Another good topic 👏I decided to stop backing decks on Kickstarter when I realized that with some campaigns the non backers could obtain a deck as soon as it was printed meanwhile I waited months for the same result. But what really angered me was when the Muse tarot and the Light seer's were available as mass market at 15$, less than a month after I received mine for which I waited a year and paid a lot. That was it for me.
I wished I'd been able to get the indie versions! I saw the Sacred Creators oracle is being mass produced with a different color pallette, which is disappointing.
Yes, it usually happens that once a campaign has successfully funded, the deck goes straight to preorders status, which usually is a substantial length of time. Better to at least wait for that, so your money is not tied up as long.
@@oldsoulmermaid1543 It looks beautiful but the requirements and surveys and four page emails make me afraid I’m going to forget something and not receive it. I used a secure shipping address for extra safety so I hope it does arrive.
I’ve only started backing Kickstarter decks in the past year, so I don’t know by how much the prices have gone up, but you are right...$65 seems to be the average. On the other hand, I’ve also notices that some new mass market pre-order decks on Amazon are in the $35-40 range, which I think is heigh for a mass market deck. Hmmm... you’ve given me an idea for a video topic! Thank you!
I mean most creators are doing everything on their own and don't have a huge publishing company to negotiate their prices. When you back on Kickstarter you're getting something someone created and are trying to make a reality. My last Kickstarter I charged $65 per deck and in the end lost $2000 once all pledges we're filled. I didn't make a single penny. But I was still happy because something I created became a reality and people around the world can now enjoy my deck. Prices are expensive because we are single person operations not because we are greedy
You know it would be really fascinating to know the breakdown of costs for producing an indie deck. I think we have all had glimpses into the travails of producing a deck and it can be a truly harrowing process. I don’t think indie deck creators are being greedy. I think it’s more a fact of the cost of producing anything has gone up. The cost of materials has definitely gone up. Still, the fact remains that the escalating costs of decks, especially indie decks, is going to keep many from purchasing them in this day and age when the cost of living is so high. As much as I love purchasing a beautiful indie deck, I’ve had a shifting of priorities. Do I want to buy that indie deck? Or, would I rather put that $65 dollars into my emergency fund or retirement fund. Now that I’m 55, I have to ask myself, “where will my $65 do the most good in the long run?” Indie decks are definitely a luxury item and not a necessity.
@@oldsoulmermaid1543 oh definitely I understand what you are saying. It’s important to spend wisely I hardly make any purchases for myself at all nowadays because everything has become so wildly costly. My next meal or car repair seems more important than hobbies :(
@@oldsoulmermaid1543 my first deck i made great money on enough so I included extra rewards and did a bunch of giveaways. I used the same goal on my second kickstarter and didn’t even have enough to cover expenses. The campaigns were only about 1 year apart. But everything shot up!
I look for the quality of design, the cardstock, and supporting independent designers. I have some indie decks and supported two designers on Kickstarter. I'm a designer by nature, have a 4-yr degree in Interior Design, and worked as a drafter. So, I see art with a trained eye. I'm very picky when it comes to decks, especially with Tarot cards. BUT, it has become very pricey. Since I'm not a professional reader, it makes me question the cost of $60 - 90 as I'm eyeing the Little Buddha Tarot by Push Kitty (Typically, I don't purchase "cute" decks). And yes... backers should be receiving their decks ahead of everyone else.
I’m not trained in art or any kind of design, so images have to affect me emotionally first! Oh, that little Buddha Tarot is so enticing and I’m trying to hold off because I do have several “cute decks”. But…sometimes the will;owner is very weak 😆.
The first and only time I’ve ever ordered a Kickstarter deck was the alleyman’s tarot. I ordered it last April and they are finally starting shipping at the end of the month.. its killing me but I think it’ll be worth it
same i was very broke when pre-ordering was going on in april 2021 n i could only afford the smallest tier. now i see it for sale for alot cheaper than even the lowest tier i got it at. im sure the deck will be awesome n im happy i was able to get it. jus a bit sad bout that
Your feelings are totally valid! I've done a few backing campaigns and had only one truly bad experience. And that was enough to put me off to KS for a while. If I'm going to back a deck, I make sure that the deck is completely finished and the creator has printed off prototypes and know which printer they're going with. Also, I've caught wind of a few creators who have developed a lackluster rep with regard to being unresponsive, unfriendly, etc. So I stay away from their campaigns. Fingers crossed that you receive your deck soon, Bonnie 💖
Yes, I need to learn to look at all of those things. I don’t think I’ll ever see the original deck. Maybe it fell through the cracks and was never sent in the first place. I’ll never know. Another deck was sent out to me Monday...hopefully I’ll get that one.
I don't back Kickstarters very often, maybe 1 or 2 a year, and usually it either has to be pretty much finished and ready to go, or just a really important deck that I want to support. I'm lucky that I haven't had any serious issues with campaigns I've backed. The most frustrating was the receiving my indie Light Seers well after people were already able to buy the Hay House version! So I was left wishing I could've just gotten the Hay House version for like 1/4 of the price AND sooner! But in the big scheme of things, it's not such a big deal. But we're still human and it can be frustrating when these things happen! And we have every right to alter our purchasing behaviours accordingly, like being more selective about the projects we support.
This is the first time I’ve had a deck not show up when everyone else has gotten their decks. I’m not certain where the hiccup is...the mail in China or the mail where I’m at here in the U.S. At this point, I don’t think it will ever arrive. Come to think of it...I’m still waiting on a replacement card for another Kickstarter deck that I had received in January! You are absolutely right, that being more selective is the way to go. I remember the delays for the Light Seers Tarot! I got my copy just days before my Hay House version arrived! And the cards were cut very unevenly. Ahhhh...first world problems! Thanks for your input, Katey!
I just saw Pappa Squirrel's video about his thoughts on ordering through KS. His perspective is slightly different, but still relating to backing KS decks. As I had commented in one of your other videos, I don't have that drive to buy decks at this time and i'm putting my spiritual investment into other resources.
I just watched his video as well! I have since backed a few decks, but honestly the prices for many Kickstarter decks are heading into the stratosphere! And…the mass market publishers are really upping their game for many decks that they seem like a more palatable option.
@@oldsoulmermaid1543 I was given a few decks (non independent) to do reviews of last year from a publishing company. And I feel the most common issue is card quality. A few of these decks had "regular quality" card stock, but Lo Scarabeo had the lowest quality card stock, next to Make Playing Cards, that I've come across. Gratefully the design and theme of a few of these decks were the saving grace in me keeping them. It "sounds" like many are leaning more towards ETSY for their potential deck purchases. At least, the product is available to be shipped.
I collect decks and must be in love with decks to use them but I have established some rules for myself: I only pay over $30/$40 if I absolutely love the deck and it’s likely to come with a book. I no longer buy expensive decks without books. I also have been good about avoiding Kickstarter. I only purchased one deck on there by an artist who has a string of previous decks sold and delivered with no issues. I find that my most treasured decks are the ones that completely exude “‘me” and my essence and because of that I usually allow a greater budget up to about $70 or $80 and those are few are and far between
Everything you say is spot on. I bought one deck that had no book which was my fault and it was the most expensive. She even asked me for extra postage, which she should have allowed for in the beginning. It was dream vision tarot. The deck that I recently got was exquisite familiars. It is quite fun. Good quality and definitely something that you won’t use everyday but still a nice deck. The wandering star was a beautiful deck i purchased, but in reality could buy it now as it is through hayhouse and a lot cheaper. So basically …. My thoughts. Don’t buy anymore and use what you ha e
I had a recent Kickstarter that was lost in the mail and creator sold all the excess copied before all his kickstarter has been fulfilled. I was miffed as first edition had extra cards and thats edition I paid for , but in the end i had to wait for 2nd run to get the deck, it soured the deck arrival for me , so much so I stored it the deck away until I can remove the negative association with the creator.
Omg 😱…that’s horrible! I don’t know if I would have ever been able to disassociate that negative experience from that deck! I’m glad that you did end up with a deck, even though it wasn’t the one you paid for. Horrible planning and practice on the creator’s part!
I don’t think you’re being petty at all. I do think you’re being reasonable and your frustration is definitely justified. Also, KS is always a gamble. The only reason why I would back a KS deck is for the additional stuff along with the deck. I don’t mind too much for the higher prices because I want to support the creator/s. With that said, I’ve noticed I’m becoming more selective on what decks I want (both indie and mass produced) and I want to cut down on the amount of stuff I have. I only use 2 of my decks regularly anyway 😅😔
Yes, I hear you about becoming more selective! When I get a new deck I like to work with it exclusively for at least 2-4 weeks so that I can get a really good feel for it…leaving some other favorites waiting in the wings 😉
I just backed my 1st Kickstarter deck. I normally find my indie decks on Etsy. You are not being petty by any means, I totally understand. I had the same thing happen with an indie preorder. I seen so many posting on UA-cam their decks as I sat and waited for mine. I felt that same twinge of envy...
I’ve started backing decks on Kickstarter again since I’ve filmed this video, as things have seem to have normalized again with deck production. I always add a month to the estimated date of a campaign. I’ve recently backed my first Deck on Indiegogo, which is a little bit higher risk than Kickstarter...fingers crossed!
I've never had a Kickstarter deck arrive as originally projected, but I've decided to just accept it as part of the experience. Like the long lines at the hobby store; I just factor in the wait.
On a side note, pre-ordering a deck on Amazon seems to be just as unreliable. I've seen unboxing videos of pre-ordered decks come out and when I question Amazon about it they tell me the deck has not been released. In one instance this went on for six weeks before I finally decided to cancel the Amazon order.
That has been a recent occurrence with U.S. Games decks. I’ve noticed that they no longer offer preorders on Amazon. You have to order from their site. I don’t know why that is.
I know this is over a year old and might no longer apply.... but your video definitely grabbed my attention from the YT suggestion list. I've watched it twice in fact. I sense you were talking about 2 different things here, mixed together. Superbacker here, and I will be blunt with The Unpopular Opinion : the problem you feel strongly about is not Kickstarter. It seems to hint more to the fact that people in communities composed of creators and content-pushers have some REALLY strong attention-seeking dynamics going on. I immensely dislike social media for this. I've pulled out of all tarot communities because of this toxic shit. Can you see that some are racing to be the first to do X (posting the new deck flip through, being first to get the item...), and/or are needy for attention from popular figures, and/or would like to be popular themselves and get similar attention but are not necessarily succeeding, and feel slighted and stuck in strong negative emotions/victimhood thoughts because of it? Listen back to the words you used: "big channel" "glib comment" "little me" "petty" "jealousy" "big youtuber" "whiny little girl"... My advice is, from the KS perspective, to analyze issues only from a business transaction angle i.e. you have a right to complain about the quality of the product, its cost, delivery, and delivery priority between backers and regular customers who come afterwards. You can totally discuss this publicly to, like Papa Squirrel did about Oracle of Oddities (one of his best rants imo lol). Don't feel bad for changing your mind on backing a campaign either. It's business. Just... don't go down the emotional road with the rest of the comments/drama/petty stuff in the tarot community. I hope you are doing better this year. BTW thanks for the comparison between mass market and indie deck for Wandering Star (which I went to watch before commenting here). Still on the fence about this deck. It's out of stock on HH, so I guess the wait-and-see decision has been taken for me already :)
Thank you for commenting on an old video! I honestly don’t remember everything I said in that video (heck…I don’t remember my videos from a month ago 😆!), but what I do remember waiting a very long time for a Kickstarter and seeing it pop up everywhere and I still hadn’t gotten mine and I was an early backer. I was worried and a little miffed when I saw it popping up on channels that admitted they were given the deck for review and I was still waiting for mine. I was right to be worried…I never got the deck. Eventually, I reached out to the creator and luckily she had a few left that she kept for her personal use and sent me one of those and asked that if the original deck ever showed up that I would send it back to her. I told her I would, but it never did turn up. The funny thing is, that in spite of everything, I ended up backing her 2nd edition of the deck because I loved the 1st one so much! I had a much better experience that time. Oh, for the Wandering Star Tarot…someone informed me that they found their copy at a Home Goods Store. I don’t know where you are, but if you are here in the States and have one of these stores near you, it might be worth checking out. I haven’t checked myself because I never shop at that particular store. Thanks again for your input 😁
@@oldsoulmermaid1543 hehe I am not in the US so I dsont know about this store... but the HH price is 13.50$ right now (but out of stock).... Imagine compared to the KS price. Oof. Funny story is that I did back the campaign while it was ongoing... and then backed off lol. Glad you are doing better today ^_^
Maybe it’s because I mostly back tech projects on Kickstarter but I always figure it’ll be 6 months to a year before I get the product. If I want something g in my hand fast, I’d look for something already produced that’s out there. But if it’s something that I’m willing to wait for I’m more than happy to wait however long it takes. If waiting is an issue, definitely never back a tech product! They take forever but are well worth it.
Yes, I still have to learn that patience is a virtue 🤣. I think the uncertainty of the times with factories having to close or working at half capacity lead to anxiousness.
Old video, but popped up on my recommendations. I don't think you're petty, I would have felt sad and disappointed too :/ Kickstarter decks are ridiculously expensive :/ I backed 3 this year but that's it, even if I understand why they are getting more expansive, it's still at least double the amount of a mass market deck and I love those too.
Kickstarter decks are getting soooo expensive. I think it’s a wonderful thing that the mass market publishers are improving their production values to compete and that some Kickstarter decks are being published mass market. I just backed 3 projects and I think that will be it for the foreseeable future.
Understand how you feel. I live in New Zealand and thinking twice about buying anything from the States as the mail is just so slow😐 much faster to buy from Europe.
Shipping from a different country from the one where you live has also become astronomical. I know here in the U.S. it can add almost $20 USD to a deck.
I've only bought a couple of them that peaked my interest. Other than that, I think the prices are getting a wee bit too high for my liking. So unless the artwork is beautiful and totally resonates with me, I'll just stick to browsing.
I wont do Kickstarter again, I backed a deck its now about 7 months since i paid and still not got the deck. I know there have been delays in printing etc and yes am getting updates but still nothing, so I will sit here patiently waiting waiting waiting AND I have already decided that I’m going to give the deck to my daughter as I dont want it anymore
i feel your frustration and think everything you said is perfectly reasonable. I'm wondering, since you made this almost one year ago, did the deck ever finally show up?
The original deck never showed up. The creator eventually had to send me a deck from her personal stock. It’s so funny 😆 because I did end up backing her 2nd edition of this deck on Kickstarter months later because I loved the 1st edition so much!
I just don't do Kick starters. When I started collecting I saw too many situations that would give me a bad feeling about the deck. I know myself...just chose not to get into the emotions of all that. I also don't want to spend $80 and a few months later it's mass produced at $20! If it's a really good deck someone usually picks it up to publish.
I’m going on a six month ban of Kickstarter. The market has become over saturated with beautiful decks and I really need to be saving money for retirement 😉
For the most part...YES! With Kickstarter decks ( and independent decks in general) you get better quality card stock and boxes! Sometimes you get extras like gold foil and metallic or matte edging on the decks. Some times you can find a mass market deck with these things, but not usually.
Well I’m my case started selling oracle deck of my art with MPC and since I was broke decided to make them to order which is uncomfortable for me and the costumers, first the production cost for just one deck cost me $63!!!! So I decided okay so the price will be $85 so at least I have around 25 of profit and I can save money to produce the deck in bulk so it’s faster shipping and better price for people, so how wrong I was, first of all Etsy charges like $14 on commissions fees per deck sold, plus the costumer have to pay themselves an extra $5-7 for taxes so it’s crazy and I feel kinda bad because I really want to make my deck affordable and reach more people and it’s getting difficult like that and I thought it was a good idea to launch a kickstarted but it leave me very confused like you are trying to get a founding for your project but at the same time the rewards are the same thing you are trying to fund, how you make both things???
This has nothing to do with this topic but I was thinking of you last night because I had just received the Gaian tarot and I was look through it and thought “I hope Bonnie has this one! She would really love the representation of different ages!” 😊 ✌️
It is on me Amazon wishlist, but I don’t have it yet! I need to get it! I’ve gone back and forth on it because of the large borders, but I think I can get over it. Do you find them distracting at all?
Omg! How horrible! The creator of my deck had to send another one out to me because the original one never got to me. I was lucky that she had some set aside for such occurances.
Nope, I don’t think you’re being petty at all, that a frustrating situation. Im waiting on 1 Kickstarter deck but that’s it. There’s Covid, price has gotten out of hand, mass market decks available before backers getting their indies, etc. I’m just glad I’m at a point we’re I’m pretty happy with what I have and I just don’t feel the need to get every deck out there anymore. Hugs 🤗
It is getting crazy! There are a couple of decks I want to add to my collection and then I may place myself on a no buy period, so that I can work with the ones I have in earnest and re-evaluate my collection. I think it won’t be too long before I get priced out of the indie decks, though. ❤️
Old Soul Mermaid Meh... once you get to where you’re not buying so many, you won’t mind spending a bit more on one you really want once in a blue moon. It’ll work itself out you’ll see 😉
I can see the side of the creator in wanting to advertise their deck with a well known channel, but as a consumer you would like the decks to go out to the people who backed and believed in the project first. This video was done early in my channel’s history and since then I’ve been given 4 decks for review from deck creators. One small Ukrainian company that I was not aware of has sent me a few decks to get them seen to an American audience and I liked the decks, so I was happy to do the unboxings for them. I agree that the best reviews and unboxings are those that are purchased by the content creator’s own money.
Small world! I will search out those reviews. I have a special place in my heart for Ukraine. My husband, passed away, worked in Ukraine and spoke well of his time there
Well I certainly will not be getting one I’m gonna stick to Regular RWS some of the concepts are getting off topic or the same as RWS they Are too expensive and some has too much goin on in the cards to get a real sense of what the hell is goin on I’m new and I wait may be years before I get one because they like $70 and more now and plus they don’t mean anything anymore people are just creating decks to create I stick to Los Scarabeo and US games
I totally understand! Indie decks are getting really expensive, though admittedly, I have no idea what it costs to produce a deck. You are correct that there are plenty of outstanding and beautiful mass market decks to choose from and that don’t break the bank...thank goodness!
Have you received your new copy of this deck yet? Of course I could be wrong, but I believe I have backed the second edition of this deck on Kickstarter. However, I am having doubts for my own reasons and may change my mind!
I did finally get it, but only after the creator sent me another copy. I never did get the original Kickstarter deck from China. I have a full unboxing of the deck on my channel. I couldn’t help myself...I’m backing the new edition too! I love the decks so much!
@@oldsoulmermaid1543 Ah, I somehow missed the unboxing. I'll take a look today. I'm trying to buy fewer decks and it is tough, but I have been putting more thought into what I buy since watching this and videos about deck addiction!
I know what you mean! I have my set storage space for decks and when it fills up, I can’t buy any decks until I purge/ sell some decks. It keeps it manageable!😂
I have backed one kickstarter. The Lightseers. And honestly I was annoyed that it went mass market so fast. With international postage I would have waited. However I appreciate that the popularity of the kickstarter helped her get the deal probably and with the changes to the deck I do have something slightly different to the MM version. I do love that deck. But... I haven't backed a kickstarter since. 🤷🏻♀️
Wow! Such control! Did you get the deck with the original 10 of Swords? I did the preorder for the indie deck and that’s when she changed that card. I’m getting more picky before I back a deck and it has slowed substantially for me.
Oh, that’s nice of UA-cam to push out an older video of mine 😆! I never did get the original Kickstarter deck. The creator had to send me a copy from her personal stash. I had to wait a long while for it. After that experience, I did stop backing decks for a number of months…but then I started backing decks again 😉
I have never backed decks on kickstarter because they are way too expansive and I know how cheap productions costs actually are. I just think it's often times a huge ripoff, why would I pay 6o€ if the deck often times only costed less than a euro in production. On top of that as pretty as a lot of those modern decks are, most of them lack symbolism to really have any real depth to them.
I definitely have a love-hate relationship with Kickstarter 😆. I have no idea about what it takes to produce a deck, but I have heard that one of the most expensive part aspects of it is the box. Those fancy magnetic closure boxes do t come cheap. I do agree that some of the decks are more of a “Tarot Art” deck, but that’s ok with me.Those decks either push me to find new ways of reading or they end up as little pockets of art that I can enjoy. I do agree that the costs are skyrocketing. It’s a good thing that the mass market publishers are upping their production quality of their decks to compete with the indie market. Now you can get some really beautiful Mass market decks 😉
This comment made me laugh so much! Please, enlighten all those deck creators, where you can produce decks that would cost one euro per final, ready-to-sell deck! I beg you, do it! Lol. Sure 60 euro decks are expensive, but it takes a lot to produce them, especially if you don't make them in China and/or don't have lots of resources to order 5000 copies at the time. The deck, the box, the book or little booklet everything costs. PLUS, what about time and energy creators spend? If they spend lots of hours making it, use their resources to create, should that be just dismissed? Saying that a deck cost one euro to produce is just very ignorant. Sorry.
You bring up some good points. You really can’t put a price on a creator’s blood, sweat, and tears put into their creation and then the production of their projects.
@@angelsaround8168 lol your comment made me laugh as well, you just gave yourself the answer, china! A lot of creators produce their decks their, in fact those companies use those decks to promote their services, giving them as examples of what they have produced in the past. Producing good quality decks in china is very cheap and you don't need to order 5000 unites to make them under a Euro, around 2000 is often times enough and even if you'd choose to produce only 500 unites it would still cost you under three Euro. Delivery costs are obviously not included but cards, box and booklet are. Guess what kickstarter is for?! Getting the financial resources and the first costumers. So a lot of them usually do have the resources and costumers to produce enough decks to keep the costs down. It's not like they are getting cheap once they are popular. Most costumers don't know where the decks were produced, creators rarely disclose such information but funny enough the prices of those who produce it in china and those who might not seem to be similar. Now if they would always disclose it and would not produce them in china (or other cheap countries), I wouldn't even be half as critical as I am. But the reality is different. I've never said time and energy doesn't count, but it's isn't worth spending 60+ Euros for me personally, especially if it was produced in china & Co. If you are willing to spend so much money then go ahead, I don't care. Your comment is ignorant as well.
Since you are obviously bothered or feel slighted by this overlook by this certain creator, why not just come out and mention her name or the Tarot in question. This is just whining and screaming into the wind . Pointless to vent and stay « general » in this situation. For criticism to be constructive and useful in expressing an opinion and getting info out there, it should be detailed. Sorry this bad experience happened to you.
Oooo…I posted this video a year ago. I don’t even remember everything I said in it. I know it was early in my channel’s existence…definitely a blast from the past 😆! Thank you for watching 🙏.
Another good topic 👏I decided to stop backing decks on Kickstarter when I realized that with some campaigns the non backers could obtain a deck as soon as it was printed meanwhile I waited months for the same result. But what really angered me was when the Muse tarot and the Light seer's were available as mass market at 15$, less than a month after I received mine for which I waited a year and paid a lot. That was it for me.
I wished I'd been able to get the indie versions! I saw the Sacred Creators oracle is being mass produced with a different color pallette, which is disappointing.
Yes, it usually happens that once a campaign has successfully funded, the deck goes straight to preorders status, which usually is a substantial length of time. Better to at least wait for that, so your money is not tied up as long.
I just bought the Alleyman’s deck and Im not sure how I feel about it
Oh, no! I’ll have to look that one up…I’m not familiar with it!
@@oldsoulmermaid1543 It looks beautiful but the requirements and surveys and four page emails make me afraid I’m going to forget something and not receive it. I used a secure shipping address for extra safety so I hope it does arrive.
They are also getting too expensive. Can’t really get a deck for less than $65 or so. Ridiculous.
I’ve only started backing Kickstarter decks in the past year, so I don’t know by how much the prices have gone up, but you are right...$65 seems to be the average. On the other hand, I’ve also notices that some new mass market pre-order decks on Amazon are in the $35-40 range, which I think is heigh for a mass market deck. Hmmm... you’ve given me an idea for a video topic! Thank you!
I mean most creators are doing everything on their own and don't have a huge publishing company to negotiate their prices.
When you back on Kickstarter you're getting something someone created and are trying to make a reality.
My last Kickstarter I charged $65 per deck and in the end lost $2000 once all pledges we're filled. I didn't make a single penny. But I was still happy because something I created became a reality and people around the world can now enjoy my deck.
Prices are expensive because we are single person operations not because we are greedy
You know it would be really fascinating to know the breakdown of costs for producing an indie deck. I think we have all had glimpses into the travails of producing a deck and it can be a truly harrowing process. I don’t think indie deck creators are being greedy. I think it’s more a fact of the cost of producing anything has gone up. The cost of materials has definitely gone up. Still, the fact remains that the escalating costs of decks, especially indie decks, is going to keep many from purchasing them in this day and age when the cost of living is so high. As much as I love purchasing a beautiful indie deck, I’ve had a shifting of priorities. Do I want to buy that indie deck? Or, would I rather put that $65 dollars into my emergency fund or retirement fund. Now that I’m 55, I have to ask myself, “where will my $65 do the most good in the long run?” Indie decks are definitely a luxury item and not a necessity.
@@oldsoulmermaid1543 oh definitely I understand what you are saying. It’s important to spend wisely I hardly make any purchases for myself at all nowadays because everything has become so wildly costly. My next meal or car repair seems more important than hobbies :(
@@oldsoulmermaid1543 my first deck i made great money on enough so I included extra rewards and did a bunch of giveaways. I used the same goal on my second kickstarter and didn’t even have enough to cover expenses. The campaigns were only about 1 year apart. But everything shot up!
I look for the quality of design, the cardstock, and supporting independent designers. I have some indie decks and supported two designers on Kickstarter. I'm a designer by nature, have a 4-yr degree in Interior Design, and worked as a drafter. So, I see art with a trained eye. I'm very picky when it comes to decks, especially with Tarot cards. BUT, it has become very pricey. Since I'm not a professional reader, it makes me question the cost of $60 - 90 as I'm eyeing the Little Buddha Tarot by Push Kitty (Typically, I don't purchase "cute" decks). And yes... backers should be receiving their decks ahead of everyone else.
I’m not trained in art or any kind of design, so images have to affect me emotionally first! Oh, that little Buddha Tarot is so enticing and I’m trying to hold off because I do have several “cute decks”. But…sometimes the will;owner is very weak 😆.
The first and only time I’ve ever ordered a Kickstarter deck was the alleyman’s tarot. I ordered it last April and they are finally starting shipping at the end of the month.. its killing me but I think it’ll be worth it
same i was very broke when pre-ordering was going on in april 2021 n i could only afford the smallest tier. now i see it for sale for alot cheaper than even the lowest tier i got it at. im sure the deck will be awesome n im happy i was able to get it. jus a bit sad bout that
Your feelings are totally valid! I've done a few backing campaigns and had only one truly bad experience. And that was enough to put me off to KS for a while. If I'm going to back a deck, I make sure that the deck is completely finished and the creator has printed off prototypes and know which printer they're going with. Also, I've caught wind of a few creators who have developed a lackluster rep with regard to being unresponsive, unfriendly, etc. So I stay away from their campaigns. Fingers crossed that you receive your deck soon, Bonnie 💖
Yes, I need to learn to look at all of those things. I don’t think I’ll ever see the original deck. Maybe it fell through the cracks and was never sent in the first place. I’ll never know. Another deck was sent out to me Monday...hopefully I’ll get that one.
I don't back Kickstarters very often, maybe 1 or 2 a year, and usually it either has to be pretty much finished and ready to go, or just a really important deck that I want to support. I'm lucky that I haven't had any serious issues with campaigns I've backed. The most frustrating was the receiving my indie Light Seers well after people were already able to buy the Hay House version! So I was left wishing I could've just gotten the Hay House version for like 1/4 of the price AND sooner! But in the big scheme of things, it's not such a big deal. But we're still human and it can be frustrating when these things happen! And we have every right to alter our purchasing behaviours accordingly, like being more selective about the projects we support.
This is the first time I’ve had a deck not show up when everyone else has gotten their decks. I’m not certain where the hiccup is...the mail in China or the mail where I’m at here in the U.S. At this point, I don’t think it will ever arrive. Come to think of it...I’m still waiting on a replacement card for another Kickstarter deck that I had received in January! You are absolutely right, that being more selective is the way to go. I remember the delays for the Light Seers Tarot! I got my copy just days before my Hay House version arrived! And the cards were cut very unevenly. Ahhhh...first world problems! Thanks for your input, Katey!
I just saw Pappa Squirrel's video about his thoughts on ordering through KS.
His perspective is slightly different, but still relating to backing KS decks.
As I had commented in one of your other videos, I don't have that drive to buy decks at this time and i'm putting my spiritual investment into other resources.
I just watched his video as well! I have since backed a few decks, but honestly the prices for many Kickstarter decks are heading into the stratosphere! And…the mass market publishers are really upping their game for many decks that they seem like a more palatable option.
@@oldsoulmermaid1543 I was given a few decks (non independent) to do reviews of last year from a publishing company. And I feel the most common issue is card quality.
A few of these decks had "regular quality" card stock, but Lo Scarabeo had the lowest quality card stock, next to Make Playing Cards, that I've come across. Gratefully the design and theme of a few of these decks were the saving grace in me keeping them.
It "sounds" like many are leaning more towards ETSY for their potential deck purchases. At least, the product is available to be shipped.
I collect decks and must be in love with decks to use them but I have established some rules for myself: I only pay over $30/$40 if I absolutely love the deck and it’s likely to come with a book. I no longer buy expensive decks without books. I also have been good about avoiding Kickstarter. I only purchased one deck on there by an artist who has a string of previous decks sold and delivered with no issues. I find that my most treasured decks are the ones that completely exude “‘me” and my essence and because of that I usually allow a greater budget up to about $70 or $80 and those are few are and far between
I absolutely agree with you that setting parameters helps! I try to keep to things that I know I will absolutely love 💕!
Everything you say is spot on. I bought one deck that had no book which was my fault and it was the most expensive. She even asked me for extra postage, which she should have allowed for in the beginning. It was dream vision tarot. The deck that I recently got was exquisite familiars. It is quite fun. Good quality and definitely something that you won’t use everyday but still a nice deck. The wandering star was a beautiful deck i purchased, but in reality could buy it now as it is through hayhouse and a lot cheaper. So basically …. My thoughts. Don’t buy anymore and use what you ha e
I had a recent Kickstarter that was lost in the mail and creator sold all the excess copied before all his kickstarter has been fulfilled. I was miffed as first edition had extra cards and thats edition I paid for , but in the end i had to wait for 2nd run to get the deck, it soured the deck arrival for me , so much so I stored it the deck away until I can remove the negative association with the creator.
Omg 😱…that’s horrible! I don’t know if I would have ever been able to disassociate that negative experience from that deck! I’m glad that you did end up with a deck, even though it wasn’t the one you paid for. Horrible planning and practice on the creator’s part!
I don’t think you’re being petty at all. I do think you’re being reasonable and your frustration is definitely justified. Also, KS is always a gamble.
The only reason why I would back a KS deck is for the additional stuff along with the deck. I don’t mind too much for the higher prices because I want to support the creator/s. With that said, I’ve noticed I’m becoming more selective on what decks I want (both indie and mass produced) and I want to cut down on the amount of stuff I have. I only use 2 of my decks regularly anyway 😅😔
Yes, I hear you about becoming more selective! When I get a new deck I like to work with it exclusively for at least 2-4 weeks so that I can get a really good feel for it…leaving some other favorites waiting in the wings 😉
I just backed my 1st Kickstarter deck. I normally find my indie decks on Etsy. You are not being petty by any means, I totally understand. I had the same thing happen with an indie preorder. I seen so many posting on UA-cam their decks as I sat and waited for mine. I felt that same twinge of envy...
I’ve started backing decks on Kickstarter again since I’ve filmed this video, as things have seem to have normalized again with deck production. I always add a month to the estimated date of a campaign. I’ve recently backed my first Deck on Indiegogo, which is a little bit higher risk than Kickstarter...fingers crossed!
How do you actually find anything on Etsy among the hundreds of resold mass market decks?
I've never had a Kickstarter deck arrive as originally projected, but I've decided to just accept it as part of the experience. Like the long lines at the hobby store; I just factor in the wait.
On a side note, pre-ordering a deck on Amazon seems to be just as unreliable. I've seen unboxing videos of pre-ordered decks come out and when I question Amazon about it they tell me the deck has not been released. In one instance this went on for six weeks before I finally decided to cancel the Amazon order.
That has been a recent occurrence with U.S. Games decks. I’ve noticed that they no longer offer preorders on Amazon. You have to order from their site. I don’t know why that is.
I know this is over a year old and might no longer apply.... but your video definitely grabbed my attention from the YT suggestion list. I've watched it twice in fact.
I sense you were talking about 2 different things here, mixed together. Superbacker here, and I will be blunt with The Unpopular Opinion : the problem you feel strongly about is not Kickstarter. It seems to hint more to the fact that people in communities composed of creators and content-pushers have some REALLY strong attention-seeking dynamics going on. I immensely dislike social media for this. I've pulled out of all tarot communities because of this toxic shit.
Can you see that some are racing to be the first to do X (posting the new deck flip through, being first to get the item...), and/or are needy for attention from popular figures, and/or would like to be popular themselves and get similar attention but are not necessarily succeeding, and feel slighted and stuck in strong negative emotions/victimhood thoughts because of it? Listen back to the words you used: "big channel" "glib comment" "little me" "petty" "jealousy" "big youtuber" "whiny little girl"...
My advice is, from the KS perspective, to analyze issues only from a business transaction angle i.e. you have a right to complain about the quality of the product, its cost, delivery, and delivery priority between backers and regular customers who come afterwards. You can totally discuss this publicly to, like Papa Squirrel did about Oracle of Oddities (one of his best rants imo lol). Don't feel bad for changing your mind on backing a campaign either. It's business.
Just... don't go down the emotional road with the rest of the comments/drama/petty stuff in the tarot community.
I hope you are doing better this year.
BTW thanks for the comparison between mass market and indie deck for Wandering Star (which I went to watch before commenting here). Still on the fence about this deck. It's out of stock on HH, so I guess the wait-and-see decision has been taken for me already :)
Thank you for commenting on an old video! I honestly don’t remember everything I said in that video (heck…I don’t remember my videos from a month ago 😆!), but what I do remember waiting a very long time for a Kickstarter and seeing it pop up everywhere and I still hadn’t gotten mine and I was an early backer. I was worried and a little miffed when I saw it popping up on channels that admitted they were given the deck for review and I was still waiting for mine. I was right to be worried…I never got the deck. Eventually, I reached out to the creator and luckily she had a few left that she kept for her personal use and sent me one of those and asked that if the original deck ever showed up that I would send it back to her. I told her I would, but it never did turn up. The funny thing is, that in spite of everything, I ended up backing her 2nd edition of the deck because I loved the 1st one so much! I had a much better experience that time. Oh, for the Wandering Star Tarot…someone informed me that they found their copy at a Home Goods Store. I don’t know where you are, but if you are here in the States and have one of these stores near you, it might be worth checking out. I haven’t checked myself because I never shop at that particular store. Thanks again for your input 😁
@@oldsoulmermaid1543 hehe I am not in the US so I dsont know about this store... but the HH price is 13.50$ right now (but out of stock).... Imagine compared to the KS price. Oof. Funny story is that I did back the campaign while it was ongoing... and then backed off lol.
Glad you are doing better today ^_^
Thanks for making this video. I appreciate your perspective. What card stock(s) do you normally look for when choosing a deck to fund?
My favorite card stock is linen! But...I basically like anything that’s not super thin and papery or glossy and sticky!
Plus u t is how I know I really want it. Using that extra time to think about it. If it goes away after Kickstarter then it wasn't meant to be.
Maybe it’s because I mostly back tech projects on Kickstarter but I always figure it’ll be 6 months to a year before I get the product. If I want something g in my hand fast, I’d look for something already produced that’s out there. But if it’s something that I’m willing to wait for I’m more than happy to wait however long it takes. If waiting is an issue, definitely never back a tech product! They take forever but are well worth it.
Yes, I still have to learn that patience is a virtue 🤣. I think the uncertainty of the times with factories having to close or working at half capacity lead to anxiousness.
Tech products are so much more risky and they don’t always work. SO glad I did not buy into the Lily drone
Old video, but popped up on my recommendations. I don't think you're petty, I would have felt sad and disappointed too :/ Kickstarter decks are ridiculously expensive :/ I backed 3 this year but that's it, even if I understand why they are getting more expansive, it's still at least double the amount of a mass market deck and I love those too.
Kickstarter decks are getting soooo expensive. I think it’s a wonderful thing that the mass market publishers are improving their production values to compete and that some Kickstarter decks are being published mass market. I just backed 3 projects and I think that will be it for the foreseeable future.
Understand how you feel. I live in New Zealand and thinking twice about buying anything from the States as the mail is just so slow😐 much faster to buy from Europe.
Shipping from a different country from the one where you live has also become astronomical. I know here in the U.S. it can add almost $20 USD to a deck.
I've only bought a couple of them that peaked my interest. Other than that, I think the prices are getting a wee bit too high for my liking. So unless the artwork is beautiful and totally resonates with me, I'll just stick to browsing.
Kickstarter is so expensive, now. And often, within a few months, the goes mass market at a fraction of the cost.
So true! It seems like more Kickstarter decks are being picked up for mass market, which is a good thing!
Some seem to be downgraded though
I wont do Kickstarter again, I backed a deck its now about 7 months since i paid and still not got the deck. I know there have been delays in printing etc and yes am getting updates but still nothing, so I will sit here patiently waiting waiting waiting AND I have already decided that I’m going to give the deck to my daughter as I dont want it anymore
i'm having this experience with the golden eclipse, sigh.
i feel your frustration and think everything you said is perfectly reasonable. I'm wondering, since you made this almost one year ago, did the deck ever finally show up?
The original deck never showed up. The creator eventually had to send me a deck from her personal stock. It’s so funny 😆 because I did end up backing her 2nd edition of this deck on Kickstarter months later because I loved the 1st edition so much!
The linc to your insta doesn't work
I just don't do Kick starters. When I started collecting I saw too many situations that would give me a bad feeling about the deck. I know myself...just chose not to get into the emotions of all that. I also don't want to spend $80 and a few months later it's mass produced at $20! If it's a really good deck someone usually picks it up to publish.
I’m going on a six month ban of Kickstarter. The market has become over saturated with beautiful decks and I really need to be saving money for retirement 😉
Does the quality between Kickstarter and mass produce decks differ a lot?
For the most part...YES! With Kickstarter decks ( and independent decks in general) you get better quality card stock and boxes! Sometimes you get extras like gold foil and metallic or matte edging on the decks. Some times you can find a mass market deck with these things, but not usually.
Well I’m my case started selling oracle deck of my art with MPC and since I was broke decided to make them to order which is uncomfortable for me and the costumers, first the production cost for just one deck cost me $63!!!! So I decided okay so the price will be $85 so at least I have around 25 of profit and I can save money to produce the deck in bulk so it’s faster shipping and better price for people, so how wrong I was, first of all Etsy charges like $14 on commissions fees per deck sold, plus the costumer have to pay themselves an extra $5-7 for taxes so it’s crazy and I feel kinda bad because I really want to make my deck affordable and reach more people and it’s getting difficult like that and I thought it was a good idea to launch a kickstarted but it leave me very confused like you are trying to get a founding for your project but at the same time the rewards are the same thing you are trying to fund, how you make both things???
This has nothing to do with this topic but I was thinking of you last night because I had just received the Gaian tarot and I was look through it and thought “I hope Bonnie has this one! She would really love the representation of different ages!” 😊 ✌️
It is on me Amazon wishlist, but I don’t have it yet! I need to get it! I’ve gone back and forth on it because of the large borders, but I think I can get over it. Do you find them distracting at all?
Old Soul Mermaid - yes. I am going to trim the blue off. I’ll do a video after so you can see.
I’ve never attempted a deck trim! A video would be helpful!❤️
I did back one project and creator disappeared . Some project some backers did not get the deck but !!!!!! the deck sold around the world already.
Omg! How horrible! The creator of my deck had to send another one out to me because the original one never got to me. I was lucky that she had some set aside for such occurances.
You are right.... Not cool! 😳
Nope, I don’t think you’re being petty at all, that a frustrating situation. Im waiting on 1 Kickstarter deck but that’s it. There’s Covid, price has gotten out of hand, mass market decks available before backers getting their indies, etc. I’m just glad I’m at a point we’re I’m pretty happy with what I have and I just don’t feel the need to get every deck out there anymore. Hugs 🤗
It is getting crazy! There are a couple of decks I want to add to my collection and then I may place myself on a no buy period, so that I can work with the ones I have in earnest and re-evaluate my collection. I think it won’t be too long before I get priced out of the indie decks, though. ❤️
Old Soul Mermaid Meh... once you get to where you’re not buying so many, you won’t mind spending a bit more on one you really want once in a blue moon. It’ll work itself out you’ll see 😉
That’s where I want to be! Thank you 🙏❤️
Yes, seeing a YT review of a deck that has not been released is not fun. For me, I question the value of the channel and the review.
I can see the side of the creator in wanting to advertise their deck with a well known channel, but as a consumer you would like the decks to go out to the people who backed and believed in the project first. This video was done early in my channel’s history and since then I’ve been given 4 decks for review from deck creators. One small Ukrainian company that I was not aware of has sent me a few decks to get them seen to an American audience and I liked the decks, so I was happy to do the unboxings for them. I agree that the best reviews and unboxings are those that are purchased by the content creator’s own money.
Small world! I will search out those reviews. I have a special place in my heart for Ukraine. My husband, passed away, worked in Ukraine and spoke well of his time there
Well I certainly will not be getting one I’m gonna stick to Regular RWS some of the concepts are getting off topic or the same as RWS they
Are too expensive and some has too much goin on in the cards to get a real sense of what the hell is goin on I’m new and I wait may be years before I get one because they like $70 and more now and plus they don’t mean anything anymore people are just creating decks to create I stick to Los Scarabeo and US games
I totally understand! Indie decks are getting really expensive, though admittedly, I have no idea what it costs to produce a deck. You are correct that there are plenty of outstanding and beautiful mass market decks to choose from and that don’t break the bank...thank goodness!
Have you received your new copy of this deck yet? Of course I could be wrong, but I believe I have backed the second edition of this deck on Kickstarter. However, I am having doubts for my own reasons and may change my mind!
I did finally get it, but only after the creator sent me another copy. I never did get the original Kickstarter deck from China. I have a full unboxing of the deck on my channel. I couldn’t help myself...I’m backing the new edition too! I love the decks so much!
@@oldsoulmermaid1543 Ah, I somehow missed the unboxing. I'll take a look today. I'm trying to buy fewer decks and it is tough, but I have been putting more thought into what I buy since watching this and videos about deck addiction!
I know what you mean! I have my set storage space for decks and when it fills up, I can’t buy any decks until I purge/ sell some decks. It keeps it manageable!😂
I have backed one kickstarter. The Lightseers. And honestly I was annoyed that it went mass market so fast. With international postage I would have waited. However I appreciate that the popularity of the kickstarter helped her get the deal probably and with the changes to the deck I do have something slightly different to the MM version. I do love that deck. But... I haven't backed a kickstarter since. 🤷🏻♀️
Just realised this is an older video. Lol. Popped up in my feed. Did you get the deck in the end?
Wow! Such control! Did you get the deck with the original 10 of Swords? I did the preorder for the indie deck and that’s when she changed that card. I’m getting more picky before I back a deck and it has slowed substantially for me.
Oh, that’s nice of UA-cam to push out an older video of mine 😆! I never did get the original Kickstarter deck. The creator had to send me a copy from her personal stash. I had to wait a long while for it. After that experience, I did stop backing decks for a number of months…but then I started backing decks again 😉
@@oldsoulmermaid1543 Yes I do have the original 10 of swords. I never did get the replacement though.
I don’t think you’re petty, I agree with you
🥰
I have never backed decks on kickstarter because they are way too expansive and I know how cheap productions costs actually are. I just think it's often times a huge ripoff, why would I pay 6o€ if the deck often times only costed less than a euro in production. On top of that as pretty as a lot of those modern decks are, most of them lack symbolism to really have any real depth to them.
I definitely have a love-hate relationship with Kickstarter 😆. I have no idea about what it takes to produce a deck, but I have heard that one of the most expensive part aspects of it is the box. Those fancy magnetic closure boxes do t come cheap. I do agree that some of the decks are more of a “Tarot Art” deck, but that’s ok with me.Those decks either push me to find new ways of reading or they end up as little pockets of art that I can enjoy. I do agree that the costs are skyrocketing. It’s a good thing that the mass market publishers are upping their production quality of their decks to compete with the indie market. Now you can get some really beautiful Mass market decks 😉
This comment made me laugh so much! Please, enlighten all those deck creators, where you can produce decks that would cost one euro per final, ready-to-sell deck! I beg you, do it! Lol. Sure 60 euro decks are expensive, but it takes a lot to produce them, especially if you don't make them in China and/or don't have lots of resources to order 5000 copies at the time. The deck, the box, the book or little booklet everything costs. PLUS, what about time and energy creators spend? If they spend lots of hours making it, use their resources to create, should that be just dismissed? Saying that a deck cost one euro to produce is just very ignorant. Sorry.
You bring up some good points. You really can’t put a price on a creator’s blood, sweat, and tears put into their creation and then the production of their projects.
@@angelsaround8168 lol your comment made me laugh as well, you just gave yourself the answer, china! A lot of creators produce their decks their, in fact those companies use those decks to promote their services, giving them as examples of what they have produced in the past. Producing good quality decks in china is very cheap and you don't need to order 5000 unites to make them under a Euro, around 2000 is often times enough and even if you'd choose to produce only 500 unites it would still cost you under three Euro. Delivery costs are obviously not included but cards, box and booklet are. Guess what kickstarter is for?! Getting the financial resources and the first costumers. So a lot of them usually do have the resources and costumers to produce enough decks to keep the costs down. It's not like they are getting cheap once they are popular.
Most costumers don't know where the decks were produced, creators rarely disclose such information but funny enough the prices of those who produce it in china and those who might not seem to be similar. Now if they would always disclose it and would not produce them in china (or other cheap countries), I wouldn't even be half as critical as I am. But the reality is different.
I've never said time and energy doesn't count, but it's isn't worth spending 60+ Euros for me personally, especially if it was produced in china & Co. If you are willing to spend so much money then go ahead, I don't care. Your comment is ignorant as well.
Since you are obviously bothered or feel slighted by this overlook by this certain creator, why not just come out and mention her name or the Tarot in question. This is just whining and screaming into the wind . Pointless to vent and stay « general » in this situation. For criticism to be constructive and useful in expressing an opinion and getting info out there, it should be detailed. Sorry this bad experience happened to you.
Oooo…I posted this video a year ago. I don’t even remember everything I said in it. I know it was early in my channel’s existence…definitely a blast from the past 😆! Thank you for watching 🙏.