Deut. 2:14 "And the space in which we came from Kadeshbarnea, until we were come over the brook Zered, was thirty and eight years; until all the generation of the men of war were wasted out from among the host, as the LORD sware unto them." Blessings!
The logical leaps that several of these are making are impressive. They require "as the crow flies" rather than accounting for known travel routes, that Moses is referring to the whole of Israel traveling together, a completely warped effort to reinterpret or retranslate the text (non-peer reviewed), and they all lack physical evidence than can be found at certain candidate sites.
As anyone who's an avid hiker knows (I just returned from Yosemite last week), the idea that any traversed distance translates to "as the crow flies" *distance* is laughable. I've seen four mile hikes completed in an hour, and six mile hikes completed in eight hours. Terrain (and to a lesser degree weather) mean EVERYTHING.
Justified comment except, back in those days they were a hell of a lot fitter. 2. The roads are established, note.. Roads, not tramping tracks for hiker's. If you want some awesome hikes, come and apply your avid-ness here down under...! Except, we hike in kilometres, we don't use that archaic shit....
I hope you upload Dr. Fritz's sessions about geographical and historical sources related to the location of Mt. Sinai. Fantastic production and team! God bless everyone.
Josephus and other ancient historians say that Kadesh Barnea was at Rekem which is Petra, which fits with Moses stating that they were at a city at the southern border with Edom.
1:39 Of cause it is the time for 1 person and not 3.000.000 people. Very interesting. So. 383 km from the traditional Sīnaī to Qādēsch Barneaʿ according to Google Maps fits perfectly. So she is right, that it could be 1 sentence and she is definitely right in 2 points. It is not the mountain in ʿarabīya as-saʿūdīya and no brackets. Midejān is in ʿarabīya as-saʿūdīya, yes, bet the Midejānīm lived on the Sīnaīpeninsula too. The sea cow (thachasch is not badger), who's leather was used for the tent of gathering (or meeting) lives in the south of the peninsula. The Jissrāʾēlīm wandered long enough (38 years) arround the mountain. 1606-1566 before our timecalculation.
I wouldn't lean on Robert Alter's translation of Scripture. In an interview he stated that scholarship long ago agreed in the document hypothesis: that the first five books of the Bible had different sources. Tim Mahoney did a good job of showing that Moses is most likely (i believe he definitely is) the sole (human) author of these five books in the Moses Controversy. In that same interview Alter also challenges the understood meaning of man being made in the image of GOD.
Alter is taking "image" as in our human physical make up, so serms ridiculous to the faithless as they see all the different people's around the world. BUT... We are all the same, genetically "Image", replace that word (for explanation only), with facsimile. God made us all genetically a facsimile of Himself, but also we're a spiritual being unlike animal's.
@@FlyingKiwi1968 'We are made in the image of GOD' means that we have spirit. Never trust one man's translation of Scripture. Committees are best endowed for this task.
Most people already know where Mount Sanai is. I don’t understand why we are still looking for it? And it was obviously volcanic and had an eruption during that time. That narrows it down a bit, right?
I noted in this UA-cam video at running time 11:34 on the map that "Horeb, [or Sinai printed in white letters, south of Mount Seir printed in yellow letters] is in what appears to be located in the Sinai Peninsula. This is not correct to me, for Horeb's or Sinai's location, as we have Saul of Tarsus (the apostle Paul's) statement when writing to the Christian Galatians, in his book Galatians Chapter 4: Verse 25 stating clearly that "... Sinai, [is] a mountain in Arabia, ..." This would place Mt. Sinai's true geographical location in the land of "Midian," depicted on maps drawn by Biblical cartographers in what is today, northwestern Saudi Arabia, EAST of the Sinai Peninsula and East of the Gulf of Aqaba (the latter an eastern "right arm" of the Red Sea) in southwestern Asia; and NOT in the Sinai Peninsula which is part of Egypt in northeastern Africa. "Midian," was the name of Abraham's 4th listed son by his 2nd wife Keturah, after his 1st wife Sarah had died. (See Genesis Chapter 25: Verses 1 and 2 NWT or New World Translation of the Holy Scriptures.) Moreover, there are cultural, physical geographical, and geological features that favor (Saudi) Arabia as being the correct location today of ancient Mount Horeb or Sinai. The Saudi Arabian government depicts Midian's Sinai location with rock or stone corrals, where livestock were temporarily housed prior to the ancient Israelites sacrificing bulls and sheep, and the summit of Sinai as being dark or black as a result of God's "descending" on the "holy mountain." Additionally, there is engraved on one rock a feature of a bull. In Egypt's Sinai Peninsula where a Catholic monastery is seen on one of the mountains, there are NO ancient geological, cultural, or physical geographical land features of evidence that would give credence that Mount Sanai was located in Egypt. Nothing in Egypt as compared with the evidence that archaeologists, geologists, and Bible scholars have found in Saudi Arabia, supporting the latter, as the apostle Paul stated in Galatians Chapter 4: Verse 25 that Sinai is in Arabian, NOT Egyptian territory.
Yes at the Red Sea crossing on both sides but that’s not Mt Sinai but Nuweva Beach. Moses was told to return to Midian where he was watching the flocks of Jethro when he saw the burning bush on the mountain.
Look up Ron Wyatt here and you can see the real Mt Sinai with the golden calf Altar the scarifice herding corral and the Split rock. Also ark discovery and Jim and Penny Caldwell who found the sites independently of Wyatt. There was also a dr to the Saudi Prince who found it.
The standard travel day was not about 20 miles, i.e. 32 km per day. The troops of Amenophis II could manage an average marching speed of 23.3 km per day; Thutmose III holds the record with 25 km; but Ramses II granted his soldiers rather more rest, they made only 20.3 km per day.(Elmar Edel, Zeitschrift des Deutschen Palästina-Vereins 69 1953, 153). With flocks and herds Moses best time was probably about 21km per day. Deborah is way off trying to mistranslate DT 1:1 as being in Moab. That is not the Jordan River but the Jordan valley including the Arabah valley. All the locations mentioned in DT 1:1 are south of Moab and are in and around Edom. You will notice the location of Hazeroth is on the way to Kadesh Barnea from Horeb. Not in Moab. Deuteronomy jumps around in space and time. DT 1:1-2 is about the second year at KB or in the east side of the Arabah. DT 1:3+ is about the 40th year in Moab, DT 1:6 is about the 2nd year but back at Horeb. DT 1:19 is back to Kadesh in the second year. Deb Hurn's Sinai as well as the classic Sinai also has the problem of Taberah where the quail came in from the sea. (Num. 11:31) There is no seashore camp.
All the places mentioned in Numbers 33 need identifying. Rameses to Suiccoth. To Etham. To Pii hahiroth before Baal zephon. To Migdol. To Marah. To Elim. To Red sea. To wilderness of Sin. To Dophkah. To Alush. To Rephidim. To wideness of Sinai. To Kibroth hattaavah. To Hazeroth. To Rithmah. To Rim mon parez. To Libnah. To Rissah. To Kehelathah. To Mount Shapher. To Haradah. To Makheloth. To Tahath. To Tarah. To Mithcah. To Hashmonah. To Benejaakan. To Horhagigad. To Jotbathah. To Ebronah. To Ezion gaber. To Widerness of Zin which is Kadesh. To Mount Hor in the edge of Edom. So Baal zephon , Pihahiroth and Migdal. Need identifying as the place of crossing. Also the place names that lead to Mount Sinai. This should describe the localities in question. No body seems to think it important, yet God has given precice locations.
I am very grateful for your ministry and I watched just about all the videos you post but on this I'm sorry I have to disagree they were not allowed into the land not because they didn't believe but because of their Disobedience same as Moses he disobeyed when he smoked the Rock and that was why he was not allowed in
And he said, The LORD came --from-- to Sinai, [point C] and rose up from Seir [point A] unto them; he shined forth from mount Paran, [point B, in betwixt] and he *came with* ten thousands of saints [angels]: from his right hand went a fiery law for the. {Deuteronomy 33:2} In summary, -- Seir [Edom]: point A is North -- Mt. Paran [Arabia]: point B is South of Seir, and North of Mt. Horeb. -- Mt. Horeb [Arabia]: is South from Mt. Paran, and South from Seir.
No exodus 3 and also exodus 8 clearly say its 3 day journey from egypt to sinai. Its 11 days from sinai to kadesh. This means its 3 times longer from kadesh to sinai from egypt. U will see on a map it doesnt work out. The distance from egypt to sinai is further than kadesh to sinai therefore we have an issue
What should have happened in 11 days took 40 years because of spiritual warfare. Ha satan and his demons didn't not want to let Yahweh's people go. This is Paul's revelation in Ephesians 6:10-18 speaks to, in part. Did the Hebrews have challenges of faith? Did they rebel? Yes but Lev 17:7 and Deut 32:17 give s a glimpse of the real battle. The real battle was, is and will always be spiritual. We do not war against flesh and blood but . . . This is why ha satan (Lucifer) sits on Mount Moriah today proclaiming he has defeated YHVH, after Isaiah 14. Still, this is a good academic debate.
A very healthy and fit adult who is used to walking... is not encumbered with any great weight... and is wearing very solid footwear... and is walking over even terrain ... could manage 20 miles in a day. Even more. But what about someone who is not all that fit... in their middle years... carrying water and provisions (something like 10 kgs / 20 lbs or so...? ) Considerations of terrain, temperature, wind, rain, etc all need to be factored in.
Been fact they were all fitter back then, it would be 35km per day AVERAGE Be also that they were well established routes. A fit human walks at 4km/hour So just under 9 hours, 35km (20 miles). Daybreak 6am to noon they can do 24km (6 x 4). A midday siesta (heat). Now they only have a 11km stretch left (2.75 hours). So, probably 2pm to 5pm, or even 3 - 6pm they've completed the 35km (20 miles).
Bani Israel was an Arabic tribe lived in Yemen along with bani yahuda and amonites and canaanites and philistines and many other Arabic tribes. Bani Israel never ever been in Egypt in Sinai in Jordan and in Palestine.
Interesting, but wrong! the locations of Mt Seir, Horeb, Hazerot and Lavan are incorrect and whoever created this map doesn't know anything about biblical geography.
BEST 2 CHANNELS on UA-cam: PatternsOfEvidence and Expedition Bible (Joel Kramer). God Bless everyone working on this amazing journey!
I like joey kramer
Sorry misspelled joel tried to change it but its not working. I really like his videos and his work plus he's a good man and very nice to talk to.
Deut. 2:14 "And the space in which we came from Kadeshbarnea, until we were come over the brook Zered, was thirty and eight years; until all the generation of the men of war were wasted out from among the host, as the LORD sware unto them." Blessings!
my 1st ep on this channel, very interesting. thanks!
I really enjoyed this one.
The logical leaps that several of these are making are impressive. They require "as the crow flies" rather than accounting for known travel routes, that Moses is referring to the whole of Israel traveling together, a completely warped effort to reinterpret or retranslate the text (non-peer reviewed), and they all lack physical evidence than can be found at certain candidate sites.
As anyone who's an avid hiker knows (I just returned from Yosemite last week), the idea that any traversed distance translates to "as the crow flies" *distance* is laughable.
I've seen four mile hikes completed in an hour, and six mile hikes completed in eight hours. Terrain (and to a lesser degree weather) mean EVERYTHING.
Justified comment except, back in those days they were a hell of a lot fitter. 2. The roads are established, note..
Roads, not tramping tracks for hiker's.
If you want some awesome hikes, come and apply your avid-ness here down under...! Except, we hike in kilometres, we don't use that archaic shit....
@@FlyingKiwi1968 fit 30 year olds, sure. But 6 and 70 year olds - certainly some with injuries and pregnancies - who are that fit?
With God everything is possible.@@ThrashLawPatentsAndTMs
I hope you upload Dr. Fritz's sessions about geographical and historical sources related to the location of Mt. Sinai. Fantastic production and team! God bless everyone.
Josephus and other ancient historians say that Kadesh Barnea was at Rekem which is Petra, which fits with Moses stating that they were at a city at the southern border with Edom.
Jabal Al lawz is the real site. they found the site where Moses smote the rock, as well as the site used to build the Ark of the Covenant.
The best proof I've seen,in Saudi Arabia.
It took Elijah 40 days to run from Mt Carmel to Mt Sinai . Why not get some athletes to test which mountains fit this description ?
Actually, 41 days from Beersheva to Horeb. He must have crawled.
Interesting...
1:39 Of cause it is the time for 1 person and not 3.000.000 people.
Very interesting. So. 383 km from the traditional Sīnaī to Qādēsch Barneaʿ according to Google Maps fits perfectly. So she is right, that it could be 1 sentence and she is definitely right in 2 points. It is not the mountain in ʿarabīya as-saʿūdīya and no brackets.
Midejān is in ʿarabīya as-saʿūdīya, yes, bet the Midejānīm lived on the Sīnaīpeninsula too. The sea cow (thachasch is not badger), who's leather was used for the tent of gathering (or meeting) lives in the south of the peninsula. The Jissrāʾēlīm wandered long enough (38 years) arround the mountain.
1606-1566 before our timecalculation.
Don’t forget, this was a large group of people with children, elderly, and animals. I don’t think they could do twenty miles a day.
Unless maybe God helped them? You know, like shoes not wearing out, etc? All these comments so far tend to leave God out of the equation.
I wouldn't lean on Robert Alter's translation of Scripture. In an interview he stated that scholarship long ago agreed in the document hypothesis: that the first five books of the Bible had different sources. Tim Mahoney did a good job of showing that Moses is most likely (i believe he definitely is) the sole (human) author of these five books in the Moses Controversy. In that same interview Alter also challenges the understood meaning of man being made in the image of GOD.
Alter is taking "image" as in our human physical make up, so serms ridiculous to the faithless as they see all the different people's around the world.
BUT... We are all the same, genetically
"Image", replace that word (for explanation only), with facsimile.
God made us all genetically a facsimile of Himself, but also we're a spiritual being unlike animal's.
@@FlyingKiwi1968 'We are made in the image of GOD' means that we have spirit. Never trust one man's translation of Scripture. Committees are best endowed for this task.
Read Galatians 4:25
The terrain also suits the Sinai Peninsula, don't 4get. Shur was 'in front of Egypt' where the Amalekites attacked the Israelites nearing Mt Sinai.
Most people already know where Mount Sanai is. I don’t understand why we are still looking for it? And it was obviously volcanic and had an eruption during that time. That narrows it down a bit, right?
Walking a huge crowd 20 miles a day seems a heck of a stretch.
Kadesh is riverside
I noted in this UA-cam video at running time 11:34 on the map that "Horeb, [or Sinai printed in white letters, south of Mount Seir printed in yellow letters] is in what appears to be located in the Sinai Peninsula. This is not correct to me, for Horeb's or Sinai's location, as we have Saul of Tarsus (the apostle Paul's) statement when writing to the Christian Galatians, in his book Galatians Chapter 4: Verse 25 stating clearly that "... Sinai, [is] a mountain in Arabia, ..." This would place Mt. Sinai's true geographical location in the land of "Midian," depicted on maps drawn by Biblical cartographers in what is today, northwestern Saudi Arabia, EAST of the Sinai Peninsula and East of the Gulf of Aqaba (the latter an eastern "right arm" of the Red Sea) in southwestern Asia; and NOT in the Sinai Peninsula which is part of Egypt in northeastern Africa. "Midian," was the name of Abraham's 4th listed son by his 2nd wife Keturah, after his 1st wife Sarah had died. (See Genesis Chapter 25: Verses 1 and 2 NWT or New World Translation of the Holy Scriptures.) Moreover, there are cultural, physical geographical, and geological features that favor (Saudi) Arabia as being the correct location today of ancient Mount Horeb or Sinai. The Saudi Arabian government depicts Midian's Sinai location with rock or stone corrals, where livestock were temporarily housed prior to the ancient Israelites sacrificing bulls and sheep, and the summit of Sinai as being dark or black as a result of God's "descending" on the "holy mountain." Additionally, there is engraved on one rock a feature of a bull.
In Egypt's Sinai Peninsula where a Catholic monastery is seen on one of the mountains, there are NO ancient geological, cultural, or physical geographical land features of evidence that would give credence that Mount Sanai was located in Egypt. Nothing in Egypt as compared with the evidence that archaeologists, geologists, and Bible scholars have found in Saudi Arabia, supporting the latter, as the apostle Paul stated in Galatians Chapter 4: Verse 25 that Sinai is in Arabian, NOT Egyptian territory.
Forgoten by the jewish people, but didnt Solomon make pillars at the believed sites to commemerate the event.
Yes at the Red Sea crossing on both sides but that’s not Mt Sinai but Nuweva Beach. Moses was told to return to Midian where he was watching the flocks of Jethro when he saw the burning bush on the mountain.
Look up Ron Wyatt here and you can see the real Mt Sinai with the golden calf Altar the scarifice herding corral and the Split rock. Also ark discovery and Jim and Penny Caldwell who found the sites independently of Wyatt. There was also a dr to the Saudi Prince who found it.
@@philmiska7295 i know
The standard travel day was not about 20 miles, i.e. 32 km per day. The troops of Amenophis II could manage an average marching speed of 23.3 km per day; Thutmose III holds the record with 25 km; but Ramses II granted his soldiers rather more rest, they made only 20.3 km per day.(Elmar Edel, Zeitschrift des Deutschen Palästina-Vereins 69 1953, 153). With flocks and herds Moses best time was probably about 21km per day.
Deborah is way off trying to mistranslate DT 1:1 as being in Moab. That is not the Jordan River but the Jordan valley including the Arabah valley. All the locations mentioned in DT 1:1 are south of Moab and are in and around Edom. You will notice the location of Hazeroth is on the way to Kadesh Barnea from Horeb. Not in Moab.
Deuteronomy jumps around in space and time. DT 1:1-2 is about the second year at KB or in the east side of the Arabah. DT 1:3+ is about the 40th year in Moab, DT 1:6 is about the 2nd year but back at Horeb. DT 1:19 is back to Kadesh in the second year.
Deb Hurn's Sinai as well as the classic Sinai also has the problem of Taberah where the quail came in from the sea. (Num. 11:31) There is no seashore camp.
All the places mentioned in Numbers 33 need identifying. Rameses to Suiccoth. To Etham. To Pii hahiroth before Baal zephon. To Migdol. To Marah. To Elim. To Red sea. To wilderness of Sin. To Dophkah. To Alush. To Rephidim. To wideness of Sinai. To Kibroth hattaavah. To Hazeroth. To Rithmah. To Rim mon parez. To Libnah. To Rissah. To Kehelathah. To Mount Shapher. To Haradah. To Makheloth. To Tahath. To Tarah. To Mithcah. To Hashmonah. To Benejaakan. To Horhagigad. To Jotbathah. To Ebronah. To Ezion gaber. To Widerness of Zin which is Kadesh. To Mount Hor in the edge of Edom.
So Baal zephon , Pihahiroth and Migdal. Need identifying as the place of crossing. Also the place names that lead to Mount Sinai. This should describe the localities in question.
No body seems to think it important, yet God has given precice locations.
To place Kadesh Barnea west of the Jordan River makes no sense if Joshua Crossed the Jordan to enter Cannan.
I am very grateful for your ministry and I watched just about all the videos you post but on this I'm sorry I have to disagree they were not allowed into the land not because they didn't believe but because of their Disobedience same as Moses he disobeyed when he smoked the Rock and that was why he was not allowed in
And he said, The LORD came --from-- to Sinai, [point C] and rose up from Seir [point A] unto them; he shined forth from mount Paran, [point B, in betwixt] and he *came with* ten thousands of saints [angels]: from his right hand went a fiery law for the.
{Deuteronomy 33:2}
In summary,
-- Seir [Edom]: point A is North
-- Mt. Paran [Arabia]: point B is South of Seir, and North of Mt. Horeb.
-- Mt. Horeb [Arabia]: is South from Mt. Paran, and South from Seir.
No exodus 3 and also exodus 8 clearly say its 3 day journey from egypt to sinai.
Its 11 days from sinai to kadesh. This means its 3 times longer from kadesh to sinai from egypt. U will see on a map it doesnt work out. The distance from egypt to sinai is further than kadesh to sinai therefore we have an issue
What should have happened in 11 days took 40 years because of spiritual warfare. Ha satan and his demons didn't not want to let Yahweh's people go. This is Paul's revelation in Ephesians 6:10-18 speaks to, in part. Did the Hebrews have challenges of faith? Did they rebel? Yes but Lev 17:7 and Deut 32:17 give s a glimpse of the real battle. The real battle was, is and will always be spiritual. We do not war against flesh and blood but . . . This is why ha satan (Lucifer) sits on Mount Moriah today proclaiming he has defeated YHVH, after Isaiah 14. Still, this is a good academic debate.
But they sinned at mt horeb, they went 40 yrs in the Arabian desert
The most convincing evidence I've seen is in Saudi Arabia mt jubals.
A very healthy and fit adult who is used to walking... is not encumbered with any great weight... and is wearing very solid footwear... and is walking over even terrain ... could manage 20 miles in a day. Even more.
But what about someone who is not all that fit... in their middle years... carrying water and provisions (something like 10 kgs / 20 lbs or so...? )
Considerations of terrain, temperature, wind, rain, etc all need to be factored in.
Been fact they were all fitter back then, it would be 35km per day AVERAGE
Be also that they were well established routes.
A fit human walks at 4km/hour
So just under 9 hours, 35km (20 miles).
Daybreak 6am to noon they can do 24km (6 x 4). A midday siesta (heat). Now they only have a 11km stretch left (2.75 hours).
So, probably 2pm to 5pm, or even 3 - 6pm they've completed the 35km (20 miles).
Bani Israel was an Arabic tribe lived in Yemen along with bani yahuda and amonites and canaanites and philistines and many other Arabic tribes. Bani Israel never ever been in Egypt in Sinai in Jordan and in Palestine.
Interesting, but wrong! the locations of Mt Seir, Horeb, Hazerot and Lavan are incorrect and whoever created this map doesn't know anything about biblical geography.