Ill say it again here, the A-S301 artificially widens the whole soundstage and while doing so it also stretches the center imaging apart like melted cheese. This is very apparent on Time Travelling, listen to 10:51 and wait for the transition, her vocals lose that center focus massively. This is what Ive noticed when I got the A-S 301 2 years back and its pretty apparent on all these vids. Must be some sort of a yamaha house sound, like some added reverb or a mild 'hall mode'. Power wise it drove my OG LS50 with no problems at all at mediocre volumes, but when I cranked it up, bass started to feel bloated and slow. It added some weight to the OG LS50 though and it can be a good or bad thing depending on how you look at it. It is a different type of sound, you may or may not like it. I dont as it strays away from the original track.
@@DougMen1 i roughly know how the final mix sounds like after comparing the yam with many other amps. If 1 out 20 amps show this trait, it is HIGHLY possible that one amp is the outlier. No other amp stretches the imaging that far off. This is usually manipulated in the pre section of the amp by adding reverb or some sort of noise to give that impression of spaciousness. I have not seen Amir review this amp. Listening test to ONE speaker has been proven time and again to be way more accurate than 2. Any rebutals can be directed at Harman or specifically Floyd Toole himself. The word soundstage or soundscape can be found within a single speaker itself, the 'usual' soundstage that people speak off is usually caused by the room, the directivity pattern of a speaker itself and decay. Big difference. Soundstaging of an amp can manipulated with mainly noise and reverb, which the yam has overdone.
I'd swear we've heard this comparison before. 🤔 Both these amps sound good with the Metas, and both sound very different. Neither of them makes them sound as neutral and accurate as they can get. Wich one I like more with them seems to change with the recording, the music genre, and maybe the day of the week. I'd have to go with the better imaging and greater richness of the Yamaha in this case, but I'm sure my old NAD gear would make them sound much more balanced than either of these. They're both very good amps, but they add a lot of their own flavor to the sound.
I wish somebody can measure the output frequency response and THD from this kind of comparison. The difference is very audible but we don't exactly know where it comes from.
Noise and reverb. Mainly those 2. I doubt the FR deviates far from neutral, it may or may not be load dependent, but that huge difference comes from that 2 I just mentioned. A time decay chart will give us more insight.
@@quananginh9446 reverb can be manipulated via the pre section of an amp, as we can see with certain hall/stadium/arena modes on some amps. I have the paid version of PowerAmp EQ app on my phone (I use it for my JBL Partybox 310) and I can adjust reverb and it sounds exactly like this. Noise can make quite a difference too as noise can and will make a soundstage seem deeper. Its weird how such a thing as noise can affect the perception of our human hearing. But I agree with you, noise only can do so much and it wont be this different.
The Yamaha is very nice, typical Japanese sound... The Arcam is in a different league... It's not just sound, lift and feel the Yamaha vs the Arcam and the difference is night and day.... I love my Onkyo and Cambridge Audio gear, but after buying the SA10, my standards are raised.
@@DougMen1 Lol, no need to lie, the Yamaha is nice, it's the overall build quality is better., the Arcam is smaller but more dense, solid. Rotel and Arcam don't make units under $500..
@@thomasward00 Just gotta say, the A-S301 really doesn't have the typical Japanese sound at all, or the typical Yamaha one. Also, your demos of your system on youtube sounds pretty good. The SA10 gives those Dentons plenty of shine.
@@DougMen1 Do you think there is much validity to what Winston says about the A-S301s center image sounding stretched or unatural? In this demo it sounds a touch extreme in comparison to the Arcam, wich never seperates or projects vocals or anything very far forward in the soundstage. In other demos with the R3s or any speakers it has more defined imaging than almost all othe amps, although some get close, but I'm trying to decide if it's exaggerated or unatural in any way
@@DougMen1 And no, there really is no clearly defined Japanese sound to me, except they have tended to lean toward slightly clear, cool 'solid state' or 'transistor' type sound, because they usually are, but they vary too much beyond that to really have a sound you could nail down.
![[Sound Battle] Arcam SA10 vs Yamaha A-S301 w/KEF Q350 BEST Integrated Amplifier for the MONEY.](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/ohWyqJU3VDU/mqdefault.jpg)
![[Sound Battle] Arcam SA10 Integrated Amplifier vs R-S202 Stereo Receiver / KEF LS50 Meta](/img/n.gif)
The Yamaha put up one hell of a fight !! I like it better to be honest. 3rd time listening and I think the Arcam has lost this one.
SA10, what a sweet midrange! sounds like a tube amplifier
The AS301 sounds meaty, beaty, big and bouncy😀
As for this comparison, I would easily pick Yamaha. The sound is much spacier and more detailed.
Ill say it again here, the A-S301 artificially widens the whole soundstage and while doing so it also stretches the center imaging apart like melted cheese. This is very apparent on Time Travelling, listen to 10:51 and wait for the transition, her vocals lose that center focus massively. This is what Ive noticed when I got the A-S 301 2 years back and its pretty apparent on all these vids. Must be some sort of a yamaha house sound, like some added reverb or a mild 'hall mode'. Power wise it drove my OG LS50 with no problems at all at mediocre volumes, but when I cranked it up, bass started to feel bloated and slow. It added some weight to the OG LS50 though and it can be a good or bad thing depending on how you look at it. It is a different type of sound, you may or may not like it. I dont as it strays away from the original track.
@@DougMen1 i roughly know how the final mix sounds like after comparing the yam with many other amps. If 1 out 20 amps show this trait, it is HIGHLY possible that one amp is the outlier. No other amp stretches the imaging that far off. This is usually manipulated in the pre section of the amp by adding reverb or some sort of noise to give that impression of spaciousness. I have not seen Amir review this amp. Listening test to ONE speaker has been proven time and again to be way more accurate than 2. Any rebutals can be directed at Harman or specifically Floyd Toole himself. The word soundstage or soundscape can be found within a single speaker itself, the 'usual' soundstage that people speak off is usually caused by the room, the directivity pattern of a speaker itself and decay. Big difference. Soundstaging of an amp can manipulated with mainly noise and reverb, which the yam has overdone.
Better separation with arcam sa10, and more natural. With voice and guitar, I think it's better timber.
I'd swear we've heard this comparison before. 🤔 Both these amps sound good with the Metas, and both sound very different. Neither of them makes them sound as neutral and accurate as they can get. Wich one I like more with them seems to change with the recording, the music genre, and maybe the day of the week. I'd have to go with the better imaging and greater richness of the Yamaha in this case, but I'm sure my old NAD gear would make them sound much more balanced than either of these. They're both very good amps, but they add a lot of their own flavor to the sound.
Yamaha proves you don't have to spend a fortune to get quality sound.
Yamaha wins this one.
I wish somebody can measure the output frequency response and THD from this kind of comparison. The difference is very audible but we don't exactly know where it comes from.
Noise and reverb. Mainly those 2. I doubt the FR deviates far from neutral, it may or may not be load dependent, but that huge difference comes from that 2 I just mentioned. A time decay chart will give us more insight.
@@AbsoluteFidelity reverb is caused by the room, not the amp. I don't know if noise can be that audible.
@@quananginh9446 reverb can be manipulated via the pre section of an amp, as we can see with certain hall/stadium/arena modes on some amps. I have the paid version of PowerAmp EQ app on my phone (I use it for my JBL Partybox 310) and I can adjust reverb and it sounds exactly like this.
Noise can make quite a difference too as noise can and will make a soundstage seem deeper. Its weird how such a thing as noise can affect the perception of our human hearing. But I agree with you, noise only can do so much and it wont be this different.
Yes, they definitely have different frequency response, a measurement from a "Audio Precision" can tell
Yamaha is the winner, this time !
I prefer Cambridge Audio AXR 85 to Yamaha 301
Arcam plus subtil dans les timbres et Yamaha plus de grave.
Recording position and position of the speakers changed during both recordings, test is not representative.
The Yamaha is very nice, typical Japanese sound... The Arcam is in a different league...
It's not just sound, lift and feel the Yamaha vs the Arcam and the difference is night and day....
I love my Onkyo and Cambridge Audio gear, but after buying the SA10, my standards are raised.
@@DougMen1 Lol, no need to lie, the Yamaha is nice, it's the overall build quality is better., the Arcam is smaller but more dense, solid. Rotel and Arcam don't make units under $500..
@@DougMen1 BTW, the Rotel A11 is on sale right now at Crutchfield for $799 right now, great deal.
@@thomasward00 Just gotta say, the A-S301 really doesn't have the typical Japanese sound at all, or the typical Yamaha one. Also, your demos of your system on youtube sounds pretty good.
The SA10 gives those Dentons plenty of shine.
@@DougMen1 Do you think there is much validity to what Winston says about the A-S301s center image sounding stretched or unatural? In this demo it sounds a touch extreme in comparison to the Arcam, wich never seperates or projects vocals or anything very far forward in the soundstage. In other demos with the R3s or any speakers it has more defined imaging than almost all othe amps, although some get close, but I'm trying to decide if it's exaggerated or unatural in any way
@@DougMen1 And no, there really is no clearly defined Japanese sound to me, except they have tended to lean toward slightly clear, cool 'solid state' or 'transistor' type sound, because they usually are, but they vary too much beyond that to really have a sound you could nail down.
It's amazing that 350.00 can beat 800.00
bedroom demo again is not edit properly, one amp full drum they other amp goes into ambiance