A lot of older loggers like to put the body of the saw down and start their back cut on their left side as seen in this video. A couple reasons they did this was to avoid excessive movement around the tree or because the footing on that side was better. Also they used 1" or less hinges even on 5' trees.
Some of these trees get nasty. Big trees that have fire in them. I've seen 12" diameter limbs falling out of 50+inch DBH pine trees as the tree burns from the top down. Do I want to be bent over cutting on my knees worrying about a one foot stump? Negative, tough guy. I want to be head-up, observing overhead hazards, ready to get out of the way. This is the reasoning with the higher stumps. Cut at a comfortable height that allows for quick escape.
Working for the FS in Oregon and Montana for as long as I did, this was considered the RIGHT way to fall a tree. Never start with a sloped cut because if you screw it up, there's no way to re-gun your cuts and get the tree to fall where you want it. In the Pacific Northwest, there's sometimes a pretty small margin between threading the needle and getting your snag hung up in jackstraw. In firefighting, don't bother throwing down Humbolts or 1' stumps. Be concerned with safety, not board feet.
The argument for diagonal/angled face cut first is because it is easier to connect a horizontal line to the diagonal that to get a diagonal to land where your horizontal is. If you're counter argument is that pros can do it with experience then i would say the same about your original comment "if you screw it up there's no way to fix it". It's just as easy to gun a diagonal as a horizontal as soon as the chain has bit into the cut even an inch
Agreed Fred.. about cutting from either side and its often easier just to flip the saw and start the backcut ... However, making the top cut first has many advantages.. that's not gonna change anytime soon..
@n1ztb ya it might be that old, though it says 2004 in the description.. if its old and out of date, they should say so. Still a nice video.. some good tips..
@murphy4trees I wonder how old the original video is; looks like early 80's maybe. And yeah, I generally start the back cut on the other side, too, unless I'm plunging and working my way around.
@3LilyLil You need to know the FS requires all stumps to be three foot high per their safety regs. Me lower the better. This guy is pro,he is only doing what the FS regs allow a sawyer to do, Yes this is weird way to drop a tree,
It really dosnt matter how old that video is. Trees havnt changed in a thousand years. And if you lived in the NW youd learn to cut trees from both sides real fast. We have what you call mountains and you cant cut on the downhill side. And for the plunge cut on almost every tree? Why?
I'm not even sure how that makes it easier to line up your cuts. Not to mention if you do your sloping cut first, gunning would be damn near impossible. The first cut is called a gunning cut for a reason. About the only time I plunge on the back cut is when there's a strong lean and I'm worried about a barber chair. And yeah, I couldn't imagine being able to cut on the same side every time unless I were in kansas.
Old habits die hard. Nice video demo, BUT the technique shown for cutting the notch is old school. It was painful to watch. Making the top cut first, as per Game of logging, will be a lot faster easier, and much less chance of making a mistake, especially for newbies. I also almost always start the backcut with the tree to my right, though I've noticed most loggers cut as you do, with the body of the saw facing down. I prefer to start form the other side and will plunge cut most bigger trees
I agree with you Doug. its scary to me that people that have little falling skills post an instructive video on how to fall a tree. Some one is going to get hurt or destroy property. just because you have a Tree Service business and hang a rope in a spar or in most any tree dosnt mean you a qualified to teach some one to fall trees. The only way to learn is to be out in the woods on a strip cutting timber. No book or video will make you a timber cutter.
Useless? Where is the video of you putting down a 50-75ft tall tree right on the money of where you planned it to fall? The video has no useless information. A person should try to know as much as possible, dropping trees that size is very dangerous.
What the hell is safe about cutting a burning tree (usually the reason you're cutting it in the first place on a fire) for a 1' stump? Unless it's right next to the line you would just dump it and move on. They fall a lot of trees in the air force do they?
Yea he does. Wildland guys aren’t timber fallers and timber fallers aren’t wildland guys. He’s teaching beginners that have never put wood to the ground, plus he isn’t cutting for board feet.
haha. man these videos are funny. i know its educational, but the hyper-exaggerated checking of ALL the cuts is just way beyond anything anyone (even beginners) does on the job...
Not following you on making the top cut first. Ive seen a lot of so called rookies do that. Why? The only reason i see is its easier to match up your corners on the next cut.
I wonder why he's teaching to to the bottom cut of the face first. If you do the top cut, the bottom cut will be almost impossible to miss. Its easier and saves time
What's this stuff about "gunning" or "under" cut on what is a simple std face cut? Making stuff up doesn't help anyone. And, no, the saw's not adjusted that rich. He just doesn't make it do work enough, piddling about in a conifer.
he is a wild land fire fighter not a timber man , approach and technique are different. judging by the size of the tree, he is a class c faller. he is an expert faller.
A lot of older loggers like to put the body of the saw down and start their back cut on their left side as seen in this video. A couple reasons they did this was to avoid excessive movement around the tree or because the footing on that side was better. Also they used 1" or less hinges even on 5' trees.
Some of these trees get nasty. Big trees that have fire in them. I've seen 12" diameter limbs falling out of 50+inch DBH pine trees as the tree burns from the top down. Do I want to be bent over cutting on my knees worrying about a one foot stump? Negative, tough guy. I want to be head-up, observing overhead hazards, ready to get out of the way. This is the reasoning with the higher stumps. Cut at a comfortable height that allows for quick escape.
Working for the FS in Oregon and Montana for as long as I did, this was considered the RIGHT way to fall a tree. Never start with a sloped cut because if you screw it up, there's no way to re-gun your cuts and get the tree to fall where you want it. In the Pacific Northwest, there's sometimes a pretty small margin between threading the needle and getting your snag hung up in jackstraw. In firefighting, don't bother throwing down Humbolts or 1' stumps. Be concerned with safety, not board feet.
The argument for diagonal/angled face cut first is because it is easier to connect a horizontal line to the diagonal that to get a diagonal to land where your horizontal is. If you're counter argument is that pros can do it with experience then i would say the same about your original comment "if you screw it up there's no way to fix it". It's just as easy to gun a diagonal as a horizontal as soon as the chain has bit into the cut even an inch
You're spot on, but Humboldts have the advantage of falling out on their own, and most pro fallers are trained on them already
Agreed Fred.. about cutting from either side and its often easier just to flip the saw and start the backcut ... However, making the top cut first has many advantages.. that's not gonna change anytime soon..
Fantastic tutor.
Only a demo! What if fire on yo ass? Oh hold on, I have a iPhone? GFL
One of best videos out there for Wildland!
Nice
@n1ztb ya it might be that old, though it says 2004 in the description.. if its old and out of date, they should say so. Still a nice video.. some good tips..
@murphy4trees I wonder how old the original video is; looks like early 80's maybe. And yeah, I generally start the back cut on the other side, too, unless I'm plunging and working my way around.
@3LilyLil
You need to know the FS requires all stumps to be three foot high per their safety regs. Me lower the better. This guy is pro,he is only doing what the FS regs allow a sawyer to do, Yes this is weird way to drop a tree,
It really dosnt matter how old that video is. Trees havnt changed in a thousand years. And if you lived in the NW youd learn to cut trees from both sides real fast. We have what you call mountains and you cant cut on the downhill side. And for the plunge cut on almost every tree? Why?
BEAUTIFUL
Is is down yet? Hmmm
Like I have all day (☆fire)
Good demo.
That was good clean cut.
This is just a quick way to get a tree down. The guy is going by the rule. 3' foot stumps are done for safety.
I'm not even sure how that makes it easier to line up your cuts. Not to mention if you do your sloping cut first, gunning would be damn near impossible. The first cut is called a gunning cut for a reason. About the only time I plunge on the back cut is when there's a strong lean and I'm worried about a barber chair. And yeah, I couldn't imagine being able to cut on the same side every time unless I were in kansas.
My stump would be ground level.
This guy's pretty ok at his job.
foornaa, Winston knows his stuff. Granted he does go way over the top but he knows who he is training.... our government employees!
That's debatable about whether he knows his stuff or not. But he's gotten much better since Pollman has mentored him.
Old habits die hard. Nice video demo, BUT the technique shown for cutting the notch is old school. It was painful to watch. Making the top cut first, as per Game of logging, will be a lot faster easier, and much less chance of making a mistake, especially for newbies. I also almost always start the backcut with the tree to my right, though I've noticed most loggers cut as you do, with the body of the saw facing down. I prefer to start form the other side and will plunge cut most bigger trees
I agree with you Doug. its scary to me that people that have little falling skills post an instructive video on how to fall a tree. Some one is going to get hurt or destroy property. just because you have a Tree Service business and hang a rope in a spar or in most any tree dosnt mean you a qualified to teach some one to fall trees. The only way to learn is to be out in the woods on a strip cutting timber. No book or video will make you a timber cutter.
Mate get a helmet with ear muffs. WTching you take off gloves then pit in ear pligs over and over was painful
Guy takes to long just cut the dam thing down
még itt magyarázol már el is őssze kugliztan meg elis tűzelltem az egészet erdőstűl!!!
My only problem with this is not using a Humboldt cut with the angle cut coming up from below.
Only use saw after proper training. Video no good then!@
Lol,ok then! Me too!
Useless? Where is the video of you putting down a 50-75ft tall tree right on the money of where you planned it to fall? The video has no useless information. A person should try to know as much as possible, dropping trees that size is very dangerous.
bom
What the hell is safe about cutting a burning tree (usually the reason you're cutting it in the first place on a fire) for a 1' stump? Unless it's right next to the line you would just dump it and move on. They fall a lot of trees in the air force do they?
You never fell for a living
Yea he does. Wildland guys aren’t timber fallers and timber fallers aren’t wildland guys. He’s teaching beginners that have never put wood to the ground, plus he isn’t cutting for board feet.
Man how rich are you running that poor Stihl? It sounds like my old Homelite 550!
Cut the tree, dont push it over, BOSS
haha. man these videos are funny. i know its educational, but the hyper-exaggerated checking of ALL the cuts is just way beyond anything anyone (even beginners) does on the job...
I could have fell 5 trees while he was making the notch.
How many trees could you have fallen instead of commenting on this video multiple times?
Not following you on making the top cut first. Ive seen a lot of so called rookies do that. Why? The only reason i see is its easier to match up your corners on the next cut.
my boss doesnt let me walk around the tree like that
I wonder why he's teaching to to the bottom cut of the face first. If you do the top cut, the bottom cut will be almost impossible to miss. Its easier and saves time
What's this stuff about "gunning" or "under" cut on what is a simple std face cut? Making stuff up doesn't help anyone. And, no, the saw's not adjusted that rich. He just doesn't make it do work enough, piddling about in a conifer.
Gunning cut and under-cut are common professional timber felling terminology. He's not making those terms up.
he is a wild land fire fighter not a timber man , approach and technique are different. judging by the size of the tree, he is a class c faller. he is an expert faller.