Learn New Music Fast With These Piano Practice Techniques!

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  • Опубліковано 25 чер 2024
  • Knowing how to practice is as important as knowing how to decipher the music on the page. In this video, I take you through 5 of the best practice techniques I know, so you can learn your music faster and more securely.
    Get your free practice workbook with some of my most effective practice techniques here: mailchi.mp/bccb1e32807f/pract...
    Get access to my complete library of transformational workshops, tutorials, and the super supportive Le Cheile Music community. More information here: www.lecheilemusic.com/members...
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    Facebook: / lecheilemusic
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    Website: www.lecheilemusic.com
    Get 2 weeks free trial and/or 30% off a Tonebase subscription when you use the coupon code LECHEILE-30 More information here: tonebase.co?ref=lecheilemusic30
    #learnpiano #beginnerpiano #pianotutorial

КОМЕНТАРІ • 130

  • @JaysCigar
    @JaysCigar 3 роки тому +63

    No flashy studio, no gimmicks...just solid, practical, USABLE advice! What a great channel!

    • @LeCheileMusic
      @LeCheileMusic  3 роки тому +1

      Thanks so much Jay! 😊🎶

    • @richmar103
      @richmar103 3 роки тому

      @@LeCheileMusic these videos really are so helpful, thanks for making!

    • @molotulo8808
      @molotulo8808 3 роки тому +1

      Hey, are you moving in on my babe?

  • @andrewmaperson
    @andrewmaperson 3 роки тому +22

    1. 1 measure +1
    2. 1 measure +1 variation
    3. Paying backwards
    4. Alternating hands measure to measure
    5. Using a metronome

    • @donk100100
      @donk100100 6 днів тому

      6. Play both hands staccato
      7. Play left hand staccato and right hand legato
      8. Play left hand legato, right staccato
      9. Play right hand, each note in a quarter note, left in eighth notes
      10. Play left hand eighth, right hand quarter
      I started these with a 5 note scale to start and work upwards. I even slowed the pulse in half.

  • @Earlofmar1
    @Earlofmar1 3 роки тому +3

    reading how it is done (as I have seen in books) versus watching how it is done is two different things. I was really impressed with this video, thanks.

  • @juliesmith3711
    @juliesmith3711 Рік тому +2

    ❤ I love watching you - not only do I learn so much that is useful but your warmth helps me manage my anxieties about struggling to learn. Thank you

  • @lifespanwellnessbeauty-60i64
    @lifespanwellnessbeauty-60i64 3 роки тому +5

    Slow works well for me. When I finally get it up to tempo, it’s much easier to play the piece correctly.

  • @mellyju
    @mellyju 9 місяців тому

    That makes perfect sense, but I hadn’t thought of it before. Very clever, thank you!

  • @hardermusic
    @hardermusic 3 роки тому +3

    I simply can not put into words how lucky I feel to have found you! From what I can tell, you are a great music educator and certainly a lot more helpful than most piano- (or general music-) teaching channels on UA-cam! I have cried literal tears of joy from understanding concepts that you put into context, that have never really "clicked" with me before. Thank you so much for the work you are doing here!

    • @LeCheileMusic
      @LeCheileMusic  3 роки тому +1

      That’s so great to hear, thank you! 🥰🎶

  • @cathieproffitt6432
    @cathieproffitt6432 Рік тому

    Thank you! I’m a granny teaching my grands and you have become my new best friend!

  • @KevinTarrant-lb1ek
    @KevinTarrant-lb1ek Рік тому

    Thanks for another great video Leah. Your piano videos are by far the best on UA-cam. Míle buíochas!

  • @qamarrossini
    @qamarrossini Рік тому

    I'VE LISTENED TO SEVERAL OF YOUR EXCELLENT PRESENTATIONS. THANKS SO MUCH !
    P. S. love the lilt of your voice, makes me miss Ireland.

  • @Nienpet
    @Nienpet Рік тому

    Clair de Lune is sitting on my piano calling my name. I’m in bed with a coffee screaming back “I can’t practice now I’m watching a video on how to practice!” 😄☕️
    Great tips. Thanks. Can’t wait to give them a go. I really like the part about feeling okay with slowing down. There’s so much pressure to sound as if you know what you’re doing from the word go and that’s just simply unreasonable. That’s quite a relief.

  • @Omega0401
    @Omega0401 3 роки тому +4

    Loved your lesson. Play at the speed of no mistakes and when silly mistakes, walk away. Great advice as well as all the other practice methods you shared. Thank you so much!

  • @AsherMandrake
    @AsherMandrake Рік тому +1

    Good tips! Thank you for sharing.

  • @annettemay6952
    @annettemay6952 3 роки тому

    Thanks for this great tutorial!!

  • @moncordero1
    @moncordero1 3 роки тому +2

    Thank you Leah! 😊👍🏼🙏🏼

  • @diane-elizabeth5066
    @diane-elizabeth5066 Рік тому

    Awesome! Thank you!

  • @freebird0797
    @freebird0797 3 роки тому

    Great channel! Thank you for your work🙂

  • @lichfieldtunelesschoir2286
    @lichfieldtunelesschoir2286 2 роки тому +2

    what an inspirational teacher you are! You have given me lots of new approaches to teaching my own adult students - thank you :)

    • @LeCheileMusic
      @LeCheileMusic  2 роки тому

      Thanks Sarah Jane, delighted to help 😊

  • @edithofr.i.emeraldisle5042
    @edithofr.i.emeraldisle5042 Рік тому

    Thank you. Great stuff!

  • @jodyj7216
    @jodyj7216 2 роки тому

    These tips are so valuable. Thank you for putting them all together and sharing!!

  • @aBachwardsfellow
    @aBachwardsfellow 29 днів тому

    I very much love your clear and succinct videos-- all are excellent. However this one caught me of guard and took me a few minutes to realize that the measures of the Schumann "Melody" you were practicing are not the ones showing on the screen (they're just slightly off-screen at the top -- at least on my computer). Once I looked it up on IMSLP it made sense!

  • @cognachobo2320
    @cognachobo2320 3 роки тому +10

    Wow - another great vid. You really are an excellent teacher and now my go to teacher for learning. Seriously, there are paid courses on Udemy (& other sites) that charge and aren’t half as good as you - perhaps you should consider authoring a course. I would happily pay for a course tutored by you - as would many others on here. When you find a quality teacher it’s worth every penny. Thanks so much for these invaluable gems. 🙏

    • @LeCheileMusic
      @LeCheileMusic  3 роки тому +4

      Thank you so much, and yes, I'm considering something along those lines - I will take your comment as a sign I should go ahead!

    • @cognachobo2320
      @cognachobo2320 3 роки тому +3

      @@LeCheileMusic please go ahead. You should absolutely be earning from your talent as a teacher. I have taken some paid courses and believe me they don’t come close to your ability and skill as a teacher. Take it as a sign and go ahead. I have subscribed to your channel and hope to be one of the first to sign up when you do start a paid course. All the best and thanks so much for sharing your talent. I really appreciate it 🙏

  • @susanking8971
    @susanking8971 Рік тому

    Thank you! So discouraged as I return to piano after 50 years. You’ve given hope with such common sense strategies!

  • @sk-lo3ui
    @sk-lo3ui Рік тому

    valuable advice, thank you..👏

  • @sopranogirl13
    @sopranogirl13 Рік тому

    Excellent advice!! Thank you so much! I’m going to use this practicing strategy.

  • @amandabouskill4982
    @amandabouskill4982 2 роки тому

    Really helpful!

  • @jeffh5388
    @jeffh5388 Рік тому

    Thank you. Very helpful indeed.

  • @WidowOfWindsor
    @WidowOfWindsor Рік тому

    December, 2022! Love your teaching style.

  • @nevertoolateforpiano2155
    @nevertoolateforpiano2155 3 роки тому +1

    Thank you for your tips! Your video is straightforward, very interesting and informative. Glad I discovered your videos!

  • @crevass2
    @crevass2 3 роки тому

    Very informative lesson!

  • @reneebrown2222
    @reneebrown2222 Рік тому +1

    These videos are so helpful! Thank you teaching me basic principles of piano again! These are so important! You’re awesome!

  • @freddieblue6351
    @freddieblue6351 3 роки тому

    Thank you!!! I love your channel. I am working myself through the Michael Aaron Adult book volume one.

  • @lawrencetaylor4101
    @lawrencetaylor4101 2 роки тому

    Merci for this. I'll put this into practice.

  • @donnypiano7379
    @donnypiano7379 2 роки тому +1

    This was very useful advice, presented in a calm and professional manner. Thanks so much.

  • @williequinlan7252
    @williequinlan7252 3 роки тому

    Thank you again 👍☘️

  • @triciakamerer3544
    @triciakamerer3544 3 роки тому

    Another quality video. Thank you for providing all of these valuable, juicy nuggets that help the process. I am eager to try some of these tips, since I have apparently just been playing and not really practicing.

  • @moondoggie5989
    @moondoggie5989 3 роки тому

    Great strategic advice!

  • @priscillablackwell6772
    @priscillablackwell6772 3 роки тому

    Love, love, love these practice techniques! Thank you so much for taking the time to share these through UA-cam.

  • @yardrail3432
    @yardrail3432 3 роки тому +2

    Thankyou for your presentation which is so helpful. Love your teaching methods6

  • @SherMusician
    @SherMusician Рік тому

    You're an amazing teacher!

  • @carolynnmathisen8754
    @carolynnmathisen8754 3 роки тому

    WOW!, Your bar plus 1 is great. Break it down into “bite size” bits. Thank you!!!!

  • @virginiaharrington3231
    @virginiaharrington3231 3 роки тому +1

    Thank you so much for your videos. They give wonderful advice and help to beginners and I am looking forward to seeing many more.

    • @LeCheileMusic
      @LeCheileMusic  3 роки тому

      Thanks Virginia, that’s great to hear 😊

  • @corinnamarie9694
    @corinnamarie9694 Рік тому

    I am learning the saxophone, but 90% of this video applies to my practice as well. Thanks for your practical and easy approach to learning to play an instrument! Cheers from Nebraska!

  • @homamellersh8446
    @homamellersh8446 3 роки тому

    Thank you so much for the superb advice, I can see where I go wrong ( I do all the things that I shouldn’t be doing) and all that explained in a beautiful Irish accent 😍.

  • @kcollins3451
    @kcollins3451 3 роки тому

    Very good tips. Using them makes practice much more fun than just playing mistakes over and over. As you say at the end, it takes the drudgery out of it! Thank you very much.

  • @salemnj1
    @salemnj1 3 роки тому +2

    I really like your videos. :) You give good advice and also seem to really have your heart in such a good place - really wanting to help people learn.

    • @LeCheileMusic
      @LeCheileMusic  3 роки тому +2

      Thank you Steven, it brings me a lot of joy to help people learn; the more time we spend playing music, the happier we all are, eh? 😊🎶

    • @salemnj1
      @salemnj1 3 роки тому

      @@LeCheileMusic definitely! :)

  • @esmith6738
    @esmith6738 3 роки тому

    Good advice. Thanks. More than good advice, great advice. After several years of instruction and “practice” on keyboards this the best advice on actual practice I have ever heard. The logic and benefits are immediately obvious yet no one has ever suggested such practice habits before. This will definitely improve my practice. Thanks so much for your help.

  • @mveleedoudavid5063
    @mveleedoudavid5063 2 роки тому

    Thanks from Cameroon

  • @nancydemers3877
    @nancydemers3877 3 роки тому

    Thank you for all your videos - excellent. I'm a very, very early beginner and am attempting this piece. It's challenging but great fun.

    • @LeCheileMusic
      @LeCheileMusic  3 роки тому

      Thanks Nancy! It’s a great little piece, isn’t it? 😊🎶

  • @robertfoster6070
    @robertfoster6070 Рік тому +1

    A digital piano helps in recording myself.

  • @24starbuck
    @24starbuck 3 роки тому

    Thanks again for an excellent video. I make all these mistakes but will keep trying to correct them to improve the speed of learning a piece. The drive to get up to speed and make it sound good is very strong. New motto ‘a note in time saves nine’!

    • @LeCheileMusic
      @LeCheileMusic  3 роки тому +2

      I like that motto - I might borrow it! 😃🎶

    • @24starbuck
      @24starbuck 3 роки тому

      @@LeCheileMusic you’re welcome! 😀I spend a lot of time unlearning a mistake made by playing too fast so it’s literally true! 😂

  • @g.970
    @g.970 Рік тому +1

    Are you in Ireland? Love your videos. They are very helpful. I took private lessons, beginning at age 35, for eight years. At 56 I downsized house and had to leave my grand piano behind. I got an amazing digital piano but it just wasn’t the same. 15 years later I’ve bought a new brand piano(sold the sofa to fit in the piano) and am starting again but learning more from UA-cam than I ever did with private lessons. Thank you

    • @deadmanswife3625
      @deadmanswife3625 Рік тому

      UA-cam is great. It's great that you realize what brings you Joy and exchange the couch so you had room

    • @LeCheileMusic
      @LeCheileMusic  Рік тому

      Hi Gretchen, yes I’m in Ireland 🇮🇪😊 Good luck with the new piano - may it bring you years of pleasure!

  • @danielsmyth9983
    @danielsmyth9983 2 роки тому

    Thanks for these great tips and your practice booklet. A newbie question, Should the pedal be used right away when doing the bar plus one work? Or do you add pedal when you have the whole piece flowing?

  • @kelguy2002
    @kelguy2002 3 роки тому

    Happy ST. Patrick’s Day M’Lady Thank you For Your Efforts ☘️☘️☘️☮️❤️🎼From 🇺🇸

  • @seansmart2756
    @seansmart2756 3 роки тому

    Thanks for another great video. I've been working on Arabesque (Burgmuller) and slow definitely helped with that one. It's the fastest song I think I've ever played haha. I usually pick slow, moody pieces. Looking forward to your next episode.

    • @LeCheileMusic
      @LeCheileMusic  3 роки тому +2

      Good stuff, Sean, a great piece - that left hand is a real challenge!

    • @seansmart2756
      @seansmart2756 3 роки тому

      @@LeCheileMusic Thank you. Yes, I did exactly as you suggested and broke it down by bar and took my time. I'm really chuffed right now.

  • @LeCheileMusic
    @LeCheileMusic  2 роки тому

    Cut your learning time in half with these piano practice techniques! Download your free workbook here: mailchi.mp/bccb1e32807f/practice-workbook-giveaway

  • @molotulo8808
    @molotulo8808 3 роки тому +1

    If I am practicing a song that has a tempo of 120 but I am learning, I will slow the tempo (Keeping in mind that the song is required for a faster tempo). I bought a CD recorded and use a cdrw disc. I have several hundred discs (with no money) and record all my practicing. Zappa recorded any time he practiced because he could use his practice tapes for song inspiration. Hendrix's father released several Jim Hendrix's albums just releasing practice recordings! I love listening to my practicing...I find this to be very useful!
    Another classic video...thank you!

    • @LeCheileMusic
      @LeCheileMusic  3 роки тому

      Recording yourself is a great practice technique!

  • @mikehoughton4881
    @mikehoughton4881 Рік тому

    Could you please do a video how to play the dotted eighth and sixteenth note rythmn? Thank you

  • @prematureoptimism7125
    @prematureoptimism7125 8 місяців тому

    Great common sense advice. Wish I'd discovered this channel a lot sooner. I've currently got an old, I believe obsolete upright acoustic piano that musicians use to affectionately call "A Tom Thumb." Mainly because of its size & the fact that it's not a full range piano. It's only got 5 and a 1/2 octaves. It also has a pickup that runs along the strings so it can be amplified by some German made system. Basically it's a small sturdy stage piano on wheels for a touring band that needed an acoustic sounding keyboard but didn't want to rent or couldn't afford a full size on their gigs. Anyway long story short, I did my best to refurbish & tune it. Now comes the real challenge. . . Learning to play the darn thing. ( that's ur cue ) 🎹🎹🎹🎹🎹

    • @LeCheileMusic
      @LeCheileMusic  8 місяців тому +1

      A Tom Thumb - sounds adorable 🥹Well done you for restoring it! 👏👏👏 Well, taking my cue from your cue, I do have a full beginner course available either from my website membership (tutorials, courses, live events etc) and also from my UA-cam channel membership (tutorials only (but including beginners course), and less expensive) that you access from the UA-cam button options just under any of my videos (you might have to scroll over a bit). Best of luck with your piano journey whatever route you decide to take! 😁

    • @aBachwardsfellow
      @aBachwardsfellow 29 днів тому +1

      ​@@LeCheileMusic James Pavel Shawcross does a nice review of a Tom Thumb piano (only 1 string per note) on his ThePianoforever channel -- interesting to see and hear.

  • @JayDeePiano
    @JayDeePiano 3 роки тому +4

    got eureka moments in this video! you certainly know how to open doors and windows for your students. ❤️

  • @JimOutLoud
    @JimOutLoud 3 роки тому

    This is great stuff. I need to go through all of your content. It seems to just make sense as opposed to all the other noise out there promising quick results. Thanks!!!

    • @LeCheileMusic
      @LeCheileMusic  3 роки тому +1

      Thanks Jim!

    • @LeCheileMusic
      @LeCheileMusic  3 роки тому +1

      And thanks also for your generous tip, much appreciated and will help fund future videos :-)

  • @homamellersh8446
    @homamellersh8446 2 роки тому +1

    Thank you for a brilliant session. I have just watched couple of your videos for the second time ( I know that because they both have “ like “
    mark) . I find that when I watch or listen to a new subject for the first time I don’t get all of it, but some time later after practicing and getting to know more about it,then the second time I can get to grips with it much better. So thank you again,very grateful for your brilliant teaching.♥️

    • @LeCheileMusic
      @LeCheileMusic  2 роки тому

      I'm exactly the same; I need to hear something multiple times before I get it 😄

  • @molotulo8808
    @molotulo8808 3 роки тому +1

    I love my electric keyboards because they are always in tune and because of midi, my keyboards are in sync. Leah should throw a Moog Matriarch Analog Synthesizer on top of her piano. Leah, do you play any other instruments? I play keyboard, guitar, harmonica, latin percussion. I would love to start playing violin!!!. My keyboards are plugged into a mixer along with my guitar pedal (Boss ME-80) where I can plug my guitar or my microphones for amplifying my drums or harmonicas. She should get an amp/reverb unit with a mic in the piano. I really want to see Leah on a Moog!
    These videos are priceless. Do you have any videos of you playing songs...love to see you playing a song! Anyone agree?

    • @LeCheileMusic
      @LeCheileMusic  3 роки тому

      Thanks Molo Tulo - I'm not sure I'd know what to do with a Moog Matriarch Analog Synthesizer, but it sounds like fun! Thanks for your suggestions - at some stage I might post a performance video - it's not my forte, but we'll see :-)

  • @melanietraplin8974
    @melanietraplin8974 2 роки тому

    I love this piece what is the name? I am going to set a goal to learn this one. You explain things wonderfully. Thank you.

    • @LeCheileMusic
      @LeCheileMusic  2 роки тому

      Hi Melanie, it's Melody by Robert Schumann. I've done a tutorial on it here which will help: vimeo.com/654143990/c2c57a7df1
      Best of luck with it! 😊

  • @jeffchisamore1556
    @jeffchisamore1556 3 роки тому

    I subconsciously sabotage myself while I record. I still haven't figured out why. Solid channel. Thank you for the great lessons.

    • @LeCheileMusic
      @LeCheileMusic  3 роки тому +3

      Thanks Jeff, bear in mind that we never play as well when we’re performing (even if it’s just to a recording device) as we do when we’re just playing for ourselves. I always tell students to play 20% slower for me than they do alone, so maybe you could try this when you’re recording as well? Let me know if it helps! 😁🎶

    • @tia904
      @tia904 2 роки тому +1

      It was for me at the beginning also but since I did it regularly, after 6 months to a year it no longer affects me. If for some reason it does I just start the recording again. I agree that it is really helpful, it has on its own significantly improved my playing sound. Rhythms issues, harshness, fingering hesitation etc. Been much more helpful than a teacher's feedback even because you hear it for yourself.

  • @freddieblue6351
    @freddieblue6351 3 роки тому

    What piano model do you play? It sounds really even and nice...very pleasant tone.

    • @LeCheileMusic
      @LeCheileMusic  3 роки тому +1

      Hi Freddie, thanks, I love it too - it’s a Kawai, not sure what model but it’s from around 1980 😊

  • @BRL1611
    @BRL1611 3 роки тому

    Building speed was my biggest issue. I always was tense, and had tight muscles.

    • @LeCheileMusic
      @LeCheileMusic  3 роки тому

      I struggle with fast playing too - but I'll be making a video about that soon too :-)

  • @maywww
    @maywww 3 роки тому

    Thank you for sharing your knowledge...However the letters on the screen are hard to read when they're the same color of your top :)

    • @LeCheileMusic
      @LeCheileMusic  3 роки тому +1

      Oops! 😭Thanks, I’ll keep that in mind for next time 😃

  • @kenneth1767
    @kenneth1767 3 роки тому

    Little by little great wealth is accumulated.

  • @norims217
    @norims217 2 роки тому

    👍

  • @katiesethna
    @katiesethna 3 роки тому

    Thank you, why have you 2 treble clefs today? Whatever, very catchy little tune. I progress!

    • @LeCheileMusic
      @LeCheileMusic  3 роки тому +3

      Good catch, Katie! Yes, it’s not unusual for both hands to play above (or below) middle C, in which case the left hand would often be written in the treble so that the music is easier to read. Likewise the right hand might be written in the bass clef. It avoids the need for a lot of ledger lines. Hope this explains it for you 😊

  • @SherMusician
    @SherMusician Рік тому

    Can the right hand play the bass clef and vice versa. Is that what u mean

  • @doriananderson185
    @doriananderson185 Рік тому

    Lea I found your App and it has been very enjoyable.I would like to become one of your student’s if you have any vacancies.If you are able to be my Teacher. I am on a fixed budget andI get paid on the last day of the month. Thank you,

    • @LeCheileMusic
      @LeCheileMusic  Рік тому

      Hi Dorian, you can find out more about options for working with me on my website www.Lecheilemusic.com

  • @colleensmith6655
    @colleensmith6655 Рік тому

    I can’t find the download button suggested in your previous video please???

    • @LeCheileMusic
      @LeCheileMusic  Рік тому

      Hi Colleen, do you mean for the practice workbook? You can download it here: mailchi.mp/bccb1e32807f/practice-workbook-giveaway

  • @robwattimena9478
    @robwattimena9478 3 роки тому

    Where can I find the sheet music of this practice technique?

    • @LeCheileMusic
      @LeCheileMusic  3 роки тому

      Hi Rob, the piece is Melody from Schumann's Album for the Young, Opus 68. If you google the Petrucci library, it's a free resource for sheet music online, you'll surely be able to download a copy from there.

  • @lawrencekellie
    @lawrencekellie Рік тому

    I have never heard of anyone else expressing the concept of "playing backwards." I have wondered for years if that is a viable memorization technique. Normal memorizing gives 1000s of repetitions of the first bar, yet the last one, gets very few. So playing the piece, as in a performance, as you proceed to the end, each bar has been memorized with less repetitions and there is a chance of mistakes as you get closer to the end.
    My considering that technique for so many years, was not in the realm of music, but in written works, such as, poems, play scripts, prose, scripture, etc. But I have never put it into practice.
    Could the "playing backwards" technique be successfully employed as the starting technique and the other ones you have mentioned are built on it?
    Lawrence
    ps. Leah. I'm extremely happy to see your arms hand, and finger movement is like a "normal" person and not like a clumsy bird trying to take off! It appears that professional performers must have that affectation. :(

    • @LeCheileMusic
      @LeCheileMusic  Рік тому

      Hi Lawrence, yes indeed, learning a piece by starting with the last phrase is a very good way to work!

    • @aBachwardsfellow
      @aBachwardsfellow 29 днів тому

      ​@@LeCheileMusic I have definitely used the "backwards" approach on several pieces -- it works marvelously well, as when playing the piece normally, it becomes more familiar and secure the further you go. Also -- in some instances, the composition has become more developed at the end, so even though the beginning has not been practiced as much, it's sometimes easier.
      However, it's also good -- early on -- to also go through the entire piece from the beginning to begin to hear the development and flow.

  • @EaglesVision999
    @EaglesVision999 3 роки тому

    Can you please check musicwithnopain channel and please see if it's a good one for sheet reading, because I'm new and your a teacher

    • @LeCheileMusic
      @LeCheileMusic  3 роки тому

      Hi Art, I just looked at the grade 1 sight-reading video - it’s looks very useful for practicing, so I would say go ahead. You can practice what you learn in my videos over there! 😁🎶

  • @jkdjose
    @jkdjose Рік тому

    I would join, but I sent an email and haven't heard back. I always send an email to see how responsive people are before subscribing to anything. So far no response....

    • @LeCheileMusic
      @LeCheileMusic  Рік тому

      Hi Jose, I responded to you on November 17th - I wonder if my reply went to your spam folder?