don't intend to crucify you for that ;) Things like that can happen even when you're 100% focus on the thing you're doing. Add in family, random noises, trying to appreciate the visuals rather than focusing on text you remember from Manga - and that's still just normal stuff. As for Serie's voice - I think in the end it was great choice. Even though my first reaction was "How in the hell is she supposed to make that low sond with that short windpipe?" But then you look at her VA and she doesn't look like she could pull it off either. Sometimes the world is funny. And Serie having "Commanding voice", but also having "softer side" makes sense. I do apologize. I replied before watching the video, but simply after seeing comment that reminded me of 2 other instances where criticism was "Anime doesn't tell us Flamme's age etc.". So I replied. And now I'm bit afraid of watching this video. I watched 3 videos about Frieren comparing Source material and it's adaptation into Anime. 1 was mostly positive, pointing out few things that could have been done better/differently etc. And even if I didn't agree with everything it was obvious that person had not only opinions, but also actual knowledge of how adaptation process works. And how conveying various types of information in those 2 very different media makes it really really hard to make perfectly and honestly often Anime that tries to be "too faithful" to source material end up badly (recent example - Helck. It wasn't the only problem this anime had and it got a bit better, but that lack of understanding that you have to fill places in between panels with something "original" was one of the reasons why that adaptation is unlikely o continue). And creators are stuck in between trying to make adaptation that is 1. faithful 2. Fills in the blanks in between panels (when needed - that depends on situation etc.). 3. Works as an anime for the first time viewer who has 0 knowledge of source material. 4. works for people who also read the source material. In reality there are even more constraints, but the first video about Frieren comparing source material to adaptation was trying to do so for first 4 episodes. It was over 1 hour long. I only lasted 8 minutes, which were whole filled by a rant of how some rock near the road looks different in Anime than in Manga and how that makes Frieren the "Worst adaptation of all times" (Couple hours later like/dislike ratio was turned off, then comments, then video was unlisted - I don't remember channel name, but I think it was nuked as well, because of flak said person got). I understand being passionate about stuff. I understand being even a bit unhinged about stuff you love. I mean I've been reading Frieren since it was still a one shot - and I love it to bits. But if I used all my bad faith and threw out all my understanding of how adapting from Manga to Anime works, then maybe at worst I could give "Anime Frieren" 7/10. And I don't feel like after throwing logic and how universe works out of the window, I should be making video shouting that "It's the worst adaptation only Good (7/10)". Which gets me back to why I'm skittish to watch your video. You turned off like/dislike ratio. Multiple comments seem to be jokes etc. If you tell me that your video isn't some rant at how "Anime people didn't understand the beauty of Frieren" - then I will definitely watch it and tell you what I agree with and what I disagree with. But you're very unlucky. Because the videos trying to compare the 2 - almost always manage to tick of both sides. And both sides have rabid parts of fandom. I'll try to watch it tomorrow. But if it's a good video (so not 1 sided rant) - then I will recommend it to others.
@@jannegrey593 I don't believe it was one-sided (you can watch it and prove me wrong), but I had to come to a conclusion which of the versions I preferred. Also the thing with Flamme's age wasn't exactly a critisizm towards the anime. I was explaining another point that related to Flamme's age/era. p.s. My video is not that deep. Just comparing the two based on some points and saying which I like better. You can give it a shot.
@@climax-sann Thank you - calm response, no shouting. I can watch it and will. Sorry, it's just that this particular niche of Frieren videos seems to be possessed by taken or vice versa ;) You will have full review in few hours.
"The characters had better voices in the manga"... "Do you hear what I say? Yes? - You better get your ears checked, because nobody made a sound here" - Scott McLoud, "Understanding Comics".
@@climax-sann - I simply found funny that you decided to point out that the voices of the characters in the manga were more satisfying. Mind you, when I came across that observation in Scott McLoud's comic, it struck me as a brick. On the flip side, no "external voice actor" that the real world can provide is likely to sound more satisfying, to you, than the ones that your fantasy conjure up.
@@woongah I agree. It's just I had some problems with some of the voices in the anime, while for obvious reasons I don't in the manga. The anime did not have to surpass, it just have to be acceptable (which it often was, with some more minor issues). It can be different, as long as it feels fitting. Plus, you'll be surprised how often voices in dubs can exceed your imaginations.
@@CarloGoiff666 What's wrong with vibes? Maybe terming it as "manga voices" was wrong on my end, but nevertheless everyone has expectations/imaginations to character voices when reading and then we just compare it against their actual voices in the anime
As a huge fan of the Manga before the anime, the Anime enhances every aspect of the Manga, nah 2 chapters is perfect the divine revolt and El Dorado arcs to me go together perfectly and are both combat heavy so it's definitely going to be stretched out, also it gives the next season a natural stopping point and it only uses 44 chapters maybe 46, giving a potential s3 time to breathe
Thanks for showing the manga comparisons. However, I have to disagree on several points: 1) 2:02 Arbitrarily adapting 3 chapters per volume would probably affect the pacing of the episodes. Whoever adapted these chapters probably had an end result in mind and did a great job. The stories did not seem slow to me as you said for some episodes, and I agree with your point that ending where they did was very good for a season ender. 2) 3:46 I agree this change was very nice for the anime and Fern really did look adorable. ^_^ 3) 4:26 I like the anime change to show Fern waking up Frieren, because it shows Fern’s caring personality. Despite her disdainful, judgmental looks and mild temper tantrums, Fern cares for her party. This was further shown by how she draped Stark with her own coat (though later she held up his jacket with her fingers like they were stinky, haha). 4) 5:25 I have to disagree with you there. Though you say it doesn’t seem logical that Wirbel would be though one to attack first, and that showing Ubel attacking first shows her greater bloodlust, I think the way the anime presented it makes more sense. First of all, it’s Wirbel’s party that is ambushing Ubel’s party. It would be pretty incompetent of you if you’re ambushing but you get attacked first instead. Second, we already had a good idea of Ubel’s bloodlust in the scene with the bandits and in her joy in talking about how they’d get to fight as others would come after their bird. In addition, it immediately makes you interested in Wirbel’s character, as it seems like he’s a cold-blooded killer, and you don’t know the outcome of who’d come out on top between his and Ubel’s battle. Yes, the backgrounds, animation quality and storyboarding, and attention to detail, such as period clothing, architecture, etc., helps with the world building and helps the viewer get immersed in their world. The extending fight scenes, btw, is another reason why it’s probably a bad idea to arbitrarily adapt 3 chapters per episode… if they did that, we would have lost out on these great fight scenes. 12:49 Meh… this is subjective. The manga panel makes Ubel look more devious, but it also makes her look younger. 13:43 I think the anime version of Himmel’s face shows more complexity and maturity. The look in the anime version is one where he is holding back his feelings. He knows his elf love does not understand human feelings, empathy, etc., so he puts on a brave face. We as viewers can see that, and it makes the scene sadder and more poignant. In the manga version, we just feel bad for Himmel. 14:50 When you are talking about the voices, I wonder if you heard the original Japanese version or a dubbed version. 16:52 Edel speaks like an upperclass woman…an aristocrat. It would not match the characters that you speak of here. The subtitles or manga translation probably couldn’t convey that. 18:40 I don’t think the anime is “slow and relaxing” either… it shows realism where it needs, and the pacing is great, with a mix of action and times for character development and storytelling. As a manga reader, you’re probably flipping through the pages, and thus you set your own pace, so it may seem like it flows faster to you. As an anime viewer, I feel like the way the story is paced creates great world building and guides the viewer to experience this story. Also, maybe because you already read the manga, you knew what would happen, so scenes seemed slow to you. But as a viewer, I never thought it was slow or “slice of life” as you described.
I only added the music at the end as a point, but didn't exactly go into it cuz the manga didn't have music (at least not in my head) so it wouldn't exactly be a comparison. I simply consider it already included with the 'visuals', which was basically meant as all the technical side of things. But yeah, definitely a plus point for the anime.
That would be like giving a point to the anime for having color, wouldn't it? Or for having movement. To be fair, though, he did offer a slight advantage to the manga for having better voices in his head for it, so maybe it is fair game.
Excellent comparison! One of the very best Manga-to-Anime adaptations I have ever seen! One critical error, was in the fight in the dungeon, where the Frieren clone uses some unknown force to blow Fern back against the wall. Fern in the anime calls it in English translation, The Height of Magic while in the manga, she calls it The Apex of Magic. This is a very significant change for the development of the later story in explaining Demon magic. While the English "height of x" suggests a maximum. If some fact is "the height of x", there is always a higher height in x+1. An Apex is not a value of any kind. It is a religious pointer to the divine. There is nothing higher than an Apex. In ancient times, an Apex was literally an arrow pointing to Heaven which then was thought to be just above our heads. Also Apex has a complex and subtle linguistic connection to Flamme. The Japanese publisher of the English translation, Shogakukan Asia, chose Apex for their English translation.
17:31 Everyone prefers the voices we have in our minds for characters over the ones they end up being given, unless they miraculously somehow sound exactly like we imagined them to sound. I personally would still put that as a draw, as nobody can compete with the voice expectations of the readers. To comment on the slow or calming feeling of the anime, I feel like that should be a point for the anime. You personally may not prefer it, but I feel like the anime is trying to portray an emotion of loss and longing that takes place at the end of something, but also at the same time trying to convey warm feelings as well. These tend to translate to slow, calming moments quite often and I feel like the anime translates these emotions very well.
Yeah, it's not exactly easy to produce voices that somehow is better than the ones we imagined. Simply being a fitting voice already shows a good adaptation. I don't mind the voices being different if they are fitting, it's just there were some minor shocks to some of the voices for me.
@climax-sann if you haven't watched the dubbed version yet, I highly recommend it; the voices there are perfect and I can't imagine any better ones for the characters.
I am left with the impression that you generally prefer reading and still panels so that you can use your own imagination on the rest. Which in turn seems like it was enough to tip the scales in the manga's favor for you. Which is fine. When it comes to matters of taste, you have to know another's tastes before their opinions on the matter can mean anything to you. So please, correct me if I mistook the situation.
Frieren feels like a timeless anime. Like, if you grabbed an avid anime watcher from 2004, 1990, and 2018, I feel like they wouldn't find this anime out of its element visuals-wise
In the manga she got ambushed and then instantly jumped at Wirbel and team. In the anime she got ambushed with the first line of spells and then Wirbel rushed in instead of the other way around.
@climax-sann that's my point that's a shit ambush. It makes sense that the guy who has war experience would actually capitalize and take the lead. It also makes more sense for them to be able to get their preferred match ups that way if they charged in.
@@codegeass7162 Now I see it, yeah. However, it can also be interpreted that Wirbel was over-confident with his first barrage of spells, considering he was shocked Fern managed to block it, which is why he just nonchalantly walked into Fern. In this way it wasn't necessarily a bad ambush (it still technically is because they failed), but rather simply a misjudgement from Wirbel.
I'm commenting this before watching the video, but I honestly believe that they did a fantastic job with the Anime for Frieren. The story as told is mostly the same. The details are there from the manga, which is where most Anime stumble - there's details that fill out the world that are missing, which can be confusing if you only watch the anime. And then Frieren goes beyond on a few occasions - the dance scene is most notable, but it's far from the only example.
Yeah, you're right. They did an amazing job with the adaptation. It's basically 1 for 1 and they did go beyond at certain points. Both Anime and Manga were amazing and I enjoyed both of them. I read the manga first, so maybe Manga bias and stuff, but my conclusion was that I simply enjoyed the manga much more than the anime.
@@climax-sann I read the first chapter of the manga, then realized that it was about to release as an anime, so put it on the back burner. Watched about half of the anime, decided that I was too impatient, and dived into the manga. So I had about half Anime first, and the other half Manga first. Maybe you have a more vivid mental image of what's going on when you read than I do - it came across that your "manga bias" was more "I liked how I imagined it" in the video. For me, I loved what they did with the animation, it really brought it to life for me. I wish I had a fraction of the talent shown in both writing the story in the first place, and the screenplay/animation they did for the anime. Both are just stunning.
my guy did not just say the characters had better voices in the manga. i was completely with you until you started talking about how the story should not be slow. is bro reading at light speed or what
@@climax-sann Every word, every frame has a deeper meaning. The anime pulls this off exceptionally well. If it feels slow, you are missing the deeper things that are going on under the surface. It isn't slow at all; it is a masterpiece of storytelling.
@@climax-sann Neither was frieren anime. Best part about frieren was always storytelling and the anime had the perfect pacing and OST to back it up. Even next major arcs in the manga such as El dorado and goddess monument arc were so great because of how it was narrated. All those character relationships, flashbacks and prior events combined with the present makes a incredible storyline. And the anime used all those elements perfectly. Good stories take there time and I'm glad frieren adaption turned out as it did
@@mdtaj7563 With slow I wasn't referring to the particular pacing or how fast the story proceeded from event to event. I talked about it in the mood section. It's that laid back slow atmosphere. I don't mind all the details and extra flashback cuts, but it felt too laid back (take Laid back camp as reference), which was an atmosphere I had not imagined while reading the manga (maybe some people did).
How is the dance scene a mere mention on the last section??? That scene is what single-handedly makes the anime better than the manga, it should be a big part of the first section!
i didn't knew they adapted almost all scenes exactly as showed in the manga. this happens with all anime? they reproduce the same scenarios, composition, angles, etc? or is just in Frieren?
For almost of Anime adapted from manga, yes. Every scene is the exact same, there are some exceptions that are known as the worst of all, like Tokyo Ghoul, The Promised Neverland and others. For Novels is different, there are just words and few panels, in that case the adaptation is based more on the dialogues like Mushoku Tensei, Re:Zero, Classroom of the Elite, and etc. it depends on the source material and if would adapt faithfully to the original.
I watched the show first and read the manga later. I loved the pacing and the "chill" vibes of the anime. I felt that the manga was too fast paced for me. So maybe what media we consume first factors into this.
Are you watching sub or dub version of the anime (or none if you understand japanese)? And are you reading translation or are you reading straight from japanese version of the manga? It's so easy to miss out on the subtle things and get lost in translation since both version is not necessarily the same. Both version of anime and manga are not necessarily the same depending on the language used (sub/dub/japanese). These days, I prefer to judge different media (movies/anime/manga/books) separately. You might like one media and absolute hate the others. For example: I'm old school, I really love reading Dragon Ball. But I absolute hate the anime (the one that I've seen 20+ years ago). But in this case, I really love Frieren anime. I read the manga too but to me the anime is superbly done. YMMV
As a manga read before the anime adaptation I would say I can not make a hardcut and say one is better than the other. In reading the manga your imagination is forced to make of the panels shown a sequence and let it play in your mind. So I get why the anime which makes the visualization of the in between like fast food is not for some people and others have it hard to enrich a panel in to a full scenario. Since the text of the people was 99% the same in manga and anime and the adaptation followed so close to the panels given i can't pick one over the other. What was tried to be conveyed reached me in both forms of medium. Emotionally with the background music and the good VA performance I might say the anime gets me to resonate in certain scenes even stronger. For the 3 chapters in one episode I could not disagree more. Since every chapter if it is not for an arc is a self contained premise the author wants to bring across I think having 2 themes mixed in one episode is okay. If you were to make it 3 themes at least one would go out of the window since for the audience to remember the first half seems nowadays near impossible. So no to that. And the gluing together of 3 chapters that are arching is also not the best. Specifically the first mage exam comes to mind where at the end of one chapter Denken goes into the uselessness to undo the frozen lake which is the introduction in the next chapter as a reminder too. But since these both chapters were adapted into one it felt of Denken saying nearly the same thing twice. Now if 3 chapters were to be adapted and these reminder would be faithfully adapted this feels more then awkward as it was with this episode. So I can not agree with that. The pacing was not as slow as you make it out to be. I think manga since you don't have the details can be consumed rather quick. After a 2nd or more watches something akin comes in, but the first time watch actually profits very much from the "taking time" because the background art is no hastily made color puke or geometric forms, but visual rich motives that need time to be soaked in. Anyhow this was an interesting watch.
Bro, I came to the same conclusion about the potential issue if 3 themes/messages were to be fit in an episode. I removed that part of the recording, cuz I was lazy to edit more and I didn't know if I conveyed this idea well, but yeah great point. Interesting points made.
The relaxed vibe or slowness is one aspect I love in the anime.
I'm old, so maybe, I like chill.😍👍😁
Yeah, one of the more huge differences between my imagination and the anime interpretation. I personally didn't imagine Frieren being easy going and mellow while reading the manga, but the anime went to this more cozy, slow, tranquil atmosphere with the SOL scenes.
I believe you are biased towards manga. The barrier breaking scene for one was definitely better in the anime.
To be fair I did read the manga first so I admit there might have been some bias for the manga.
@@climax-sannI also believe for voices your slightly more in favor of manga, because your interpretation of the voices are subjective, I do understand the mild disappointment when a character doesn't sound like how you think they would though
I strongly - strongly disagree with your thoughts of injecting more chapters per episode. I've seen way too many anime rush to a particular endpoint, thus adapting too many chapters per episode. Frieren may have been a little slow, but in my opinion it was perfectly suited for the tone it had. I really like it when anime go to the lengths to faithfully include as much content as possible, so I would much rather have what we got, where the staff are given the time needed to beautifully adapt each panel. There is no need to accelerate the pace of the anime at all, and doing so would only come with negatives.
Yeah maybe just add an extra episode or 2 maybe 3 depending on the chapter distribution in the second season to get all the current 128 chapters but I think the whole point of the anime is to not rush through things and enjoy the slow pacing
I disagree with trying to squeeze more in to each episode. I feel the pacing and letting things breath in this series was perfect. It's a journey after all. I remember watching LOTR Return of the King in the theater and felt it was rushed. Watching the Extended versions if felt much better. Feel your missing the point on that. What I like about the anime over the manga is those montage shots that are so tiny in the manga that it was hard for me to read what it was vs letting the anime use the full frame.
We did know that Flamme was from at least a thousand years ago because Frieren said so in episode 4 with "Even after 1000 years, I'm still dancing in the palm of my master" and that was a "daaayyymm" moment for me and it just reinforced Frieren's age along with the "one one hundredth of my life", that she's stated before.
I think Serie's voice was not what I was inmagining.
I think a lot of people do prefer the relaxed pacing of Freieren considering the anime's popularity. It was just my own preference kinda thing.
And yeah, you're right, I missed the 1000 years part. All I remember was simply something like "after all these years". Thanks for mentioning.
Serie's voice somehow just instantly felt suitable in my head.
@@climax-sann Oddly, you're not the first person to even make a video about adaptation and pointing to the same "flaw" of how "Flamme's age is never stated" or something similar. It's possible that some people missed it the first time (I watched 30+ reactions to Frieren Anime - at least 15% of reactors did have issues placing when Flamme lived or how old Frieren was) and like it often happens, even if they later watch it again, they don't listen as carefully, because they "remember" what was said. But not really.
Of course I don't know if this was what happened to you. There might be multitude of reasons of why you missed it and I don't intend to crucify you for that ;)
Things like that can happen even when you're 100% focus on the thing you're doing. Add in family, random noises, trying to appreciate the visuals rather than focusing on text you remember from Manga - and that's still just normal stuff.
As for Serie's voice - I think in the end it was great choice. Even though my first reaction was "How in the hell is she supposed to make that low sond with that short windpipe?" But then you look at her VA and she doesn't look like she could pull it off either. Sometimes the world is funny. And Serie having "Commanding voice", but also having "softer side" makes sense.
I do apologize. I replied before watching the video, but simply after seeing comment that reminded me of 2 other instances where criticism was "Anime doesn't tell us Flamme's age etc.". So I replied.
And now I'm bit afraid of watching this video. I watched 3 videos about Frieren comparing Source material and it's adaptation into Anime. 1 was mostly positive, pointing out few things that could have been done better/differently etc. And even if I didn't agree with everything it was obvious that person had not only opinions, but also actual knowledge of how adaptation process works. And how conveying various types of information in those 2 very different media makes it really really hard to make perfectly and honestly often Anime that tries to be "too faithful" to source material end up badly (recent example - Helck. It wasn't the only problem this anime had and it got a bit better, but that lack of understanding that you have to fill places in between panels with something "original" was one of the reasons why that adaptation is unlikely o continue). And creators are stuck in between trying to make adaptation that is
1. faithful
2. Fills in the blanks in between panels (when needed - that depends on situation etc.).
3. Works as an anime for the first time viewer who has 0 knowledge of source material.
4. works for people who also read the source material.
In reality there are even more constraints, but the first video about Frieren comparing source material to adaptation was trying to do so for first 4 episodes. It was over 1 hour long.
I only lasted 8 minutes, which were whole filled by a rant of how some rock near the road looks different in Anime than in Manga and how that makes Frieren the "Worst adaptation of all times" (Couple hours later like/dislike ratio was turned off, then comments, then video was unlisted - I don't remember channel name, but I think it was nuked as well, because of flak said person got). I understand being passionate about stuff. I understand being even a bit unhinged about stuff you love. I mean I've been reading Frieren since it was still a one shot - and I love it to bits. But if I used all my bad faith and threw out all my understanding of how adapting from Manga to Anime works, then maybe at worst I could give "Anime Frieren" 7/10. And I don't feel like after throwing logic and how universe works out of the window, I should be making video shouting that "It's the worst adaptation only Good (7/10)".
Which gets me back to why I'm skittish to watch your video. You turned off like/dislike ratio. Multiple comments seem to be jokes etc. If you tell me that your video isn't some rant at how "Anime people didn't understand the beauty of Frieren" - then I will definitely watch it and tell you what I agree with and what I disagree with. But you're very unlucky. Because the videos trying to compare the 2 - almost always manage to tick of both sides. And both sides have rabid parts of fandom. I'll try to watch it tomorrow. But if it's a good video (so not 1 sided rant) - then I will recommend it to others.
@@jannegrey593 I don't believe it was one-sided (you can watch it and prove me wrong), but I had to come to a conclusion which of the versions I preferred. Also the thing with Flamme's age wasn't exactly a critisizm towards the anime. I was explaining another point that related to Flamme's age/era.
p.s. My video is not that deep. Just comparing the two based on some points and saying which I like better. You can give it a shot.
@@climax-sann Thank you - calm response, no shouting. I can watch it and will. Sorry, it's just that this particular niche of Frieren videos seems to be possessed by taken or vice versa ;)
You will have full review in few hours.
"The characters had better voices in the manga"...
"Do you hear what I say? Yes? - You better get your ears checked, because nobody made a sound here" - Scott McLoud, "Understanding Comics".
It's the same thing as visualizing what the characters are doing and how the scenes are played out in reading a book, this time with the voices.
@@climax-sann - I simply found funny that you decided to point out that the voices of the characters in the manga were more satisfying.
Mind you, when I came across that observation in Scott McLoud's comic, it struck me as a brick.
On the flip side, no "external voice actor" that the real world can provide is likely to sound more satisfying, to you, than the ones that your fantasy conjure up.
@@woongah I agree. It's just I had some problems with some of the voices in the anime, while for obvious reasons I don't in the manga. The anime did not have to surpass, it just have to be acceptable (which it often was, with some more minor issues). It can be different, as long as it feels fitting.
Plus, you'll be surprised how often voices in dubs can exceed your imaginations.
Yeah i came for an objective opinion and end up just listening some dude's mumble jumble about "manga voices" and "vibes".
@@CarloGoiff666 What's wrong with vibes? Maybe terming it as "manga voices" was wrong on my end, but nevertheless everyone has expectations/imaginations to character voices when reading and then we just compare it against their actual voices in the anime
Giving character voices to a silent medium is hilarious ngl
Not rly, people can imagine how the voices sound like in their head.
So yeah, anime > manga
As a huge fan of the Manga before the anime, the Anime enhances every aspect of the Manga, nah 2 chapters is perfect the divine revolt and El Dorado arcs to me go together perfectly and are both combat heavy so it's definitely going to be stretched out, also it gives the next season a natural stopping point and it only uses 44 chapters maybe 46, giving a potential s3 time to breathe
Thanks for showing the manga comparisons. However, I have to disagree on several points:
1) 2:02 Arbitrarily adapting 3 chapters per volume would probably affect the pacing of the episodes. Whoever adapted these chapters probably had an end result in mind and did a great job. The stories did not seem slow to me as you said for some episodes, and I agree with your point that ending where they did was very good for a season ender.
2) 3:46 I agree this change was very nice for the anime and Fern really did look adorable. ^_^
3) 4:26 I like the anime change to show Fern waking up Frieren, because it shows Fern’s caring personality. Despite her disdainful, judgmental looks and mild temper tantrums, Fern cares for her party. This was further shown by how she draped Stark with her own coat (though later she held up his jacket with her fingers like they were stinky, haha).
4) 5:25 I have to disagree with you there. Though you say it doesn’t seem logical that Wirbel would be though one to attack first, and that showing Ubel attacking first shows her greater bloodlust, I think the way the anime presented it makes more sense. First of all, it’s Wirbel’s party that is ambushing Ubel’s party. It would be pretty incompetent of you if you’re ambushing but you get attacked first instead. Second, we already had a good idea of Ubel’s bloodlust in the scene with the bandits and in her joy in talking about how they’d get to fight as others would come after their bird. In addition, it immediately makes you interested in Wirbel’s character, as it seems like he’s a cold-blooded killer, and you don’t know the outcome of who’d come out on top between his and Ubel’s battle.
Yes, the backgrounds, animation quality and storyboarding, and attention to detail, such as period clothing, architecture, etc., helps with the world building and helps the viewer get immersed in their world. The extending fight scenes, btw, is another reason why it’s probably a bad idea to arbitrarily adapt 3 chapters per episode… if they did that, we would have lost out on these great fight scenes.
12:49 Meh… this is subjective. The manga panel makes Ubel look more devious, but it also makes her look younger.
13:43 I think the anime version of Himmel’s face shows more complexity and maturity. The look in the anime version is one where he is holding back his feelings. He knows his elf love does not understand human feelings, empathy, etc., so he puts on a brave face. We as viewers can see that, and it makes the scene sadder and more poignant. In the manga version, we just feel bad for Himmel.
14:50 When you are talking about the voices, I wonder if you heard the original Japanese version or a dubbed version.
16:52 Edel speaks like an upperclass woman…an aristocrat. It would not match the characters that you speak of here. The subtitles or manga translation probably couldn’t convey that.
18:40 I don’t think the anime is “slow and relaxing” either… it shows realism where it needs, and the pacing is great, with a mix of action and times for character development and storytelling. As a manga reader, you’re probably flipping through the pages, and thus you set your own pace, so it may seem like it flows faster to you. As an anime viewer, I feel like the way the story is paced creates great world building and guides the viewer to experience this story. Also, maybe because you already read the manga, you knew what would happen, so scenes seemed slow to you. But as a viewer, I never thought it was slow or “slice of life” as you described.
How do you not mention Evan Call's INCREDIBLE score as a point for the anime.
I only added the music at the end as a point, but didn't exactly go into it cuz the manga didn't have music (at least not in my head) so it wouldn't exactly be a comparison. I simply consider it already included with the 'visuals', which was basically meant as all the technical side of things. But yeah, definitely a plus point for the anime.
That would be like giving a point to the anime for having color, wouldn't it? Or for having movement. To be fair, though, he did offer a slight advantage to the manga for having better voices in his head for it, so maybe it is fair game.
A lot of this is just "My interpretation of the manga was more in line with my interpretation of the manga than the anime was"
Excellent comparison! One of the very best Manga-to-Anime adaptations I have ever seen! One critical error, was in the fight in the dungeon, where the Frieren clone uses some unknown force to blow Fern back against the wall. Fern in the anime calls it in English translation, The Height of Magic while in the manga, she calls it The Apex of Magic. This is a very significant change for the development of the later story in explaining Demon magic. While the English "height of x" suggests a maximum. If some fact is "the height of x", there is always a higher height in x+1. An Apex is not a value of any kind. It is a religious pointer to the divine. There is nothing higher than an Apex. In ancient times, an Apex was literally an arrow pointing to Heaven which then was thought to be just above our heads. Also Apex has a complex and subtle linguistic connection to Flamme. The Japanese publisher of the English translation, Shogakukan Asia, chose Apex for their English translation.
17:31 Everyone prefers the voices we have in our minds for characters over the ones they end up being given, unless they miraculously somehow sound exactly like we imagined them to sound. I personally would still put that as a draw, as nobody can compete with the voice expectations of the readers.
To comment on the slow or calming feeling of the anime, I feel like that should be a point for the anime. You personally may not prefer it, but I feel like the anime is trying to portray an emotion of loss and longing that takes place at the end of something, but also at the same time trying to convey warm feelings as well. These tend to translate to slow, calming moments quite often and I feel like the anime translates these emotions very well.
Yeah, it's not exactly easy to produce voices that somehow is better than the ones we imagined. Simply being a fitting voice already shows a good adaptation. I don't mind the voices being different if they are fitting, it's just there were some minor shocks to some of the voices for me.
@climax-sann if you haven't watched the dubbed version yet, I highly recommend it; the voices there are perfect and I can't imagine any better ones for the characters.
I don't know,. Anya trying to use her mature voice sounds about right to me for frieren.
I am left with the impression that you generally prefer reading and still panels so that you can use your own imagination on the rest. Which in turn seems like it was enough to tip the scales in the manga's favor for you. Which is fine.
When it comes to matters of taste, you have to know another's tastes before their opinions on the matter can mean anything to you. So please, correct me if I mistook the situation.
Frieren feels like a timeless anime. Like, if you grabbed an avid anime watcher from 2004, 1990, and 2018, I feel like they wouldn't find this anime out of its element visuals-wise
Ubel attacking makes less sense cause the context is an ambush. What a bad ambush if you dont get the first attack lol
In the manga she got ambushed and then instantly jumped at Wirbel and team. In the anime she got ambushed with the first line of spells and then Wirbel rushed in instead of the other way around.
@climax-sann that's my point that's a shit ambush. It makes sense that the guy who has war experience would actually capitalize and take the lead. It also makes more sense for them to be able to get their preferred match ups that way if they charged in.
@@codegeass7162 Now I see it, yeah. However, it can also be interpreted that Wirbel was over-confident with his first barrage of spells, considering he was shocked Fern managed to block it, which is why he just nonchalantly walked into Fern. In this way it wasn't necessarily a bad ambush (it still technically is because they failed), but rather simply a misjudgement from Wirbel.
The scene where the guy attacked first was done so with other similar shots for hype up the fight and make a twist later.
I'm commenting this before watching the video, but I honestly believe that they did a fantastic job with the Anime for Frieren.
The story as told is mostly the same. The details are there from the manga, which is where most Anime stumble - there's details that fill out the world that are missing, which can be confusing if you only watch the anime. And then Frieren goes beyond on a few occasions - the dance scene is most notable, but it's far from the only example.
Yeah, you're right. They did an amazing job with the adaptation. It's basically 1 for 1 and they did go beyond at certain points. Both Anime and Manga were amazing and I enjoyed both of them. I read the manga first, so maybe Manga bias and stuff, but my conclusion was that I simply enjoyed the manga much more than the anime.
@@climax-sann I read the first chapter of the manga, then realized that it was about to release as an anime, so put it on the back burner.
Watched about half of the anime, decided that I was too impatient, and dived into the manga.
So I had about half Anime first, and the other half Manga first.
Maybe you have a more vivid mental image of what's going on when you read than I do - it came across that your "manga bias" was more "I liked how I imagined it" in the video.
For me, I loved what they did with the animation, it really brought it to life for me. I wish I had a fraction of the talent shown in both writing the story in the first place, and the screenplay/animation they did for the anime.
Both are just stunning.
@@TheBaldrickk"I liked how I imagined it" is the perfect way to summarize what I said.
my guy did not just say the characters had better voices in the manga.
i was completely with you until you started talking about how the story should not be slow. is bro reading at light speed or what
Bro, I will debate with everyone that the Frieren manga isn't 'slow'
@@climax-sann Every word, every frame has a deeper meaning. The anime pulls this off exceptionally well. If it feels slow, you are missing the deeper things that are going on under the surface. It isn't slow at all; it is a masterpiece of storytelling.
@@climax-sann Neither was frieren anime. Best part about frieren was always storytelling and the anime had the perfect pacing and OST to back it up. Even next major arcs in the manga such as El dorado and goddess monument arc were so great because of how it was narrated. All those character relationships, flashbacks and prior events combined with the present makes a incredible storyline. And the anime used all those elements perfectly. Good stories take there time and I'm glad frieren adaption turned out as it did
@@mdtaj7563 With slow I wasn't referring to the particular pacing or how fast the story proceeded from event to event. I talked about it in the mood section. It's that laid back slow atmosphere. I don't mind all the details and extra flashback cuts, but it felt too laid back (take Laid back camp as reference), which was an atmosphere I had not imagined while reading the manga (maybe some people did).
How is the dance scene a mere mention on the last section??? That scene is what single-handedly makes the anime better than the manga, it should be a big part of the first section!
"The anime does feel slow" and that shows that you don't understand Frieren at all
i didn't knew they adapted almost all scenes exactly as showed in the manga. this happens with all anime? they reproduce the same scenarios, composition, angles, etc? or is just in Frieren?
For almost of Anime adapted from manga, yes. Every scene is the exact same, there are some exceptions that are known as the worst of all, like Tokyo Ghoul, The Promised Neverland and others. For Novels is different, there are just words and few panels, in that case the adaptation is based more on the dialogues like Mushoku Tensei, Re:Zero, Classroom of the Elite, and etc. it depends on the source material and if would adapt faithfully to the original.
Not exactly the same composition, perspectives or angles (sometimes it is) but essentially the same scene and shot.
Mate. The anime was perfectly paced; it didn't need to be compressed!
I watched the show first and read the manga later. I loved the pacing and the "chill" vibes of the anime. I felt that the manga was too fast paced for me. So maybe what media we consume first factors into this.
14:43 for dumb future reference, only because it took me by surprise, mon-not-toe-nuss, once you say it fast it sounds like mon-not-ta-niss.
Are you watching sub or dub version of the anime (or none if you understand japanese)? And are you reading translation or are you reading straight from japanese version of the manga? It's so easy to miss out on the subtle things and get lost in translation since both version is not necessarily the same. Both version of anime and manga are not necessarily the same depending on the language used (sub/dub/japanese). These days, I prefer to judge different media (movies/anime/manga/books) separately. You might like one media and absolute hate the others. For example: I'm old school, I really love reading Dragon Ball. But I absolute hate the anime (the one that I've seen 20+ years ago). But in this case, I really love Frieren anime. I read the manga too but to me the anime is superbly done. YMMV
As a manga read before the anime adaptation I would say I can not make a hardcut and say one is better than the other. In reading the manga your imagination is forced to make of the panels shown a sequence and let it play in your mind. So I get why the anime which makes the visualization of the in between like fast food is not for some people and others have it hard to enrich a panel in to a full scenario. Since the text of the people was 99% the same in manga and anime and the adaptation followed so close to the panels given i can't pick one over the other. What was tried to be conveyed reached me in both forms of medium. Emotionally with the background music and the good VA performance I might say the anime gets me to resonate in certain scenes even stronger.
For the 3 chapters in one episode I could not disagree more. Since every chapter if it is not for an arc is a self contained premise the author wants to bring across I think having 2 themes mixed in one episode is okay. If you were to make it 3 themes at least one would go out of the window since for the audience to remember the first half seems nowadays near impossible. So no to that. And the gluing together of 3 chapters that are arching is also not the best. Specifically the first mage exam comes to mind where at the end of one chapter Denken goes into the uselessness to undo the frozen lake which is the introduction in the next chapter as a reminder too. But since these both chapters were adapted into one it felt of Denken saying nearly the same thing twice. Now if 3 chapters were to be adapted and these reminder would be faithfully adapted this feels more then awkward as it was with this episode. So I can not agree with that. The pacing was not as slow as you make it out to be. I think manga since you don't have the details can be consumed rather quick. After a 2nd or more watches something akin comes in, but the first time watch actually profits very much from the "taking time" because the background art is no hastily made color puke or geometric forms, but visual rich motives that need time to be soaked in.
Anyhow this was an interesting watch.
Bro, I came to the same conclusion about the potential issue if 3 themes/messages were to be fit in an episode. I removed that part of the recording, cuz I was lazy to edit more and I didn't know if I conveyed this idea well, but yeah great point. Interesting points made.
ty for this video
Frierenenenenenenen