Cheddar man and Mesolithic Europeans
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- Опубліковано 13 сер 2019
- Cheddar man was typical of Mesolithic European hunter-gatherers. His physical features and way of life resembled others who lived in Western and Central Europe from 14,000 to 6000 years ago. Geneticists call his race the Western Hunter Gatherers (WHG). The Mesolithic is characterised as the warm period following the ice-age. In this video I visit Cheddar gorge and the very cave in which Cheddar man was found. I look at some late stone age hunting tools such as microliths and I even describe what the Mesolithic religion was like based on the scarce evidence we have, from the caves of El Cogul to the Shigir idol of Russia. The main WHG samples I look at are Loschbour man, Cheddar man, La Brana man and Villabrunna man.
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Music in order:|
Theme = Wolcensmen - Sunne
Bark sound productions - Eld
Quincas Moreira - Dawn of Man
Stark Von Oben - Winter Soulstice
Ormgård - Sjálfsforn
Geographer - Jay sweeps
Loschbour man 3D animation by CNRA (Centre National de Recherche Archéologique in Luxembourg and Nic Herber (AnubisPictures) Luxembourg.
Sources:
The evolutionary history of human populations in Europearxiv.org/pdf/1805.01579.pdf
The genetic history of Ice Age Europe
www.nature.com/articles/natur...
Survival of Late Pleistocene Hunter-Gatherer Ancestry in the Iberian Peninsula
www.cell.com/current-biology/...
Population dynamics and socio-spatial organization of the Aurignacian: Scalable quantitative demographic data for western and central Europe
journals.plos.org/plosone/art...
Upper Palaeolithic Siberian genome reveals dual ancestry of Native Americans
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/arti...
Carvings on Mesolithic idol were made with beaver jaw tool
www.archaeology.wiki/blog/201...
The Genomic History Of Southeastern Europewww.biorxiv.org/content/10.11...
Mesolithic Art
courses.lumenlearning.com/bou...
Star Carr pendant
www.york.ac.uk/news-and-event...
Mesolithic And Neolithic, Of Cheddar And Bread
www.gnxp.com/WordPress/2018/0...
Ancient DNA reveals how wheat came to prehistoric Britain
www.nature.com/news/ancient-d...
The fact that Cheddar Mans corpse was rotting away and lying as bones in his cave for the rest of the Mesolithic seems to go against cave dwelling. Surely there were not tonnes of decent caves to choose from, and I find it hard to believe that the rest of the clan would just carry on while Uncle Grog rotted in the corner.
that's an interesting point.
@@Survivethejive Chances are CM succumbed to injuries while taking refuge from whatever hostile situation was there (Inclement weather or predation) possibly being cut off from his own clan in a hunt or himself being alone to begin with. Of course unless the people there believed in ritualistic sacrifices or their religions if they had any at the time played a role in it. CM could have also been a pariah from his own people too for breaking some tradition or committing a taboo among his own people. Not much clue on what to go on about HOW he died, if it was a social aspect or just some mere mishap.
I read a story where a health inspector found a grandfather rotting in the corner of a restaurant kitchen because the family running the business were too busy to take care of him.
Was he in open air, though? Lots of Neolithic people buried their dead under their own houses, maybe Cheddar Man's people did something similar.
Grug " who maken cheese in here "
Groog " dats jus grog in corner"
Grug " woof he smell like moldy cheddar man "
Studying ancient Europe is very important and extremely underestimated, so your channel is incredibly valuable. Good luck to you. Moyo pochtenie.
@@aravankinslayer8487 what is that?
@Prince of the Spirit Most haplogroup I people today are very much Yamnaya in the case of I1 and also Neolithic farmer in the case of I2. None of them cluster closely with any of these ancient samples.
Indo-Europeans are the ones who left the greatest modern contribution and gave rise to all modern European cultures, other than the Uralics, who also were in close contact with them.
What do you get when you take I1 in its non admixed state? A bunch of berry foragers? You can't even call yourself a Germanic or "Viking" then, as they originated with Indo-Europeans.
Sean David To my knowledge, the top scientists who have worked on this clearly stated that skin colour is NOT something that can be determined. I remember one of them “issuing a correction” from the Natural History Museum when the BBC started the publicity with that ‘black’ looking Cheddar Man. His eyes were blue...that’s correct & confirmed by experts.
Maybe if he he could get his facts right ...
@Adrian Carlos stop schizo-posting.
Interesting that that mesolithic cave painting already depicted men with short hair and women with distinct clothing.
@Silvana Barilla lol
@james c Well I was moreso talking about how they didnt look like our typical long haired cavemen/Conan in plain loincloths. I try not to think about SJW views every time I consider stuff like this, by the polls theyre like 8% of the population so no need to give them the time of day.
Did they? All of them? Every culture? Their purpose in choice of clothing was to depict sexual differences and nothing else and they had ethical standards dictating this fact? You know this for a fact? It wasn't a matter of practicality and comfort, for instance: for ease of sex, the different way the sexes piss, the chores each individual may have been doing each day, child rearing. No? You think it was a matter of men being men and women being women and never the twain shall meet and it being that way since we learned to fashion clothing from fibres and skins? You gathered that from one picture of one cave painting? Really? All I saw that made it different was the spirit man had a very large cock and no clothes and the women surrounding him clothed in skins, with tits. It was suggested it was a fertility rite, of course the people are sexualised. Where's the men to compare it with? Wearing a skirt of skins too. It's art, not reality. It's like saying all women were fat and round because most of the Venus sculptures were fat and round, we know they were not. They were unhealthy, often starved to death and they died at a very early age; do you really think they had time to have meetings on dress codes, let alone fashion a range of garments? Men and women have been wearing practically the same clothes (usually none) for most of history. When fabrics were invented they all wore robes. The first art showing wearing trousers was of horse riders of the steppes, again, practicality. It is only recent that the sexes were differentiated and only in some societies and mostly because of modern fashion western trends. Check your Victorian values, this is the 21stC.
@@goeegoanna Not sure where you got the idea that it was ethical and therefore devoid of any practical purpose.
As for it only being recent that clothing was used as gender markers, off the top of my head Minoan art is like 3000 years old and has clear examples of gendered clothing.
@@usedx115x Of course clothing is of practical purpose, as it had always been. My point is that men and women have always worn very similar clothing, including in Crete, linen skirts, men's were shorter, women's were longer. My point is the art in that painting did not show clearly gendered, distinct clothing there is no logical way you could make that assumption when evidence shows otherwise. More to the point, why would you feel a need to? Your SWJ comment later alludes to your reasoning, which seems to show your moral standards on the subject making it an ethical proclamation, or am I wrong?
I've always thought it a rather peculiar assumption that most "cavemen" lived in caves. There do not appear to be enough caves to accommodate estimated populations. As you point out, just because the remains we have found are in caves, protected from erosion, does not necessarily mean that they lived there. I think it more likely that very few lived in the caves and that those sites were more of gathering places and places for rituals.
Genetics has added a wholly new perspective on understanding the ancients. I am amazed at how we can extract DNA from such ancient samples. A very interesting video.
it seems caves were used to despose of the dead in the mesolithic but there is also evidence of other uses too - painting in the paleolithic - but hunting tools were also left in caves. mesollithic people def built houses to live in though just like modern hunter gatherer tribes in the tropics do
Caves would've been used for two reason in my opinion. Spiritual rituals/meditational activities, or refuge from cosmic disasters such as periods of meteor streams were there may have been flaming comets/asteroids falling from the skies causing death and destruction to anything on land.
@@Survivethejive what about oasa man, the oldest sapiens they say
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pe%C8%99tera_cu_Oase
i think carpathian basin, central europe is the center of old europe, a lot warm springs, stabile climate in ice age like todays st. petersburgs climate......a heat oasis in ice age
It might have been their storage shed.
There are way more caves that have been lived in than most realise. The thing that puzzles me is places like Creswell Crags as most lived on or near the cost until only a few thousand years ago. Same as the caves in the dales. Given the (contested) population of Europe being possibly as low as 3000, if the population density of Europe was vaguely uniform then the UK would only have a few hundred. Creswell Crags, Victoria Cave, and Kent's Cavern between them could cope with that, never mind the bazillion caves on the coast near what would have been razor clam and limpets etc (both of which are damn good eating).
A tree without it's roots will wither away.
Not if fossilised
A tree watered with Brando is in need of no electrolytes
@Ell Fuxion lmao
Wyclef what?
Ash and Elm Æ
Adam-and-Eve Æ
Æther way we're covered by leaves. 🌲
Fascinating presentation that’s clearly taken no shortage of time, effort and of course, talent.
Very impressive...
Improper use of ;
Veronica Christopher Thank you Veronica.
@@YellowSynth Just had a glance at your channel featuring errr Nigerian Princesses… *lol* indeed
16:50 “They weren’t black people. They weren’t kangz .”
LOL
Josef Daniel Your comment is funny because it’s dumb
Lmao he actually said it😂😂😂😂
They are viKangz
It's funny how speaking the truth is seen as brave in this corrupt age.
@@AJDOLDCHANNELARCHIVE No one thinks it's brave 😂
I am 70-years old. During my time in school and college, we did not have access to the depth of historical knowledge available today. I enjoyed this presentation. Somehow, I just am not grasping the concept of haplogroups. I know I am missing some important historical connections, so I am working at a better understanding of haplogrouping.
haplogroups were more important between 1990 and 2010 than they are now. We now have genome wide analysis so we don't just look at the haplogroups which provide less information.
@@SurvivethejiveThank you. I appreciate the information.
@@d.m.collins1501 Would it matter if they were or weren't when the genetic group they belong to is European? I mean that's his point; that he was European genetically; he just lacked the specific genetic markers that result in a very pale complexion.
You should drop your prejudice. He covered various factors which may have resulted in Cheddar Man being Black, he just considers them unlikely. What he said, was that he wasn't African.
Today, we have people saying the Jewish and Semitic people were actually Black. Yet, we have historical evidence to the contrary, in Egyptian Stele that are several thousand years old, which are etched on limestone and pigmented, where that pigmentation that has survived for millennia in some places, shows Egyptian's as Dark Brown, another Group as Orange, and still another group which is identifiably Semitic as parchment colored.
That's going back 4000 years to the period when Semitic people populated what is now modern day Iraq, Syria, Lebanon, Jordan, Israel, Palestine and half of Iran, and had trade routes stretching along the Southern Mediterranean Coast, up through Spain and Portugal, Iberia, to Britain, and potentially as far as Denmark, Norway, and Sweden, and mixed with populations of Indo-Europeans in Greece, Anatolia, and Armenia, and potentially as far as Afghanistan to the East.
There's even older examples, that show similar pigment choices. Apparently Egyptian Pharaoh's took Semitic wives quite often around 2500 BCE. Possibly even some Indo-European, but it's hard to know without knowing the identities or origins of those people, unlike the other Stele where it is clearly known who they represent. They're dressed in Egyptian attire, and there doesn't really seem to be any indication of origin other than the choice of pigment applied.
But, we do know from other Sources, that Women of non-Egyptian origin, were found quite often in tombs, at least in some places. Though, their origins have not yet been identified either; just that they're not native to Egypt.
Sure, he could have been Black, but it's honestly doubtful. More likely he was closer to bronze skin tones or something similar, much like the Semitic and Indo-European people of later periods.
You're an inspiration, Jason! You still have that fire and passion for learning
@jasondaniel It's pre-history.
Best part of video is at 16:55: "Sorry, they weren't Kangz" - HA HA HA HA HA HA HA!!! Thank you for that, Thomas! THANK YOU!!!
I always say if we stop fortifying food with vitamin D it would solve the Kangz problem currently in Europe.
I laughed out loud when he said sry and walked off camera. Light humor is more hilarious than slapstick in some instances.
Super G no you’re triggered because it’s not true and that they lied and made him look black to justify the invasion.
@@persiphoneisadude4547 No, not that he had dark skin, but rather the misleading reporting in which "dark" just HAS TO BE interpreted as black, when in reality his skin color could have been anywhere within a range from olive-toned to the very dark that we see in the recent illustration of him - we don't actually know. It's this dishonesty with an anti-White ideological push behind it that "triggers" me, and not the actual skin color that Cheddar Man might have had.
@@byroncarter8561 no proof of that
Very good nice to see interest in our ancestors
Witchfinder Nielsen just for the BBC to come along and say he was an African!
@Witchfinder Nielsen At least he wasn't an obese diabetic moron like his 21st century relatives
@@gerard7817 you are right about the BBC is stopped watching the propaganda a long time ago
@@Treeman196 so fragile
@@drys3136 what ever
It seems to have taken several million years for Cheddar Man to mature, but he seems to have aged well.
Is this a cheese joke???
@@MrFullkaosjohn It is, to put it Mildly. I hope it was not in...poor taste. Okay, I'll go now.
@@RikoJAmado That was a cheesy joke
Aren't Mesolithic cheese jokes now well past their sell-by date?
I enjoyed the sharp wit of the OP.
Seeing you almost stumble over yourself and your words out of PURE excitement and joy of genetic history is just so beautiful and humbling, man. Great work
"They weren't kangz, sorry" 😂
William Eaton We don’t know how light they were. We do know that modern Europeans took a lot of their light skin genes from neanderthals. Looking back on the DNA scientist still don’t know why, but it would seem clear humans in cold climates would need lighter skin for vitamin D absorption. Modern Europeans only became light within 11,000 years and perhaps maybe tanned skinned or brown skinned within the last 25,000 years. So most of the time when modern humans were in Europe they were significantly darker than they are now. Which is a very cool fact seeing we have only been around for 100,000-150,000 years.
@@NovaDoll even 100000 years ago there were different races even within homo sapiens. So difference between cromagnon from east Africa and cromagnon from West Africa could be as high as between homo sapiens and neanderthal.
William Eaton Did you read what I wrote because if you did you wouldn’t have wrote such stupid comment about them lacking genes from sub-Saharan Africa. I stated how some of the light skinned genes came to be. ✌🏽
Пальцерезка Please go back a read what I wrote. Clearly I wasn’t talking about other humans was writing about light genes that are clearly lighter than tan.
Пальцерезка Please go back a read what I wrote. Clearly I wasn’t talking about other humans was writing about light genes that are clearly lighter than tan.
The tall idol at the end reminds of Slavic god Svetovid's idol...
Yes, I thought so too.
I never knew all Cro-Magnons had blue eyes - very interesting factoid
that isn't what i said. cro-magnon is not a category of people anymore
@@Survivethejive greeks believe they are ceo-magnons thats what they teach them on school LOL
@@gugashmazari7816 wait forreals
Ancestors found in Europe and Asia including China and Japan.
Egyptian pharaohs found with red hair and Caucasian facial structures and were taller. All of these were Caucasian, blue eyed, blond/red haired, and taller. A recent study found that DNA from a red haired Egyptian pharaoh was compared to present Egyptian DNA and then others. They found no present day Egyptians with that DNA.
@@btk1213
😂
What an illusion!
I recommend leaving this fantasy world, it's better for you!
Bugger. I thought we were all Africans. There goes my slavery compensation application idea.
@FearOfFacts Maybe it is because digging bones in Greece, Israel and NW Africa is easier then in subsaharian parts of Africa. And based on genetic population south of Sahara are geneticly more different from each other than rest of humanity.
FearOfFacts. Our species origins is well founded in Africa. Other human found outside Africa - floriensis, Neanderthals, denisovans- are descendents of others who came from Africa, being Homo Erectus the one paleontologists think left Africa first.
@FearOfFacts Did you look up the source article that presented this "Homo Sapiens" from Greece? It's actually a very fractured fossilized fragment of the nape that was measured and the measures of that crania turned out to be in the size standards of later Anatomically Modern Humans. But excuse me, that is no proof that this fractured fossil belonged to Homo Sapiens. We know that some Neanderthals even had chins as protruding as some of AMH had, and the protruding chin is a very unique characteristic of the AMH. So the fact that a fragment of crania is smaller than Neanderthals usually had means nothing in regard of dating the exodus of the AMH from Africa.
@FearOfFacts the original African homo sapiens are genetically as different from us as they are from modern African populations, just because they live in the same place doesn't make them closer in relation. it is likely they were visibly more similar than modern Europeans but that is just an environmental adaptation for survival.
@@desiderata8811 According to OoA. Which has withstood some beatings in the past few years
White and Black are words of our age, a lot of things happened in between and the ideas about race have changed many times as different groups interacted with other groups. We shouldn't get stuck into the idea that somebody with darker skin (and how dark that is of course really hard to judge) is in some way "African" or "Black", those ideas didn't exist back then and the divisions that we use are actually fairly recent (not last thursday tho, but they have changed over the centuries). Of course calling Cheddar man "Black" is a political choice the same way as calling Germans "the Aryan race", both are anachronisms and both should be brought into context.
But on the other hand, you guys shouldn't get stuck up on the idea that your connection to these ancient peoples is that strong, a lot of funky shit happened in the history and it is many thousand years after all, don't fetishise the haplogroups as some people might be fetishising the phenotypes.
@@adriancarlos9155 Africa wasn't called that by European colonisers, that is completely wrong. It was the name for the southern part of Mediteranean (except Egypt that is, Egypt was perceived as not part of Africa) since early Roman times and it might be of Berber origin so I am not sure about who those European colonisers should be or how do you precisely mean it.
Your argument about colour and names is a deep philosophical argument but I don't think it is worth discussing it here in length, I'll just say that race doesn't have that much to do with precise colour, that is just something you insert in the end as a signifier to justify your preexisting position. Many physiological things are not such signifiers and they are quite arbitrary (more in "Towards Political Theory of Race" by Sheth for example).
Romans did judge people's skin tone - they had the word "Aethiops", "burnt-face", but it didn't have the same social connotations, Romans cared more about what gods you worship than what colour your skin has, but they weren't colourblind. As did the Egyptians for that matter, but the cultural implications in both cases was quite different on both sides.
Around the idea of "Black people are from Africa and White people from everywhere else" - well, in pre-modern times it was mostly the case that in Africa the darker skin tones pevailed. But in the end we are all from Africa and as many racists gonna tell you, Indians aren't White in their book, Arabs aren't White in their book so in the end the places where White people are from get quite limited.
I am not sure if you actually read what I was writing or even if you are engaging it in any way. For me African or Black doesn't actually have that much to do with the exact colour - it is a cultural signifier of OUR TIME, there are now identities based on that fact, and I am criticising both sides trying to force something onto somebody that didn't have this concept at all, so what is the point?
Race is a term created to divide us, be careful of those who identify themselves and base their lives around arbitrary characteristics they have no control over.
@@Roadrun98 That is one thing, the other thing is that race is a very complex term that today has a different meaning that it has 500 years or 2000 years ago and imposing it on somebody that lived I don't know, 10k years ago might be a little bit foolish in the same way it is foolish to read Bible as a fantasy novel.
What determines one's color of skin, I read that skin color/Meletonen comes from the sun. Was there sufficient warmth/sun exposure in Europe at this time to claim the skin color of a human?
@@Auggies1956 1. melatonin
2. migration can play an important role, just look around today
3. there is a reason the lineage we are talking about here is comparatively minor
4. this aint what i was really talking about
The scientists later admitted that they can't really determine the skin color of Cheddar Man. From the New Scientist journal of 21 February 2018:
A Briton who lived 10,000 years ago had dark brown skin and blue eyes. At least, that’s what dozens of news stories published this month - including our own - stated as fact. But one of the geneticists who performed the research says the conclusion is less certain, and according to others we are not even close to knowing the skin colour of any ancient human.
The skeleton of Cheddar Man was discovered in 1903 in a cave in south-east England where it had lain for 10,000 years.
Until a few weeks ago, he had always been depicted with pale skin. This makes some sense, given that people living at northern latitudes often have paler skins. The explanation may be that it allows more of the weak northerly sunlight into their skin, so they can make enough vitamin D. And it seems our species reached Europe 30,000 years before Cheddar Man lived, so his ancestors would have had plenty of time to evolve paler skins.
But the new DNA analysis suggests that Cheddar Man may have had dark skin. Most news stories said his skin was “dark to black”.
Giveaway genes
To show this, researchers including Susan Walsh at Indiana University-Purdue University Indianapolis read Cheddar Man’s DNA. Walsh had helped develop a model that attempts to predict someone’s eye, hair and skin pigmentation solely from their DNA, and the team applied this model to Cheddar Man.
The most recent version of the model was published in May 2017. It focuses on 36 spots in 16 genes, all linked to skin colour.
To test it, Walsh and her colleagues took genetic data from over 1400 people, mainly from Europe and the US but also some from Africa and Papua New Guinea. The team used part of the data to “train” their model on how skin colour and the 36 DNA markers are linked. They then used the rest of the data to test how well the model could predict skin colour from DNA alone. The model correctly identified who had “light” skin or “dark-black” skin, with a small margin of error.
When Walsh and her colleagues applied the model to Cheddar Man, they concluded his skin colour fell between “dark” and “dark to black”.
Not so sure
The research was first announced by press release, to coincide with the release of a TV documentary. It has now been posted to a preprint server.
Walsh stresses that the study doesn’t conclusively demonstrate Cheddar Man had dark to black skin. We cannot place such confidence in the DNA analysis, she says. For one thing, Cheddar Man’s DNA has degraded over the last 10,000 years.
“It’s not a simple statement of ‘this person was dark-skinned’,” says Walsh. “It is his most probable profile, based on current research.”
In fact, we are not ready to predict the skin colour of prehistoric people just from their genes, says Brenna Henn at Stony Brook University, New York. That’s because the genetics of skin pigmentation turn out to be more complex than thought.
Too many genes
In November 2017, Henn and her colleagues published a paper exploring the genetics of skin pigmentation in populations indigenous to southern Africa - where skin colour varies more than many people appreciate. Just weeks before, a group led by Sarah Tishkoff at the University of Pennsylvania in Philadelphia had published a paper on the genetics of skin pigmentation in people from eastern and southern Africa.
“The conclusions were really the same,” says Henn. “Known skin pigmentation genes, discovered primarily in East Asian and European populations, don’t explain the variation in skin pigmentation in African populations. The idea that there are really only about 15 genes underlying skin pigmentation isn’t correct.”
It now seems likely that many other genes affect skin colour. We don’t know how.
If we are still learning about the link between genes and skin pigmentation in living populations, we can’t yet predict the skin colour of prehistoric people, says Henn.
This debate may seem of little practical importance - although the idea that Cheddar Man was dark-skinned generated enormous public interest. However, we need to know the limitations of this sort of genetic technology.
Police could one day plug DNA from a crime scene into one of these models to determine what a suspect looks like. Walsh’s model might succeed at this in the US, says Henn, because it was trained on DNA from people with similar ancestry to North Americans. But it may well fail elsewhere.
Henn’s team has tested an older model that aimed to predict skin colour from DNA. When they put it to work among southern African populations, “it literally predicted that people with the darkest skins would have the lightest skin”
you are the man of the month!
@@tomatensoup190 Thank you for that. I was feeling down but you helped me to feel better with your comment. You can help me to feel even better if you copy-and-paste that article and post it wherever the Cheddar Man story pops up. Have a great day!
@@Thulesmann I will. I think this is very important because people just blend out standard scientific methodology if it fits their narrative.
@@tomatensoup190 Thanks! I find it interesting that when this story first broke and we all heard about how Cheddar Man was this unusually dark person, it was a big story, but this later retraction by the researchers was hardly mentioned.
The leftist MSM didn't detract their claims of blackness though... It for sure was used with an agenda for liberals pushing migration.
Thank you! Absolutely fascinating and you make it so clear to understand! A real pleasure to listen to👏
People weren’t just living in caves during late Palaeolithic era but they where also living In Tents because a tent from 40000 BCE that was made from mammoth hind was found in Russia. Also the oldest house in the world was found In the world was found In Ukraine, it was 15000 years old and made from mammoth bones, Ukraine and the step where really the cradle of civilisation at the time
This reassured all my research. My dad looks just like the Spanish WHG picture. Totally fascinating topic. Also we look like twins, I must be your American relative. Keep up the videos. Nice to hear tales from kin. GG!🙂☝️🇺🇲
Cheddar Man is Huwhyte.
I love your videos. I am both U5a1 and I2a1, so have always been fascinated by the WHG. Great video.
Amazing video man keep up the good work
When analysing DNA and focusing on skin colour, there will be a range of possible skin tones, ..from lighter to darker / or darker to lighter skin tone.
Unfortunately the group that stated that Cheddar Man was of the darkest possible skin tone,
(And just as unlikely, as the lightest possible skin tone), chose the political, rather than the scientific, to inform their pronouncement. Choosing to conclude black skin as the original Western European colouring , so as to include, new black skinned immigrants, in the ancient history of Britain.
If DNA analysis of ancient African populations were conducted, focusing on skin tone, and chose to favour the paler end of possible skin tones, and concluded that ancient Africans were pale skinned, there would be an outcry of “Whitewashing” from the dark skinned communities.?
Well when you get a degree in anything related to genetics, feel free to challenge it with your own peer reviewed articles. Until then, go speculate yourself.
@@fadillangston9797
How about a worthless degree in gender studies, that more than meets the genetics degree requirement. Gender is completely down to genetics. And I’m sure the gender studies echo chamber would be only too happy to peer review and affirm a multitude of genders, as much as the little green men echo chamber would validate various exoplanets for where they abide.
Bad ideas with a degree to attempt to legitimise them, are still bad ideas.
Not that you have a bias on this skin tone topic?
There's a lot of denial about Cheddar man's skin tone on this channel. The stories that someone serious suggests some kind of false heritage for politics are nonsense. The populations who first had the genes resulting in paler skin moved into the area long after Cheddar man lived 8500 years ago. A light skin Cheddar man is not possible. There is no serious debate around this.
It can't be denied that such an emotional reaction to a dark skinned Cheddar man is a very big indication of racism. My perspective comes from the right and I frankly troll the woke anti-racists running around screaming racism at every corner all the time. They are a real issue in the states currently. If I'm unconvinced you aren't racist you may have a problem.
It's strange the channel props up David Reich, an excellent scientist, but then cherry picks the information in his studies to support a racial purity ideology. He has provided the bulk of the genetic science on the ancient hunter-gatherers and indo-europeans. In his words, that science "should give racists no comfort."
@@russpaxman3660 Doesn't sound like you got that degree yet. I'll wait.
They're giving it another go across the water now.
www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/early-irish-people-were-dark-skinned-with-blue-eyes-documentary-1.4541124
I love all of the analysis of the lineages of the people. That's real anthropology.
Thank you for helping bring my ancestors alive. Very moving.
At the British Museum in 1996 I saw the astonishing variety and sophistication of tools, weapons, decorations and clothing of this period. They seemed essentially modern to me.
I felt they showed that the producers were no different from me, just working with different resources.
But, having blue eyes, I would say that.
"Hi kids, it's me, CheddarMan! I'm here to tell you that cheese is a wholesome snack that is high in calcium for your growing bones and protein to make you big and strong."
kids: "Yay.... Thanks, CheddarMan!"
Cheddar Man being lactose intolerant is a cosmic joke.
Where's Edamman ?
12:34
Is this actual footage from the mesolithic?
Your work is bloody good. Respect. And THANK YOU.
Fantastic work which will inform and educate for decades.
Fascinating and better then most mainstream documentarys!
UA-cam finally gave me a good recommendation.... excellent job, guys... I'll be going through your older stuff and keeping up with the new stuff... I have always had an interest in topics like these :-)
Same :)
I love everything you share!! Thank You!!
Excellent video once again Tom, love these medium length documentaries, very on point and succinct.
A problem at 10:01. The relationship between the ancient samples and present-day populations will most likely depend on what PCs you choose to plot. It appears to me that PC1 (accounting for only 0.8% of total variance) was specifically chosen because it had high scores on variables that delineate mainland Europeans from peoples of Caucasia. In many other PCA plots you don't see such a gap.
IMO, PCA should probably not be used for this purpose; dimension reduction, by itself, does not solve the classification problem.
P.S. At 2:35 it says the probability of blue eyes was 53% which is probably not the same thing as saying they were a blue eyed population.
Thank you for another well researched but concise video. I had the pleasure of meeting STJ in Cheddar near the end of the day, he was dissapointed at how many Victorians discarded Paleolithic information & artifacts (if i recall correctly). I directed him and his swedish spouse to some traditional Cheddar Cheese, lovely bloke.
We got the cheese and were very grateful for your advice and directions!
Such quality work. Excellent job !
Thank you so much for your research..you are a great speaker and I love the soundtrack music
Enjoyed it very much thank you.
That Star Carr amulet looks very similar to Irish Ogham . Very fascinating video Tom .
Very well done Tom, always informative. Keep 'em coming
Amazing content, brother 🤘🏻✊🏻
Some of your audience may not like this, but I would love to see videos like this about other parts of the world. Say, the Americas or the Indian subcontinent. Never hurts to branch out a bit.
Cheers!
There are 1.2 billion Indians in the world - let one of them do it.
@BLUE DOG thank you for saying the truth, once again they hate us, because they aint us
@@russianbotfarm3036 Unfortunately India is becoming one of those places where modern political concerns are tainting anthropology. It's now common in India to deny the Indo-European connection, because they believe it's a colonial idea that Europeans invented to justify control of India, which is retarded, but hey. The Indians get sensitive about nationalism.
@@BOBofGH Although it is really obvious when you look at different Indian castes. The highest caste have some European features and look like a totally different people from the lowest caste, who are often darker than some Africans.
there is not enough controversial stuff related to what white guys find enjoyable in those places
your videos are amazing. keep up 👍👍
Glad you like them!
13:36 "Ooga Booga cavemen" _Thought crime alert._
Any One even the first primates to walk weren’t kangz.
Hey dude you have a picture of Thomas carlyle in your profile
@@saadrizvi6630 He's my snow-nigga.
What's with the racism, guys?
@Brega Odinsson it's just true. Cheddar man wasn't black by our current definition.
Great vid. Thanks for the history lesson
Fantastic video man, please keep them coming!
Regarding skin colour of Cheddar man, Nina Jablonski of Penn State department of Anthropology, Found (I think in a study of Asian or American natives peoples) that skin colour could change from light olive to deep brown (and one imagines the reverse) in as little as 100 to 200 generations. She gave a time frame of about 2,500 years. So if Cheddar man's ancestry in northern Europe lasted longer than 2,500 years, then he probably had the skin colour not too different to that of say a Mongolian or modern Spaniard
Makes sense
I agree, to give an example would be John Rahm, a golfer from Spain. This is what came to mind. His range, maybe darker for few depending on the influence from said gene.
Even the lightest European would tan over the years living outside in the sun all day long
Nah it was darkened by globalists have fun screeching in the comments I won't reply
Skin colour differences can be as old as 250 000 years or even older as was proposed by Genetic tests on San people and their ancestors.....
Quick question. I was reading up on my Y-DNA haplogroup I-M223 and I read the it and a G haplogroup were European Hunter Gatherers. The video said the EHG were U5 (is this a maternal haplogroup?). Please explain.
Haplogroup G arrived later with neolithic farmers from Anatolia. I2a and U5b were typical WHG lineages.
My neck of the woods,Was in the cave the other day with the missus....
Just realized that I have both the same haplogroups as you - I1 and U5 (U5a2 in my case, if that matters). Greetings from Southern Germany to my haplogroup-brother! ;)
I am also I1 and I was adopted from Poland.
Damn Thomas, your production quality has been top notch lately, the work really shows!
Definitely proud to be a patron mate.
Thank you!
Thank you for posting this interesting video.
So what do any of you suggest that would be found under suspicion of archeology in archeology digging up and under angel falls, there seems to be a lot of caves underneath the three Guiana's what forns the Amazonian base
Wow the Shigor Idol is amazing
The Star Carr pendant is amazing, it looks like Ogham
Thank you again for a superb video
Glad that I discovered this channel!
My friend across the pond, you are a beast! Keep up the good work
Beautifully shot, amazing video
BC, BCE, and now ybp. Is this nomenclature intended to confuse?
18:00 dope looking guitar pick. those cave men must have been Rockin' in the stone age.
More substance than an E from the early 90s. Good stuff.
M V lol
‘Eezer Goode, ‘Eezer Goode; he‘s Eben .. Norton Horsford.
He‘s re fined, sub lime; he makes you feel fine:)
European peoples should cherish their history and culture.
Splendidly informative
So the indo-europeans formed from a mix of EHG and CHG on the pontic steppe? Or was there a third component
later IE mixed with Neolithic European farmers as the third element.
Cheddar-Man probably worst hero.
He can throw blocks of cheese. It doesn't sound impressive, but have you ever had a block of cheese at you? It hurts
About skin being "white" or "black", mine changes color according to the level of UV radiation available to me. I tan up almost as dark as the purported Cheddar Man if you leave me out in the sun. I rarely burn. Learning about WHG genetics has explained to me why my skin has a different color base from my pinker counterparts, even though it can be quite pale where the sun doesn't hit.
im about as pale as it gets, no joke. My brother looks basically middle eastern. Both of us are entirely European (germanic/other euro mix)
Cheddar man was likely not that dark though, neither are you
@@s66s46 I wish you'd been around to see my. very German father get a refusal of service at a restaurant in the pre-civil rights south. He was THAT dark after a two week vacation in Florida. I agree that the Reconstruction of Cheddar Man was a shade too dark for
Original reasons.
He didn't turn black, please. Take your bs story elsewhere
@@memphiswaspmafia I assume you were addressing me. No, my father remained boadly northern European in phenotype, but his skin turned dark enough to be mistaken for an African-American and denied service at a small diner in Norris Dam Tennessee in 1956. It was truly stupid to assume anyone will be undesirable based on skin tone or any other physical difference. That incident made an impression on my six year old self. Some of us Caucasians retain the ability to protect ourselves from the sun by tanning very darkly. I would even call this a survival trait as modern humans moved into northern latitudes where the UV is scarce. We can be dark when we need to be and pale when we need to be. It makes no difference, we're all Nature's children.
Just discovered your channel. Absolutely awesome presentation, thanks a lot, Thomas and good luck in your research.
real good show. thank yew.
Fancy seeing you here, master bowman!
I hate it when the skeletons have better teeth than me.
based and Jivepilled
Really enjoyed this Thankyou 😊
Tom, do you mind if I ask a stupid question? Which group were the tallest on average; the steppe people, the WHG and EHG, or the Neolithic Farmers?
@@Rin-ir9bu Thank you. Do we know how tall the other groups were on average?
the maasai
the ice age didn't end. it's still here. we are in an interglacial. a warn period between cold periods but it is still the quaternary ice age. humans have never existed outside of the ice age. ever. reference the vostock cores.
Maybe. We may have put an end to the Ice Age with our industry.
Bruce Tucker judging from some of the other comments on this channel you probably won’t get much agreement with that here
Edit: “some of the”
Super-interesting as always Tom!
you have a new subscriber👍
Do the markings on that pendant match any old or current waterways? Maybe it's a map?
Interesting!! 😃
Kangz. Holy shit that was funny. Glad I decided to stay up 20 extra minutes for this.
Your life is sad.
Excellent content, just as usual. Is there any chance to make a video about I2 y-haplogroup and/or subgroups?
Zsigmond Haraszti no i made a vid on haplogroups
Thank you thank you thank you thank you so so so so so so so so so so so so so so much sir for your information. This video is very important for me. Thank you so much.
12:34 How the hell did you go back in time and gain this ancient footage?
Mesolithic cave man performing ancient deer dance ritual, circa 12800 BCE, colourised
@@lance-biggums See the females walking past him? Maybe it is a mating call, to attract the ladies.
Not the biggest fan of some of your videos but the vitamin D and cheddar man point is a good one and really does bring about doubts on how dark cheddar man was.
It shouldn’t ,what should is when did the arrival of non dark skin people happen.and is it not a loss of pigmentation.what else was lost with it?melatonin?,what was gained or replaced it?
Even the researchers said they don't know how dark he was and the artist said the same thing. They sort of just chose that color. That same software claimed modern native Americans are black as west Africans. Most other software said he was more olive or "intermediate." Like modern day natives lol.
I am interested in one very important thing:
What is a difference between Cro-Magnons and Western hunter-gatherers?
Were not Western hunter-gatherers a direct descendants of the Cro-Magnons?
And if they were not Direct descendants of the Cro-Magnons, than where did Western hunter gatherers come from?
I am haplogroup u5 as well and I really couldn't understand with the map was showing me about that. Is that haplogroup associated with the highest amount of the western hunter gatherers ancestry?
No it isn't. It comes from WHG originally but now is highest among sami and berbers
Great presentation!👍 I am an American, and like you, I am also U5 (U5a, “Saami”,). I am also Mesolithic I1 (paternal). Fascinating to learn about both sides of my “ancient” heritage!👍
Very nice video. I am glad I wasn't the only one thinking Chedder man couldn't have been as dark as he is sometimes depicted in the media. It seems there are some political activists who over-attribute things to Africans lol.
Even if he was dark he wasn't African
Good stuff. Nice one.
Are you able to load your interview with red ice TV up? As didn't get to listen to the whole thing before they were persecuted by UA-cam
red ice website has it
Fair play he’s in good shape marching up that gorge...
Just found this down a UA-cam rabbit hole and enjoyed it. Thank you. I would really like to see something about the indigenous people of Australia. It always goes through my mind when historians talk about people of 10 000 - 15 000 years ago that Aboriginal Australians have been here on this continent for upwards of 60 000 years......just saying
I'd be dubious when taking those upper limits of how long Indigenous Australians have been in Australia. Full behavioural modernity didn't really establish itself until 50 000 years ago, so either Indigenous Australians lack the genes related for full behavioural modernity (which is racist if wrong, and very confronting, if correct) or Indigenous Australians haven't been on Australia for as long as previously said (or they arrived in small populations 60 000+ years ago and then either died out, or bred into successive, much larger waves of migration, who left Africa later, with full behavioural modernity.
In which case saying Indigenous Australians have been in Australia for 60 000+ years is like saying "Humans have been on the moon since 1969." We went there, were there for a little while, then left. We'll go back, but the evidence that humans were there in 1969 does not mean it was a continuous colonization of the moon from 1969 to the far off future when we inevitably colonize the moon.
Take with a grain of salt, and do your own research where Indigenous Australian history is concerned, as there are as many vested interests in misrepresenting the age and history of Indigenous Australians to paint them as "the oldest continuous culture on Earth" as there are in misrepresenting Indigenous Australians as lesser than other races. Why would people want to study Indigenous Australians? Either they're not from the Australia and they have a dispassionate view, or they're from Australia, and they grew up with all of our post-colonial racial hangups and the unprofessional bias that that brings with it.
It is accurate to say that the Tasmanian Indigenous, for example, continuously inhabited Tasmania for at least 10 000 years, before European arrival. THAT is an established fact, but the idea that humans arrived once to Australia 60 000+ years ago and then never arrived again and simply populated the continent from that genetic bottleneck (like many written sources on Indigenous Australian history positions readers to believe) is historically unlikely and academically unprofessional. It's not fashionable to state that Australian historical studies are INCREDIBLY politically biased, but if you've ever read any books on the subject (which I have. Dark Emu wasn't worth the paper it was printed on) you'd recognize there are a lot of emotionally invested people studying Indigenous Australian history, and that's not a good foundation for a field of research.
To be honestly I’m still a little confused about the difference between Western Hunter gatherers and Magdelanian cultural complex, are the people associated with the Magdelanians considered to fall under the umbrella of WHG? Or were they a distinct group who were assimilated/replaced by them?
@@myself5812 If they migrated from the middle east were they related to Anatolian hunter-gatherers?
@@myself5812 Interesting ... The Magdelanians did'nt go completely extinct, right? They were assimilated into the Villabruna cluster? I read an article and genetic that claimed that.
@@myself5812 I think read about them in relation to Iberia and Southern France Not that it really maters, but any idea what their phenotype may have been? WHG were darker skin-blue eyed, were they similar?
Wait how are Scandinavians the closest living relative when Balkans have the majority of the same haplogroup as the dude you showed? It said I2a1, iirc Balkans has I2a2 not sure about I2a1, and Scandinavia has I1.
Or did you base that conclusion on autosomal dna?
Jan U of course autosomal because that measures genetic similarity and haplogroups do not
Would it be wrong to assume that a lot of archaeological evidence might be under seawater as early inhabitants would have lived by the coast, estuaries and lost rivers. BTW Cheddar Gorgeous.
No that is probably right. Also doggerland was inhabited by WHG
18:07 that's an ancient guitar pick ;) "Play that funky music cheddar boy, play that funky music right. "
Fantastic video, congrats