Why F1 cars are SLOWER than Supercars? Engineer Explains!
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- Опубліковано 7 гру 2022
- EVERYONE knows it's because F1 cars are designed to go around corners fast... but that's not everything.
Here are 6 major misconceptions about why an F1 car ISN'T faster than some supercars.
I wasn't even going to make this video until I posted a Short about Formula 1 cars and their top speeds. But I had so many comments with some very fundamental misconceptions about how power, drag, weight, and gearing are all related.
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#formula1 #f1 #engineering #redbullracing - Спорт
I'm a graduate engineer, with some FS experience and a massive F1 fan. I have been watching your channel since the beggining and I want to offer you massive congratulations for the fine balance between simple explanations and deep dives you make, Blake, you are awesome man, keep it up!
i read this as i'm a graduate engineering with some f**ks sake experience
@@skilllondon6716 It took me 2 years to not chuckle when I saw those to letters combined 😂
@Skill London haha loved that joke, I have a Bachelor of Science in Mechanical Engineering and it was always funny to read BS Degree on the transcripts back in college 😂 oddly enough I'm working as a Civil Engineer now, still a massive F1 and mechanical engineering fan!
😭😭 mate I'm an unemployed automotive masters graduate as well and my final project was to calculate drag coefficient of the Tesla Cybertruck. This vid is so relatable 🙋🏻🤍
Thanks so much!
That external combustion engine joke caught me off guard lmao
LOL I gotta keep ya on your toes man 😂
@@brrrake definitely. I almost feel stupid for considering googling "ferrari external combustion". Love a good neutrally-delivered sneaked in joke. Keep it up.
Same. I was rolling @ 4:32
Caught Carlos off guard too 😬
How did I miss that? I thought he said internal combustion. I was so confused LMFAO.
I’m a dancer with a Mechanical Engineering degree who’s been following Formula 1 for about three years now and i must say, your videos are beautifully done! It’s refreshing to hear someone with actual engineering knowledge breaking down the beauty of math and physics in F1! Reminds me of how much of a nerd I am and why I love motor sport! Bravo sir! Bravo👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽
Do a in depth technical comparison video on F1 cars vs Le man cars please
You are the F1 Mark Rober and I hope you will soon be enjoying the same level of success! Thank you for the great content!
That external combustion engine joke had me finished. 🤣🤣🤣🤣
Ferrari did it to themselves, thank them! haha
Great. The final part tells why an f1 car can be driven only by people that are well prepared physically
As someone who works in the Automotive industry as an engineer, I could not think of an easier way to explain those concepts than you did in the video.
Also, your insights on the external combustion engines developed by ferrari is amazing.
Thank you, Sarang! Also I'm glad you enjoyed the discussion of Ferrari's developments 😅😅
Excellent video Blake. One of your best. Informative, concise and easy-to-understand. Good job homie!
Thank you, HMS BOJO James Man!
Been on F1 yt for a long time now. I already had a very good understanding of these concepts, yet still this video got me hooked. I think I've never seen anyone explain this subject so well. Great video
Thanks so much!
@@brrrake Thank you! Keep up the amazing work
What a great channel to get into F1 and keep learning about it. Keep it up mate!!!
Your content is always fascinating.
This was a good watch, love the information🔥
How about a "what if" video of if F1 had a drag race at the end of every season, where they removed all regulations and let teams go absolutely berserk. Some questions:
1. What sort of regulations are hindering the ability to max out a car's straight line speed?
2. Which generation of f1 car is the best to try a top speed record on?
3. Which team's chassis/aero design/ power unit is already best equipped for the job?
Thanks! This video made me sub today!
It's just power. Fuel flow limited to approx 100kg/hr
I think the best generation would be the slippery V10s of 2004/05. In the current V6 hybrid era only the 2016 cars come close
At Monza in 2004/05 the cars were doing about 365 - 370 kph in qualifying with no extras whatsoever (DRS ,ERS, Turbo,Tow), but did have unrestricted fuel flow & injection pressure, free choice of gear ratio & 20k rpm limit which is commendable
agree with that ending, I feel waaaaaaaaaaay more smarter watching this video HAHAHA. Another great one Blake, makes me wanna re-visit my undergrad thesis. I remember it took me quite a while to write the "background" part on how aerodynamics in race car works. Wish this video was uploaded 2 years ago, not an hour ago 😂😂😂
I'm sorry I was still at Red Bull then and I couldn't do YouTUbe .😂
great video bud, you have a thing for these explanations, keep up the good work
Took a glance at the title and thought to myself, "I wont learn anything, its just another f1 content creator youtube video"
Then I noticed it was Brrrake and completely rethought my previous impression. Thanks for the quality content man, so much more informative than 85% of the content creators right now.
Thanks, Nick! I always do my best to deliver. I'm glad you enjoyed it!
Brilliant video. The way you broke down the drag coefficient and it's relation to top speed for F1 cars is amazing.
Hello! I'm really glad you enjoyed it!!
"Ferrari were rumoured to be working on an EXTERNAL combustion engine this season" hahaha oh god.
We’re getting to technical terms where people mostly don’t care about. It’s hard to prove because not everyone can comprehend everything. But once you try to understand it will all make sense.
Amazing video. Warms my heart
It should maybe also be mentioned that while the power of the ICU + ERS might be 1,000hp in total, typically the ERS will be deployed at the beginning of a straight, and will not be available at the end anymore (you need a braking zone to charge up again). So the available power at the end of a straight will be more like 800+hp. So, even if you have an infinte straight, the terminal velocity will be determined by the ICE alone.
Also, higher rpm will not yield significantly more power anymore beyond a certain limit, because fuel mass flow is limited by the regulations at 100kg/h.
Most cars in qualifying are deploying ot the end of the straight, actually. It depends on their drag level, pace and EM strategy. 👍 In some cases, you're correct, but in many instances teams are deploying most of the lenght of the main straights.
@@brrrake i kinda disagree with this.
In Quali, ERS is used throughout thr lap regardless of opening the waste gate to use more out of corners.
Most drivers deploy off corner exits, not really on the straights for Qualifying. It still is circuit dependant, but generally clean exit is what gives any driver more lap time.
@@slimstrait780 you're mistaken. That's not how it works. Electrical deployment is MOST of the full throttle in quali. Wastegate strategy depends on the team and isn't particularly relevant to this discussion
@@brrrake so basically what you're saying is that, what I didn't say was wrong but rather than say so you're simply disregarding what I said?
I said I disagree I didn't say you were wrong.
I never implied ERS wasn't deployed primarily at full throttle?
I'm saying that when it comes down to it, a lot of ERS can be used at corner exits.
Nothing I said is irrelevant, if not it just adds to your comment.
@@slimstrait780 unless you work for a power unit manufacturer I'm not sure you'll have much of an understanding of their wastegate strategies. Yes it's used on corner exit. But in qualifying it's used for almost the entire straight on most straights. You can't use more or less on corner exits. The power is limited to 120kw. Sorry I'm a bit lost
I'd loved too see all the equations in one frame so you can follow allong and pause to understand it. Otherwise very nice video. I came into f1 because I was interested in the physics of cars and racing. Love this kind of content.
I randomly ended up here and i love the knowledge you gave through this video. I don't usually comment, but great video!
I have enjoyed it and thank you for making it
Thanks, Robert!
4:50 ...And rarely exceeds 12000 RPM... Fun fact: If you mention this anywhere near guys, who remember V10 sound from 2000s, resulting outcry would very much be louder than actual current gen car engine roar... Or whimper
Truth!
Great Vids, love cool
Thank you!
That Honda motor… it still makes my heart skip a beat. It’s such a work of pure beauty.
Keep up the great work Blake!
Thanks, you too!!
@@brrrake
Seeing Drag equation triggered my Aersoapce Engineering degree PTSD. Great video as always Blake
My uncle has been a mechanic for 40+ years and has served as a Crew Chief at a grassroots motorsport level for multiple years. In this time he worked at an aftermarket performance tuner and would always follow up the statement from customers "I want to go fast!" with the question "Okay, how do you want to go fast?" to many a quizzical expressions. Fast comes in so many different shapes and sizes that all you need to do is look at all the vastly different motorsports disciplines across the globe to just begin to have an understanding. Defining fast is a tremendously tricky question to answer and one must narrow it down to "fast how" before one can make a full package to accomplish that task. The only misconception that I would say I failed on is the #6, Honestly never gave much thought about how much of an affect drag would have on an F1 car at relative Top Speed and how strong it really is. Guess I should have taken into consideration how many G's Fighter Aircraft generate since I can't imagine a modern F1 car is not too far off of a fighter jet pulling on the joystick at max tilt.
Maybe faster in a straight line, until breaking and cornering is inserted in the equation.
Thats where the F1 car really shines.
Exactly
This channel is extremely underrated. Subscribed ;)
Thanks man!
A most excellent video. As an aero engineer who built commercial airlines for a living, this video explains the complexities of engineering a vehicle to go fast on a multitude of racing circuits very, very well. I would love to see your analysis of car performance at all the F1 racing circuits, and the compromises that the FIA Formula 1 rules and restrictions induce in the designs of the ten cars. Buy the way, I concur with all six of your conclusions that debunk the common myths about F1 cars when compared to super- or hyper-cars. Perhaps an even better analysis of race car performance can be realized by comparing F1 cars to sports prototype cars such as Le Mans or Daytona.
Oh that's an excellent suggestion! Thanks so much for the kind words man! Maybe we'll look at this a bit more in the future
Love the video! Always so informational.
The white board moving with the writing was a bit annoying, all I saw was words slightly shaking.
I've made a note of it. I genuinely appreciate the feedback 🤝🤝 also thanks
IndyCar teams spend a month in may preparing for the Indy 500 and trimming the car out to about half the drag of a the street and road circuits . Some of the teams have specialists who go over every surface smoothing , adjusting , covering every gap and join to make the cars as slippery as possible . The result is almost 400km top speeds with only 6-700hp of power , 1/3 less than f1 car and in a bigger , heavier and less sophisticated car. But the f1 car is much faster around a road/street circuit as drag and downforce gets added back on . its all about design choices and goals
Excellent summary
Fantastic video! Thanks
Mech E isn’t my wheelhouse, but I always appreciate watching other engineers slay in their circuit!
Thanks man!
That's surprising that Mexico is where everyone hits the highest top speed, but then you factor in the lower air density and the track layout basically mirroring Monza then it does make sense, everything else made sense to me already having watched the top gear Bugatti special which also stated that drag is the biggest hurdle to going past ~350kph, like logically, all that downforce that pushes a car down in corners don't just disappear along the straights
Its awesome to see the follow-up video you referenced in my comment on your shorts video :D 1000 HP of drag. Units are weird.
I think I have wtChed this video three times now.. this is the coolest thing I have ever learned
Great video
Thanks, Darren!
Bugatti engineers said a couple things that are noteworthy. The first was that the Chiron weighs over 4000 lbs because it has to be a stable platform at +250 mph. They said a car at those speeds wants to fly so badly that any undulation or bump that upsets the car relationship to the road would launch it into the air. Instead of using permanent huge wings to keep the car planted, they engineers used weight with a smaller wing.
They also said that after a certain speed, the factor of air resistance is a inverse square to velocity and the car requires a lot of HP just to go slightly faster.
They said that tires were a factor in building a car that can reliably go over 250 MPH since the RPM of the tires cause so much stress that they can fly apart... yet alone the friction caused by the high speeds affecting wear and handling. It took Michelin a while to come up with tires that could handle the speeds and be street legal at the same time.
Lastly, the transmission was the potential limiting mechanical factor in the Chiron and it took a lot of engineering to get a transmission strong enough to handle the torque and horsepower of the car.
I'm a driving instructor, also huge F1 nerd. I use the "1G" braking fact all the time when I'm teaching emergency stops. Afterwards, to try and get people to perform the stop better, I quite often joke about being "able to stop quicker if I just took my foot off the accelerator!"
LOL just lift off the gas, man!
Gears? Enter the CVT… oh, it was so good they banned it…
What if one of the higher altitude circuits was held at sea level? 1)same setup, 2)setup with the same downforce level as (high altitude), 3)setup with the same drag level(h.a), 4)other set up in between(3 and 4 settings). Can we rank them ? (minimum lap time). What's the sweet spot between drag and downforce?
Damn, nice F1 channel for a change.
I took my physics final today felt confident loved the class and I love everything about this educational video thanks
Cause they are designed not for top speed, but for being fast AROUND circuits. Another whole concept. Now ima watch the video
I heard those lmp cars with that stupid fin on the back happens to be able to accelerate faster than f1
Just a quick correction : the aero drag increases in a polynomial way, not exponentially. Also, I love your videos !
I didn't mean this literally 😅 the ^2 kind of covers that but fair point! Thanks so much
Layman: F1 are designed to Drive around Racing circuits as quickly as possible rather than straight line top speed.
Engineers/Physicists: Aero Dynamic, drag, downforce, Faster at corner>straight line speed, compromises, e=mc²!
Well explained! You really should have added a quick sentence explaining WHY they want all this induced drag. That would be to allow more power to be applied to the tires without them losing grip for faster acceleration, as well as to allow faster corner speeds, also due to the tires being forced down onto the surface.
I really didn't dig into that at all and I'm a bit disappointed now honestly! Great point
@@brrrake Thank you! I am just like you, as I love explaining things to people in language they can understand, even without the slightest knowledge about a subject, and you are about the best at it! My OCD was responsible for my comment ;)
@@mykemech it was a totally valid comment and I love constructive feedback always!
Great one blake. I think you could have gone deeper on air density and the extra effect that has on everything from drag to cooling. Or even how engineers look at air as less dense water. Did not know the teams were locked in with gear ratios for the season.
I know the rules say 8 fwd gears and no overdrive gears. How close to 1:1 will they go for 8th gear?
Why can they not have a gear that's overdrive?
@@beemrmem3 its in the rules that they cant have a overdrive gear. Each team picks their gear ratio’s and thats what they use for the whole season. Not every team has the same gear ratio’s either.
I didnt even know that they created so much drag.. im an f1 noob so i always thought it was more aerodynamic😅 makes sense though.. seriously appreciate all the info
😭😭 mate I'm an unemployed automotive masters graduate as well and my final project was to calculate drag coefficient of the Tesla Cybertruck. This vid is so relatable 🙋🏻🤍
Thanks for making me gooder smarter ❤
The segment in gearing was what confused me tbh, ty for bringing light on that
Btw I feel happy that my comment partly inspired this video 😊
good one blake
The Honda at bonneville was actually built to regulation and theoretically could’ve entered a Grand Prix and been legal
I didn't know that! Mental!
Great video but I did not really understand why they make the cars so draggy. How does that optimize lap time ?
Because downforce!
You earned my subscribe at precisely 0:51 into the vid
I knew there would be a few connoisseurs in the audience 🙏
"You don't need a windtunnel to see this."
And there my coffee went *sploosh*
😂
If you know, you know 😂
Great video! What's the reason all the cars are geared for at least 400kph? If they made the gearing slightly shorter, perhaps to 370 or 380kph, could they not get a little more top speed due to having a little more torque? Or do they have such long gears for fuel efficiency reasons?
Most likely past the max torque so no advantage to the overall lap time and engine wear as they are limited on the amount of engines they are allowed for the season
@@bloodzkull ah, that makes a lot of sense. Thanks!
Lol we should know the answer to that already, but let’s hear what u gotta say Blake
SHOULD!
Does anyone know if the 20m price tag is for one car or is that including all the replacement parts they are aloud per season ?
1 car
Because the engine itself alone is the most expensive part of the entire car where it can run as little as $10,000,000 bucks
I did read they are allowed up to 3 F1 engines with one of them used for qualifying laps (where the engine is set to run at MAXIMUM RPMS!)
11:56 One dumb question: why at Baku they reach high top speed if they are not in a high altitude? is this because of the shape of the circuit that requires low downforce?
It's the longest full throttle region on the calendar and this year particularly there were insane winds I'm fairly certain (~40kph. Most of which I believe was a tailwind on that straight)
What happen when F1 drive in mexico circuit, but using monza spec car? Will it reach 400kph?
Probably yes
The level of information and data he gave was amazing!!! Never thought learning mathematics can be more fun!! 😂💖💖
Thank you, Ayush!
I would feel very unsafe in a supercar going so fast with so little downforce.
I would feel unsafe above 160mph or so, I reckon.
Ngl you are one of the reasons I don't want to give up on my dream to work in F1. Thank you. It's been more difficult than you could ever imagine but you bring me hope when even I don't believe in me. Thank you man.
You can do it!
@@brrrake love ya man
fyi: I'm one of people he calls out in this video.
Firstly, excellent video all around. Clear points, supported by data & math. you earned a sub on this one.
my original contention was about gearing and kind of remains: there IS a gear set by which that car - can - go faster (maybe not much, but some) after watching this video, I'll add: but you wont find it in an F1 race because its not strategically advantageous. I think our disagreement (if it was even that) has more to do with you looking at it inside the scope of actual racing with all the restrictions & strategy (a valuable POV), while I was talking more about just raw mechanics.
ps I dig the white board to show some of the math, but please stop it from wobbling!
Hey man! Thanks for the comment. To your defense prior to the V6 hybrids, the v8s would spend some time now and then in the limiter in 7th gear depending on the circuit and having a tow.
Definitely going to dial the whiteboard wiggle jiggle down 🤣
At the end of the day the f1 car is compromised by catering to cornering speed.
Pure top speed is almost always irrelevant and can't be considered alone. The Williams spent a lot of time in the upper end of the speed traps at the end of the season... Doesn't really say much 😅
Cheers, Matt! Welcome to the channel. Thanks for the discussion and constructive criticism on the video - it genuinely helps 🤝
Okay, I’m right at the “misconceptions” introduction and have to say before I hit play again, I can’t believe people on the internet think it’s a good idea to “actually..” a former F1 engineer. SMH. I’m an electrical engineer and love all of the engineering that goes into F1.
It happens. It's all part of the discussion but it's really strange when people tell me I'm wrong about something I spent a lot of time working on at a high level. Of course you can disagree with the comparison, but at least they need to bring some info to the table 😅 hope you enjoyed the video, as silly as it is!
@@brrrake not silly at all! I just find it weird that people will argue with you when you have the pedigree you do. :)
The budget for 2022 season is $140million divide that by two to get a price for each car per team, since you chose, Redbull they breached that budget cap, to get an advantage over other teams and merely got off with a slap on the wrist, so that redbull car costs somehow more.
You should apply for a job with the FIA. They could use your help
compare it with the old F1 cars the V10's era
put a 2004 late ferrary with slicks
Thank you man that’s paid knowledge right there for free
Also in mexico the combustion is limited even with turbos the engine cannot put as much power as in monaco
I think this depends on the engine and turbo. I'm pretty sure in the past some teams weren't turbo speed limited and others were. I could be mistaken though!
What was your role at red bull f1 team?
I was a Trackside Performance Engineer 2015-2017 (Performance engineer to Kvyat and Verstappen)
from 2018 to 2021 I was a Simulator Performance engineer
Couldn't help but point out that drag force doesn't increase exponentially with velocity. It's polynomial. Exponential would be something like 2^v
Yes. v^2
1:57 how far did he say literally?!
rad fucking video my dude
Appresh ya!
Honestly, if you just want to see a car go as fast as humanly possible, just watch NHRA Top Fuel, because those cars do 320 mph with ease, but it's a straight line to 1,000 feet
Edit: and this video could be applied to any form of motorsport in terms of explaining aerodynamics
Top speed is no need one have to copeup with average speed for a track and sustain it for longer duration।
Dude if your going on a steep hill the gear that can stabilize the car in an constant speed would allways be faster than if you put a higher gear
no matter how meny gears you have . What the people are trying to say is if you have a higher gear and you were on a flat surface you can go faster it would just be harder to rev up, but since you have all the other gears its a 100% go faster.
........ No
also to add up the reason why the teams cannot rev the engine up to 15k rpm, cause of the fuel limit flow. which sucks cause the rule makers knew about it. so dumb.
try to explain this on the next video thanks..
This Buggatti is literally as fast as a plane 😳
On cruise. 300 mph is a jetliner on cruise while the bugatti engine and tyre is at its limits.
@@dy7296doing at 490 is more than many chopper speed and on road the air resistance is more than in air.
Where's the sneak in the background moved to 🤨
I have parted with Sneak and I'm now doing my own thing.
They should change that gear ratio rule.
Why, exactly? It doesn't add anything.
Hypercar.
F1 cars could go faster, of course! But really, this video could simply be summed up as.... F1 cars are built to go fast around an entire lap and balance speed against grip, load and g forces. The top and low speed graph should have been caveated with this reflects the differing course types and, again, the aerodynamic packages applied for each. Also, F1 cars do have many reg applied, and there's also no refueling! Gone are the days of "splash and dash". Btw, nice to be reminded we don't hear the old phrase "hitting the rev limiter" when back in the days we might be watching a team getting it wrong come race day.
I was just about to say this....
In a nutshell, f1 cars plan on CORNERING, eventually, while a Bugatti doesnt 🤣🤣🤣🤣
For those who don't know the FIA basically limits how much the engine can rev at average and max, so YES, if they give the chance, an F1 car could actually rev into 19k rpm and go berzerk
But with the current fuel flow limitations there is no point. The engines spend most of their time upshifting around 12krpm (the limit is currently 15k).
I’ve been watching f1 for more than half my life and I’ve never seen anyone go into such deep explanations that make sense in some way to the average teenager
Thanks!!
Hi Blake, one thing that has to be factored in for the top speed of F1 cars is that they will often not have full power for an entire straight. At some point they will stop using the MGUK to power teh wheels and use the MGUH to store energy in the battery, and may also do some lift-and-coast, with the MGUK recovering energy as well.
Which brings me to the 2026 F1 rules. The maximum power output is about the same as now ~1,000hp, but there is much more from the MGUK - 470hp. And that MGUK power will only be available for short amount of time.
Could you do an analysis of the expected performance of the 2026 F1 power units and how they might be used?
This is the case sometimes, but most of the time in qualifying the cars are deploying down most all of the straights - if there is clipping it's a difference in a few KPH. This is of course in general, but there are exceptions.
I'm waiting for the 2026 F1 Power Units discussion to kick off a bit more then I'll do make some calculations on the power units - that is an excellent video idea though!
I really hope they make some more changes than just the power units, because those regulations with these cars look... crap.
@@brrrake Supposedly they will make the cars smaller and have active aero to reduce drag on straights. They will need a lot less drag on the straights. The weight will be much the same, as the power unit saves no weight over current units.
I don't know why there isn't more discussion on the 2026 power units now.
The rules don't seem to be conducive to good, hard racing. More endurance style racing. Which might be because the power split between ICE and ERS is almost exactly the same as old LMP1.
Well of those 20 million dollars for the f1 car is 10 million for just the engine
That Ferrari dig though
I'm a 23 year old guy doing a degree in car design. I been following F1 since I was a kid so most of stuff I pick up is off TV and the internet, and I'm happy to say that I only got 1 misconception wrong!
I learned today F1 Vmax is not gear limited! I also learned that everyone needs to select 1 set of ratios for the whole season, wew. But they're allowed to change final drive right?
Final drive is fixed with the hybrids! Good work though!
A modded Ford GT with only a turbo V8 has just done 500kmh. Street legal hypercars are just items created to flaunt wealth, nothing else.
I just want a 400 hp ford transit van
Got all of it correct. Make sense since I'm PROBABLY a PhD ;)))
Bwahaha. Ez ez ez
I have to say, I think the fixed gearing is a bit silly
Why exactly?
I really thought F1 used to go up to 410km/h but apparently no.
External combustion engine 🤣🤣🤣😭😭😭